Propaganda strategy: Should the US have renamed Baghdad's airport?

[nogginhead]

In this morning's briefing (4/4/03), they announced that they've renamed the airport in Baghdad from Saddam International to Baghdad International. For example:

http://www.heraldsun.news.com.au/common/story_page/0,5478,6239440%255E25778,00.html


This seems like a formal renaming, not the informal naming of Bush International Airport (http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A36742-2003Mar27.html).

I'd suggest that if we don't want to seem like an army of occupation, we shouldn't be mandating the names of anything. However odious we may find the names the Iraqis have for them.

[Wyld Stallyn]

Well, it must get boring for the Iraqis having everything named "Saddam __________" or "Hussein________". Oh wait, they have the genocide and torture to keep them busy. Anyone know how long it's been called "Saddam International"?

[AZCowboy]

While I have a tendency to be critical of this administration's execution of this war, I have no problem with this one.

One of the tactical objectives of this engagement is to remove the "cult of personality" that Saddam Hussein reigns over Iraq. As you will notice, coalition troops routinely take down the SH billboards, statues, and any other pictures. The Iraqi's themselves are still to scared to do so, so the coalition troops are doing it for them.

Certainly, when a new government is constituted, they can also rename the airport.

At least they aren't calling it Dubya International.

Anecdotally, here (http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&ncid=1038&e=2&cid=540&u=/ap/war_establishing_order) is an interesting story about how the coalition troops are working with locals to re-establish a society with Iraqi input.

[Grey]

How exactly is labeling the international airport in Baghdad "Baghdad International Airport" an example of occupation? It describes what it is exactly.

Given the amount of time between controlling and renaming the place I doubt there was sufficient numbers of Iraqis to form a quorum.

[Squink]

How official can the name change be ? I seriously doubt that we've filed the necessary forms with the Iraqi Ministry of transport and communication. A truly official renaming will have to await the formation of a new government, and airport authority. Til then, Baghdad International has a pleasant, generic sound to it.

[nogginhead]

Originally posted by Grey
How exactly is labeling the international airport in Baghdad "Baghdad International Airport" an example of occupation? It describes what it is exactly.


If they want to call it that informally, it's fine. It's just that big public works projects are powerful symbols. So the US DoD deciding what the Iraqis and the world should call the Airport is symbolic of a level of control over the country that the US has thus far been unwilling to show. Recall, for example, that the US is not raising Old Glory anywhere, IIRC. In that particular propaganda move, we show symbolically that we are not conquerors: we don't claim this land for the US.


Given the amount of time between controlling and renaming the place I doubt there was sufficient numbers of Iraqis to form a quorum.

My point exactly. Everyone would probably agree that de facto the US controls the airport. But the public opinion of making that statement loudly (aggressively?) by renaming the airport is not the one we're been trying to cultivate.

AZCowboy
One of the tactical objectives of this engagement is to remove the "cult of personality" that Saddam Hussein reigns over Iraq. As you will notice, coalition troops routinely take down the SH billboards, statues, and any other pictures. The Iraqi's themselves are still to scared to do so, so the coalition troops are doing it for them.


I'm a little wary of this as well. There are two possibilities I see:
1) The Iraqis all hate Saddam and are afraid to show it.
2) The Iraqis don't hate Saddam enough to want to pull down the posters etc.

In either case, how does the US troops pulling down the posters help us? Help the Iraqis? I agree that it has domestic political value at home, and possbly morale benefits for the US soldiers, but one would hope that's not the point.

I question whether 1 or 2 is operative. It seems that the administration was 100% sure the Iraqis would run out an hug us, but that doesn't seem to be the dominant paradigm.

[AZCowboy]

I don't think it is related to numbers one or two.

Please read the anecdotal article I linked. It even talks about how US troops pulled down the Iraqi flag. The locals were offended, and the US agreed to let the Iraqi flag fly again.

The point is that we are fighting SH and his regime, not Iraq. Renaming SH Int'l Airport is consistent with this approach.

The issue is that the cult of personality that is SH is what we are fighting. Whether a democratic election of Iraqis would support our renaming or poster tearing isn't relevent, we're fighting to remove the vestiges of SH's influence on the populace.

After the war is over, and the Ba'athists removed from power, then it will be time to take into account how the Iraqis wish to honor/dishonor SH. Until then, we should be removing any symbols of SH's power.

[John Mace]

Funny, a few of us were suggesting this AM that it should be renamed George W. Bush international airport, adjacent to Powell City w/ easy access to Exxon Soccer Stadium.

[5 time champ]

I am surprised the name was not changed to Iraqi Freedom Airport.

[Largo62]

My local news anchor, in one of those "oops, I made a personal comment" moments, referred to it as a "thumb in the eye of Saddam Hussein," which seems to me entirely appropriate, given that this whole war is supposed to exist to remove the son-of-a-sow.

Once the war is over the Iraquis can call it whatever they want. It seems unlikely that Saddam will be even a part of the name they finally decide on.

[Left Hand of Dorkness]

I am surprised the name was not changed to Iraqi Freedom Airport.

Heh. When I heard this story on the radio this morning, I winced, actually expecting them to announce that it was renamed Freedom International Airport or something similarly obnoxious.

Sometimes it helps to remember that, however much I oppose the war, the folks in the military seem to have a lower goofball quotient than Congress has.

I thought this change was appropriate.

Daniel

[Rhum Runner]

I thought I had encountered every possible irrational criticism of the invasion. I see now that I was wrong.

[Priam]

Its a generic name acceptable to all. It says what it is, nothing more and nothing less. It is the International Airport in the general Baghdad metro area. Where, again, is the problem here?

[nogginhead]

Originally posted by Rhum Runner
I thought I had encountered every possible irrational criticism of the invasion. I see now that I was wrong.

Thank you for your insightful contribution to the conversation.

[nogginhead]

Originally posted by Priam
Its a generic name acceptable to all. It says what it is, nothing more and nothing less. It is the International Airport in the general Baghdad metro area. Where, again, is the problem here?


We're discussing the propaganda impact of choosing to rename the airport. Not the propriety of the name that was chosen.


If you think the name is not important, perhaps you wouldn't object to renaming 'Reagan Airport' back to 'Washington National'? Oh, that one's OK with you? How about changing 'Kennedy' back to 'Idlewild'?

[Azael]

If you think the name is not important, perhaps you wouldn't object to renaming 'Reagan Airport' back to 'Washington National'? Oh, that one's OK with you? How about changing 'Kennedy' back to 'Idlewild'?


But the name is important. "Saddam Hussein Airport" is a direct reference to the cult of personality that SH has built up around himself; I fail to see how this renaming is any different than tearing down the ubiquitous pictures of SH all over Iraq. Implying some sort of equivalence to renaming American airports named for political figures is a red herring. We are not currently at war with the US nor are we trying to remove any of those figures from power.


from Rhum Runner
I thought I had encountered every possible irrational criticism of the invasion. I see now that I was wrong.

I predict you will be wrong again... and again.

[nogginhead]

Originally posted by Azael


But the name is important. "Saddam Hussein Airport" is a direct reference to the cult of personality that SH has built up around himself; I fail to see how this renaming is any different than tearing down the ubiquitous pictures of SH all over Iraq. Implying some sort of equivalence to renaming American airports named for political figures is a red herring. We are not currently at war with the US nor are we trying to remove any of those figures from power.

[/b]


I think we agree on the importance of the name of the airport. I didn't mean to imply an equivalence, I was merely trying to make the point that it is something that people take very seriously.

I'm not sure I agree that it is the same as tearing down the posters, though. The name is something that's clearly determined by the government of the country (posters are not). It's symbolically a statement _more_ substantial than "we are in charge". It says "we are the government". Which is probably true, but it is expressly _not_ the message we are trying to send.

I mean, we could change the name of the nation back to Persia, and that would be a difference in scale from the airport name maybe smaller than the posters to the airport. And I doubt we would think it was a good propaganda move.

[quote]
I predict you will be wrong again... and again.


People will be criticizing this for a long, long, long time. That's what happens when you start a war against the wishes of at least a third of the citizens. Some people apparently want discussion to cease once a decision has been made. Those people should be living in a more totalitarian state that the US currently is.

[Azael]

Those people should be living in a more totalitarian state that the US currently is.


Some people seem to be losing their grasp on reality.

[nogginhead]

Apologies for the coding. :smack:

[Azael]

I mean, we could change the name of the nation back to Persia, and that would be a difference in scale from the airport name maybe smaller than the posters to the airport. And I doubt we would think it was a good propaganda move.

Erm... except we aren't invading Iran... yet. Iran = Persia IIRC.

If the name of the country was Saddam Hussein you might be on to something. I see nothing wrong with showing that we are in control and SH is not, as that seems to be the objective at hand. If we were renaming the airport to something offensive or sufficiently colonial in nature then you might have a legitimate complaint but come on... Besides, they can name the airport whatever they want once SH is removed and a new government is installed.

[nogginhead]

Originally posted by Azael


Some people seem to be losing their grasp on reality. [/B]

Perhaps that was a little extreme... but many people (including the prez (http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=174431&perpage=50&pagenumber=1)) seem to be getting awfully upset that dissent still exists. It gets to ya after a while.

[nogginhead]

Originally posted by Azael

Erm... except we aren't invading Iran... yet. Iran = Persia IIRC.


Oops. Brain misfire there... though probably not so far off, depending on whether you want to go back as far as Cyrus the Great or not. I think actually the name could have been applied to this area much more recently. But in modern usage it is usually synonymous with Iran.



If the name of the country was Saddam Hussein you might be on to something. I see nothing wrong with showing that we are in control and SH is not, as that seems to be the objective at hand. If we were renaming the airport to something offensive or sufficiently colonial in nature then you might have a legitimate complaint but come on... Besides, they can name the airport whatever they want once SH is removed and a new government is installed.


OK, look. I'm trying to talk about whether renaming the airport is consistent with our propaganda goal that we are 'liberating' Iraq.

I AM NOT SAYING IT WAS WRONG. I AM NOT COMPLAINING ABOUT IT.

I'm trying to discuss it.

[Priam]

Originally posted by nogginhead
If you think the name is not important, perhaps you wouldn't object to renaming 'Reagan Airport' back to 'Washington National'? Oh, that one's OK with you? How about changing 'Kennedy' back to 'Idlewild'?

No problems here. If it was changed to Chirac National Airport I might have a problem, but a generic name? I'd be hard-pressed to care less.

[NutWrench]

I think they should definitely rename Death-to-Carter Avenue. :D

[Alcibiades]

Of course they needed to change the name of the airport. Leaving it as it was gives the current regime legitimacy.

The name "Baghdad International Airport" is descriptively appropriate.

[scr4]

I see the ["http://www.airport-technology.com/codes/B.html"]airport code[/url] for Saddam/Baghdad International is SDA. Are they going to change that as well?

[scr4]

Sorry. Correct link: airport code (http://www.airport-technology.com/codes/B.html)

[Beagle]

Sometimes it helps to remember that, however much I oppose the war, the folks in the military seem to have a lower goofball quotient than Congress has. My wife, who works around politicians, agreed with me that this statement is funny, true, and somewhat profound.

[Bryan Ekers]

Of course they should have renamed it, in the interest of rapid communications.

Air Force Colonel: We'll dispatch the wing to (chuckle, snort) Saddam International Airport.
Air Force Major: Yes, sir. I'll get the crew chiefs in place at (snicker, chuckle) Saddam International Airport.
AFC: Yes, and make sure the supply trucks make a fuel drop at (giggle, chortle, snicker) Saddam International Airport.

How can have a staging area that no-one can name without giggling? It's un-American!

[Broomstick]

Originally posted by nogginhead
If you think the name is not important, perhaps you wouldn't object to renaming 'Reagan Airport' back to 'Washington National'?As a matter of fact, there were folks who protested the renaming of Washington National airport, and some of us still use the old name in preference to the new one.

But that would be a different argument.....

[Sam Stone]

I mean, we could change the name of the nation back to Persia, and that would be a difference in scale from the airport name maybe smaller than the posters to the airport. And I doubt we would think it was a good propaganda move.


How about 'Babylon International'?



I see the airport code (http://www.airport-technology.com/codes/B.html) for Saddam/Baghdad International is SDA. Are they going to change that as well?


Nah. Half the airports in the U.S. and Canada have 3-letter designators that don't match their current names. Names change all the time, the idents are generally permanent.

[LordDenning]

How about Saddam Hussein Memorial Airport?