"The Jews killed Arafat!"

[Eve]

PARIS (AP) - Freshly armed with Yasser Arafat's weighty medical dossier, his nephew pinned blame on Israel for the late Palestinian leader's death and refused Monday to squelch rumors of poisoning - even though he acknowledged that doctors found no known poisons. Nasser al-Kidwa, who is also the Palestinian ambassador to the United Nations, said the files are inconclusive on the cause of Arafat's death, but "I believe the Israeli authorities are largely responsible for what happened." Before his death, French doctors had disclosed that Arafat had a high white blood cell count as well as a low count of platelets, a substance that aids in blood clotting . . . That is consistent with a variety of illnesses from pneumonia to cancer. Farouk Kaddoumi, the new head of the Palestine Liberation Organization's mainstream Fatah faction, repeated his belief that Arafat was poisoned. "Why, then, the low platelets count? There is no reason except poisoning," he said.

—Yeah, yeah. We also killed Princess Diana, Gregory Peck, and that old lady from the "Where's the Beef?" commercial. They just pissed us off

[betenoir]

We killed him.

signed Morty

[Trunk]

I took part too.

signed Schlomo.

Take hope. . .if nothing else, the Palestinians are known for being reasonable, so they'll see right through Farouk Kaddoumi's statements.

[CandidGamera]

First Jesus, and now this. Bastards.


;)

[lieu]

Until the day before, he'd been the picture of health.

[gum]

Yeah. They waited with killing him until he was 75 and a has-been , huh.

Originally posted by TrunkTake hope. . .if nothing else, the Palestinians are known for being reasonable, so they'll see right through Farouk Kaddoumi's statements. . I don't know whether to laugh or cry at this. I'll go with the :D

[Eve]

Bastards.

I'm sorry. I'll write "I will never kill Arafat again" 100 times on the blackboard.

[GaWd]

Yep, I killed him. Christ, too.

Yours Truly,

Schmuel

[dropzone]

What IS the fascination with conspiracy theories over there? As I've said before, I've rarely met one I didn't like but it would never occur to me that he was poisoned. I mean, look at his eyes the past year or so--he obviously had cancer. And his face? Working on stroke two or three, I'd wager. A decrepit old man dies--this is surprising? And since when has Mossad been that subtle? They've always been, "Yeah, I iced the bitch. So what?"

[Papermache Prince]

What's worse, we will never read about the poisoning allegations because the Jews control all the media.

[Exgineer]

You sure as hell took your damned time about it. A bunch of WASPs would have had him on ice by '67 or so.

[Eats_Crayons]

and that old lady from the "Where's the Beef?" commercial. I thought you had her cryogenically frozen in a vault hidden under the "Pirates of the Carribean" attraction at Disneyland.

Or was that someone else? And if it was, did you kill him too?

[Marley23]

Can't say nobody saw this coming. It sort of sounds like the nephew is blaming Israel for hurting him with the confinement, which can't have helped anybody's health, but then again there's no evidence of poisoning and his statement refuses to rule it out in a very pointed way. Jackass.

[gobear]

Just as a slight hijack, I've got a joke to share. . .

Yassir Arafat goes to a fortuneteller. He asks her, "What can you tell me of my future?"

She looks into her crystal ball and says, "You shall die on a Jewish holiday."

Arafat's eyes widen as he says, "Can you tell me which one?"

The fortuneteller says, "Listen, when you die, trust me, THAT day will be a Jewish holiday."

[Master Wang-Ka]

Dropzone, y'r bein' too rational.

Think back to the American south, back around the turn of the century. If anything bad happened, it was generally the ni-- um, black folks' fault.

Now think back to the Cold War at its worst -- 1948 to 1975 or so. If anything bad happened, it was those damn Commies.

There is a level of hatred at which rational thought pretty much ceases. The Middle East passed that level decades ago. Anything bad happens to a Palestinian, it's the Israelis' fault. Or the Americans'; lot of folks over there don't see much difference.

I'd figure the "Marine shooting unarmed Iraqi" flap would have demonstrated that. Allow for a dozen different incidents where unarmed Westerners are kidnapped, terrorized, videotaped, and then murdered, and the press over there barely mentions it... but allow for one unarmed Iraqi to be shot by an American, and the entire Arab world goes bughouse; the media over there is STILL gleefully kicking that one around.

Like I said... you're not gonna understand this one by thinking rationally.

[Squink]

You know eve, this poisoning theory wouldn't spread so easily if Sharon hadn't threatened to kill Arafat (http://www.google.com/search?q=ariel+sharon+%22kill+arafat%22&sourceid=mozilla-search&start=0&start=0&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8&client=firefox-a&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:official)

[Diogenes the Cynic]

Not to lend credibility to any conspiracies, but "Israeli authorities" != "The Jews."

[Jackmannii]

""Why, then, the low platelets count? There is no reason except poisoning," he said."

Hey, this is good stuff.


Now, anytime someone croaks at our hospital and they want me to do an autopsy, all I have to do is find a low platelet count and presto!, it must be a poisoning - off to the Medical Examiner's office.

This has potential to be a real time-saver.

[danceswithcats]

I thought it was Professor Plum in the Conservatory with the lead pipe. :smack:

[HPL]

Oh my God!

They killed Arafat!

Those.........Bastards?

[LouisB]

I think he died of AIDS. Did the Jews arrange that?

[Ike Witt]

We also killed Mohammad, Buddha, Confucius and Kennedy. Don't piss us off.

[Left Hand of Dorkness]

Hey, hey, I'm never pissing off a Jew again.
Daniel

[Cervaise]

I'm never pissing off a Jew again.Too bad, because it gives you an extra six or seven feet of distance, if you can keep your footing on the yarmulke.

[EddyTeddyFreddy]

Too bad, because it gives you an extra six or seven feet of distance, if you can keep your footing on the yarmulke. Great Og, may I for once break an unwritten rule of this board and say:

ROFLMAOPIP!!!!!!!

[Left Hand of Dorkness]

Too bad, because it gives you an extra six or seven feet of distance, if you can keep your footing on the yarmulke.

I disagree: as Isaac Newton said, "If I have pissed further, it is by standing on the shoulders of gentiles."

Daniel

[Marley23]

We also killed Mohammad, Buddha, Confucius and Kennedy. Don't piss us off.
Lyndon Johnson was Jewish?

[vanilla]

After Dangerfield died, he lost all reason to go on.

[Marley23]

After Dangerfield died, he lost all reason to go on.
You know, it could be said that Arafat didn't get no respect at all. Hmm. I wonder...

[Reeder]

Trying to pull the OP back on course.

Does anyone really believe Israel wouldn't have done it if the had the chance?

[Left Hand of Dorkness]

Does anyone really believe Israel wouldn't have done it if the had the chance?

Poison Arafat? of course they wouldn't: the last thing they want is Arafat the Martyr haunting them for decades to come. The man was close to death anyway: why make him immortal?

Ah, but they could do it without anyone noticing? Bullshit. Ain't no such thing as a perfect crime, and they knew for damn sure that when Arafat died, his death would be closely investigated.

Not worth the risk.
Daniel

[Reeder]

Poison Arafat? of course they wouldn't: the last thing they want is Arafat the Martyr haunting them for decades to come. The man was close to death anyway: why make him immortal?

Ah, but they could do it without anyone noticing? Bullshit. Ain't no such thing as a perfect crime, and they knew for damn sure that when Arafat died, his death would be closely investigated.

Not worth the risk.
Daniel


Poisoning with obvious poisons I agree.


But if they could make in look natural.

It's looks to me like the Drs could not find a reason for what happened to Arafat.

[FinnAgain]

We did not kill Arafat!

we hired the Illuminati to do it for us.

[FinnAgain]

Well Reeder:... just to hypothesize...

could've been ricin (http://www.sciencentral.com/articles/view.php3?language=english&type=24119&article_id=218392166&cat=1_2)
and there is precident (http://www.cnn.com/2003/WORLD/europe/01/07/terror.poison.bulgarian/)

[Reeder]

You wanna know what's so bad?

If Israel did it. And I'm not saying they did. Just if.

American tax dollars paid for it.

[FinnAgain]

You wanna know what's so bad?

If Israel did it. And I'm not saying they did. Just if.

American tax dollars paid for it.

Eh, that's not necessarily true.
I could see the Weitzman Institute coming up with some untracable poison all on their own.

[LilyoftheValley]

Who killed Arafat?
ELVIS!
Who killed Clara Peller (http://www.tvacres.com/admascots_clarapeller.htm)?
ELVIS!

Man oh man
What I want you to see
Is that the Big E's
Inside of Israelis.

[detop]

I thought it was Professor Plum in the Conservatory with the lead pipe. :smack:

Shouldn't that be Professor Pflaumstein ?

[Marley23]

It's looks to me like the Drs could not find a reason for what happened to Arafat.
Some recent GD discussion on the topic: http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=287295

[Squink]

Poison Arafat? of course they wouldn't
There are more obscure toxins in heaven and earth, Left Hand of Dorkness, than are dreamt of in your philosophy.

[Reeder]

Eh, that's not necessarily true.
I could see the Weitzman Institute coming up with some untracable poison all on their own.


I agree. But who funds the institute?

We fund 90% of Israel's military.

And the Palestinians know it.

Is there any wonder why they hate us?

Hell..we gave Israel armored humvees before we gave them to our own troops.

[danceswithcats]

Tinfoil-it's what's for hats. :rolleyes:

[dropzone]

(stamping my foot with annoyance)

You suspect Arafat, a sickly old man, was POISONED?!?!? Brother Reeder, you have become an embarassment to those of us who are merely paranoid. What possible motivation could there have been to hurry along what was obviously imminent when the risks of discovery were so great? :mad:

[Reeder]

(stamping my foot with annoyance)

You suspect Arafat, a sickly old man, was POISONED?!?!? Brother Reeder, you have become an embarassment to those of us who are merely paranoid. What possible motivation could there have been to hurry along what was obviously imminent when the risks of discovery were so great? :mad:

Show me where I said he was poisoned.

Idiot.

[dropzone]

You danced around it but left obvious who you were dancing with.

[LavenderBlue]

You wanna know what's so bad?

If Israel did it. And I'm not saying they did. Just if.

American tax dollars paid for it.

Given what a corrupt, thieving and murderous fuck he was what's really so bad is that the Palestinians didn't do it. Arafat should have died at the hands of a suicide bomber.

[Reeder]

You danced around it but left obvious who you were dancing with.


Personally.

I don't give a fuck if they did or not. Regardless of what you want to try to pin on me.

Want to know what I really think?

I wish the Israeli government and the Palestinian government would kill each other off and the people of both countries could go on with their lives.

But casting aspersions is wahat you want to do.

Well fuck you asshole.

My gripe is that mine and your tax dollars are used to kill Palestinians.

Is that ok with you?

[Weirddave]

You wanna know what's so bad?

If Israel did it. And I'm not saying they did. Just if.

American tax dollars paid for it.
Well, in that case, we'd finally be killing an actual terrorist with our tax dollars, I would have thought you'd be happy that we finally got it right.

[KarlGauss]

Show me where I said he was poisoned.

Idiot.

No, asshole, he didn't claim you "said" he was poisoned, just that you "suspect" so.

BTW, I don't think I have ever seen such bizarre and twisted logic as in this gem: You wanna know what's so bad?

If Israel did it. And I'm not saying they did. Just if.

American tax dollars paid for it.

And I say to you, dear Reeder, "If you are a genius. And I'm not saying you are. Just if.

I killed Arafat."

Same logic. From a falsehood, anything follows.

[Reeder]

One mans terrorist is another mans freedom fighter.

If my country had been taken from me by mandate..

Then I'd be a "terrorist" too.

Wouldn't you?

Of course you wouldn't.

Fighting for your country is a bad thing.

[dropzone]

Is that ok with you?(angelic smile) Why, yes it IS, Mr Reeder! Every April 15th I enclose a note asking that every last dime of my taxes be spent on exterminating the Palestinians. :rolleyes: If Israel did it. And I'm not saying they did. Just if.This is the classic dodge of a conspiracy nut who doesn't want to be pinned down as actually saying something. This allowed you to suggest an accusation, as you also did when you said Poisoning with obvious poisons I agree.

But if they could make in look natural.but still hop up and down saying, "Show me where I said Israel poisoned him!" It's weaseling, pure and simple. It's really sad when you use methods so cheap and sleazy that you get a person like me, who usually agrees with you, to call you on it.

[FinnAgain]

One mans terrorist is another mans freedom fighter.

Nope, freedom fighters don't target women and children.
Try again.


If my country had been taken from me by mandate..

They didn't have a country, 'palestinians' were mostly Jordanians.
Try again.


Then I'd be a "terrorist" too.
Wouldn't you?

Nope, I'd attack military targets and not blow up busses.
Try again.



Of course you wouldn't.
Fighting for your country is a bad thing.

Deliberately murdering women and children is a bad thing.
Try again.

[Reeder]

So the country called Palestine pre 1948 was just a suburb of Jordon?

Give me a fucking break.

[World Eater]

Reeder, I think you should take a deep breath for a moment.

[Reeder]

Deliberately murdering women and children is a bad thing.
Try again.


Interesting.

King David Hotel.

Look it up.

[FinnAgain]

King David Hotel.

Look it up.

I'm well aware of the history of the region, Irgun, Hagana, and the Stern Gang.
The fact remains that the Palestinians' current strategy targets civilians.
Try again.

[Reeder]

Reeder, I think you should take a deep breath for a moment.


I am no defender of Arafat.

Of course he was a terrorist.

But why is there only one side of the story on this board?

[Reeder]

I'm well aware of the history of the region, Irgun, Hagana, and the Stern Gang.
The fact remains that the Palestinians' current strategy targets civilians.
Try again.


What??

They didn't target civilians??


Hell.. the attack on the King David Hotel killed 15 Jews.

[FinnAgain]

So the country called Palestine pre 1948 was just a suburb of Jordon?

.

Nope, it was Transjordan (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Transjordan)
Try again.

[FinnAgain]

What??
They didn't target civilians??
Hell.. the attack on the King David Hotel killed 15 Jews.

What exactly does the word "current" mean to you?

[Reeder]

What exactly does the word "current" mean to you?

I understand now.

The past doesn't matter.

So anything before today is gone right?

The bombs Israel has dropped in the middle of busy streets don't count.

The assassination squads the the sent out that killed the wrong people.

pfft.

They don't count either.

Geez people.

My only gripe is my tax dollars pay for all these deaths.

And y'all think its ok.

May God have mercy on your souls.

[World Eater]

I am no defender of Arafat.

Of course he was a terrorist.

But why is there only one side of the story on this board?

No sides, I'm coming into the middle of the arguement here. When I see you arguing with fine posters like FinnAgain and Dropzone I wonder wtf is going on, that's all.

[FinnAgain]

I understand now.
The past doesn't matter.

The past does matter, it simply does not matter when we're talking about current practices.


So anything before today is gone right?

No, anything which has transpired in the past is still very much real, but I believe we were discussing how the Palestinians target civilians.



The bombs Israel has dropped in the middle of busy streets don't count.

Unfortunately the situation is very difficult.
Send in troops, and you have a Jenin style problem on your hands.
When you have to kill terrorists, missiles are your best bet.

I am, however, unfamiliar with the claim of the IDF dropping bombs in busy streets for a purpose other than hitting a terrorist. If you provide me with a cite I will provide you with condemnation of the IDF in that instance.



The assassination squads the the sent out that killed the wrong people.

Again, I am unfamiliar with this. If you provide a cite, I will condemn the action. I will, however, support the policy of targeted killings of terrorists.



My only gripe is my tax dollars pay for all these deaths.
And y'all think its ok.


So your only gripe is that we pay for it?
Jeez, your moral outrage doesn't go too deep, does it?


May God have mercy on your souls.

Leave your invisible friend out of this. ;)


P.S. On preview: World Eater Thank you very much.

[Reeder]

Unfortunately the situation is very difficult.
Send in troops, and you have a Jenin style problem on your hands.
When you have to kill terrorists, missiles are your best bet.

Ahh...

Collateral damage.

To hell with civilians as long as we get the target.

I bet you just love our Iraq war.

[Reeder]

So your only gripe is that we pay for it?
Jeez, your moral outrage doesn't go too deep, does it?

This whole thing started out about tax dollars.

Then you and yours jumped to Israels defence.

I guess the USS Liberty means nothing to you and your ilk does it.

[World Eater]

P.S. On preview: World Eater Thank you very much.

No, thank you for bringing some sanity to this place. There are some people that just get it, and you my friend are at the top of that list.

Reeder can get a bit crazy sometimes, but his heart is in the right place.

We all need to stick together.

[FinnAgain]

Ahh...
Collateral damage.
To hell with civilians as long as we get the target.

Minimize civilians deaths whenever possible.
But when an organized ring of terrorists orchestrates the murder of hundreds of your civilians, and then deliberately makes its HQ in residential areas, you have limited options.
Not responding is not an option.
Sending in troops is not an option.
Unfortunately collateral damage become unavoidable.


I bet you just love our Iraq war.

Reeder: You should know better. I've posted in threads that you were in about Iraq, if you are unaware of my position, check those threads.

The situations are also not equal.
Iraq did not attack us.
Iraq was not a threat to us.
Iraq did not target our civilians.

[Reeder]

You are saying Israel doesn't attack civilians? Give me a break.

Do me a favor. I have to go to bed. Should have a long time ago.

But do some research for me.

Find how many Israeli civilians have died and how palestinians civilians have died.

Compare the two numbers.

Then if you think I'm still in the wrong.

Let me have it.

Be safe my friend.

[LavenderBlue]

One mans terrorist is another mans freedom fighter.

If my country had been taken from me by mandate..

Then I'd be a "terrorist" too.

Wouldn't you?

Of course you wouldn't.

Fighting for your country is a bad thing.

I wouldn't disrupt the Olympics and murder innocent athletes.

I wouldn't hijack planes and murder innocent civilians.

I wouldn't throw old men in wheelchairs off boats.

I wouldn't steal a billion dollars.

I wouldn't tell little children the only children solution was to kill themselves and murder people at a pizza parlor.

Fuck you for even remotely defending Mr. Arafat. Do all of us liberals a favor and become a Republican.

Aw forget I actually like some Republicans.

[Reeder]

Fuck you for even remotely defending Mr. Arafat. Do all of us liberals a favor and become a Republican.


I hate to disappoint you...

But I'm not a democrat.

If you were familiar with my posts you'd know that though.

[FinnAgain]

You are saying Israel doesn't attack civilians? Give me a break.

What does the word "target" mean to you?


But do some research for me.
Find how many Israeli civilians have died and how palestinians civilians have died.
Compare the two numbers.
Then if you think I'm still in the wrong.
Let me have it.


No need.
Like I said, I'm aware of the facts about the region.
More Palestinians have died than Israelis.
I will also point out that the Palestinians have a policy of paying/encouraging children and civilians to take part in violent protests.
So it's not like they don't bear some responsibility for it.

here is a partisan cite which you probably won't put too much stock in (http://www.jcpa.org/jl/vp441.htm)

But here's one with quotes from the other side (http://www.wnd.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=18773)

"There is no doubt that a child [martyr] suggests that the new generation will carry on the mission with determination," said the Mufti, appointed by Palestinian Authority President Yasser Arafat. "The younger the martyr, the greater and the more I respect him. ...

Or how about this? (you don't even need to read the article) notice all those 'civilians' next to the guy with the machine gun? (http://www.betar.co.uk/articles/betar1059578683.php)


Be safe my friend.

You too.
If you need me to kick you around some more on this topic, just let me know. ;)

[FinnAgain]

Sorry I missed some of this, juggling this thread with an IM conversation, yeesh!

I am no defender of Arafat.
Of course he was a terrorist.

One mans terrorist is another mans freedom fighter.
If my country had been taken from me by mandate..
Then I'd be a "terrorist" too.

Jeez, I wonder how anybody ever might've possibly thought you were defending Arafat. I, for one, am stumped.

This whole thing started out about tax dollars.
Then you and yours jumped to Israels defence.
I guess the USS Liberty means nothing to you and your ilk does it.

It started about tax dollars, then I pointed out that you had a very weird slant to your perception (http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=5528459&postcount=52)
And, The USS Liberty was attacked in '67. (http://ussliberty.org/index.html)

And, to prempt you, no, I do not discard it or place no blame on Israel, I will note that it is not A) current B) relevant to the second Intifada.

No, thank you for bringing some sanity to this place. There are some people that just get it, and you my friend are at the top of that list.
Reeder can get a bit crazy sometimes, but his heart is in the right place.
We all need to stick together.

Awwww shucks... ~shuffles feet~ tweren't nuthin'

It's actually sorta odd, I've agreed with Reeder on a good few of his recent posts in other threads. It's just that he's wrong in this instance.

[FinnAgain]

One final thing as I've got a paper to write that's due at noon tomorrow:

another partisan cite but with refrences to US findings on the Liberty. (http://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org/jsource/History/liberty2.html)

[teleute12]

Reeder, shut the hell up so we can go back to the jokes.

[Alessan]

Wow. This thread went from really funny to really pathetic really fast.

I usually try to avoid these debates - life, after all, is much too short - but as a Doper I feel the need to correct erronious facts whenever I encounter them. It's a burden, I know.



We fund 90% of Israel's military.

....

Hell..we gave Israel armored humvees before we gave them to our own troops.

The Israeli military budget is $9.11 Billion. (http://www.cia.gov/cia/publications/factbook/geos/is.html). U.S. military aid (75% of which must be spent on American-made hardware) is less than $2.4 Billion. (http://www.haaretzdaily.com/hasen/pages/ShArt.jhtml?itemNo=155168&contrassID=2&subContrassID=1&sbSubContrassID=0&listSrc=Y). Closer to 25% than 90%. A lot, to be sure, but even without it Israel is currently the second most powerful military force in the Middle East (after the U.S., of course).

As for the Humvees, I'm pretty sure the armor was added on after delivery; Israel has a long history of tinkering with foreign-made hardware. And even if I'm wrong, all it means is that the U.S. military neglected to order them for its troops - I mean, it's not as if they cost that much - which is their failing, not ours. There is not a finite number of armored Hummers to go around, you know. If there had been a shortage and the U.S. military had wanted them they would have gotten dibs.

[Left Hand of Dorkness]

There are more obscure toxins in heaven and earth, Left Hand of Dorkness, than are dreamt of in your philosophy.
Nuh uh. I know there are obscure toxins. I addressed this in my first post: what doesn't exist is the perfect crime.

It's a cost/benefit equation. Arafat was going to die soon anyway, so the benefit to poisoning him would've been marginal. The risk of being discovered in an attempt, whether successful or not, is that Arafat would be immortalized as a martyr.

Israel may be brutal toward the Palestinians, but the country's government isn't stupid.
Daniel

[ralph124c]

Is it possible that Arafat had advanced AIDS? There are several credible reports (one from the Rumanian Secret Police) that Arafat led a very active homosexual sex life. The old goat was (from several accounts) quite promiscuous.
Have the French released any detailed pathology reports?

[Sevastopol]

- but as a Doper I feel the need to correct erronious facts whenever I encounter them.
...
I don't.


p.s.
Hang in there Reeder.

[Jackmannii]

Arafat was actually poisoned by the United Parcel Service.



They don't wear those brown shirts for nuthin'.








I hate the UPS, and this is a golden opportunity to pin something on them. So don't go correcting me with none of yer facts, Alessan.

[EddyTeddyFreddy]

Arafat was actually poisoned by the United Parcel Service. You think? And here I thought he was FedExed.

[vanilla]

But why is there only one side of the story on this board?
Because we are all (except you obviously) controlled by Israel.
Sorry, nothing personal. :rolleyes:

[Epimetheus]

I thought you had her cryogenically frozen in a vault hidden under the "Pirates of the Carribean" attraction at Disneyland.

Or was that someone else? And if it was, did you kill him too?

Oo, with a radio controlled synthetic heart and animatronic limbs?

[vanilla]

One mans terrorist is another mans freedom fighter.

.
One boards nut is anothers charter member

[Marley23]

Israel may be brutal toward the Palestinians, but the country's government isn't stupid.
Confining him to his compound and holding him under seige for years could be called stupid, it generated a lot more sympathy for him.

[dropzone]

Is it possible that Arafat had advanced AIDS?While I usually associate the look in his eyes in recent years with AIDS I've also seen it in people who have cancer from other causes,* but that would explain why his nephew is saying that the doctors couldn't find the cause. French MDs are pretty damned good and I suspect they know perfectly well what killed him.
Have the French released any detailed pathology reports?Not publicly and I believe French law prohibits them from doing so if the family says no. As such news would detract from the image they are creating of a mythic Arafat it's probably unlikely we'll know anything until a French reporter sneaks in and steals his chart. It is fortunate that French reporters are good, too, and love a good scandal.


* - What, you can't tell somebody has terminal cancer from a look at his eyes? That wide-eyed, haunted look stands out like a sore thumb.

[Left Hand of Dorkness]

Confining him to his compound and holding him under seige for years could be called stupid, it generated a lot more sympathy for him.

Really? Didn't seem that way to me; seemed to me that it marginalized him. Where did it generate sympathy for him?

Daniel

[TwistofFate]

There are several credible reports (one from the Rumanian Secret Police)

No, from one defector from the Romanian secret service. and no actual proof. and of course, so what if he was? What business is it of yours?

will you be making the same allegations when Sharon dies?

[Finagle]

You think? And here I thought he was FedExed.

This fits the facts. We know he had cirrhosis, so he was effectively de-livered.

[Shodan]

I love how we got from here:
If Israel did it. And I'm not saying they did. Just if.

American tax dollars paid for it.To here:
Well fuck you asshole.

My gripe is that mine and your tax dollars are used to kill Palestinians.
without even a scrap of evidence.

Directly from paranoia-fueled speculation to accusation.

And Left Hand of Dorkness - "pissing on the shoulders of gentiles" is beyond brilliant.

Regards,
Shodan

[Shodan]

Actually, on rereading the thread, I see that Reeder's later post could be interpreted as objecting to Israel's fight against terrorists in general, not an alleged poisoning of the Dear Departed. My apologies for the misconstrual.

Reeder, you are still a fruitcake and wrong on every substantive point, but you were not specifically accusing the US.

Regards,
Shodan

[GaWd]

Reeder's just envious of us Jews who control the media, and investment markets and banks and American Politics, and that the Zionist Conspiracy allowed them to escape the twin towers attacks on 9/11.

:rolleyes:

You really are a nut, Reeder.

Sam

[FinnAgain]

- but as a Doper I feel the need to correct erronious facts whenever I encounter them.
I don't.


p.s.
Hang in there Reeder.

Wow, what a surprise, you don't care about the truth, especially if it gets in the way of some good Israel bashing. Nobody could've expected that from you I mean, sevastapol, a freakin' idjit? Nawwwww...

[Eve]

By the way, you notice the Pope and Billy Graham aren't looking too good these days? We're waitin' for them to get juuuuuust old enough . . . Then poison 'em!

Bwa-hahahahaha!

[vanilla]

Israel would poison Billy Graham??!!! :dubious:

[Left Hand of Dorkness]

By the way, you notice the Pope and Billy Graham aren't looking too good these days? We're waitin' for them to get juuuuuust old enough . . . Then poison 'em!

Bwa-hahahahaha!
Did you guys do Ronald Reagan, or was that the terrorists?
Daniel

[FinnAgain]

"...but... I didn't eat the fish."

[FinnAgain]

Did you guys do Ronald Reagan, or was that the terrorists?


Do Reagan? Man, he was old and leathery and smelled funny, who'd want to do him?
Oh, oh!
I see.
Yeah, we capped that punkass.

[Left Hand of Dorkness]

Do Reagan? Man, he was old and leathery and smelled funny, who'd want to do him?
Oh, oh!
I see.
Yeah, we capped that punkass.
"Capped that punkass"? What is this, Goys in the Hood?

Daniel

[FinnAgain]

Jew Tang Clan reprezeeeeeent!

[GaWd]

As my Great-Great-Grandmother might say in her Broken english and Russian accent, were she alive(G_d willing!):

"Vurd, Yo!"

Sam

[FinnAgain]

Wouldn't that be "Vurd, oy!" ;)

[GaWd]

Or, and this would be a particularly popular hit with the "progressive" Orthodox crowd, "Yo, vey!" I can see old Eastern European Jewsih women on walkers and in wheelchairs talking trash at the bridge table, flashing gang signs and wearing Platinum bling...

;)

Sam

[FinnAgain]

"Yo bitch, you'd best not be steppin to my gefilte fish!"

[Eve]

I can see old Eastern European Jewsih women on walkers and in wheelchairs talking trash at the bridge table, flashing gang signs and wearing Platinum bling...

The drive-by kina horas are something fierce. "Paigeren zol er!"

[Sevastopol]

- but as a Doper I feel the need to correct erronious facts whenever I encounter them.
I don't.(my emphasis)


Wow, what a surprise, you don't care about the truth...

: Rollseyes :

[Mojo]

Jew Tang Clan reprezeeeeeent!
Speaking of which, ODB did just die under mysterious circumstances.....

probably has to do with that Wu Tang Bar Mitzvah song (Jew Tang Clan reprezeeeeeent!
Speaking of which, ODB did just die under mysterious circumstances.....

probably has to do with that Wu Tang Bar Mitzvah song that wasn't like any Bar Mitzvah I ever went to...

) that wasn't like any Bar Mitzvah I ever went to...

[gum]

Did you guys kill him too? (http://news10now.com/content/all_news/?ArID=31860&SecID=83) :eek:

[mks57]

I guess the USS Liberty means nothing to you and your ilk does it.

My ilk can beat up your ilk.

[EddyTeddyFreddy]

But ilk hunting season hasn't opened yet. Did you get your license?

[FinnAgain]

Yep genius, I know, you don't feel any need to correct erroneous facts.
(you think bolding your intellectual dishonesty makes it better?)

[FinnAgain]

Did you guys kill him too? (http://news10now.com/content/all_news/?ArID=31860&SecID=83) :eek:

Yes gum, yes we did.
We were gonna get him when he turned 90, but you know the Jewish mind... when we engage in byzintine globe spanning conspiricies, we take our sweet time.

[GaWd]

Yep genius, I know, you don't feel any need to correct erroneous facts.
(you think bolding your intellectual dishonesty makes it better?)

:p :p :p

Here we go again...

Careful Sevastopol, we Jews have answers for everything. It's part of the conspiracy.

Sam

[Sevastopol]

Yep genius, I know, you don't feel any need to correct erroneous facts.
(you think bolding your intellectual dishonesty makes it better?)

There's a whole world of subtlety out there you are missing.

[FinnAgain]

There's a whole world of subtlety out there you are missing.

Like why it's cool to pump round after round into a pregnant woman and her children as long as they're Israeli settlers? (http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=4830652&postcount=274)

Guess I'm just not as subtle as you.

[Sevastopol]

Oh good grief. Someone else please explain it to Gawd and FinnAgain.

[GaWd]

Explain what? That your reputation preceds you? That your meat-handed attempt at humor by pointing out some grammatical error failed?

[GaWd]

Explain what? That your reputation precedes you? That your meat-handed attempt at humor by pointing out some grammatical error failed?

[Jackmannii]

There's a whole world of subtlety out there you are missing.Not to mention irony.

[FinnAgain]

Not to mention irony.

Elaborate please.

[danceswithcats]

But ilk hunting season hasn't opened yet. Did you get your license?

Does a license for hunting 2% ilk cost less than a whole ilk license?

[Jackmannii]

Elaborate please.I was referring to the irony of sevastopol claiming that others are missing out on the world's subtleties.


Guess I was too subtle.

[FinnAgain]

I was referring to the irony of sevastopol claiming that others are missing out on the world's subtleties.


Guess I was too subtle.

(I wasn't sure who you were refering to)
And...
That was a very good laugh, thank you.

[Reeder]

The history of our foreign aid to Israel.

Be aware..it is a PDF file.

http://www.fas.org/man/crs/IB85066.pdf

As an aside. If you don't have adobe reader 6 you should get it. Many improvements.

[Reeder]

Now tell me we aren't financing Israels military.

[FinnAgain]

Money goes towards the IDF, and has for some time now.
But that in and of itself isn't wrong, is it?
Where is the substance of your argument please?

[Sevastopol]

...That your meat-handed attempt at humor by pointing out some grammatical error failed?

Sometimes you win some, sometimes not. It happens.

That said, I'm curious. Why did you post three laughing smilies when FinnAgain did a clunky and later imitation of the same joke?




Yep genius, I know, you don't feel any need to correct erroneous facts.



:p :p :p
Is this a Jewish solidarity thing?

[Reeder]

Money goes towards the IDF, and has for some time now.
But that in and of itself isn't wrong, is it?
Where is the substance of your argument please?


Money goes to the IDF?

Much money goes to the IDF.

Who was it that said.."A billion here..a billion there and soon you are talking real money".

I have an idea.

Suppose we let Israel pay for their own military? Even the money or loans we give Israel frees up money they can pour into their military.

Do we give the Palestinians any military money?

Of course not.

[FinnAgain]

Suppose we let Israel pay for their own military? Even the money or loans we give Israel frees up money they can pour into their military.

You've mentioned dollar ammounts and such, but as of yet I've seen no reason (or at least haven't seen your reasonsing) as to why we shouldn't be giving Israel money. Would you mind making that explicit?


Do we give the Palestinians any military money?
Of course not.

See, we don't give money to the Palestinians becuase there is a massive contingent of Palestinians who are murderous fucks dedicated to the destruction of any Jewish state and who routinely target civilians.
Ya know, they're terrorists.

Again, I'm not sure what your reasoning is... we need to give money to the terrorists as well as their victims to make things even-steven?

[Reeder]

Let me get this straight. You say all Palestinians are.. what were your words?

murderous fucks?

Why are we giving money to the Israeli's who target kids and teenagers?

Aren't they murderous fucks?

Do I need to show you links or do you read the news?

[GaWd]

That said, I'm curious. Why did you post three laughing smilies when FinnAgain did a clunky and later imitation of the same joke?



Is this a Jewish solidarity thing?

That's it. I show my solidarity to Brother Finn by displaying the Zionist sign of the Three Smilies like Zo: :p :p :p This is how we show each other that we're there for them.

Couldn't it be that I think you're a cock and coming from you it had all the humor of a suicide bomber and yet, coming from someone of level-head like my Zionist conspirator, Finn, it was funny as hell?

Sam

[vanilla]

lets see.because they are a state?

[vanilla]

That was my reply to Reeders third query.

;j :mad: :confused: :dubious: :rolleyes:

[Reeder]

lets see.because they are a state?

So is North Korea.

So by your reasoning we should be paying for their military too?

[FinnAgain]

Let me get this straight. You say all Palestinians are.. what were your words? murderous fucks?

Wow... just... wow...
You want to apologize for suggesting that I've stated a group is fungible in order to demonize them, or should I just tell you to go fuck yourself?
Nowhere have I said all Palestinians are anything, and to be quite frank, I fucking resent that insinuation.


Why are we giving money to the Israeli's who target kids and teenagers?


Prove it.



Do I need to show you links or do you read the news?

Now that's ironic. Every post in this thread where I've posted a cite I've kicked your ass with it, you've yet to post a single cite that gets at your actual point (which I will note, has nothing to do with economics. I will also note that it is fundementally dishonest for you to not make your position explicit and justify it. Nobody disputed that we give money to Israel, if you wish to debate the conduct of the IDF, then post cites and make your case.)

And now you're asking me if I read the news?
You at least get an A for nerve.

[vanilla]

So is North Korea.

So by your reasoning we should be paying for their military too?
I so knew you were going to say that.

[FinnAgain]

. I That's itshow my solidarity to Brother Finn by displaying the Zionist sign of the Three Smilies like Zo: :p :p :p This is how we show each other that we're there for them.


Goddamnit GaWd, if you go unmasking the conspiracy all over the place we're just gonna have to off some more goyim!
~sighs~
You are so burying the next body!

[Reeder]

So I guess you want links to news stories about the Israelis targeting kids and teenagers.

Be back in a few.

[vanilla]

So is North Korea.

So by your reasoning we should be paying for their military too?


Of course, we have the same friendly relationship with North Korea as we do with Israel!

[FinnAgain]

So I guess you want links to news stories about the Israelis targeting kids and teenagers.

This may be the pit, but it's still the Dope.
As the saying goes,
cite?

And just to clarify, the only thing I want is not just for you to support your position.

I am dead serious, I expect an apology or a retraction of your totally spurious claim that I have suggested that all Palestinians think/do/are anything. You don't get to paint me as a racist/bigot and get away with it, sorry to say.

[Reeder]

I stayed away from obviously biased sites like Al Jeezera. There are many more if you want.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/israel/Story/0,2763,1220635,00.html

http://www.smh.com.au/news/Middle-East-Conflict/Gaza-incursion-takes-toll-on-children/2004/10/06/1096949594733.html?oneclick=true

http://www.cnn.com/2004/WORLD/meast/05/03/mideast.violence/..
With this one..granted the terrorists took refuge in the school but it didn't matter to the Israelis whether there were children there or not.

My whole point.

http://web.amnesty.org/library/Index/ENGMDE151472002?open&of=ENG-PSE

In the two years since the beginning of the intifada, the Palestinian uprising against Israeli occupation of the West Bank and Gaza Strip which broke out in September 2000, more than 250 Palestinian and 72 Israeli children have been killed.

http://www.taipeitimes.com/News/world/archives/2004/10/07/2003205889

http://chapelhill.indymedia.org/news/2004/10/11982_comment.php

And for one final link since many here take them as gospel..

http://chapelhill.indymedia.org/news/2004/10/11982_comment.php

[GaWd]

Reeder, on these so-called "targetted" children and teenagers. Did they happen to belong to terror groups or have anything to do with terror attacks? Or are you saying the IDF routinely just picks a couple poor Palestinian teens to gun down?

Goddamnit GaWd, if you go unmasking the conspiracy all over the place we're just gonna have to off some more goyim!
~sighs~
You are so burying the next body!

D'oh! I've been a bad Zionist Conspirator. I almost told them about the secret handshake. Wait, did I mention the Secret Handshake? :eek: Nooooooooooooooooooo ;j

Sam

[Reeder]

My apologies.

You only think most Palestininians are murderous fucks.

See, we don't give money to the Palestinians becuase there is a massive contingent of Palestinians who are murderous fucks dedicated to the destruction of any Jewish state and who routinely target civilians.
Ya know, they're terrorists.

[vanilla]

Not a massive contingent; just 2 guys who really get around.

[GaWd]

http://www.cnn.com/2004/WORLD/meast/05/03/mideast.violence/..
With this one..granted the terrorists took refuge in the school but it didn't matter to the Israelis whether there were children there or not.

Just like it has stopped American forces and forces around the globe from attacking Religious buildings, Mosques, and schools when their enemy retreats inside like cowardly dogs...

My whole point.

http://web.amnesty.org/library/Index/ENGMDE151472002?open&of=ENG-PSE

THis is your "whole point"? How thin...


And for one final link since many here take them as gospel..

http://chapelhill.indymedia.org/news/2004/10/11982_comment.php

I take this faulty "cite" for nothing. Some blogger posts a picture of a soldier with a weapon in the "rest" position and calls it "pointing" the weapon at schoolchildren? This is the gospel? The Gospel of propaganda, maybe...

Seeing how they have a rather funny idea about "fact", I would think the entire cite with a grain of salt.

Sam

[Sevastopol]

coming from you it had all the humor of a suicide bomber and yet, coming from someone of level-head like my Zionist conspirator, Finn, it was funny as hell?

Sam

Credit where it's due GaWd, credit where it's due.

[Reeder]

snip...



I take this faulty "cite" for nothing. Some blogger posts a picture of a soldier with a weapon in the "rest" position and calls it "pointing" the weapon at schoolchildren? This is the gospel? The Gospel of propaganda, maybe...

Seeing how they have a rather funny idea about "fact", I would think the entire cite with a grain of salt.

Sam

I agree. It came from wikipedia.

[Reeder]

IMHO..It looks like the Israelis think..kill them young and they won't grow up to be terrorists.

Let them do what they want.

I just don't want the US to help them do it.

As long as we do help them...there will be a never ending stream of people that hate us.

I don't give a fuck if they hate Israel.

[EddyTeddyFreddy]

Does a license for hunting 2% ilk cost less than a whole ilk license?
Only in Israel, the land of ilk and honey.

[GaWd]

Oh holy christ Reeder, shut the fuck up. There is absolutely nothing to support such a disgusting claim. There never has been and never will be. The U.S. does enough all on its own to garner hate and derision.

To suggest that Israel is on a path of genocide hell-bent on eliminating whole generations of young Palestinians is beyond the pale. Even for you it's unusually paranoid. Why don't you concern yourself with things you can safely comment on. THings that We as Americans do across the globe that are directly affected by our hand, not abstractly by our money.

Sam

[FinnAgain]

You have yet to prove that the IDF is specificaly targeting children.

I, on the other hand, can prove

not only are Palestinians arming their children, they know it's wrong and don't want anybody catching it on film. (http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,61434,00.html)
Or how about a mother of a suicide bomber who pleads with terrorist groups to stop using children to kill? (http://www.dailynews.co.za/index.php?fArticleId=2283746)
And as long as you like Human Rights Watch how about what they have to say on the Palestinians using children for murder? (http://www.hrw.org/english/docs/2004/11/02/isrlpa9591.htm)
And they say a picture is worth 1000 words, how about a whole lot of photos and articles? (http://www.mideastnewswire.com/archive/me_rights_abuse_children.html#p_ca_videos)
How about setting up a terror training camp for children as young as ten? (http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1172081/posts)
Or a Wikipedia article talking about Palestinian tactics, including their kids being killed by carrying pipe bombs? (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Child_suicide_bomber)
Take a good look, a very good look. (http://www.jewishgrassroots.com/images/Shocking%20images%20of%20Palestinian%20toddlers_files/Shocking%20images%20of%20Palestinian%20toddlers.htm)

So you see, simply pointing out that Palestinian children are killed ignored the fact of who put them in harms way, and why.

Oh, and
My apologies.
You only think most Palestininians are murderous fucks.

You sarcastic fuck.
Hamas is a member of the PA, that a massive enough contingent for you? (http://www.hamasonline.org/index.php?blogid=1&archive=2003-10)
How about Fatah? (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fatah)

You want more?
You're acting like a dumb fuck, and I do NOT appreciate your attempts to paint me as a racist, you asshole.

[LavenderBlue]

Is this a Jewish solidarity thing?

It's really more of an anti-idiot solidarity thing.

[Reeder]

Where did I paint you as a racist? You are the one that played the racist card you twerp. It does seem to be a touchy point with you.

But I never mentioned racism.

Hell..

I never even thought about it.

My gripe is that you support the exact reason most people in the mideast hate us. And as long as we pay for Israels ability to kill Palestinians..they will continue to hate us.

[Reeder]

I never once said what the Palestinians are doing is right.

Never once you asshole.

I don't give a fuck about Israel or the Palestinians.

I care about my country. The soldiers we put in harms way.

If Israel means more to you..good for you.

I hope you sleep well at night. Seeing as our soldiers are dying for your wants.

Fuck you.

[Reeder]

God damn it. People like you piss me off. The cares and concerns of a foreign country outweigh the needs of our own country.

You make me fucking sick.

How many American soldiers have died because of your beliefs?

[FinnAgain]

Listen.
You've claimed that I've said "all" palestians are something, and that I've said that "most are murderous fucks.
In case you're clueless, both those statements tacitly call me a racist.
And yes, it's a touchy point, becuase I'm not a racist, racism is disgusting, and I do not put up with bullshit accusations.


But I never mentioned racism.
Hell..
I never even thought about it.

Then you really need to look at what you're saying.
Because if someone said "all blacks are X" or "all Jews are Y", they'd be guilty of racism. Same for "all Palestinians are Z."



My gripe is that you support the exact reason most people in the mideast hate us. And as long as we pay for Israels ability to kill Palestinians..they will continue to hate us.

...
You want me to furnish you with cites as to how Bin Laden went berserk when we posted troops in Saudi Arabia?
Or how other groups hate us for their very own reasons?

Oversimplification does nobody any good.

[Reeder]

As for the racist bit..you are fucking reaching. and you know it.

As for the Bin Laden thing..

Tell you what..You convince Bushco to stop supporting Israel militarily..and watch the change.

And this is not a dig. If Kerry had been elected..it would be the same.

I never even thought about racism.

I don't even see where racism fits into it.

Palestinians and jews are both caucasions.

Unless you are black?

[FinnAgain]

I never once said what the Palestinians are doing is right.
One mans terrorist is another mans freedom fighter.
If my country had been taken from me by mandate..
Then I'd be a "terrorist" too.

Liar


Never once you asshole.

It's there in black and white.
Fortuantely (for me) you're the asshole.


I don't give a fuck about Israel or the Palestinians.

Then what the fuck is your point? Just that lots of the Arab world is anti-Israel? Do you even care what the reality is?


I care about my country. The soldiers we put in harms way.

We don't have soldiers in Israel.
And the Muslim world has plenty of reasons to hate us besides Israel, your oversimplification is, quite frankly, moronic. Google "the shah" if you really want.


If Israel means more to you..good for you.
I hope you sleep well at night. Seeing as our soldiers are dying for your wants.

How dare you?

God damn it. People like you piss me off. The cares and concerns of a foreign country outweigh the needs of our own country.

Where have I said that? Idiot.



You make me fucking sick.

The feeling is begining to become mutual. I can see why you're a board joke.

[Reeder]

Board joke?

You can't even come up with your own line.

Says a lot about you.

[Reeder]

That says a lot too you know.

For anything you have to say about me to bother me, I'd have to care about what you say.

Trust me in this. I don't care in the least what you say.

[FinnAgain]

You can't even come up with your own line.

It's called a meme.

And since I started lurking on the Dope I've always seen people refer to you as an example of raving idiocy.
It's simply that before today, I didn't see the truth in their statements.
You are a joke.
You are the person who gets compared to all the nuts here.
You are the example that gets trotted out.

No, I'm not putting you on any ignore filters, but I've had it with responding to you. Get a crowbar, us it to get your head out of your ass, and we can talk some other time. Hell, I won't even hold any grudges. I genuinely enjoyed reading your posts up till now. But right now, I'd rather undergo a vasectomy via weed wacker than endure another instant of 'discourse' with you.

Ciao.

[Reeder]

Feel better now?

Go lay your little head down and get you some sleep.

You sure as hell need it.

Btw...

Instant???

Did you perhaps mean instance?

I thought maybe you did.

Again..says a lot about you.

[Reeder]

Just how bent out of shape some people can get on an anonymous message board.

It seems to me..the more you complain the more guilty you are.

YMMv of course

[Kythereia]

It's amazing... just how bent out of shape some people can get on an anonymous message board.


Quite amazing, isn't it?

(I want to hear more Jewish jokes, please. *hopeful ;j*)

[FinnAgain]

(I want to hear more Jewish jokes, please. *hopeful ;j*)

Q: Why are moyels so poor?

A: All they get are tips.

[Kythereia]

Q: Why are moyels so poor?

A: All they get are tips.

*huge grin* That's the stuff! *applauds*

[gum]

Originally posted by ReederDo we give the Palestinians any military money?

Of course not. Don't worry about it. The Palestinians get plenty of money.

About all their neigbouring countries support the Palestinians financially. Among them Saudi.

http://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org/jsource/arabs/saudipal.html

And there are ofcourse these nineteen countries who pledge financial support to the UN agency helping Palestinians:

http://www0.un.org/apps/news/storyAr.asp?NewsID=9063&Cr=palestine&Cr1=

Among them my fucking country.


And there's this:
http://www.auswaertiges-amt.de/www/en/aussenpolitik/regionalkonzepte/nahost/index_html#6

The EU provided in 2003 some 80 million euro as budgetary support for the Palestinian Authority and a further 22 million euro through the World Bank. This funding is contingent on specific political, administrative and financial reforms, whose implementation is being monitored by the IMF and the EU Commission. As a result of the energetic reforms introduced by Finance Minister Fayyad, the financial sector is now one of the areas where progress is most tangible. The current reform-oriented budget adopted on 15 January 2004 meets key EU demands and has been published on the Internet.

The United Nations Relief and Works Agency for Palestine Refugees in the Near East (UNRWA) received an additional 86.12 million euro in EU funding for education and health programmes, and a further 58.28 million euro was made available by the Commission as humanitarian assistance and food aid.



The fact that most of the money didn't go to the refugees but were used to buy weapons makes it all the more clear that the Palestines are not the underdog and never will be.


FinnAgain, a creep (http://entertainment.news.com.au/common/imagedata/0,1658,275552,00.jpg) is stalking me. Do you think you can get him too? ;)

[FinnAgain]

Gum my friend, we can get anybody. We're the Jews after all. Ninjas aint got nothin' on us.

Although, I've gotta tell ya, icing braveheart will cost you extra.

[World Eater]

I know I poked my head in this argument back on pg 2. Reeder this is the type of fly off the rails thread that has a bad ending. I urge you to step away for a day or two, and come back with a fresh head.

[PaulFitzroy]

FinnAgain and Gum, ask Reeder what Israel and the U.S's support for them have to do with the nightclub bombing in Bali (http://news.bbc.co.uk/onthisday/hi/dates/stories/october/12/newsid_2543000/2543731.stm), or the Madrid train bombing (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/March_11,_2004_Madrid_attacks)...

[FinnAgain]

FinnAgain and Gum, ask Reeder

Um... why?
You just did.

[PaulFitzroy]

Never mind...

[gum]

FinnAgain hehehe.

::looking doubtful:: How much extra? Remember, I'm Dutch. :D

[FinnAgain]

Seeing how the dollar is doing, I'd wager that two euros and a scrap of toilet paper will do in about a week.

Then again, since you're dutch, you could just put me up in your place while I wander the streets of amsterdam; you'd get yourself one dead moviestar, and we'd call it even.

[FinnAgain]

Never mind...

K.
I mean, I know it was a rhetorical device, my point was just that you should get involved in the debate if you feel like it.
In other words, welcome to the thread.

[gum]

Oh, good. Good. I thought I had to actually part with my money. And we're the Scots of the mainland, see?

It's a deal. ;)

[FinnAgain]

And we're the Scots of the mainland, see?

You wear skirts and have a love/hate relationship with England? ;)

[Weirddave]

Can I ask just one question of all of the Israel haters in this thread?

Did it ever occur to you that the primary reason we support Israel is not because they are a Jewish state, and the US is secretly run by the Jews, Not because they are killing the Palistinian dogs, and that's what the racist US wants, but because they are the only functioning democracy (for now, good Lord willing and the creeks don't rise, it'll be the case in Iraq within the next 5 years or so ) in the middle east? Arabs who didn't abaondon their land in '48 have an equal place in Isralie society as Jews, and in fact have representatives in the Knesset. They are treated equally, and given full protection of law.

Can you say the same for the Palistinians?

Just curious,

Weirddave

[roger thornhill]

\And we're the Scots of the mainland, see?
Your inventors are Dutch, but your criminals are European?