N*****s can be white, too!

[torie]

No, you ignorant, fuck, they can not.


My mother's boyfriend is black. Fine. I have a problem with his borderline abusive behavior, not his blackness.

One of my mom's friends had enough, told him off, and called me. On the phone with me, she called him a "nigger". When I took exception to this, she said, "No, I'm not rasict, white people can be niggers too."

No they can not. The word "nigger" stems from the word "negro", which is Spanish for "Black". The way I understand it, (Correct me if I am wrong) "nigger" is a bastardization of the word, "negro".

I am upset for two reasons. First, my mother's boyfriend is probably now on her case and verbally abusing her for her friend's outburst. If my mother gets hurt in anyway for her friend's actions, heads are gonna roll. First, his, then, her friend's.
Second, the word "nigger" has a racial connetation. Nothing, I mean, NOTHING, will take that away. If you called Mr. Mom a "nigger" it is because you harbor some racist attitudes, and are now trying to hide it.



Do not justify keeping alive such a dispicable word with such a lame statement.


God, this whole thing makes me almost want to LIKE the abusive fucker.

[Marley23]

Is your friend a racist, or did she just say it because she was pissed off? If it was the latter, I'd let it drop. It's of no consequence what word she called him on the phone with you during a moment of anger. I'd be much more worried about your mom if the guy is abusive.

[Cisco]

I'm with you on this one. I used to know a lot of openly racist people and when I would call them out of it they would say the exact same thing. It's because they're pussies and they don't want to admit their full racism in front of outsiders.

And, I know your last statement was written half-jokingly, but don't even think about liking someone just because someone else called him a bad name. He still sounds like a cock no matter what your mom's friend called him.

[torie]

I just tried calling my mom three times.


No answer.


One more try, then I am driving to her house.


Wish me luck.

[Otto]

Ah yes, the "nigger means stupid" defense. A racist skinhead of my former acquaintance became very enamored of this argument after she, if you can believe it, got turned on to reggae. She went from skinhead to rasta literally overnight, even announcing her intention to grow dreadlocks. I let her have the argument, figuring it was better for her to step off the racist skin beliefs and if "N=S" helped her along that path then good on her.

I get just as frosted when people use "gay" to mean "syupid" and then don't understand why that pisses me off.

[elfbabe]

I get just as frosted when people use "gay" to mean "syupid" and then don't understand why that pisses me off.

... but it makes it ALL BETTER when they spell it "ghey," right? :rolleyes:

There are many benefits to being a loner and choosing one's company carefully. Not least of which is the fact that I haven't heard someone use the word like that in... nearly a year, I think.

This whole thing sort of reminds me of the lesbian phone saga, now that I think about it.

[dnooman]

I think you should worry more about your mom's health than her boyfriend's feelings.

[kitarak]

I think you should worry more about your mom's health than her boyfriend's feelings.

Umm... yeah? That's exactly what she seems to be doing.

torie, I hope your mother's ok.

[GingerOfTheNorth]

Wow, I hope your mom is alright.

That is a word we were brought up to never, ever say. I remember one time my brother saying "n_____" instead of 'tiger' in that 'eeny meenie minie moe' saying, and my mother storming in from three rooms away to smack him one. It still shocks me when a (black and Puerto Rican) friend (and poster on this board) calls herself a "Nigger Rican".

This whole thing sort of reminds me of the lesbian phone saga, now that I think about it.
I would like to know what the 'Lesbian Phone Saga' is.

[Marley23]

I would like to know what the 'Lesbian Phone Saga' is.
And also if there are pictures. ;)

[GingerOfTheNorth]

And also if there are pictures. ;)
Oh, yeah - one a them video-phone thingmies. ;)

[county]

Well, if everyone would just purchase a read Judith Martin's book on "Manners" we wouldn't have these problems. Everyone could just feel how they wanted to about other people but they would not say or do things that are offensive.

Might even bring about world peace.

[papergirl]

I think county's onto something there. But then I'm all for politeness and the wisdom of refraining from making oneself look like a racist asshole.

Torie, I hope your mom's okay. Maybe you can update us?

Best,
karol

[Ace309]

... but it makes it ALL BETTER when they spell it "ghey," right? :rolleyes:

[hijack] Woah, other people do this? Forgive me for living in a bubble, but I thought it had popped up in the TheSmartMarks/World Domination Inc/Underground Smarks triad. Next you'll be telling me other people say DRAWMUH~! too.

- Ace, feeling very stupid.

[kung fu lola]

I would like to know what the 'Lesbian Phone Saga' is.

The story of the phone who loved other phones (http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=216812&highlight=lesbian+phones). By the brilliant and lovely LaurAnge.

[GingerOfTheNorth]

The story of the phone who loved other phones (http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=216812&highlight=lesbian+phones). By the brilliant and lovely LaurAnge.
Ahhh, yes. I'd forgotten that.

[ForumBot]

If she just said it in anger, then it's just fine. I have an Irish friend, and whenever I'm pissed off at him I call him "that potato-eating shithead." That doesn't mean I hate Irish people.

[Otto]

Because if you can't spew racist hate speech in the heat of anger, when can you spew racist hate speech?

[liirogue]

Do you have an update, torie? Is everything okay?

[Jurhael]

There are many benefits to being a loner and choosing one's company carefully.

Yea, really.

But, I always thought that "nigger" meant low thinking person. It was taken from the term "niggardlyness" or something. BUT, that obviously changed. Heh.

Whatever the case, when that term is used(and it's the only term that makes me cringe when even thinking of it), most people tend to think of it as a very deragative word for black person. So, when your friend said "nigger", I seriously doubt she was thinking "low minded person". Not to say she's racist, the word sure as hell is.

[Slithy Tove]

Ah, the old "whites can be niggers, too." You'r mom's friend is in distingushed company: Robert Byrd said these same word on the floor of the US Senate.

Of course, if this is true, then black guys can be peckerwoods, right? So when I start seeing black guys driving around in pickups with Confederate battle flags on the bumpers, I'll subscribe to this theory. In the meantime, "nigger" is the most trusted shibboleth in our language: anyone who uses it, whatever his or her race, has identified him or herself as being civilizationally retarded.

Argue me on that, but what is NOT debatable is the prospect that this guy is "probably now on her (your mom's) case and verbally abusing her for her friend's outburst." He can't use that as an excuse to abuse her any more than if she were to buy the wrong brand of cereal or play the TV too loud while he's trying to nap. This "look how mad you made me" crap just doesn't cut it.

[elfbabe]

But, I always thought that "nigger" meant low thinking person. It was taken from the term "niggardlyness" or something. BUT, that obviously changed. Heh.

Afraid the American Heritage Dictionary gives the origin of "nigger" as "Alteration of dialectal neger, black person, from French nègre, from Spanish negro."

Wordorigins.org says (http://www.wordorigins.org/wordorn.htm#Nigger):

Nigger

This most offensive of words in American speech dates back to the late 16th century, although the modern spelling doesn't appear until two centuries later. The OED2's earliest cite of the modern spelling is from 1786 in Burns's Ordination. (The Random House Historical Dictionary of American Slang, however, claims that this is an editorial error and Burns's original manuscript uses the older niger.) The obsolete spelling niger dates to 1574. It comes from the Latin meaning black. It shares this common root with negro.

...

It is etymologically unrelated to the word niggard.

While what you said may well be what you were personally told about the word's origin's, 'tain't so.

[Jurhael]

While what you said may well be what you were personally told about the word's origin's, 'tain't so.

Actually, I got it from a Bible that mentioned the word Niggardness.

It is etymologically unrelated to the word niggard.

Ah. There it is. It's all in the spelling. Dur.

[torie]

Because if you can't spew racist hate speech in the heat of anger, when can you spew racist hate speech?


If I can't spew rasict hate speech in anger, then the terrorists have truely won.



My mom is fine. When her friend left, Mr. Mom rolled his eyes, and invited my mom to a party. Guess he had a rare moment of reasonablity. :) She said she had lots of fun that the party.And what was I doing staying up so late and calling her so many times? Didn't I know she was fine? I was gonna make her think something horrible happened to me!

So it's all ok. My mom isn't even mad at her friend. :confused:

[Biggirl]

Wow, I hope your mom is alright.

That is a word we were brought up to never, ever say. I remember one time my brother saying "n_____" instead of 'tiger' in that 'eeny meenie minie moe' saying, and my mother storming in from three rooms away to smack him one. It still shocks me when a (black and Puerto Rican) friend (and poster on this board) calls herself a "Nigger Rican".


I would like to know what the 'Lesbian Phone Saga' is.

I only do it in the privacy of my own, um, mouth.


P.S. I think the Lesbian Phone Saga refers to a thread were someone somewhere called their phone "gay". I tried searching for it but got nothing.

[Miller]

I have a friend who used to call me a nigger. We're both white, incidentally. Actually, he didn't just call me a nigger, he'd perform a whole song-and-dance routine, set to the Tigger song from Winne the Pooh. Strange guy. Also used to claim to be a Puerto Rican Jew, but I think he just watched too much Welcome Back, Kotter.

[V.bis and Baudhead]

Disclaimer: I do NOT endorse, support, or follow any of the following practices. I am describing them here for information only. I am trying to describe a rather nasty practice here, and the mentality behind it.

I'm going to have to at least partially disagree with the OP, insofar as I have, in fact, heard the n-word applied to white people, as a serious term and on a consistent basis. Several, shall we say, less enlightened members of my own extended family use the word that way to decry the failings of various groups of people, of any race or ethnicity. (Decrying the failings of pretty much every group of people other than themselves was a big pastime among my extended family, and it's one of the big reasons I really don't talk to them very much anymore. But that is another story.)

When talking about white people, sometimes they applied the term to groups of people of certain nationalities (for example, they might say something like, "those damned Antarctican-n*****s!"). More typically, it was applied to those rural, impoverished, and uneducated individuals that might otherwise be derided as "rednecks" or "hillbillies." (I don't approve of those terms either, I'm just listing some other slurs here for comparative purposes.)

In any case, whatever group it was applied to, the n-word was almost universally understood to indicate that the individuals in question were of unacceptabe countenance - worthless, shiftless, low-class, undignified, slovenly, uneducated, criminal - you name it, all rolled into one word. But in the case of white people, it seemed that there was an added factor - the term was intended to indicate that the individuals in question posessed the negative qualities listed above in such abundance that were a discredit to white people, that they were "no better than n*****s." The implication was that being African-American was pretty much the worst thing you could be. (I am NOT saying I agree with any part of the above - but that's how the term was used.)

For anyone out there who may wonder why African-Americans consider this little word to be so bad, well, now you know. It's not merely impolite, or merely stupid, or merely a nasty name to call somebody. It is the embodiment of the sentiment that African-Americans are, well, everything I listed above - simply put, lower and unacceptable. Whenever some public figure is accused of having said the n-word, it seems like it gets brushed aside. Even from my own family, I've heard plenty of lame excuses and rationalizations, not the least of which was the "white people can be n*****s too" defense, which I regard as a big, steaming load of bullshit. For someone to have used that term is a pretty damning indictment of that individual's character, in my view, and it is not something to be taken lightly.

So getting back to the OP: Yes, white people CAN be n*****s, but that does not make it OK. Even when the term is applied to white people, its intent is still to evoke a negative image of African-Americans.

I hope I haven't offended anyone with the above - I know I'm walking a tightrope here. But if I've made you angry, about the fact that there are still individuals out there who hold these views, then my job here is done.

[Marley23]

The word niggard is probably of Scandanavian origin. Definitely unrelated.

[cue "The More You Know"]

[dropzone]

[QUOTE=V.bis and Baudhead]In any case, whatever group it was applied to, the n-word was almost universally understood to indicate that the individuals in question were of unacceptabe countenance - worthless, shiftless, low-class, undignified, slovenly, uneducated, criminal - you name it, all rolled into one word.[QUOTE]"Trash" works so much better. One can add any modifier desired but any person of any race, creed, or color can be trash. And if you leave off the modifier it isn't even hate speech!

Your explanation accurately describes the usage I am familiar with when the N-word is used to describe someone who is not African-American. Don't be surprised, though, to have people disagree with you. They consider their experience to be the totality of all experiences.