A Poll: How Many People See Themselves In This Linked Article? [Archive]

GilaB

03-07-2005, 09:50 PM

I'm not profoundly gifted, but I went to CTY (the program at Hopkins mentioned in the article) and was asked to join their Study of Exceptional Talent (meaning that I test very well, but then, standardized tests have always been my talent in life.) I don't have what the people in the article have, exactly, but I was always 'Gila the Walking Encyclopedia' from early elementary school until I got to a tracked high school, and I was still exclusively a brain to the other classes besides my own. I've spent my life telling people that I'm not as smart as they think I am - it's just that my talents are flashy. I have a big vocabulary and retain random facts well, so I tend to know a little bit about most things. Only once I got to college and grad school (a little ahead of schedule, but not nearly as fast as the people in the article) have I finally fit in a bit more. (The summer gifted programs were a godsend, in that I was finally among 'people like me,' as I put it after my first summer, age 11.)

Queen Tonya

03-07-2005, 09:58 PM

Nope, not me.

pinkfreud

03-07-2005, 10:31 PM

Abbie Carmichael

03-07-2005, 10:38 PM

I'm blessed coming and going, but not in a prodigy-type sense.

lokij

03-07-2005, 10:43 PM

Somewhat. I thank Gods that I'm NOT profoundly gifted in the way those examples are because if I was I'm sure I wouldn't have been able to cope. I have a hard enough time being merely bright, and growing up was Hell. I do feel that I'm wasting my potential and feel that 'imposter phenomenon' quite intensely at times. GilaB sounds like me in many regards.

FilmGeek

03-07-2005, 10:56 PM

I do see myself in that article. I was bored in school because everything came so easily and the other kids hated me because everything came so easily. (I tested at 160-ish when I was young.)

I struggled in math, but I couldn't get help because I was so smart.

I'm forever thankful that my parents didn't advance me through school ahead of my age group. The school's recommendation was to put me in the second grade at four. I was socially backward enough (before coming into my own at 16 through much hard work) and I still struggle with social issues. I can't imagine going to college at an early age and being even further ostracized.

Priam

03-07-2005, 11:24 PM

Yes. It all resonates.

I've never been officially tested for IQ or any other measure of intelligence, so I can't say for certain whether I fall into the "greatly gifted" category. I can say that my intellectual abilities were far above what most of my peers could keep up with throughout grade school. I often felt that pressure from both sides: don't be too dumb or your parents will be disappointed, but don't be too smart or you'll get beat up at school.

Beyond that, not to sound melodramatic, there's the loneliness of having very few people who you can fully talk to. With many of my friends, even these days, I find myself conversing with one metaphorical hand behind my back. My vocabulary, for one thing, can often get out of control. It's an odd fact that my syllable-count actually gets longer as I get further intoxicated. For another, I love talking deep history and philosophy... but the only people I can ever seem to do that with are 40 year olds who too often pretend I don't even exist (I'm nearly 21 ferchrissake!).

Even in college I've faced the mounting pressure of everyone realizing how intelligent I am. Professors push me harder. Fellow students give me odd looks when I answer questions one after the other because I'm sick of waiting around for some other schmoe to raise their hand. One of the ways I've chosen to handle this, namely slacking off because I can, is probably not healthy... but it gets the classroom limelight off me. I don't want to be the know it all anymore. The hours stink and the pay is non-existent.

My father used to tell my brother and I that we could change the world if we put our minds to it. I don't think he ever realized what a burden knowing you could puts on a person. I have the intellect and verbal ability to go places and do things, but what is the price? How can you compromise that knowledge with "normality"? Must it be an either-or path?

picker

03-07-2005, 11:31 PM

I'm not profoundly gifted, but I went to CTY (the program at Hopkins mentioned in the article)

Heh! So did I, for creative writing and rhetoric back in the mid-80s. Man, I'd totally forgotten about that. Thanks for reminding me.

Little Nemo

03-08-2005, 12:38 AM

I got stuck in the middle. I'm intelligent but I'm not a genius. The result was that I've always been able to get by in most intellectual situations with minimal effort. But that's let to the problem that I've become lazy and don't make the effort to go for achievements that would require significant effort on my part.

HMS Irruncible

03-08-2005, 07:02 AM

I can identify with the part about youngsters who are prodigious at mastering things that are already known, but have no creative or innovative talents. That's a tough thing, because you pull way out in front of the crowd at a young age, but the crowd eventually catches back up in adulthood. To have an IQ of just below 149 is to be damned with faint praise, but I suppose it's better than 100.

Jayn_Newell

03-08-2005, 07:03 AM

Somewhat. I've never had my IQ tested, and I sincerely doubt it's in the 180 range. But to echo lokij, thank Og. It was bad enough being just smart. I could get grades that were good for most people and still not feel like I was doing well enough, because I was used to doing better. I had people constantly ask me for homework help throughout junior high (I eventually started refusing, for several reasons), and I am not good at simplifying things for others so it was a real hassle. Fortunately, I was just smart enough that I could take pride in it and not feel all those pressures that those in the article feel, which would have been hard because I'm really shy. Even as it is it's hard, because I got to university and suddenly felt dumb around my classmates.

Now this--
Robert says his first memory is of lying in his crib thinking about reincarnation
I see myself in, only for me it was the meaning of life.

fessie

03-08-2005, 07:42 AM

I'm nowhere near that gifted, but I was ostracized by peers and did feel extraordinary pressure to excel. I've never achieved what my test scores predicted and everyone expected. Fortunately I found music and thus profound joy.

Ephemera

03-08-2005, 07:48 AM

Nope.

When I was tested for the Gifted Program in elementary school, my IQ was 127, which is a respectable score, well above 100 baseline, and enough to get admittance but otherwise, it's not particularly noteworthy.

I'm of above average intelligence but with six billion people on the planet, that means there're a hell of a lot more people out there that are even moreso.

fessie

03-08-2005, 08:13 AM

Thanks for sharing that article. My Hubby actually fits the profile more closely than I do. He sailed through school, everybody's Golden Boy, but since completing his Ph.D. in molecular biology 9 years ago he's been lost and failing his expectations. I remember attending his younger brother's high school graduation and hearing their mom say she expected Nobel Prizes from each of them. She was one of those "no sports for you" types. His brother's been living in a tree in Alaska ever since.

I hope that reading the article will give him some comfort.

Anaamika

03-08-2005, 08:36 AM

My attention span is too short to read the entire article, so from that I have to conclu--HEY! THAT DOG HAS A PUFFY TAIL!

Hey milquetoast, the article isn't that lo-A PUFFY TAIL YOU SAY?!

Trunk

03-08-2005, 08:37 AM

My father used to tell my brother and I that we could change the world if we put our minds to it. I don't think he ever realized what a burden knowing you could puts on a person.

If it helps. . .I'm pretty sure he was wrong.

jsgoddess

03-08-2005, 08:52 AM

I've tested extremely high in IQ, but honestly, it really hasn't meant anything. My school used to give me IQ tests every couple of months and it wasn't until I was applying for college that I knew what my scores were.

I grew up in a rural area with few educational options. My five siblings are all brilliant, so I had them to talk to. And I've always been fairly self-contained and extremely frivolous, so I didn't have a huge amount of angst over any of it. I did think that going to college was going to normalize me in a larger group, but it didn't. By then, though, I guess I just didn't care. I'm blessed in that I'm hard to bore, so I never found school torturous.

So, the only thing I see of myself in that article is a kid with a high IQ.

silenus

03-08-2005, 08:59 AM

Nope. I don't resemble any of those people in the least. High IQ, moderate expectations, happy, fulfilling life. No prob. :D

Miss Purl McKnittington

03-08-2005, 01:28 PM

I grew up in a rural area with few educational options . . . I did think that going to college was going to normalize me in a larger group, but it didn't.

Beyond that, not to sound melodramatic, there's the loneliness of having very few people who you can fully talk to. With many of my friends, even these days, I find myself conversing with one metaphorical hand behind my back. My vocabulary, for one thing, can often get out of control. . . . For another, I love talking deep history and philosophy... but the only people I can ever seem to do that with are 40 year olds who too often pretend I don't even exist (I'm nearly 21 ferchrissake!).

. . . Fellow students give me odd looks when I answer questions one after the other because I'm sick of waiting around for some other schmoe to raise their hand. One of the ways I've chosen to handle this, namely slacking off because I can, is probably not healthy... but it gets the classroom limelight off me. I don't want to be the know it all anymore. The hours stink and the pay is non-existent.

These describe my experiences more closely than the article. It probably helps that my IQ has never tested above 140. (My older sister's is 148. She lords those 8 points above me. Grrrr. And I lord my ACT score over hers, so ha.)

The things that ring especially true are what Priam says about vocabulary and talking to adults. It really hurts when your friends ask you to "dumb down" what you're saying because they don't understand you. It's not that you try to confuse them -- the words just come naturally. My best conversations are with my parents, for god's sake. One of my best friends? My high school English teacher.

As noted above, I have an older sister with whom I have a very competitive relationship, despite that she's 8 years older than I am. It's good-natured, though; we don't sabotage each other. My younger brothers are both completely average -- average IQs, average interests, average everything. I came to resent them a bit when we were all still in middle/high school. I'd be getting straight A's and comments like "Sarah is very intelligent and a delight to have in the classroom," on my report cards, and my parents wouldn't say a thing. My brothers, on the other hand, would get a range of grades from A's to D's and my parents would pour attention on them, urging them to try harder. Hello! I wanted acknowledgement! And it didn't help either that they wanted to go to my brothers' baseball and football games, while my concerts and plays were duty attendance.

If anything, I'm resentful that people that are completely average intelligence-wise have an easier time navigating through life socially. I hate it when I'm talking to a guy and I let a "big" word slip out or I'll say something about the show we're watching totally reminding me of Spenser's "The Faerie Queene." His eyes will sort of glaze over, while I realize I've shot myself in the foot. I hate to have to limit what I say because my knowledge is so much a part of who I am.

Priam

03-08-2005, 02:06 PM

If anything, I'm resentful that people that are completely average intelligence-wise have an easier time navigating through life socially. I hate it when I'm talking to a guy and I let a "big" word slip out or I'll say something about the show we're watching totally reminding me of Spenser's "The Faerie Queene." His eyes will sort of glaze over, while I realize I've shot myself in the foot. I hate to have to limit what I say because my knowledge is so much a part of who I am.

Oh heck yes. I'm guilty of this as well, though for me it generally manifests in annoyance towards historical inaccuracies in movies. I once insisted that my friend pause "Crime and Punishment in Suburbia" two seconds in because the opening quote was from Dostoyevsky before the firing squad. Nowhere did it indicate that it was a faked squad. The only way he would've died that day was if he tripped and fell or choked on a chicken bone! ... and I've started again. Anyway, after about two minutes of me being pedantic, the movie was duly restarted.

It's just I can't realize most people don't know this stuff or even care very much. They don't care about Emperor Basil II Bulgaroktonos. They don't realize what an impact the advance of Islam in the mid-first millenium had on shaping the modern world. Let's all face it: I'm just intelligent enough to be an annoyance to myself and others. Except teachers... teachers love me.

Miss Purl McKnittington

03-08-2005, 02:28 PM

I do the historical innacuracy thing really heavily with costuming. Panniers are so not Elizabethan. (I'm looking at you, glut of Elizabethan period films from the mid-90s.) For some reason, most people really don't care about things like that. A Knight's Tale nearly gave me an apoplectic fit. Good thing I watched it by myself.

Priam, we must be the same person in different bodies, because teachers love me, too.

MaxTheVool

03-08-2005, 04:03 PM

Warning: This post will include some boasting and arrogance. Don't blame me, I didn't start the topic :)

I was a very gifted child, probably in the "profoundly gifted" category, although people rarely made a fuss over me about it. However, the fact that I always knew I was smarter than everyone else my age was a very defining feature of my general worldview... it was both a blessing and a curse. A blessing in that even in the worst depths of junior high school, I never really lost my self esteem despite being very much an outcast, and never felt any need to succumb to peer pressure, conformity, etc. A curse in that I was an arrogant asshole, and am still only partially recovered from that.

I was (and am) lucky in that I come from a VERY bright family in which intelligence and learning are valued (and, in fact, expected). Both my parents have PhDs. Of my paternal grandparents' 6 grandchildren, I was the 4th to go to college, and the 1st NOT to go to Harvard.

A few random comments:
-I definitely felt that the educational system didn't do me right, in many ways. In particular, I was smart enough that I basically never had to really intellectually struggle. So I breezed through high school, breezed through much of college, and then when I hit things that were truly difficult (in my case, complex analysis) I just didn't know how to deal with it, and I failed at it miserably, whereas people who had less natural smarts than me but were used to really applying their intellects knew how to work at it until they understood it

-I've long wondered what affect I had on my (older) sister, who was plenty bright in her own right (she did go to Harvard), but less so than me, at least as far as standardized testing, etc., was concerned. I think it must have been very difficult and intimidating for her, particularly in the intellectually oriented family that we had. On the other hand, that might just be me wanting to overstate my own importance in her development :) It certainly is the case, however, that she was the "rebel" of the family, in that she smokes and drinks and listens to rock music, unlike my parents and I, who are big nerds.

-One thing I remember with some amount of resentment is that at college (I went to Haverford College in Pennsylvania), I was chatting with someone else in my math class who had taken the same national math contest that I had, and he said something like "well, I got the 50th best score in North Carolina, but someone else in my school got the 6th best score in North Carolina, so no one made much of a fuss over me". And I was thinking "well, I got the best score in California, which is much bigger than your state, and no one made a fuss over me at all... and I didn't even realize anyone should have. But NOW I do." I wonder how my life would be if there had been more recognition and programs for the very very gifted when I was growing up?

Anyhow, now I'm 31, I have a satisfying job where my brightness comes in handy (writing video games). I don't have any illusions that I'm going to change the world, or even ever convince anyone of anything in The Pit, but I'm basically happy with my life. For what that's worth :)

pravnik

03-08-2005, 05:40 PM

Heh...I was talking with my brother on the phone just last night and he was ribbing me about something or other with "yeah, you always were a little slow. Late bloomer, that's you." He's about my same age and we went to school together, so he has a unique perspective on the whole thing. I was a gifted child very early on (I don't know if you would call it "profoundly gifted," I don't know where the cutoff is). I could read about as well by the time I turned 3 as I do now, to the bewilderment of my parents. My dad says it was a little disturbing somehow when he'd walk into a room and I'd be drinking a bottle and reading the newspaper. I remember being on a preschool field trip at the zoo and another kid asked the teacher "can we feed the monkeys?" while standing directly in front of a sign that said "do not feed the monkeys." I said to him "the sign right in front of you says 'do not feed the monkeys!' Can't you read?" I wasn't being mean, I was genuinely confused.

Unfortunately, that was about the pinnacle of my academic performance for the next 12 years or so. About in the seventh grade, I started failing classes, and to this day I can't tell you why. Partly, it was an attitude problem. At any rate, I was hardly "ostracized for my brilliance," since any brilliance I may or may not have possessed was kept pretty much secret by my failing grades, except for being called into a school counselor's office every other semester or so to find out why I wasn't living up to the level of acheivement my aptitude tests indicated I was capable of. My ostracism was much more of the garden variety.

I kept failing classes all the way though high school. By way of example, in my computer math class in 11th grade, I spent the whole semester hacking into the math program and making it so a giant penis appeared onscreen when you booted it up. My grade for the semester was a 7. As terribly amusing as that was, it wasn't so amusing when I flunked out and didn't get to graduate with my class. My brother walked across the stage at the graduation ceremony, and I didn't even attend. High school was a sad, lonely, and angry time for me. Don't worry, though, my life rocks in every way possible now. :D

pasunejen

03-08-2005, 06:01 PM

I see my boyfriend in the article, and, to a lesser extent, myself and most of my friends.

I don't think people realize how much damage can be done by constantly telling kids how bright/special they are and what great things they could do. It puts on a lot of pressure, to the extent that living your life like a normal person constitutes failure. Taking kids out of bad situations or putting them in programs to develop abilities they show interest in developing is one thing, but forcing it is going way overboard.

Hell, I'm currently trying (at 21) to pull out of the whole Gifted Child mindset, and my dad is fighting it all the way--"But you have a gift for this, you have such intelligence, you need to be doing something academic, your mind is perfect for research"...I'd smack him, if it weren't for the fact that he honestly thinks he's helping.

People need to learn where to draw the line between positive reinforcement and making kids feel like they have a duty to what is, in the end, a genetic accident. Especially if performing that duty is at odds with being a whole person and living the way he/she wants to.

pasunejen

03-08-2005, 06:15 PM

I've long wondered what affect I had on my (older) sister, who was plenty bright in her own right (she did go to Harvard), but less so than me, at least as far as standardized testing, etc., was concerned. I think it must have been very difficult and intimidating for her, particularly in the intellectually oriented family that we had. On the other hand, that might just be me wanting to overstate my own importance in her development :) It certainly is the case, however, that she was the "rebel" of the family, in that she smokes and drinks and listens to rock music, unlike my parents and I, who are big nerds.

Missed this before, and wanted to comment.

While my intelligence and my brother's are nowhere near the 180 range, we both hover around low genius. My poor sister, who is of above-average but not amazing intelligence, came between us.

She's a much harder worker than I am, having attained basically the same grades in school by dint of exertion, voluntarily seeking out tutoring, etc., while I basically lazed through school. She also did a lot more with her time outside school--devoted herself to band, worked on a therapeutic horse farm, etc. In short, she's a far more interesting person than I am.

While my parents make an effort to recognize all of us equally, it's clear that it's easier for them to put a real value on my academic achievements (CTY, this and that GPA, got into U of Chicago's Linguistics PhD program, blah blah blah) and my brother's academic and athletic achievements than on her drive to succeed.

She's coming into her own now, but I know that for a long time she felt like she was just desperately playing catch-up to me, and this caused all sorts of problems between her and my parents and particularly between the two of us. Thank god everything's all smoothed out and both of us realize we're just people for Og's sake--maybe it's got something to do with the realization that she'll most likely go way farther in life than her lazy-ass sister--but I dearly wish I could go back and make those years easier for her.

Zebra

03-09-2005, 11:47 AM

Not so much.

The people in the article were extremely gifted. But I was gifted enough to be teased about it in school and I did get questions wrong on purpose just so I wouldn't have the top score again a few times.

If anything in adult life I'm probably not living up to my full pontential. I don't feel like a fraud. I feel more like a slacker.

Sunspace

03-09-2005, 01:59 PM

I'm not even close to being among the "profoundly gifted" (if anything, I'm among the "fairly smart"), but I resonate with that article.

I may not have learned multiple languages at three, but I could read at four.

My first memory is not of thinking about reincarnation, but of waking from a nightmare and staring in fear at the light bulb on the end of my crib, imagining the buzzing filament inside and the wires connected to it.

I've never had a formal IQ test--the ones I've taken online have had such variable results that the're almost meaningless.

During school I mostly had decent marks, enough to get by. One year--grade 11, I think--I had straight As, but that was not repeated.

But...

The social effects of school were very negative for me, and probably resulted in far more disadvantage to me than any advantages I may have gotten through intelligence.

During school I learned to hide myself and try to fit in. And those lessons, taught by the fists of bullies and the derision of classmates, started in kindergarten. I learned to do what was necessary to get by, but not much more. After all, I didn't want to be singled out again.

There were entire types of skill I needed, that I had no idea existed, and that school as it was then couldn't teach me. I refer to social skills: how to talk to and understand others, how to read body language, how to behave so that others can feel comfortable. I'm only learning those skills now, and I'm 41.

I wonder now what I would have been like if I had had the environment to really push myself, to see what I really could have become.

I wonder what would have happened if phys-ed had taught me how to control and use my body, how to dance, be social, and defend myself... rather than being a font of shame that I escaped at the first oppurtunity.

I wonder what things would have been like if I could have used all my vocabulary and mental skills and been open about it.

I strongly suspect that I am operating at maybe 10% of what I could be.

Carnac the Magnificent!

03-09-2005, 03:15 PM

Not me, not close. Twice tested by Mensa. High enough IQ to sting if it were water temperature, but nowhere close to boiling. The first and last time I mentioned my (lapsed) Mensa affiliation was during my first interview out of grad school. It suddenly became the subject of discussion. The primary interviewer was clearly intrigued/intimidated and made me, then a 22 yo, squirm like hell.

To my mind, "astonishing intelligence" goes well beyond a standardized test. It's multifaceted and rare--much rarer than, say, a 160 IQ or some freakish savant ability.

QuickSilver

03-09-2005, 03:27 PM

Nope. Dumb as a post. As a majority of my posts here will bear witness.

But I lern. I lern. Eee-vennn-tualeee.

:D

Ghanima

03-09-2005, 04:43 PM

Kind of sort of identify, not at 180 (I think I was 136) but it rings a bell. I've since taken care of the problem with drugs and alcohol. :cool:

Eonwe

03-09-2005, 04:47 PM

First, a shout-out to all you fellow CTYers out there. Definitely one of the more important things to happen to me, because, as GilaB said, I was, "finally among 'people like me'."

I've never considered myself 'genius,' but certainly struggled as someone who perhaps wasn't objectively 'smarter' (whatever that means), but who retained info really well, had a high level of comprehension for all subjects, and got a kick out of exploring new things. I also had much more satisfying and rewarding interactions with adults than peers for a long time. I just 'got' adults more than other kids. We could talk about real things, and they didn't feel the need to put me down or make fun of me. School was a piece of cake for me, and for quite a few years I was well ahead of the curriculum in a few subjects, (of course, I had to sit through what was to me remedial English and math because there was no 'gifted'/tracked programs in middle school. There were three years of my life wasted). Didn't have to work much; understood subjects without the reinforcement provided by doing homework. I was always on the outside, but I had a few other friends who were there with me; maybe one or two of whom did it with as minimal effort as I put in.

Well, I burnt out my senior year in high school. There was just a little too much work to be done (and I was someone who was used to doing no work and still doing well. Senior year, I did realy well on all my AP exams, but my grades in those classes were pretty poor because I didn't get off my ass enough to hand in the required assignments more often than not), and I cared too little. I was tired.

I ended up in college for a few years but struggled seriously with getting work done. I've been in and out part-time since then, but basically failed out as a junior (credit-wise). Maybe I'll go back if I have a specific goal or purpose, but the college-for-college's-sake motivation wasn't enough to keep me going. Classes still seemed to go horribly slowly, and I still ended up being one of the few to actually participate, raise my hand, and discuss stuff intellegantly, and after a month of that my mind and interests wandered, my grades slipped, and so the saga continues.

So, yeah, I struggle a lot with myself with regards to expectations and where I am now. I was the 'smartest' guy in my class for a long time, and now I'm a college drop-out. That's hard enough to reconcile in my own head, but I also know that I'm disapointing my family to various degrees as well.

Sorry if this became more of a confessional-type thing for me. But, that's a bit of my experience.

pravnik

03-09-2005, 05:28 PM

This article I ran across probably speaks a bit more to me than does the op:

http://www.hoagiesgifted.org/underserved.htm

Spectre of Pithecanthropus

03-09-2005, 05:29 PM

Nope. Dumb as a post. As a majority of my posts here will bear witness.

But I lern. I lern. Eee-vennn-tualeee.

:D

Unless I am mistaking the reference, you also talk to stuffed moose and learn English..."from a boook!'

Hallo! Is nice today!

Spectre of Pithecanthropus

03-09-2005, 05:34 PM

As to the OP, I'm another one of the "middling bright" crowd. I think I tested out around 130 in grade school, and range from about 125 to 140 on Internet tests. But nevertheless I had problems with math--so much so that my GPA was pulled down and I could never join the state scholarship federation.

My parents tell a story about how I identified the colors on a multicolored ball way before most kids do, as well as other typical stories about early reading and so on. But nowhere in their tales is any mention of precocious mathematical ability! :(

ninetypercent

03-09-2005, 06:13 PM

I doubt that you'll get many people who will admit on a messageboard that they are greatly gifted. In my observation, such an admission is likely to result in accusations of elitism or arrogance.

It's odd that it's okay for a person to admit having inherited genes that make her extremely tall, but if she were to admit that she inherited genes that make her extremely intelligent or extremely talented, many people would react with resentment.

There was a discussion in the Mensa Bulletin a while back on the issue of whether or not to mention Mensa membership on one's résumé. There were quite a few horror stories about the reaction of potential employers to the revelation that an applicant is a "genius."

Intelligent or talented? What's the different.

Excelling at schoolwork is a talent. To say that that excelling at schoolwork equals intelligence is arrogant and elitist. Tall people are obviously tall, relative to the average height. There's little room for variation in that observation. I can play quake better than 99.9% of the global population. Am I profoundly gifted? Are other people automatically deficient because they are uninterested in playing quake, or can't play as well as me?

RancidYakButterTeaParty

03-09-2005, 06:17 PM

I've always been slightly above average, but nowhere close to the people mentioned in the article. Education was not that important in my family. I am 29, and was the first person anywhere in my family, extended to the gills if you like, that ever graduated from college. I think this caused me to realize too late that I had more potential than most of my siblings. I was never pushed to succeed in school, or given any extra opportunities, such as a gifted program.

The one thing that has helped me, I think, is the fact that I continually want to learn something new. I know I am not the smartest person in the world, so I am more than willing to learn from the rest of you.

Tenar

03-09-2005, 07:19 PM

Re the OP, I'm not even close. Bright enough for Mensa (barely), too emotionally screwed to make anything of myself; note that the emotional problems had nothing to do with intelligence, except in the sense that people with bipolar disorder are frequently fairly bright.

Pardon the small hijack, but this was the paragraph that struck me the most in the linked article (regarding the 30-year-old aspiring musician):

His mother sees things differently. "I consider him a failed prodigy, and with no joy do I say that. I am devastated," she says. "I am disappointed. My heart is broken." His failure to do more with his gifts, she says, is "the world's loss." In her view, he is deluding himself with a life of trivial pursuits: "He is jovial. He is amiable. He is full of self-deception.

Words do not exist to express my disgust with this woman. (Well, they do, but this is not the Pit.) She calls herself a mother, but from the looks of things, she would rather have seen her son miserable and productive (and impressing people) rather than ordinary and happy. I suspect rejecting her ambitions was a survival tactic on his part.

monstro

03-09-2005, 07:28 PM

I always wished for giftedness and other ways of "specialness", but I fear I'm just a regular, average, run-of-the-mill schmoe. I have been described as talented, but I can't accept I am because I know I can't hold a light to truly talented people. I've been described as smart, but again--this is a relative descriptor. I may be smarter than average, but smart? I don't know.

msmith537

03-09-2005, 08:25 PM

Carnac the Magnificent!

03-09-2005, 08:36 PM

So, yeah, I struggle a lot with myself with regards to expectations and where I am now. I was the 'smartest' guy in my class for a long time, and now I'm a college drop-out. That's hard enough to reconcile in my own head, but I also know that I'm disapointing my family to various degrees as well.

Interesting post. Obviously bright, but have you been assessed for adult attention deficit disorder, or bipolar/anxiety disorder NOS? No offense intended.

jsgoddess

03-09-2005, 09:52 PM

I think the problem is that when you are that smart, most normal work seems stupid and tedious.

In my experience, I'm harder to bore than pretty much anyone I know. My problem is more likely to be overfascination than boredom or tedium.

Tamryne

03-09-2005, 11:09 PM

I can kind of see myself in that article. I have never been exceptionally talented, but at my school in kindergarden they test everyone to see who should go into the gifted/talented classes, and I was one of four who got in, and the only girl.

Beyond that, I can pick up on things quickly, and I have been reading rather difficult books since I was able to get my hands onto them (I learned to read in less than a month).

But, I really am not phenomenally talented, and I really have not been teased or accepted into many talented summer camps. Mostly because I am not a good test taker, and rather poor, but I am graduating early, and could have graduated two years early if parents had let me :mad: .

And the college scholarships are rolling in!

Cunctator

03-10-2005, 04:55 AM

I think the problem is that when you are that smart, most normal work seems stupid and tedious. Not every math genius becomes John Nash. A lot end up working mundane (if high paying) jobs toing actuary stuff for an insurance company or building financial models for an investment bank. A lot of them just become bitter resentful hired brains that are put in a room and fed numbers to crunch. Or they approach any career much in the same way I might approch a summer job at McDonalds - a tedious chore working with mental inferiors that offers no challange or satisfaction.

Not only do people resent them, I think many of them simply just aren't interested in other people because they seem dull and uninteresting by comparison.

That sounds like a load of rubbish to me. I'm an actuary and my job involves far more than sitting in a room being "fed numbers to crunch". It's more than being highly numerate - you also have to be able to solve problems, assess risks and be able to explain complex concepts clearly to companies and clients (both orally and in writing).

BobNewby

03-10-2005, 05:16 AM

I think of myself as pretty average, although I started reading quite early.

Mississippienne

03-10-2005, 06:00 AM

I'm quite intelligent and have always tested with a high IQ. I remain unimpressed by this because I have no innate talents that I could develop with my intelligence. I'm not a musical genius. I'm not an incredible artist. I'm terrible at math. I'm not naturally creative or inventive. So what's the point of having above average intelligence if it doesn't do anything?

A friend of mine and I were talking about this one day; she's got a similar IQ to mine. We were talking about MENSA and how we both could qualify, but neither of us had ever joined. As she put it, "We'd be the dumbest smart people in the room." That's an over-simplification, but that's how we both felt. What would either of us bring to the party?

ninetypercent

03-10-2005, 02:43 PM

Eonwe

03-10-2005, 11:35 PM

Interesting post. Obviously bright, but have you been assessed for adult attention deficit disorder, or bipolar/anxiety disorder NOS? No offense intended.

No. I've thought about it. I went to a counselor about something moderately related to all this for a while at school (free service, grad student shrinks). It's, I don't know, even doing that in a constructive way was really hard. It ended up being a positive experience, but getting the gumption to go was really tough.

The idea of being diagnosed with adult add or another disorder is scary. The idea of taking medicine for it is scary. I know it's been great for many people, and I'm not making a judgment call about it, but... I don't know. What if I don't have it? Then I'm a fuck-up all on my own. What if I do? Do I really want to take medication? Will I lose some things about me that I like? None of the roads are easy, and at this point it's just mentally easier to be me and deal with what comes. Not that I'm always happy with it, but that's life I guess.

It's funny you mention anxiety though. A huge part of my struggles with school and other things involve being horribly petrified (literally) at the prospect of confrontation/failure. I had some times in school when I unplugged my phone, stayed in the room, even avoided e-mail because I'd missed few classes and/or assignments and just couldn't... I don't even know what I couldn't do, but the thought of interacting with the person I'd let down I couldn't deal with. I still have times like that now in non-school settings.

BobNewby

03-11-2005, 03:38 AM

Puzzles?

IQ tests can only tell us how stupid a person is. As soon as their score is no longer in the stupid range, the tests lose their utility. In other words, they're bullshit.

Strange how everyone on the Internet is a genius.That's the most intelligent thing anyone's said in this thread.

jsgoddess

03-11-2005, 07:57 AM

IQ tests can only tell us how stupid a person is. As soon as their score is no longer in the stupid range, the tests lose their utility. In other words, they're bullshit.

I agree with you. I have tested very high on IQ tests, but I am not remarkable in any way. I remember trivia and am extremely easy to amuse. These aren't signs of brilliance. I don't have overwhelming angst or fear of failure or anything. I'm just a person who tests high on IQ tests. (In the past, of course. I haven't had a real IQ test in... oh dear... 15 years.) I genuinely think an IQ test tests a person's ability to take an IQ test. And hwn I saw the scores I had throughout school, the really notable thing was that my IQ kept creeping up. I was learning how to take the tests.

Synthesis

03-11-2005, 08:13 AM

My daughter is gifted (but nothing like these kids) and I can confirm that exceptionally intelligent kids are very difficult to raise. When you child's intelligence exceeds your own, but they have normal and child-like emotional development, it creates a while slew of difficulties.

I sincerely hope that she can relate to and deal with people as an adult. Being smart isn't as important as being well grounded with strong intrapersonal relationship skills.

There is a novelty to a child like this. Yes, I initially enjoyed showing off her raw abilities (she could, for example, add 4 numbers with 5 digits in her head almost instantantly...at age 6) but that wears off quick and I realized it was a horrible thing to do.

Anyway...it can be a curse as well as a blessing. Even more so with REAL gifted kids like these.

taxi78cab

03-11-2005, 09:50 AM

I didn't relate to the article as much as I did to what other posters here said.

<snip>I also had much more satisfying and rewarding interactions with adults than peers for a long time. I just 'got' adults more than other kids. We could talk about real things, and they didn't feel the need to put me down or make fun of me. <snip>

That sounds so familiar. I didn't really feel comfortable with people my age until I was in high school and didn't feel that anyone "got" me until college. Unfortunately, just when I discovered other smart people, I also discovered much, much smarter people and had a hard time realizing that I wasn't the smartest. After being told practically from birth on up through high school that I was SO smart, it was a slap in the face to realize that I wasn't really that smart compared to all the other students.

I also relate to what lokij said about feeling like I'm wasting my potential. I like my job, but I'm not changing the world. And there are times when I hear the voices of all those people from high school days telling me what great things I could do and I feel bad that I'm not out there doing those great things. Despite the fact that doing those great things would make me miserable.

I'm just glad to hear others expressing similar feelings.

Synthesis

03-11-2005, 02:19 PM

"IQ tests can only tell us how stupid a person is. As soon as their score is no longer in the stupid range, the tests lose their utility. In other words, they're bullshit.

Strange how everyone on the Internet is a genius."

I just reread that. Great point.

People that are exceptional and extraordinary don't need a test to quantify what they have. There is a shock value to it and it is really clear to anyone around that the person is beyond "normal". It isn't a situation where someone says "They are really smart" but more like they are almost "freakish" in nature.

I think there are many very bright and genius level people in the world but I think this article is about people that fall outside of that realm.

From what I've seen, it isn't really so much an aura of intelligence but more of a raw ability to learn, understand and retain at a jawdropping rate with ease because the emotional and relational skills are not on par with the learning rate.