I am going to tear my father's doctor a new orifice

[ivylass]

My father spent the night in the hospital in late October with bad stomach pains. They diagnosed diverticulitis, or maybe a cold in his intestines. They don't know, really.

He's feeling better, but he's also 69 years old and a bit on the overweight side. However, he's very active, still working a part-time job, working on his hobbies, and getting ready to take his new RV on the road.

Today, he has an appt with his urologist, because the MRI showed a mass on the kidney. He's supposed to get the results today.

So he and my step-mom get to the doctor's office a bit early for his 3:45 appt, fill out the 30 squintillion forms, then about 4:20 he's taken back to the examining room.

Where he waits.

And waits.

And waits some more.

Meantime, my step-mom has found my father's file, which shows a hemoraghic (sp?) mass on the kidney which could have been there for years.

They continue to wait.

And wait.

And wait some more.

Then, at 5:20, a nurse pops her head in. "Oh, Mr. Ivylass's father! You're here! I'm sorry, but everyone's gone home. We're just locking up the office."

:eek:

Oh my fucking God! This complete disregard for a patient's well-being is completely beyond me. How the hell do you forget a patient? If the nurse hadn't checked the room they could have been locked in.

He still doesn't know the results of the MRI, although from what they could figure out from the file, the mass doesn't seem to be anything to be worried about. Of course, we don't know, do we, because the goddamn doctor went home!

My dad let slip the doctor's name, and I found them online. I left a message with the answering service, and when (more likely if) the son of a bitch calls me back, I shall give him several pieces of my mind.

My dad has an appt with his regular doctor tomorrow, where he will demand a new urologist referral, but I'm afraid he's had it and unless he's loses a limb he won't willingly step foot inside another doctor's office again.

How the hell does something like this happen? I understand there are emergencies and the doctor is called away, but it sounds like my father was simply forgotten.

Well, I shall make sure that doesn't happen again. Bastards.

[Qadgop the Mercotan]

Hard to be sure who to pin the blame on. The doc may well have been told by his medical assistant that he was all done, had seen all there was to see, or something like that.

Or the MA could have told the Doc, and he just forgot.

It's not right, but it happens.

I forgot a patient once (unwrapped a nice little old lady's splint because it had been on too tight, told her I'd be back in 20 minutes to check again on her, got pulled into an emergency, where I spent the next 60 minutes messily keeping someone stable, got out, finished the paperwork on my desk, and went off-shift (it was late at night). 90 minutes later, I sat bolt-upright in bed and said "OMG, the LOL!" (Doctor speak for "oh my god, the little old lady") I called the office (we were open 24 hours) and they said, yes, they'd just found her, the night doc had taken care of her. The poor dear had wandered out of the exam room, wondering if we'd forgotten her!

I called her the next morning to apologize. She was nice about it. It was over 10 years ago, but I remember it quite well. :o

[ivylass]

Well, somebody screwed up. Luckily my father didn't pay his co-payment before he went back to the exam room.

I expect an apology, not to me, but to my father. He doesn't want to pursue it, but for God's sake, what if someone had a malignant tumour and they were delayed in getting treatment because the doctor went home without telling them!

[MsRobyn]

If I'm stuck waiting in the waiting room for more than, say, five or 10 minutes is poke my head out and take a look around. I've had more than one MA "forget" about me, and the reminder is helpful.

Robin

[MsRobyn]

If I'm stuck waiting in the waiting room for more than, say, five or 10 minutes is poke my head out and take a look around. I've had more than one MA "forget" about me, and the reminder is helpful.

That said, forgetting your father was inexcusable, and I'd make it a point to discuss this with the doctor.

Robin

[iamthewalrus(:3=]

I'd expect that a sincere apology will be forthcoming. I can completely understand your anger at the situation, but people sometimes make mistakes. Thankfully, in this case, your father appears not to be in any further medical danger as a result.

[ivylass]

And sometimes you have to remind them twice, huh? ;)

If I'm kept waiting for more than say 15 minutes past my appointment time, I touch base with the receptionist.

After all, if I'm fifteen minutes late, they'll make me reschedule. Least I can do is remind them that my time is also valuable.

I don't know, maybe we've gotten so used to waiting at doctor's offices that we figure there's no point in complaining.

[Abbie Carmichael]

I empathize, ivylass, this is a VERY hot button issue for me. Just last month my mom went postal on her doctor, who had kept her waiting in the exam room for an hour and then breezed in with a "we've been busy." (I should add that she had specifically made an early morning appointment so she could avoid a long wait, and plus this was the last straw of about 3 years of this office pulling stunts like that.)

Mom chewed her out, got up and left. It was pretty cool.

I don't know, maybe we've gotten so used to waiting at doctor's offices that we figure there's no point in complaining.

I do think that's the case. No amount of bitching will get you in sooner so patients turn into those little shocked monkeys from that study that eventually just lay down and keep getting shocked because they're tired of fighting. I imagine the only people who are seen by their doctors on time are "important" people. I imagine my city's mayor never waits at the doctor, for example.

I would be fine with waiting a while if I knew that once the doctor got in the room, I would have his or her undivided attention for as long as I needed it. It's been my experience, with GP's here, anyway, that they have you wait for about an hour and then you physically see them for (literally) 5 minutes. "Hihowareyouwhatswrongherestheprescriptionbye." My first OB when I was pregnant would actually sit down, take his time and answer all my questions. He constantly ran late, but he was worth the wait.

Another thing that would soften me up about waiting is if they'd show me the same leniency if I were late. If I showed up an hour late, they'd refuse to see me, AND bill me for an office visit. Can I bill them for an hour of my time when they keep me waiting? Noooooooo.

Grrrr. Now I'm pissed. :mad: I think I'm going to adopt MsRobyn's rule of thumb.

Give 'em hell, ivy.

[Amberlei]

Wow, your poor dad. Hope he doesn't distrust all doctors because of this office's mistake. I had a kinda sorta similar incident once, and wish I'd known what course of action to take. I was in the midst of a root canal and had the file or whatever it is that they use stuck down inside my tooth. The technician took an x-ray and then said the dentist would be back shortly and left the room. There I sat, scared to move, with this sharp pointy thing stuck into my tooth, my mouth propped open with some dental dam holder thingamajig for over an hour and a half while my mouth slowly got less and less numb. Just when I was at the point where I was determined that I was going to go to the phone and call for help. (Imagine the 911 call. "eo el ee ee. I ah a ena ah e ee." [Hello, help me please. I'm at a dentist and they left me.]) the receptionist came back and found me. They'd all gone to lunch and the dentist had left for a trip. She called a dentist upstairs in the same building and he finished me up, but to this day, I get furious when I think of it. And they even billed me twice for this afterwards! Once for each dentist! GRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRR!

[Loopydude]

Hey, they're overworked, end of story. You've got a legitimate beef, but my brain would be hamburger if I had to put up with the schedule some of these folks have to deal with. My mom's an N.P., and guess how much fun she has on some busy days. Her attending is a workaholic, and she's convinced he doesn't sleep. Either that or he's got a twin brother. It's the fun&giggles world of managed care, folks. Get used to it, coz it ain't gettin' better any time soon.

[Abbie Carmichael]

There I sat, scared to move, with this sharp pointy thing stuck into my tooth, my mouth propped open with some dental dam holder thingamajig for over an hour and a half while my mouth slowly got less and less numb. Just when I was at the point where I was determined that I was going to go to the phone and call for help. (Imagine the 911 call. "eo el ee ee. I ah a ena ah e ee." [Hello, help me please. I'm at a dentist and they left me.]) the receptionist came back and found me. They'd all gone to lunch and the dentist had left for a trip. She called a dentist upstairs in the same building and he finished me up, but to this day, I get furious when I think of it. And they even billed me twice for this afterwards! Once for each dentist! GRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRR!

You didn't talk to a lawyer?!?!?!?!?!??!?!?!?!??!?!?!?!

Patients have got to stop putting up with shit like this! Had I been that dentist I would have begged your forgiveness and set you up with free dental care or something for a year just to keep you from suing me!

[Alice The Goon]

This response is more for the "I don't want to wait at all to see my doctor" people rather than the OP's father. THAT obviously was a big mistake.


I'm an MA, and I'm all for you patients bitching and moaning and pitching your fits when you're not seen right at your appointment time. As long as you do it in front of and for The Doctor. All too often, inpatient patients have no problem getting rude, pushy, even downright abusive to the Medical Assistants or Nurses, yet when the Doctor comes in they're suddenly passive and sweet.
*I* am not to blame when the Doctor is running late. I have no control over how soon you are seen. And poking your head out the door every 5 to 10 minutes is likely to A) violate other patients' confidentiality and B) alienate the Doctor and his staff, and may provoke some passive-agressive behavior from them, like making you wait even longer.
Naturally, if you're waiting like the OP's father did, it may be called for to inquire, but jeez people, 5 or 10 minutes??? Some people need to learn to accept that waiting at the doctor's is a fact of life. Do you pitch a fit at the Department of Motor Vehicles, too?

[Abbie Carmichael]

*I* am not to blame when the Doctor is running late. I have no control over how soon you are seen.

Agreed.

Since you work in this field, I'll ask: who IS to blame for overbooking and long waits for the doc? Are the doctors telling their staff to book a gazillion appointments per hour or is it the office managers that are doing this?


Naturally, if you're waiting like the OP's father did, it may be called for to inquire, but jeez people, 5 or 10 minutes??? Some people need to learn to accept that waiting at the doctor's is a fact of life. Do you pitch a fit at the Department of Motor Vehicles, too?

I would bake cookies for a doctor that only made me wait 5 or 10 minutes.

There's two periods of waiting around here: the time between getting there and getting back to the exam room, and then the time you're in the exam room until the doctor shows up.

The DMV is different. I only have to be there about once every 4 years or so, I'm standing in line so I can sort of estimate how long they will be, and I can walk into the DMV any time. I can choose to go midmorning, midweek, midmonth. Even if I make an 8:00 doctor's appointment and am the first patient of the day, I'm still not going to see the doctor until 9:00. The DMV doesn't have the gall to charge you, either, if you end up (somehow) wasting their time.

For me it's about equity. I'll quit bitching about the doctor's office making me wait a long time when I can do the same to them and not hear a peep out of them about it, since that's what they expect from their patients.

[MsRobyn]

This response is more for the "I don't want to wait at all to see my doctor" people rather than the OP's father. THAT obviously was a big mistake.


I'm an MA, and I'm all for you patients bitching and moaning and pitching your fits when you're not seen right at your appointment time. As long as you do it in front of and for The Doctor. All too often, inpatient patients have no problem getting rude, pushy, even downright abusive to the Medical Assistants or Nurses, yet when the Doctor comes in they're suddenly passive and sweet.
*I* am not to blame when the Doctor is running late. I have no control over how soon you are seen. And poking your head out the door every 5 to 10 minutes is likely to A) violate other patients' confidentiality and B) alienate the Doctor and his staff, and may provoke some passive-agressive behavior from them, like making you wait even longer.
Naturally, if you're waiting like the OP's father did, it may be called for to inquire, but jeez people, 5 or 10 minutes??? Some people need to learn to accept that waiting at the doctor's is a fact of life. Do you pitch a fit at the Department of Motor Vehicles, too?

Ten minutes when I'm in pain or sick *is* a big deal, particularly when the staff doesn't seem to care, as you don't. If it's a confidentiality problem, perhaps you'd better consider closing the exam room doors, and if you're getting passive-aggressive and forcing patients to wait longer, that's just unprofessional. Most people go to the doctor because there's something wrong, and I don't think it's unreasonable for staff to check in periodically to make sure they're OK.

I'm sympathetic to the demands of medical practice. Honestly, I am. Stuff pops up that no one has control over. But if procedure takes precedence over good patient care, perhaps you'd better consider another line of work.

Robin

[Ferret Herder]

Since you work in this field, I'll ask: who IS to blame for overbooking and long waits for the doc? Are the doctors telling their staff to book a gazillion appointments per hour or is it the office managers that are doing this?
I've worked in the medical field for several years, and in my experience, it's the fault of the doctors. They're the ones who insist on allowing yet another patient to be overbooked. They're the ones who control what their office hours are (for the most part) and how many days a week they see patients. They head to a back office to return phone calls to other doctors, etc. during their clinics. They get held up on their way to the clinic talking to other doctors. They have to return one last E-mail which ends up taking 5 minutes or more.

Mind you, often enough there will be some patient who is unexpectedly complicated and requires a lot of office time. It's not always the doctor's fault, but a good majority of the time it can be. This also varies between offices, so I'm just addressing my experience.

At my last job, I had one parent (it was a peds practice) ask me regarding one of the doctors if she could expect to be seen on time. I told her, truthfully, "Frankly, no, you won't. This is because he's a very popular doctor, he has a great bedside manner, and he spends as much time as any family seems to need in discussing the child's cardiac problems and explaining what could be done. So when you're waiting for the doctor to see you, it's because he's reassuring some other family like yours, and he'll do the same for you when he sees you." She was satisfied with that answer.

I'll quit bitching about the doctor's office making me wait a long time when I can do the same to them and not hear a peep out of them about it, since that's what they expect from their patients.
I regularly see patients who come in a half hour, hour, or more late. One patient comes in a half hour late each time, to the point where I tell her to come in a half hour earlier than the time I write her into the schedule.

Of course, this invariably throws my schedule off, but I try my best to keep it from affecting those patients who were on time.

[Alice The Goon]

Oh, it's not that I don't care. It's just that there's nothing I can do about it. If you really have a problem with waiting, you need to speak to your doctor about that. What would you have ME do, knock on the door of the room the doctor is in and tell him you're ready to be seen now? You are more than welcome to shop around and find a doctor who is always on time, that is your choice. And I didn't say that I personally would make a person wait longer who's being an ass, but I have seen it done.
As for other patients' confidentiality, we do keep the room doors closed. However, most nurses stations are in very close proximity to those doors, and when patients don't stay in their room with the door shut, there's way too much overhearing of conversations and phone calls with and regarding other patients.

[ivylass]

[QUOTE=Amberlei]Wow, your poor dad. Hope he doesn't distrust all doctors because of this office's mistake. /QUOTE]

That is exactly what I'm afraid of. He had some bloodwork done, and now they want him to see an oncologist. He told me yesterday that unless his primary doctor today can give him specific reasons as to why he needs to see an oncologist (not, well, we need to investigate this further) then he's not going.

[DogMom]

That is exactly what I'm afraid of. He had some bloodwork done, and now they want him to see an oncologist. He told me yesterday that unless his primary doctor today can give him specific reasons as to why he needs to see an oncologist (not, well, we need to investigate this further) then he's not going.

You know, I can understand this, though. It doesn't necessarily mean that he now mistrusts all doctors. I can understand not wanting to submit to Doctor Test-itis.

<rambling personal anecdote>
DogDad had a problem with one eye where it just pretty much stopped working. First his doctor ran some tests...then sent him to an Opthalmologist...who sent him to a specialist 1/2 hour away...who sent him to a specialist in Indianapolis...who couldn't figure out why anything was wrong and wanted to run a bunch more tests - just because she could. When we asked what the point of the extra tests was, she said that she'd never seen this kind of thing before and she really, really wanted to basically turn DogDad into a guinea pig and have every test known to man run on him just to satisfy her curiosity. By the way, no, there's nothing to worry about, this is what happened, it's not anything fatal, it's likely not going to go to the other eye, but here, let me run a bunch more tests on you at your expense to satisfy my curiosity.
Um, yeah, I don't think so. You do 'em for free? You put us up at a hotel so we don't have to keep doing a 5-hour round-trip drive every time? Sure. We do this all on our dime to make you happy and get you some new medical write-up? Don't think so.

</rambling personal anecdote>

After having suffered through a few bouts of Doctor Test-itis, honestly I can sympathize with your dad. If the doc doesn't have a good reason to send him to a specialist, and it's just basically "because I want to and because I can", I wouldn't go either.

[catsix]

ivylass said:
After all, if I'm fifteen minutes late, they'll make me reschedule. Least I can do is remind them that my time is also valuable.

I billed a doctor once while I was making my sole income from consulting. I'd been kept waiting for an hour and a half past my appointment time, and I'd mentioned to the receptionist a couple of times that I really hoped they hadn't forgotten about me, because sitting there waiting was costing me money. Sitting there meant I wasn't working, and if I wasn't working, I wasn't getting paid.

The doctor was not too pleased when I said I was billing them the going rate for 1 hour of my time as a consultant, but they got the message. I don't get kept waiting for such long periods of time anymore, and they typically schedule me for the first appointment of the day or the first one after lunch.

Abbie Charmichael said:
Can I bill them for an hour of my time when they keep me waiting? Noooooooo.

It can be done. They truly hate it, but it's possible.

Loopydude said:
You've got a legitimate beef, but my brain would be hamburger if I had to put up with the schedule some of these folks have to deal with.

Lots of people have to put up with difficult schedules and long hours. That doesn't mean we get a pass on forgetting the people who make our paychecks possible.

DogMom said:
When we asked what the point of the extra tests was, she said that she'd never seen this kind of thing before and she really, really wanted to basically turn DogDad into a guinea pig and have every test known to man run on him just to satisfy her curiosity.

This kind of happened to me with the hives that would not go away. They ran test after test and had me at appointment after appointment trying to satisfy their curiousity about my apparently really rare condition. After three months when they figured out I wasn't allergic to anything and I wasn't dying, I got kind of tired of all the needles, poking and biopsies. They also brought in tons of medical students (UPMC is a teaching hospital after all) to look at me. That I didn't mind so much. The medical students were generally nice people who were afraid of making me uncomfortable, but were genuinely there to learn. More than once I had to reassure a medical student that I was not cranky and grumpy at him or her, it's just that having a constant, total body itch for 6 months makes a person a little rough. What I found the most interesting was that only a couple of the doctors but most of the medical students would ask 'What is it like to itch all the time?' like they were trying to figure out exactly how I felt. Most all of them apologized for not being able to do anything for me. I finally started to do a lot of research on the internet about other people with my condition and found out that some people had luck with a combination of Atarax and Pepcid AC, so I made an appointment with the one doctor I felt most comfortable with to just talk to him. He looked at my research, agreed that there was no reason to think that treatment would be harmful and said 'How do you feel about giving it a shot?' It worked extremely well. Then it was time for more 'Hey, get in here, look at this patient!' :)

I still can't get most of the doctors to believe, even though it's in my chart, that one of the few allergies I do have is to steroids. One was so insistent that the only treatment I could have for the anaphylaxis was steroids (ER Doctor, definitely an overworked guy) that I finally had to say 'It's in my medical records that I'm allergic to it. I am telling you right now in front of the nurse that if you give me that, I will probably die.' before he'd try something else. I have no idea what woulda happened to me if things had been so severe that I couldn't speak.

[TellMeI'mNotCrazy]

I billed a doctor once while I was making my sole income from consulting. I'd been kept waiting for an hour and a half past my appointment time, and I'd mentioned to the receptionist a couple of times that I really hoped they hadn't forgotten about me, because sitting there waiting was costing me money. Sitting there meant I wasn't working, and if I wasn't working, I wasn't getting paid.

The doctor was not too pleased when I said I was billing them the going rate for 1 hour of my time as a consultant, but they got the message. I don't get kept waiting for such long periods of time anymore, and they typically schedule me for the first appointment of the day or the first one after lunch.



Did they actually pay the amount? (I always mentally threaten to do this, but end up losing my conviction.)

[Bosda Di'Chi of Tricor]

<snort> ivyglass is going through a career change.
She is now an orifice worker.

:D

[ivylass]

Well, the doctor is unavailable.

I left an "urgent" message with the office manager...I haven't heard back yet, and that was about quarter after nine.

[NicePete]

This is why I love my GP. Generally the time I spend with him is longer than my wait. I rarely wait more than 10 minutes from my appointment time to see him and he always spends at least 15 minutes talking to me. I think he's great.

His office staff, on the other hand, are a bunch of rude, snotty little bitches.

[stretch]

I'm an MA, and I'm all for you patients bitching and moaning and pitching your fits when you're not seen right at your appointment time. As long as you do it in front of and for The Doctor. All too often, inpatient patients have no problem getting rude, pushy, even downright abusive to the Medical Assistants or Nurses, yet when the Doctor comes in they're suddenly passive and sweet.
I have no problem with complaining directly to the person who kept me waiting. It's caused me to change doctors, dentists, vets, and other things too.


Naturally, if you're waiting like the OP's father did, it may be called for to inquire, but jeez people, 5 or 10 minutes??? Some people need to learn to accept that waiting at the doctor's is a fact of life.
Why? Why do I invariably have to wait at the doctor's office? The doctors and their staff are quite capable of arranging the workload to not keep the majority of their patients waiting every single day. There is no good reason for this to be the rule rather than the exception.

My most excellent dentist retired this year. Prior to his retirement, I did not have to wait for my appointments, or sit around waiting for the dentist after the hygenist did her work, or worry about not getting adequate time with the dentist. He took on a partner and then sold the practice to him and retired. The new dentist immediately fired all the staff and changed the way the practice worked, including overbooking patients, resulting in waits. There were other service issues due to getting rid of the excellent staff that had been there. It didn't take long for mr.stretch and I to decide to change dentists. And I let the guy know exactly why he was losing me as a patient and why I would no longer be referring folks to the practice. I now have a new dentist. One of my requirements for medical practioners is that they understand the value of my time.

Occasional emergencies do mess up a doctor's schedule. Happens to me too. But when I walk in the office on time for my appointment, that's the time to let me know that things are running behind and I may have an extended wait. Then don't be surprised if I decide that I would be better served to re-schedule in non-emergent situations. That's to everyone's benefit.

Oh, I could go on and on; crap service anywhere is one of my biggest pet peeves.

Do you pitch a fit at the Department of Motor Vehicles, too?
Oh, yes. :)

[Loopydude]

Lots of people have to put up with difficult schedules and long hours. That doesn't mean we get a pass on forgetting the people who make our paychecks possible.


Yeah, well, they do make the big bucks, and I sometimes take the "suck it up" attitude with them myself; but usually more so when they harsh on folks like my mom (who are in the same boat, and are working just as hard) in frustration. I guess I have a partisan attitude in that regard.

Suffuce to say, though, that, esp. in primary care these days, it sucks all around, and the frustration is warranted. It seems quite possible that nobody is having a particularly healthful experience some days, be they patients of practitioners. I lay the blame largely on the managed care system as it exists, but that's just me.

[Loopydude]

Should have been "be they patients or practitioners".

[ivylass]

The office manager called me back.

Right off I told her I was not sure if she was the person I should talk to, then I explained the situation.

She said that what I was explaining to her was not correct.

:mad:

I responded that that was what my father experienced.

She said that what happened to my father was terrible, but there was a little more to the story.

Apparently, my father's MRI results had not been received, so the doctor told the "girl" to reschedule for today (Tuesday). Which she did, but didn't bother to tell my father or anyone else in the office. In fact, the office called Friday to remind my father about his appointment for Monday.

It was this same office manager who realized my father had been abandoned in the exam room, by seeing his card on the desk, and sent a nurse back to get him.

She said she would have no problem calling my father to apologize (she asked for the phone number) and said she would speak to the doctor about giving him his MRI results over the phone.

She said this should never have happened, she was most apologetic about it, and I assume steps will be taken to make sure this doesn't happen again.

As long as my dad gets his MRI results without having to go back in, I shall be happy.

[Bosda Di'Chi of Tricor]

So, does this mean you aren't fascinated by orifices anymore?

[JayElle]

I am so grateful for my primary care doctor. I never wait longer than 10 minutes to be let into the examining room and she comes in immediately. I recently had a scare with a lump in my breast - I called the nurse and she said "I have an opening in two hours. Can you make it?" None of this waiting around, maybe we'll see you, maybe we won't business.

How is it that my current doctor can see me promptly, give me the answers I need, and give me excellent care when my previous doctor made me wait at least one hour and refused to even actually see some of his patients? He would send in a P.A. then the P.A. would run back to his office, get the OK, and come back to the patient. I never once laid eyes on the man.

I'm going to go bake cookies for my new, wonderful doctor.

[catsix]

TellMeI'mNot Crazy said:
Did they actually pay the amount? (I always mentally threaten to do this, but end up losing my conviction.)

No, what they did was eat the co-pay and not make me wait in the future.

[ivylass]

So, does this mean you aren't fascinated by orifices anymore?

No, I still am. In fact, I wish I had one. Instead, I'm stuck in this cubicle where anyone can bother me.