Pitting my goldfish

[SnoopyFan]

Nathan and David, I am REALLY mad at you!

We clean out your nice little tank before we go to Kentucky for Christmas. You had clean water and plenty of food, thanks to the vacation feeder. We even had my MIL drive a whole hour and a half to our house just to check on you guys.

You were waiting until we left the house for a few days to attack Sheba (the Betta fish), right? You three always seem to have gotten along. We specifically got a girl Betta so there wouldn't be any fighting.

But nooooooo. You guys just couldn't behave, could you? We come home to find Sheba MISSING from the tank. After some prodding, we find her under the vacation feeder, DEAD, and her FINS had been chewed off!!!!!!!

WTF? You chewed her FINS? And don't sit there and mouth your little fish mouths at me, you know darn well she couldn't have chewed them off herself! And don't give me the "we were hungry" routine, you were well fed the entire time.

I'm mad at the two of you and I'm tempted to flush you little bastards! She was a good little fish and never did you assholes any harm!

[aaslatten]

Yikes, I guess they had a nice Christmas dinner, though.

[torie]

I move the cases against Nathan and David be dismissed on the grounds that thier puny fish minds cannot comprehend the extreme and grievous nature of thier act.

[Sanscour]

I move that Nathan and David be executed in the most fitting fashion possible: death by pirahna.

Sanscour

[Lynn Bodoni]

You had a FEMALE Betta? What's the point? Males only fight other male Bettas, as far as I know.

[Lynn Bodoni]

I'm sorry, that last remark of mine sounds cold. I'm sorry that you lost a fish that you were fond of. It's never easy to lose a pet.

[gluteus maximus]

SnoopyFan, it's possible that the fin-chewing occurred post-mortem, and that Nathan and David are only guilty of desecration of a corpse, not ichthyocide. Goldfish and bettas are not really a good mix, thermally-speaking, because goldfish prefer cooler water temperatures, and bettas need warm water. Possibly Sheba died of natural causes, and Nathan and David were just pecking at her fins in an effort to revive her...

[Odinoneeye]

Male bettas mostly attack only other male bettas, but will often nip at anything with longer fins. Are your goldfish the long finned variety?

My guess is what gluteus said. Any fish will bite at another fish that is sick or dying. Bettas don't have a very long lifespan so she could have just died of old age. Could be a number of reasons.

[cowgirl]

I note that neither Nathan nor David has entered this thread to speak in their defense.

And I'm sorry to hear about Sheba. Better sleep with one eye open from now on ...

[Khadaji]

Originally posted by Lynn Bodoni
You had a FEMALE Betta? What's the point? Males only fight other male Bettas, as far as I know. Years ago (jeez has it already been 20 years?) I had a male betta that would attack anything with flashy colors.

[Elza B]

Originally posted by cowgirl
I note that neither Nathan nor David has entered this thread to speak in their defense.

And I'm sorry to hear about Sheba. Better sleep with one eye open from now on ...

"Mom! Mom! My goldfish is a murderer!"

Or so paraphrased. Why do I keep seeing Stan's evil goldfish in my head?

Ava

[BadBaby]

I've had two male betas for about four years now and am sort of on autopilot care-wise, but when I first got them all the books and sites I read said that while it was possible to have them in a mixed tank you had to watch the tank like a hawk. Either the beta or the others, depending upon fishy politics, could become lunch at the drop of a hat.

Poor little Sheba, she ain't comin' back.... where's the sad smiley when you need one?

[PunditLisa]

I note that neither Nathan nor David has entered this thread to speak in their defense.

I have been retained by Mr. Nathan* to defend him against these outrageous charges. Mr. Nathan wishes to enter a plea of "not guilty."

I would also make a motion to throw out any testimony given by Mr. SnoopyFan, the key investigator in this case. Mr. SnoopyFan has a long history of favoritism towards the CANINE species and, by his own words above, an extreme predudice against goldfish. I will prove how every piece of damning evidence against my client was collected by this known goldfish hater, and as such is tainted.

I will also illustrate how Mr. SnoopyFan in his single-minded, zealous pursuit against my clients due to his foregone conclusions regarding their guilt, failed to pursue leads relating to my clients' claim that a band of marauding piranhas was seen in the vicinity of Ms. Sheba's abode shortly before the discovery of her body.

I will also show that the crime scene was so corrupted by Mr. SnoopyFan's flea-bitten and filth-encrusted hands in his zeal to recover the body that any evidence linking him to the victim (like, oh, say, dental impressions) must be DISREGARDED! He admitted as such right here in the pit: "After some prodding..."

It's in the Pit
You must acquit!

Respectfully submitted and hopefully time stamped,

PunditLisa

*who is too stupid to realize that I am not an attorney

[Labor]

Did you find a 1920's style death ray in the tank?

[Never to be Queen]

I'm with gluteus maximus in thinking the chewing happened after the fact. Perhaps Sheba gorged herself on the vacation feeder.

I am sorry you lost your beta. I once had a very cool girl baby who was purchased from a science class that used her in an experiment. I encouraged her to make baby bettas with a handsome blue betta named Boniface. She was more into chewing on Boniface, however. She bit off his fins whenever she had a chance. I had to pull them apart when she started sinking her little betta teeth into his side. Boniface made lots of nests but he never got to use them for eggs.

[Never to be Queen]

Oh dear, I meant to say "I once had a very cool girl <B>betta</B>who was purchased from a science class that used her in an experiment." :eek: :eek:

That typo does make the thread more interesting though.

[BuckleberryFerry]

Originally posted by avabeth
"Mom! Mom! My goldfish is a murderer!"

Or so paraphrased. Why do I keep seeing Stan's evil goldfish in my head?

Ava

I'll thank you now for the nightmares I'll be having tonight.

[EddyTeddyFreddy]

Assuming Nathan and David are guilty as charged, Eddy (http://community.webshots.com/photo/782975/16661429ioKueSKFqo), Teddy (http://community.webshots.com/photo/782975/16661459kpafnBgxTn), and Freddy (http://community.webshots.com/photo/782975/16661499jHdDdhCSBB) have volunteered to carry out the execution.

P.S. Lynn, if that's not enough cute pix, how about this (http://community.webshots.com/photo/735286/805480) for a, shall we say, change of pace?

[SnoopyFan]

Is it me or does that horse pic look more like the horse has been into cocaine instead of snow?

[EddyTeddyFreddy]

:: snort ::

Naw, SnoopyFan, carrots are his major jones. Bran muffins are his addiction. He regards me as a mobile treat dispenser, so I often get a Pavlovian reaction to my presence (http://community.webshots.com/photo/3060406/3060539UemPScgJyk). Okay, once in a while he does hit the bottle (http://community.webshots.com/photo/3060406/3060438BPNStScQwj), but only on appropriate occasions (http://community.webshots.com/photo/3060406/3060443cSFJwXuCpA).

[SnoopyFan]

Do horses actually drink corn oil?

[EddyTeddyFreddy]

Not drink, exactly; they'll eat it if you mix say half a cup into their grain. Adds extra calories without giving them the carbo high that too much grain will. Nick's a mouthy guy and when I showed him his corn oil was frozen, he grabbed the bottle and stood there waving it at me while I whipped out my camera. :D

Doing stuff like this (http://community.webshots.com/photo/735286/805479) and this (http://community.webshots.com/photo/735286/805483) is how he got his nose powdered.

[Aldebaran]

Originally posted by SnoopyFan
Do horses actually drink corn oil?

I don't know what you refer to with "corn" oil.
But I never saw any horse drinking any sort of oil.

As for your poor Beta....
If you did put the poor helpless creature in a cold-water tank, you need to be accused of unwanted fishmurder-caused-by- ignorance-about-its-needs.

Salaam. A

[Aldebaran]

Eddy TD,

You actually do that? Adding oil to their food?

Salaam. A

[sugaree]

Aldebaran, oil in this context refers to cooking oil. I add plenty of the type of oil made from corn, walnuts, or olives to my own food myself.

[amarinth]

10-to-1, Nathan's already read David the riot act ("Thou art that fish!") already, and this pitting is redundant.

[EddyTeddyFreddy]

Aldebaran, "corn" in American English means what the British call "maize". You may be thinking of corn as what we call "wheat". And yes, as this article (http://ohioline.osu.edu/b762/b762_7.html) points out, corn, canola, soybean, or mixed vegetable oils can be and are fed with grain to some horses as a calorie-dense supplement. I prefer to topdress my horses' rations with flaxseed meal, as it's less mess for the same effect.

Oil as in petrochemicals is quite another thing. Nor would I offer my horses fishmeal, no matter how protein-rich it is, nor how deservedly sent to slaughter its constituents. ;)

[Aldebaran]

Mine get now and then linseed on their oats.

I've never seen horses eating corn. A missing part in my culture :)


Salaam. A

[EddyTeddyFreddy]

My two horses love corn, whether kernels or the cobs, or even the husks. The linseed is a great source of omega-3 fatty acids. Some people buy the flaxseeds in bulk and grind a ration fresh for each feeding, since horses can't readily digest the unground seeds. I feed stabilized flaxseed meal (http://enreco.com/enreco/Products/Horseshine.htm) since it's much easier to use.

Over all of human history, many cultures have found many different ways to feed their livestock. I'm grateful to live at a time and in a place where scientific research into animal nutrition has helped make it possible to maintain my 21-year-old horse in robust good health.

What breed(s) of horse do you own, Aldebaran? The easy guess, of course, is Arabian, or Barb. :) Or do you have Thoroughbred racehorses? I have a Thoroughbred and an American Quarter Horse.

[EddyTeddyFreddy]

Oh, geez, SnoopyFan -- here you start a thread to Pit your evil goldfish, and look where it's wandered to! <sigh> I'm such a blithering idiot sometimes.....

Very well, back on topic: Your wretched murderous finny friends should be shown a frying pan, and some tartar sauce, and told that these objects of doom await them should they ever dare to assault another companion. Perhaps you should allow the algae in their tank to grow and spread until they hover by the surface, glooping their tiny mouths in pathetic wheezes, begging for mercy and forgiveness.

[Elza B]

EddyTeddyFreddy, just gotta say it - you're very cool.

Okay, now that my blatant brownosing is done, this whole thread is making my miss my sophomore year in college fish - Sam and Gus. (Funny, SnoopyFan, I was also in college in WV, and my fish had real names). They lasted the whole year - I got 'em from Wal-Mart. They ended up croaking when I transported then home from college - Sam bit the big one on the trip, and Gus died a few days after.

I didn't think fish had personalities until I had those two. They were very cool. Don't be too hard on them, SnoopyFan. They're just being fish.

Ava

[Aldebaran]

Eddy TF,

At home we have Arabians, Berber and Haflinger. (And a Shetland pony to keep the donkey company.)
We have also thourougbred of Belgian breed and Hannoveran. And one Polish (Shagya-Arabian) which was my horse when at the innocent teenage/student age I did jumping-contests with her in Belgium and neighbouring countries. (Which she loved to do and was not bad at.) She is now an aged lady and must be handled carefully since her frontlegs seem to have suffered a lot. So I don't ride her anymore since several years. Until two years ago I had there a beautiful Appaloosa (few-spot) as resident exotic (what is exotic to you is normal to me and vice-versa, no?). But surprisingly enough he can't be trusted when the children would come unattended too close to him. Since I prefer to avoid any risk with them he moves elswhere when they are in Belgium, until they are a bit older and listen when their father says something. (I never despair).

I looked at the pictures of your horse. He seems to be in very good condition. Do you have that freezing cold temperatures overthere that coverage is needed when he's outside or is it just out of precaution?

Salaam. A

[EddyTeddyFreddy]

Ah! Would a Berber be the same as a Barb? Related to but not the same as an Arabian? I'm familiar with Haflingers, and at the barn where my horses live we have a miniature donkey and his constant companion, a miniature mare, who's smaller than a Shetland pony. Are there miniature horses (also known as Falabellas) in Europe? They're quite popular here. They're too small for even children to ride, but people drive them, and even barrel race them in harness.

It would be interesting to compare your Belgian Thoroughbred to my American one, to see whether there are any differences. The Hannoverian is a fine breed of Warmblood, and is popular with dressage riders in my area. Do you still do showjumping, or is that a thing of your reckless past? Do you now ride for pleasure, or study dressage?

A friend of mine had a Shagya Arabian, and they are wonderful sport horses. I much prefer them to the over-refined, snake-necked types that win in-hand classes in the American Arabian show world.

Your lovely but not calm enough Appaloosa amuses me. It's so easy to fall into stereotypes, with animal breeds as with human races and nationalities, yet the individuals in each group can be so very different, eh? My Quarter Horse is indeed as calm as stockhorse breeds (QH, Paint, Appaloosa) are supposed to be. Yet my Thoroughbred is just as easygoing, even though he's of a breed, like Arabians, that's considered hot, flighty, and difficult.

My QH, Nick, is now 21 years old, yet still healthy and ridable. He was a show hunter in his early days, but has been a pleasure horse since I've owned him (now almost 12 years). Here he is (http://community.webshots.com/photo/735286/108397396NbKCFd) at age 20. He hasn't changed since then, other than to add some sprinkles of white hair over his eyes. He does have arthritis in his hocks, and has always been sensitive to cold, even in his younger days, so he must be blanketed in the winter. Yes, we do get cold, snowy winters here in Massachusetts. We can expect snow anytime from November through March.

My TB, Ben, is 13, a former field hunter. I do training level dressage with him, and also ride him for pleasure on the trails. He and Nick (http://community.webshots.com/photo/735286/108397396NbKCFd) are buddies, but the creaky old man still bosses the athletic young fellow around. :D

[Lynn Bodoni]

Moving this to MPSIMS.

Lynn

[Aldebaran]

EddyTF,

Yes, Berber horse refers to those horses that are sometimes wrongly taken for Arabians by people who aren't that well informed.
I prefer of course my unbeatable Arabians :) Outsiders often seem to think they are difficult to handle, while it is quite the opposite. They are very sensitive and intelligent and the only thing one needs to do is handle them with care and respect. I can trust them also with the children, but since a child is sometimes very impulsive (and impatient) I don't permit them to ride them until they are a bit older. (They are for now happy with the Haflingers anyway)
I don't do any jumpings anymore since my jeep hit a rock that was hiding itself in the desert. It knocked me out for 3 days and did quite a bit of damage to my body (brains were of low quality long before). So I must be careful with my back every now and then.
The Hannover are indeed trained for dressage. I'm not good at it, but a friend of mine is and works with them every time we are in Belgium.

I've heard of those mini-ponies, yet don't know anyone who has one. I've heard they aren't even much higher then my newfoundlander, so that would be a funny sight.

From what I can see on the picture, Nick seems to have still a very good back for his age. I can't say the same from my old lady. She worries me because her condition isn't that good at all lately. Everytime I go back home I expect it to be the last goodbye. And a transport and change of environment would not do her good now. So I try not to think about it.

Salaam. A

[EddyTeddyFreddy]

by Aldebaran:
From what I can see on the picture, Nick seems to have still a very good back for his age. I can't say the same from my old lady. She worries me because her condition isn't that good at all lately. Everytime I go back home I expect it to be the last goodbye. And a transport and change of environment would not do her good now. So I try not to think about it. It's so sad to see them age and dwindle, as we watch helplessly, isn't it? Do you have equine dentists (or veterinarians who take care of equine teeth) in your country? She may be losing condition if her teeth need floating to remove sharp edges that are cutting into her cheeks and making it hard to chew. My old horse is helped to stay in good condition by the grain mixture I feed him, which is specially formulated for the nutritional needs of old horses. I also give him supplements that keep his joints flexible and relieve the achiness of his arthritis without the stomach upset that butazolidine can cause. Still, there comes a time when we have only one gift left to give them. It's very hard to face that, isn't it?
I prefer of course my unbeatable Arabians. :) Outsiders often seem to think they are difficult to handle, while it is quite the opposite. They are very sensitive and intelligent and the only thing one needs to do is handle them with care and respect. Of course, for some people that's asking too much. You cannot handle an Arabian (or any other horse with spirit and intelligence) without respect, and expect the animal to give you its trust and obedience. Anyone who attempts to bully them, or treats them clumsily, will indeed find them difficult.

Here is a link (http://www.amha.org/) to the website of the American Miniature Horse Association. The Falabella is the miniature horse breed that was developed in South America, and here is the website (http://www.imh.org/imh/bw/fal.html) for that breed.

[Horseflesh]

Originally posted by Khadaji
Years ago (jeez has it already been 20 years?) I had a male betta that would attack anything with flashy colors. Which is why you never found Elton John in your tank.

Sheba probably watched Finding Nemo one too many times and figured she could effect a similar escape. Nathan and David caught on to her plan, hobbled and gagged her, then hid the body when she died unexpectedly. Happens all the time in the movies.

[EddyTeddyFreddy]

:smack: Fish! We were talking about fish! :smack:

A young man of my acquaintance keeps his Bassman in a tank -- a juvenile bigmouth bass. Bassman was only an inch or so long when captured but has thrived and grown rapidly in captivity. He'll be released to the wild next spring. Noah keeps his other fish in separate tanks, since Bassman even at this early age is an avid predator.

[psychomonkey]

[i]As for your poor Beta....
If you did put the poor helpless creature in a cold-water tank, you need to be accused of unwanted fishmurder-caused-by- ignorance-about-its-needs.
Salaam. A [/B]
Im gonna have to call you on this, Bettas may thrive at 70-75, but they are comfortable at 65 which is what is ideal for Goldfish. Assuming the water is room temp it should be 68-72 which is well within both fish's range. I see no problem with this other than the words "small aquarium" since goldfish get huge, I generally recommend 10 gallons per fish as a barest of minimums preferably 20.

[picunurse]

If you changed the water just before you left, poor lil' beta could have gotten Ick. Its a fishy disease that rots off fins they look chewed. If its not treated, the fishy gets to play whirlpool in the bathroom.
Sorry, no cite. I don't Goggle.

[bluecanary]

Now we have a thread in MPSIMS that starts with 'Pitting' :D