Star Wars Droid ponderings

[toadspittle]

I was watching a bunch of Star Wars this weekend. I have a couple of questions/debate topics re: droids.

1. Why are droids so hated? Is it a simple case of discrimination? (Is Lucas trying to make a comment on racism, etc.?) We all remember the famous Mos Eisley cantina entrance, where the bartender tells Luke, "We don't serve their kind here! ... Your droids. They'll have to wait outside. We don't want them here." Likewise in Attack of the Clones, a bartender yells at Artoo when he, Anakin, and Padme are slumming it aboard that refugee ship.

Whence the hate? For the Luke-era stuff, I can see people being a bit pissy over memories of the Separatist droid armies that, I'm sure, did a lot of damage. But in AotC?

2. What does(n't) C-3PO know about Princess Leia in Star Wars (Ep.IV)? I know he had his mind wiped at the end of Ep.III, but I can't tell if, when he sees the hologram Artoo starts playing, he honestly doesn't know who she is, or if he's playing dumb. It kind of seems like the latter, but if that's the case, why bother telling Luke that they were aboard a Rebel ship in the first place?

[toadspittle]

anyone?

[Little Nemo]

I think Lucas just wanted to have a downtrodden minority to show how his heroes were more enlightened than the common herd. But he didn't want to use some human group or other group that was too close for comfort. He wanted his audience to feel admiration for his heroes without being distracted by sympathy for the victims.

[toadspittle]

Hmm. But even Obi-Wan (Ep. 2) says, "Well, if droids could think, there'd be none of us here, would there?"

[Labtrash]

For #2 in the OP:

During the battle on the blockade runner, didn't C3PO say something to the effect of "there'll be no escape for the princess this time", which would indicate he DID know who she was (but maybe not what she looked like)?

Other than that, I got nothing.

[ArizonaTeach]

Lucas likes to rewrite history, and I have read in a puff piece (it might have even been in the Star Wars Insider) that he put that droid detector in the cantina to show racism...I tend to think that's not true and that it's a tacked on explanation...the calls of racism were big enough for him to add Lando at the time, and I don't remember him pointing to the droid situation to show he's an enlightened, hip dude. By the time of Ep 2, it's canon, though.

In the EU, there's a lot of talk about the general preudice towards non-humans, however.

As far as 3PO, I always figured she was in tight spots before, that's all.

[bouv]

As far as the bar goes, droids don't drink, so they aren't going to spend any money. Just takin' up space, so don't let them in.

[GuanoLad]

I think they're looked on as an inferior class of pseudo-people. Artificial beings that are academically and physically superior to real people? Bastards, the lot of 'em!

[toadspittle]

Lucas likes to rewrite history, and I have read in a puff piece (it might have even been in the Star Wars Insider) that he put that droid detector in the cantina to show racism

Jesus. I've watched Star Wars probably a hundred times, and I never realized that was supposed to be a "droid detector!" I thought it was just coincidental that it started making noises when the droids walked by.

[Little Nemo]

I think they're looked on as an inferior class of pseudo-people. Artificial beings that are academically and physically superior to real people? Bastards, the lot of 'em!Plus, they go stealing our women away with their fancy mechanical attachments.

[Rachael Rage]

"Droid Detector?" Really? I will have to watch my DVDs again, but I've seen that film hundreds of times and never noticed a "Droid Detector." My guess is that there was some random background noise that happened to occur when the droids walked in, and some fan along the way decided to give it significance, as when an epic, heroic back-story is given to an extra in the corner wearing a rubber mask.

It's not like the bartender needed a detector, all the droids in the Star Wars universe seem pretty obviously mechanical.

[Sage Rat]

It's not like the bartender needed a detector, all the droids in the Star Wars universe seem pretty obviously mechanical.
Customers generally look pretty customer-y, and yet stores will sometimes put a bell on the door (a customer detector) just to know that someone they need to deal with came in the door.

[robardin]

We all remember the famous Mos Eisley cantina entrance, where the bartender tells Luke, "We don't serve their kind here! ... Your droids. They'll have to wait outside. We don't want them here."
One rationalization for the "no droids in the cantina" policy would be due to the place being such a frequent venue for mayhem and shady goings-on. If your customer base needs to do such things as:
arranging the smuggling of goods or passengers in dark corners
point and fire blasters at people for bounty (or to avoid capture for bounty)
Slash someone's arm off with a lightsaber, fer Chrissakes, not only committing aggravated assault but announcing to all that you're a Jedi outlawed these past 20+ years
then having droids around would be a Bad Thing, as they can record and play back holos of events for Johnny Stormtrooper, not to mention the possibility of the total wreckage of the place that could ensue if a fight that starts with shoving and one-on-one blaster fire escalates into full-on melees of combat droid bodyguards.

[Pleonast]

I always assumed it was a straightforward statement, "We don't serve droids". They only have alcohol there, not oil.

Which is why Futurama robots drink alcohol. It's a play off the teetotaling Star Wars droids.

[Dunderman]

"Droid Detector?" Really? I will have to watch my DVDs again, but I've seen that film hundreds of times and never noticed a "Droid Detector." My guess is that there was some random background noise that happened to occur when the droids walked in, and some fan along the way decided to give it significance, as when an epic, heroic back-story is given to an extra in the corner wearing a rubber mask.There is a machine on the entrance wall. It flashes blue and gives off a noise when the droids pass, and then the bartender says his line. If it was intended to be a droid detector I don't know. I'd give even money either way.

[levdrakon]

I can't remember where the scene took place, but I remember a little droid having heat applied to its feet and it was pretty obviously painful, and it was pretty obviously torture.

Why would anyone do that?

[smiling bandit]

I can't remember where the scene took place, but I remember a little droid having heat applied to its feet and it was pretty obviously painful, and it was pretty obviously torture.

Why would anyone do that?

There is actually a serious answer to the question. The flippant asnwer, of course, being that it's a sight gag. It could be frightening or serious, but in this particularly case it was a joke. They're "torturing" the robot's feet, like he had nerves down there or something.

The serious answer is that the "torturer-bot" apparently had some kind of droid-brain malfunction back in the day. So she (having a female persona) started to enjoy causing pain. She particularly liked screwing with otherdroids, and applied her droid abilities to the art and science of torture. Eventually Jabba picked her up as a torturer, and the rest is history.

[Sunspace]

There is a machine on the entrance wall. It flashes blue and gives off a noise when the droids pass...I always thought that was a vendng machine. :)

[Hypno-Toad]

I think the reason is that Lucas needed the droids to be outside to witness the stormtroopers searching the city. So he came up with this.

[levdrakon]

The serious answer is that the "torturer-bot" apparently had some kind of droid-brain malfunction back in the day. So she (having a female persona) started to enjoy causing pain. She particularly liked screwing with otherdroids, and applied her droid abilities to the art and science of torture. Eventually Jabba picked her up as a torturer, and the rest is history.They've got control chip/collar/thingies. Why torture something unless you hate it? Who cares if the torture-bot is programmed to torture? Why waste the time and energy that way?

My point is R2D2 & C3PO weren't welcome or served in the cantina not because the bar didn't happen to have oil-bath facilities, but because they were hated.

[control-z]

There is a machine on the entrance wall. It flashes blue and gives off a noise when the droids pass, and then the bartender says his line. If it was intended to be a droid detector I don't know. I'd give even money either way.

I always took it as a driod detector, although I don't remember noticing it until several viewings.

[cochrane]

I tend to believe Three-pio's mind actually was wiped at the end of Episode III. Otherwise, in Episode IV, he would have had to make some connection between Luke and Anakin, if only to say, "I was built by an Anakin Skywalker. Could you and he be related?" I know the mindwipe was put in Episode III strictly to force continuity, as I'm sure people have had the same question since The Phantom Menace.

[smiling bandit]

They've got control chip/collar/thingies. Why torture something unless you hate it? Who cares if the torture-bot is programmed to torture? Why waste the time and energy that way?

She wasn't programmed for it. She picked that up on her own, as it were. Apprently, she had some odd malfunction which caused her to become essentially sadistic. But why not? Apparently Driod tech is very far advanced; all they seem to lack is the capacity to, well, "guess." Given the emotions expressed by R2 and C3P0, a psycho Droid isn't unrealistic.

Regardless, Jabba didn't care what she did as long as the Droids got their jobs done, so she pretty much amused herself by tormenting them, as well as anything else she got her cold droid limbs on.

[Morbo]

For #2 in the OP:

During the battle on the blockade runner, didn't C3PO say something to the effect of "there'll be no escape for the princess this time", which would indicate he DID know who she was (but maybe not what she looked like)?

Other than that, I got nothing.

My take on that was that his mind was wiped at the end of Episode III, but since then he's had adventures with Capt. Antilles aboard the Organa's rebel ship Tantive IV, and those adventures involved Leia escaping the Empire on a few occasions.

If it hadn't, there'd be real problems with him saying things like "What a desolate place this is" rather than "I was built here."

Of course, there's the matter of Owen Lars not recognizing 3PO right away when he went to buy droids off the Jawas. ("You. I suppose you're programmed for etiquette and protocol...on second thought, didn't you live at my moisture farm for a while before we inexplicably let you fly away with Senator Amidala?")

Maybe protocol droids all look and sound like that. (Although we've never seen another one that looked like him other than the rude one painted black in ESB).

[Malvert P. Redd]

Maybe protocol droids all look and sound like that. (Although we've never seen another one that looked like him other than the rude one painted black in ESB).

Not true. There was a couple of white ones aboard the Tantive IV and a few on Yavin.

[Morbo]

Not true. There was a couple of white ones aboard the Tantive IV and a few on Yavin.

Missed those then. I guess there's a basic Protocol Droid model kit. (Who put the gold plated skin on him? I can't remember. Wasn't he unfinished at the end of Phantom Menace?)

[Mister Rik]

Not true. There was a couple of white ones aboard the Tantive IV and a few on Yavin.
White, or silver? If I remember correctly, the first time we see C-3PO he's standing, apparently having a conversation, with a silver version of himself.

I've actually been pretty curious as to how Anakin came to be building a protocol droid in the first place. Was he refurbishing a broken-down, discarded droid that somebody dumped on Yatto? Assembling random spare parts he found in the junkyard? Or are droids such ubiquitous commodity items in the SW universe, ala personal computers, that it's simple and inexpensive enough for a slave kid to order a kit via mail order?

[Bosda Di'Chi of Tricor]

"We don't serve their kind here! ... Your droids. They'll have to wait outside. We don't want them here."

He is obviously not running a Robosexual Bar.

Duh.

[Hypno-Toad]

He is obviously not running a Robosexual Bar.

Duh.
Or maybe he's just tired of them hitting on the slot machine.

[msmith537]

One rationalization for the "no droids in the cantina" policy would be due to the place being such a frequent venue for mayhem and shady goings-on. If your customer base needs to do such things as:
arranging the smuggling of goods or passengers in dark corners
point and fire blasters at people for bounty (or to avoid capture for bounty)
Slash someone's arm off with a lightsaber, fer Chrissakes, not only committing aggravated assault but announcing to all that you're a Jedi outlawed these past 20+ years
then having droids around would be a Bad Thing, as they can record and play back holos of events for Johnny Stormtrooper, not to mention the possibility of the total wreckage of the place that could ensue if a fight that starts with shoving and one-on-one blaster fire escalates into full-on melees of combat droid bodyguards.

Or simply that they are machines and you don't bring them into a cantina for the same reason you don't bring a motorcycle in. The bartender might have been being sarcastic, telling Luke to leave his farm equipment outside. Clearly anti-droidism isn't so common on tatooine that it was immediately apparent to Luke what he was talking about.

Or there could be some resentment for droids and automation on depressed planets like Tattoine where jobs may be hard to find.




He is obviously not running a Robosexual Bar.

What did you just say?!!

Oh..sorry..I thought you said roMOsexual.

[ArizonaTeach]

Jesus. I've watched Star Wars probably a hundred times, and I never realized that was supposed to be a "droid detector!" I thought it was just coincidental that it started making noises when the droids walked by.Well, it's all part of the magical nuances of Star Wars. You know how subtle those movies are!

:D

Honestly, I can't tell you if it was always supposed to be a droid detector, but I can guarantee that it's the current official version of what it is. Hell, there's probably an explanation in one of the Star Wars novels or even a short story in one of the collections that gives a huge backstory to the cantina owner explaining his anti-droid bias, and I'm 95% sure it likely connects to Anakin Skywalker.

[Malvert P. Redd]

White, or silver? If I remember correctly, the first time we see C-3PO he's standing, apparently having a conversation, with a silver version of himself.


I'm pretty sure the ones in A New Hope were white. You see a silver one turn up in The Phantom Menace. Its name was TC-14. They made an action figure out of him. It was exactly the same as C-3P0, but because of the color and the inclusion of a serving tray accessory, that figure sold for ridiculous amounts at online auctions.

[Malvert P. Redd]

Another nitpick I just remembered. The Death Star Droid action figure wasn't actually the "Death Star" droid. The one on the Death Star was black. The action figure was silver. The silver model is the droid seen babbling in the Jawa vehicle's junkhold. I really hope someone got fired over that.

[Mister Rik]

I'm pretty sure the ones in A New Hope were white. You see a silver one turn up in The Phantom Menace. Its name was TC-14. They made an action figure out of him. It was exactly the same as C-3P0, but because of the color and the inclusion of a serving tray accessory, that figure sold for ridiculous amounts at online auctions.
Hmm. I'll have to dig out my VHS tape and look again. Maybe this is something else Lucas changed on the DVD :p

[Morbo]

I'm pretty sure the ones in A New Hope were white. You see a silver one turn up in The Phantom Menace. Its name was TC-14. They made an action figure out of him.

(Bolding mine)

Wasn't it a woman droid? In fact, didn't the black-skinned one from ESB also have a woman's voice? Is 3P0 the only one we've heard speak with a male voice?

[Malvert P. Redd]

(Bolding mine)

Wasn't it a woman droid? In fact, didn't the black-skinned one from ESB also have a woman's voice? Is 3P0 the only one we've heard speak with a male voice?

If I recall, the only thing the 3P0 doppelganger in ESB said was "Et-Chu-Tah!" Wasn't a particularly male or female voice. With the exception of the robot waitress in AOTC, I always think of most of the droids in the SW universe as male. EV-9D9 never struck me as a female, but the Star Wars Databank describes her as such. Huh.

[Lemur866]

The "We don't serve their kind here!" was a joke I say, a joke, son. See, the cantina serves 500 kinds of mutant aliens without batting an eye, yet let a *droid* walk in and they're prejudiced.

And there's a silver version of C3PO in the first minutes of A New Hope, shuffling down the hallways of the rebel blockade runner with C3PO and R2D3...but the silver droid turns left when C3PO and R2D2 turn right, and we never see it again. C3PO has therefore always been some sort of standard model droid. Until The Phantom Menace screwed up the continuity by having him built by Annakin out of spare parts.

[Bosda Di'Chi of Tricor]

And there's a silver version of C3PO in the first minutes of A New Hope, shuffling down the hallways of the rebel blockade runner with C3PO and R2D3...but the silver droid turns left when C3PO and R2D2 turn right, and we never see it again. C3PO has therefore always been some sort of standard model droid. Until The Phantom Menace screwed up the continuity by having him built by Annakin out of spare parts.Said spare parts from a standard model protocol droid.

[Mister Rik]

And there's a silver version of C3PO in the first minutes of A New Hope, shuffling down the hallways of the rebel blockade runner with C3PO and R2D3...but the silver droid turns left when C3PO and R2D2 turn right, and we never see it again.
That's the one I'm talkin' about!

[Malvert P. Redd]

I always wondered what the purpose of the Death Star mouse droid was. Turns out, he was a courier! Found that out when you actually get to play its character during one of the Jedi Knight games.

[tonedef]

I think there was a bunch of humans who hundreds of years back went to a planet of just droids and captured a heap of them and brought them back to there planet and get them to work for them for a few centuries entill finally after a war the droids where freed.
Now it seems there is a different bar for droids then humans, maybe one day they can get along and droids will be allowed to site anywhere they want on the spaceship!

[Bosda Di'Chi of Tricor]

I think there was a bunch of humans who hundreds of years back went to a planet of just droids and captured a heap of them and brought them back to there planet and get them to work for them for a few centuries entill finally after a war the droids where freed.
Now it seems there is a different bar for droids then humans, maybe one day they can get along and droids will be allowed to site anywhere they want on the spaceship!

Write this up as a script, & show it to Lucas.

Given his penchant for tossing internal consistency to the 4 winds, you may have written Star Wars 7.