Baseball Scorers: How would you score this?

[JamesCarroll]

I like to score baseball games whever I get the chance to see one in person. I'm not a pro, but I'm no slouch either. The following occured in today's Wilmington - Salem (Carolina League) game:

Batter 1: Walks
Batter 2: Hits it to short, who mishandles the ball. Both batters/runners are safe.

I scored it:
Batter 1: Reached 2nd on error and can not be an earned run; (he only made it to third, so it wasn't an issue).

Batter 2: here's the problem. The obvious play was to second for the DP, but I was always told that you can't assume that the DP would have worked; therefore Batter 2 would have reached on FC. As such he would have been an earned run if he scored.

There was one out at the time of the play (Batter 0: F8 to start the inning).

Did I score it right?

Thanks.

[doctordoowop]

The second batter would not necessarily be an earned run. If the next batter strikes out, for example , that should have been the 3rd out. Then all remaining runs are unearned,including the second batter. If, OTOH, the next batter hits a HR, all 3 are earned, because there should only be 2 outs, not yet 3.

[Treviathan]

I think you have to assume the throw would've gone to first, not second, thus making Batter #1 the earned run and Batter #2 the unearned run.

Originally posted by doctordoowop
If, OTOH, the next batter hits a HR, all 3 are earned, because there should only be 2 outs, not yet 3.

No, because the batter who reached base via the fielder's error is not the pitcher's responsibility, and thus only two of the three runs would be earned.

[RickJay]

I would score it

Batter 1: BB

Batter 2: On first E6
Runner 1 advances E6

Batter 2 is an unearned run no matter what; he is assumed to have reached E6, so he cannot score without that error. Whether or not Batter 1 is unearned depends on how the inning progresses.

The fact that the shortstop MIGHT have gone to second for the force is irrelevant; he didn't. According to the OP as I understand it he booted the ball without making the throw, so you assume he missed his shot at BATTER 2, not the lead runner (Batter 1.) No fielder's choice exists. He never made the choice.

This would be scored differently if the shortstop cleanly fielded the ball and DID make an attempt on Batter 1 at second, but say the second baseman bobbles the throw; then, in fact, Batter 2 reaches FC 6-4, and Batter 1 advances E4. Then Batter 1 would be unearned no matter what, and Batter 2 would be earned if he scored with less than 2 out and unearned if he scored with 2 out.

[Jonathan Chance]

I'm not quite sure that's right.

Everyone knows that one can't assume the DP in scoring. But I'm also pretty certain that one can't assume a FC as the fielder made no choice.

So, Batter 1 is on base and the pitcher's responsibility.

Batter 2 is on base and not the pitcher's responsibility.

Fielders Choice does not come into play as the fielder made no choice.

So a home run by batter 3 equals 2 ER and 3 R on the pitcher's record. And probably a stern talking to for the shortstop.

[cleops]

Originally posted by RickJay
I would score it

Batter 1: BB

Batter 2: On first E6
Runner 1 advances E6

Batter 2 is an unearned run no matter what; he is assumed to have reached E6, so he cannot score without that error. Whether or not Batter 1 is unearned depends on how the inning progresses.

The fact that the shortstop MIGHT have gone to second for the force is irrelevant; he didn't. According to the OP as I understand it he booted the ball without making the throw, so you assume he missed his shot at BATTER 2, not the lead runner (Batter 1.) No fielder's choice exists. He never made the choice.

This would be scored differently if the shortstop cleanly fielded the ball and DID make an attempt on Batter 1 at second, but say the second baseman bobbles the throw; then, in fact, Batter 2 reaches FC 6-4, and Batter 1 advances E4. Then Batter 1 would be unearned no matter what, and Batter 2 would be earned if he scored with less than 2 out and unearned if he scored with 2 out.

"...and Batter 2 would be...unearned if he scored with 2 out."
Interesting. Why is that?

[doctordoowop]

Correct-it doesn't matter which is unearned-if the next batter hits a HR-2 earned runs, not 3. Sorry. BTW,all 3 would be credited on their personal records for a run (scored).

[JamesCarroll]

I'll ask next time I'm at the park. Truth be told I'm not just a fan. I'm actually the sound operator (DJ) for the team and score every game for fun (and maybe the hopes of becoming Official Scorer someday; its pretty cut throat in the pressbox ;) ). Didn't want to cloud the OP with details.

They have a couple of OS's and there's one that always suffers my stupid questions, but he wasn't there today. Next time he is though I'll ask him.


Thanks for thoughts though. I still think Batter 2 would reach FC. Error or not, in my opinion the play was at 2nd and if 6 hadn't booted (correct, there was no throw) Batter 1 would be out and could never be earned. I can't assume DP, so B2 is FC and earned regardless.

But then that's why he's keepin' score and I'm playing "Sponge Bob Square Pants"....

[Freddy the Pig]

Originally posted by JamesCarroll
Thanks for thoughts though. I still think Batter 2 would reach FC. Error or not, in my opinion the play was at 2nd and if 6 hadn't booted (correct, there was no throw) Batter 1 would be out and could never be earned. I can't assume DP, so B2 is FC and earned regardless. That is entirely correct. As the scorer, you do have to exercise judgment as to where the play would have been made. If, for example, the runner had been running on the pitch, you would assume a play at first and, for purposes of earned run determination, assume that without the error you would have had B1 at second with one out. But absent such an unusual circumstance, again, your reasoning is 100% correct.

[Cyberhwk]

Originally posted by jklann
That is entirely correct. Yes it is, I work hand in hand with the official scorer for our local minor league team. In a game a week or two ago we had this play come up...TWICE in the same game!

[JamesCarroll]

I checked with the OS last night. He scored the same way I did. E6 on the first batter/runner (unearned all the way), FC on the second. The notion of "the fielder never had a chance to choose" was incorrect according to him. Since the first batter hadn't broken for second you must assume that 2nd was where the play was. If he had broken early (hit and run or SB attempt), then "maybe" as he put it.

Thanks to all who replied. Our season is windng down and the GM has already asked me to DJ next year. I think I'll ask him for an 'appretice scorer' position instead. Heck, who knows maybe some day I could make PA Announcer!!

:D