Unpopular Americans?

[jenex]

There's recently been a poll discussed in the media about the opinions of other countries concerning the US. As usual we're not doing so well. It's nothing new to me that the US isn't well liked worldwide but it concerns me more so these days. I wonder if people just don't like the government, or is it us Americans as individuals, is it only the people they read about or see in the movies? What should America do differently? Why is Canada so well liked? Is everyone jealous because we get to border Canada? Okay, kidding about that. But seriously, is any one else worried? Is it really all about oil in the Persian Gulf?

[Ximenean]

I'm sceptical about this supposed widespread anti-Americanism, or at least about how deeply-felt it is. As a Brit, I'm used to hearing "typical bloody Yanks"-type comments, but I've never known anybody who genuinely dislikes Americans, for obvious reasons. It's just human nature to occasionally grumble about the big kid on the block. If it were something about Americans themselves, how come nobody hates Canadians, as you point out? Most furriners can't tell the difference. Many people dislike the policies of the US government, but then so do quite a few Americans.

[jimmmy]

My understanding of “THE POLL”* by the Pew Research Center, was that there was a general decline across the world in attitudes toward the U.S. the reasons:

quote;-------------------------
Suspicion about U.S. motives in Iraq coupled with the widely held beliefs that the United States routinely ignores the interests of other nations and doesn't do enough to help solve global problems
End quote----------------------

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A11089-2002Dec4.html

But that U.S. culture, products (esp. media products) and people were generally well regarded and wanted.

*Survey include a total of 38,263 randomly selected adults in 44 countries

[istara]

When people here express dislike (often strong) for "Americans" they nearly always - as far as I am aware - mean American politics/politicians, and most specifically, George Dubya Bush.

The only thing that causes huge dislike and resentment here against Americans generally is the *perceived* ignorance or bias of the American masses against matters Islamic, and Israel/Palestine.

The more educated here focus this dislike on the American and international media though, rather than blaming the consumers of that media.

Like any racism, racism against Americans in a true prejudicial, hostile, irrational sense tends to only be prevalent among certain echelons of society - ie the far less well educated.

[jenex]

I lived in England for a time and at first was offended by anything said against Americans. But after a while I gained a broader perspective and was able to understand alot of the resentment towards us; I could even laugh at all the American jokes Jeremy Clarkson told! It's good to hear from people in other nations that us average citizens are not being blamed for things we cannot control. Do the people in Islamic nations know that about 99% of media we recieve about the Islamic faith is positive and supportive? We aren't being told to distrust or hate anyone.
This is encouraging, thank you for the posts!

[occ]

Most people who have strongly negative or positive opinions on Americans are likely fairly ignorant of our actual culture. I wouldn't take these polls seriously in terms of condemnation of America -- but I would take them seriously in terms of how hatred can take root amongst uninformed masses.

[everton]

Originally posted by jenex
...I could even laugh at all the American jokes Jeremy Clarkson told!
Did you hear Clarkson say anything kind about anyone? The Germans? The French? The Spanish? Vegetarians? He sees himself as a kind of smug, English, P. J. O'Rourke-style curmudgeon slamming anything that might spoil his fun, especially if it's foreign.

If you had English ears instead of American ones you'd hear plenty of abuse travelling eastwards across the Atlantic as well - trust me. It shouldn't be taken very seriously IMHO.

These polls only ever seem to be published to get a cheap reaction, or to scare people into thinking paranoid thoughts. The world does not hate America or Americans, but the current geopolitical situation (not only in respect of the Middle East) gives plenty of reason to believe that, *perhaps*, there are aspects of US policy that might be inspired by selfish reasons that are so far unclear, and that the price for carrying them to fruition might have to be paid by everyone else.

[Hari Seldon]

Just for the record, I am an American citizen and I have been living in Canada for 34 years and not become a citizen for a number of reasons, some silly.

There was a poll reported this morning that 38% of Canadians believe that W is a greater threat to world security than Saddam Hussein. Apparently they asked for elaboration of the opinion and it turned out that they typically felt that he was sitting on the largest arsenal the world has ever known (an undeniable fact) and didn't have the foggiest idea what he was doing. Still 38% (nearly a majority from Ontario east) answered that poll that way. I don't necessarily agree with the poll (and I do believe that religious fundamentalism--not limited to Islam--trumps them both) but i am fully in accord with the elaboration.

[China Guy]

My experience in Asia for many years has been that it is quite rare to find someone who dislikes Americans personally. That is, directed at you personally because you are an American. After the Hainan Plane incident, which is the most tense time I've been through for raised passions, a lot of Chinese came up to me and quite venomously said "why did you bomb us?" To which I replied, "me??? WTF, I was in Shanghai over the weekend." Then it became "why did your government do it" and no longer a personal attack.

Most people separate government policy and you being personally responsible. also, an awful lot of people in Asia have at least a distant friend or relative who have become Americans.

[Mops]

I'd agree with istara and China Guy from a German perspective. The attitue of people I talk about politics is mostly:


US as a country: awesome.
US people: mostly decent people, same proportion of a**holes as everywhere. Lots of achievements they can be proud of (including their part in defeating Nazism). A bit histrionic in expressing patriotism.
US-produced mass media: addictive (continues to produce movies and TV series that really cannot be missed) but oh so parochial.
US leadership: How can a sane population democratically elect those right-wing zealots and Christian Taliban?

[jjimm]

I was about to post something, but tschild has expressed everything I was going to say, better than I could. The only addition is - US foreign policy: sometimes good, usually dangerous. Subject to serious amounts of blowback.

[TV time]

Originally posted by occ
Most people who have strongly negative or positive opinions on Americans are likely fairly ignorant of our actual culture. I wouldn't take these polls seriously in terms of condemnation of America -- but I would take them seriously in terms of how hatred can take root amongst uninformed masses. My experience overseas and in the U.S. is that there is more ignorance about other countries' cultures by citizens of the U.S. than the other way around by a wide margin.

Regarding the OP, I tend to agree with the bulk of the previous posters. It has been my experience that Americans as a whole are liked and respected. The current administration, however, is seen as something of a bully who disregards international law and agreements rather cavilerly.

[Wallenstein]

There tend to be two main sterotypes of Americans where I live:

1) the 50-something, overweight tourist couple, husband most likely with a loud shirt and baseball cap, camera around neck, both of them talking too loudly in Kings College chapel.

2) the v loud, extra-bubbly US college gal over for a couple of semesters. Probably a cheer-leader (usually blonde), annoyingly chirpy voice.

Neither image is actually representative of the majority of American visitors (obviously), but US graduate students do seem to be louder and more "in-yer-face" than other nationalities, and that's often enough for people to fit them into the standard mould.

Personally I think the reason Americans get a hard time over here sometimes is that they are so close to the UK in so many general ways (language, ethnicity, ethics etc) that any smaller differences in mannerisms or etiquette present themselves more obviously to us.

Basically wot usram said, we take the piss 'cos deep down we know you ain't so different to us really, and in some ways we are a bit jealous I guess.

Anti-US attitudes *are* getting worse though, but it still tends to be aimed either specifically at Pres. Bush or at the conservative, 'bomb anything that moves', "USA!"-chanting section of society.

The fact you lot seem to enjoy shooting each other so much while still bleating on about the right to bear arms also seems kinda weird to a *lot* of people over here (IME).

[sunbear]

We pollute the world with Baywatch and teh Sopranos...

[Lemur866]

Yeah, except those people who hate "the US government" but not the citizens seem to forget that we citizens choose our government. It is not "beyond our control". We have the government we have because we choose that government.

Yes, many countries have dictatorships. You can't hate Iraqis because of Saddam Hussein. But George Bush isn't a dictator. He was elected president of the United States by the people of the United States.

[syncrolecyne]

An interesting thing about that poll is it showed American popularity surged in the former Soviet countries polled (Russia, Ukraine, and Uzbekistan). Are there any reasons for that? Perhaps Russia's terrorism problems in Chechnya (or the American's blind eye to some of Russia's abuses) has given many people there the impression that at last, we are on the same side?

[Cisco]

Originally posted by Lemur866
We have the government we have because we choose that government.



Bush didn't even win the popular vote. And how many percent of the total eligible population voted for him? I seem to remember reading somewhere that it was like 8 or 9%. Yea, we really chose him alright...(not that RoboGore would've been any better...)

[trader_of_shots]

< rant >

OK - I was very very anti american for a long time, this came about by ther american peoples ignorance to world events nor to the damage they are occuring to the rest of the world.

Then i went to America

Pretty much the American people are lovely, warm and open. I honestly was completely wrong about them. I was blaming the American people, whom are force fed censored news - forced to consume - re-educated in there own homes - for the Horrible things the Amreican goverment is doing/has done.

Like .. the American goverment insists on telling the American people that the rest of the world is just jealous. pfft whatever.

Anyway - It is only natural that the American people be blamed for the actions of there goverment by the rest of the world because the rest of the world simply does not know how repressed you guys are.

BTW i am going back to the US in a few months to marry a yank - Turn coat ?

[sunbear]

Our ignorance is difficult to hide when we have Bush touring the world. Also, ignoring global warming etc so we can drive bigger SUVs does not help our image. Europeans get a chance to look good, and ignore their own spending, as we look like big spenders and consumers.

[jenex]

....I didn't vote for Goerge W and he never called me to ask what I think he should do regarding international policies. I know we have the idea that the American news media is not full of special intrest additives and government spoon feeding; that's why I personally am concerned with global opinions and how they will affect the country I live in.
Has Jeremy Clarkson ever made fun of Canada? I think not. Belgium yes, but never Canada. What is it about Canada??? If Americans put gravy on their french fries would that help?

[TV time]

Originally posted by Lemur866
He was elected president of the United States by the people of the United States. Well,..sort of. At least he was chosen by the electoral college. That's kind of like being chosen by popular vote, in a way...Almost. And that stuff that went on in Florida (that got him the electoral win) where his brother is governor, was probably just coincidental.

I mean what I just wrote sincerely, but it keeps coming out sardonic.

[Charlie Tan]

Things American, that stupify us over here:

- Jerry Springer/ Jenny Jones / Rikki Lake ("Oh, is that what everyday Americans really look like" - as opposed to the sterotype from Hollywood)
- How incredibly violent the society is.
- Your views on the death penalty. Mainly, that it's even an issue and has not been abolished.
- Your views on abortion.
- How ignorant Americans are on world issues/geography (And I throw in, myself: "With great power comes great responsability". If peeple were less ignorant, would the forreign policy be the same?

Misconceptions gallore:

- The US has no culture of its own, no history, it's all plastic.
- The home of the double standard (meaning every single citizen)
- Fast and eats lots of burgers.
- Ugly American Tourist.

Not my own opinions, mind you. Just some general things often heard from the public over here.

[sunbear]

- Ugly American Tourist

Thye stick out in travels, as they are the ones, besides Brits, who only speak English!

[pepperlandgirl]

The US has no culture of its own, no history, it's all plastic.

Ever read The American Scholar by Ralph Waldo Emerson? Sadly, he makes the same complaint....

[lil_faerygirl]

Ok, granted that Bush isn't very educated. And he's more than a little aggressive. (probably, too much in the case of Iraq). But I think he did a good job right after 9/11. Face it, the Taliban needed to go, regardless of whether or not they were haboring Bin Laden. If there's one good thing he has done it's that. (we had help from other countries, too. Thank you for that.) You can argue that he risked more American lives by sending in troops, but I have family who were in the army in Afghanistan and what they saw maybe them WANT to be there, just to get rid of the Taliban. Bush isn't a total loser. He just acts like it sometimes. I definitely like him more than Clinton. Don't even get me started on that guy.

[MelCthefirst]

Some of my best friends are American (no really!) but they are educated and have all lived in other countries or have family members from other countries - maybe this gives them a bigger world view?
I have also met lots of lovely people when travelling in the states.
The thing that gets me is the ignorance of the masses - the endless supply of the ignorant on day time talk shows.
We arguably have this in all countries, it's just that America shows us this on TV and Film on a daily basis, thus appearing to have more than its fair share of ignorance and stupidity.
Also the 'rights' issue.
I cannot fathom how anyone can fight for their right to not wear a seatbelt, helmit, fence their pool etc etc because for us, it might be a pain but we fundamently understand that it is for safety of us and our families and communities. This also makes Americans come across as ignorant.
Also, ofcourse, the right to have guns - how can Americans on the one hand become shocked and horrified at the high school shoot outs etc and yet fight for the right to have millions of guns circulating in the communities?

[jenex]

Just because SOME Americans like to keep an arsenal of guns doesn't mean we all do. Some people are responsible enough to keep atomic bombs if they wanted to, but sadly we can't single out stupid people and take away their toys...or sterilize them. I know it's controversial, but some people really should not be allowed to breed.

[everton]

Originally posted by sunbear
- Ugly American Tourist

Thye stick out in travels, as they are the ones, besides Brits, who only speak English!
<nitpick>That's not quite true for a variety of reasons. For instance, there are other travellers who don't learn the language of the country they're visiting too (and there's less incentive to do it if your home language is English, which doesn't only include Americans and British). </nitpick>

But you're right that we both score badly in surveys compared to most other countries, and yes it does help if you can at least make an effort to speak to people in their own language.

pepperlandgirl
I hope, and believe, that Emerson wouldn't say that if he was writing today. Exported popular culture rarely places anyone's country in a favourable light, though, however much money it makes.

[DMC]

From my ten years in Germany, as an American citizen, I agree with several previous posters that it's not the people, with one exception, that are disliked, but many of the government policies and attitudes.

The one exception is the military. There IS discrimination against soldiers in towns with American bases, even though the same towns have absolutely no problems with non-military Americans living or visiting there.

As someone who fit into both camps during my stay (two years as a soldier, eight as a civilian), I can understand the hostility towards the soldiers, as they would often go out on the town in large groups, get drunk, and cause all sorts of problems. To be fair, they weren't real happy with having German bases in their towns for the same reason, but the language/cultural differences made it even worse when dealing with our soldiers.

[Mops]

>The one exception is the military [...]

Two words: young men.

[msmith537]

Originally posted by e-logic
The fact you lot seem to enjoy shooting each other so much while still bleating on about the right to bear arms also seems kinda weird to a *lot* of people over here (IME). [/B]


We need our guns for keepin the King of England out of our face.

[DMC]

Originally posted by tschild
>The one exception is the military [...]

Two words: young men.

Yes, oftentimes large groups of young men, under the influence of alcohol. :)

That's why I also mentioned that they weren't fond of bases full of soldiers of any ilk, even their own.

[Colin_P]

I've often wondered about the motivations/agenda behind the military actions undertaken by the American government.

Its hard to understand why they'd intervene in some conflicts whilst ignoring others.

[Sparc]

As regards Europe add to all of the above a fundamental difference in philosophy of politics. While European political ideals tend tends towards forwarding the "common good" the US ideal is more oriented at the "individual good." It might seem to be a hairsplitting difference at first glance, but has deep ramifications. For instance: the resulting conception of freedom in the US flavor can come across as offensive to a European sensibility since, according to the European, the common good supercedes the freedoms of the individual to a higher degree than in the US. This is most clearly obvious in cases like gun control.

When you add to that the higher degree of moral idealism in the US it becomes downright confusing to us Urapeeans. Hence it’s easy to end up asking yourself: how can a country that embraces freedom and the rights of the individual to run their lives as they see fit also support the death penalty and seriously consider banning abortions. You could say that, to some, the Merkins look like a load of freewheeling, gun tooting Libertarian moralists.

On the same mint Americans once in awhile slam us for being overtly statist and reactionary. Which combined with the paradoxically liberal moral climate could arguably come across as we were a bunch of bureaucratic, dope smoking Socialist libertines.

As most often the root of the evil, whatever end of the stick you are at, is all the nationalist and patriotic crap that is spewed either in magnanimous spills through the mouth, as in the US, or in sizzling jets through the nose, as in Europe. Whichever way it comes out the vomit stinks and corrodes the poor bastard who happens to be standing at the receiving end.

Just my two Euro Cents…

Sparc

[squid]

So everyone hates us now...they'll come back as soon as they need something. Gotta go...Jerry Springer's on.

[manhattan]

Off to IMHO.

[jenex]

I cannot explain why the Jerry Springer watching, anti-abortion rights crusaders, and consumers of all things at the expense of others have become the average American stereotype. Oh, I forgot rude tourist and poor chocolate connoiseur. I don't see myself as any of those things and most other Americans I know are only one or two of them, if at all. Does Jerry Springer realize what a pain in the ass he is??? I'm nice and I don't throw chairs at my relatives, damn it!

[gex gex]

originally posted by lil_faerygirl
Ok, granted that Bush isn't very educated. And he's more than a little aggressive. (probably, too much in the case of Iraq). But I think he did a good job right after 9/11. Face it, the Taliban needed to go, regardless of whether or not they were haboring Bin Laden.

Do you know how many other countries have leaders that "need to go" just as much as the Taliban did. It ain't Bush's job to decide who runs countries that aren't his own. Bin Laden made his attack slightly more justifiable, but this still doesn't mean that he did a good job post 9/11. Anyone could have shuffled around Washington post 9/11 and it'd be called "doing a good job."

If there's one good thing he has done it's that. (we had help from other countries, too. Thank you for that.) You can argue that he risked more American lives by sending in troops, but I have family who were in the army in Afghanistan and what they saw maybe them WANT to be there, just to get rid of the Taliban. Bush isn't a total loser. He just acts like it sometimes. I definitely like him more than Clinton. Don't even get me started on that guy.

You know, we really didn't care about who Clinton did what to and what he said about it. At least we felt like he could find other countries on a map and that he knew what he was talking about.


Anyway.

I was talking to the security guy at work last night, and we were discussing Survivor.

Him: (on Ted) well, it was cause he was pissing in the cave. It's disgusting. Typical yanks... I knew some back in the army.

So, now you know. If you'd just learn to piss outside the cave, the rest of the world would like you a lot better ;)

[astorian]

Many people around the world love AND hate the U.S., simultaneously.

P.J. O'Rourke told a hilarious story years ago, about his travels in Lebanon. He said that he met a young Arab male who screamed in his face that America was the Great Satan, and that all Americans deserved to die and (in almost the same breath!) he was going to dental school in Michigan, as soon as he could get the financing arranged.

I think this Arab O'Rourke described is typical of many people in the Third World. They resent the U.S. for its debaucherie and conspicuous consumption, while at the same time, they dream of moving to America, and SHARING in some of that debaucherie and consumption!