Is Christian dominionism a threat to democracy?

[MrVisible]

There seems to have been a change in Christianity of late. A once loosely-connected group of denominations, worshipping in their own distinctive ways, has coalesced into a nationwide, uniform church, referring to itself for the most part simply as Christian. This coalition has been very active in trying to impose its political will on the United States. Until recently, I had thought that this was simply a theological revival, with attendant political consequences, and that there was no real unifying purpose or ideal driving this change. As it turns out, there may be a goal to all of this after all; the end of democracy in the United States, and the establishment of a world-wide theocratic Christian government.

I've spent the past few days hunting down information on the subject, and I have to say that, while I'm uncertain as to the scope of the movement and the extent of its influence, the very principles that it is founded upon frighten me deeply.

I'd appreciate it if the readership here could take a look at the following sites.

The Coalition on Reformation (http://www.reformation.net)
The Coalition on Revival (COR) is a network of evangelical leaders from every major denominational and theological perspective who share a vision for and a commitment to worldwide revival, renewal, and reformation in Church and society.
Established in 1984, it's an organization that has created a series of documents designed to create consensus and cooperation among different denominations, for the purpose of expanding Christian dominion. From their Manifesto for the Christian Church (http://www.reformation.net/cor/cordocs/Manifesto.pdf):COR’s vision is to see Christians everywhere doing all they can in the power of the Holy Spirit to take every thought captive to the obedience of Christ (2 Cor. 10:5), in every aspect of life. Toward that end, we have developed a series of worldview documents that set forth what we believe are the fundamental and essential points of the total Christian world and life view. The COR worldview documents state what we believe are the biblical principles for all spheres of human life including theology, evangelism, discipleship, law, civil governments, economics, education, family, medicine, psychology and counseling, arts and media, business and professions, and science and technology.

We believe that the COR worldview documents state where the entire Church must stand and what action it must take to accomplish its task in the remaining years of the Twentieth Century and on into the next century.

We affirm that the Great Commission is a mandate by our Lord to go forth into all the world and make Bible-obeying disciples of all nations. Getting men’s souls saved is only a preliminary part of
fulfilling the Great Commission. Our work is incomplete unless we teach them to obey all He commanded. The word of the Lord’s prayer for God’s will to “be done on earth as it is in heaven”
are another way to state the essence of the same Great Commission.

Here is a list of signers of this manifesto (http://www.reformation.net/cor/signed_manifesto.htm). The names include Dr. Virginia Armstrong, Ph.D., Executive Director,Blackstone Institute of Public Law and Policy, Dr. William Barker, Th.D., Editor Presbyterian Journal, Dr. Richard Bliss, Ed.D., Director of Curriculum, Institute for Creation Research and Dr. Tim Lahaye, D.Min., President, American Coalition for Traditional Values.

This is an article that explains some of the complex history and politics regarding dominionism (http://www.zmag.org/zmag/articles/diamond1.htm). And another article (http://www.publiceye.org/magazine/v08n1/chrisre1.html), with a very comprehensive overview of the movement's history and goals. This article (http://www.rapidnet.com/~jbeard/bdm/Psychology/cor/notes_on.htm) offers a history, some analysis, and notes on the people behind Reconstructionism.

The more I look for information on dominionism and its connections to the organizations that comprise the religious right, the more I find that scares me silly. The Promise Keepers apparently have some dominionist philosophies (http://www.positiveatheism.org/crt/kcpk.htm) at the heart of their organization; their seventh and last promise is:A Promise Keeper is committed to influencing his world, being obedient to the Great
Commandment (see Mark 12:30-31) and the Great Commission (see Matthew
28:19-20 ).

Mark 12:30-31
Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind and with all your strength. The second is this: Love your neighbor as yourself. (NIV)

Matthew 28:19-20
Therefore go and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit, and teaching them to obey everything I have commanded you. And surely I am with you always, to the very end of the age. (NIV)
You'll recognize the Great Commission term from the Manifesto.

I know that I'm in danger of getting labelled as a loony-tune conspiracy theorist. I'd have dismissed all of the information I've come across, except for one thing: the ideals and tactics of dominionism are common enough that they're heard frequently in every religious or political debate I've witnessed for years. "This has always been a Christian nation." "We have a duty to evangelize." "The Bible is inerrant." Etcetera.

If they're a tiny little fringe movement, then it seems like they've had a lot of influence on Christian thought and politics lately. But that's the thing; I don't know how tiny this movement is. How many denominations are dominionist? How many Christians want to establish a Kingdom of God here on earth, by supplanting democracy with theocracy? How far along are they in the pursuit of this goal?

So, I turn to the Millions to tell me the scoop. What's the deal with this theology? How widespread is it? What denominations ascribe to it? Am I being paranoid?

[Boyo Jim]

Is that you, Richard?

Well yes, if these people took over and formed theie ideal state, it would certainly be a threat to democracy.

As to their chances: slim to fat...

[Dances With Bass Amps]

are a small but vocal and virulent element

a 'movement' loosely defined, and with very fuzzy borders...

at one fringe is Gary North -- who crescendoed with Y2K -- it almost seemed he hoped it would be something that would 'crush our society" so that his new geneva or whatever could come up from the ashes...

do a search on the last name of his father-in-law -- Rushdoony -- and you can find out about Reconstructionism proper; just as anything else , it makes more headway in certain areas than others, I recently saw something about impact in Tennessee politics... will try to find it...

[Dances With Bass Amps]

some nice quotations from

R J Rushdoony, Gary North, David Chilton and others...

http://www.serve.com/thibodep/cr/words.htm


.




:eek:

[The_Peyote_Coyote]

Dances: I'm speechless. I looked at some of those quotes, and, hell's bloody bell's, those lunatics make Jack Chick look like a liberal. I would like to take that one ignorant sonuvabitch who thinks slavery is great and work him in a cotton field when the mercury is above 90.

I'm beginning to believe seriousily that this nation and perhaps the world are slipping into a second Dark Ages.

[Dances With Bass Amps]

http://www.qrd.org/QRD/www/RRR/recon.html

caint find what I wanted on Tennessee yit...

[Dances With Bass Amps]

hell's bloody bell's, those lunatics make Jack Chick look like a liberal..

thazza fact, Jack

or rather,

thazza fact, Peyote Canyon...

[Dances With Bass Amps]

in terms of "this is what Christianity IS these days..."

.

DeMar, North, et al

These are

Calvinists On Steroids.

.

They don't represent a huge concensus;

but democracy is a county-by-county, state-by-state game.

.

So ya gotta 'member what Zeus said to Narcissus.

.

Watch yerself!

[tomndebb]

If they're a tiny little fringe movement, then it seems like they've had a lot of influence on Christian thought and politics lately. Actually, that is a misconception (although one they would like to promote).

What they have is an agenda wrapped in the buzzwords and catchphrases of Evangelical Christianity. By using the same phrases as people who have similar (not identical) religious beliefs--even if they have no common connection in the political arena--they are able to convey the ideas that a) they are mainstream and b) enormous numbers of people agree with them.

The reality is that a certain amount of their beliefs and ideals are shared to one extent or another with many other Christians. However, once that surface similarity is scraped away, there are an enormous number of people who would be horrified at what these particular bigots promote.

That is not to say that they should not be confronted and exposed, but to note that they are not nearly as close to launching the theocratic takeover that they would like to see. (Of course, with Dubya and Ashworth as stalking horses, they may get farther than I would normally expect. But the Falwell/Reagan connection looked unbeatable until the citizenry of the U.S. had a look behind the curtain and began backing slowly away. With LaHaye involved, they can't really let the Catholics or Episcopalians join, so they immediately lose a large number of potential recruits.)

[Dances With Bass Amps]

I was tryin to EDIT and I couldn't

I meant

Peyote Coyote

-- not

Peyote Canyon

Sorry.

.

[Dances With Bass Amps]

"they are not nearly as close to launching the theocratic takeover that they would like to see"

[Apos]

If people like this ever did try to take over American society in any meaningful way, they would be heavily opposed, and almost certainly kicked squarely in the arse.

And you know who would do most of the kicking? Other Christians.

That's how it's been in the past, anyway. These movements come and go. Sometimes they DO radically dominate American society, as during the McCarthy era, and sometimes they leave high watermarks. But you know what they say about the price of freedom...

[Polycarp]

Dances with Bass Amps has said most of what I would. I see the Reconstructionist Movement and its congeners as a lunatic fringe among Christians that has the potential to seduce those mainstream conservative Christians who are in opposition to modern liberalism through their religious and moral views.

See www.chalcedon.org for more interesting stuff.

Apos, I'd like to hope you're right, and I certainly will be among those doing the kicking in opposition to such a movement (doing my part already insofar as I can). But one of my nightmares about society is Heinlein's Future History -- which seems more and more a fictionalization of the past sixty years, and which culminated in a Falwell/Robertson individual being elected President and (with the help of a venal Congress and supine Court) replacing our government with a theocracy.

[MrVisible]

Here's what concerns me:

I can't get any numbers.

How many people subscribe to dominionist ideals? How many denominations support the idea that America must become a Christian state? How many conservative think tanks and political action committees have dominionism at the heart of their agenda? How many people are in those denominations? How many roads must a man walk down?

I can find an amazing amount of dominionist rhetoric online, and all of it sounds very much in line with current conservative christian political positions. With traceable connections between dominionism and Focus on the Family, the Institute for Creation Studies and even the Promise Keepers, how do we know that dominionism isn't the foundation of the conservative Christian right?

It's easy to dismiss them as a fringe movement, but doing so without evidence seems a bit complacent. If a few denominations of Christians decided to subvert and overthrow democracy in the US, can you honestly say they could never do it? They have money, political power, a good base of popular support, nationwide recruiting centers, and a certain amount of ideological invulnerability.

I'm worried, because the idea of basing secular law on Christian values has become a fact of life in the government already; it seems like they've got a tremendous foothold. It's the first step that I'd take if I wanted to begin to covertly transform the US into a theocracy.

All I want to know is: how many of them are there?

[Monty]

Originally posted by The Peyote Coyote
I would like to take that one ignorant sonuvabitch who thinks slavery is great and work him in a cotton field when the mercury is above 90.

Peyote,

Didn't you find it odd that the same dude who thought slavery was so great in Old Testament times because it brought the slaves into contact with believers in the gospel message also says that the god of the Jews is the devil? Chilton looks a little too far out of rationality.