Re the new "iPod Shuffle" has Apple lost it's mind, or am I blind to the genius?

[astro]

Meet iPod shuffle, the unpredictable new iPod. (http://www.apple.com/ipodshuffle/)

So I'm reading the description on Apple's website. The iPod "shuffle" is a new iPod that's flashcard memory based.

Mmmm OK, lots of them out there like that, and Apple's a bit late to the flash player party. What makes it different or special?

I see that it comes in 512 meg and 1 gig sizes at $ 100 and $ 150. Well prices seem competitive! (unusual for Apple)

Oh BTW it's got no display... Huh? And you can't choose a song to play. Nope! All the songs are randomly shuffled, all the time.

What the hell? I re-read it to make sure I didn't miss anything.

No... wait you don't have to just trust the whimsy of the fates, you can choose a boring, fascist "play order" mode that plays them as you loaded them, but you still can't see what's chosen or playing.

Is this marketing hubris gone mad, or a special genius I just can't see? (literally and figuratively)


Time to mix things up. Meet iPod shuffle, the unpredictable new iPod. What will it play next? Can it read your mind? Can it read your moods? Load it up. Put it on. See where it takes you. Choose from pocket-size 512MB or 1G models starting at $99 and surprise yourself.


Random is the New Order
Welcome to a life less orderly. As official soundtrack to the random revolution, the iPod Shuffle Songs setting takes you on a unique journey through your music collection — you never know what’s around the next tune. Meet your new ride. More roadster than Rolls, iPod shuffle rejects routine by serving up your favorite songs in a different order every time. Just plug iPod shuffle into your computer’s USB port, let iTunes Autofill it with up to 240 songs(1) and get a new experience with every connection. The trail you run every day looks different with an iPod shuffle. Daily gridlock feels less mundane when you don’t know what song will play next. iPod shuffle adds musical spontaneity to your life. Lose control. Love it.

[levdrakon]

I just saw that today. I think someone at Apple screwed up. It's big selling point is that it randomly shuffles. Woo hoo! A whole new radical X-treme listening experience!

[Scruloose]

Even if you were to think this feature was amusing, you'd probably think this for about 2 minutes. Right up until the moment you wanted to hear a specific song, and had no way of finding it.

New Coke and Clear Pepsi, move over big guys.

[even sven]

I love shuffle (I'm always in shuffle mode, although usually shuffling around a "rainy day" or "sunny day" playlist) but it's been around forever. My old MP3 CD player did shuffle when the iPod was just a gleam in Apple's eye.

[Tentacle Monster]

Apple has never been one to play up the affordability of their products. Usually because they're not. Shame in this case, considering that $150 is a pretty damn good price for a 1GB MP3 player. Shuffle's nice, and a lot of people like it, but not me. I like to listen to whole albums at once. Besides that, I've got a couple of audiobooks on my Neuros. Going from George Carlin to Jimmy Buffett to GWAR to a random chapter out of The Universe in a Nutshell is a bit too schizophrenic for me.

[pizzabrat]

Uh, it's only 100 dollars, and it's an iPod. I think that's the point!

[astro]

Uh, it's only 100 dollars, and it's an iPod. I think that's the point!

So real world usability is supposed to take a back seat cause "it's an iPod"?

[Rysler]

So real world usability is supposed to take a back seat cause "it's an iPod"?

pizzabrat is right. It's just about branding. iPod brand flash player. They're gambling on the name making the sale. Having never used a flash player... Do none of them have display features? Or is that an iPod drawback?

[Kal]

You can turn the shuffle feature off.

[cheddarsnax]

Rysler: It's an iPod drawback. The Creative MuVo (http://www.nomadworld.com/products/muvo_txfm/), Rio Cali (http://www.digitalnetworksna.com/shop/_templates/item_main_Rio.asp?model=258), TDK Mojo (http://www.tdk.com/cdmp3/mojo256f.html), and others all have displays.

[N9IWP]

Apparently LOTS of iPod users use shuffle. And as you say, you can play songs in playlist order. It is an interesting decision - "hey - instead of cramming a display on a tiny player, just get rid of the display altogether!"

Plus it doubles as a USB drive so you can store files on it too.

Some (most?) flash players have displays, but most (all?) of the displays suck (that's my understanding, not personal experience)

People thought the iPod mini (4GB for $249 when you could get a 20GB iPod for $299) would flop - it was a huge hit.

Brian

[astro]

You can turn the shuffle feature off.

I know, I mentioned that in the OP.

The lack of display is just such a bizarre design choice for a company like Apple that likes to have cutting edge products. Only the lowest of the low end flash players don't have an LCD that displays the song choices. A 512 meg and 1 gig player will hold about 100/200 songs of average length, respectively. In 2005 to be expected to have to wade through that number of song choices without a display to guide you is just nigh incomprehensible.

[Ferret Herder]

Some (most?) flash players have displays, but most (all?) of the displays suck (that's my understanding, not personal experience)
Yeah, but it's better than not having one. IMO, of course.

[Paul in Qatar]

No display Mac = buy your own display.
No display iPod = buy your own display.

It MIGHT be genius. I could foresee a new class of audio products that use an iPod as a storage device, like a CD, and provides a high-quality display as part of the bargain.

Get in your car, put your Shuffle into slot of your car radio and select a playlist. Get home, recharge the thing by sliding it into your home stereo. Use the display on the hi-fi. Same with boom boxes and the rest of it.

Or maybe I am wrong.

[N9IWP]

I suppose there COULD be some display that hooks up to the USB port, but I think it defats the purpose.


Funny footnote on official site: ( http://www.apple.com/ipodshuffle/ )

[2]Do not eat iPod shuffle.


lets you think it is lawyers going amok, the Mac mini has this:

Keyboard, iPod mini, dock, hands, AirPort, Bluetooth and PC sold separately

(the picture shows somebody holding the logic board)

and

Keyboard, mouse, megaphone and display sold separately


I picked a 512 MB USB drive at random from bestbuy -- $79. (there are more expensive ones but I'm sure there are cheaper) - so basically you get a MP3 player for $20.

Personally I don't really want one, and I can see how the lack of display would bother people, but a there is a large segment that this appeals to (including current iPod owners) Think of it a s radio that only plays your favorite 200 songs.

Brian

[lno]

It appeals to me, even though the image (http://images.apple.com/ipodshuffle/images/indexibook20050111.jpg) appears to be a pregnancy test.

I've got a pile of mp3s but I've never purchased a portable mp3 player. I definitely don't want to spend $299 or $399 on an iPod, or even $249 on an iPod Mini. I'd like to put a playlist on that and either listen to it in order or randomly, and if I want to skip a song, I press the >> button and move to the next one. I think people focusing on the shuffle aspect or the lack of display are missing the point of this.

It would be something to use while taking a dog for a walk, or working out, or cleaning the house, et cetera. It's almost as idiot-proof as turning on a radio. This isn't meant to replace the existing line of iPods, but rather complement them. If you're looking for a mp3 player that holds thousands of songs and allows you to rapidly select the specific one you want, this isn't the iPod for you.

Fortunately, Apple has a couple others available that may suit your needs.

[pulykamell]

It appeals to me, even though the image (http://images.apple.com/ipodshuffle/images/indexibook20050111.jpg) appears to be a pregnancy test.

I've got a pile of mp3s but I've never purchased a portable mp3 player. I definitely don't want to spend $299 or $399 on an iPod, or even $249 on an iPod Mini. I'd like to put a playlist on that and either listen to it in order or randomly, and if I want to skip a song, I press the >> button and move to the next one. I think people focusing on the shuffle aspect or the lack of display are missing the point of this.

It would be something to use while taking a dog for a walk, or working out, or cleaning the house, et cetera. It's almost as idiot-proof as turning on a radio. This isn't meant to replace the existing line of iPods, but rather complement them. If you're looking for a mp3 player that holds thousands of songs and allows you to rapidly select the specific one you want, this isn't the iPod for you.

Fortunately, Apple has a couple others available that may suit your needs.

You can always try the Frontier Nex Ia player, which retails at around $60-$70. Works on Flash cards (sold separately). It also has a display, you can select what you want to listen to, and if you know where to show, you'll be up and running well under $150 for a 1 Gig portable music experience.

[initech]

I think the appeal is in the way it interfaces with iTunes. It sounds like connecting it to your PC causes iTunes to "autofill" the iPod with a random collection of tracks from your larger collection, giving you a little of that iPod shuffle love, for a whole lot less money. I think it sounds great, since I'm not willing to lay down $300+ for a real iPod.

[Etherman]

I don't know if lack of a display is that big a deal. Remember cassettes? And CD's? All you had was a "skip to next track" and maybe a track number, which you had to cross reference with the CD case.

Yes, I realize that is progress, but a lot of Apple's customers are yuppies/use-to-be-thirtysomethings who remeber that style of interface, and will be just fine with it. Apple has always excelled at this, using intuitive, familiar interfaces for new tasks.

I think Paul in Saudi has a good point, as I've had the same idea. Imagine several different types of players that you could slap a thumbdrive in, and play all your music from your drive. Your friend could do the same with his own drive/music. It even has your playlists stored on the drive, and lets you choose which you want to hear. Kinda like that little control unit you get with XM radio, where you can put the unit into a stereo, a car stereo, a portable, etc. and get your stations.

Any bets that we see the iPods, that mini mac and the iMovie/iFilm etc suite morph into Apple's shot at the "media pc?" A small (palm pc) sized color LCD on the iPod, and now you have video, not just music, recorded (or downloaded) to your Mac, played where you want on your iPod with LCD.

Just a guess.

[Barbarian]

They're already halfway there with the iPod photo.

The lack of display doesn't matter for the iPod shuffle-- it's not designed for anyone who already has an iPod or other MP3 player, it's for someone who's looking to get into the portable MP3 world cheap. That it doubles as a USB memory stick is an added bonus. Throw in the ability to run it off AA batteries, and Apple will laugh to the bank.

[cheddarsnax]

I don't know if lack of a display is that big a deal. Remember cassettes? And CD's? All you had was a "skip to next track" and maybe a track number, which you had to cross reference with the CD case.
You also had about ten different tracks. The iPod Shuffle can hold 240.

[Mangetout]

I'm predicting the next one to hit the market will be the iPod Silent - stores up to 3GB of music and playlists - it won't actually include any features necessary to play them, but you'll know they're in there and hey, it's an iPod.

[Sat on Cookie]

I'm predicting the next one to hit the market will be the iPod Silent - stores up to 3GB of music and playlists - it won't actually include any features necessary to play them, but you'll know they're in there and hey, it's an iPod.

Thanks for the wake-up laugh. :)

[35340]

So real world usability is supposed to take a back seat cause "it's an iPod"?

I love that. I'm putting it on my whiteboard at work.

[Antigen]

No display Mac = buy your own display.
No display iPod = buy your own display.

It MIGHT be genius. I could foresee a new class of audio products that use an iPod as a storage device, like a CD, and provides a high-quality display as part of the bargain.

Get in your car, put your Shuffle into slot of your car radio and select a playlist. Get home, recharge the thing by sliding it into your home stereo. Use the display on the hi-fi. Same with boom boxes and the rest of it.

Or maybe I am wrong.

My Mac-obsessed friend sent me this (http://www.macbidouille.com/news/photonews19/day3-6-460.jpg) yesterday. He tells me it's a way to use your iPod with a home-wide sound system. And it has a display. I'm not sure about any of the details, or even if it's legit, but it looks like what you're talking about.

But I figure anyone who can afford a home-wide sound system with a control box like that will buy the normal, big iPod anyway, so I don't really get it.

[Terrorcotta]

The lack of display is just such a bizarre design choice for a company like Apple that likes to have cutting edge products.

I used to hold Apple in high regard for design until I had to use the round, 'hockey puck' mouse, the 'toilet seat' iMac or find a pen/pointy thing to start my G4 in the morning...

For operating systems they are great but their hardware is not always perfect. Can't wait to see how you turn on the new Mini Mac!

[Mangetout]

For operating systems they are great but their hardware is not always perfect. Can't wait to see how you turn on the new Mini Mac!Looks like the power button is at the back, next to all the ports etc.

[UrbanChic]

My husband and I have all but decided to buy a Mini Mac for our oldest son. He needs a new computer and space is an issue. I also want to expose him to different operating systems.

I won't buy the iPod Shuffle, though. The lack of a display was the deal-breaker. When I saw the spot about it on The Today Show this morning, I was all over it. I didn't realize it lacked a display until I went to apple's site.

[brix11]

No one's mentioned that the iPod Shuffle is the only flash player that will play the iTunes Music Store's AAC encoded files without the need to convert them first. This is a big plus for me, although I think the increasing use of propietary codecs is ridiculous.

I'm not sure I'd miss the display on something like this, then again I'm the type who prefers 'shuffling' anyway. Plus, it seems easy enough to update the playlist in iTunes; I'd just throw on enough tracks to get me through whatever I'm doing then go back and change it.

[Terrorcotta]

Looks like the power button is at the back, next to all the ports etc.

You're right, I looked at the specs and that's the ticket.

Monster specs, by the way. I just hope the power is easier to push in than the G4.

[LifeOnWry]

This actually sounds like something that would be designed for me. I spent almost a year converting my albums and tapes to mp3s, and I use the Windows Media Player to make enormous playlists, then I set everything on shuffle - it is like having a radio station programmed with only songs I like. I got a satellite radio system for Christmas, and I love it, but I find that having music sorted by genre gets boring after a while. I make CDs for the car, and I'm forever mixing genres, but a CD only holds about 20 songs or so. This sounds like something I would really like, so I'm going to go look at it and see what kind of hardware stuff I'd need and if it would be compatible with my PC.

[levdrakon]

I don't know if lack of a display is that big a deal. Remember cassettes? And CD's? All you had was a "skip to next track" and maybe a track number, which you had to cross reference with the CD case.

Does anyone know what Etherman is talking about? Was he defrosted from some glacier or something? ;)

[Finagle]

Does anyone know what Etherman is talking about? Was he defrosted from some glacier or something? ;)

Yes. A CD is just like a vinyl LP, but without the needle. And it's smaller. A cassette is kind of like an 8-Track, except it's smaller and you have to flip it over to hear the other side.



Does that help any?

[Max Torque]

I'll wager part of what enabled Apple to reach the $100 price point was a side benefit (to them) of losing the display: no navigation software. As I recall, they contracted with an outside vendor to produce the iPod navigation software, and Apple still doesn't own the software outright. Since they don't have to install a copy of that software on the iPod Shuffle, they're probably saving themselves a bundle in software license fees.

The Shuffle will appeal to a pretty huge segment of portable music listeners, I'll wager. Most people I know like to listen to their music on "Random" anyway, and almost no one sits and listens to their portable player long enough to make it through 240 songs at one stretch. At 4 minutes a song, that'd be 16 hours. By then, you'd need to refresh the battery anyway.

Unfortunately, this player sounds like it might be almost impossible to use with audiobooks. Unless, perhaps, you can force it to draw from one iTunes playlist only, put the files you want in that playlist, and turn off the shuffle.

[WotNot]

It MIGHT be genius. I could foresee a new class of audio products that use an iPod as a storage device, like a CD, and provides a high-quality display as part of the bargain.

Get in your car, put your Shuffle into slot of your car radio and select a playlist. Get home, recharge the thing by sliding it into your home stereo. Use the display on the hi-fi. Same with boom boxes and the rest of it.

Or maybe I am wrong.

Or maybe you're not: Apple & Leading Car Companies Team Up to Deliver iPod Integration in 2005 (http://www.apple.com/pr/library/2005/jan/11cars.html)

[35340]

A friend of mine at work just came pu with a good point - for your MiniDisc player you can get headphones with a display screen integrated on the cord - why not do that (much like IPod's current remote earbud combo) and put your skip buttons on there?

I think it might be a decent idea for a price break cheap intro to Ipod (especially with the way it handles their exclusive coding) and be a great second Ipod for those so inclined to need one for [insert reason for not jogging wearing 1000 worth of gear].

What I think would be neat would be to have 'book rentals' much like the dvd rentals currently at airports. At airports, bus stations, highway rest stops, have a machine that you can plug your Ipod or Ipod Shuffle into and instantly buy or rent an inexpensive book on tape or whatever to give you something more to listen to. It's hooked up to the interweb so you can sync it to your home system then or later.

[Bad News Baboon]

I think the shuffle is awesome for when I go to the gym or take the baby on a walk.

I don't need a display for those times and the small size would be ideal.

[scr4]

-- it's not designed for anyone who already has an iPod or other MP3 player, it's for someone who's looking to get into the portable MP3 world cheap.

Actually I alreaedy have a 40GB iPod and I think the Shuffle would complement it well. The full-size iPod doesn't fit in a pocket comfortably, and it's fragile - at least I assume it's fragile and treat it accordingly because it's expensive and I know there are moving parts in there. I wouldn't use it outdoors (jogging, bicycling*) or while walking around inside (working in the lab). I think the Shuffle would be perfect for those occasions. I already have all my music on iTunes and presumably it can manage both iPods.

*I know, bicycling with headphones on is a bad idea. I'd only use portable speakers, and only while touring in the middle of nowhere.

[Graycat]

If I had known about this last month, I would have waited and bought it for my daughter, rather than the Rio Forge I got her for Christmas. I would have saved forty bucks over the Forge, got twice the capacity, and how much do you need a display when all you have loaded is two or three audiobooks and one Hilary Duff CD?

[elbows]

Why this little thing could not have come at a better time in my world.

The Mr. got himself an Ipod a couple of months back, couldn't be more over the moon about the thing, he loves it.

So I was wanting to take some music to the gym, or while working on the garden, or painting the house etc. I was afraid to mention this to the Mr for Christmas, certain he'd insist on getting me an ipod or ipod mini.

And to be honest I felt it would be a terrible waste. I don't need all of that capability. I wouldn't use it that often. I'll get frustrated when I have to relearn all the controls everytime I want to use it. Why not just get a cheap MP3 player that does little more that play at random? We just had this conversation not three days ago. And for all my protests, when he ended with, "Well, okay, but promise you will let me choose and buy it.", I knew I was sunk. I had not convinced him one little bit I was certain.

The beautiful part is that it is already compatible with the itunes stuff he already has set up on my computer.

I tell you, they made this, just for me.

[SuperNelson]

This looks great to me. I currently have a Rio Cali sport player that I run with. I wanted an iPod, but I figured it would last about 100 miles of trail runs. My Rio has a small display, but about the only time I look at it is to see if it's on and how much battery life is left. The buttons are in a wierd place, and I can never find the right one when I'm running. The iPod Shuffle holds more music, is cheaper, lighter, fits in my pocket, has a rechargable battery, and looks easier to use on the run than my Rio. My Rio needs a special cable and software to load; the iPod Shuffle just plugs directly in to a USB port. I'll probably wait a few weeks until I can see one in person in a Mac store, but I certainly plan to buy one eventually.

[yojimbo]

I plan to get one of these as well.

The ipod was just too expensive for my musical needs.

This is great. Make a play list on itunes, plug the dodad into USB and whoosh away I go. Turn on/off the shuffle when I want.

Perfect and for the right price too. Looks great as well.

[UrbanChic]

My Rio has a small display, but about the only time I look at it is to see if it's on and how much battery life is left.The battery meter's the most important item on the display!

[SuperNelson]

The battery meter's the most important item on the display!
I agree. And the iPod Mini has a battery indicator right below the power switch.

[lno]

Unfortunately, this player sounds like it might be almost impossible to use with audiobooks. Unless, perhaps, you can force it to draw from one iTunes playlist only, put the files you want in that playlist, and turn off the shuffle.You can put a specific playlist onto the iPod Shuffle and flick the doodad on the back to "play in order" mode. I suspect that, should I purchase this, the first playlist would be the 44 file, 233 megabyte unabridged recording of The Return of the King, narrated by Robert Inglis, running about fourteen and a half hours.

The only inconvenience, if any, would be creating individual playlists for individual audiobooks, but that's extremely trivial to handle.

[joshmaker]

...it's fragile - at least I assume it's fragile and treat it accordingly because it's expensive and I know there are moving parts in there. I wouldn't use it outdoors (jogging, bicycling*) or while walking around inside (working in the lab).While I of course don't recommend doing it, I have accidentally dropped my iPod onto the pavement several times and it still works fine. They're really quite rugged.

[SuperNelson]

Plus, I run with my flash player in an outside pocket in my running shorts. At 3/4 of an ounce, the iPod Shuffle is very light. At 6.4 ounces, a full-fledged iPod would probably trip me and scare the neighbors when my shorts dropped down to my ankles. Not sure about the iPod mini.

[Terrorcotta]

Plus, I run with my flash player in an outside pocket in my running shorts. At 3/4 of an ounce, the iPod Shuffle is very light. At 6.4 ounces, a full-fledged iPod would probably trip me and scare the neighbors when my shorts dropped down to my ankles. Not sure about the iPod mini.


Sounds like you would have a flash problem, alrighty...

[UrbanChic]

I agree. And the iPod Mini has a battery indicator right below the power switch.Then I should just add a buck to the money I'd spend for an iPod shuffle and spring for the Mini. I think the Mini has the battery meter right on the display, though.

I went back to apple's site and I see the Shuffle has a 'battery indicator light'. I wonder how that works? I much prefer a meter.

[rjung]

The battery indicator LED is green for full charge, orange for low, and red for "uh oh," I believe.

Not sure if I like the no-display feature either, though on the other hand, you can imagine it's a radio station that only plays the songs you like. :)

I might get one anyway just to use it as a USB flash disk with free iPod player. It'd be nice for long airplane trips.

[Merkwurdigliebe]

Yeah, fellas, I mean, no matter what, how often do you select a song on your iPod/MP3 player? I don't do it that often, to be honest, and I almost always have it on random. Seriously I have too many songs to form a playlist that would make me happy at any given moment. This little thing is cool becuase if you are on the bus, doing something where you can't or don't want to go search for a song. Honestly, I hate searchign for a song, and I normally just work with playlists.

And for all of the people out there that cite other competitors with a similar price or more storatge or whatever, there are a couple of things to notice here. Firstly you get iTunes, which is an awesome interface. Once I used an Archos interface and it sucked so bad I only loaded it once. The playlists were impossible. iTunes has got to be worth at least 20 dollars in the equation if not more. Then you have the coolness factor which some find valuable too. I mean the iPod mini coming out in colors was such a nod to that market! How many girls wanted a pink one ? So smart those folks at apple have been lately.

[Padeye]

I've been frustrated by the planned obsolecense in MP3 players where most have built in memory and a retail price that is out of line with the current price for flash memory. Of those that use removable cards none I am aware of use compact flash memory which is the most widely available in largest capacity (no fixed upper limit I am aware of) and lowest cost per megabytge. My new PDA works as a very nice MP3 player but since it uses SD memory I think the largest card I can get is 1GB. Not bad but I'd prefer a compact flash slot so I could drop in a 8GB card when those drop to the $100 range.

[Padeye]

Oh, and I have a 128mb TDK Mojo. The display is better than nothing I suppose but Ineed reading glasses for it. Will hold most CDs at high quality bit rate which all I need for going to the gym. If it had a slightly better display and took maybe an SD card and sold for under $100 I'd be happy.

[MrFantsyPants]

I've been frustrated by the planned obsolecense in MP3 players where most have built in memory and a retail price that is out of line with the current price for flash memory. Of those that use removable cards none I am aware of use compact flash memory which is the most widely available in largest capacity (no fixed upper limit I am aware of) and lowest cost per megabytge. My new PDA works as a very nice MP3 player but since it uses SD memory I think the largest card I can get is 1GB. Not bad but I'd prefer a compact flash slot so I could drop in a 8GB card when those drop to the $100 range.

I picked up a Frontier Labs Nex IIa from eBay. heres one (http://cgi.ebay.ca/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=15062&item=5743683847&rd=1). Got a 512 meg card for $35, and it all runs on AAs.

That said, I may switch to an iPod Shuffle, just for the size and convenience, and coolness of course.