Lost my "Charter Member" label? Why?

[Dewey Cheatem Undhow]

Hey guys, quick question -- I subscribed here way back when it first went to a pay site, and I've kept my membership up ever since. I think I was late this last year, and I note my tag now just reads "Member." Any gap was just an oversight on my part, is it possible to regain my "Charter Member" tag?

[Q.E.D.]

I think I was late this last year...
There's the problem.
...is it possible to regain my "Charter Member" tag?
Probably not (http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=7237781&postcount=56). Seems they did at one time, but not anymore. Sorry. :(

[Kozmik]

But apparently Q.E.D. is no longer a "Charter Member", and there is always the possibilty that the administrators will implement this (http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=7450579&postcount=17) by the next board upgrade.

[wring]

(snip) and I note my tag now just reads "Member."
well, I didn't want to say, but, we took a vote and ... ;)

[TubaDiva]

QED is not a paying member; as a member of the Straight Dope Science and Advisory Board he pays no subscription, so that's not a valid comparison.

If you let your Charter Member subscription lapse, that's the end of it. Once lost Charter Member status cannot be regained. Please pay attention.

[Dewey Cheatem Undhow]

You've gotta be kidding me.

[Dewey Cheatem Undhow]

I mean, really, this is just a label in the admin page, right? A five second operation to restore that label?

Good Lord, I went through a really busy patch where I wasn't really banging around on the internet much.

One would think such a minimal courtesy could easily be extended.

[Q.E.D.]

You already had a 30-day window in which to renew. How much more time should they give you? The Charter membership comes with a 50% discount on the subscription fee, and in exchange, you're expected to renew within the given time frame. If they're just going to give back the Charter title to people who forget/are too lazy/are too busy/don't have the money/whatever then what's the point of having a deadline at all? If they do it for you, then they'll have to do it for everyone and a "five-second job" turns into a full-time project.

[Dewey Cheatem Undhow]

I've just gone through my email to see when I got the reminder to pay (which is usually what triggers me to go do it) and it isn't there. Possible I just missed it and deleted it by mistake, I suppose, but that is unlikely; I check my email pretty closely.

Like I said, I went through a stretch where I wasn't banging around the internet terribly much, and didn't notice the lapse until later when I tried to post or do a search (I forget which). I paid up immediately.

Basically, I don't know what happened, but whatever it was was an honest oversight. I have every intention of keeping myself current. I've always kept current in the past; check your records.

I'm a little disappointed that my HMO is apparently more willing to extend common courtesies than the administrators here, and even more disappointed with the tone you're taking. I am, after all, a longtime paying customer; is a little customer service too much to expect?

[Dewey Cheatem Undhow]

I also don't object to paying the higher rate this year, BTW, and while I'd grumble a bit about paying it future years, I could even probably live with that, although I'd prefer to have only paid it this year as a sort of "late fee."

[Dewey Cheatem Undhow]

In fact, I could live with a late fee as a penalty for not paying on time. I think that's far more reasonable.

[Campion]

Perhaps instead we could come up with a new title for former Charter Members who don't renew in time and therefore lose their Charter Membership, become mere Members, and then complain about it? I think we'd all benefit from that.

[What Exit?]

Perhaps instead we could come up with a new title for former Charter Members who don't renew in time and therefore lose their Charter Membership, become mere Members, and then complain about it? I think we'd all benefit from that.
Would "Cranky Old Members" work? ;)

[Colibri]

Would "Cranky Old Members" work? ;)

Members Demeritus?

[ivylass]

I'm a little disappointed that my HMO is apparently more willing to extend common courtesies than the administrators here, and even more disappointed with the tone you're taking. I am, after all, a longtime paying customer; is a little customer service too much to expect?

Oh, for God's sake. You're comparing an internet message board to an HMO? There were stickies all over the place reminding of the deadline to renew. You admit that you were not "banging around the internet terribly much." Are the admins supposed to track you down via snail mail or telephone and make sure you really really really do want to renew at the Charter Membership Rate?

You missed the deadline. You're now a member. Suck it up and quit whining.

[Dewey Cheatem Undhow]

Cute.

You know, about six years ago when I was moving from Texas to New York (I've since moved back), in the hubbub of moving my wife and I neglected to pay one of our credit cards. Naturally, there was a late penalty on the next statement, something that was clearly within their rights to charge.

So we called them, explained our oversight, and asked them to remove the charge as a courtesy. And they did, with little fuss, even though they could have clearly required us to pay it, because we had been a good customer for several years. And it worked out rather well for them, because we've cointinued to be good customers ever since.

And certainly the nice lady on the phone never did anything so preposterous as to ask with a sneer "how much more time do you think we should give you."

It's not like I'm asking for the moon here. Just a little reasonable customer care.

[What Exit?]

Cute.

You know, about six years ago when I was moving from Texas to New York (I've since moved back), in the hubbub of moving my wife and I neglected to pay one of our credit cards. Naturally, there was a late penalty on the next statement, something that was clearly within their rights to charge.

So we called them, explained our oversight, and asked them to remove the charge as a courtesy. And they did, with little fuss, even though they could have clearly required us to pay it, because we had been a good customer for several years. And it worked out rather well for them, because we've cointinued to be good customers ever since.

And certainly the nice lady on the phone never did anything so preposterous as to ask with a sneer "how much more time do you think we should give you."

It's not like I'm asking for the moon here. Just a little reasonable customer care.

Yes, but Q.E.D. is not an admin or Mod, he is an SDSAB, which means he is getting a free ride in exchange for providing some excellent staff reports. So treat his posts as strictly another snarky poster. He is just more equal than the rest of us. ;)

Jim

[Dewey Cheatem Undhow]

Oh, for God's sake. You're comparing an internet message board to an HMO? Yes I am, and unfavorably at that.

Here is why. When I was in college, I cut my hand rather badly over one weekend and had to go to the ER. I was, at the time, covered under my parent's health insurance. Because I was a dumb college kid, I didn't call to tell my parents about it until a day or so later. The health insurance carrier required something like 48 hours of notice after an ER visit in order to pay up. We were one day outside that window.

My dad called them up, discussed the issue with them politely, noted that he had called as soon as he had learned of the injury, and asked them to cover the visit. They did, after a little discussion, because my father had been a longtime customer of theirs and they recognized the request as one for a reasonable courtesy.There were stickies all over the place reminding of the deadline to renew. You admit that you were not "banging around the internet terribly much." Are the admins supposed to track you down via snail mail or telephone and make sure you really really really do want to renew at the Charter Membership Rate?No, but they are to send out an email notice, which I apparently did not get, although I do admit it is a remote possibility that that is my fault, too. At any rate, there was a minor breakdown of communication between customer and service provider, and that sort of minor breakdown ought not be a huge big deal to remedy after the fact.
You missed the deadline. You're now a member. Suck it up and quit whining.My word. I hope you never take a job in customer service if that is your preferred manner of replying to customer requests.

[Dewey Cheatem Undhow]

As a matter of fact, ivy, I'm quite curious: I've now described two situations in my own life that neatly parallel the one here. Do you consider either of them to be "whining"? Are all requests for the extension of a courtesy "whining"?

[Dewey Cheatem Undhow]

Yes, but Q.E.D. is not an admin or Mod, he is an SDSAB, which means he is getting a free ride in exchange for providing some excellent staff reports. So treat his posts as strictly another snarky poster. He is just more equal than the rest of us. ;) Fair enough, although I think carrying the SDSAB badge does confer an inference that he speaks with some authority on these matters. It does imply he is part of the apparatus that runs this show.

So I amend my sentence to say: "And certainly the nice lady on the phone never did anything so preposterous as to dismissively meet our request with 'please pay attention.'"

[What Exit?]

Fair enough, although I think carrying the SDSAB badge does confer an inference that he speaks with some authority on these matters. It does imply he is part of the apparatus that runs this show.

So I amend my sentence to say: "And certainly the nice lady on the phone never did anything so preposterous as to dismissively meet our request with 'please pay attention.'"
That is a fair complaint, not one that will get a change in policy, but a fair complaint.

The SDSAB, definitely does not imply that he speaks with authority on these matters. He has no mod abilities at all and is not consulted on policy and decisions. It is possible that they may take his suggestions a lot more seriously than yours or mine, but that is not even definitely true.
I suspect they will be just as derisively dismissive of his suggestions as ours. ;)

Jim

[TubaDiva]

I mean, really, this is just a label in the admin page, right? A five second operation to restore that label?

Good Lord, I went through a really busy patch where I wasn't really banging around on the internet much.

One would think such a minimal courtesy could easily be extended.

If that was the situation, sure, but that's not the deal.

It's apparently something that takes going between several computer systems (the subscription stuff is not on the same server as the sdmb) and involves some work and some time. More work and time than is warranted for such a change, especially so for a tech department that has a full plate to begin with.

To avoid this, pay your subscription on time and maintain your Charter Member status; once you let it lapse, that's the end of it.

Personally I would love to be able to give you what you want, I'd like to help with some better outcomes here. But there is literally nothing I can do to fix this once it happens, nothing.

All I can do here is work as hard as I can to get the word out when it's resubscription time and then tell the unpleasant truth if you let that time get past you. We do all we can to let you know when it's time to take care of business.

The personal responsibility to renew your subscription is up to you. If it makes you feel better to shoot the messenger, then carry on.

[Dewey Cheatem Undhow]

Well, I guess I have zero incentive to renew in a timely fashion in the future now. That's not the best way to protect your revenue stream, assuming regular, predictable payments are part of your business model.

It would have been nice to have known about this consequence in advance. It is, at the very least, non-obvious from the materials I've seen. And no, brief mentions in an ATMB thread is not obvious.

Suffice it to say I think this represents extremely poor customer service.

The personal responsibility to renew your subscription is up to you. If it makes you feel better to shoot the messenger, then carry on.
And this kind of comment? Abysmal customer relations.

But there is literally nothing I can do to fix this once it happens, nothing. And this? Categorically untrue. There is always something that can be done, depending on how badly you want to please your customers.

What you mean to say is "I don't want to expend the effort to make this happen." Which can, in some cases, be a legitimate response; some customers are intractable, and some ask for the sun and moon. But let's not go confusing the impossible with the merely inconvenient.

[kayT]

Dewey, if you have really been around this long surely you have seen others trying to get the charter back and failing. Why are you acting like a 2 year old?

[Kat]

Like I said, I went through a stretch where I wasn't banging around the internet terribly much, and didn't notice the lapse until later when I tried to post or do a search (I forget which). I paid up immediately.

Weren't on the Internet much?? The Charter Member subscriptions expired on April 28. Subscription reminders were up on the board at least from April 5 (when the Subscription Help 2006 (http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=366113&highlight=charter) thread went up in ATMB). You have 42 posts from April 5 to April 28; it appears that the time period you weren't being active was in March (you only have 7 posts for the month of March).

There were, by the way, announcements at the top of every forum about re-subscribing for most of April, not only threads in ATMB.

[Eutychus]

Why does this mean so much to you?

In the grand, greater scheme of things, taking this much enegy for a name on an internet message board speaks to me of someone who needs a little perspective in his life.

[Kat]

:smack: Ah, no...I cannot apparently read years. You were inactive from January 30, 2006 until April 22, 2006. You posted 9 times between April 22 and April 25, and then not again until yesterday.

Those announcements about renewals were still up, in every forum, when you came back on April 22, though.

[Dewey Cheatem Undhow]

Dewey, if you have really been around this long surely you have seen others trying to get the charter back and failing. Why are you acting like a 2 year old?Actually, no, I was not aware of any other such failures.

And really now, a 2 year old? Was I acting like a toddler when I asked for the late fee refund from my credit card? Was my father when he asked for a time extension from his health insurance carrier?

[Qadgop the Mercotan]

Customer service? I ain't no customer. I'm a member of an elite club, and there are dues that I pay to be a member. How those dues are to be paid was spelled out quite well, along with penalties for non-compliance.

[Kat]

Actually, no, I was not aware of any other such failures.

And really now, a 2 year old? Was I acting like a toddler when I asked for the late fee refund from my credit card? Was my father when he asked for a time extension from his health insurance carrier?
Truthfully, if you requested them more than 4 months after the fact, yes, you would have been.

[Dewey Cheatem Undhow]

:smack: Ah, no...I cannot apparently read years. You were inactive from January 30, 2006 until April 22, 2006. You posted 9 times between April 22 and April 25, and then not again until yesterday.And all but one of those posts, you'll note, related to a very specific computer problem I was having and was trying to fix post-haste. I wasn't exactly lolling around on the boards, skimming for things to read. I was tightly focused on that particular issue.

[jjimm]

Not only is the whine absurd, but the desired resolution childish.

You snooze, you lose - and by extension: you snozt, you lost.

[Dewey Cheatem Undhow]

Why does this mean so much to you?Because customer service is important, and a dying art to boot.

[Eutychus]

Because customer service is important, and a dying art to boot.

But customer service doesn't mean giving you something that you had to right to because you decided to whine about it.

Customer service as it applies to everybody on the board means the the rules are applied evenly and fairly to everybody. It does not mean making exceptions for certain people who feel they deserve special consideration.

Besides, people can see that your sign up date was April of 2001. If a title means that much to you, perhaps you should go out for a breath of fresh air.

[Dewey Cheatem Undhow]

Not only is the whine absurd, but the desired resolution childish.

You snooze, you lose - and by extension: you snozt, you lost.Again, I have no problem with the fact that the SDMB is perfectly entitled to handle this as it is.

I am simply questioning the wisdom being so rigid in that approach with respect to a longstanding customer, as well as the wisdom of essentially telling a valued customer to bugger off.

[hawksgirl]

Again, I have no problem with the fact that the SDMB is perfectly entitled to handle this as it is.

I am simply questioning the wisdom being so rigid in that approach with respect to a longstanding customer, as well as the wisdom of essentially telling a valued customer to bugger off.
Because then every Charter Member who didn't sign up in time would whine about it with the same reasoning that you have and expect to be catered to?

[Dewey Cheatem Undhow]

How those dues are to be paid was spelled out quite well, along with penalties for non-compliance.I disagree that the "penalties for non-compliance" were in any way spelled out well.

[Dewey Cheatem Undhow]

If a title means that much to you, perhaps you should go out for a breath of fresh air.It is raining, and I am doing some long-overdue semi-automated tasks that require my periodic attention to boot.

Having said that, can we dipense with the "why are you investing so much energy into this," please? I'm sitting here at my desk, doing various tasks, including occasionally posting in this thread. It really doesn't take that much energy.

[jjimm]

I am simply questioning the wisdom being so rigid in that approach with respect to a longstanding customer, as well as the wisdom of essentially telling a valued customer to bugger off.You're not being told to bugger off, you're just being told that you missed the window of opportunity to attain your (IMO pointless) "title".

And the credit company you dealt with must be very rare: the ones that I've dealt with recently would not only have downgraded your title, but also banned you, put a bucket on your head and whacked it with a hammer, and kicked your arse off the internet permanently.

[Eutychus]

Having said that, can we dipense with the "why are you investing so much energy into this," please? I'm sitting here at my desk, doing various tasks, including occasionally posting in this thread. It really doesn't take that much energy.

Well, we could, but c'mon ... honestly ... any more energy than it would take to say "Oh gee, I lost my charter member title because I was too late in re-signing back up" is WAY too much energy.

[Dewey Cheatem Undhow]

Because then every Charter Member who didn't sign up in time would whine about it with the same reasoning that you have and expect to be catered to?
A line of argument that my credit card company and my father's insurance carrier both could have pursued, and could have done so more persuasively, since the monetary stakes were considerably higher.

Having said that, I've certainly expressed a willingness to cough up a reasonable late fee, which is how most companies prevent this sort of rush by their consumer base.

Further, does anyone really think this is a problem? That hordes of charters are going to start harassing the poor admins? This kind of argument can be true, but more often than not it's just a way of avoiding the customer's request.

[Dunderman]

I am simply questioning the wisdom being so rigid in that approach with respect to a longstanding customer, as well as the wisdom of essentially telling a valued customer to bugger off.Then leave.

Seriously, after seven years in customer service, I still don't get this. What's with the whining? What's with the "Here's some friendly advice on customer service" shtick, which every single time really means "Do everything exactly as I say or I will complain about it until you do"?

And what is this about? Your title being "Member" instead of "Charter Member". Well boo-hoo.

I wish they'd make us all members, just to shut people like you up. How the fact that you lose charter member status when you're late with paying has managed to evade your attention is a mystery; this is not exactly the first "what happened to my title?" thread.

[psycat90]

You've got to be kidding me.

I for one do believe that yes, if your little public tantrum were to result in a status change, then the poor admins would most certainly be harassed by hordes of ex-charters looking to get their status back. This is not the first thread of its kind, sadly, I'm certain it won't be the last.

[Dewey Cheatem Undhow]

How the fact that you lose charter member status when you're late with paying has managed to evade your attention is a mystery; this is not exactly the first "what happened to my title?" thread.I do not constantly monitor every thread in these forums -- indeed, as noted earlier, I have been inactive for long stretches as of late -- and I should not have to in order to be aware of this particular consequence.

And politely but firmly asking for a courtesy, and countering flimsy rationales for avoiding such courtesies, is not "whining." Nor (on preview) is it a "tantrum." If you really think it is, I feel sorry for you -- you must get hosed an awful lot.

[hawksgirl]

I do not constantly monitor every thread in these forums -- indeed, as noted earlier, I have been inactive for long stretches as of late -- and I should not have to in order to be aware of this particular consequence.

And politely but firmly asking for a courtesy, and countering flimsy rationales for avoiding such courtesies, is not "whining." Nor (on preview) is it a "tantrum." If you really think it is, I feel sorry for you -- you must get hosed an awful lot.
There is a huge difference between a messageboard and a credit card company or whatever. When the company cuts you a break, you feel good that you were satisfied with the service, and the company doesn't risk a lot of loss from other people finding out and trying the same thing. By posting here, it is made public, and all other users know that you can whine and get your way successfully, and cry foul if they don't because they know that someone else got it to work.

Can you see the difference now?

[Dunderman]

I do not constantly monitor every thread in these forums -- indeed, as noted earlier, I have been inactive for long stretches as of late -- and I should not have to in order to be aware of this particular consequence."Constantly monitor every thread"? It was made clear from the start, and the subject has been up several times since.And politely but firmly asking for a courtesy, and countering flimsy rationales for avoiding such courtesies, is not "whining." Nor (on preview) is it a "tantrum." If you really think it is, I feel sorry for you -- you must get hosed an awful lot."You've gotta be kidding me" is polite?

"Flimsy rationales" - jeez. There's a rule in place. You didn't bother to know it, and as a consequence you fell foul of it. Now, you cannot understand why an exception shouldn't be made in your case, and every attempt to explain it to you is by definition a "flimsy rationale".

I mean, do you really not understand the concept? You seriously believe that this is a matter of, as you put it, a "five second operation"? If so, please open an "Ask the typical customer" thread, 'cause I have some questions to ask you.

But above all: why do you care? What's so important about the word "charter"?

[samclem]

Dewey. Just throwing this is as a minor possibility.

Has your email address changed in the last year? From the one you keep on file with the SDMB. Or have you had the same email address for the last year, the one on file, and continued to read emails to that address? I know that I have more than one email address and might not always read an email to one of them.

Just thinking.

[Rilchiam]

There is always something that can be done, depending on how badly you want to please your customers.

What you mean to say is "I don't want to expend the effort to make this happen." Which can, in some cases, be a legitimate response; some customers are intractable, and some ask for the sun and moon. But let's not go confusing the impossible with the merely inconvenient.

IOW, you admit that having one's status changed is not a right, or even a necessity. But the admins should do it for you because you're speeeeeecial.

[Chronos]

Wait a moment... Dewey is a lawyer, right? So we have here a lawyer complaining that the rules were followed, and he doesn't think they should have been? I don't get it.

[yojimbo]

They did it for some people. More turned up with the same moan. Obviously they have made a decison not to do it anymore.

Suck it up Dewey Cheatem Undhow. You are here long enough to know nothing will come out of this.

Look on the bright side, you're still a member. The really cool hush hush things that tubadiva promised a few months ago can't be far any now ;)

[wring]

you could always make a sig line linking to this thread so everyne could know what's really important.

[Eleusis]

You can have my title, dude.

[Dr. Drake]

I remember when the board went from no dues (free!) to annual dues. At the time, there was an IMMENSE amount of discussion on Charter Members, including the fact that if you lost that status, for any reason whatsoever, that was just too bad. I was a lurker at the time and debated joining up, and sort of regret not going for it. But the rules were clear.

Now, you can't have become a charter member unless you were around that time. So your claim to be ignorant of the rule isn't going to garner much sympathy; it's not a new rule. Maybe you didn't pay close attention, but whose fault is that?

I wish the HMO hadn't cut you a break. I wish the credit card company hadn't waived the late fee. They have created a monster: I shouldn't have consequences, I was only a little late. I shouldn't have consequences, I didn't know the rules or didn't pay attention to the rules. I see this sense of entitlement all the time, and I'm tired of it. There was a deadline and you missed it.

Customer service has nothing to do with it; customer services is about the solution of a customer's problems, and perhaps a little kindness. They are being kind, they're just not being weak and giving in. There isn't a problem; you are still a full member of the SMDB.

If you'd like, you could change your user name to Dewey Cheatem Undhow Who Is Really a Charter Member but Due to an Evil and Unfair Policy by the Wicked SDMB Has Unjustly Lost That Label and Must Hereafter Be Incorrectly Listed as a Mere Member.

[imthjckaz]

I also don't object to paying the higher rate this year, BTW, and while I'd grumble a bit about paying it future years, I could even probably live with that, although I'd prefer to have only paid it this year as a sort of "late fee."The SDMB doesn't have late fee's.
You're either a Charter Member or a Member.

Because of an unintended oversight, you lost your Charter status.

Life is tough.

You could continue to whine and throw a tantrum about that loss, but I think the only thing that would happen is that somebody might call a waaambulance.

Or you could just suck it up.

The choice is yours.

[Tapioca Dextrin]

Here is why. When I was in college, I cut my hand rather badly over one weekend and had to go to the ER. I was, at the time, covered under my parent's health insurance. Because I was a dumb college kid, I didn't call to tell my parents about it until a day or so later.

So your excuse when you were a teenager was that you didn't understand the consequences of your actions. Your excuse now that you in your, what? forties? fifties? is that you are not responsible for you own actions. I sure hope you don't have a job that entails telling anyone to admit responibility for what they've done IRL.

FTR IMO any thread where the OP complains 20+ times about something toally asinine is (IMO) throwing a hissy fit.

[Frank]

They did it for some people. More turned up with the same moan. Obviously they have made a decison not to do it anymore.
We did do it last year, for quite a few people. That was the first renewal, and some bewilderment was expected. After a couple of weeks, the line was drawn - oh well, sorry, you are SOL. This year, we didn't expect bewilderment. Nor did we expect someone renewing four months late to pitch a hissy. Our fault, no doubt.

[Kat]

I do not constantly monitor every thread in these forums -- indeed, as noted earlier, I have been inactive for long stretches as of late -- and I should not have to in order to be aware of this particular consequence.

"Constantly monitor every thread" *blinks and reads again* "Constantly monitor every thread"??

I will repeat: Notification of the renewal period was put up as an announcement. Not a single regular thread. Not even as a sticky in every forum. As an announcement!!! Like the one currently up by Dex about rules and etiquette. An announcement shows up on the top of every forum, labeled Announcement, above even the sticky threads, and set apart from them with a gray bar. You can't open any forum without seeing the announcement at the top, and as far as I know, you can't post a new thread without first going into the forum. If you were so focused on solving your computer problem that you couldn't be bothered to read the official announcements at the top of the forum, that is the administration's fault? Not to mention that was discussed in a thread you started the day after you posted to the Amazon.com pitting (Amazon.com pit post: 8:09 pm on 4/22, Linux thread started: 4:42 pm on 4/23).

Incidentally, TubaDiva posted last year a list (http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=6109281&postcount=33) of everything they did in 2005 to make people aware of the upcoming renewal. I couldn't find such a list this year, but I doubt that they did less, knowing what happened last year: which was several threads from people saying "I missed the renewal cutoff, can I pleasepleasepleaseplease get my Charter Membership back?" Some missed the deadline by a few hours (http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=314248&highlight=charter), some took a few days (http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=316527&highlight=charter) and Tuba sent in names to request the status change back to Charter Member, and more and more people jumped onto those threads. Eventually, the decision was announced (http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=328538&highlight=charter) that it wasn't going to happen anymore.

What's the point of even having a cutoff date when people are going to expect to get the same deal after it's expired?

[twickster]

I disagree that the "penalties for non-compliance" were in any way spelled out well.
Well, other than the fact that what being a charter member would entail -- in terms of the reduced rate and the distinction in status line -- at the time we originally went PTP. If you'd been around and paying attention then ... oh wait, you say you were. My bad.

[Dewey Cheatem Undhow]

Dewey. Just throwing this is as a minor possibility.

Has your email address changed in the last year? From the one you keep on file with the SDMB. Or have you had the same email address for the last year, the one on file, and continued to read emails to that address? I know that I have more than one email address and might not always read an email to one of them.

Just thinking.Hi Sam, no, the email address I use here is a forwarding account from my law school alma mater, so it dumps into an account I do read. Dunno what happened here though, because the renewal email is definitely not in there.

[Rilchiam]

After four months, might it have been deleted automatically? And perhaps you should change your contact info to include an email account that you do read.

[Dewey Cheatem Undhow]

I wish the HMO hadn't cut you a break. I wish the credit card company hadn't waived the late fee. They have created a monster: I shouldn't have consequences, I was only a little late. I shouldn't have consequences, I didn't know the rules or didn't pay attention to the rules. I see this sense of entitlement all the time, and I'm tired of it. There was a deadline and you missed it. "Entitlement" would imply some sort of obligation on the part of the SDMB, and I am clearly not claiming that. Your comment -- and others like it -- are misplaced.

If this was a place where I had little history, where my patronage was an unknown factor, I would never ask for a courtesy in a million years: the business does not know if I am a long-term customer and has no reason to give it. What I'm talking about here is not a sense of entitlement; far from it, I'm talking about maintaining a mutually beneficial customer-provider relationship.

The HMO didn't cut my dad a break to be generous; they did it because they valued his past patronage, and wanted to be sure that patronage continued. The credit card company did not waive my late fee out the kindness of their hearts; they did it because they valued my business and wanted that business to continue. As, indeed, it has.

[Dewey Cheatem Undhow]

After four months, might it have been deleted automatically? And perhaps you should change your contact info to include an email account that you do read.Well, as I said, it forwards into an account that I do read (the alumni account is not an actual mailbox; it just forwards to an account I designate). And that account does not delete incoming emails after any time period.

[What Exit?]

...snip...

The HMO didn't cut my dad a break to be generous; they did it because they valued his past patronage, and wanted to be sure that patronage continued. The credit card company did not waive my late fee out the kindness of their hearts; they did it because they valued my business and wanted that business to continue. As, indeed, it has.
Of course the Credit card company had hopes that you would continue to pump thousands of dollars through there hands and more than pay for the late fee.
The HMO probably gets $3000 to $6000 per year (please adjust down for inflation is long ago). These companies both had huge monetary incentives to keep you happy.
The SDMB, has a best the hopes of getting $7.99 per year for another 5 to 10 years. Not the same incentive is it?
Where as if they leave things alone, which is easy, they either piss you off and never get another dime or you complete your venting (and getting abused) and pony up $14.95 per year for 5 to 10 years. The Risk reward says they might as well not accommodate you and take their chances. They need to jump through a few hoops to help you, if they help you, they then have to help others. It would probably be a very bad business decision to help you out.

Jim

[Dewey Cheatem Undhow]

So your excuse when you were a teenager was that you didn't understand the consequences of your actions.Well, in the HMO example, the party requesting the courtesy was my father, not me; he was the customer, not I.Your excuse now that you in your, what? forties? fifties? is that you are not responsible for you own actions. 33, and that is not my argument. I fully admit that this was an oversight on my part, and have pretty much done so from my very first post.FTR IMO any thread where the OP complains 20+ times about something toally asinine is (IMO) throwing a hissy fit.Oh, come now; surely you can recognize that the bulk of my posts after the start of the thread are simply replying to those who have elected to take issue with my request.

[Dewey Cheatem Undhow]

If you'd like, you could change your user name to Dewey Cheatem Undhow Who Is Really a Charter Member but Due to an Evil and Unfair Policy by the Wicked SDMB Has Unjustly Lost That Label and Must Hereafter Be Incorrectly Listed as a Mere Member.Sorry for coming back to Drake's post, but at this stage I'm just responding to general points raised rather than specific posters, and this line seems to exemplify one of those general points. So let me say this:

Slow down. I've registered some disappointment in the administration in this thread, but registering some disappointment does not automatically translate to "the admins are evil and I hate them and they all terribly unfair, mean people." We ought, I think, to be able to register disappointment without being saddled with a whole host of viewpoints that were never expressed.

This is also why I balk at descriptions like "whining" or "tantrum." I'm hardly a wild-eyed lunatic here. I've stated my position, I think, with politeness and my criticims have been restrained (and no, Priceguy, I do not consider "you've gotta be kidding me" to be an especially harsh sentiment, particularly given the culture of these boards). I disagree with the judgment at work here, and have given my reasons for it, but that doesn't make me some kind of self-appointed martyr.

[TubaDiva]

At the time of the resubscription drive there were announcements at the top of every forum. These announcements were in place for nearly a month.

There were also active threads on the subject in ATMB. These threads were prominently displayed on the Straight Dope Message Board front page.

Finally, emails were sent to each and every subscriber that had not yet resubscribed and had a subscription due to expire in a few days . . . every member who had selected "yes, it's okay to send me email" in their system settings. If someone selected "no," we respected their wish to not receive email from us and did not send an email renewal notice.

DCH, please look at your settings. I note that the default setting to receive email is "yes;" you have to specifically select "no" yourself.

[Dewey Cheatem Undhow]

Nor did we expect someone renewing four months late to pitch a hissy. Just FTR, I re-registered on June 3, not just now. I know this because I have the PayPal reciept in my inbox. Not that it makes a difference or anything, but let's be sure our facts are accurate.

I registered then because I first realized I my error when I went to use the search function to find an answer to a particular question. I didn't realize the loss of title until just now because I haven't been actively participating for several months.

[Alma]

Finally, emails were sent to each and every subscriber that had not yet resubscribed and had a subscription due to expire in a few days . . . every member who had selected "yes, it's okay to send me email" in their system settings. If someone selected "no," we respected their wish to not receive email from us and did not send an email renewal notice.
I don't know what might have happened, but I never received emails this year or the last regarding subscription renewal. I've had the same email address for years and I religiously check my spam folder, but I never did see it. I also don't think there's any kind of white-listing going on with my provider.

But that doesn't matter to me so much. I think I paid early just to avoid any problems. Looking at the user panel I see that I can pay now for the next subscription period, so there isn't any reason for me to fail to keep up.

Fer chrissakes, It's just a title. Does anybody really think there's some kind of superior status associated with having paid on time? I'm only interested in keeping my subscription current to assure that I can keep posting and searching. They can change my title to "big nobody" for all I care.

[TubaDiva]

Oh, please, don't be so modest; that's my job. :)

Not sure why you're not receiving these emails, Alma, but I do note that we did get a lot of complaints from people who later found their emails in the spam trap. Some email systems filter more strenuously than others.

[Rick]

::: reaches for a can of WD-40:::
Yup, sounds like a stuck whiner valve, let me lube it for you.
:D

[Kozmik]

You snooze, you lose - and by extension: you snozt, you lost.And by extension: you lost.

[ivylass]

My word. I hope you never take a job in customer service if that is your preferred manner of replying to customer requests.

I have worked in customer service. I will go out of my way to help a customer if I can. However, as TubaDiva has explained, there is absolutely nothing she can do. You, however, continue to beat the dead horse instead of accepting the reality that there is absolutely nothing she can do.

You were not active on the boards. Fine. If it were that important to you to remain a Charter Member it would have stayed more in the forefront of your brain. You missed the window. Sorry, dude, but there were notices, and do you not bear some responsibility to keep track of your own memberships? What happens if you let your car insurance lapse? Is that your fault or the fault of the insurance company for not tracking you down? How much notice do you need?

[Dewey Cheatem Undhow]

you lost.Shouldn't this actually be lozt? :)

ivy, as I've stated repeatedly, the fault for the lapse is my own; I have not claimed otherwise (I have said that the loss of title was a non-obvious consequence, but that is not the same thing). Fault doesn't really enter into my argument; letting that credit card statement slip by was my fault, too, but that didn't affect what a good customer service response was to that situation.

And far from "beating a dead horse," all I'm doing at this point is responding to what others are saying. If you don't want a response, don't reply to my posts.

[ivylass]

You're coming across with an attitude of "I screwed up, so YOU fix it."

[Ethilrist]

Could it be that the real issue is not the "charter" part but the "extra $7.50 a year" part? If you're not going to post for four months out of the year, paying an extra $7.50 eats into the profit margin a bit, I would think.

If you're arguing from the point of "hey, if you charge people $15 a year, you'll lose a lot of posters..." that was the whole point!!! They started charging so they could separate the wheat from the chaff. You may not be chaff, sir, but, like me, you're also not whole-grainy goodness.

[Chronos]

I don't know what might have happened, but I never received emails this year or the last regarding subscription renewal. I've had the same email address for years and I religiously check my spam folder, but I never did see it. I also don't think there's any kind of white-listing going on with my provider.

But that doesn't matter to me so much. I think I paid early just to avoid any problems.That would explain it, then. If you were already paid up when the e-mail went out, it never would have been sent to you in the first place, because you didn't need it.

[Dewey Cheatem Undhow]

You're coming across with an attitude of "I screwed up, so YOU fix it."Decided to take your turn at the deceased equine, eh?

I disagree with that characterization, of course. All I can really say, I suppose, is that if you never ask those businesses with whom you have a longstanding relationship for the odd pass, regardless of fault, then you simply aren't being an effective consumer.

Could it be that the real issue is not the "charter" part but the "extra $7.50 a year" part? If you're not going to post for four months out of the year, paying an extra $7.50 eats into the profit margin a bit, I would think.

If you're arguing from the point of "hey, if you charge people $15 a year, you'll lose a lot of posters..." that was the whole point!!! They started charging so they could separate the wheat from the chaff. You may not be chaff, sir, but, like me, you're also not whole-grainy goodness.
Oh, poppycock; the stated reason was a desire to defray operating costs.

At any rate, my long absences make me something of the ideal customer -- I pay the fee, but don't use up a lot of bandwith. That is, I bring in revenue but add little to costs.

[JohnBckWLD]

In honor of all the work he did here (http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=2998087&postcount=4); all those in favor of switching DCU's title from Member to a customized Libertarian Librarian tag say aye.

Aye

[Waverly]

At any rate, my long absences make me something of the ideal customer -- I pay the fee, but don't use up a lot of bandwith. That is, I bring in revenue but add little to costs.I am the more ideal customer. On top of paying, I have given up my Charter Member status in order to more fully fit in with the hoi polloi. Further, I post the most insightful and entertaining posts on the internet. It is time I renounce my Member status.

I hereby request, I demand, the title Elder God.

[Guinastasia]

I don't know what might have happened, but I never received emails this year or the last regarding subscription renewal. I've had the same email address for years and I religiously check my spam folder, but I never did see it. I also don't think there's any kind of white-listing going on with my provider.

But that doesn't matter to me so much. I think I paid early just to avoid any problems. Looking at the user panel I see that I can pay now for the next subscription period, so there isn't any reason for me to fail to keep up.

Fer chrissakes, It's just a title. Does anybody really think there's some kind of superior status associated with having paid on time? I'm only interested in keeping my subscription current to assure that I can keep posting and searching. They can change my title to "big nobody" for all I care.


Thank you. What the fuck is the big deal, anyways? I think the first time we went subscription, there was a glitch in the system and I was labelled just "member", even though originally I was a "Charter Member". I didn't even notice until someone pointed it out. Who the fuck cares?

[twickster]

And far from "beating a dead horse," all I'm doing at this point is responding to what others are saying. If you don't want a response, don't reply to my posts.
You do realize that that keeps the thread active. If you really consider the horse dead, you could ask a mod to lock the thread. Of course, we'd all then turn our attention to other matters, which may or may not be pleasing to you.

[Alma]

Not sure why you're not receiving these emails, Alma, but I do note that we did get a lot of complaints from people who later found their emails in the spam trap. Some email systems filter more strenuously than others.

It's probably something akin to that, maybe it's my ISP. I'm not terribly worried about it, tho.

[CynicalGabe]

Dude... It's a label, that shows up under your user name.. on an internet message board. Suck it up and move on with your life. I find it hard to believe that anyone, let alone an adult, can muster the outrage to continue ranting about this. There is nothing they can do, and it was your fault.

Get over it.

[Dewey Cheatem Undhow]

You do realize that that keeps the thread active. If you really consider the horse dead, you could ask a mod to lock the thread. Of course, we'd all then turn our attention to other matters, which may or may not be pleasing to you.Well, yes, it keeps the thread active, as does your replying to me. I can reasonably take your decision to reply as meaning you wish to continue the discussion, right? And I'm not one to abandon my own threads; I started the topic, I should be willing to participate (within reason) as long as others wish to continue discussing the thread topic (or thread hijack, as the case may be).
I find it hard to believe that anyone, let alone an adult, can muster the outrage to continue ranting about this.Well, again, I dispute that I'm ranting about anything at all, or that I'm particularly outraged. One can express disappointment at a decision without it being a rant or rising to the level of outrage. Indeed, I've been entirely civil here.

But more to the point -- again -- I pretty much ceased lobbying the admins very early in this thread. Since then, I've just been replying to other posters, disputing their misconceptions about my argument, my motivations, and (apparently) my worth as a human being.What the fuck is the big deal, anyways? It isn't, actually; I think others in this thread are actually making this out to be a bigger thing than I intended.

Look, I take the position that, as a consumer, everything is pretty much negotiable. Even things that are supposedly non-negotiable. That means, rule one, at least ask for the occasional dispensation. Rule two is don't settle for the first "no," and sometimes don't settle for the second or third, either. "No" is often a stock answer that disappears after a little discussion. You simply aren't being an effective consumer if you take that first "no" as inviolable. You're effectively leaving money on the table if you do.

So is the title a small thing? Sure. Worth a handful of electronic missives written on a rainy holiday? I think so, at least. It isn't like I was giving up an afternoon of golf or something. It cost me very little to pursue the inquiry a bit. I'd be a poor consumer if I did not do so.

[hawthorne]

Dewey Cheatem Undhow
Well, again, I dispute that I'm ranting about anything at all, or that I'm particularly outraged. One can express disappointment at a decision without it being a rant or rising to the level of outrage. Indeed, I've been entirely civil here.

But more to the point -- again -- I pretty much ceased lobbying the admins very early in this thread.If your original point is done, there's no shame in saying "I think we're done here, could mods close the thread", or walking away.

If you're wanting to it to continue or for it to stand as an expression of disapointment, it should be in the Pit (civility notwithstanding).

Letting it dribble on makes you look like a lawyer who doesn't know when to sit down.

[twickster]

Well, yes, it keeps the thread active, as does your replying to me. I can reasonably take your decision to reply as meaning you wish to continue the discussion, right?
Not necessarily -- I just wanted to express my impatience that you won't let this sucker die, and suggest that there might be some attention-promiscuity, if not actual attention-whoredom, in your keeping on with it.

And I'm not one to abandon my own threads; I started the topic, I should be willing to participate (within reason) as long as others wish to continue discussing the thread topic (or thread hijack, as the case may be).
But the thread topic has become "who the hell cares?"

[Anaamika]

I think it's wrong to say this place has entirely bad customer service. I would like to point out that every time the boards have gone down for a day I get an extra day added to my subscription. When I don't get DSL service for a day Verizon doesn't extend my contract for a day, they tell me to go fuck myself and deal with it. I think that behavior on the part of Ed is great customer service.

[CaveMike]

Dewey, why don't you offer to write a Staff Report? Surely you could create an interesting report out of some matter of law. That will set your status to SDSAB and wipe out your (higher) renewal fee.

[Q.E.D.]

Dewey, why don't you offer to write a Staff Report?
It's not quote that simple. I've no doubt that Dewey could produce a well-written and informative Staff Report on whatever subject he chooses, but whether the SDSAB title is eventually conferred depends on a variety of factors which Ed Zotti must weigh. Usually, more than one Report needs to be be written, as well. Should Dewey want to try that route, the person to contact is C K Dexter Haven, who coordinates the SDSAB (and does a darn fine job at it, too).

[Dewey Cheatem Undhow]

When I don't get DSL service for a day Verizon doesn't extend my contract for a day, they tell me to go fuck myself and deal with it. Really? Jesus, I'd switch providers over that kind of treatment if I were you. My cable internet provider is pretty good about crediting my account over outages, as long as I call them to let them know.

As for the staff report idea -- I'm flattered that you think me capable of that, but honestly, the areas of law I work with are boring, at least to normal people. I mean really, really boring. I'm fairly certain I'm paid partially for my ability to read this stuff without falling asleep. I'm actually very concerned here, as a report written by me may cause several members to become comatose, family members might have to consider pulling the plug, and I just cannot have that on my conscience.

[Shodan]

I've registered some disappointment in the administration in this thread, but registering some disappointment does not automatically translate to "the admins are evil and I hate them and they all terribly unfair, mean people." We ought, I think, to be able to register disappointment without being saddled with a whole host of viewpoints that were never expressed.Come now - if you were really a Charter Member, you would know this is impossible.

;)

Regards,
Shodan