Extreme Makeover: Home Edition - Question

[AuntiePam]

I checked the other threads on this show and didn't see this asked or answered. (Wonderful show, by the way -- sort of a mega-Queen-for-a-Day.)

Do the families have to pay taxes on their new homes (and the other stuff)? I realize they have property taxes like the rest of us, but is there a gift tax? (Like what happened with Oprah's Pontiacs).

I have sort of a side question about tonight's show (the new widow with two children in Bakersfield). Can someone make a living on 20 acres of alfalfa?

[dropzone]

I wondered the alfalfa question, too, but you saw their house. With the Bakersfield climate plus that fancy new irrigation system and knowing nothing about alfalfa except that it grows pretty quickly I'm thinking they might be able to get in maybe five crops a year. It looked like folks in Virginia harvested three times a year and we had a proper winter.

[Walloon]

Extreme Makeover: Home Edition is a type of game show, and game show winners have to pay taxes on all their prizes, whether cash or merchandise. The "gifts" are really given for the family's on-camera participation in the show. So it does have a contractual nature — each party is exchanging something of value with the other.

[Dewey Finn]

Newsweek had an article (http://msnbc.msn.com/id/4933223/) about this a few months ago. Essentially, they lease the home for ten days at $50,000, and rentals of less than fifteen days are tax-free. Also, they consider the improvements free under a tax code loophole.

[Walloon]

Key paragraph from that Newsweek article:But NEWSWEEK ran that logic by a half-dozen outside tax professionals. While some called it clever—even "elegant"—most scoffed at the show's approach, saying the IRS would be highly unlikely to agree with all aspects of it. "When you look at the big picture, these provisions were not meant for this," says Jim Seidel of RIA. The result: if audited, the "Extreme" families could be hit with huge tax bills.

[grayhairedmomma]

I have sort of a side question about tonight's show (the new widow with two children in Bakersfield). Can someone make a living on 20 acres of alfalfa?


My question about this episode is: will she be able to sell the hay they provided her with? How long before it starts to mold/rot? And how will she harvest the alfalfa? Did they give her the equipment? It didn't look like they had harvesters.

How did the dad die?

[Walloon]

According to ABC's Extreme Makeover: Home Edition website:Then, one fateful day, Glen [Elcano] was driving home from making a delivery to another local farm when a car pulled out in front of him. He was killed instantly in the accident.This occurred June 3, 2004; he was 32 years old.

As for hay, the University of Minnesota Extension (http://www.extension.umn.edu/distribution/cropsystems/DC7404.html) says,Hay harvested late in the season and consumed during the winter months is stored for a relatively short time at relatively low temperatures and should have minimal losses. Hay harvested early in the season and stored into winter will be subject to some warm temperatures before winter arrives and is likely to have greater losses. The greatest losses can be expected for hay that is stored through winter into the following spring and summer. . . You can expect losses after 12 to 18 months of storage to be twice as great as losses after nine months of storage.

[dropzone]

And how will she harvest the alfalfa? Did they give her the equipment? It didn't look like they had harvesters.They seemed to have two new tractors, one small and one medium sized. For twenty acres I suppose they'd pay somebody to come in with a baler. It wouldn't pay to own something that expensive that they'd only use a few half-days a year.

While researching for the game my family plays while watching this show, "Which Ones are Gay?"* I noticed that all of these people are actually quite qualified to be doing this. Especially, surprisingly, Paige, who helped found a company that buys "handyman specials" and refurbishes them for low-income folks to buy in a rent-to-own program. And, even more than the others, she's an insane overachiever. (http://abc.go.com/primetime/xtremehome/bios/paige_hemmis.html)** And Paul is highly qualified, but you can tell that. I like how so many of them come to this with a set-building background. That's what you need, both for creative use of materials and for the attitude needed to work 72 hours straight before opening night.

This show isn't as much fun, though, now that Ford and Sears and everybody else are competing to give away the most money. Making do with a low budget is more fun. And where are the hissy fits of yesterday? Preston HUGGED Constance, for crying out loud! This show used to reflect large chunks of my career but now it's just, like AuntiePam called it, "a mega-Queen-for-a-Day." And, as a tough, macho guy, I don't appreciate all the crying, especially when Paul does it because I start up, too, and my wife laughs at me. And since Paul is crying most of the time this season I've been getting laughed at just a little too much.



* - Or, with this show, "Are ANY of Those Guys straight?" Yes, Paul probably is, being married to a woman and his boot fixation. And if Ty really came up with the idea of tractor-pull tractors tearing the house down, well, that indicates something that having been a male model and a design student would normally argue against. :D And Michael, having twelve children and being on his third wife--no, I made that up. He was the easy and obvious one. Preston, though, getting into arguments with those hot, HOT! women and never once saying, "You know what she needs?" or "I got something that'll shut her up?" I think it's pretty obvious. :dubious:

** - She's a carpenter who is also an EMT and a wedding planner and a sales manager with degrees in theology and psychology while still managing to look fabulous, all thanks to amphetamines.

[Papermache Prince]

Queen for a Day (http://timstvshowcase.com/queenfor.html), for those too young to remember, was an actual radio, then tv show. Four women contestants described their sad stories; audience applause choosing the most deserving of the title "Queen For A Day." At the end of the show, the Queen sat on a throne, wore an ermine robe, and was awarded several prizes: a washing machine, a sewing machine, etc. It last aired in 1964, although according to the link above, it also appeared in 1969 in syndication. I can't imagine the feeling you'd have after going public with your sad story, then losing because you just weren't miserable enough.

[Cowgirl Jules]

I wondered the alfalfa question, too, but you saw their house. With the Bakersfield climate plus that fancy new irrigation system and knowing nothing about alfalfa except that it grows pretty quickly I'm thinking they might be able to get in maybe five crops a year. It looked like folks in Virginia harvested three times a year and we had a proper winter.

I was counting alfalfa cuttings here in the Valley this year for some inane reason (I'm in the same valley as Bakersfield, but 3 hours north), and I lost track at 7 or 8. Cowboy says he thinks they got nine cuttings this year, but it was an exceptionally good year. He doesn't think anyone could make a living on 20 acres of alfalfa - I think it would be a hard living to make with a truck (assorted veggies) farm in better soil than Bakersfield's got.

Did they have a dairy? Because dairy cows go through alfalfa like it's nobody's business. That one piece of equipment (the swather) that they got is part of the haying process, but not all of it. I think most people that have fields that small don't own their own equipment - we've got 20 acres which will be pasture next year, and we'll hire out the plowing.

It's probably been dealt with in other threads, but do they really only take a week to build these houses? Some of them are knocked down and rebuilt from scratch, and that sure isn't much cure time for a concrete foundation. Poor people to have their houses rebuilt only to fall apart later.

[belladonna]

A bit off topic, but....

Is it just me, or does anyone else wish this show wasn't such a tragedy-fest? I think it's great that they pick people who could use a bit of an uplift in their life. But at the same time, I kinda think, damn, there's tons of people out there who go day to day, making ends meet by just scraping by who would love to be part of this. But because their great aunt Tillie didn't die of infected lice bites while cooking, thereby causing a massive fire to sweep through the home and -flash-roasting poor Rover which traumatized their toddler who hasn't spoken since, they're totally written off.
I'd like to see a regular Joe or Jane get a chance without having to be miserable first.

[AuntiePam]

My question about this episode is: will she be able to sell the hay they provided her with? How long before it starts to mold/rot? And how will she harvest the alfalfa? Did they give her the equipment? It didn't look like they had harvesters.

Yeah, that too. If area farmers had 15,000 bales to donate, it means they've had bumper crops or there's not much of a market for it. I didn't see anything to indicate that she had animals to feed the alfalfa to.

Maybe the pet shop in the boy's bedroom isn't a bad way for them to go. :)

The tax situation doesn't sound so good. They can hardly call a totally new house a "renovation".

[Dewey Finn]

It's probably been dealt with in other threads, but do they really only take a week to build these houses? Some of them are knocked down and rebuilt from scratch, and that sure isn't much cure time for a concrete foundation. Poor people to have their houses rebuilt only to fall apart later.

In the Newsweek article I quoted, one recipient complained of the poor quality of the construction. And Norm Abram (of This Old House) mentioned in the article that it's not possible to do high-quality work in a week.

[alice_in_wonderland]

Is it just me, or does anyone else wish this show wasn't such a tragedy-fest?

I did at first, but then when I thought about it, I sort of agree with it.

If they choose a family that's REALLY down on their luck, no one can bitch that they didn't deserve it. I mean really, autistic kids, blind kids with deaf parents, family members living on the street for 30 years, people killed in all sorts of horrible circumstances. I think most would be hard pressed to begrudge any of the receipents their good fortune.

Regarding the construction - it seems like a lot of times they raze the whole house, but build on the existing foundation which would help out with time a bit. Also, this season it seems like they're getting bigger, comercial contractors for the building, so perhaps the short time frame is easier to accomplish without losing quality.

[Askia]

Dewey Finn. With respect to Norm Abrahms, I've never seen hundreds of laborers tackle one of the Old Houses, including teams of painters, electricians, construction workers, landscapers, etc., using hundreds of thusands of dollars in materials, working in 24 hour shifts.

The Wolsun family home cited in the Newsweek article was the second show broadcast last season and may have been among the first few houses the design team ever did, back when it was essentially the design team tackling the household projects and far fewer contractors involved. The construction problems in that particular home may have had more to do with the new format of the show and the limits of the design teams skills. Now with the show hitting its stride, getting round the clock shifts of contractors and skilled volunteers is the norm, plus they now have established relationships with more quality contractors; I imagine they have far fewer problems with the completed homes now.

[Dewey Finn]

That may be true. I know that Habitat for Humanity sometimes build houses in a week, so the time frame may not be the problem.

[Dewey Finn]

Getting back to the tax issues of the show, what if the production company, Ford and Sears treated the stuff given as gifts? I'm not a tax professional, but my understanding is that tax on contest winnings or prizes are paid by the recipient, but the taxes on gifts are paid by the giver. That sounds more legitimate than the tax dodge mentioned in the Newsweek article.

[Eureka]

A bit off topic, but....

Is it just me, or does anyone else wish this show wasn't such a tragedy-fest?


It's not just you. I've only watched a couple of episodes, and that is one of the reasons why. One of the episodes I saw featured an apartment in New York
City they were redoing for two firefighters who were incredibly deserving. I mean, what could be better? Patriotism, firefighters, NYC, Post-911, etc.

I got SO tired of hearing what great guys, heros, etc. they were. It seemed like everytime either guy was mentioned it was in the context of how deserving they were and how unfortunate it was that two such wonderful guys had to live in this scruffy little apartment, that didn't even have two proper bedrooms.

I have nothing against them selecting especially deserving families as opposed to average people. But if they point out how deserving the families are everytime they talk about them, I'm not going to make a habit of watching the show. (I might not anyway, but that bugged me).

[Askia]

The show is not a tragedy fest -- the show celebrates people who persevere despite sometimes overwhelming personal tragedies, handicaps and losses, and whose lives would improve immensely with home improvements they cannot afford.

The firefighters, strictly speaking, were among the LEAST deserving peope on these shows so far although as post 9-11 representatives of the NYC Fire Department, they were certainly deserving for that group -- which may explain the speedboat all the firefighters got to share at the end.

[dropzone]

The construction problems in that particular home may have had more to do with the new format of the show and the limits of the design teams skills.And that is the downside of letting set designers build your house. :eek:

[AuntiePam]

I have nothing against them selecting especially deserving families as opposed to average people. But if they point out how deserving the families are everytime they talk about them, I'm not going to make a habit of watching the show. (I might not anyway, but that bugged me).

Sunday night's ep was just the second one I've watched, but it bugged me too -- constantly cutting away to a team member reminding us about the family's tragedy. Unnecessary.

More time on the design and construction aspects would be nice.

Does Ty use that bullhorn in every show?

[Walloon]

Getting back to the tax issues of the show, what if the production company, Ford and Sears treated the stuff given as gifts?See my first two posts above.

[alice_in_wonderland]

Does Ty use that bullhorn in every show?

Yep. And it's insanely annoying. But often, he's got a naked chest shot going when he's using it, so I'm helpless to turn away.

I think Ty is a cutie-patootie. Annoying in a BIG way, but cute, nonetheless.

[SmackFu]

Interesting local article on the latest makeover: http://www.bakersfield.com/local/story/5093348p-5138926c.html

(You have to register to read it though. Damn Bakersfield Californian!)

[Askia]

Smackfu. That IS an interesting article. I've snipped a large-ish excerpt here:
Throughout the process, the focus has been on Jennifer Elcano and her children, whose story touched thousands of Kern residents after her husband, Glen, was killed in a traffic accident in June. The show's producers and Ty Pennington, the on-camera "team leader," said they wanted to ensure that the family would never have to worry about losing the farm again.

The problem with that sentiment, according to Linda Elcano and her daughter, Deanna Elcano Blaise, is that the property south of Bakersfield is actually owned by Linda, not Jennifer. All of the new irrigation systems, all of the improvements on the Elcano farm -- including the new house and barn -- are owned by the family matriarch, not Glen Elcano's widow.

"I own the property out here," Linda Elcano said. "The work done ... it's improvements to my property."

The elder Elcano is quick to point out that Jennifer is family and Michael and Ashley are cherished grandchildren. They can live in the new house for as long as they wish.

But she owns the land outright, so it's in no danger of being lost to creditors or corporate interests. Bottom line: the mother-in-law is making sure that it's known that SHE owns that land her daughter-in-law lives on, even though her daughter in law was successful in getting the show to come out there and make the improvements. I think it's pretty clear the elder Elcano will not pass on shares the property to her daughter-in-law, but her grandkids will probably inherit shares.

There are some interesting notes about how the elder Elcano's house -- which was right next door, and much more modest -- was blocked off-camera by prducers by stacking bales of hay in front of it in establishing shots.

Not to diminish the importance of what's happened here, but it does take the gloss off the fairy tale somewhat.

[SmackFu]

Askia, thanks for posting that snippet. I was in a hurry before and couldn't post a quote like I should have, since it's behind a registration link (that I used bugmenot to get around myself).

[Askia]

SmackFu. No problemo. I finally got around to seeing the episode in question and some things are becoming clear to me: like the fact that the mother-in-law, who actually owns the land that was improved on, is completely absent from the actual show, even though she apparently lives right next door! I wonder what she did to piss off the producers so much that they would so thoroughly leave her out? I mean, her inclusion should make the story all the more poignant -- elderly mother, widow, young kids, lose only son/husband/father in tragic accident, might lose 100 year old family farm.

WAG: she bad-mouths her dead son for some reason, or blames the daughter-in-law. Since either would detract from this sympathetic story, they leave her out.

[AuntiePam]

So there really was no danger of "losing the family farm"? I feel manipulated. Imagine that. A manipulative TV program. :dubious:

[Wile E]

Sunday night's ep was just the second one I've watched, but it bugged me too -- constantly cutting away to a team member reminding us about the family's tragedy. Unnecessary.

More time on the design and construction aspects would be nice.
...

I've watched it just a few times and I also find the unending sappiness a little too much. I get it that these people have had it tough but instead of each person on the design team going on and on about that, maybe they could spend more time on explaining and showing the design and construction aspects and telling us some simple things we could do. This sort of thing might make the rest of us feel more included instead of actually feeling bad that are lives aren't just a little more tragic so we could get an awesome home makeover, too.

[lawoot]

We just had this crew in our area last week for a makeover (I think it's airing in January). A $200,000 house, but the contractors say that when you add up everything that went into it (labor, materials, new top-of-the-line appliances, etc), it probably actually ran into the millions. The family in question lost there home in a fire, and have been living in a tent for the last few months. The neighbors started bitching about the moise and non-stop commotion in the local paper, but were smacked down by the rest of the community real fast ("Gee. You're complaining about a week of noise. These people lived in a TENT for FOUR MONTHS. Get over yourself.")

Still - constant trucks, 24 hours a day, thousands of spectators and volunteers(the local transit system set up special shuttles to the site) - what fun!

Here's an article about the experience: Homemade Excitement (http://www.thesunlink.com/bsun/local/article/0,2403,BSUN_19088_3336623,00.html)

And another, about the noise (http://www.thesunlink.com/bsun/local/article/0,2403,BSUN_19088_3333524,00.html)

[Askia]

So there really was no danger of "losing the family farm"? I feel manipulated. Imagine that. A manipulative TV program. :dubious: If ABC Extreme Makeover: Home Edition had never shown up and not done a thing to the property, no. There farm would not have been in any immediate danger, but you saw how run down the place was. I think the danger of "losing the farm" comes in once they do put in all the improvements--- new house, two new cars, new huge barn, new irrigation systems, new farming equipment, etc. -- because suddenly this old 100 year old farm has a lot of new taxes to worry about and is worth something. THAT'S why local farmers donated bales and bales of hay to sell, and a $60, 000 trust was set up, and 20 acres was planted for free, etc. -- gives them a leg up and some capital to work with.

Wile E. This is a home makeover show that's an outgrowth of a human fashion makeover show.... not Trading Spaces or This Old House. You're suppsed to watch the miracle unfold for some lucky family whose fortunes are being turned arund.

[Wile E]

...

Wile E. This is a home makeover show that's an outgrowth of a human fashion makeover show.... not Trading Spaces or This Old House. You're suppsed to watch the miracle unfold for some lucky family whose fortunes are being turned arund.

Well, I wasn't the only one to express that sentiment and if I am supposed to just watch the miracle and sappiness unfold, then I just choose not to watch.

[Askia]

Wile E. Hey, wait. I apologize, OK? I don't mean to pick on you or presume to tell you how to feel. Clearly I like the show, I like it a lot, and the sappiness and tears of happiness are generally a plus for me. When they showed how they helped complete the model airplane the son and his never finished, and the father's boots by the fireplace, that made even cynical old me feel happy for the widow Elcano. Sometimes I think we live in a mean old world and it's nice to see whole communities pull together to help someone out--even if the Hollywood picture we're presented with is not the whole truth.

[5que]

Kind of along the lines of "how can they do this in a week"....

How can the whole family head off to Disney World, a dude ranch, etc. on about 2 hours notice?? Wouldn't you need to, I don't know, tell your boss you're gone for a week? Same with school for the kids. Do they have a week's worth of clean undies, or does the limo have to wait for a couple loads of clothes?

So I'm wondering if there maybe is a couple of days between the "Good morning XXX Family!!!" from Ty's bullhorn, and the family jetting off.

[Askia]

I imagine Ty Pennington and/or the show's producers have a lot to do with facilitating an abrupt departure once they pull up to the house; making phone calls on their behalf, explaining things to schools and employers, etc. Also, when families are notified they're finalists for the show they're probably given instructions to let various people know a week-long absence is a distinct possibility.

As for packing, I've seen some families travel kind of light, so maybe a clothing allowance is provided while they're on vacation.

[deadeyesdad]

Ok here's some SD on the 11/21 EMHE epiosode. The farm and house were about 5 miles from my farm. I know the family. It is not like they were our best friends but I know who they are and have a lot of friends who were good friends with them and helped out with a lot of the stuff you saw on the show.

[deadeyesdad]

And then I get distacted and one of my girls plays with the mouse and clicks submit so I have a new post.

The house and barn were really built in 1 week. I didn't think it was possible but they did it. It actually rained that week and slowed down some of the work but there were a ton of volunteers and they were working 24/7 on the stuff.
What I heard is they call you and tell you that you have made the final selection and you need to be ready to leave at such and such a time on this day. They also tell you that you are one of 5 or so finalists(I don't know if there are any other "finalists" that are told to wait and nobody shows up but I doubt it). So it is possible that a family is ready to go to Disneyworld when the crew shows up.
The hay:15,000bales at 125 lbs a piece=1,875,000lbs of hay divided by 2000=937.5 tons of hay. At $150 a ton, I don't know the quality of the hay donated but the number isn't too far out of what is market price for the area. 937.5x$150=$140,625. So let's say about $150,000 in hay to sell. There is a huge market for hay in the area. There is about 150,000 dairy cattle within 10 miles of the farm. That is where a lot of the hay came from in the first place.

[Askia]

deadeyesdad: Thanks for sharing that! BTW, is there anything to my speculations why the matriarch Elcano was left off this week's episode? I think it must be that she comes off unsympathetic on camera. Do you know if thats true?

[deadeyesdad]

I think it is because the "story" doesn't look as good when those silly little facts get in the way. "Hey let's just hide gandmama and make it look all pretty". I don't really know. I can ask around and see what I come up with. I haven't been home much since the show aired and a lot of other people have been gone so I really haven't talked that much about the show as aired. I kind of watched it but since we were TIVOing it I didn't really sit and watch it like I would like. Sometime this weekend I watch it for real.

[Askia]

Hey thanks. I know this isn't terribly important in the grand scheme of things but I find it really odd that the mother-in-law wasn''t included unless she was hospitalized that week or just isn't, y'know, pleasant.

If you find out anything, post it and I'll definitely read it!

[StGermain]

Maybe she didn't want to be seen on National TV haing her daughter-in-law and grandchildren living in a hovel.

StG

[Askia]

... good point... and that would tend to fall under, "...not pleasant...' and may explain why her house was blocked off by the producers... hmmmm.

[AuntiePam]

Or maybe she lives in a hovel too. ?