You-Snark-It Forbidden Thread (Mafia Discussion)

[Scuba_Ben]

LIVING PLAYERS FROM THE YOU-SOLVE-IT MAFIA GAME PLEASE STAY OUT!

It seems to be my turn to start the Forbidden Thread for the current Mafia game (see game thread) (http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=447411).

The usual rule applies in this thread: Living players and eligible subs please stay out of this thread. Dead players are welcome after their death scene has been posted.

To start the peanut gallery commentary: As I understand the rules, the death scene and dossier take the place of investigation roles. With zero power roles, this game will favor the nitty-gritty attentive players.

Who's going to be the first to get lynched? Place your bets now. Kat? zuma v1? sachertorte? A new player?

[SkipMagic]

I added "Mafia Discussion" to the thread title to help make it less ambiguous for folks who aren't involved with the game.

[USCDiver]

Sorry, sorry, sorry! I got the PM and thought I'd already sent it back. My head's spinning over all this and I'm trying to keep up with here and the link Mtgman sent. Hopefully, I'll have at least a sorta basic working knowledge of what's going on and what I should do. Again, I apologize for the delay. Now I'm off to reading and the other confirming.

Bolding Mine. Um what link and confirming would that be? To the scum boards perhaps?

[Panurge]

Bolding Mine. Um what link and confirming would that be? To the scum boards perhaps?

I think it's a link to the flash tutorial on the scum boards.

[Mtgman]

Bolding Mine. Um what link and confirming would that be? To the scum boards perhaps?
Yea, you weren't the only person to pick up on that. I'm not sure I did the right thing by explaining what I had sent her, but I did have interaction with her, specifically, that I didn't have with others, so I figured I should explain it. Also note I didn't say that was the only link I'd sent her, just that I had sent a link to a mafia tutorial to her.

Enjoy,
Steven

[NAF1138]

Yea, you weren't the only person to pick up on that. I'm not sure I did the right thing by explaining what I had sent her, but I did have interaction with her, specifically, that I didn't have with others, so I figured I should explain it. Also note I didn't say that was the only link I'd sent her, just that I had sent a link to a mafia tutorial to her.

Enjoy,
Steven


I think you were fine. She said something that was meant to reffer to a specific situation, she is new and doesn't know that she really has to watch what she says (even if she "knows" this, she doesn't know it), I think you would have said the same thing no matter what her alignment. Frankly that last one is the most important.

You might not have said it if she wasn't new, but then she wouldn't have posted that either.

[Mtgman]

By the way, this game is designed to be spectator friendly. The comments shared about each player are only the tip of the iceberg, there are lots more like those, some crazier, under their covers(so to speak). The logic puzzle is solvable by anyone as info is released(please let the players do their own work though) and we're happy to have people participate in making the gruesome, and very unflattering, death scenes for those players too lazy to write their own.

Enjoy,
Steven

[CatInASuit]

So, the game is about to kick off properly with the first Day coming up shortly.

I wonder how the game will start.

Random Voting
Dossier Discussion
What the secret is

or just general panic and argument :D

[NAF1138]

So, the game is about to kick off properly with the first Day coming up shortly.

I wonder how the game will start.

Random Voting
Dossier Discussion
What the secret is

or just general panic and argument :D


My money is on option 3.

Go team secret!

[USCDiver]

I think that the DA, LLP will at the least steer discussion towards the Dossiers. I'm interested to see how they react if the town is flat-out against publicly disclosing them. Will Pleonast shoot his off just to be himself? Will sachertorte involve himself in a long winded, numbers focused, argument with half the town? Will the end result help the Associates or the DA?

[NAF1138]

never mind

[Mtgman]

Oh, now that's interesting. Pleonast is trying to get Santo Rugger to organize a "reveal the dossiers" party in his death scene. Kind of rude to impose on the dead like that, IMHO, but it does open up a new aspect of gameplay. Instead of just color/flavor in the death scenes, there could be one-shot strategy. Interesting.

Enjoy,
Steven

[Scuba_Ben]

Oh, now that's interesting. Pleonast is trying to get Santo Rugger to organize a "reveal the dossiers" party in his death scene. Kind of rude to impose on the dead like that, IMHO, but it does open up a new aspect of gameplay. Instead of just color/flavor in the death scenes, there could be one-shot strategy. Interesting.

Enjoy,
Steven
We've got to give Pleonast some kudos for coming up with a very interesting idea. But it may be of limited use; ISTR that the death scene will be censoredcopyedited by the Mods.

Still, the death scene is the one chance Santo Rugger has to do something in the game. I hope e makes good use of it.

[USCDiver]

Also, unless the Dead reveal their complete Dossier in their death scene, it will be quite difficult to do a meaningful analysis of revealed Dossiers. Particularly if it makes it to Day 2 or 3 before the town agrees to reveal all.

[Mtgman]

We've got to give Pleonast some kudos for coming up with a very interesting idea. But it may be of limited use; ISTR that the death scene will be censoredcopyedited by the Mods.

Still, the death scene is the one chance Santo Rugger has to do something in the game. I hope e makes good use of it.
I'm thinking there isn't much I'd reject a death scene for. Attacks on players would be forum violations(so they're out), and there are a couple other restrictions, otherwise it's pretty wide open. If Santo Rugger wants to dance to someone else's tune in his death scene, that's his call. Everyone else in the thread will have to decide if they think it's a good idea on their own.

Enjoy,
Steven

[Mtgman]

So it seems the reveal of the private dossier components is gathering steam. A couple players are digging in against it, a couple are leading the charge to try to force it. Most are silent on the issue. What do you think? Enough have been revealed by now publically to do some analysis. Do you think further reveals would help or hurt the town? Why or why not? This is part of the publicly accessible logic puzzle I promised for spectators. If there were suddenly six pieces of info per player which were public, but only one of them was trustworthy, how would that affect the calculus when a new death scene with a piece of info came out?

Enjoy,
Steven

[USCDiver]

I'm interested to see what Hal Briston does with his information.

Personally, I think the town is pretty much lost without the mass reveal. They have no other information. Without a dossier manifest to analyse, the town is left to root out seemingly scummy info from actual posts (a la faithfool's foolish post) which in my experience is about 10-20% accurate at finding true Scum. At that rate, they'll have killed each other off in sufficient numbers to give the game to the DA, LLP.

In the same light, if the DA has effectively obfuscated their Dossiers it will be damn near impossible to find one of them based on the Death Scene's unless the town is lucky enough to hit on the Public Item once or twice.

My big question is when will it occur to the town to No-Lynch for a few Days?

[NAF1138]

I'm interested to see what Hal Briston does with his information.

Personally, I think the town is pretty much lost without the mass reveal. They have no other information. Without a dossier manifest to analyse, the town is left to root out seemingly scummy info from actual posts (a la faithfool's foolish post) which in my experience is about 10-20% accurate at finding true Scum. At that rate, they'll have killed each other off in sufficient numbers to give the game to the DA, LLP.

In the same light, if the DA has effectively obfuscated their Dossiers it will be damn near impossible to find one of them based on the Death Scene's unless the town is lucky enough to hit on the Public Item once or twice.

My big question is when will it occur to the town to No-Lynch for a few Days?


The thing is, the game was designed so the dossiers wouldn't really help or hurt either side much at all, no matter what is done with them. They give the town a slight edge, but not much edge at all. Same thing with the secret mechenisms in the game. They are to give the town a slight edge, but they are not desinged to be able to allow either side to reach victory.

If the game is played well, town should be able to find and catch scum with no power roles at all. I know it can be done, because I have played in games where it is done, and have read other games where it is done. It is just hard, and will take the town actually working together.

The game is really just a vanilla vs. scum game. Everything else is there (more or less) just to generate discussion.

[Mtgman]

I'm interested to see what Hal Briston does with his information.

Personally, I think the town is pretty much lost without the mass reveal. They have no other information. Without a dossier manifest to analyse, the town is left to root out seemingly scummy info from actual posts (a la faithfool's foolish post) which in my experience is about 10-20% accurate at finding true Scum. At that rate, they'll have killed each other off in sufficient numbers to give the game to the DA, LLP.

In the same light, if the DA has effectively obfuscated their Dossiers it will be damn near impossible to find one of them based on the Death Scene's unless the town is lucky enough to hit on the Public Item once or twice.

My big question is when will it occur to the town to No-Lynch for a few Days?
But you see, that's exactly how vanilla on vanilla Mafia works. They have to comb the conversation for inconsistencies or illogical behavior. With no hidden motives for anything any of the town are doing or saying they should be transparent. Someone weaseling or lying is almost certainly scum. There are plenty of examples of twenty person games with five scum, all vanilla, where the town finds the scum. The group seemed to be losing their ability to analyze posts for scummy behavior and were becoming reliant on power roles or fancy mechanics. I designed the dossier to be straightforward(a couple of people have hit on how simply it really works) and they're making far too much of it really. Both town and scum are falling into this trap, but it's worse for town to obsess over it than for scum. We'll see if they can pull their heads back together pretty soon.

Enjoy,
Steven

[WF Tomba]

I've been trying to follow this game, and as far as I can tell the dossier system isn't doing anything at all. I think Town should ignore it entirely. They get ONE piece of information about a killer per night. With each player having six discoverable pieces of information, and an unknowable amount of duplication, I don't see how this is likely to help except perhaps very late in the game, when there are fewer players left. It's more of a distraction than an aid.

By the way, I wonder if anyone has noticed that the dossier attributes are taken from the recent Two Truths and a Lie thread.

[Mtgman]

Most of them are. That's one of the several booby traps set up, for both town and scum, in the Dossier system. If the scum fake their dossiers someone who catches on to where the attributes came from can call them on it(about 15% of them were taken from another SDMB thread, but more obscure). Making up attributes out of whole cloth is a good way to get caught as scum because they're the only ones with a motive to lie. So that's a booby trap for the scum. Revealing all the dossiers makes the Night Kill reveals more ambigious so that's a trap for the town. It was explicitly stated that this game needed to be won the old fashioned way, by talking and analyzing each other's posts and voting. The Dossier will step in every now and then with a clear piece of evidence which puts a player in the hotseat, but it's only an indicator, not an auto-lynch mechanism. False positives are another trap built into the dossier system. Smart play by the town keeps the false positives to a minimum. Smart play for the scum maximizes false positives. Still, neither group has control over it, and over five Nights(the minimum for the game), I expect it to match a revealed comment with a public attribute of a Disgruntled Associate.

So, a question for the spectators. How was the nightkill clue? Too easy? Too hard? Too esoteric? If there had been a public attribute which said "I once drove a V/W beetle through the front door of a 7/11" would you have made the connection easily? Is that a good thing, or a bad thing? We can make the clues harder or easier. I'm learning towards harder, but that's just my natural bastardly tendancies I think, so some feedback would be good.

Enjoy,
Steven

[NAF1138]

Most of them are. That's one of the several booby traps set up, for both town and scum, in the Dossier system. If the scum fake their dossiers someone who catches on to where the attributes came from can call them on it(about 15% of them were taken from another SDMB thread, but more obscure). Making up attributes out of whole cloth is a good way to get caught as scum because they're the only ones with a motive to lie. So that's a booby trap for the scum. Revealing all the dossiers makes the Night Kill reveals more ambigious so that's a trap for the town. It was explicitly stated that this game needed to be won the old fashioned way, by talking and analyzing each other's posts and voting. The Dossier will step in every now and then with a clear piece of evidence which puts a player in the hotseat, but it's only an indicator, not an auto-lynch mechanism. False positives are another trap built into the dossier system. Smart play by the town keeps the false positives to a minimum. Smart play for the scum maximizes false positives. Still, neither group has control over it, and over five Nights(the minimum for the game), I expect it to match a revealed comment with a public attribute of a Disgruntled Associate.

So, a question for the spectators. How was the nightkill clue? Too easy? Too hard? Too esoteric? If there had been a public attribute which said "I once drove a V/W beetle through the front door of a 7/11" would you have made the connection easily? Is that a good thing, or a bad thing? We can make the clues harder or easier. I'm learning towards harder, but that's just my natural bastardly tendancies I think, so some feedback would be good.

Enjoy,
Steven

Personally I feel that they could be a little harder. But I am going to let the ultimate decision on that front be up to you. The dossiers are your thing.

Anyone who wants to help create the dossier clues PM me or MtgMan and we will send you the link to the off site boards where we are working on the puzzles.

Also, if everyone could remember that there is nothing actually stoping active players from reading this thread (exept their own honor) and that we need to be a little bit careful about what we say and know about the active game when posting here. This is a spoiler free thread, so speculation only please.

[CatInASuit]

So, a question for the spectators. How was the nightkill clue? Too easy? Too hard? Too esoteric? If there had been a public attribute which said "I once drove a V/W beetle through the front door of a 7/11" would you have made the connection easily? Is that a good thing, or a bad thing? We can make the clues harder or easier. I'm learning towards harder, but that's just my natural bastardly tendancies I think, so some feedback would be good.

I think if you had said "I once drove a V/W beetle through the front door of a 7/11", the town would start looking for an alternative meaning because coming straight out and saying it would be too obvious. ;)

Sometimes a spade is just a spade.

It is interesting how the town is handling it, and they have had some good/bad ideas.

It is a shame that faithfool looks to be trying to bow out though.

[Oredigger77]

I'm hoping that faithfool is scum and is just using the bowing out as a cover so people will feel sorry for her and focus their attention else where. Because 1 mistake for a noob is hardly a major offence I'm sure I will do worse when I finnaly play one of these.

[NAF1138]

I PM'd her to ask what was up, and she does seem to feel that she doesn't stand a snowballs chance in hell of not getting lynched, so she should just go along for the party.

I did my best to talk her out of it, and pointed out that people who start off like her (lots of quick votes against them right away) tend to get unvoted and stay alive for a very long time.

We shall see what she decideds to do.

[CatInASuit]

Good Grief, I must have made an impact in the Blade Runner Game,

sachertorte is already using my question tactic

[USCDiver]

For those playing along at home, here's my current compilation of public Dossier items (mod revealed and/or 'claimed').

I think I know what brewha is seeing, but I'm not sure...


Santo Rugger (Deceased)

One of my high school classmates was killed in the attack on the USS Stark.
The remainder of this Dossier is obfuscated in his death scene

Pleonast:

1. I had my last cat, Clawdia, professionally preserved and she sits in my bedroom.
2. I have handled and fed a lot of snakes, alligators and crocodiles.
3. I've wandered and built on an old, live Soviet bomb dump.
4. My mother was a former NFL cheerleader.
5. I am scared of moths.
6. I was once bitten by a wild animal while visiting Dollywood.

Diomedes:

1. While Jay Leno was doing a stand-up show I attended, he recognized me as someone who had previously seen him perform and spoken briefly with him.
2. I have had a conversation with Laurence Fishburne.
3. I provided a line in a song that became a top 20 hit for the band Traffic.
4. I've been bitten by a tiger.
5. I had my last cat, Clawdia, professionally preserved and she sits in my bedroom.
6. I have had a conversation with Michael Chiklis.

Hockey Monkey:

1. I graduated from college over 9 years after enrolling, and I was nearly expelled twice.
2. I got an autograph from Billy Crystal on top of the World Trade Center.
3. I'm in favour of making mandatory both organ donation and the use of human corpses as a source of meat. (eww!)
4. I once drove a VW Bug through the front door of a 7/11.
5. I have gone to Disney World 3 times and Disneyland at least 5 times
6. I have held 5 American Bald Eagles.

zuma:

1. I have walked along the shore of the Bay of Pigs.
2. My great-great-grandfather was a duke in Sicily.
3. I've travelled with royalty in torn T-shirt and jeans.
4. I believe that aliens are stealing my socks.
5. I believe that the Apollo moon landings were filmed in Hollywood.
6. I have memorized the entire \"D\" section of the dictionary

faithfool:

1. I believe the Honda Element is a good-looking car.
2. I enjoy practicing the cello.
3. I have performed an exorcism.
4. I provided a line in a song that became a top 20 hit for the band Traffic.
5. I have been shot in the head with a muzzleloading .45 caliber pistol and in leg with a bow and arrow.
6. I voted for a boy for prom queen.

Rysto:
1. I wear a size 7 shoe.
2. I was in a biker movie.
3. I believe the cruelty makes foie gras all the more tasty.
4. Farts are really funny. People only pretend to not think they are.
5. I believe that the world would be a much better place if about 25% of the population were taken out back and shot.
6. I started a forest fire by playing with matches.

ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies - I was a trombone soloist in college.

storyteller0910 - I've travelled with royalty in torn T-shirt and jeans.

Freudian Slit - I believe farts are really funny. People only pretend to not think they are.

sachertorte - I've climbed to the top chamber of Cheops.

ShadowFacts - I enjoy practicing the cello

MHaye - I believe that zombies are inherently funny.

Kat - I played piano with Sly Stone in a Holiday Inn restaurant.

One And Only Wanderers - I once had sex in front of the Washington Monument.

brewha - I am scared of moths.

HazelNutCoffee - I own an authentic 1920s lady's flapper outfit.

Hawkeyeop - I have performed an exorcism.

Hal Briston - I have a near phobia of octopi.

[WF Tomba]

Whoa! Check out what Hal Briston just claimed! I hope the Town realizes that whether the claim is true or not, it's strongly in their interest to lynch him. Obviously, if it's not true then he's Scum, but even if it is true the bad guys have no reason to get rid of him since they can't prevent him from revealing what he knows in his death post; they actually would do better to let him live under suspicion than to confirm his tale by killing him. And for that very reason, the Town needs him to die eventually!

The only remaining question is when the Town should kill him. It would be best if they could first get some people whose dossiers he supposedly knows to reveal . . .

[USCDiver]

Whoa! Check out what Hal Briston just claimed! I hope the Town realizes that whether the claim is true or not, it's strongly in their interest to lynch him. Obviously, if it's not true then he's Scum, but even if it is true the bad guys have no reason to get rid of him since they can't prevent him from revealing what he knows in his death post; they actually would do better to let him live under suspicion than to confirm his tale by killing him. And for that very reason, the Town needs him to die eventually!

The only remaining question is when the Town should kill him. It would be best if they could first get some people whose dossiers he supposedly knows to reveal . . .

Can you explain again why it would be in the Town's interest to kill Hal? For all we know, he is given the Dossier of a random player during each night. In that case, he should be killed by the Disgruntleds as soon as possible. Or perhaps it was a one shot deal and his power is spent leaving him no different from any other player.

If the Town thinks he's lying, then he should be killed for lying. If they think he's telling the truth, then he's a Pro-Town player and should be kept alive as long as possible and go after players they think ARE scum.

[Eureka]

I'm just happy that someone in this thread revealed the "secret" of where much dossier info came from. This makes comments about figuring out the secrets of the dossier and being able to tell who is lying about the dossier much easier to understand. Of course, since no one is likely to come right out and say "I'm a Disgruntled Associate", one never knows for sure whether those wishing for dossiers to be revealed are as pro-town as they appear.

(The earlier discussion of randomizing the order for reveals made me nuts--because it seemed so contrived. Plus I don't get the point of randomizing all that well, . . .suffice it to say that I don't really get Mafia strategy and there are reasons I'm unlikely to ever decide to play. I've played it live, where in less than an hour you go from 20 people to 3. That I can deal with. Weeks and weeks of strategizing? Forget it.)

[USCDiver]

If MHaye's latest post (http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=9285534&postcount=445) is to be believed, there are players who may or may not believe that Hal Briston has access to ALL of the Dossiers.

[WF Tomba]

Can you explain again why it would be in the Town's interest to kill Hal? For all we know, he is given the Dossier of a random player during each night. In that case, he should be killed by the Disgruntleds as soon as possible. Or perhaps it was a one shot deal and his power is spent leaving him no different from any other player.

If the Town thinks he's lying, then he should be killed for lying. If they think he's telling the truth, then he's a Pro-Town player and should be kept alive as long as possible and go after players they think ARE scum.
Well, here's how I see it. I am pretty sure that Hal is not given new information each night, because that would make him virtually a Detective, and would seem to violate what the game moderators have said about the structure of this game. On rereading their statements now, I see that they have not said there are no power roles, but they have certainly given that impression. I've been assuming all along that no player is inherently more valuable to his or her team than any other. I guess I could be wrong about this.

Anyway, assuming I am not wrong about that, then Hal Briston's survival is no more valuable to the Town than that of any other player, while the doubt and confusion created by allowing his claims to remain suspect would surely work powerfully to the Disgruntled Associates' advantage. That's what I was thinking, anyway.

[NAF1138]

On rereading their statements now, I see that they have not said there are no power roles, but they have certainly given that impression. .

We said what we meant, and we meant what we said. It's not our fault if people read additional meaning into our words. :p

[Darth Sensitive]

Hey, what does EBWOP stand for?

[Eureka]

It must be something like Edited By Way Of Post

[Darth Sensitive]

Ah, that would make sense.

[ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies]

Well that was fun while it lasted.

I sent NAF a PM. I have not yet been given any tasty tidbits about my attacker(s).

Catching up...

[ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies]

And...got as far as the first post part of the first post and realized that I shouldn't be here yet.

:smack:

[Santo Rugger]

Damn, Cookies, seems like when the scum find somebody worth killing, they tend to want to kill them in simultaneous games.... lame - o. Looking forward to reading your composition.

[ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies]

All caught up now. :) Do we get access to the scum boards and perfect knowledge, or are we resigned to the peanut gallery and golf clapping until the bitter end?

[NAF1138]

All caught up now. :) Do we get access to the scum boards and perfect knowledge, or are we resigned to the peanut gallery and golf clapping until the bitter end?

Secret board info on its way.

[MHaye]

Secret board info on its way.Speaking as we are about secret boards info, can you pass me the link please?

[ShadowFacts]

Speaking as we are about secret boards info, can you pass me the link please?

Well, this thread is quiet. Is all the action at the secret boards?

I'm sad to have died, as I felt I was one of the few who were actively working to get people to rely less on the dossiers. Oh well, we'll see what happens today. I fear the success of the previous lynch is going to lead to more overreliance on the dossiers.

[USCDiver]

Well, this thread is quiet. Is all the action at the secret boards?

I'm sad to have died, as I felt I was one of the few who were actively working to get people to rely less on the dossiers. Oh well, we'll see what happens today. I fear the success of the previous lynch is going to lead to more overreliance on the dossiers.


You're right on the nose on several points. There hasn't been much action in any of the threads, including the Game thread.

[ShadowFacts]

You're right on the nose on several points. There hasn't been much action in any of the threads, including the Game thread.

Well, as my corpse is still fresh, I'm still interested in how this game turns out, so I'm going to attempt to revive the discussion here. I'm very pleased that brewha is on the hot seat right now as he was my #1 suspect. I'm glad sach is on him, because he and I seemed to thinking similarly throughout this game so far, and I think he is town. I also like the way he is utilizing the dossiers to go after brewha: namely, he is not focusing on the dossier itself, but on brewha's behavior with and statements about the dossiers, i.e. trying to catch him in a lie. IMHO, that's what Associates should be doing.

I'm not happy with Hockey Monkey's approach, which seems like pure speculation and chaff-throwing. Could still be a misguided townie, but she's on my watch list.

Oh, and one more thing: Diomedes made a comment that maybe I misheard or made a mistake on the killer's trait in my death post. This is very suspicious to me. He should know that that language comes straight from the mods. That read to me like obfuscation, and he's also on my suspicion list.

[MHaye]

I'm still following the game, I just haven't had too much to say. But then I never do say much.

I hope that one or two other players follow Storyteller's approach, as it will add a second dimension to the game and perk interest back up.

[ShadowFacts]

I'm still following the game, I just haven't had too much to say. But then I never do say much.

I hope that one or two other players follow Storyteller's approach, as it will add a second dimension to the game and perk interest back up.

I agree. I like story's analysis, and he's pinging on exactly the same people I was pinging on (except Hawkeye, who I have no read on). I hope he and sach can rally the town to some quality analysis (assuming they are town, of course :D )

Hopefully your lynch will do the town some good after all. ;) I'm very glad I stuck to my guns on that one - it smelled funny to me and I tried to get people to think twice about it, but failed.

[USCDiver]

ShadowFacts are you going to stay in the dark on who is who? Most of the detailed discussion is going on in the off-site discussion board but it is assumed perfect knowledge.

[ShadowFacts]

ShadowFacts are you going to stay in the dark on who is who? Most of the detailed discussion is going on in the off-site discussion board but it is assumed perfect knowledge.

Yeah, NAF sent me the link and I'm over there now. Surprises all around :D

[nesta]

I finally had a chance to read through this game. Not much action in the spectator thread it seems. I'm trying to resist requesting the prefect knowledge link because I enjoy trying to figure out who the scum are more than just following along. Anyone not spoiled still following the game?

To get things restarted around here, I think Pleonast is scum. Same with Hawkeyeop. I think Hal is town, and I mostly think both brewha and sachertorte are too. The rest I have mixed feelings on. I originally thought that faithfool slipped, like everyone else thinks/thought, but now I'm not so sure.

storyteller0910 is scum. He's always scum, even when the Mods don't agree. I find myself agreeing with everything he says... it's so logical, and makes so much sense, so it must be manufactured to gain trust. Mark my words, he's scum this time.

Of course, I was convinced Cookies and Kat were scum based on their current posting style and my past experience playing with them, so reverse my list and it will probably be closer to true.

What does everyone that doesn't already know think of the dossier clue: "It's either you or me, and I'm not giving up my chance to try gebackenes before I die?"

On its face it seems to be saying that the killer hadn't eaten cow udders, but that's not the way this seems to work. The actual dossier clue would usually be that the killer had, but of course scum lie. I wonder if the Mods are using this as an extra clue to say that the killer actually has but that they didn't list it in their reveal of their dossier. I'm also a little concerned that there wasn't at least a little more talk about the clue--it seems everyone just dropped it.

After a quick review I see sachertorte had the same theory about the Mods hinting at a false dossier that I did, and maybe that's where I got my idea. However, since he's the only one with that item in his dossier he would say that.

These games are such fun, even just watching.

[Sir Dirx]

Anyone not spoiled still following the game?
I am!

As much as I'd like to be wrong, I somehow think Pleonast and Dio are actually town. Both of them are simply cutthroat; I hope I'm never up against them if I play.

I'm still trying to remember what all I based this conjecture on, but I "deduced" (wild-assed guessed) that brewha, faithfool, and Hal were scum. This would mean Hal's doing a heckuva job playing innocent. I'm still not sure on Storyteller and Sachertorte; not only am I getting their posts confused with one another, but their posts are also rather long full of analysis that I can't quite wrap my head around sometimes. The rest of the players... no idea. I think I guessed one or two more were scum, based on their interactions with and voting in regard to the above suspected scum, but it's all pretty tentative.


As for the gebackenes clue... idunno. I figured it's most likely one of two scenarios: the dead player changed the clue's wording a bit too much in their death post, or the mods gave an anti-clue ("The killer does not have the 'I have eaten cow udder' fact on their dossier"). I don't think it's a separate dossier fact that someone had but was covered up; it's too similar to the other cow-udder-clue. Somehow, as diabolical as the mods are, I like to think they'd have gone for more diversity.


Also, zuma seriously needs to stop with the phone posts. I mean, ow.

[nesta]

I am!
Good, I'm not alone. :)

As much as I'd like to be wrong, I somehow think Pleonast and Dio are actually town. Both of them are simply cutthroat; I hope I'm never up against them if I play.
I'll admit that I read the entire game yesterday, so my gut feeling might be tainted by the fact that I didn't have to wait for responses and think things through. To me, though, both of them have seemed rather suspect in their weak logic in going after people. They seem to be deciding whom to go after before coming up with a good reason, and when called on it falling back with attacks that don't add up. I can certainly understand them leaping with gut feelings and then trying to justify it, but something about Pleonast especially has seemed off to me.

I'm still trying to remember what all I based this conjecture on, but I "deduced" (wild-assed guessed) that brewha, faithfool, and Hal were scum. This would mean Hal's doing a heckuva job playing innocent. I'm still not sure on Storyteller and Sachertorte; not only am I getting their posts confused with one another, but their posts are also rather long full of analysis that I can't quite wrap my head around sometimes. The rest of the players... no idea. I think I guessed one or two more were scum, based on their interactions with and voting in regard to the above suspected scum, but it's all pretty tentative.
Someone in the game (I'm not sure who, and I'm too lazy since I'm just spectating to check) proposed Hal was trying to cover up for faithfool with his claim that the dossier was true. Hal doesn't seem to me like the type of player who would so transparently defend a fellow scum who was likely to be lynched at that point. (But maybe that's what he wants us/them to think?) Therefore if Hal is scum I doubt faithfool is.

brewha posted his "I have a theory and I'm not going to tell you about it," and then later recanted it, which I don't think scum would do at that point in the game. Scum had nothing to gain by that but I can see a townie reading too much into the dossier twist doing it. I also think the brewha "other thread" thing is either a misunderstanding or pushed by the scum, but I lean towards a misunderstanding because at least in the previous SDMB games it seems the scum don't tend to actively look for those types of inconsistencies but rather latch onto them. To me that feels like a town-on-town attack.

As for the gebackenes clue... idunno. I figured it's most likely one of two scenarios: the dead player changed the clue's wording a bit too much in their death post, or the mods gave an anti-clue ("The killer does not have the 'I have eaten cow udder' fact on their dossier"). I don't think it's a separate dossier fact that someone had but was covered up; it's too similar to the other cow-udder-clue. Somehow, as diabolical as the mods are, I like to think they'd have gone for more diversity.
Again I'm too lazy to go back and look at the actual rules post, but didn't it say that those the scum kill will get a random dossier fact about their killer? It seems to really weaken this town advantage if they are going to give clues about traits the killer didn't have. I think it's more likely that the Mods are saying that the killer really did have the udder item in their dossier, but they might be saying "scum lie, and therefore lied in the death scene and you can't read anything else into it" or "scum lie, and they lied about it in their public reveal." Unfortunately that means either sach is scum or he isn't, which doesn't help much yet. If he is I have to give him a lot of credit for the way he derailed that particular lynch mob since he seemed very genuine to me.

On the meta-game level the clue seems rather obvious to me, where I thought they would probably get more obscure. To me this means that they intended the clue to be found easily but didn't expect the real meaning to be obvious. Counting on hidden knowledge, that the real holder of this dossier item hadn't revealed it, seems to fit. I could be buying into sach's theory to save himself, though, so maybe the negating language was just thrown in to cast a little doubt.

Also, zuma seriously needs to stop with the phone posts. I mean, ow.
Agreed. It is kind of fun to try to figure out what he is really trying to say, though. Almost a puzzle within a game that is itself a puzzle.

[NAF1138]

What does everyone that doesn't already know think of the dossier clue: "It's either you or me, and I'm not giving up my chance to try gebackenes before I die?"

On its face it seems to be saying that the killer hadn't eaten cow udders, but that's not the way this seems to work. The actual dossier clue would usually be that the killer had, but of course scum lie. I wonder if the Mods are using this as an extra clue to say that the killer actually has but that they didn't list it in their reveal of their dossier. I'm also a little concerned that there wasn't at least a little more talk about the clue--it seems everyone just dropped it.




If you REALLY want to know, PM me and I can tell you what the clue means. Or I will send you the link to the spoiler thread. Its a party over there.

Come to the dark side. We actually do have cookies. :p

[Scuba_Ben]

I concur -- WTF is with zuma and his incoherent posts? I want to lynch him on general principles.

The deceased vision does seem to indicate Hockey Monkey, assuming everybody's honest about their dossiers. So who is lying about their info?

[Sir Dirx]

I concur -- WTF is with zuma and his incoherent posts? I want to lynch him on general principles.

The deceased vision does seem to indicate Hockey Monkey, assuming everybody's honest about their dossiers. So who is lying about their info?
The sig file and "Thanks!" bits from the death post are getting to me. Especially the sig file. A half-wittted "eureaka!" moment led me to think maybe Kat figured out on her own who killed her, or at least had a strong idea, and those comments were clues to a specific player by way of their signatures on the board. I checked all the living players; no dice. Nothing comes close. Would've been cool, though, had that really been the case.

As for Hockey... As much as I hate metagaming, the observation that NAF's comment to her likely indicates her as innocent is pretty interesting thinking. Not sure I'm sold on it, but it's a little convincing.

[dotchan]

Spamming this thread a bit to toot my own horn, so to speak:

Signups are open for the next off-board Mafia game (http://psychopathgame.proboards106.com/index.cgi?board=temp&action=display&thread=1200415290&page=1#1200447273)

I'm going to be the Evil Disembodied Voice From the Sky (i.e. Game Mod), so you can't vote for me this time. :D

[Kat]

Why not? Is there a rule about no voting for the mod? ;)

[mmouse9799]

Anyone not spoiled still following the game?



These games are such fun, even just watching.


This is the first mafia game that I've ever followed and I'm not "spoiled". I must say that it is sometimes difficult to keep up with it; though other times I wish it would move much faster. Is that typical of these games in general?

I was sure that either Dio or Faithfool would be scum, but with the departure of Dio and Hal it looks like that isn't the case. Technically Faithfool could still be scum, I guess...but her post to Dio saying, "I guess we were both wrong" indicates to me that she isn't. :: shrug ::

Does anyone out there have any thoughts?

[Eureka]

I decided I needed to spend less time reading Mafia games after having a dream in which I was actually playing Mafia, and Come to the Darkside We have Cookies(probably not the correct spelling/spacing) attacked me on the basis of the number of letters in my name.

(And I never have any idea who is Scum or who isn't. But I must say, I have a lot of sympathy for brewha, because in the only live game of Mafia I ever won as a Mafia person, we got down to three players. And I had to vigorously accuse one of the others of being Mafia. Which was out of character, but otherwise I was doomed. I won, because the third player picked at random, really, despite good arguments from the player I accused, arguments from me, and advice from the Zombie Gallery that one of the players left was acting out of character. I so wanted to slap the Zombie Gallery for making it harder for me to win).

[mmouse9799]

I decided I needed to spend less time reading Mafia games after having a dream in which I was actually playing Mafia, and Come to the Darkside We have Cookies(probably not the correct spelling/spacing) attacked me on the basis of the number of letters in my name.

(And I never have any idea who is Scum or who isn't. But I must say, I have a lot of sympathy for brewha, because in the only live game of Mafia I ever won as a Mafia person, we got down to three players. And I had to vigorously accuse one of the others of being Mafia. Which was out of character, but otherwise I was doomed. I won, because the third player picked at random, really, despite good arguments from the player I accused, arguments from me, and advice from the Zombie Gallery that one of the players left was acting out of character. I so wanted to slap the Zombie Gallery for making it harder for me to win).


:) I had a dream last night that the Kool-aid man was shooting ice cubes at me. I have no idea where that came from.

[ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies]

I decided I needed to spend less time reading Mafia games after having a dream in which I was actually playing Mafia, and Come to the Darkside We have Cookies(probably not the correct spelling/spacing) attacked me on the basis of the number of letters in my name.

I don't know about name length, but having the user name of the largest (and ugliest...don't let the handfull of token pictures of the victorian mansions fool you) town in my home county of Humboldt, upon which the television show of the same name is loosely based (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eureka%2C_CA) is certainly worth at least a vote on Day 1 out of principle. ;)

I'm not quite sure how I feel about affecting peoples dreams via Mafia... :eek:

[mmouse9799]

What does NETA mean? It's not in the wiki glossary that I've been using for these things...

[MHaye]

Not Edited to Add.

An alternative is EBWOP : Edit By Way Of Post.

Both arise from the fact that editing your post is a modkillable offence.

[Darth Sensitive]

Not Edited To Add

[mmouse9799]

Not Edited to Add.

An alternative is EBWOP : Edit By Way Of Post.

Both arise from the fact that editing your post is a modkillable offence.

Thanks!!

[Sir Dirx]

Pleonast may be worried about getting night killed toNight, but if I were scum, I think I'd go for zuma instead. He's very obviously town at this point, giving very good analyses, and moreover, I think all the other townies trust him as well. There's no way scum could convince anyone to lynch him at this point. Pleo may be a strong power player as well, but he seemed strangely uninvolved in the HazelNutCoffee lynch compared to earlier in the game. I honestly forgot he was still around until his night post. Assuming he's town, that can hurt him; scum could easily use that to throw suspicion on him and paint him scummy. There's even been a little bit of suspicion on him before, too. Probably won't be enough to lynch him though, as others are topping people's suspicion lists way over him.

Brewha seems to be exonerated now, with the HNC lynch. Though it could still be possible that they're both scum and played an elaborate and risky game; attack eachother constantly, one of them finally gets sacrificed, and the other looks like a perfect townie. Not sure if the scum are that creative to have tried that here, but it's an interesting possibility nonetheless.

This game is fascinating.

[mmouse9799]

This game is certainly interesting. It's the first that I've followed. (Though, I did read the werewolf game.)

Something seems strange with Sachertorte. I don't know what it is, though.

[HazelNutCoffee]

Well, hello y'all.

This game is proof positive that I suck at being scum. :p The good part is, despite my demise I'm pretty sure the remaining scum have a fighting chance. Especially the way things are going now.

The dossiers were an interesting element in the game, although at this point people seem to be ignoring them, more or less. They did spark a lot of debate in the beginning, which was fun (although any talk of numbers makes me grumble. :: coughPleonastcough :: ) I have to admit, if I'd known more about the system I don't think I would've signed up. It's an interesting game structure but my personal preference would be the more traditional one with a few power roles thrown in for good measure. Not that I didn't have fun in this one - just if I had my druthers, as they say. I'm interested in what the other players think as well.

[Sir Dirx]

The good part is, despite my demise I'm pretty sure the remaining scum have a fighting chance. Especially the way things are going now.
Dammit! That game is already the first thing I check when I log onto the boards (seventeen times a day...). Now my finger is going to be stuck on the Refresh button from here on out. If I wasn't having so much fun trying to figure things out msyelf, I'd practically be begging for the info for the Perfect Knowledge thread.

Not that I hope to see the scum win (I think.. still undecided actually), I do hope your comment suggests they're being far more cunning than anyone realized. I've seen all kinds of potential for truly sneaky tactics, and am dying to know if any were actually used.

[Koldanar]

So how does one get spoiled on this game? I didn't want to while i was playing off-board on the off chance I'd try to start meta gaming, but I 'd like to see whats going on here :)

[NAF1138]

So how does one get spoiled on this game? I didn't want to while i was playing off-board on the off chance I'd try to start meta gaming, but I 'd like to see whats going on here :)


You make a post like the one you just made.

PM on it's way.

[HazelNutCoffee]

You make a post like the one you just made.

PM on it's way.
Is there a perfect knowledge thread? Can I have a linky?

[NAF1138]

Is there a perfect knowledge thread? Can I have a linky?


Yes you can. PM on it's way.

[Kat]

Hell, me too?

[mmouse9799]

So, what does everyone think of Hawkeye's newest arguements?

[Sir Dirx]

Even if they make sense (and I honestly don't quite follow them still), I really don't think they belong in this game. That sort of thing is precicely the reason why I'd like to see an all-newbie game; any talk about "you're behaving differently here than you are in this other game" causes significant metagaming problems, I think.

What I'm still puzzling over, though, is how exactly are they convinced that Faithfool is town, based on the last clue not matching her dossier? Aren't there two scum left, still?

[NAF1138]

Even if they make sense (and I honestly don't quite follow them still), I really don't think they belong in this game. That sort of thing is precicely the reason why I'd like to see an all-newbie game; any talk about "you're behaving differently here than you are in this other game" causes significant metagaming problems, I think.

What I'm still puzzling over, though, is how exactly are they convinced that Faithfool is town, based on the last clue not matching her dossier? Aren't there two scum left, still?


This is a very good idea. On mafiascum they have a new players forum where there are 2 vets (who are there to help teach) and, if I remember correctly, 6 newbies.

Wonder if we could get the same sort of thing going on here? We probably wouldn't need the vets, just a smaller game open to players who have only played in 0-1 games.

[mmouse9799]

Wasn't there something awhile back about having a game where newbies paired up with more expierenced players to learn the ropes? Though I haven't played, it seems as though this is a very complicated game. It looks like Hawkeye is just trying to assimilate what he knows about the game and the players to make the best decision he can. And, NAF, it does seem like you started this line of arguement with a comment in the other game. Are you a new player?

[Hal Briston]

Ah hah...here's the forbidden thread...I kept forgetting to check this out. Anyway...

As soon as I read this:
It's lynch or lose, which means that all three townies must vote together. And if two townies mis-vote, the two scum can insta-hammer and win the game. Be very wary before placing a vote....I became sure that Rysto is scum. That 100% reads to me like scum saying "Hey fellow team scum member -- if two townies mis-vote, make sure to insta-hammer along with me!"

[ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies]

You know you want to come to the perfect knowledge boards...


we have cookies

[Hal Briston]

Naaa...I still like the mystery. :)

[NAF1138]

Wasn't there something awhile back about having a game where newbies paired up with more expierenced players to learn the ropes? Though I haven't played, it seems as though this is a very complicated game. It looks like Hawkeye is just trying to assimilate what he knows about the game and the players to make the best decision he can. And, NAF, it does seem like you started this line of arguement with a comment in the other game. Are you a new player?

Not new, just interested in seeing the game survive player burnout. We really need to start getting new blood, since so many of the active players we have left are rather set in their ways. A lot of the more adventurous, shake things up, players haven't played in a while. So we need a fresh perspective.

Also, the games have been getting progressivly harder, and as a byproduct of that I think fewer new players are joining. I think that is a good thing in terms of keeping current players interested, but it will eventually make the mafia games impossible for outsiders to get into. And that would be a shame.

For example when I posted this game I actually considered puting a disclaimer on it saying that it was going to be much harder then it seemed at first glance, and only people who felt they knew what they were doing should apply. But then hawk and faithfool wouldn't have shown up, and brewha and rysto probably wouldn't have come back. And they have all been a great part of this game. I hope faith sticks around and plays again. This was a rough game to get your feet wet with.

Sorry, I just started rambling there and got a little off point. I think a new player game would be fun. It would in all likelyhood be less...intense, and probably a lot of fun to watch. And new blood is always a good thing, and I think the SDMB games is a great place to play the types of games that will most interest new players.

Once players have played a couple of SDMB games, we can lure them to the offsite boards where the more extreme games are being played. (seriously, three kingdoms (http://psychopathgame.proboards106.com) is a bloodbath, you should check it out if you haven't)

So...um...yeah...that was more answer then your question was looking for. But I like to talk about mafia...so um...yeah.

[Hal Briston]

Do we have an official "List" for modding games? I think I'd like to run a "strictly newbies" game for those who have played zero (maybe one) games previously. Getting some fresh blood into this would be a very good thing, and I'm sure that there are a lot of potential players who are interested, but a bit intimidated.

[Sir Dirx]

Sign me up for the proposed newbie game. Of course, given how much the current game has fascinated me, I'd even join a game against veterans at this point, intimidation be damned.

Also, I was thinking about it the other day, and realized that the movie Hot Fuzz could make a pretty interesting theme to base a mafia game on. Just a thought.

[dotchan]

I guess it's not a SMDB game unless someone posts game-breaking information. Fortunately hawkeyeop got knocked off via independent means so it all worked out, but still.

Maybe I should have modkilled NAF for metagaming hawkeyeop in the first place...

[NAF1138]

I guess it's not a SMDB game unless someone posts game-breaking information. Fortunately hawkeyeop got knocked off via independent means so it all worked out, but still.

Maybe I should have modkilled NAF for metagaming hawkeyeop in the first place...

Hey Hey, nothing in the rules against metagaming. You want someone to not metagame, put it in the rules.

[NAF1138]

Do we have an official "List" for modding games? I think I'd like to run a "strictly newbies" game for those who have played zero (maybe one) games previously. Getting some fresh blood into this would be a very good thing, and I'm sure that there are a lot of potential players who are interested, but a bit intimidated.

I don't think there is anyone on the list after me. PM skipmagic.

[ShadowFacts]

Do we have an official "List" for modding games? I think I'd like to run a "strictly newbies" game for those who have played zero (maybe one) games previously. Getting some fresh blood into this would be a very good thing, and I'm sure that there are a lot of potential players who are interested, but a bit intimidated.

I'd like to play in the next SDMB game and I prefer to play here than on other boards, so maybe this newbie game can be run off board? I say that in complete selfishness, of course, so please forgive me. :D

[mmouse9799]

So...um...yeah...that was more answer then your question was looking for. But I like to talk about mafia...so um...yeah.

It's all good. This is obviously a passionate group of players. How long have you each been playing and how did you start playing this game?

[zuma]

I'd like to play in the next SDMB game and I prefer to play here than on other boards, so maybe this newbie game can be run off board? I say that in complete selfishness, of course, so please forgive me. :D

A compromise could be just having a basic game (which I think are more fun... I am probably in the minority in that opinion), and hold x number of spots (50%?) open for first-time players. Having some experienced players around instead of just newbies would probably be helpful to new players.

[dotchan]

Hey Hey, nothing in the rules against metagaming. You want someone to not metagame, put it in the rules.

Well, I've put "don't discuss ongoing games outside of their respective game thread" as an explicit part of my rules. I thought that didn't need to be spelled out, but clearly I was wrong. :(

[NAF1138]

Well, I've put "don't discuss ongoing games outside of their respective game thread" as an explicit part of my rules. I thought that didn't need to be spelled out, but clearly I was wrong. :(


I didn't talk about your game outside of the thread. But you are right, I shouldn't have said anything. It was a 99% random vote that got taken too far. Hawk broke your rule by talking about your game in my game thread, but he was already dead. So I guess that doesn't hurt anything.

[ShadowFacts]

A compromise could be just having a basic game (which I think are more fun... I am probably in the minority in that opinion), and hold x number of spots (50%?) open for first-time players. Having some experienced players around instead of just newbies would probably be helpful to new players.

Good idea!

[Hal Briston]

Ok, I've gotten the nod (thanks Skip!) for running the next game -- Newbie Mafia. My current thoughts:

Sixteen players, and we'll be keeping it basic -- mostly vanilla, with a Cop, a Doctor and perhaps a Serial Killer (or maybe a group of Masons) thrown in. Those who have never played get first dibs, and then filling it out with those who have one game under their belts.

There will also be the M.A.B. -- an as-yet-undetermined number of experienced players (I'm thinking in the neighborhood of three) who will serve as the Mafia Advisory Board. They won't be actively particpating in the game itself (no voting, can't be killed, wouldn't "win" or "lose"), but would be following the game closely and would post suggestions and point out things that first-timers may not pick up on.

Thoughts?

[mmouse9799]

Ok, I've gotten the nod (thanks Skip!) for running the next game -- Newbie Mafia. My current thoughts:

Sixteen players, and we'll be keeping it basic -- mostly vanilla, with a Cop, a Doctor and perhaps a Serial Killer (or maybe a group of Masons) thrown in. Those who have never played get first dibs, and then filling it out with those who have one game under their belts.

There will also be the M.A.B. -- an as-yet-undetermined number of experienced players (I'm thinking in the neighborhood of three) who will serve as the Mafia Advisory Board. They won't be actively particpating in the game itself (no voting, can't be killed, wouldn't "win" or "lose"), but would be following the game closely and would post suggestions and point out things that first-timers may not pick up on.

Thoughts?

That sounds interesting...

[USCDiver]

Ok, I've gotten the nod (thanks Skip!) for running the next game -- Newbie Mafia. My current thoughts:

Sixteen players, and we'll be keeping it basic -- mostly vanilla, with a Cop, a Doctor and perhaps a Serial Killer (or maybe a group of Masons) thrown in. Those who have never played get first dibs, and then filling it out with those who have one game under their belts.

There will also be the M.A.B. -- an as-yet-undetermined number of experienced players (I'm thinking in the neighborhood of three) who will serve as the Mafia Advisory Board. They won't be actively particpating in the game itself (no voting, can't be killed, wouldn't "win" or "lose"), but would be following the game closely and would post suggestions and point out things that first-timers may not pick up on.

Thoughts?

How would they be providing these suggestions? I have a bit of a hangup about non-players (and even dead players) posting in the game threads. It seems to be against the spirit of the game (I'm looking at you Idle Thoughts). If they're providing advice through PM then are they going to be helping the Town or the Scum or both? Because (for instance) if a MAB member gave me some advice as a townie about something and another player began talking about that same aspect of the game, I would assume that they had also been advised the same thing and I would assume they were Town. It would skew my thinking something fierce.
Anyway, I'd like to see the idea hashed out a little more so that it can be appropriately scrutinized by the masses.

[mmouse9799]

How would they be providing these suggestions? I have a bit of a hangup about non-players (and even dead players) posting in the game threads. It seems to be against the spirit of the game (I'm looking at you Idle Thoughts). If they're providing advice through PM then are they going to be helping the Town or the Scum or both? Because (for instance) if a MAB member gave me some advice as a townie about something and another player began talking about that same aspect of the game, I would assume that they had also been advised the same thing and I would assume they were Town. It would skew my thinking something fierce.
Anyway, I'd like to see the idea hashed out a little more so that it can be appropriately scrutinized by the masses.

I think if would be best to have different mentors for the town and scum. Maybe have someone well-experienced at being scum mentor the scum. (Santo Rugger ?) Likewise, have another couple of people be the MAB for the town. Just a thought.

[zuma]

Eh... I wouldn't be a big fan of the Mafia Advisory Board. Seems a bit too parternalistic for my tastes. I'd throw a few experienced players in the game itself. I don't think anyone not in the game itself should be weighing in.

[zuma]

Eh... I wouldn't be a big fan of the Mafia Advisory Board. Seems a bit too parternalistic for my tastes. I'd throw a few experienced players in the game itself. I don't think anyone not in the game itself should be weighing in.

And assuming 5 scum, I'd make sure there were at least one or two experienced players on the scum team.

[Captain Klutz]

And assuming 5 scum, I'd make sure there were at least one or two experienced players on the scum team.Although if there are only a few experienced players and it is known that at least one of them is in the scum team...

Although that could be an interesting wrinkle, as scum may then be less inclined to bump off the experienced players.

[mmouse9799]

I'm quite anxious waiting for this outcome. I think this is the most "green dots" I've seen at one time since the game started.

[Scuba_Ben]

With faithfool's flurry of votes between 1:00 and 1:30 Eastern time today, I think Faith is scum -- otherwise there would've been a vote. Let's see what the outcome is.

[mmouse9799]

I know!!! Come on NAF, forget the color already. Just tell us what Sach was!!

[Eureka]

I'm not sure I believe that faithfool is scum, although it's certainly possible. I do find her appearance today in the nick of time, but being unable to choose someone to vote for convenient. Although, since I mostly believe her about her problems with internet access due to real life stuff, it's not impossible.

But if all this wishy-washy nonsense isn't at least partly an act, I'm having a hard time seeing why faithfool ever thought this would be a fun game to play.

[peekercpa]

I'd like to play in Hal's game unless the mutton comment dq's me. Watched but never participated. Also, need to figure out this whole referencing quotes thing. Don't have enough hours in the day to do the level of referencing that you all do.

[Hal Briston]

Heh...don't sweat it, peekercpa...I won't hold it against you, and there won't be any dossiers to sort through.

The sign-up thread for Newbie Mafia will be posted as soon as a winner is declared in the current game.

[peekercpa]

Otie Dotie. Maybe farm animal based. :)

[fluiddruid]

Off to The Game Room!

[HazelNutCoffee]

Whoa, dude.

[peekercpa]

Newbie question on the solve it mafia game. Since there are only three players left and they are at night hasn't the scum won?

[Scuba_Ben]

Newbie question on the solve it mafia game. Since there are only three players left and they are at night hasn't the scum won?
I seem to recall that there's four players left - 1 scum and 3 townies. If your count is right, then yes, it would royally suck for the town.

Can we get a general rule change? If a Day ends with 1 scum and 2 town, should the Night be a no-kill Night?

AOE: You're correct, I just now saw the post where faith was modkilled. It does indeed suck for the town.

[brewha]

Hey Hal, I've already done a couple of games, so I'm sure I'm disquailfied. But, any chance you'll set up a protected thread of perfect knowledge like NAF did? If so, can I get in on that? I find the game more entertaining if I know who is what and why they're doing what they are.

[HazelNutCoffee]

I seem to recall that there's four players left - 1 scum and 3 townies. If your count is right, then yes, it would royally suck for the town.

Can we get a general rule change? If a Day ends with 1 scum and 2 town, should the Night be a no-kill Night?
Why? To make things easier for Town?

Right now there are three Town and one Scum. Presumably Tomorrow there will be two Town and one Scum left for the endgame. If faithfool gets mod-killed, of course, the game will be over either way (unless she turns out to be Town but for some bizarre reason the remaining Scum decides to make it a no-kill night).

ETA: Ooops, didn't realize the mod-kill already happened.

[Scuba_Ben]

Why? To make things easier for Town?No, to make the game end on a Town action.

ETA: Ooops, didn't realize the mod-kill already happened.Neither did I when I had posted. Join the club.

[HazelNutCoffee]

No, to make the game end on a Town action.

But why should the game end on a Town action? Such a rule would make things easier for Town regardless of the reason why it was implemented.

[Hal Briston]

To continue the occasional hijack -- I'm going to hold off starting Newbie Mafia for a bit. Since fluiddruid started a new game, I don't want them to begin at the exact same time, so I'll give the new one a week or two to get off the ground first.

[Mtgman]

Newbie question on the solve it mafia game. Since there are only three players left and they are at night hasn't the scum won?
Technically the scum can choose not to kill at Night, so all the players could be alive to face Day 9. Realisitically the scum have the game in hand and there is no reason to risk losing it by playing another Day.

Enjoy,
Steven

[Sir Dirx]

So. Pleonast was scum. I admit, I kept thinking maybe he was, but that was always followed with "naaaah, it's obvious he's town. Who else looks suspicious?" Very well played.