Watch as I throw the neighbor's dog into the pit

[Spongemom]

I have semi-nice neighbors. What I mean by that is when I wave at them in passing, they'll keep their middle fingers to themselves. I'm pretty sure the reason they dislike me is because I dislike their dog. And by dislike, I mean boil with hatred. Perhaps I'm being rash, perhaps it isn't all the dog's fault...after all, it is in a Rottweiler's natural instincts to eat his neighbor's cats. Which brings me to my point. I started out with 7 cats. One belongs to my gramma (one we still have), one was mine, and 5 were mine's kittens. One kitten died the morning after birth, ok, I dealt with that. One was stepped on, got its jaw broken and we didn't know it, and it ended up starving to death because we found out too late and nothing could be done. I cried, I had a funeral, I moved on.

Now we're down to 5 cats. I hear a commotion in the neighbor's backyard one day, I step out my backdoor, and see them pulling their dog off of one of my cats. Sandy. She was lying on the ground, no blood, so the thing I was most worried about was her incision (she had been spayed less than a week before this). I jumped the fence, picked her up, took her in the house, layed her on a towel on the table, and proceeded to check her out. As I expected, her incision was wide open. I attempted to clean it out with peroxide when I noticed that there were more holes. The placement of the holes meant she didn't bleed hardly at all, but I knew then that she was done for, as it was around 7 pm, two hours after the vet had closed. I wrapped her in the towel and held her to my chest, and she died not five minutes later. Another funeral.

Down to four. My gramma comes back to my room a few weeks after Sandy's incident, and tells me I need to rush Patrick to the vet, he's on the front porch. I go to the front porch, and I see him lying there, not moving, barely breathing, and it's apparent by his face that he's in shock. He's covered in dog slobber from guess who. I wrap him in a towel, drive 50 mph down first street to the vet, Doc takes him back and tells me he'll call with any information, and does everything he can to save my cat. I get a call an hour later, Patrick never came out of shock, and his internal injuries would have killed him anyway. Another funeral.

Three left. My gramma's cat, my cat, and one of my cat's babies. This one happened a little over two weeks ago, on May 9th. (The others were in Feburary '04) I'm standing in the backyard talking to my cousin, when I happen to glance over into the neighbor's back yard. I see my favorite cat, my momma cat, on the ground, broken and bloody. I'm freaking out now, you could hear me wailing down the block, I'm sure. I go over there and get my cat, and she's already getting stiff. I carry her to my own backyard, find a box for her, and go in to change my shirt so I can wrap her for burial in the one I was wearing when I picked her up. Another funeral, this one the worst. I loved that cat, she used to crawl under the covers with me at night. Not anymore.

Now all I have left is one of my cat's daughters, and my gramma's cat. Did you know I've never had the same cat for more than two years?!? Dogs always fucking eat them. Even when I was little, a dog ate my cat. I've decided that I'm not getting any more animals, I'll just enjoy everyone else's.

Someone is going to pay. I'm either letting the dog loose for the dog catcher (which I doubt I'll do, since it's not really the dog's fault, I know, the whole instinct thing), or I'm going to torment my neighbor's for the rest of the time they live there. They moved here from some other state, I can't remember where, and they have that "we're from _____ so that makes us better than you" attitude. I have plenty of friends who would egg their house for ten bucks.

So, there's my first pitting. I feel better now. Well, not really, but still.

Oh, I do have one last photo of my cat, one that I took the day after she died. Before you go accusing me of being some kind of beastiality/necro freak, have a look: http://img268.echo.cx/img268/3170/10001552xq.jpg I believe that's her, right there above the dumpster, in the neighbor's yard. If you don't think it is, please, leave me alone in my beliefs. I need this.

[FinnAgain]

I grok just how painful this must be for you, and I really am sorry for your loss... but for the love of mercy, if you're letting your cats go outdoors you need to stop.

[Spongemom]

Oh, believe me, the two we have left don't get to go outside at all, no matter how badly they want to (and trust me, they really want to). It's a bitch keeping their sneaky asses inside, but I can't handle another one dying. I have four graves behind the garage already.

[Elenfair]

I'm really sorry for your loss. It sounds like your neighbours' dog has a pretty strong prey drive and is not often supervised. Have you spoken to them about this?

I advise against turning the dog loose. First off, if it's in any way aggressive, it could turn against you. Secondly, it could run off and take down a neighbourhood child, and that'd be awful...

You may want to contemplate keeping your cats indoors - for their own safety - at least for now... :(

[Spongemom]

I'm really sorry for your loss. It sounds like your neighbours' dog has a pretty strong prey drive and is not often supervised. Have you spoken to them about this?

I advise against turning the dog loose. First off, if it's in any way aggressive, it could turn against you. Secondly, it could run off and take down a neighbourhood child, and that'd be awful...

You may want to contemplate keeping your cats indoors - for their own safety - at least for now... :(
They don't give a shit. They're pissed off at me for being pissed off at their dog, because my cats got in their yard. They say it's my fault. They never even had the decency to say "I'm sorry about your cat" for any of them.

That dog wouldn't turn against me, I'm sure of that, but I don't know about him and small children. That's why I'm not letting him out. I'll find another way to exact justice.

See my last post about keeping them inside. It's tricky, but so far I've been lucky.

[FinnAgain]

Yeah... I know how cats can be. Hopefully you can keep them indoors despite their tricks. Have you spoken to your neighbors yet? Maybe they'd be willing to keep their dog on a dog run or something?

[FinnAgain]

Shit... simupost. Your neighbors sound like real assholes. You might want to investigate civil court as an option. Maybe that'd put the fear of Bast in those fuckers.

[Spongemom]

Yeah... I know how cats can be. Hopefully you can keep them indoors despite their tricks. Have you spoken to your neighbors yet? Maybe they'd be willing to keep their dog on a dog run or something?
Their dog is their baby. They're still pissed off at me for my cats getting in their yard. My being mad at them makes them mad at me. Go figure. They aren't going to do a damn thing, and they've made that perfectly clear.

[Spongemom]

Shit... simupost. Your neighbors sound like real assholes. You might want to investigate civil court as an option. Maybe that'd put the fear of Bast in those fuckers.
Won't work, my cats got in their yard, nothing I can do.

[FinnAgain]

That's my thought too, but it couldn't hurt to speak to a lawyer, preferably a vicious lawyer. It seems to me that if you had a child who'd gotten into their yard it'd still be their responsibility to keep their dog 'on a leash', so to speak. I mean... IANAL but I know that a swimming pool is considered an 'attractive nusiance'. At the very least, maybe if you threaten legal action your neighbors might do something.

That or you could always sic a wolverine on their dog...

[Spongemom]

I could never afford a lawyer, and that would just tempt them to let their dog in my window or something.

[FinnAgain]

Damn... well, then I guess all I can really say is that I understand that pets are members of the family, and I know how rough it is to see one of them die in the best of circumstances, let alone in pain.

I'm sorry you can't do anything about your neighbors... maybe a wolverine will just happen to wander through their yard.

[Spongemom]

One can only hope.

[fiztig]

They don't give a shit. They're pissed off at me for being pissed off at their dog, because my cats got in their yard. They say it's my fault. They never even had the decency to say "I'm sorry about your cat" for any of them.

<snip>
For the love of Christ keep your cats inside. And I'm sorry to say it during a time when you're feeling down, but it is your fault - you're the one who let the cats get outside. Remember, from your neighbour's perspective they've had a string of dead cats in their yard, all killed by their dog, which I know I would have found very distressing if I were them.

I'm sorry your cats died. Keep them inside.

[pendgwen]

I love cats and I know how much it hurts to lose a beloved pet but I don't see how your neighbors are in the wrong here. Are you suggesting that in order to make sure your cats are safe they shouldn't let their dog out in their own backyard?

[Spongemom]

I've already said that I intend to keep them inside for the rest of their lives, or the dog's life, whichever comes first. I can't take any more of this. They're miserable, but I don't care, at least they're alive.

[Spongemom]

I love cats and I know how much it hurts to lose a beloved pet but I don't see how your neighbors are in the wrong here. Are you suggesting that in order to make sure your cats are safe they shouldn't let their dog out in their own backyard?
I know they're not in the wrong, legally anyway. What really pisses me off is the way they think they're too good to apologize for something their dog did.

[Martin Hyde]

This is a sad lesson you should have learned a long time ago. Cats just aren't meant to be outside pets. Sure, they're outside in nature, but modern America has nothing in common with their natural habitat. There's lots of dogs, cars, and packs of feral cats out there that will make mince meat of a house cat pretty quickly.

I'm not so insane about the cats-->indoors thing that I start shrieking about it like many people, but I'll advise anyone I know to keep their cats indoors at all times (don't let them get in the habit of going out, its one they will never get out of) or tell them it's their own fault when their cat which could live 15-17 years dies after 2-3.

Anyways, I won't pile on here as you've been told all this enough times.

And in no way was this incident the dog owner's fault. Dogs are supposed to be territorial and the cat got in the dog's territory, bad result when the dog is a rottweiler. I'm almost too nice to people sometimes so if I was them I'd probably say, "sorry about you cat, keep them inside, or at least make sure they don't go in my yard, my dog kills cats that are in my yard."

But I certainly wouldn't be obligated to do that.

[calm kiwi]

This is a sad lesson you should have learned a long time ago. Cats just aren't meant to be outside pets.

Bollocks! I am willing to be proven wrong but I THINK that the US is the only place with predominatly inside cats.


Sure, they're outside in nature, but modern America has nothing in common with their natural habitat. There's lots of dogs, cars, and packs of feral cats out there that will make mince meat of a house cat pretty quickly.

There are cars and dogs everywhere. Feral cats? Yep probably.


I'm not so insane about the cats-->indoors thing that I start shrieking about it like many people, but I'll advise anyone I know to keep their cats indoors at all times (don't let them get in the habit of going out, its one they will never get out of) or tell them it's their own fault when their cat which could live 15-17 years dies after 2-3.


We have never had a cat live less then 19 yrs. The current cat was born in '88.

It MAY best in your area to keep a cat inside....it is not a universal truth. Cats ARE NOT inside animals, well not until we make them be. Cats are hardy creatures, maybe that is why the Eygptians saw them as (outside) gods.


I never heard of a dog killing a cat in my neighbourhood....maybe they are all too PC here. :D

Just my experience of course.............I shall tell the cat to avoid dogs tomorrow (shit she is 18, teenagers never listen).

[Contrapuntal]

They don't give a shit. They're pissed off at me for being pissed off at their dog, because my cats got in their yard. They say it's my fault. It is your fault, plain and simple. After the first cat died you had fair warning that their dog would do this. Their dog is surrounded by a fence. Your animals were on their property. Repeatedly. And you have the gall to threaten them and their dog? I am sorry about your cats but you have no one to blame but yourself. What would you have them do? Check with you every time they let their dog out? You really need to be pitting yourself for being an irresponsible pet owner. Here's a hint. If you don't know where your animal is you are doing something wrong.

[calm kiwi]

.

I shall tell the cat to avoid dogs tomorrow (shit she is 18, teenagers never listen).


Ooops my maths is crap! :)

[Queen Bruin]

Spongemom I'm so sorry to hear about your cats. To offer a possible compromise, perhaps you could look into a Kittywalk (http://www.catsplay.com/kittywalk.php3) system. Or do like I am this summer, I am screening my (very small) porch for my three cats.

I'm so sorry you had to deal with something like that. Watching any creature in pain tears me up. And I've had to see it more than I would like.

[pullin]

Y'know. Civil action might be more effective than you think. (1) The dog is a Rotty. (2) It is vicious. (3) Homeowner's liability policies take a dim view of (1) & (2) above.

Insurance Dopers...? I. Montoya..? care to comment?

Just a thought.


(I think Montoya's in the insurance biz. Apologies if I'm mistaken)

[Trunk]

And in no way was this incident the dog owner's fault.

You must have missed where spongemom clearly indicated the reason they're not apologizing is because they think they're too good for that.

They're from a state where the people think they're too good to apologize.


:rolleyes:

[Cheesesteak]

I get it now, this is a parody pitting. Spongemom is the one with the dog, and she's cleverly pitting her unreasonable neighbor.

Right?

pullin, generally we only care if the dog is vicious towards people, not towards smaller, invading animals in it's territory. My cats gleefully kill mice in my apartment, are they "vicious" as well? You also forget #2a, where the dog is securely fenced in at all times. Spongemom does not have any rights to sue, AFAIC.

[Contrapuntal]

Y'know. Civil action might be more effective than you think. (1) The dog is a Rotty. (2) It is vicious. (3) Homeowner's liability policies take a dim view of (1) & (2) above.

Insurance Dopers...? I. Montoya..? care to comment?

Just a thought.


(I think Montoya's in the insurance biz. Apologies if I'm mistaken)
Where do you get that the dog is vicious? Even spongemom says "That dog wouldn't turn against me, I'm sure of that," I have a 13 pound Jack Russell Terrier that has killed cats that have come into my yard, (over a six foot privacy fence), who is the sweetest dog in the world as long as you're not a furry creature that runs along the ground. JRTs are bred to bring small animals to ground. Being vicious has nothing to do with it.

And civil action? Good grief! What would be the claim, exactly? I would give good odds that the OP is in violation of the leash laws in her community. She continued to let her cats out after one of them had been killed. She knowingly exposed two more cats to a horrible and predictable death. Another cat died after it "got stepped on" (love the passive voice) and they were too clueless to notice that it was not eating. By her own account she has "never had the same cat for more than two years", because "dogs always fucking eat them." I suppose all of those were someone else's fault as well.

It is pretty clear to me who is responsible for the deaths of her cats.

[Trunk]

To back up what Contrapuntal said. . .

One was stepped on, got its jaw broken and we didn't know it, and it ended up starving to death because we found out too late and nothing could be done.

If anyone should be calling the authorities, it's the people with the rottweiler on spongemom who. . .

1) Stepped on a cat's head.

2) Which was forceful enough to break it's jaw.

3) The people in the household were too negligent to notice the broken jaw.

4) Or the fact that the kitten wasn't eating, so severely that it STARVED to death.

That's fuckin' animal cruelty.

[Excalibre]

Oh, believe me, the two we have left don't get to go outside at all, no matter how badly they want to (and trust me, they really want to). It's a bitch keeping their sneaky asses inside, but I can't handle another one dying. I have four graves behind the garage already.
It only took four of them dying to make you realize that cats are vulnerable to predators outside?

Gosh, you learn quick.

Even if it wasn't for your neighbor's dog (whom you imply is not loose), it ain't like there aren't plenty of other threats. Cars in the city, coyotes in the country, cats with diseases, et cetera et cetera et cetera.

I found myself shaking my head continuously as I read this story - in horror at the fate of your cats, and out of rage that someone like you would be permitted to own animals and not take even the most basic care of them. Apparently you view cats as completely disposable - you've never had the same cat for more than two years, and you blame dogs for this? There will always be dogs. You've decided to entrust your cats' safety to every dog owner in the world keeping their dog under such tight control at all times that their dogs never accidentally get free, every wild dog, wolf, coyote, and other predator - there's no shortage of predators, even in urban areas - dropping dead, and everyone in the world giving up driving cars? What in the name of every holy relic in every church under the sun happened to your fucking brain that you would let this happen over and over and over? Are you just one of those people who views your cats as a pleasant decoration - no responsibility, and always replaceable?

You've never had a cat live more than two years? And it hasn't occured to you that folks are supposed to keep cats indoors for a reason? Here's a clue: the life expectancy of cats who spend most of their time outdoors is between one and two years. The life expectancy of an indoor cat is somewhere closer to fifteen. Even in nature, our cats' wild ancestors did not lead charmed lives, and housecats have had a lot of their instincts bred out of them. They are not equipped to survive outdoors, especially not in urban areas.

Irresponsible people like you disgust me. You don't want to know what I'd like to do to you right now. You know, tragedies happen, mistakes get made, and sometimes pets die. But if you had half the brains got gave a fucking pomagranate, it wouldn't have taken you four fucking dead cats to decide to take the advice that your vet has no doubt been giving and countless other organizations give. Everyone knows you're not supposed to let housecats outside, and I yet I could still forgive you for your foolishness.

But in your case, you let your cats out after seeing them get killed over and over by the predator you knew to live right next door.

You think this is your neighbor's dog's fault? Nope. Look in the mirror. Then give your cats away to someone who's remotely capable of caring for them. I hope truly awful things befall you, in exchange for what you let happen to your cats, you worthless piece of human-shaped excrement.


They don't give a shit. They're pissed off at me for being pissed off at their dog, because my cats got in their yard. They say it's my fault. They never even had the decency to say "I'm sorry about your cat" for any of them.
Tell me something.

How in the name of God do you expect your neighbors to keep your cats safe, when your cats go into their yard where they keep their dog? What exactly more are they supposed to do? Because it sure sounds like they're being responsible. If their dog is locked up, they're doing their part. And you neglect to take even the most basic care of your poor pets, and expect them to fucking apologize?

This is fucking surreal. Am I missing something here? Do I have the basic facts right - you let your cats outside, the cats entered the enclosure where your neighbors kept their dog (it wasn't roaming free), and cat after cat died before you decided to take some responsibility and keep your cats inside? Because that's seriously what I read in your post, and yet you actually seem to think it's someone else's fault. Please tell me that I misread something somewhere, and you don't just callously let four cats die before you decide to stop letting them cavort with the neighbor's dog. My mind must be playing tricks on me. There is no one in the world so fucking stupid and so casually evil as to ignore that many cats dying before they decided to respond.


I know they're not in the wrong, legally anyway. What really pisses me off is the way they think they're too good to apologize for something their dog did.
What a shock. You're not pissed about your cats at all. This is actually about some moronic feud you have because your neighbors are too "uppity" with you. The cats are apparently just pawns in your stupid fucking argument. Which, I suppose, is why you decided to let cat after cat get killed by the neighbor dog.

Well, figure it out. Your neighbors did exactly what they're supposed to do - they kept their dog enclosed. You let your cats go outside and into the dog's enclosure time after time. And you want a fucking apology? I swear, if I knew you in person, I don't think I'd be able to restrain myself from committing violence. There is very little worse in the world than the sort of scumbag who decides to take in a pet but declines the responsibility of actually taking care of it. Right now I'm hoping you suffer the same fate your cats did - it seems fair that you get ripped apart by dogs the way you let your cats. Maybe later I'll be able to read your horror story a little more calmly.

You've learned your lesson. Next time keep the door to your goddamn doublewide shut, you brainless piece of trash. Don't sacrifice your fucking pets to support some moronic point about neighbors who are too high 'n' mighty, you fucking idiot hick.


Bollocks! I am willing to be proven wrong but I THINK that the US is the only place with predominatly inside cats.
New Zealand has a lot fewer natural predators, if I'm not mistaken, and is overall far more rural, which means fewer cars. That makes where you live a very bad comparison to the United States.

I'm aware that it's sort of a new-fangled idea to keep cats inside. But the statistics show that in an urban area, most cats allowed to go outdoors live only a few years, whereas cats kept inside live several times longer. It's hard to break a cat of the habit of wanting to get outside, but honestly, ours may be fascinated by the birds but they live happy lives indoors. Whether it's a common practice where you are or not, at least in the US, your cat is virtually certain to die far too young if you let it out. The environment we live in is nothing like their natural habitat, and they just can't cope with it.

[Unregistered Bull]

Haven't cats in New Zealand made huge dents in the native fauna, especially the bird population some of which are actually endangered species? I know that Oz where feral ones are actively hunted has a huge problem with cats. Keeping outdoor cats seems hugely irresponsible both to the cats and to other animals.

[Little Bird]

Their dog is their baby. They're still pissed off at me for my cats getting in their yard. My being mad at them makes them mad at me. Go figure. They aren't going to do a damn thing, and they've made that perfectly clear.
Oh for fuck's sake! What do you want them to do? Keep their dog inside all day? There's a concept. It's a dog. Dogs go outside in their fenced yard to poo. That's what dogs do. Cats stay inside because they poo in a litterbox. There is no reason why your cats should be outside. But I guess you are the queen of everything and they should be required to follow your rules.

Keep your cats inside. It is your stubbornness, stupidity, and wanton disregard for their well being that got them killed. Your neighbors have every right to be mad at you and don't need to do a damn thing.

[jlzania]

No sympathy from me either Spongemom-except for your poor cats that is.
And your neighbors.
Maybe, just maybe, they're sickened by the fact that they had to come home to a mauled cat in their backyard. I know that I would be.
Someone is going to pay. I'm either letting the dog loose for the dog catcher (which I doubt I'll do, since it's not really the dog's fault, I know, the whole instinct thing), or I'm going to torment my neighbor's for the rest of the time they live there. They moved here from some other state, I can't remember where, and they have that "we're from _____ so that makes us better than you" attitude. I have plenty of friends who would egg their house for ten bucks.
So, you're too irresponsible to properly care for your cats and they should have to pay?
Give me a break.
If you let your child run into a busy street, would it be the driver's fault if she/he got hit?
've decided that I'm not getting any more animals, I'll just enjoy everyone else's.
You konw, that's the only intelligent thing you've said thus far.

[NurseCarmen]

Maybe the reason they aren't apologizing is that they expect an apology from you first. Since it was your irresponsibility that started all this in the first place.

[Genghis Bob]

Another vote here for the "Spongemom, what the hell were you thinking?" side. We've always kept our cats indoors, right from kittenhood. They've grown up very content to stay indoors where it's safe.

[FinnAgain]

I'd just like to retract some of my previous comments, I misread the OP. I must've glossed over or forgotten the part where the neighbors were physically trying to pull their dog off of the cat. I don't see what else they could've done. Ah well, this is obviously an emotional issue, and I'm going to bow out.

[missbunny]

I love cats and I am so very sorry yours died in such horrible ways.

Please stop letting them outside though. Or build or buy an enclosure for them. I think it's horrible that your cats were killed but you are the one at fault here. Stop putting your beloved animals in a situation where they are getting into a fight that they obviously cannot win.

I don't think it would have helped in the case you describe, but just about every vet has an after-hours emergency service; many vets take turns being the one on call. You should find out what your own vet's procedures are in case anything ever happens.

Oh, I do have one last photo of my cat, one that I took the day after she died. (snip) I believe that's her, right there above the dumpster, in the neighbor's yard.

This I don't understand - do you mean that bag sitting on top of the garbage can? Are you saying that they dug up one of your cats' bodies and put it in a bag of trash and put it on their can? What am I misunderstanding? Is the whole picture not showing up for me somehow?

Again, I am very sorry and you must be very sad. But your post shows that you are doing many, many things wrong in your raising of cats. Letting them continually wander when you know very well that there is an extreme danger right next door seems very foolish to me. Wanting an apology from the neighbors should be at the bottom of your list of priorities.

[Caricci]

Spongemom , you should be ashamed of yourself. This is coming from the owner of three outdoor cats.

[Neurotik]

This I don't understand - do you mean that bag sitting on top of the garbage can?
This confused me, too, but I think she's talking about the little glitter of light hovering over the trashcan.

[askeptic]

Spongemom, people like you make me sick. I love animals, even cats. I have three dogs and live in a rural area. I spent several thousand dollars on a fence to keep my dogs on my property.

My neighbor keeps bringing home cats. They keep getting into my fenced yard and my dogs keep killing them. I hate coming home to find a mangled bloody mess in my yard. It makes me pissed that I have to keep cleaning up the mess. I do not like seeing animals, even cats suffer. I wish my dogs did not do it, but well...they are dogs.

Fortunately unlike you my neighbor is a reasonable and good person. Each time his cat has been killed he apologizes. He has no problem with my dogs. He knows this is his fault not the dogs.

You have no legal cause of action against the neighbor but if you do anything like go on his property and let his properly fenced dog loose he could and should sue your fucking pants off.

God damn it, I better stop now, I am getting more and more pissed off as I type. I will limit my comment to this: You are an unreasonable person.

[missbunny]

This confused me, too, but I think she's talking about the little glitter of light hovering over the trashcan.

Ah. I thought it was a ball or toy in the yard.

[Trunk]

This confused me, too, but I think she's talking about the little glitter of light hovering over the trashcan.

Oh my god, I think you're right. That's why she said, "if you don't think it is, please, leave me alone in my beliefs. I need this."

It's one of those spots I've seen in almost every other photograph I've ever looked at.

I thought she'd just posted the wrong image.

[Pedro]

Someone is going to pay. I'm either letting the dog loose for the dog catcher (which I doubt I'll do, since it's not really the dog's fault, I know, the whole instinct thing), or I'm going to torment my neighbor's for the rest of the time they live there. They moved here from some other state, I can't remember where, and they have that "we're from _____ so that makes us better than you" attitude. I have plenty of friends who would egg their house for ten bucks.

I can totally see where your neighbours got that impression and it has nothing to do with _____. Maybe the fact that you want to torment your neightbours because you are an irresponsible pet owner tipped them off.

[Jackmannii]

I once lost a great cat to dog(s) coming into my yard to kill him.

I currently have two dogs, one of which (by a great stretch of the imagination) might attack a stray cat in my yard. If that happened, I'd be sorry about it, but it would be completely the fault of the cat owner for letting their animal stray.

[archmichael]

Spongemom, I know this pile-on probably comes as a huge shock to you. You obviously posted thinking that most people would take your side. Let this pile-on be a wake-up call that you are not thinking clearly.

You are in the wrong. Apologize to your neighbor. Dont add hypocrisy to the list, by claiming your neighbors are too good to apologize then not do it yourself.

[Giraffe]

Right now I'm hoping you suffer the same fate your cats did - it seems fair that you get ripped apart by dogs the way you let your cats.Excalibre, it is against the rules to wish death on another poster. Consider yourself warned.

[Try As I Might...]

Hey Spongemom,

I am very sorry for your loss. However, what the above-posters have said is true. What could the dog owners have done? It is horrible, but your cats kept going into the dog's secured backyard.

The other thought that has struck me that you are feeling very vindictive towards the dog and the owners. It is pretty clear that you have already contemplated litigation (and dismissed it) and are now contemplating other means to get back at the dog. If I owned the dog and had any inkling of the hostility you felt towards the dog, I would not apologize out of fear that you would attempt to use it as an admission of liability or negligence. It wouldn't work, but I would be afraid that you would use it to harass me or make my life as miserable as possible because my dog was doing what dogs are apt to do--eat cats. It may well be that your neighbors feel this way as well.

Question, what if your neighbor raised rats and the rats kept getting into your yard only to be eaten by your cats? Would you at some point start to feel resentment towards the rat owners because they can't control the rats?

[askeptic]

Spongemom, this probably is not going the way you had hoped. My advice to you is to ask the powers that be to close this thread, so this evidence of your unbelievable cluelessness will quickly fall off the first page.

I hope you have learned something from this pit experience.

Next, IMMEDIATELY beg your neighbors forgiveness for being such an incredible asshole, and promise them that you will not be so irresponsible in the future.

Then apologize to us for thinking we were stupid enough to tolerate your kind of stupidity.

Then, apologize to your remaining cats for failing to take care of them in a proper manner.

Finally, try to be a better person/neighbor/pet owner/Doper in the future.

[askeptic]

O my fucking god, Spongemom is training to be a vet!!!!!!!!

(link removed --Giraffe)

[Contrapuntal]

O my fucking god, Spongemom is training to be a vet!!!!!!!!

(link removed --Giraffe)Un. Fucking. Believable. Words fail. They really do. Oh, wait, here's a couple.

Spongemom, study up reeaall hard in the classes on animal behavior. And think twice before advising your clients to set bothersome dogs loose, and to egg the houses of their owners. What a chucking fucklehead.

[Left Hand of Dorkness]

May I suggest we back off? While I agree with the overall sentiment in the thread, we don't need to prove which of us can come up with the nastiest insults to hurl at Spongemom. And we really don't need to be invading her forum.

Spongemom, I'm sorry for your grief, and I hope you get a chance for some serious introspection here about how you need to deal with your animals and with your neighbors.

Daniel

[Trunk]

O my fucking god, Spongemom is training to be a vet!!!!!!!!

(link removed --Giraffe)

She's from Kansas. That's a suprise.

[Contrapuntal]

And we really don't need to be invading her forum.


Daniel

Invading? Where do you get that? She invited us in. Check out the link at the bottom of the OP.

She stepped on a kittens's head and then let it starve to death. And she wants to be a vet. I'd say she's fair game.

[vetbridge]

I hear a commotion in the neighbor's backyard one day, I step out my backdoor, and see them pulling their dog off of one of my cats.


Sorry that your cats are dying, however it is up to you to keep them on your own property. Although local laws may vary, in my area you would be liable if the neighbors dog on their own property were to eat your cat and have gastrointestinal problems as a result.

I would add that in my locality you would be investigated on animal neglect/cruelty charges based on what information you gave in the OP.

[askeptic]

Lefty you are one of the Dopers I most admire and it shames me a little to be chastized by you. As usual your reasoned approach is the superior one. But for fuck sake she put this in the pit. It is one of the most incredibly stupid things I have ever seen.

I advised her on how to end this. I told her to ask that the thread be closed. She chooses not to do it. The consequences of that are on her head.

As to invading her forum, I would not have posted the link had it not been availible in her profile. I agree that looking for outside info on a Doper is innapropriate, but when they make it availible in there profile it is information that they want others at the Dope to know.

I am sorry for the vitriol, but She put this in the Pit, she can stop it. Maybe if enough of us point out what an unreasonable ass she is she will start to question her behavior. I doubt it but maybe.

I for one would be interested to hear her response to the comments in this thread.

[archmichael]

I advised her on how to end this. I told her to ask that the thread be closed. She chooses not to do it. The consequences of that are on her head.
In regards to this, there is nothing to indicate that she has logged on since her last post, or is even aware that a pile-on is taking place

[askeptic]

In regards to this, there is nothing to indicate that she has logged on since her last post, or is even aware that a pile-on is taking place

Well, she can learn not to drop "Stupidity Bombs" in the Pit and leave. If I started a thread I would certainly wait around to see how it is received. If I did not have time to wait I would post it later when I did have time.

[Left Hand of Dorkness]

In regards to this, there is nothing to indicate that she has logged on since her last post, or is even aware that a pile-on is taking place
Exactly...I'm not chastizing (I think you're great, too, actually!) but rather saying that I think she's going to get the message loud and clear next time she logs on, and we probably don't need to pound it in any harder. Despite her (very serious, in my eyes) mistakes, I think she's grieving now, and is likelier to hear the message better the fewer insults it's mixed in with.

Yeah, it's in the Pit, so insulting her is allowed. I'm just not sure it's adviseable.

(And I know you're not telling folks to invade her messageboard; sorry if that wasn't clear. I was just suggesting that folks not use the link as an opportunity to do that.)

Daniel

[Giraffe]

askeptic, I removed the link in your post (to spongemom's profile on another message board). I don't want people showing up on that board to harrass spongemom based on this thread.

This isn't a warning, since I don't think your intention was to start a board war, but please don't do it again.

[Giraffe]

Invading? Where do you get that? She invited us in. Check out the link at the bottom of the OP.

She stepped on a kittens's head and then let it starve to death. And she wants to be a vet. I'd say she's fair game.The link to her forum was in her signature. That's not an invitation to take this thread over there. And even if it was, don't do it.

[Anaamika]

I think you guys need to ease up on Spongemom, too. What happened was horrible but ripping her a new asshole isn't going to bring back any of the cats. When she logs back on and reads the responses, and when we see her response to all of this, then we can see where to go from there. If she posts new information, or seems to realize where she went wrong, that's one thing, or if she comes back with curses, that's another.

1000x a poster has posted something and then come back and realized just how horrible it sounded. I'm not saying Spongemom will necesarily bring any evidence to light to exonerate her, but she might. And this wicked pile-on is a bit much. You all have assumed that the kitty that was hurt was personally stepped on by Spongemom and personally allowed to starve to death, but the fact remains, we don't know the details.

If she really is broken up about it, then we've told her what she did wrong and hopefully she'll learn from it. However, screaming invectives at any human only makes them get defensive.

[Cemetery Savior]

You must have missed where spongemom clearly indicated the reason they're not apologizing is because they think they're too good for that.

They're from a state where the people think they're too good to apologize.


:rolleyes:

Anecdotal. What specific state has "Too Good For You" on the license plate?

If my dog were to kill a neighbor's cat (unlikely, as he's a spaniel puppy), I would probably be too embarrassed at first to talk to them, even with condolences. the second time, I'd probably be angry with the neighbor for allowing this scenario to continue, and the third-fifth times...in shock at the unwillingness to change.

[mhendo]

May I suggest we back off? While I agree with the overall sentiment in the thread, we don't need to prove which of us can come up with the nastiest insults to hurl at Spongemom. And we really don't need to be invading her forum.

Spongemom, I'm sorry for your grief, and I hope you get a chance for some serious introspection here about how you need to deal with your animals and with your neighbors.

DanielI think this is excellent advice.She stepped on a kittens's head and then let it starve to death. And she wants to be a vet. I'd say she's fair game.You make it sound like this was intentional and wilfull, rather than an awful accident.In regards to this, there is nothing to indicate that she has logged on since her last post, or is even aware that a pile-on is taking placeExactly.

Her profile, as of right now, says that her last post was at 3.39am Eastern. That would be, i think, 2.39am in Kansas. People have to sleep too, you know. And she may have had to go to work or run errands today. Much as we might love to, not everyone can spend 24 hours a day replying to Straight Dope threads.Well, she can learn not to drop "Stupidity Bombs" in the Pit and leave. If I started a thread I would certainly wait around to see how it is received. If I did not have time to wait I would post it later when I did have time.Give her a break!

She hung around for two hours after posting her OP, and made quite a few follow-up posts. Is there some rule i'm not aware of that says she has to stay in front of her computer until every single doper has had a chance to give her a kick?

FWIW, i agree with most people that her rant at her neighbors and their dog was misplaced, and that she needs to seriously re-evaluate the way she looks after her cats. And she might well realize that after reading the responses in this thread. But, much as i love to engage in a pile-on when i think the circumstances are right, i do try to stay off when the person's post might have been affected by grief. While castigating SpongeMom for her rather narrow view of her situation, we could also show a little sympathy.

[Cemetery Savior]

Anecdotal. What specific state has "Too Good For You" on the license plate?

If my dog were to kill a neighbor's cat (unlikely, as he's a spaniel puppy), I would probably be too embarrassed at first to talk to them, even with condolences. the second time, I'd probably be angry with the neighbor for allowing this scenario to continue, and the third-fifth times...in shock at the unwillingness to change.

Geez...upon re-read, I think Trunk whooshed me. Must...read...rolleyes.

[askeptic]

Sorry Giraffe, it certainly was not my intention, while I know board wars happen I have seen plenty of invaders come to the Dope, it just did not occur to me that Dopers might instigate one. My bad, sorry. It won't happen again.

And Lefty if you were talking to me I am flattered.

[Contrapuntal]

The link to her forum was in her signature. That's not an invitation to take this thread over there. And even if it was, don't do it.
Who has done that, or even suggested that it be done? The link is most certainly an invitation to view her forum, which is all anyone has done. All you've got is Lefty on his high horse telling us not to do stuff that no one has done. I ask again, where was it even implied, except by Lefty, that we "take this thread over there"?

[askeptic]

She hung around for two hours after posting her OP, and made quite a few follow-up posts. Is there some rule i'm not aware of that says she has to stay in front of her computer until every single doper has had a chance to give her a kick?


You and Lefty are right and I apologize.

[Trunk]

Geez...upon re-read, I think Trunk whooshed me. Must...read...rolleyes.

Trunk: 1
Cemetery Savior: 0

OK, I'm done with the pig-pile on Spongemom. I didn't have to make that last crack about Kansas, but that state's been pissing me off lately, too.

I remember after her very first post here, about how she was going to post in purple, she got pig-piled and handled it all right.

Of course, posting in purple isn't quite the same as crushing kittens' heads and feeding them to rottweilers, but whatever. . .

[Contrapuntal]

Anaamika, mhendo,

From the OP:

One was stepped on, got its jaw broken and we didn't know it, and it ended up starving to death because we found out too late and nothing could be done. (Bolding mine)

As I noted before, I just love the passive voice. No sense of responsibility there at all. Shit happens. Nothing we could do about.

No one is suggesting that she killed the kitten on purpose. She did, however, know that a human being had stepped on the head of a creature that weighed at the most a couple of pounds. That should have triggered a vet trip right there. Failing that, close observation for several days is absolutely called for. She was not even aware that the kitten was not eating. I simply meant to juxtapose this apparent lack of empathy and observation skills with her stated desire to become a veterinarian.

[Spongemom]

Fuck you all. Every fucking one of you.

[CanvasShoes]

(1) The dog is a Rotty. (2) It is vicious. (3) Homeowner's liability policies take a dim view of (1) & (2) above.

These two things are not mutually exclusive. My sister bred and raised rottendogs for several years. Her two cats considered her dogs nice warm cat beds. They dog slobber they got on them was from absent minded licking not viciousness.

The animal's behaviour has to do with its upbringing NOT its breed.

That said, even a misbehaving dog has a right to go into its own yard without warning the neighborhood animals that it is going to do so. I'm sorry spongemom about your kitties though.

[Excalibre]

1000x a poster has posted something and then come back and realized just how horrible it sounded.
Four cats, Anaamika, four of them!

Sometimes I cool down later and regret things I said. While I regret my violation of board rules earlier, I find that my rage towards Spongemom has not abated in the slightest. I don't think folks are upset with her for what she said - her insults towards her neighbors are merely the icing-sugar glaze on top of it. I just don't see this as something you can come up with a subsequent justification for. I'm not enraged because of what she's saying in her grief. I'm enraged because she let such an awful thing happen - four times over.

When I worked at a vet clinic, a client once came in with their second cat dying of feline leukemia, a disease that's preventable with vaccination. One of the doctors told me that she really wished she could sit the client down in her smacking chair and slap some sense into her. I can understand making a mistake, but four times?

I'm a cat lover, and this thread is making me slightly hysterical. I had better not look again.

[Excalibre]

Fuck you all. Every fucking one of you.
And on posting, I see that even Spongemom recognizes that her behavior was unconscionable - she has nothing to say to justify it.

[JohnBckWLD]

Fuck you all. Every fucking one of you.
How to win friends and punish enemies

[Who_me?]

Fuck you all. Every fucking one of you. (Size reduced by myself)

Overreact much?

[mhendo]

Fuck you all. Every fucking one of you. You're making it very hard to justify asking people not to pile on, you know.

[Cemetery Savior]

Fuck you all. Every fucking one of you.

Subtle.

[Spongemom]

I never thought a message board could make me cry. A fucking message board. You people are ruthless in your attacks. I never thought I'd run into so many insensitive, uncaring, and flat out mean people at one fucking time.

[Crafter_Man]

Spongemom:

You're obviously in the wrong here. If you don't want your cats to be eaten by your neighbor's dog, then keep your damn cats on your property.

We live in a very rural area. Cats that happen onto my property become moving targets for my .308.

[Spongemom]

i Don't Need Any More Of This!!!

[Cheesesteak]

First off, ignore Crafter_Man when it comes to cats. He's got his own rules that most people don't agree with.

Second, what's gone down here is hard, but you should take it as an opportunity to take a step back and look at yourself. We are not all evil uncaring people, most of us do care and empathize with pet owners. Your actions, as described in your OP do not suggest a set of bad dog owners, but a cat owner who did not fulfill her duties to protect her pets. That does not make you a bad person, but you need to see this and appreciate why people are taking you to task.

[Excalibre]

i Don't Need Any More Of This!!!
Crafter_Man is a despicable cat-hater.

I can't see what you did as anything short of utter neglect, though. I guess you can't explain it away either. I nearly cried reading your message this morning, out of sorrow for your cats. I still can't muster any sympathy for you, though.

I hope that in the future you realize the responsibility that pet ownership entails. And I think you should have this thread locked. It's very unlikely to get any better.

[Giraffe]

Who has done that, or even suggested that it be done? The link is most certainly an invitation to view her forum, which is all anyone has done. All you've got is Lefty on his high horse telling us not to do stuff that no one has done. I ask again, where was it even implied, except by Lefty, that we "take this thread over there"?Sorry, I should have been more clear. I wanted to head off any potential discussion of whether the link in the OP constituted an invitation to post to spongemom's forum by making it clear that such an action would still be unwelcome in either case. I wasn't chastising you or implying that you planned to do such a thing.

[Giraffe]

Thread closed at request of OP.