Pleased to meet you, my name's... Hitler

[Martha Medea]

I was in the GD thread about holocaust denial (http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=349672), when I came across this and other similar asides.

In Dublin, there is a restaurant called Mao's. It doesn't seem to offend anyone that the man was a mass-murderer. That place still bothers me.


I started typing my reply, but then realised I didn't have anything to add to the OT because several posters had already made my points for me. I also got a little more het up than GD permits, so here's a pitting instead.

Where I live, a couple of people on the fringes of public life have 'Hitler' as their given name. It fills me with revulsion, but no one else I know bats an eyelid. It amazes me that they feel OK about going around with a name like that, and that they don't get spat upon by everyone they come into contact with.

For people who say 'it isn't their fault, they didn't choose to be named that' - even if your parents were deranged or ignorant enough to give you that name, wouldn't the civilised thing to do be to drop it in favour of something less offensive? I can understand up to a very limited point that maybe the full horror of the holocaust is not so resonant in countries like this one, that were not affected, but when you see that the US Embassy here even has one of them on their list of local recommended lawyers (http://santodomingo.usembassy.gov/Consular/ACS/attorney.htm), it makes me wonder what the fuck they were thinking of. Scroll down and see for yourself.

[silenus]

Since my last name is Eichman, I really don't see your point here.

[lieu]

Bummer of a birthmark, Hal.

[Yeticus Rex]

I just can't wait for the next John Smith to start world-wide genocide.....penis will ensue when that comes to fruition.

[Martha Medea]

As I said, 'Hitler' is his given name, his first name, the name his parents chose. No prizes for guessing why they chose it. If it were a surname, it wouldn't be such a big deal, although I'm certain that most people with that particular one changed it long ago.

As for other surnames shared with infamous historical figures, unless silenus was whooshing me, they are not nearly so distinctive as 'Hitler' to provoke the same reaction. That also applies to your hypothetical "John Smith", Yeticus.

[Ice Wolf]

I'd have more of a double-take reaction than revulsion because someone had the first name of "Hitler". These days, folks might even change their name to that, just to get the negative reaction.

Doesn't diminish how I feel about the stuff Adolf Hitler did -- I'm just not that fussed about names.

[silenus]

Well, our listed Hitler graduated from Law School in 1966. That means he was born in 1942 or before. If his parents were right-wingers, in Laten America, then it is very likely that they named their son before his namesakes genocidal policies became widely known. As for changing it...maybe not. Why would/should I change my name because of something somebody else did? Any problems would be with the narrow minds of others, not the way I live my life. If they can't seperate a name from an action, then piss on them.

And no, it's no whoosh. That's my last name.

[The Weird One]

Martha, I see what you mean. It seems a safe guess that the Dr. Hitler Fatule-Chain of the Dominican Republic is not of German descent. If it were my name, I would certainly change it. Are people in the DR not as aware of the Holocaust as we are, do they just not care, or are they actively anti-semitic?

[Bricker]

I started typing my reply, but then realised I didn't have anything to add to the OT because several posters had already made my points for me. I also got a little more het up than GD permits, so here's a pitting instead.

Where I live, a couple of people on the fringes of public life have 'Hitler' as their given name. It fills me with revulsion, but no one else I know bats an eyelid. It amazes me that they feel OK about going around with a name like that, and that they don't get spat upon by everyone they come into contact with.


Are there any Trujillo families in your neighborhood?

[Miller]

I kinda wish my parents had named me Hitler, just so I could legally change it to Hilter and become a living, breathing Monty Python reference.

[Captain Amazing]

Are there any Trujillo families in your neighborhood?
Well, again, what she's pitting isn't "Hitler" families, but people with the first name "Hitler". So the analogy wouldn't be a "Trujillo" family, but someone with the first name Trujillo

[NurseCarmen]

Hitler! Attilla! Pol!

Time for dinner!!

[Troy McClure SF]

...the US Embassy here even has one of them on their list of local recommended lawyers (http://santodomingo.usembassy.gov/Consular/ACS/attorney.htm), it makes me wonder what the fuck they were thinking of. Scroll down and see for yourself.

They were probably thinking, "Hey, maybe we shouldn't decide who we list based on whether we like his fucking name or not."

[Fear Itself]

On the other hand, do you think it is easier to be elected mayor if your name is Superman (http://peninsulaclarion.com/stories/093005/elections_0930ele002.shtml)?

[friedo]

On the other hand, do you think it is easier to be elected mayor if your name is Superman (http://peninsulaclarion.com/stories/093005/elections_0930ele002.shtml)?

I know a dog named Hercules Rockefeller Superman IV, Esq.

He's a poodle.

[lissener]

I know a guy from Iceland name Itler. You have to introduce him twice.

[KarlGauss]

I can't find a cite for it, but recall reading that in the 1930's and 40's, the people of Easter Island, quite isolated except for radio contact, and even then not understanding most foreign languages, made a habit of naming their boys "Hitler". Apparently, they heard near-constant references to a certain Herr Hitler on the radio and figured he must be some big shot. :eek:

One reporter told a tale of being in a restaurant when a fellow walked in and was greeted by a loud, uninhibited, "Hola, Hitler!" Seriously.

[Jackmannii]

I know a dog named Hercules Rockefeller Superman IV, Esq.

He's a poodle.It actually used to be "fashionable" for dimwits to name their dogs things like Hitler ("Heel, Hitler!") and Mussolini.

I have not heard of people naming their mutts Osama*, but it would not surprise me.


*or Nancy Grace, for that matter.

[Miller]

It actually used to be "fashionable" for dimwits to name their dogs things like Hitler ("Heel, Hitler!") and Mussolini.

I have not heard of people naming their mutts Osama*, but it would not surprise me.


*or Nancy Grace, for that matter.


Didn't Mark Twain name his dog after his editor, so he could be the one giving him orders for a change?

[pravnik]

Hitler! Attilla! Pol!

Time for dinner!!Pol's on the Pot, mom!

[Martha Medea]

I can't find a cite for it, but recall reading that in the 1930's and 40's, the people of Easter Island, quite isolated except for radio contact, and even then not understanding most foreign languages, made a habit of naming their boys "Hitler". Apparently, they heard near-constant references to a certain Herr Hitler on the radio and figured he must be some big shot. :eek:

One reporter told a tale of being in a restaurant when a fellow walked in and was greeted by a loud, uninhibited, "Hola, Hitler!" Seriously.

This also happens in the rural areas here, and as a result there are people all over the place called Stalin and Lenin as well as Hitler, and for all I know Pol Pot and Osama bin Laden might crop up here and there as well.

This case is different: this lawyer and another, younger man whose name I've seen in the papers as well are from the urban, better educated sectors of society, who can't have not known what they were doing.

Similarly, many old lefties have named their kids Lenin, Stalin, Engels and the incomparable 'Sovietski'. Even if most people are not offended by this, it's difficult to take people with these names seriously. Can't they or their parents see that going out in the wider world with a name like that is a fucking liability?

It actually used to be "fashionable" for dimwits to name their dogs things like Hitler ("Heel, Hitler!") and Mussolini.

Comically enough this lawyer's brother is named Mussolini. Which leaves little doubt about what was inspiring their parents.

Are there any Trujillo families in your neighborhood?

No, I don't live in that kind of neighbourhood.;) I've never come across anyone with that surname in the DR, except for one TV sports presenter. The Trujillos are all in exile, or long dead.

I used to work with a person whose surname was Trujillo, and she came from another Latin American country. She had to come and work with colleagues in the DR and I heard a couple of hostile comments from people, based on her surname, even though I'm pretty sure there was no connection with the DR Trujillos.

Anyway, happening to have the same surname, especially a common surname, is not comparable to having actively chosen a name that will inevitably upset or offend some, if not all, people. It certainly strikes a raw nerve with me. As you may have noticed.

Call it prejudiced or petty, but I would not want him to be my lawyer.

Or my driving teacher, for that matter. In the city of Santiago there is a driving school called 'Escuela de choferes Hitler'.

I can sort of see the funny side, but it still pisses me off.

[Lord Mondegreen]

Are there any Trujillo families in your neighborhood?

The CEO of Australia's largest telco (Telstra) is Sol Trujillo (http://www.telstra.com.au/abouttelstra/corp/executives.cfm).

Telstra was originally a government-owned enterprise which was partially privatized some years ago and listed on the stock market. Millions of Australians bought shares at the time.

Since taking over as CEO the company's share price has fallen almost 25%. I suspect many investors will have very negative feelings towards his name - I don't foresee many birth notices welcoming the arrival of Trujillo Smith.

[duffer]

Hitler! Attilla! Pol!

Time for dinner!!

Actually in this case it would be:

Hitler! Hun! Pot!

Man, I'm the first to notice that? :eek:


Martha, is this really that upsetting to you? How old are the people that were given the name as newborns? And one question I have that may have been answered, are you in the Dominican Republic? (Not sure)

Why would you demand a person change their name because it was also used to call Evil in for his homework? Is it possible that some don't think sharing a name equates having the same evilness? Is eveyone named Joe supposed to be ashamed for Stalin's acts? It's a name. Do we now hold it against a person what their parent's name them?

Sins of the father and all that.

I can easily see someone in the US naming their kid Osama. That's on the parents. If the kid grows up knowing that's his name without knowing the association of it, why should he change it?

I think of the name Martha as being old, doddery, and outmoded. Change your name. Unless it is your name, which justifies my stereotype of you. Names mean everything. :rolleyes:

[Frank]

I can easily see someone in the US naming their kid Osama. That's on the parents. If the kid grows up knowing that's his name without knowing the association of it, why should he change it?
I work with an Osama, and his attitude is, "It's my name." It's a fairly common name among Muslims - not on a par with John or Joe, but fairly common - and I see no comparison with someone giving their child a first name of Hitler or Stalin or Pinochet or Bush.

[duffer]

I work with an Osama, and his attitude is, "It's my name." It's a fairly common name among Muslims - not on a par with John or Joe, but fairly common - and I see no comparison with someone giving their child a first name of Hitler or Stalin or Pinochet or Bush.

The comparison being I find Osama as detestable as Hitler, Pol Pot and Stalin. I wouldn't expect any of them to change their name based on the person that made us all aware of the name. Where did you miss that?

[duffer]

Never mind. Saw the inclusion of Bush. Says what you have to say on the subject right there, doesn't it?

[Frank]

The comparison being I find Osama as detestable as Hitler, Pol Pot and Stalin. I wouldn't expect any of them to change their name based on the person that made us all aware of the name. Where did you miss that?
Your comment that "it's on the parents." To choose a given name for a child that is from your cultural heritage is far different than choosing a given name that is a last name from a different culture. A more apt comparison would be the Smith's, O'Reilly's or Esposito's naming their child binLaden.

[Frank]

Never mind. Saw the inclusion of Bush. Says what you have to say on the subject right there, doesn't it?
Well, you should know my views by now, duffer, or else you haven't been paying attention. Or else I haven't clicked my sig yet in this thread.

Why should Osama or Saddam be detestable as a first name when Joseph or Adolf or August or George is not?

[Kolak of Twilo]

Why should Osama or Saddam be detestable as a first name when Joseph or Adolf or August or George is not?

Sidenote: Harpo Marx was born Adolph Marx. Later in life he legally changed it to Arthur Marx.

[Jotun]

I can easily see someone in the US naming their kid Osama.

I can too. Osama isn't a very rare name. I knew two of them. I still think it's a bit different than naming your kid Hitler. After all, Osama is the guys first name. I'm sure there are plenty of newborn Adolf's out there.

[duffer]

Point taken on the Bush part. Got little knee-jerk there. Carry on.

[Jotun]

I can too. Osama isn't a very rare name. I knew two of them. I still think it's a bit different than naming your kid Hitler. After all, Osama is the guys first name. I'm sure there are plenty of newborn Adolf's out there.

Whoa, where did I go wrong?
I could have sworn I was at the end of the thread. I post it and see that several other people said the same thing!

It must have been a long day :p

[ZipperJJ]

I work with an Osama, and his attitude is, "It's my name." It's a fairly common name among Muslims - not on a par with John or Joe, but fairly common - and I see no comparison with someone giving their child a first name of Hitler or Stalin or Pinochet or Bush.

Michael Bolton: Yeah, well at least your name isn't Michael Bolton.
Samir: You know there's nothing wrong with that name.
Michael Bolton: There was nothing wrong with it... until I was about 12 years old and that no-talent ass clown became famous and started winning Grammys.
Samir: Hmm... well why don't you just go by Mike instead of Michael?
Michael Bolton: No way. Why should I change? He's the one who sucks.

:D

[zagloba]

Anybody else here remember the Vic Hitler story line on Hill Street Blues?

[Martha Medea]

Fine, some of you are cool with parents choosing to name their baby son 'Hitler' and for the unfortunate child to keep on using his name in adult life.

Let me ask this question - if I told you I have absolutely no Muslim or Arab heritage but had chosen to name my son 'BinLaden Lastname', not Osama, which is arguably a nice enough first name, whether or not you are an Arab or a Muslim, wouldn't you take it as an in-your-face endorsement of what the more famous bearer of that name did to your people? And if you are not a New Yorker, or a citizen of the US, wouldn't you understand them taking offence? I was not directly affected by the 9/11 attacks but I would feel offended and upset on behalf of those who were.

yes, duffer, I am in the DR. The Hitler/Mussolini brothers are immigrants, or sons of immigrants from the Middle East. I have no way of knowing whether they were born in the DR because there have been several waves of immigration from Lebanon, Syria, Jordan and the Palestinian territories. Draw your own conclusions.

[Martha Medea]

My user name? I chose it deliberately because of its mumsy associations. Like the planet I inhabit, it's mostly harmless. ;)

Names are loaded with meaning IMO. How many threads here have raved and railed about idiot parents burdening their kids with ridiculous names?

Give me Madison, Xavion* or even Kajina** over Hitler any day. :D

*Real name from my home town.
**No one's actually gone for that one yet but I live in hope.

[Uvula Donor]

Let me ask this question - if I told you I have absolutely no Muslim or Arab heritage but had chosen to name my son 'BinLaden Lastname', not Osama, which is arguably a nice enough first name, whether or not you are an Arab or a Muslim, wouldn't you take it as an in-your-face endorsement of what the more famous bearer of that name did to your people? And if you are not a New Yorker, or a citizen of the US, wouldn't you understand them taking offence? I was not directly affected by the 9/11 attacks but I would feel offended and upset on behalf of those who were.

I couldn't fucking care less. Settle down, Francis.

[Knowed Out]

I remember there was a case against a Neo Nazi a couple of years ago who changed his named to Hi Hitler.

He actually thought that's what the Nazis were saying when they extended their arms to him.

[Martha Medea]

I remember there was a case against a Neo Nazi a couple of years ago who changed his named to Hi Hitler.

He actually thought that's what the Nazis were saying when they extended their arms to him.

Now that's priceless. :D

[zweisamkeit]

Let me ask this question - if I told you I have absolutely no Muslim or Arab heritage but had chosen to name my son 'BinLaden Lastname', not Osama, which is arguably a nice enough first name, whether or not you are an Arab or a Muslim, wouldn't you take it as an in-your-face endorsement of what the more famous bearer of that name did to your people? And if you are not a New Yorker, or a citizen of the US, wouldn't you understand them taking offence? I was not directly affected by the 9/11 attacks but I would feel offended and upset on behalf of those who were.



Yes, but what you're upset about (before this post, anyway) were the people with those names, not the parents who named them. If he grew up with that name and was called it day in and day out, it's his goddamned name. I think it's not as easy to just switch to a new name as some people think (otherwise a lot more people who hate their names and say so daily would just pick a new one).

[Excalibre]

Yes, but what you're upset about (before this post, anyway) were the people with those names, not the parents who named them. If he grew up with that name and was called it day in and day out, it's his goddamned name. I think it's not as easy to just switch to a new name as some people think (otherwise a lot more people who hate their names and say so daily would just pick a new one).
I still think that if a kid accepts the surname of a man who commited genocide as a first name and doesn't change it when he has the opportunity, it's a de facto endorsement. A lot of people go by different names than their parents called them growing up - in fact, that's the norm in a lot of cultures. So someone will have to get used to having a different name on forms and things - lots of people do it for much less reason.

I don't know enough about the Dominican Republic to know if there's some cultural difference that I'm missing, though. Personally, if I met someone with the first name Hitler, I doubt I'd bother getting to know them well enough to find out what the deal with it was. As far as I'm concerned, the choice to keep a name and not fix it, which incidentally is quite easy in the U.S. - or at very least use a different name in unofficial circumstances - indicates endorsement.

This is why I've never bothered giving a listen to the seminal indie band Gang of Four. I'm sure they're great - they have a good reputation, anyway - but they're named after the friggin' Gang of Four.

Incidentally, I'm curious about the name "Adolph". I have to say that I would be quite surprised to meet an Adolph in the United States - it seems that even the first name has been contaminated by the association. But I've known a Spanish guy named Adolfo; am I right in assuming that it's still a reasonably common name in many places?

[Fear Itself]

Incidentally, I'm curious about the name "Adolph". I have to say that I would be quite surprised to meet an Adolph in the United States - it seems that even the first name has been contaminated by the association. But I've known a Spanish guy named Adolfo; am I right in assuming that it's still a reasonably common name in many places?My wife has an Uncle Adolph, we call him "Dolphie".

[hajario]

This is why I've never bothered giving a listen to the seminal indie band Gang of Four. I'm sure they're great - they have a good reputation, anyway - but they're named after the friggin' Gang of Four.

I feel the same way about Joy Division. How much of an asshole do you have to be to call yourselves that? I'm glad that piece of shit offed himself.

[Excalibre]

I feel the same way about Joy Division. How much of an asshole do you have to be to call yourselves that? I'm glad that piece of shit offed himself.
At least "Joy Division" isn't a name used by perpetrators of genocide. But yeah, I hear what you're saying.

I never liked them much because all of their music is completely tuneless and sounds like it was recorded in a phone booth.

[Troy McClure SF]

Incidentally, I'm curious about the name "Adolph". I have to say that I would be quite surprised to meet an Adolph in the United States - it seems that even the first name has been contaminated by the association. But I've known a Spanish guy named Adolfo; am I right in assuming that it's still a reasonably common name in many places?

Common, probably not, but Adolph Gasser (http://www.gassers.com) runs a well-known camera repair shop in San Francisco.

And if that's not bad enough, I still meet people to this day named Joseph (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stalin). What a bunch of bastards they are!

[Excalibre]

And if that's not bad enough, I still meet people to this day named Joseph (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stalin). What a bunch of bastards they are!
Holy fuck!

Actually, to me it's surprising that the name "Adolph" seems to be tainted, since it's his first name. But a big part of that is probably that it just wasn't a real common name in the United States at least before that time.

[hajario]

Actually, to me it's surprising that the name "Adolph" seems to be tainted, since it's his first name. But a big part of that is probably that it just wasn't a real common name in the United States at least before that time.

I wonder how common a name Benedict was 230 years ago in the Colonies?

[kidchameleon]

I wonder how common a name Benedict was 230 years ago in the Colonies?

And all those people endorsing him by running around with his last name as their first name. :rolleyes:

[hajario]

And all those people endorsing him by running around with his last name as their first name. :rolleyes:

WTF is up with the rolleyes? We're talking about names getting less popular when someone notorious happened to have the name. It was a legitimate question.

[Excalibre]

WTF is up with the rolleyes? We're talking about names getting less popular when someone notorious happened to have the name. It was a legitimate question.
And an interesting one. Given that "Arnold" was a fairly common first name before and after, it's not exactly comparable with deciding to name your kid Hitler which does look pretty clearly like you're naming him after Der Führer. What's the problem, kidchameleon?

[Uvula Donor]

Incidentally, I'm curious about the name "Adolph". I have to say that I would be quite surprised to meet an Adolph in the United States - it seems that even the first name has been contaminated by the association.

What about that meat tenderizer, huh? Fucking jackboots, goose-stepping all over my steak. Papain über alles!

[Coin]

I'll grant that naming your children after a mass murderer is not a nice thing to do, but some families may have had traditions associated with those names before they became famous. No one is obliged to choose names for their children with an eye for making you happy. They ought to pick something that won't make life harder for the kid, but ultimately that's their decision.

As far as adults not wanting to change their name: If Hitler Jones has been called that since he was born and he's eighteen now, he's used to it and his family and friends no doubt associate it with him at least as strongly as you associate it with the German dictator. People were named Hitler a long time before he rose to power, and in a few hundred years, once the stigma has faded, I wouldn't be surprised if Adolph was a popular name again.

I think the Office Space quote earlier in this thread sums it up well. People stuck with the name Hitler should be bringing a class action suit against the countries where Hitler resided during his lifetime forcing them to posthumously change his name to "Mungface Poopypants", because *he's* the one who did something wrong.

[Guinastasia]

Isn't the name Adolf very popular in the Swedish Royal family?

[Martha Medea]

People were named Hitler a long time before he rose to power

Are you serious? 'Hitler' as a first name?

and in a few hundred years, once the stigma has faded, I wouldn't be surprised if Adolph was a popular name again

As others have mentioned, Adolf or Adolph, although not in the top 10 baby names, are still to be found here and there. I know several, all in Spanish speaking countries, who bear the name 'Adolfo' due to family tradition (dating back to well before their more famous namesake rose to power) where the oldest son is named after the father. For some reason almost all the post-WW2 Adolfos use nicknames.

[psychonaut]

You people think someone with the first name "Hitler" is weird? How about someone whose complete given name is "Adolf Hitler"? Someone with that name was an undergraduate computer science student at the University of Toronto a few years back. I never taught him, but did see him online on the system's Unix server on numerous occasions. Every once in a while another student would complain to the system administrators that someone had hacked the server and changed their username to Adolf Hitler. And the response from the administrators was inevitably, "Um, no, that's the kid's real name."

My colleagues who taught him told me he was some Indian (as in, from India) kid, and that as far as they knew he had been named Adolf Hitler from birth. Apparently he was a pretty ordinary-looking and -acting student. I don't know why his parents chose this name -- perhaps they admired Hitler, or perhaps they didn't know who he was and just chose the name out of a history book, or perhaps they were playing a cruel practical joke on their son.

[Humanist]

Having some relatives that work in hospitals has enabled me to hear some strangely chosen names. Crippling names. The sort of names that would scar a child for life. None of this, however, prepared me for one name in particular. One name whose stupidity was placed above all others.

One day, a baby boy was born at our local hospital. He was somewhat unremarkable, white, born from a middle class single mother. In every way but one, he was utterly inconspicuous. I am told that he was bright and active, and reached out for the attention of anyone nearby. His infant eyes were blissfully unaware of the heavy burden that had been placed upon him. The burden... of a name.

Not his last name, to be sure. He bore no familial relation to any famous tyrants or mass murderers. His last name didn't even rhyme with a bodily function. No, the burden came entirely from the syllables his mother screeched when she was asked the all-important question.

"So, what are you going to name him?"

"Saddam Jihad."

The mother, it seems, was trying to impress her Islamic boyfriend. Her Islamic boyfriend who had been born and raised American. Her boyfriend, who, it seemed, was not even the baby's father.

Once a person recovered from the stunned silence that the boy's name naturally evoked, the next question, naturally, is, "Why do you want to name him that?"

"Well, Saddam for Saddam Hussein, of course, and Jihad means holy war."

My shock overcame my empathy, at least at first, in this instance.

[Monty]

but when you see that the US Embassy here even has one of them on their list of local recommended lawyers (http://santodomingo.usembassy.gov/Consular/ACS/attorney.htm),
Just a minor note: that's not a list of recommended lawyers. It's merely a list of lawyers. The US Embassy isn't permitted to recommend any particular lawyer.

[Monty]

Humanist: I can top that. One "brilliant" Sailor on my first ship actually named his son Rat. Rat was the Sailor's nick-name when he was a tyke.

[Monty]

Incidentally, I'm curious about the name "Adolph". I have to say that I would be quite surprised to meet an Adolph in the United States - it seems that even the first name has been contaminated by the association. But I've known a Spanish guy named Adolfo; am I right in assuming that it's still a reasonably common name in many places?
Jewish classmate of mine in high school has an older brother named Adolph. Everyone in the family and all of his friends call him Dolph.

[Excalibre]

"Saddam Jihad."
Wow, that beats my plan to name the first little tyke "Slobodon McGenocide".

But I think the "Mc" gives my idea a nice playful kick.

[DMark]

I remember there was a case against a Neo Nazi a couple of years ago who changed his named to Hi Hitler.



Wasn't Hi's wife named Lois?

When I was a kid, in Illinois, a new doctor performed surgery on me...his name was Fidel Castro. Things got a bit icky in the 60's with his name, but he never changed it.

I recently read that relatives of Adolf Hitler live in the US, but have changed their name, live anonymously and have produced no heirs.

[Dancy McDance Dance]

Stephen Cobert's real name is Ted Hilter. No relation. Well, distant relation, two generations back. Directly.He's Adolf Hitler's grandson. Anyways, it's out there. It's no longer news.

[TheLoadedDog]

"Saddam Jihad."

The mother, it seems, was trying to impress her Islamic boyfriend. Her Islamic boyfriend who had been born and raised American. Her boyfriend, who, it seemed, was not even the baby's father.

Once a person recovered from the stunned silence that the boy's name naturally evoked, the next question, naturally, is, "Why do you want to name him that?"

"Well, Saddam for Saddam Hussein, of course, and Jihad means holy war."

My shock overcame my empathy, at least at first, in this instance.
Okay, so that's pretty off, but Jihad is actually a regular Arabic name. My stepson has a Lebanese classmate called Jihad. He's a nice little kid too. Maybe somebody who knows Arabic can come along and tell me the original meaning of the word (I've forgotten), but it's not "holy war". That is a secondary usage (admittedly the one most well-known to Westerners). From memory Jihad is a general term meaning a sort of internal struggle and development to better one's self as a Muslim. Muslims are meant to practice "Jihad", even if it is simply in the form of mental development. The holy war side of it is just one manifestation. At least that's my understanding of it.

[Humanist]

Muslims are meant to practice "Jihad", even if it is simply in the form of mental development. The holy war side of it is just one manifestation. At least that's my understanding of it.

Right. You and I know this. The seriously odd thing is that the lady there didn't know this. She was really just in the earliest stages of understanding this unique and diverse culture, through her boyfriend. They didn't stay together at the hospital, and the boyfriend seemed to be a second or third generation Arab-American, and fairly accepting of the American culture around him. That's what made it so... surreal. The woman made it very clear that the name was her choice, not her boyfriend's. It was just odd to hear of someone who knew so little about the culture of Islam picking a name that most Americans would associate with the least pleasant aspects of its fringe groups.

[jjimm]

Some cultures name their kids after significant events current at the time of the child's birth - both good and bad. There is a significant minority of kids walking (or crawling) around in parts of east Asia with the names Tsunami, Osama, Earthquake, Famine, etc.

In some cultures a "good" name is a good thing. In others, an important name is a good thing.

As for the point about the Dublin restaurant called 'Mao' - now two restaurants, the first being so successful - I know one of the chefs, I've eaten there, and I share Liberal's queasiness about the name. And add my own queasiness because I think the food there is shit.

(Incidentally, I recently met a cat called Hitler (http://www.crowaptok.com/travelogue/images/hitler.jpg). See if you can work out why...)

[TheLoadedDog]

That cat also reminds me of Leonard Nimoy for some reason.

[Coil]

Similarly, many old lefties have named their kids Lenin, Stalin, Engels and the incomparable 'Sovietski'. Even if most people are not offended by this, it's difficult to take people with these names seriously. Can't they or their parents see that going out in the wider world with a name like that is a fucking liability?

In Sweden we've had an MP for the Greens with the last name of Stalin (http://www.riksdagen.se/webbnav/index.aspx?nid=1111&iid=0186490041606) and there is a former boss of one of the bigger unions with the first name Ninel (read it backwards). The name fits her though since she's politically a leftie.

[kidchameleon]

And an interesting one. Given that "Arnold" was a fairly common first name before and after, it's not exactly comparable with deciding to name your kid Hitler which does look pretty clearly like you're naming him after Der Führer. What's the problem, kidchameleon?

The problem is that somehow if one doesn't change their name in response to historical messiness, they are some how 'endorsing it' in your eyes. That's just ignorant thinking.

[flight]

Michael Bolton: Yeah, well at least your name isn't Michael Bolton.
Samir: You know there's nothing wrong with that name.
Michael Bolton: There was nothing wrong with it... until I was about 12 years old and that no-talent ass clown became famous and started winning Grammys.
Samir: Hmm... well why don't you just go by Mike instead of Michael?
Michael Bolton: No way. Why should I change? He's the one who sucks.

:D
Damn, being able to post this was the only reason I read past the second post. Urgh.

[hajario]

The problem is that somehow if one doesn't change their name in response to historical messiness, they are some how 'endorsing it' in your eyes. That's just ignorant thinking.

The problem is that you haven't been paying attention. Try actually answering his and my question.

[kidchameleon]

The problem is that you haven't been paying attention. Try actually answering his and my question.

Why? Open a thread in GQ if you're interested. I was justing using Gerneral Arnold's name as a sarcastic example of how rediculous it is to judge (http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=297953&highlight=osama) someone upon their name.

[hajario]

I was justing using Gerneral Arnold's name as a sarcastic example of how rediculous it is to judge (http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=297953&highlight=osama) someone upon their name.

Who is doing that? We're talking about stupid parents who would name their kid with a stupid name. There is also a side discussion about how names tend to become less popular in Western culture when they are associated with someone notorious. You're off on your own.