Is Greyhound really that bad? (+ Is there anything to do in Buffalo?)

[HazelNutCoffee]

A friend of mine and I are planning to travel a bit on the East coast this August. We plan to start in DC, then go to NYC, Boston, and then Toronto. Neither of us have a driver's license, so it'll be all buses and trains.

I'm used to traveling on buses - when I was in Europe I prefered them to trains because of the ridiculous difference in price. The image of Greyhound in the States, however, seems to be rather . . . negative. The only real concern I have right now is how we're going to get to Toronto. There's a bus that runs from DC to NYC that I've taken before, which was perfectly clean and lacking in colorful characters. The trip from Boston to NYC is relatively short, so I don't think that'll be too much of a problem either. But from Boston to Toronto - I think it'll take something like 12 to 13 hours. Planes are too expensive on our budget.

I was thinking we have a few options - take the very cheap Greyhound from Boston to Toronto and suck up the fact that we'll be a bit cramped for 12 hours; or, take the bus back to NYC and go to Toronto from there. The train from NYC to Toronto is $90. There is a bus from NYC to Toronto but that's not much different from the Boston-Toronto bus, and it's more expensive, for some reason. We could also take a bus to Buffalo, spend a night there, and then take a bus to Toronto, which all together might cost around $70. (Also, the bus from Boston to Toronto is a ridiculous $45.)

So I guess my questions are:
1) Is Greyhound horrific enough to make it worth taking the train for twice the price? (And what, exactly, makes it so bad? Is it dirty? Unreliable? Are the passengers frequently violent/aggressive? Would two girls be more inclined to attract unwelcome advances?)

2) Is there anything to do in Buffalo, NY for a day? Without a car, I should add.

[Anaamika]

I take Greyhound and Adirondack Trailways often, a girl alone, and rarely have any problems. Once they lost my bag and jumped through hoops to get it back. Occasionally I've been hit on. I can handle myself when being hit on. When I have traveled with a girlfriend I get hit on even less because many guys are afraid to approach you when you're not alone.

And for Buffalo - Buffalo sucks eggs (sorry buffalonians) but you could see Niagara Falls!

[ShelliBean]

My husband has had to take Greyhound quite a few times in his life (trucking companies will often send you on the bus to their HQ to pick up your truck so you don't leave your car sitting somewhere unfamiliar for long periods of time). His opinion: it sucks balls. Not just balls, schweaty balls. Part of it is taking 12 hours to make a 6 hour drive, layovers in bus stations - some are OK, some are in the worst parts of town, part of it is the clientele (and I ain't being snooty, we're one of them after all), and part of it is the general grimyness of riding with a bunch of people with their worldly possessions stuffed under the bus in garbage bags while attached to a public toilet, and all that that implies.

I would pay for the train ticket if I had the money, but that's because in my family we feel like we've put our time in on the bus. If you haven't it might be a fun experience.

[pulykamell]

I actually quite enjoyed Buffalo the last time I was there. Then again, I like to eat, and finding the best wings and beef on weck more than kept me occupied. YMMV.

Oh, and yes, Greyhound sucks. My impression of them may be jaded, since I once took a 50-hour journey from Los Angeles to Chicago on them, and then again onto Boston a week later. I don't ever want to experience that again.

[Cerowyn]

So I guess my questions are:
1) Is Greyhound horrific enough to make it worth taking the train for twice the price? (And what, exactly, makes it so bad? Is it dirty? Unreliable? Are the passengers frequently violent/aggressive? Would two girls be more inclined to attract unwelcome advances?)

2) Is there anything to do in Buffalo, NY for a day? Without a car, I should add.If you're considering the train, flying is probably the next cheapest to a bus, especially if you're traveling between two major cities. But, if my choice was between a bus and the train only, the price premium on the latter would have to be very high to make me choose the former. Just in terms of comfort and rest, the train is a much better option.

If you're in Buffalo, the most obvious day trip would be to Niagara Falls, although most of the tourist-y stuff is on the Canadian side. Of course, once you're on the Canadian side, a couple of hours in Niagara-on-the-Lake is a must do! And frankly, once you get past the Falls themselves, a much more worthwhile trip than Niagara Falls. Unfortunately, the resident SDMB Buffalo expert I know is no longer a poster here, but I'm sure there are others who could chime in.

And, hey, if you're looking for some guides in Toronto, there are a lot of Dopers here. We might even be able to coordinate a get-together ('cause Og knows we need a reason, since we never seem to pull them together unless there are visiting Dopers).

[Idle Thoughts]

Greyhound is not bad if: A. you don't mind cramped conditions (not for someone who has claustraphobia, trust me) and B. you don't mind not getting very much sleep those days (that you're traveling on one).

Other than that, it's way cheaper than anything else and it's fairly easy and relaxing. Some of the newer ones have TV screens in the middle of the aisle (from the ceiling) and it plays movies and such. I've taken a LOT of greyhounds in my life and really, they're not as "dirty" as most say they are...but granted, do try (if you decided this route) not to sit in any of the far back seats because this is where the bathroom is.

It really depends too on things that you have no control over such as how many people are on the bus and how crowded it is. If you're able to get on a bus that is mostly empty or half full....or are able to, in any case, have a seat all to/for yourself, your ride will be much easier and more relaxing, not to mention more comfortable. But again, this relies on things you can't really change either way.

But overall, I think it's a pretty good way to travel...and it doesn't take as long as it used to.

Plus the distances you'd be taking it are very short. So I think your best bet would be the bus and unless you're expecting a limo-like ride, you should be okay with it. Again, the only way you wouldn't is if you don't like slightly cramped places or want to sleep. Sleep, unfortunatly, is mostly all of impossible on these rides. The seats just aren't comfortable enough. This is another reason why, if you go this route, you should try to get a seat all to yourself.....or, if you must share, share a seat with someone you know (which is good you're going with your friend).

Hope this helps. I've taken Greyhound over 15 times, I'd say, in the last ten years, so if you ever have any questions, I can help (and I'm sure others can too. :p)

[kanicbird]

You could get a bus from Boston to Albany NY (actually Rensular) , NY, from there you can get Amtrak out to Buffalo (and beyond?), this would shortcut having to travel down to NYC and back up again and should save quite a bit of time (Trains out to Buffalo come from NYC through Albany)

Really if you can swing it this leg would be so much worth it to catch a flight, it's a long haul.

Have you considered changing your cities? If you get rid of Boston or Toronto, and add in Philly it will make your travel time quite a bit less (Note you can take commuter rail from Philly to NYC, and for that matter longer, but those are 2 major cities which IMHO is worth a visit.

[Queen Bruin]

I have taken Greyhound quite a bit over the years and overall have a pretty jaundiced view of the bus. Here's (http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=8368046&postcount=2) a post I made about Greyhound a while ago. The whole thread (http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?p=8368046&) is worth reading. Things may be different on the East Coast but they downright suck here.

[Muffin]

The Greyhound Bus Museum (http://www.greyhoundbusmuseum.org/buses.html) in Hibbing, Minnesota, is first rate. When experienced along with the giant open pit Hull Rust Mahoning Mine (http://www.ironrange.org/attractions/mining/hull-rust/) in Hibbing, the Lake Superior Railroad Museum (http://www.lsrm.org/Home/Home.asp) in Duluth, and the Great Lakes Maritime Museum in Duluth (http://www.williamairvin.com/), you get a feel for how the USA developed into an economic powerhouse.

And that is as close to a Greyhound bus as you should ever get, for riding one one truly sucks. I'm getting nauseous just thinking about it.

[Darryl Lict]

I've only been on one Greyhound bus, and it was one of the more miserable experiences I've had. Now, I've been on buses in Burma, Cambodia, Viet Nam, Peru, Lithuania, and Mozambique, amongst other places. From a comfort perspective, all the foreign buses were worse, but the fact that you are on a fucking bus in America considerably diminishes the aesthetics of the experience.

Having a travel companion will make life much better. Get on the bus early and grab a paired seat so a dirtbag like me doesn't try to sit next to you.

The reason I'm commenting on this thread is that I'm intrigued by a travel concept and wanted to mention it to you. There is a highly competitive network of very cheap buses that go from Chinatown to Chinatown in major metropolitan areas. I believe there is service in every single city on your itinerary. Now, I love hanging out in Chinatown, so in every city, I'd end up there eventually anyhow. WARNING: I HAVE NEVER BEEN ON A CHINATOWN BUS AND HAVE NO IDEA WHAT IT IS LIKE.

Have fun on your trip, those are some killer cities.

[Least Original User Name Ever]

I've done Greyhound from Detroit to Buffalo (to see an ex while we were still dating).

The drive is a little boring (is it taking you through Canada or through the States?) but it's fine. You really can meet up with some interesting people along the way. With that being said, I'm not a foxy young woman, so it could be a different experience for you.

Lemme remember...the bus station in Buffalo is downtown. Unfortunately, downtown is pretty much dead. I'm not kidding, it's flippin' dead. There is a pretty fun nightlife sector (on Chippewa Street). There is a subway system, but using the word "system" is odd. It'll take you down Main Street. That's it. Up and down the street. It'll take you from downtown (by the HSBC Arena) past where I went to school (stop and bask in the glory) down to...the University of Buffalo. Like I said, it's pretty much shitty, but there are some nice little stores.

I do have some contacts in Buffalo still and if you wanna see what I can, drop me a line. It also depends what you want to do.

Ooh! If you go right by where I lived (right next to the LBJ housing projects), you'll head past the world's worst golf course (Deleware Park) and get to the Albright-Knox modern art museum (right across the street from Buffalo State). If you like modern art, I highly suggest it. There are also some Frank Lloyd Wright homes that are on the street right behind the museum. Across the 198 from the Albright Knox is the Buffalo History Museum. I never went there (kept forgetting/found out it existed at the end of my stay there) but I could see how it might be fun. In the immediate area is an exact replica of David, one of 3 in the world (or so I'm told).

Yeah, drop me an email if you need more info/contacts.

[HazelNutCoffee]

Thanks for all the advice! I'll have to discuss this a bit more with my friend, but I might be back with more questions. Unfortunately we can't alter our destinations, or at the very least we have to end up in Toronto because we're meeting a friend there. I'm tempted to cross Boston off the list, though, because it's mucking everything up in terms of transportation.

[Rube E. Tewesday]

Haven't taken a but in years, but it's always been pretty much a case of "Hey, whatta you know, I thought Charlie Manson was still inside". Much prefer the train, though it's far from perfect.

[gigi]

The reason I'm commenting on this thread is that I'm intrigued by a travel concept and wanted to mention it to you. There is a highly competitive network of very cheap buses that go from Chinatown to Chinatown in major metropolitan areas. I believe there is service in every single city on your itinerary. Now, I love hanging out in Chinatown, so in every city, I'd end up there eventually anyhow. WARNING: I HAVE NEVER BEEN ON A CHINATOWN BUS AND HAVE NO IDEA WHAT IT IS LIKE.
Yeah, I've heard it's $10 between NYC and Boston? A young bohemian girl I know of takes it regularly and I haven't heard that she's had any problems.

The worst I had was a 37-hour trip from OKC to New York. The only seat available was drenched in cheap whiskey and I was miserable also because I was leaving my honey behind. What a drag. But generally, for shorter trips like yours, it's not too bad, especially if you have a friend with you.

[Jackmannii]

Scariest thread title I've seen in a long time.

[Frosted Glass]

Greyhound has treated me well through my college years. The most uncomfortable experience for me was when I took the bus from San Francisco to Las Vegas via Los Angeles. The trip overall was not too bad but the San Francisco to LA leg was ridiculous. I have never seen so many people awake and talking on an overnight Greyhound. When I travel between Pittsburgh and New York overnight, no one is saying a word. Everyone is passed out and thats the way I like it at night. I had three different people trying to talk to me at once when all I wanted to do was sleep. After I gave up on the idea of sleep it was ok though. The people were nice enough...strange, but nice. Of course, I am also a guy. My female friends have had very different experiences riding the Greyhound solo. They all revolve around unwanted advances but nothing frightening, just annoying.

I actually prefer the amount of space you get on a Greyhound over the space on a plane. Of course, you are rarely on a cramped plane for 8+ hours.

[KSO]

Have you checked flights on JetBlue? Some of their one ways between Boston and Buffalo are only $59.

[Kalhoun]

Eh...if you're with a friend, it won't suck nearly as much. For starters, you have each other to distract yourselves from the pathetic lot you're riding with. Secondly, it's pretty damn cheap and reliable. Finally, if nothing else, you'll have a bus story to share with your friends.

Go for it. You'll have fun on your trip!

[HazelNutCoffee]

Have you checked flights on JetBlue? Some of their one ways between Boston and Buffalo are only $59.
Huh. I don't know why I never considered that. I guess if we took a plane to Buffalo and then took a bus it would cost about $80-90. Something to think about. Thanks!

[sugar and spice]

I've taken Greyhound between NYC and Upstate a few times, I actually don't have anything bad to say about it, and I would definately use Greyhound again for trips 5 hours or less. It was worth what I paid for the ticket, thats for sure. I think that today, JetBlue is the best option for NYC->Buffalo, but thats just because its so much faster.

I've only heard nice things about Chinatown buses.

[Cerowyn]

I actually prefer the amount of space you get on a Greyhound over the space on a plane. Of course, you are rarely on a cramped plane for 8+ hours.The lone advantage of being unemployed for me is no more 10,000 km flights eight (or more) times a year.

[eleanorigby]

I only rode Greyhound once--but that was enough. It was a long time ago, around 1983, from Iowa City, IA to Champaign, IL. It was daylight. I was thin, young, attractive. I dozed off and awoke to find some nasty looking dude covering me--my head, and upper body with a huge coat (think Hagrid-sized). I cried out, "Hey!" and he looked taken aback and then said he thought I might be "cold".

I have no idea what he was trying to do (or what he hoped to achieve), but I got off that bus with relief in Champaign--very grateful that my boyfriend was at the station to pick me up. He rented a car and took me back to Iowa City a few days later...

I would NEVER sleep on a Greyhound, if I were to ride one again(not likely).

Some people are nice on the bus, but be careful.

[Cerowyn]

Huh. I don't know why I never considered that. I guess if we took a plane to Buffalo and then took a bus it would cost about $80-90. Something to think about. Thanks!
It's almost as if I don't even post...

[John DiFool]

I rode them years ago between college and home-the main thing I remember is the awful headaches I got from the mixture of cigarette smoke and diesel fuel fumes.

[Idle Thoughts]

Smoking isn't allowed on the buses anymore, thank goodness. :p

[OtakuLoki]

Have you checked flights on JetBlue? Some of their one ways between Boston and Buffalo are only $59.

Is that with the mandatory airport fees, or not? I don't mean to say you're necessarily wrong in suggesting that a discount air carrier may be cheaper than the bus, but it can be a shock for the inexperienced air traveller to assume that air fare is the only cost they will face for flying.



For my own experience, I've done the bus thing often. Not so much in the past several years, but I used to go down to NYC fairly regularly.

In my experience while Greyhound was acceptable, i.e. you'd get there, usually on time, their bus fleet was older, and smaller, than their competitor: Trailways. Now the problem with Trailways is that it's actually a system of smaller companies with reciprocity agreements - so you can't easily compare fares online. You can buy the tickets in any Trailways stop to anywhere they go - no problem. What you can't do, on your own, is find fare information. But they do have 1-800 numbers for fare information and in my experience were very patient and willing to help a customer with questions. (For Adirondak Trailways, that number is: 800-858-8555)

Odd bit of trivia: Greyhound Canada used to be part of the Trailways system, not Greyhound US. :eek:

In spite of that, my experience (mostly with Adirondack Trailways, Peter Pan, and Capital Trailways) the fares were cheaper than the comparable Greyhound fares, the buses were newer, and had more comfortable seats, and the trips were more tightly scheduled, i.e. less layover time.

For those suggesting rail as an alternative, it may have changed, but when I was doing the travelling I'd mentioned - it was invariably the most expensive travel option, and the least convenient. Now, part of that was Amtrak only went through my city once a day, with a Boston-to-Chicago run that was timed for convenience of the arrival departures at the ends of the trip. i.e. going east the train was leaving at 2 or 3 AM. I know that's changed since that time, but it has left me very leery of considering rail travel.

I've said it before, but I do want to emphasize again - my experience is several years out of date, so things may have changed. Take this with a grain of salt.

One more thing to mention to the OP, several years ago at least, both Greyhound and Trailways allowed one to purchase tickets that would allow one to ride their buses anywhere for a set number of days, rather than to and from specific destinations. These passes were on the order of a month-long time frame, and if one were planning to do a lot of travelling around a region were often a very good value for the money. More expensive than a single round trip ticket, but I think they were comparable to three one-way tix, or so...

I can't seem to find a mention of it on the Trailways websites, but here's the Greyhound (http://www.discoverypass.com/index.asp?referrerid=1) version. A quick look at the fare rates indicate it may be more expensive than I recall, but if you check out your planned fares, it may still be cheaper for you.

[HazelNutCoffee]

It's almost as if I don't even post...
Sorry, I cdid see your post, but for some reason I only associated your suggestion with flights to Toronto, which are all expensive becase they're international flights, apparently. I had to have it spelled out for me. :smack:

Yes, I am aware of other fees (airplane tax and such), but thanks for the reminder, Otaku!

I had a guy put a blanket over me on an airplane, but he was cute and Welsh, so it made me happy . ;)

[Cerowyn]

Sorry, I cdid see your post, but for some reason I only associated your suggestion with flights to Toronto, which are all expensive becase they're international flights, apparently.Well, even if you're talking Boston to Toronto, Expedia.com gives a base price of $172 per person (one way, mid-week in August). Even with the taxes, it's at least in the same ballpark as the train, and the flight is less than two hours. That's got to be worth some extra cost. :)

[OtakuLoki]

Yup. But looking at bus fare for that same set of assumptions: mid-week in August, it's twice the fare ($87). Almost four times as much if HazelNutCoffee can buy the tickets, fourteen days in advance ($45). (Of course, it's a minimum 14 hour trip, vs. 2 so...)

[HazelNutCoffee]

Yup. But looking at bus fare for that same set of assumptions: mid-week in August, it's twice the fare ($87). Almost four times as much if HazelNutCoffee can buy the tickets, fourteen days in advance ($45). (Of course, it's a minimum 14 hour trip, vs. 2 so...)
Yeah. There's no way I'm taking the plane from Boston to Toronto. Even considering the time I'd be saving, the different between $45 and $172 is a lot. Taking the plane to Buffalo seems like a reasonable option, though.

[yola]

I would say Greyhound serves a much needed enterprise. Cheap travel and a bus goes where trains don't.

Besides that, last fall I found myself riding a Greyhound bus from Reno to Modesto, then Modesto to Oakland.

My sister was going to give me a ride from Boise to Modesto. We made it as far as Sparks where I shouted "I'd rather take a Greyhound bus than ride with you". I got a cab from Sparks to Reno ($20 with tip) and the cab driver said "your not gonna like the bus and should have stayed with your sister" after I told him what I was doing.

My advice is to relax, sit back and see America on Greyhound. At first, when I got on the bus, I was a little intimidated by being in close quarters with strangers. I react the same way on planes or any public transporter. (heh) Once I confirm we are all human I can breathe a sigh of relief. Which reminds me. There is a commode (which is what I think they call toilets on a bus or a train. Head on a boat and I forget what they call them on planes.)

To get to Modesto from Reno the bus went through Sacramento with a 6 hour layover for another bus to Modesto. Most Greyhound bus stations are right downtown and I had time to walk around the state capitol and the Sacramento River. One tip is each bus station has lockers you can rent to stow your stuff so you don't have a lot to carry while visting the city.

On my mail run ride on Greyhound the drivers stopped at places that sold food and water but its easy enough to carry your own.

You know life is an adventure and its what you make of it. Long live Greyhound!

[Muffin]

Greyhound? That was my first coroner's inquest.

[CalMeacham]

I haven't ridden the system in years, but back in 1980 I wanted to travel across the USA 9which i hadn't seen most of) by rail, using a Rail Pass. Therre was only one problem -- there WAS no USA Railpass.

So i got a 30-day pass for the Greyhound system $341.25 for 30 days unlimited travel on any Greyhound bus. I mooched off friends and relatives or stayed at college dorms across the country. I actually finagled a couple of extra days on the pass. I also wrangled a copy of the phone book-sized complete country schedule (which they don't like to let out).

I have no complaints about the bus. They were clean and efficient (and on time! )A lot of servicemen rode the bus, and a lot of Hispanic folk, especially in the Southwest. But everyone was polite, and interesting to talk to.


A train would've been roomier and easier to get up and walk around in. and you could often get a snack (which generally I wouldn't recommend. In my experience, Amtrak's fare is unpredictable and overpriced, and you'd never mistake their dining car for the Orient Express'. )

[Lissla Lissar]

I don't know if you'll be transfering, but Canadian Greyhound buses are supposed to be much less traumatic than American. I've only ever been on Greyhound in Canada, and it's fine. I've never been hassled. I used to bus a lot when i was in school.


WARNING: I HAVE NEVER BEEN ON A CHINATOWN BUS AND HAVE NO IDEA WHAT IT IS LIKE.
A good friend of mine took the Chinatown bus from Philly to DC a couple of weeks ago. She said that there was an actual bullet hole in the windshield, and the driver talked on his cell phone the whole way, varying his driving speed to match his conversation. And the bus door didn't close properly. She said it was a hair-raising ride.

[CalMeacham]

The reason I'm commenting on this thread is that I'm intrigued by a travel concept and wanted to mention it to you. There is a highly competitive network of very cheap buses that go from Chinatown to Chinatown in major metropolitan areas. I believe there is service in every single city on your itinerary. Now, I love hanging out in Chinatown, so in every city, I'd end up there eventually anyhow. WARNING: I HAVE NEVER BEEN ON A CHINATOWN BUS AND HAVE NO IDEA WHAT IT IS LIKE.


Here in Boston the Fung=Wah Bus Company is a joke and scandal. They've had a disproportionate number of accidents and close calls, and constantly seem to be in the news.