My Spidy sense tells me this is a dumb thing

[Rhythmdvl]

I live in a nice little basement apartment in Washington, DC with a fireplace in the living room. Being a guy, I have the natural urge to barbecue. Can’t really do it on the sidewalk, can’t really do it on the front steps and don’t have access to the backyard. Fireplace…. fire… chimney… smoke goes up the chimney… fire sits in the fireplace…fire safe in the fireplace…smoke outside the house… small habachi would fit neatly between the andirons… Hmmmmm ::said raising one eyebrow::

So there I was, reaching for my keys when all of a sudden, my Spidy sense went haywire. I sat down for a moment and did that thing with my hands that represents weighing options (you know the one I’m talking about – sort of a cross between myself playing with my girlfriend’s breasts and the doctor telling me to turn my head and cough.)

::left hand:: Nobel prize in literature for Indoor Grilling Made Easy
ahhhhhhhh!

::right hand:: Darwin award for To Serve Man 2000
arrrrrgghh!


What could go wrong? Droppings from the fireplace down on my kabobs? Wonderful brick and ash flavorings from last winter? I am not talking about throwing a steak or two on a heap of burning wood – the fireplace is totally cleaned out and there is space to put a habachi. Has anyone here done this before? Has anyone here lost someone (or someone’s house) to such a thing? Am I being overly stupid here (it’s been known to happen before!) or is my Spidy sense misfiring? If your willing to sanction my scheme I’ll make you a steak dinner, but you’ll have to be willing to sit in the house while it cooks.

Keeping the fire at bay
(for the moment)

Rhythmdvl

[bunnymom]

Well, I would think that fumes from charcoal/charcoal lighter fluid would be a concern.I'm pretty sure that not all fumes would ascend the chimney and you might get sick or suffocate.

But I bet one of these guys has actually tried this and could give you a more definitive answer.

...spidy sense...roflmao

[TheNerd]

In college, I knew a guy who tried barbequeing in the basement of the dorm. He set off all the fire alarms in the building, and the whole place smelled like charcoal for a week.

Of course, he didn't have a chimney to work with.

[Sycorax]

Well I live in the Md. burbs and would love to take you up on your offer of a steak...BUT my spidey sense went off too.
Not willing to risk asphyxiation and/or immolation for a free meal.

[Rhythmdvl]

I did a bunch of searching before I posted… I found a lot of sites that said not to go to sleep with a burning fire, etc., but none mentioned cooking. Fumes? Being a manly-man, I laugh at the wimpy fumes (I produce my own, thankyouverymuch). It being summertime, having a source of heat in the living room guarantees that the windows and doors will be open, and the fan on.

mmmm… roasted corn….. baby potatoes….chicken legs….burgers!

[Sycorax]

Hmmm...I'm re-thinking this. Filet mignon, medium rare?

[RealityChuck]

Most bags of charcoal have warnings not to use them indoors or for heating. However, I don't know if it's a problem in a fireplace, which is, after all, designed for fires. Assuming the flue is open (and you'll know pretty quickly if you forgot), the hot air from the coals (and the CO) will be drawn up the chimney.

My father-in-law does occasionally put charcoal in his fireplace. No ill effects, but he doesn't try to grill on it.

[Mr. Cynical]

And although there were no problems, I would not recommend it. You never know what could happen.

[Doug Bowe]

It sounds like you're renting. Could your landlord have topped the chimney for the Summer months?
Before you spend a lot of money on charcoal and grills that might fit the fireplace and such, why not light a portion of newspaper in there to see if it ventilates?

[Lynn Bodoni]

I have no idea what happens if you try to burn charcoal in a fireplace. However, one winter when I was still living with my folks, the electricity went out in our all-electric home (heavy, HEAVY snow). We were able to cook in the fireplace, on a wood fire.

There used to be grills in some public parks. I don't know if there still are. You might check around and see.

[astro]

Man to man... for even *asking* this question I'm going to make a wild assed guess that you aren't married or sharing space with a female significant other who would have nipped this urge in the bud early on.

Worry less about immolation and more about what greasy smoke is likely to do to your flue (your fireplace flue).

Also think of the stink. Wood smoke can be strong enough but unless you want your house redolent of the faint (or not so faint) whiff o' week old barbecued chicken think again. If you want to test this get a kettle grill and after some serious barbecuing set it in your living room with the top off for a week or two and see how your house smells when you get home at night.

If you are renting and your landlord catches "wind" of what you are doing you might be liable for painting and or deodorizing expenses and/or lose your security deposit because they claim they have to clean the chimney etc.

Risk reward doesn't seem to pan out plus well... sorry but it just sounds _so_ dumb assed like it's an accident waiting to happen. I think your "spidey sense" is right to warn you and I speak as a charter member of the "Oh my God what I have done now!" club. Listen to your inner spider.

[Marlitharn]

When I was a kid we used to bbq in our fireplace. My dad found some kind of small table-looking thing with a metal mesh top and he'd let the fire burn down to coals, set the table/grill/thingy/whatever it was over it, and slap on a hunk of raw cow. Mighty tasty. If the fireplace is working, and your landlord doesn't object to you using it, I'd say go for it. Just don't use charcoal. Build a regular fire, using wood and kindling. Quite innovative, my dad. His outdoor bbq grill consisted of a 55 gallon drum cut in half lengthwise and hinged, mounted on a pole so he could swivel it around and let the lid block the wind.

OR, build your fire, let it burn down, wrap everything you want to cook in a double layer of aluminum foil, and bury it in the coals. Packet cooking is my friend!

[HorseloverFat]

If you're going to do it, I'd rather you not, please burn wood not charcoal. Once my dad BBQ'd a pig in the garage because it was raining, all the windows and the garage door were open and the stench of burning pork and charcoal stayed for at least a year.

Smoke from the charcoal and the lighter fluid will stick in all sorts of places, and if it gets into your TV or computer you can kiss them goodbye. Just BBQ at the bottom of the stairs on the sidewalk, no one if gonna reach in and grab a burning steak with their bare hands, especially if you're standing right there. Just keep an eye open for stray dogs and cats.

[Guy Propski]

I think astro and Horselover (BTW, love your name, I'm a PKD fan too) have hit on the real problem. There shouldn't be any ventilation issue, since a fireplace is designed to allow smoke from a fire to exit the building safely.

What you will run into is the stench of rancid grease. The fireplace and flue will begin to accummulate quantities of grease from spattering, and this will start to stink. Pretty soon everything in the place will stink. While I am the first to support your love of BBQ, I think your plan officially qualifies as a Bad Idea. Don't do it, Peter Parker!

[sailor]

This is a bad idea all around. To draw well it needs a critical amount of fire which will depend on the fireplace. In any case I do not understand this *urge*. Can't you eat out? You don't have any friends with a yard? Heck, my barbacue has been sitting out in the yard unused for years now.

On the anecdotal side: my friend was having a house renovated during the cold winter months. Some workers decided to start a fire in the fireplace because the house was freezing. But the flue was blocked.... They put some wood there and started a fire and ... the smoke filled the room and they were lucky they didn't set the house on fire. After it was over the whole house still smelled like smoke for a long time. He couldn't get rid of the smell that had permeated everything.

[Needs2know]

You should buy yourself an electric grill. They are wonderful for these kinds of situations. I bought a small hibatchi sized one for my mother. It has lava rocks just like a gas grill. She uses hers outside but I'm wondering if you couldn't just plug it in near your stove and vent the grill odors out with the stove vent fan. Maybe I need a spidy alarm, what do you think?

Needs2know

[sulla]

I have a book about it by some fairly well-known chef at home. If anyone questions this or is interested, I can try to dig it out tonight.

The posters who say "use wood, not charcoal" are right on.

I have done hung ducks and pheasants over applewood, and turkey, roasts and leg of lamb on a jury-rigged iron spit. My fireplace is fairly large with a big old iron (open-bottomed) firebox. I build a big roaring fire in there, wait until I have a couple of thick logs going with good ashy bark and the flames have died down, and then I get busy. The hung or spitted meat is high enough up in there that odor within the house isn't a problem - altho w/ducks, the smell of the fat sizzling down on the wood lingered for a day or so. You can also toss vegetable or seafood packets in there but wrap them securely - unlike a grill, you will have flames to contend with. Sometimes it is a challenge to retrieve the meat to check doneness. Have large, heavy, whole-hand-and-forearm-too pot holders. I clean my fireplace on a regular basis, and the chimney sweep comes twice a year. Maybe I'm just lucky to have a well-made fireplace, but I've never had a porblem with smoke, grease, etc. getting on anything else in the house.

The key points are:
Properly working chimney
LARGE fire that's been going for a few hours
Securing the meat high up in the fireplace opening

I would think that living in an apartment, your chimney would be well-maintained. Experiment with some fires and see how the airflows and drafts are. I don't know about using a hibachi. Could you get enough wood in there to have a sizeable fire? I would just ditch it, myself. Use a nice wood fire and throw some flavored wood chips on there if you want.

Fireplace cooking is fun - I suggest you try it. It's a great winter activity. The ducks especially are delicious. Roast some chestnuts while they're cooking. Follow common-sense safety precautions, of course, the main ones being a ready fire extinguisher and secure screen. People have cooked over open fires within their dwellings for centuries. I don't know why it seems so outrageous these days. In the summer I grill outside like everyone else.

Oh, and to contradict stereotype - I'm a woman.

-sulla

[ndorward]

To add to the chorus of "don't use coal": my bag of charcoal (not briquettes, I hate those things) has a warning blazoned on the top: DO NOT USE INDOORS. It kindly explains that you will get carbon monoxide poisoning.

all best --N

[sailor]

Yes there are many things you can do but the question is would you want to?

As has been pointed out there are major reasons why it is better not to do it but it does not mean you cannot do it.

In a small fireplace in a basement apartment it does not sound like the best idea. Even when you cook in the kitchen you make plenty of greasy fumes that settle everywhere. Do you want that in the living room?

Another aspect I would consider is flue fires. Flues should be inspected and cleaned regularly to prevent flue fires from creosote buildup. I imagine using the fireplace for roasting can make the problem much worse.

I suppose if the apartment is not yours, you do not care about leaving a mess behind but If it were mine I would not want to rent it to someone who intends to do this kind of thing.

[douglips]

The point about a large fire being required is crucial.

Have you ever noticed when you build a fire for the first few seconds some of the smoke gets into the room? That's because the fire is too small a heat source to drive the convection up the chimney. If you are using a small BBQ you may not have enough heat for the smoke to go up the chimney and you will get the Darwin Award.

[Spoke]

Good Lord, man, it's summertime!!!

You build a fire indoors this time of year, and you're apartment is going to be hotter'n Hell! It'd be one thing if you were way up in the frozen north somewhere, but I see from your OP that you are in D.C., which is known to get hot enough in the summer to melt tungsten.

Are you MAD?

[Rhythmdvl]

[quote]Yes there are many things you can do but the question is would you want to?[quote]
Which is why you should always listen to your Spidy sense!


While reading the replies I had the mental image of one of those race-type carnival games - the kind where you shoot water in the clown's mouth and watch things rise up toward a finish line. On two platforms sit a Darwin Award (www.darwinawards.com) and a Nobel prize. Which will it be? Who is the clown? Yikes.

So what I've gathered so far:

Heat is essential. No heat, no air movement, no life.
No charcoal. Find a use for the leftover wood.
No greasy, splatter-prone chimney-coating food.
Have the chimney cleaned first.


So no one has quite come right out and said, do this and you will die. There are things to be wary of, very important things. Spidy sense still isn't quite quiet yet though. I'll do a bit more checking in Lincoln park, but I'm fairly sure there are no grills out there. Motorcycle is my only transportation, so I don't think traveling to a grill is a viable option. I think the best idea so far is packet cooking. Clean, not so many fumes (from the food) and easily controlled.

I'm sorry that I can't adequately describe the motivation to some of you. I guess if you weren't born with the grilling gene you just won't understand why an electric grill just won't cut it, or why in the heat of summer the need to eat roasted corn could easily outweigh the desire not to sweat like a pig.

Dinner invitations may be forthcoming, or perhaps directions to a park (DoperBq?) Notice I did not rule out funeral arrangements.

[kunilou]

OK, I'll say it

DO THIS AND YOU WILL DIE!

1. Charcoal doesn't burn, it smolders
2. Smoldering is incomplete burning
3. Incomplete burning release carbon monoxide
4. Fireplaces need a nice full burn to create a draft
5. Without a draft things will back up into the room
6. (refer back to #3) Carbon monoxide will back up into the room
7. You will keel over while you are trying to baste
8. The chicken will burn to a crisp and you will win a Darwin award -- posthumously.

[Rhythmdvl]

Rhythmdvl: “So no one has quite come right out and said, do this and you will die.”

kunilou: “ DO THIS AND YOU WILL DIE!”


Damn! Damn damn damn DAMN!

[Sassy]

A friend of mine died from using a hibachi in a place that was not adequately ventilated. The fumes continue long after the flame dies down. Please don't...

[handy]

They make a teflon grill you can put on your stove top to get a similar BBQ experience.

Or you can use some liquid smoke.

Don't use lighter fluid, use one of those electric starter thingys if you really must try it at home.

[Bosda Di'Chi of Tricor]

Reality check here, people.

Am I the only person here who has ever been in a reconstruction of a 18th or 19th century house?

Our Colonial & Civil War ancestors used to cook indoors over a fireplace all the time, dammit!!!!!!

And here in Murfreesboro TN , we have a reconstruction of one such Colonial village. And one of the buildings is a working blacksmith's shop with a real charcoal-fired forge! They use the forge with the door closed all the time!! I've seen them do it, dammit!!

And nobody's died yet. :p


Quit passing yourselves off as experts when ya doesn't know diddy-squat!!!

[Chronos]

I am not talking about throwing a steak or two on a heap of burning wood
Why not? Caveman steak, welcome to the Boy Scouts. Actually, you typically use coals, not a fire. A teflon grill wouldn't be a "similar BBQ experience", as handy says... Fire good! Sweat good! *grunt*
I'll repeat what others have said: Use wood. The forge that Bosda just mentioned would be a considerably larger fire than anything in your Hibachi, and thus would vent itself more. For kitchen cooking, you can bet that they used wood.
One other note: If you're used to BBQing over charcoal, the cooking times will be longer, as charcoal burns hotter than wood.

[Chas.E]

Reality check here, people.

Am I the only person here who has ever been in a reconstruction of a 18th or 19th century house?

Our Colonial & Civil War ancestors used to cook indoors over a fireplace all the time, dammit!!!!!!



ya but..

Note that those "fireplaces" weren't fireplaces, but huge hearths with huge chimneys. They were designed for cooking.

The modern chimneys in today's homes aren't designed for cooking. If you cook food, especially meat, you're likely to start a fire in the chimney due to the accumulation of fat and grease condensing on the walls of the flue. Ever notice that open flame cooking pits in restaurants have grease traps? These vent hoods start on fire often enough even WITH the grease traps.

[DougC]

- - - I saw the title of this thread and figured you were talking about buttcandles.
http://www.buttcandle.com
- MC

[sailor]

Rhythmdvl, I definitely do not have that barbacue gene. Mine has been sitting out in the yard unused for some years now. In any case, you say you are in DC... I am sure there are plenty of parks with grills you can use. Just to mention one: You can find several at the park at Daingerfield Island, where the Washington Sailing marina is, just south of National Airport, on the GW parkway. I am sure there are many more places.