Catwoman

[SCSimmons]

So, the Mrs. & I were watching Batman Returns on A&E this afternoon. After Michelle Pfeiffer made her first appearance in costume, the following exchange ensued:

Me: Eh. Halle Berry was better.
Mrs: No, she wasn't.
Me: Yeah, she was.
Mrs: No. She just wore less clothes.
(beat)
Me: OK. You and I obviously have very different definitions of 'better'.

But seriously ... Ms. Pfeiffer and Ms. Berry are both lovely, talented actresses. And I know that Berry won a Golden Raspberry for that performance. But IMHO, that had a lot more to do with how horrendously terrible that movie was, than anything about her performance, which I thought was mostly pretty decent. And Pfeiffer's performance, on review, seems a bit campy & over the top. (Like most everyone's performance in every movie in the series starting with Burton's Batman, save possibly Michael Keaton's.)

So--what are your opinions? Who is the ultimate Catwoman, so far? (I'm not going to try to exclude Julie Newmar etc., because you crazy people will throw those names in even if I do ...)

[Kamino Neko]

Well, of the live action Catwomen, I have to say...Julie Newmar.

I haven't seen the Halle Berry movie, so I can't compare her to the other 3 (Pfeifer, Kitt and Newmar), but of the three I have seen, Newmar wins.

She had a certain level of fun that I found to be missing in Kitt's verion, and Pfeifer...meh. I can think of nothing good to say about that movie, really.

I have to say though, criticising Pfeifer's performance because she went with the effect the director was going for - everyone was campy in that flick, and so were the sets - is kind of a weak position. That it failed to be fun, despite that, however, is.

[Sir Rhosis]

^^^You left out Lee Meriwether.

I vote for Juli, of course.

Sir Rhosis

[Kamino Neko]

^^^You left out Lee Meriwether.

I ALWAYS forget her. I've never seen her episodes, and plead that as my defense. The rest of my post stands as is, though.

[Sir Rhosis]

Actually, Meriwether only appeared in the movie shot between the first and second seasons. Newmar was unavailable.

Meriwether was okay. The film is on DVD for about five bucks.

Sir Rhosis

[Menocchio]

Halle Berry and Michelle Pfeiffer weren't playing even vaguely the same character, so it's not really a comparison.

But I still have to say Newmar.

Or Adrienne Barbeau.

[LawMonkey]

Actually, Meriwether only appeared in the movie shot between the first and second seasons. Newmar was unavailable.

Meriwether was okay. The film is on DVD for about five bucks.

Sir Rhosis

And well worth picking up the DVD, too, particularly as it's the only authorized 60s Batman available right now. "Some days, you just can't get rid of a bomb!"

Oh, and another vote for Newmar as the finest Catwoman. Rrrowl.

[Voyager]

Halle Berry and Michelle Pfeiffer weren't playing even vaguely the same character, so it's not really a comparison.

But I still have to say Newmar.

Or Adrienne Barbeau.
When was she Catwoman? That I've got to see.

But I vote for Newmar. And for sexiest robot, too.

[LiveOnAPlane]

I vote for Julie Newmar, also, but really just dropped in to link to some pics:

Julie Newmar (http://www.spiritone.com/~darren/graphics/julie1.jpg)

Adrienne Barbeau (http://batman.ugo.com/gothamgirls/catwoman/adrienne_barbeau/default.asp) (Well, sorta)

Lee Meriwether (http://batman.ugo.com/gallery.asp?img=6&gallery=batman_catwoman_filmtv)

Michelle Pfeiffer (http://www.comicbookhotties.com/images/michelle-pfieffer/michelle-Pfeiffer-picture.jpg) (Warning: have your popup blockers on when clicking here; it tries to do several. Safe for work, though)

Eartha Kitt (http://batman.ugo.com/gallery.asp?gallery=batman_catwoman_filmtv)

Halle Berry (http://www.gothamist.com/images/2003_9_catwomanhalle.jpg)

[Bryan Ekers]

Nastassja Kinski




:D

[ianzin]

I'd like to vote for Lee Meriwether. I think she was a good actress, as well as being an extraordinarily beautiful and attractive woman, and I don't think she gets her share of nostalgic recognition and attention.

I've nothing against Michelle Pfeiffer (more's the pity, ba-dum, rimshot), but I don't think she was any good at all. When the movie came out, I think the only thing people were impressed by and raved about was the suit, and the fact that the producers got Pfeiffer to wear it. The suit, the suit, the suit... not the actress or the acting.

Haven't seen the Halle Berry flick, based on the advice of millions.

[Kamino Neko]

Lee Meriwether (http://batman.ugo.com/gallery.asp?img=6&gallery=batman_catwoman_filmtv)
Eartha Kitt (http://batman.ugo.com/gallery.asp?gallery=batman_catwoman_filmtv)

The Lee Meriwether link goes to Eartha Kitt and the Eartha Kitt link goes nowhere.

[Chronos]

Halle Berry is sexy. Catwoman is sexy. And ripped skintight leather is sexy. And yet, somehow, the people behind that movie managed to make the combination of those three elements completely and totally un-sexy. I can't imagine how this is possible, but it had to have involved a great deal of skill. You can't screw up that badly by accident.

Michelle Pfeiffer was better, inevitably (since it's not possible to get much worse than Berry as Catwoman), but I wasn't too impressed by her, either. She never seems too remarkable in anything I've seen with her (unlike Berry, who as I mentioned is usually very hot).

The others, I'm too young to remember them on the screen, but based on still pictures, I'd go with Julie Newmar. Which might not be entirely fair; I've heard that much of Eartha Kitt's appeal was her voice, but I can't judge that.

[DesertDog]

The others, I'm too young to remember them on the screen, but based on still pictures, I'd go with Julie Newmar. Which might not be entirely fair; I've heard that much of Eartha Kitt's appeal was her voice, but I can't judge that.Well, for a sample of Ms.Kitt's voice in its prime, think back to last Christmas and the memory of Santa Baby you undoubtedly heard a time or two. That's her. Now, imagine that voice pitched lower and more, hmmm, cat-like.

I'll be in my bunk.

DD

[Mister Rik]

I must be alone in liking Halle Berry's Catwoman. I only vaguely remember Pfeiffer's performance, but I do remember what ianzin mentioned: the suit.

The old Batman TV show was so long ago, and it's been about three decades since I watched it in reruns as a kid, so I really don't remember much about any of those performances. I was also young enough that I never really noticed that sometimes she was white and sometimes she was black.

[ianzin]

Halle Berry is sexy. Catwoman is sexy. And ripped skintight leather is sexy. And yet, somehow, the people behind that movie managed to make the combination of those three elements completely and totally un-sexy. I can't imagine how this is possible, but it had to have involved a great deal of skill. You can't screw up that badly by accident. Perceptive and brilliant commentary. Well said. I've heard that much of Eartha Kitt's appeal was her voice Actually, although Kitt doesn't get my vote, you raise a good point: she was the one who actually sounded most like a cat woman.

Can someone with a higher comix IQ than me please clear up something for me while we're on the subject? Was Catwoman supposed to have any special powers or abilities, other than a pleasing inclination to dress in skin-tight black leather?

[Anaamika]

Me: Eh. Halle Berry was better.
Mrs: No, she wasn't.
Me: Yeah, she was.
Mrs: No. She just wore less clothes.
(beat)
Me: OK. You and I obviously have very different definitions of 'better'.

:eek: :eek: :eek: :eek: Uh, I don't think you and I could ever be friends! Halle Berry was better? She was just naked-er. No way, she didn't even come remotely close and every copy of that movie should be burned and forever removed from the Earth, and I say that about almost no movies.

Michelle Pfeiffer, for sure! I'm surprised no one else agrees!

[cckerberos]

Was Catwoman supposed to have any special powers or abilities, other than a pleasing inclination to dress in skin-tight black leather?
Nope, no special powers. And not much of an inclination to dress in skin-tight black leather, either (until recently).

[Kamino Neko]

Was Catwoman supposed to have any special powers or abilities, other than a pleasing inclination to dress in skin-tight black leather?

Few of Batman's foes have any superpowers - he's got a few, granted, but not many.

Catwoman, like most of Batman's rogues gallery, has some specialised skills, few morals, and something of a fixation.

(Barring a couple elseworlds where she is a literal cat-woman.)

[Fetchund]

Eartha Kitt.

Rrroooowwrrrr! That voice!!!!

[JThunder]

I'd like to vote for Lee Meriwether. I think she was a good actress, as well as being an extraordinarily beautiful and attractive woman, and I don't think she gets her share of nostalgic recognition and attention.
I vote for Ms. Meriwether (http://lymphocytes.741.com/lee.html) as well. She has a more classically beautiful look than Julie Newmar, and I think that she had a more feline grace about her.

[Hey, It's That Guy!]

Julie Newmar was the best, followed by Lee Merriwether in the 1966 Batman movie.

But to me, the perfect modern choice for Catwoman (to help redeem the awful movie) should have been Gina Gershon. It's hard to get any sexier than her. Apparently the producers of the new cartoon series "The Batman" (not to be confused with the much-loved Batman: The Animated Series) agree, since they cast the lovely Ms Gershon as their voice actress for Catwoman.

[MrDibble]

Michelle Pfeiffer, for sure! I'm surprised no one else agrees!

I do. All 3 the 60s Catwomans look ridiculous to me. They may be pretty or have nice voices, but put them in that era's Cat-suit and they just look like bad camp. Like dancers in some cat-themed rival to a Playboy club.

Whereas Pfeiffer looks like someone who could claw your eyes out. I like "dangerous" in my (sometimes)villains.

[cmkeller]

I can't believe I had to scroll almost to the bottom to find someone who voted Pfeiffer.

I see two, and I'll add my own vote as a third. Hot, hot, hot.

[Lord Ashtar]

But to me, the perfect modern choice for Catwoman (to help redeem the awful movie) should have been Gina Gershon. It's hard to get any sexier than her.
Oh man, that's a fantastic idea. She'd be perfect for that. Maybe if they decide to include the Catwoman in any of the new Batman movies they'll get her.

Gina Gershon in a Catwoman suit...damn. Just...damn.

[The Batman]

Pfeiffer. I wasn't around during the TV show (thank god) so my choices are limited, but still, she's better than Berry and the suit's sexier too.

[Skald the Rhymer]

So, the Mrs. & I were watching Batman Returns on A&E this afternoon. After Michelle Pfeiffer made her first appearance in costume, the following exchange ensued:

Me: Eh. Halle Berry was better.


You're insane, dude. Michelle walking downstairs in the backless dress in BR is one of the high points of American cinema.

[Skald the Rhymer]

Few of Batman's foes have any superpowers - he's got a few, granted, but not many.

Catwoman, like most of Batman's rogues gallery, has some specialised skills, few morals, and something of a fixation.

(Barring a couple elseworlds where she is a literal cat-woman.)

Thinking of Batman's Rogue Gallery, the only two I can think of with super-powers are Clayface (the shapeshifting version) and Killer Croc (arguably). The rest all have gimmicks.

[Bryan Ekers]

Thinking of Batman's Rogue Gallery, the only two I can think of with super-powers are Clayface (the shapeshifting version) and Killer Croc (arguably). The rest all have gimmicks.

Man-Bat, arguably, since he and Clayface (at least originally) each took a serum to transform themselves. I guess by that standard, Bane might count as well.

[Kamino Neko]

Thinking of Batman's Rogue Gallery, the only two I can think of with super-powers are Clayface (the shapeshifting version) and Killer Croc (arguably). The rest all have gimmicks.

Actually, now that I think of it, Batman has a surprising number of powered enemies...

Even sticking to the ones that originated in Batman, not ones he's faced because he deals with other heroes: I'd count Blockbuster (both of them) and Orca in the same class as Croc - either superpowered, or normals right on the cusp of it. And the third Clayface was also superpowered (he melted people). I'm unfamiliar with the later Clayfaces, but I understand they're powered, too. Poison Ivy is powered - she's toxic to the touch naturally, she's immune, or near immune to most toxins and diseases, and some writers give her control over plants, in continuity. Man-Bat goes without saying.

That gives 9 or 10 (arguably) powered villains that I know are primarily, or originally, Batman's. (There's more when you include characters like Solomon Grundy and the Floronic Man who he's dealt with several times, but are more identified with someone else.) Still a small number in relation to the size of his rogues gallery as a whole, but more than I thought I'd get for him.

[kunilou]

Although she didn't actually play the part, I'd like to nominate Sean Young.

Who knows. If she had gotten the part, she could have brought a method acting emotionally-unstable-just-underneath-the-surface quality that would have pushed the character in an entire other direction.

Otherwise I'll go with Eartha Kitt. That voice!