Is Homo Sapiens the only specie that rapes?

[teela brown]

Is the act of rape committed only by Homo Sapiens, or do other animals do this? I have a couple of ideas to discuss, but I'd like to hear from your well-oiled brains first. What do you think?

[C K Dexter Haven]

You'll need to define "rape" a little first. Homo sapiens is the only species where a male might have intercourse with a female, even if the female threatens to scream for the police, or to hit the male on the head with her handbag.

[KimKatt]

It's also the only species in which the male can hold a gun on the female, or threaten to have her fired... At least I think it is.

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Bragging mode on:

I got my CNE!

Bragging mode off.

[Dragwyr]

Considering that most animal species capablie of sexual reproduction have sex specifically for perpetuating the species, I would say YES. Humans are one of a couple of species that have sex for pleasure (I think dolphins have been cited as doing this as well, but I'm not so sure I buy it). Therefore, humans would be the only species capable of rape... all the other animals have sex because they WANT to have offspring. I guess you can't call that rape then.

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-Dragwyr
"If God had meant for man to eat waffles,
he would have given him lips like snowshoes"
-Rev. Billy C. Wirtz

[SoMoMom]

I was watching a documentary about dolphins one time. They showed a group of male dolphins gang up on a female dolphin for the purpose of reproductive activity. The female swam from them until she was exhausted and could no longer get away from them. Can we call that rape? I don't know. It gave me a sick feeling in my stomach watching it though.

[Myron Van Horowitzski]

all the other animals have sex because they WANT to have offspring

I disagree, Dragwyr. Other animals do not have sex specifically for perpetuating their species; they do it because it feels good. They don't know any better

I would say that only humans ever have sex expressly for procreation, because we're the only ones who know that sex=offspring!

But I think what you mean is that only humans have sex even when they know it won't produce offspring.

See you in Great Debates, eh?

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Your brain-in-a-jar,
Myron

Imbibo, ergo sum.

[handy]

Well, animals can't say 'No' so, guess so.

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"'How do you know I'm mad' said Alice.
'You must be, ' said the Cat, 'or you wouldn't have come here.'"

[Needs2know]

When I was a teen I was with my dad one day. We were at one of his friends shops in town. The guy had this lab that laid around in the shop all day. One of their friends came in with his pet Bobcat on a leash. This stupid dog gets up comes over and tries to mount the damned Bobcat. Need I say that fur and a good portion of the dogs nose began to fly.

Needs2know

[KeithB]

In the talk.origins archive, they talk about bedbugs that practice "stabbing rape." After mating, a bedbug puts a plug in the female so that no other male can mate. Some males get around this by simply using a sharp penis that pierces the female and injects the sperm into her body so that it can travel to the eggs.

Now get this, some males perform this act of stabbing *on other males* so that their sperm gets carried to more females.

[vandal]

Actually, there is a species of male bats that forces sex upon the female. I cannot remember the name of the species or the common name, but it was a recent special on bats on the discovery channel. It may rerun again. Or hopefully, someone here can elaborate on it.

[Fillet]

If you define rape as a male forcing a female to have sexual relations when the female is unwilling, then apparently our primate relations also have the capacity to rape. See this page (http://www.mc.maricopa.edu/anthro/origins/apeswrath.html) for a discussion of aggressive primate behaviors in general.

[Mr. Cynical]

Once, about ten years ago, I went to the zoo here in Denver. What I saw was about as close to an attempted rape as it gets, I think.

'Twas in the monkey house. I was watching the baboons scamper about their pen, frolicking to and fro.

Well, Mr. Dominant Male comes rushing from the other side of the cage to the front, where there were a pair of females playing with a stick. The male immediately grabbed the hindquarters of one of the females, and attempted to mount her.

The female wanted no truck with this, and braced her feet against the male's hips. He pulled harder, trying to break her resistance, and the female let out a blood-curdling scream. (by this time I was standing ther all agog, dumbstruck)

When the male realized that he was not going to be able to mate with her, he immediately began to masturbate himself with his foot, (I imagine he was thanking him monkey-god for opposable toes right about then) while still attempting to force the female onto himself.

The female, still in his grip, continued to scream. The others in the pen screamed. I was ready to scream.

Finally, the male climaxed onto the straw beneath them, and settled back onto his haunches. He released the female, who immediately ran to the far side of the pen, and clung to the other female for support.

I'd classify that as an attempted rape, for sure. I would also classify it as pretty nasty that the male picked up the discharge and ate it.

$0.02 worth of my personal experience. Hope it helps.



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The more I teaches you, the dumber you gets.

[Earl Snake-Hips Tucker]

I think most rapes are probably committed by straights.

Ok, that's Homo sapiens.

Nevermind.

[teela brown]

I guess the concept of rape can be looked at in two seemingly similar but basically different ways: (1) an act of engaging in sex when one of the two individuals is unwilling but unable to prevent the act; and (2) an act of sex brought about because one individual has threatened the other with harm or death unless the other complies. Situation (1) seems to describe all the acts of "animal" rape we are discussing, while only Homo Sapiens has the sophistication to commit situation (2).

My ideas are that some special conditions must be present before "animal" rape can occur. Because animals are unable to communicate the promise of a threat, as humans can, the only way they can have sex with an unwilling partner is to be able to somehow "pin" the partner. I've heard that seals on the beach can rape (pinning down the female with their weight), ducks can rape (in the water -- the female cannot easily get out from under and fly away quickly), and have heard of zoo gorillas pinning the female in the corner of the cage (one assumes that in the jungle, she can run away). However, I have heard Jane Goodall describe an instance of male chimps chasing a female up a tree and pushing her off a high branch in frustration when she refused to mate. This is approaching situation (2).

So, I guess my point is that if an animal female is physically able to run away from her unwanted partner, she should be able to avoid "animal" rape.

[Arnold Winkelried]

My answer to the OP would be no, Homo Sapiens is not the only species.

I read an article in Science News or Scientific American once about a species of platyhelminth (flatworm) where one male will occasionaly insert his penis into another male's reproductive canal, and depost a ball of a cement-like substance that will prevent the other male from extruding his penis and therefore render the other male unable to mate.

I would classify that as an example of homosexual rape.

[Lance Turbo]

Originally posted by Arnold Winkelried:
I read an article in Science News or Scientific American once about a species of platyhelminth (flatworm) where one male will occasionaly insert his penis into another male's reproductive canal, and depost a ball of a cement-like substance that will prevent the other male from extruding his penis and therefore render the other male unable to mate.

I would classify that as an example of homosexual rape.

I would classify that as either, "What will Mother Nature think of next?" or, "Eww!"



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Am I supposed to believe that all this rain was suspended in mid-air until moments ago?

[astro]

Animals are perfectly capable of communicating the "promise" of a real threat and in point of fact, do so quite often as a major part of establishing status hierarchies. Several primate species (among others) "rape" in both the first and second sense of your definition.

As a side note females have also developed several counter strategies to achieve their pro-creational game plans. Some good references on this issue would be

The Red Queen: Sex and the Evolution of Human Nature by Matt Ridley

The Moral Animal : Why We Are the Way We Are: The New Science of Evolutionary Psychology by Robert Wright

Amazon has both.


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>I guess the concept of rape can be looked at in two seemingly similar but basically different ways: (1) an act of engaging in sex when one of the two individuals is unwilling but unable to prevent the act; and (2) an act of sex brought about because one individual has threatened the other with harm or death unless the other complies. Situation (1) seems to describe all the acts of "animal" rape we are discussing, while only Homo Sapiens has the sophistication to commit situation (2).
My ideas are that some special conditions must be present before "animal" rape can occur. Because animals are unable to communicate the promise of a threat, as humans can, the only way they can have sex with an unwilling partner is to be able to somehow "pin" the partner. I've heard that seals on the beach can rape (pinning down the female with their weight), ducks can rape (in the water -- the female cannot easily get out from under and fly away quickly), and have heard of zoo gorillas pinning the female in the corner of the cage (one assumes that in the jungle, she can run away). However, I have heard Jane Goodall describe an instance of male chimps chasing a female up a tree and pushing her off a high branch in frustration when she refused to mate. This is approaching situation (2).

So, I guess my point is that if an animal female is physically able to run away from her unwanted partner, she should be able to avoid "animal" rape.

[handy]

Some animals have sex when they are only 6 months old. That's statutory. Hmmm.

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"'How do you know I'm mad' said Alice.
'You must be, ' said the Cat, 'or you wouldn't have come here.'"

[bibliophage]

The book Demonic Males states that non-dominant male orangutans frequently rape females. Normally females will mate only with dominant males, so rape is the only way a non-dominant male can spread his seed. The book even describes one case of a male orangutan raping a human female.

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Work is the curse of the drinking classes. (Oscar Wilde)

[Narile]

Male blackfooted ferrets* will sneak into the den of an unrelated female ferret who has young and forcibly mate with any immature females in the den. Appearently the males sperm will survive in the females uterine tract long enough to impregnate her when she sexualy matures.
The images of this was rather shocking to see on one of the discovery channels (Animal planet I think, but not certain.)

*I think it is blackfooted ferrets, though it might be one of the other mustelid families such as weasels or mink.

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>>Threads killed, no questions asked, just give me the payment, and I'll post to it...the kiss of death of late.<<

---The dragon observes

[domina]

Posted by Vandal:
Actually, there is a species of male bats that forces sex upon the female.
I cannot remember the name of the species or the common name, but it
was a recent special on bats on the discovery channel. It may rerun
again. Or hopefully, someone here can elaborate on it.

I remember that show. As I recall, they were bats who pair-bonded. One female was separated temporarily from her mate, and another male jumped on her. The female squawked and put up a fuss--it certainly looked like rape.

[RoboDude]

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When I was a teen I was with my dad one day. We were at one of his friends shops in town. The guy had this lab that laid around in the shop all day. One of their friends came in with his pet Bobcat on a leash. This stupid dog gets up comes over and tries to mount the damned Bobcat. Need I say that fur and a good portion of the dogs nose began to fly.
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A pet bobcat?

Is that legal? Where was this?

[Anti Pro]

The issue that hasn't been addressed yet, is that rape in the human world isn't just about sex, but about power, and humiliation.

The examples given so far, have addressed males wanting to 'relieve' themselves, but not about necessarily humiliating and degrading the female. Human rapists seek privacy and usually darkness to cover the act they know to be 'wrong' and illegal. Animals don't seek that, their acts aren't based on a 'wrong' vs. 'right' behavior.

Many rapists are married, so it isn't just about the sexual act, they have access to that. It is about exerting power to induce fear and helplessness in the female, that is exciting to them. And if it isn't achieved sufficiently, they will use sodomy, which I doubt is echoed in the animal kingdom.

Though I've witnessed odd, aberrant behavior, my mom's FEMALE dog was forever 'humping' the leg of any unwary visitor to our house (pretty embarrassing if it happened to be a prospective boyfriend, they tend to look upon this as an unhappy dating experience!)

[Whammo]

When the male realized that he was not going to be able to mate with her, he immediately began to masturbate himself with his foot


Dear God man! Dont you know i'm trying to work here?!?! So I'm taking this call and trying to walk someone through fixing their shit and reading the board at the same time. Then I read your post. Your whole description is priceless, I almost lost it on the phone and had to make an excuse and put this guy on hold while I laughed.

Are you trying to get me fired??!?! :D

[meara]

I agree! ROFL on the monkey story -- I had to read that one to my husband to explain why I was laughing so hard.

[Beruang]

I guess the concept of rape can be looked at in two seemingly similar but basically different ways: (1) an act of engaging in sex when one of the two individuals is unwilling but unable to prevent the act; and (2) an act of sex brought about because one individual has threatened the other with harm or death unless the other complies. Situation (1) seems to describe all the acts of "animal" rape we are discussing, while only Homo Sapiens has the sophistication to commit situation (2).



Only if one can show that animals have a "will." Which requires a sense of self. And probably a sense of morality.

[Arnold Winkelried]

The examples given so far, have addressed males wanting to 'relieve' themselves, but not about necessarily humiliating and degrading the female.How about the flatworm homosexual rape example? I think the male that was the victim is degraded and humiliated.

[Iolanthe]

The examples given so far, have addressed males wanting to 'relieve' themselves, but not about necessarily humiliating and degrading the female.How about the flatworm homosexual rape example? I think the male that was the victim is degraded and humiliated.


Actually Arnold, I'd call this one more competition for a mate, rather than an attempt to humiliate & degrade. Humiliation and degradation may be the result, both for the male flatworm and the female baboon, but I don't think it was the intent on the aggressor. How degraded can a flatworm feel anyway? Mind you, *I'm* feeling slightly queasy.

[jiHymas]

It took two years, but Scientific American came through for us. In the June 2002 issue, Maggioncalda & Sapolsky describe rape as a common reproductive strategy among orangutans. Briefly, there are three types of fertile orangutans - adult males, arrested adolescent males and females. Adult males are about twice the weight of members of the other two groups and there is a social tendency for young males to remain arrested adolescents for as long as there is an adult male around (if they start to grow, they get beat up a lot).

"The great majority of adult female orangutans are sexually receptive only to mature males." The arrested adolescent males will rape adult females.

There are a number of references in the article; the on-line ones are www.orangutan.org, www.orangutan.com and www.orangutannetwork.net

[El Zagna]

My great-uncle Zenas Bartlett had a pet monkey, Jake, whose bad behavior was documented in the book The Marlin Compound by Frank Oltorf.

...[Jake had] an unnatural attachment to cats. He
would grab those who strayed at the barn and would
race with the yowling victim to the top of a tree, where
the unfortunate cat faced the awful alternative of being
dropped or seduced. Sleek toms were as vulnerable as
demure tabbies, it making little difference to Jake as it
was all wrong anyway.

[urban1a]

Originally posted by Dragwyr
Considering that most animal species capablie of sexual reproduction have sex specifically for perpetuating the species, I would say YES. Humans are one of a couple of species that have sex for pleasure (I think dolphins have been cited as doing this as well, but I'm not so sure I buy it). Therefore, humans would be the only species capable of rape... all the other animals have sex because they WANT to have offspring. I guess you can't call that rape then.

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-Dragwyr
"If God had meant for man to eat waffles,
he would have given him lips like snowshoes"
-Rev. Billy C. Wirtz

You need to look up the Bonobos (pygmy chimpanzees). The use sex much like humans do. Not just for reproduction.

Check out this link http://songweaver.com/info/bonobos.html I've forgotten how do to the fancy coding so this will have to do

[chula]

Originally posted by Dragwyr
Considering that most animal species capablie of sexual reproduction have sex specifically for perpetuating the species, I would say YES. Humans are one of a couple of species that have sex for pleasure (I think dolphins have been cited as doing this as well, but I'm not so sure I buy it). Therefore, humans would be the only species capable of rape... all the other animals have sex because they WANT to have offspring. I guess you can't call that rape then.I want to echo what Anti Pro said. Rape is not about sexual pleasure, it's about domination. So whether or not other animals have sex for pleasure or reproduction is not relevant to the rape issue. It seems that some (I'm thinking of primates) do use sex as a show of domination.

[chula]

I just ran across this (http://www.snopes2.com/critters/wild/pleasure.htm):Bonobos and dolphins are the only animals other than humans who engage in sex for pleasure. The above claim is true for a very specific definition of "sex for pleasure," which in this case is copulation between the male and female of a species where such activity is completely separated from the purpose of fertilization. That is, in only a couple of animal species other than humans will males and females willingly (and regularly) engage in sex with each other even when there is no possibility that offspring will be produced as a result. (Note that this definition specifically excludes homosexual and masturbatory activity, as neither of those categories involves male-female pairings.)

[Tranquilis]

Wild Stallions rape. When a stallion is ejected from his dominant poistion, the newly dominant stallion will have forceable sex with as many mares as possible, for the purpose of causing miscarriages in any pregnant mares.

It's about reproductive strategy: If the mares miscarry, they'll become available sooner to bear the new stallion's young, and the stallion will be guarding fewer of his former rival's offspring.

Needless to say, the mares resist this as much as possible, and it's not unheard-of for a new (or even established) stallion to recieve very serious wounds in the process.

Deer also rape, and in fact, ungulates in general can be very brutal.

Male lions kill the young of a male that has lost a battle for top position, for the purpose of bringing the females into heat as quickly as possible (and remove the young of his defeated rival). This may not be technically rape, but serves the same purpose, reproductive strategy-wise.

[zen101]

I think it's funny that people hear about rape in animal communities like dolphins, which are given credit for many human traits like intelligence; language; and curiosity, yet say they have "a hard time believing this". Why?

I do think there is only one quality truly unique among humans, our ability to self-hate. All evil is not exclusive of the homo sapiens specis. There are cannibal animals up and down the food chain, baby killing animals, greed too, and yes rape in it's various forms exists in the animal kingdom.

Rape for dominance seems to be the most common form, dogs for example will hump anything including yourt leg to assert dominance. Many other animals do this as well.

It's hard to ascribe actual motive to more deliberate sexual rape, but dolphins do indeed engage in this. Male dolphins form strong bonds with other young male dolphins while growing up and will often assauly younger female dolphins (usually ones that are not mated to a specific adult male) and apparently, according to at least one documentary on the Discovery channel and a Cornell web page that I can unfortunately no longer pull up, they engage in homosexual rape of much younger male dolphins as well. Although they do this without the benefit of papal sanction.

Seems that the more intelligent an animal is or the more leisure time it has the more nasty business it can get up to.