Where are MY leather seats?

[phall0106]

Okay, my boss, just bought a new car. A Cadillac. She gave me a ride last week to pick up some stuff related to work. It has leather seats and rides like a cloud of air. It has more buttons on the console than a space rocket. A Very Nice Car.

Our Director of Development, was talking to his wife on the phone. His office is next to mine, so I really can’t help but overhear his conversation. They’re buying a new car. A Honda. They just had a new baby six weeks ago. The wife is on maternity leave, and they have a four year old who attends The Goddard School preschool.

Today was payday. I paid off the electric company, and the cable company, and even paid off the phone company, who sent me a cut off notice the other day because I owed them two months worth of phone bills. For the big splurge, I bought tickets to a local performance for HallBoy and myself. We’re going on Friday evening, and we’re going with a friend and her son. I’ll show up in my ten year old Chevy, with 130,000+ miles on it. The very same one who shimmied suspiciously when I was sitting at a stop light this morning, and the same one who makes a knocking sound at the front brake when I apply the brake. I’m sure my friend will arrive on Friday in her Mercedes. It’s black and doesn’t shimmy at stop lights. I’ve ridden in it as well. It has leather seats and more buttons on the console than a space rocket.

I. Just. Don’t. Understand. I don’t understand why I seem to be destined to struggle from one financial crapfest to the next, and why some people seem to ride around in leather seats and a collection of buttons on consoles. Is it my karmic destiny to forever have only a few dollars in my pocket and never to consistently plant my ass on my own leather seats?

It's not like I'm pissing away money on fancy-schmancy crap we don't need. Okay, I did buy some fresh asparagus and out of season corn on the cob at the farmer's market last week. Why is it that I'm struggling from paycheck to paycheck, but it seems that everyone around me has money to spare?

[Mr. Moto]

So your boss and some other high mucketymuck at your place of employ have more money than you have?

I don't know what you're doing wrong that you're driving a old Chevy. I don't know if you're doing anything wrong, really. I just know that in my own old Chevy driving days (and I had a shitty old Cavalier) I didn't whine about my plight on a message board.

There are lots more important things in life than power windows, you know.

[Velma]

It is my experience that a lot of people are willing to take on a lot of debt. Especially when it comes to cars. You could probably get approved for a new car loan too.

Keep telling yourself "I choose not to buy a new car. I choose to spend my money on other things." That's what I tell myself, anyway. Sure I could take on a huge car payment but to me it seems like a waste. Cars depreciate very quickly, they are not an investment. We put a good chunk of money into our 401K every month. More than enough for a new car payment. Someday I will retire wealthy, woo-hoo!! (Just 38 more years to go...) But it is hard to do when we have to turn down other things we want now.

Sometimes I wonder how people can afford things and I can't, but it's really none of my business. But it's still frustrating to never seem to get ahead so I share your pain.

[Nutty Bunny]

I know where you're coming from. I see some of these beautiful houses and cars and wonder what the owners do for a living and how I can do that, too. They can't ALL be doctors, lawyers, etc. Can they?

My husband and I are in our 30s and make about 60k per year. He has a 5 year old Neon and I just traded in the 97 Corrolla for a 05 Hyundai Accent* (with a loan, of course). My first new car, but it had to be the bottom of the line model. I call it my clown car.

We also just got a loan for a $20K used mobile home because we can't afford $100 - $200K for an actual house. We want to have a baby, but I don't know where we're going to get a minimum of $600 per month for day care. Neither one of us can quit our jobs. We have maybe $7K in credit card debt--sizable, but not crippling.

So, when I see these families of 4, pulling out of their driveways in their SUVs, I'm puzzled. How do they do it and what am I doing wrong? It's very frustrating and I feel your pain.

*How sad is it that I consider it an accomplishment that I'm able to get a Hyundai Accent? :rolleyes:

[Lord Ashtar]

If nothing else, you probably own your car and they each owe approximately $45K on theirs. All things being equal, I'd rather own my car (sans leather seats and a bunch of useless buttons), which I do.

[Greenback]

Who says you're doing anything wrong? Sometimes life is just like that. I'd rather go fishing with my son than work late into the night in order to get the boss to recognize me. So we struggle a bit at times. All I ask for a car that gets me from point A to point B, a Pepsi every once in a while, good friends, loving family (um, reverse the order). Life is not defined by the toys you have because then Bill Gates wins hands down. I'm not conceding. I'm changing the definition of what constitutes winning :)

[Metacom]

I just know that in my own old Chevy driving days (and I had a shitty old Cavalier) I didn't whine about my plight on a message board.
Yeah!

Ya hear that, you stinking prole? Stop whining and fetch me a latte! Be back in 5 minutes or your family won't get that Rid I promised you for a bonus!










;)

[stpauler]

I just ran into some old friends this weekend. They had bought a house in a rather affluent suburb for a little over $300K. In the driveway sat a new Mercedes SUV and the BMW SUV was parked in the garage. I suggested heading out to eat when I was told "No, sorry, not in the budget, we've got $20 a week spending cash". Different priorities I guess, I'd rather live within my means and have more options.

[LionelHutz405]

Stop beating yourself up because you aren’t as rich as others appear to be. There will always be those with more money than you. That doesn’t mean you are doing anything wrong.

Also, some people inherit money. Even middle class parents can leave a hefty chunk of change to their kids if they owned a house, for example.

‘Winning’ is not owning a car with leather seats and a bunch of stupid buttons,

[Cheesesteak]

I. Just. Don’t. Understand. I don’t understand why I seem to be destined to struggle from one financial crapfest to the next, and why some people seem to ride around in leather seats and a collection of buttons on consoles. Is it my karmic destiny to forever have only a few dollars in my pocket and never to consistently plant my ass on my own leather seats?Apparently the problem is that you don't understand what it takes (or are unwilling/unable to do what it takes) to get a high(er) paying job. If you want the leather seats and fancy house and expensive toys, you need to earn the money to pay for it, or live a life of crushing debt.

Are you willing to do what it takes to get that higher paying job? Some of us (me, for example) are not going for maximum dollars, and trade off some life value for dollar value. A friend of mine is making rather more than me, but busting ass, 12 hour days, long business trips (Australia anyone?) the works.

I'm no Charlie Church, but not coveting your neighbor's goods is sound advice. Worry about your own home, your own goods, your own finances, don't worry about keeping up with the Joneses.

[phall0106]

I do have the "high paying job"--as high as I can go with the degree I have, in the field I'm in. Yep, maybe my mistake was getting a degree that wasn't related to medicine or law. Next time, I'll be sure to do something that'll rake in the dough instead of something that I'm truly good at, and that satisfies something inside of me.

I've also supported myself and my three kids without the benefit of child support, or a spouse who pulls in an equal to mine salary. I also put myself through college, and now have an ass load of school loan debt that I'm repaying (and not shirking the responsibility of that).

This wasn't a fucking whine about leather seats--simply another example about the damn differences of being in a similiar set of working conditions to my "neighbors" but not being able to keep up with the Joneses. yeah, I know the overwhelming debt load some of these neighbors must have--a Caddy doesn't come without a boatload of debt--but while I'm busting my ass to go from paycheck to paycheck because I'm not mortaged up to my ass (other than school loans), everyone around me (or so it seems) is rolling in the dough with little or any ill effects of doing so.

It's not necessarily a situation of "coveting my neighbors goods" as it is an envy of sorts of their ability to pull off the appearance of having it "all" (whatever in the hell that is). I guess what I'd really like is the ability not to break out into a cold sweat when my car makes a funny noise, or friends are making plans to get together and I have to use the "it's not in the budget this time around" line, or shop at a consignment store (or the Salvation Army Thrift Store) for my clothes and the kids clothing. I'd really like the ability to hold off buying groceries, or paying the gas bill, or even buying a candy bar from the neighborhood kid selling them for band because it's not payday yet.

[Bricker]

It's not always true that nice cars mean a crushing burden of debt.

I bought my BMW 328i in 1996 for cash.

How?

Because I bought my last new car, a 1987 Nissan Sentra. And I paid it off. And after I paid it off, I kept making "car payments," every month, into a savings account that was set up especially for that purpose. I kept that Nissan Sentra for nine, almost ten years. And every month I had it, I made a car "payment" -- most of them to me. Instead of paying someone else interest, I made interest on the money I was paying month after month.

IN 1996, I was able to walk into a BMW dealership and pay cash for a very nice car.

And I'm still making my car payments.

[Katriona]

Why is it that I'm struggling from paycheck to paycheck, but it seems that everyone around me has money to spare?

The key word is probably 'seems.' Like noted above, they're probably in debt to the eyeballs, or they could be skimping elsewhere, where nobody but they will see it.

For example, my brother is a cop in a suburb here generally noted for its 'old money' reputation. Most of the houses are wired so that when the security system is tripped, the PD gets called to check it out. He tells me that he's been to several that have little more than a TV and a mattress inside - like the people wanted the 'right' address, but once they bought the Big House, they couldn't afford to do anything with it.

[HeadNinja]

You can have leather seats! All you need is a Chevy.

Take the Chevy onto the highway.

Look for dead deer. In Ohio you'll find one every couple miles.

Smell the deer. If its fresh it should smell like nature. Throw it in the trunk.

If it smells not so fresh then drive on. There is no shortage.

Skin all the fresh deer. While some people like to use a vegetable peeler for this job I generally go with a knife. If cash is tight pick up some pieces of flint and bank them against the bumper. Sharp edges galore!

Stretch the skin out on the roof of your car. Pin the leggy bits with Duct tape. This starts the "tanning" process. I usually use Coppertone for deer, generally an spf of 15, because I don't want it to burn.

Eat a light dish of vension and leeks, with faint hints of radiator fluid.

Drive around for a week or so of sunny days.

Brush off Maggots - This step is important.

Using Duct tape, attach your new fine leather covers to your old vinyl seat. Note that it is also reversible. You could easily have a fur seat!

Repeat process for each seat.

----------

The appearance of wealth is easy to attain with a good credit record. The reality of wealth is that for most people it takes time, effort, and prioritization. Heck, having a "middle class" life is a tricky without a good support system. Teach your kids how to play big ticket sports and wait for the endorsement deals. Worked for Wilma McNabb.

[tremorviolet]

It's not necessarily a situation of "coveting my neighbors goods" as it is an envy of sorts of their ability to pull off the appearance of having it "all" (whatever in the hell that is). I guess what I'd really like is the ability not to break out into a cold sweat when my car makes a funny noise, or friends are making plans to get together and I have to use the "it's not in the budget this time around" line, or shop at a consignment store (or the Salvation Army Thrift Store) for my clothes and the kids clothing. I'd really like the ability to hold off buying groceries, or paying the gas bill, or even buying a candy bar from the neighborhood kid selling them for band because it's not payday yet.

Yeah, I get that way too. (FWIW, my car is seventeen years old and has 165,000 miles on it) I'm making more money than I ever have before and I know it's more money than some of my friends yet I have trouble keeping up with the cable bill. It's not like I'm super extravagent either, I shop at Target for clothes. Yet my friends have new cars and are buying houses on less than me. I just have to keep telling myself that I'll be completely out of debt by January (crossed fingers)...

[Anne Neville]

I feel the way the OP does toward people here in the Bay Area who own nice homes.

The key word is probably 'seems.' Like noted above, they're probably in debt to the eyeballs, or they could be skimping elsewhere, where nobody but they will see it.

Yeah, and if anything unexpected happened- say if they lost their jobs, or their car was totaled- they'd probably be in trouble.

My car has no leather seats or extra buttons, but I was able to write a check to pay for it instead of getting a car loan. Felt pretty good to tell my insurance agent that there was no lender, and feels pretty good to not have to make car payments every month.

[Tenar]

I am (horrors!) 43 years old. Although I am steadily and gainfully employed, and I do my best, to say that I am an underachiever would be putting it mildly. I wouldn't even know "the Joneses" if I tripped over them. However, I am not being raped by some adolescent "soldier" in an fight between African warlords. I am not mourning my dead in Indonesia. I am not dying of AIDS in South Africa. I am not starving in any of a number of countries. I am not living in any one of a hundred thousand nightmare scenarios all over the globe that beat the shit out of driving an old car and scraping by with the creditors.

We are all entitled to our moments of resentment and frustration. I have certainly felt pretty frustrated with my lot at times. I have never been much for being grateful for what I have. But at least I have learned how to be grateful, at least some of the time, for what I do not have.

Hope things go better for you soon. :cool:

[gwendee]

I've put the phone company's check in the electric company's envelope "by accident" a time or two. It seems that whenever I think the ends are going to meet in a given month I'll suddenly need a car repair or expensive dental work.

I don't want to say "I know just how you feel" because I'm not sure that I do. Often I do wonder when I might have a month or two go by when I can write the rent check and buy groceries in the very same week. I'm grateful to say that I've always had everything that I need . Once in a while I'd like to buy a book or CD without mentally calculating my bank balance and the possible consequences.

For whatever it's worth, I did not learn one single thing about finances as I was growing up. My twenties came and went without a thought about saving for retirement or anything else. Now I'm closer to 40 than 30 and still don't have a savings account. I think more of this information should be taught to high schoolers (that and "When Citibank offers to send you a credit card with a $1000 limit throw the letter away!")

In a few weeks, when you can still fill your tank for under $30.00 you'll be very glad not to have a Cadillac.

[Gorsnak]

In 1996, I was able to walk into a BMW dealership and pay cash for a very nice car.

And I'm still making my car payments.
Sheesh, I knew Beemers had a reputation for being in the shop all the time, but that you'd actually have to pay for repairs by installment? Awful, just awful. ;)

[Anne Neville]

In a few weeks, when you can still fill your tank for under $30.00 you'll be very glad not to have a Cadillac.

Oh yes, that's another thing I love about my Honda Civic. I can still fill up for less than $20, and only have to fill up once a week most weeks. I don't expect the "less than $20" thing to last much longer, though.

[galt]

Stop beating yourself up because you aren’t as rich as others appear to be.This is a wonderful sentiment, and the difference between "as rich as others are" and "as rich as others appear to be" is definitely significant, as others have pointed out.

I am not a rich person. I make enough money to get by without worrying about being able to pay my bills, but I do so partially because I have very little interest in owning things that make me appear wealthy. I drive a 10-year-old Ford Ranger (cloth seats!) and I live in a neighborhood that's known to be "affordable." I use coupons at restaurants. etc. That, and when I have been in debt, I've made a concerted effort to slowly and steadily get out of debt.

On the other hand, I have friends who I know cannot afford their $700/month car payments and are never going to get anywhere because they are compelled to buy flashy things in order to appear successful. They do manage to fool people who don't know them, but it doesn't make them feel any better, because they know they're faking it.

[chaparralv8]

I know where you're coming from. I see some of these beautiful houses and cars and wonder what the owners do for a living and how I can do that, too. They can't ALL be doctors, lawyers, etc. Can they?

My husband and I are in our 30s and make about 60k per year. He has a 5 year old Neon and I just traded in the 97 Corrolla for a 05 Hyundai Accent* (with a loan, of course). My first new car, but it had to be the bottom of the line model. I call it my clown car.

We also just got a loan for a $20K used mobile home because we can't afford $100 - $200K for an actual house. We want to have a baby, but I don't know where we're going to get a minimum of $600 per month for day care. Neither one of us can quit our jobs. We have maybe $7K in credit card debt--sizable, but not crippling.

So, when I see these families of 4, pulling out of their driveways in their SUVs, I'm puzzled. How do they do it and what am I doing wrong? It's very frustrating and I feel your pain.

*How sad is it that I consider it an accomplishment that I'm able to get a Hyundai Accent? :rolleyes:


DINK, 45k post-tax, and struggling? You have an $400/month house on a $200/month lot, barely $200/month in bills in the warm months, and a $300/month car loan - your fixed expenses add up to under 25% of your post-tax income. Where's the big sucking sound? Do you spend $500 every weekend for a night on the town? Do you gamble? Snort cocaine?

[gravitycrash]

Am I the only person who prefers cloth over leather seats? And yes, I know the difference between faux leather and real leather.

To the op, my younger brother and sister in law have a house in the 350k range and one bmw m3 and a full size conversion van so that they are able to pull their 24' cobalt ski/cruise boat. :rolleyes: The van is fully loaded including a dvd player with dual lcd screens for the backseat so their kids won't get bored.

They also have over 50k in credit card debt and I've never seen him so unhappy. My younger brother is also losing his hair and going grey at a rapid rate.

Sometimes the simple things are best.

[velveeta]

For example, my brother is a cop in a suburb here generally noted for its 'old money' reputation. Most of the houses are wired so that when the security system is tripped, the PD gets called to check it out. He tells me that he's been to several that have little more than a TV and a mattress inside - like the people wanted the 'right' address, but once they bought the Big House, they couldn't afford to do anything with it.

I've been in one of these. Huge 7,000 sq ft "McMansion" on 3 acres. Inside, the mattresses were on the floor, no furniture, no blinds and the only TV was so old it had dials and no remote. There's another one in my neighborhood that's the same deal, but they have 2 brand new BMWs in the garage - a X3 and a 645. That's over $100,000 worth of new cars - except it's not really since they depreciate so fast.
It's none of my business what they do with their money, but I wouldn't want to live like that. I do find it funny when I get condescending comments about how I'm only 33 and one day "you'll have this too." Even more humorous when you consider that we live in what I like to call a yuppie tract house - it's a cookie cutter development where all the houses look the same. So they have no idea what I make or what I have (I have blinds!), but I must be desperately unhappy to not have 2 expensive foreign cars parked in my driveway. I just smile and think of the $120,000 I have in the bank instead.

[BrotherCadfael]

I'd no sooner want leather seats than I'd want vinyl. Too hot and sticky in the summer...

[velveeta]

And for the record, my Jeep's seats are made of wetsuit material. :D

[phall0106]

I'd no sooner want leather seats than I'd want vinyl. Too hot and sticky in the summer...

Yes, I agree. And, in all honesty, I don’t like leather seats in cars. They’re hard and uncomfortable to sit upon, cold in the winter and hot in the summer. If you’re wearing something that’s anything other than…well, Velcro… and you brake, you can feel the pull on the seatbelt when your body slides forward against the seat. And god knows there’s no way I would ever be comfortable taking on a $400 (or more!) a month car payment, plus the cost of full insurance for a vehicle with a loan attached to it (the benefit of having no car loan is a relative small car insurance payment each month). However, I’d at least like to have the option of saying, “No, I don’t believe I’d like to have leather seats” because I don’t like leather seats, rather than because there’s no way in hell I can afford to have them.

[Nutty Bunny]

DINK, 45k post-tax, and struggling? You have an $400/month house on a $200/month lot, barely $200/month in bills in the warm months, and a $300/month car loan - your fixed expenses add up to under 25% of your post-tax income. Where's the big sucking sound? Do you spend $500 every weekend for a night on the town? Do you gamble? Snort cocaine?

That's what I'd like to know. On paper, we look great. We do have about $500 in student loan/credit card debt and I'll admit that we're doing better than we ever have and I'm glad to have a place that we will own in 10 years and two cars that were made in the last 5 years. We have the "luxury" of being able to buy a CD or a book and go out to dinner (chain only), but we buy our clothes at Target. We're not overly spendthrifty.

I guess what I'm getting at is that I don't see how people who have a $800+ mortgage, child care and related baby expenses have any sort of life whatsoever. I don't want or need a $300K house or leather seats, but I'd like to have a baby AND a little peace of mind that I'll be able to pay for it.

[OpalCat]

[semi-related tangent]Eh, I think leather seats are disgusting. I don't want to sit on someone else's dead skin, thanks. But besides that, they smell so gross! And they're nearly as uncomfortable as vinyl. I don't get why they're so popular. Give me comfy cloth upholstery any day, thanks.

[PunditLisa]

[semi-related tangent]Eh, I think leather seats are disgusting. I don't want to sit on someone else's dead skin, thanks. But besides that, they smell so gross! And they're nearly as uncomfortable as vinyl. I don't get why they're so popular. Give me comfy cloth upholstery any day, thanks.

We paid to get (after market) leather seats installed in our Sienna because we have two kids and a dog. It's much easier to wipe up ketchup and vacuum out dog hair on leather than on cloth. My neighbors got a new car about the same time we got ours but she got cloth upholstery. She called to inquire about the cost for converting to leather because the pretty tan upholstery already has several stains that she can't get out.

[chaparralv8]

That's what I'd like to know. On paper, we look great. We do have about $500 in student loan/credit card debt and I'll admit that we're doing better than we ever have and I'm glad to have a place that we will own in 10 years and two cars that were made in the last 5 years. We have the "luxury" of being able to buy a CD or a book and go out to dinner (chain only), but we buy our clothes at Target. We're not overly spendthrifty.

I guess what I'm getting at is that I don't see how people who have a $800+ mortgage, child care and related baby expenses have any sort of life whatsoever. I don't want or need a $300K house or leather seats, but I'd like to have a baby AND a little peace of mind that I'll be able to pay for it.

Well, if you own your home outright within 10 years it'll all be worth it... see if you can pay an extra Bennie a month on this.

[PunditLisa]

Re the OP:

It's not necessarily a situation of "coveting my neighbors goods" as it is an envy of sorts of their ability to pull off the appearance of having it "all" (whatever in the hell that is). I guess what I'd really like is the ability not to break out into a cold sweat when my car makes a funny noise, or friends are making plans to get together and I have to use the "it's not in the budget this time around" line, or shop at a consignment store (or the Salvation Army Thrift Store) for my clothes and the kids clothing. I'd really like the ability to hold off buying groceries, or paying the gas bill, or even buying a candy bar from the neighborhood kid selling them for band because it's not payday yet.

One day you'll realize that it's the struggle that you went through that made your kids the incredible people they are. A lot of children today grow up without struggle because their misguided parents think that it's best to shelter their kids from all pain. It is to their detriment. Kids SHOULD hear the words "It's not in our budget." They SHOULD know the humility of walking around in second hand clothing. They SHOULD hear their mother crying over how she is going to pay the bills and then watch her get up the next day and carry on. Yes, it's cliche, but being poor (relatively speaking) will build their character in ways that a new SUV with a built in DVD player will NEVER do.

You don't realize it yet because you're still in the thick of it, but sharing these struggles together has bonded you in a way that "rich" people can never duplicate.

[Angel of the Lord]

This is something that's been happening a bit with my husband and I lately.

Between the taxes. homeowner's insurance, PMI, and actual mortgage, we have quite the monthly housing payment. (The actual principal & interest is only 587 or something a month. . .the payment is something like 930, because we pay the taxes and stuff with the payment). We make about 50K a year. It's tighter than what we were paying before (400/mo in rent for a small house), but we thought it was worth it. Having a newer, larger house* is something that greatly improves our quality of life; before, we lived in a tiny two-bedroom one-story bungalow, and the lack of space drove us NUTS. We both, however, drive cars with over 100K miles on them.

In contrast, we have a couple that we're friends with who also make approximately 50K. They both have brand-spanking new Honda Civics with all the snazzy little features, 18K apiece; they also go out to eat at expensive restaurants and the like. . .and live at home with their respective parents. With what I'm making, were I living at home rent-free, I could easily afford to buy a nice, shiny new car. I'd rather live on my own. It's a matter of priorities.

*the house is NOT a McMansion. It's not that big, and it was built back in 1985. It's a nice tri-level with a two car garage, 3 bedrooms, a living room, a family room, 1 3/4 baths, and a kitchen/dining room combo. We paid about 100K for it. Just in case anyone gets the wrong idea.

[belladonna]

I guess what I'm getting at is that I don't see how people who have a $800+ mortgage, child care and related baby expenses have any sort of life whatsoever.
Well, unless they're making a large amount of money they probably don't have much of a life--unless they're maxxing out credit lines left and right. But that's okay, really. Once a baby comes you don't have much time for a "life" as you know it now anyway. Something as simple as a walk in the park can easily become the day's entertainment.

As to the OP--I feel you. I'm also a solo mom, struggling to raise two babies on one income. Seeing 1/2 or more of your pay go straight into daycare can be frustrating, to say the least. On top of that, I don't know anyone else my age with kids yet, so all of my peers are still running around with ridiculous amounts of disposable income, new toys, fancy clothes, etc. A discrepancy like that puts a pretty big strain on a friendship, and I'm sorry to say most have not held up.

But I just remind myself that I've made the choices that brought me here, and
I've got everything I need even though I might not have everything that I want. Kids grow, financial burdens shrink, and I've got plenty of time to chase the almighty dollar later if the mood strikes me. For now, I'm happy focusing on enjoying what I have, even if that is a 15 year old car and a 100 year old house.

[Nutty Bunny]

Well, if you own your home outright within 10 years it'll all be worth it... see if you can pay an extra Bennie a month on this.

That's the plan, once we do all the work on it that we've planned and purchased a few appliances. A few of the ones we have are gasping for breath as we speak.

It's nice to be paying almost $200 less than we were in rent so we can put it to good use on our own home. Like I said, we're better off now than we ever have been and as long as I stop comparing myself to others who seem to have more, everything will be fine.

Now to find money for child care. Now that I think about it, my husband and I decided that we're ready for a baby to be our "lives" anyway. At 34, we'd better get crackin'! ;)

[OpalCat]

"$800+ mortgage" I was reading as a mortgage for over $800,000 total. Not a monthly $800 payment... is that what was meant? That's not that big... in fact that's not really possible in a lot of areas of the country without putting down a massive downpayment. We bought our townhouse (northern VA) four years ago and our mortgage payment was $1600/month. We refinanced two years ago and it's down to $1350... which is still pretty typical for the area. If we had bought a "real house" we'd have been paying much more than that. For three years before we bought that townhouse we rented a really run-down townhouse for $1250/month.

I am glad I don't live in an area with that high of housing costs anymore...

[Mr. Goob]

I wonder about the quality of life vs. the stress. My best friend and his wife combinded make 3x as much as I do. They live paycheck to paycheck and have lots of toys and shiney gizmos with buttons and knobs and dials. The bicker about money all the time.

I have some toys with the buttons and knobs and dials of my own. They aren't all the newest or bestest and fastest with the mostest. They are however all paid for.

Some wants haven't migrated into being needs for me. Like a cell phone, digital camera or a newer computer that's from 1997 (still running Windows 95.) My in debt friends have several of each of these examples.

It's their money to spend as they wish, don't dare complain to me about being broke. I made that clear a long time ago. In return I don't whine (much) about what I'd like to have and refuse to run up a credit card to buy it.

One upside is he lets me play with his toys sometimes.

[Neurotik]

(The actual principal & interest is only 587 or something a month. . .the payment is something like 930, because we pay the taxes and stuff with the payment).
That's less than what I pay on just my monthly rent for a studio in Woodley Park.

[Chefguy]

I heard on a news program the other night that the average American retires with about $35,000 in cash savings in the bank. A scary thought, if ever there was one.

Would you rather have the transitory luxury of a Caddy, a cabin on a lake, four snowmachines, two motorcycles, a small plane, a couple of four-wheelers, a giant flat-screen TV, and an 8,000 sq.ft. home with the accompanying staggering debt load, or live a good retirement free from debt and worry? Put your extra money in a savings instrument and let the suckers pay some CEO's salary.

My wife and I paid taxes on about $200K last year. I drive a Honda and live in a condo. Having some money and not spending it foolishly don't usually go together. At the moment, I'm going on six months unemployed. Am I glad I didn't run out a buy a Lexus? Word!

[LordVor]

Between the taxes. homeowner's insurance, PMI, and actual mortgage, we have quite the monthly housing payment.

[unsolicited financial advice]
I really don't believe in PMI. In almost all cases, you can take out a home equity loan
to cover the difference between what your mortage balance is and the 80% equity value you need to not need PMI. So you take out the home equity loan, pay down the mortage balance by the same amount, and then pay the home equity loan payment instead of the PMI payment, which is usually about the same monetary expense, with two important differences:

1) The home equity loan payment actually goes towards your home equity, where PMI vanishes into the bank's pockets.
2) The interest you pay on the home equity loan is almost always tax deductible.

Sometimes, when you have a person who makes the same as you but who seems to be able to have more/better stuff, it actually is because they're doing a bunch of seemingly little things like this that actually does give them more spendable money than you.
[/unsolicited financial advice]

[Angel of the Lord]

[unsolicited financial advice]
I really don't believe in PMI. In almost all cases, you can take out a home equity loan
to cover the difference between what your mortage balance is and the 80% equity value you need to not need PMI. So you take out the home equity loan, pay down the mortage balance by the same amount, and then pay the home equity loan payment instead of the PMI payment, which is usually about the same monetary expense, with two important differences:

1) The home equity loan payment actually goes towards your home equity, where PMI vanishes into the bank's pockets.
2) The interest you pay on the home equity loan is almost always tax deductible.

Sometimes, when you have a person who makes the same as you but who seems to be able to have more/better stuff, it actually is because they're doing a bunch of seemingly little things like this that actually does give them more spendable money than you.
[/unsolicited financial advice]

In our case, we actually paid quite a bit less than what the home's worth; we bought it HUD, and the other homes in the area are selling for about 15-20K more than what we paid (we lucked out and saw this the day it was listed, which was the day after Thanksgiving, so there weren't a whole lot of other people looking). The area's growing, too, as more people move out of the city, and we have easy access to the main bypass through the city--we're pretty sure that this area's going to appreciate at a fairly good rate. We've also put some work into it, too. Most if it's cosmetic stuff (painting and such), but we're also going to change out some of the original cabinets. We're pretty sure that, in a year or so, we can get the house re-appraised and eliminate the PMI.

The only 80/20 mortgage that the company I work for (and therefore financed with) had offered a choice between a higher fixed rate or a variable rate. We didn't want to go with variable, and our monthly payment would've been a little more with the higher fixed rate than it would with the PMI, and--as we locked in our rates back in December--we didn't want to go variable, for good reason.

But we *did* almost go with an 80/20, so that's pretty good advice :).