PDA

View Full Version : Why don't casinos offer solitaire?


Octalcode
07-22-2008, 11:22 AM
Is there a logical reason that casinos don't offer solitaire? I've never seen it in a casino.

Sateryn76
07-22-2008, 11:25 AM
I've wondered this myself. When I play, I "pay" $52 for the deck, then every card that makes it to top row nets me $5.00.

The only thing I can think of is that, because you have to work through many hands to make a profit, they don't want to take up the space, pay the dealer, etc., for just one guy to gamble. And, I'm sure the rule tweaking necessary would change it too much for the average person to enjoy.

Q.E.D.
07-22-2008, 11:25 AM
You just haven't been looking in the right places. Many casions have some variant of solitaire, usually Klondike. Typically, you buy the deck for $1 per card ($52) and the house pays out $5 for each card you play to the Aces.

silenus
07-22-2008, 11:33 AM
It's still there, but it isn't that popular and the house can make a greater profit by using the dealer elsewhere.

MrSquishy
07-22-2008, 01:36 PM
So how does it work? The dealer just stands there and watches you play? This seems problematic; I can imagine a bored dealer not noticing cheats, especially if they employ a little sleight-of-hand. You'd think if a casino thought there was a market for solitaire, they'd just use a computerized version.

Bryan Ekers
07-22-2008, 01:38 PM
I've got a guaranteed-win system, as soon as they start offering Minesweeper,

Pasta
07-22-2008, 01:39 PM
Casinos have to balance what customers want versus what makes them money. If solitaire beat out other games in this battle, you can bet your butt it'd be there. In solitaire's case, hands-per-hour is very likely the death knell. Blackjack, pai gow, etc. can be dealt much faster.

And if it's like others have described, my guess it would be less popular with customers due to the high buy-in. Games where you can dribble in $5 or $10 at a time can entertain someone with $100 to blow for several hours. A game where you have to commit $52 just to get dealt in will turn off this sort of casual gamer. (It doesn't matter that they can get that back as they play. It's a different thing psychologically.)

TV time
07-22-2008, 01:49 PM
It's still there, but it isn't that popular and the house can make a greater profit by using the dealer elsewhere.That is indeed the problem. It tends to be rather labor intensive. One player and one dealer and one time through the deck. In addition, it is a relatively slow moving game. In the time a player gets through one game three or four hands of blackjack can be played by three or so players.

So how does it work? The dealer just stands there and watches you play? This seems problematic; I can imagine a bored dealer not noticing cheats, especially if they employ a little sleight-of-hand. You'd think if a casino thought there was a market for solitaire, they'd just use a computerized version.The last time I played it (admittedly years ago), no chance of a player using slight of hand since the player never touched the cards or at least no more than touched the cards to indicate which card he wanted moved or flipped. I do wonder about the possibilities of a computerized game though.

Bootis
07-22-2008, 02:30 PM
The obvious solution is to have video solitaire. Maybe they have it in Vegas, but I have never seen it anywhere else, which seems pretty silly to me. Is it a beatable game, if you get good enough at it? Maybe the difference between skilled players and average players is too great to make a profit.

Octalcode
07-22-2008, 02:34 PM
It's still there, but it isn't that popular and the house can make a greater profit by using the dealer elsewhere.


I agree about the dealer put to better use in a different area.
I'm thinking of a computerized version, no dealer needed.
Maybe 10 cents/card making it in the $5.00 area. Much more enticing than $52.00 per game.

smiling bandit
07-22-2008, 02:38 PM
You just haven't been looking in the right places. Many casions have some variant of solitaire, usually Klondike. Typically, you buy the deck for $1 per card ($52) and the house pays out $5 for each card you play to the Aces.

Whoa. That sounds like a good deal. I'm not that hot at Solitaire, but I'm betting I could do this. Are there special rules which prevent experts from clearing two or thre hundred a night?

Edit: By :"do this" I meant that I could keep my losses down to a tolerable rate.

rowrrbazzle
07-22-2008, 02:40 PM
Remember, the answer to almost any question beginning "Why don't they..." is "Money."

Mathochist
07-22-2008, 02:43 PM
Is there a logical reason that casinos don't offer solitaire? I've never seen it in a casino.

The variant known as Canfield started out as a casino game. Guess what the guy's name was who owned the casino.

Enola Gay
07-22-2008, 02:52 PM
The obvious solution is to have video solitaire. Maybe they have it in Vegas, but I have never seen it anywhere else, which seems pretty silly to me. Is it a beatable game, if you get good enough at it? Maybe the difference between skilled players and average players is too great to make a profit.

I've seen video solitaire in Vegas-it's usually on those machines right by the Slots. I played a few years ago but can't recall exactly how it worked. I know you paid a certain amt for the deck, then got money for each card you got on top....but there was something complicated about it, like different amts of money for different cards or the amt changed once you got to certain levels, can't remember exactly. The weird thing was that when I play on my computer, I win all the time, but on that machine I lost miserably every time.

But I can't imagine any casino having Solitaire tables. It would be awkward having a dealer stand there to watch you play.

Sateryn76
07-22-2008, 02:57 PM
I've seen video solitaire in Vegas-it's usually on those machines right by the Slots. I played a few years ago but can't recall exactly how it worked. I know you paid a certain amt for the deck, then got money for each card you got on top....but there was something complicated about it, like different amts of money for different cards or the amt changed once you got to certain levels, can't remember exactly. The weird thing was that when I play on my computer, I win all the time, but on that machine I lost miserably every time.

But I can't imagine any casino having Solitaire tables. It would be awkward having a dealer stand there to watch you play.


The variation I use in the "Vegas" option, in which you pull three cards at a time, and can only use the top card. So if an ace is the third card pulled, you have to play the top two cards to make your way down to it.

This makes winning way harder...

Elendil's Heir
07-22-2008, 02:59 PM
Why go to Vegas or Atlantic City or some Mississippi steamboat to play solitaire, anyway? You don't even have to leave home.

Telemark
07-22-2008, 03:15 PM
Whoa. That sounds like a good deal. I'm not that hot at Solitaire, but I'm betting I could do this. Are there special rules which prevent experts from clearing two or thre hundred a night?

Edit: By :"do this" I meant that I could keep my losses down to a tolerable rate.
There are many casino games where if you play responsibly and know the odds you can lose money at a tolerable rate. :)

Santo Rugger
07-22-2008, 03:49 PM
Why go to Vegas or Atlantic City or some Mississippi steamboat to play solitaire, anyway? You don't even have to leave home.Why go to the theater if you can watch it at home? Why go out to dinner if you can eat at home? Why go out for a drink if you can mix it at home?

It's all about the atmosphere. Some people dig it, some don't.

Q.E.D.
07-22-2008, 03:55 PM
Whoa. That sounds like a good deal. I'm not that hot at Solitaire, but I'm betting I could do this. Are there special rules which prevent experts from clearing two or thre hundred a night?
Only the rules of probability. But, you can try this yourself. As far as I know, Windows still comes with the Solitaire app. Open it and go to Game > Options and under Scoring, select Las Vegas.

jasonh300
07-22-2008, 06:15 PM
My grandpa used to play solitaire at home....with real cards! When was the last time you saw someone doing that?



One of the 3 big casinos (I think it was Casino Magic) on the "strip" in Biloxi, Miss. (pre-Katrina) had a solitaire table. And a "Casino War" table which was a game we always called "Battle" as kids.

I watched the "Casino War" table long enough to see that the player made a bet for each hand, and there were multiple people playing. The dealer had one card and each player got a card. If the player got a higher card, they were paid, if not, the money was taken away. If there was a battle, the player had to put up another bet unit.

GreedySmurf
07-22-2008, 06:24 PM
I must admit I don't do it anymore, but I learnt to play Solitaire with real cards, not on a computer.

I find it interesting that the 3 card draw seems to be an 'option' to many people. Way I was taught that was how Solitaire was meant to be played.

Surely the game becomes too easy if you turn your cards one at a time?

Snarky_Kong
07-22-2008, 09:18 PM
I must admit I don't do it anymore, but I learnt to play Solitaire with real cards, not on a computer.

I find it interesting that the 3 card draw seems to be an 'option' to many people. Way I was taught that was how Solitaire was meant to be played.

Surely the game becomes too easy if you turn your cards one at a time?

If you play the Vegas way that means you only get to go through the deck once and not three times.

RealityChuck
07-22-2008, 09:32 PM
The variant known as Canfield started out as a casino game. Guess what the guy's name was who owned the casino.The Canfield Casino (http://www.saratogahistory.org/) still exists, though it's a museum.

Elendil's Heir
07-22-2008, 11:14 PM
Why go to the theater if you can watch it at home? Why go out to dinner if you can eat at home? Why go out for a drink if you can mix it at home?

It's all about the atmosphere. Some people dig it, some don't.

Well, sure. But... solitaire? I mean, c'mon! :dubious:

Santo Rugger
07-22-2008, 11:43 PM
Well, sure. But... solitaire? I mean, c'mon! :dubious:Fair enough. :p

RichS.
07-22-2008, 11:45 PM
When I go to a casino to gamble, I don't want to sit in a dingy corner, like some recluse, and slowly gamble the rent check through slots and video poker. I'll never understand why people prefer machines to real dealers and other gamblers.

That said, there are some games like solitaire that I just can't see turning a profit for the house unless done with some type of video machine.

Schnitte
07-23-2008, 01:00 AM
My grandpa used to play solitaire at home....with real cards! When was the last time you saw someone doing that?

I'm doing that regularly, and I'm just 25 years old. I do play solitaire on the computer, along with Minesweeper, when the computer is running and I'm bored. But from time to time, I like to play just a quick game of solitaire without having to start the computer, so I grab a pack of cards and go along.

Cyberhwk
07-23-2008, 03:04 AM
I watched the "Casino War" table long enough to see that the player made a bet for each hand, and there were multiple people playing. The dealer had one card and each player got a card. If the player got a higher card, they were paid, if not, the money was taken away. If there was a battle, the player had to put up another bet unit.Another local casino got Casino War and was completely laughed at for it. "Who the hell do they think is going to play high-card for money?"

Casino War ended up having one of the highest hold percentages out of any table they had on their floor. Game made so much money customers stopped playing it. They took their profit and replaced the table.

Pasta
07-23-2008, 03:17 AM
I watched the "Casino War" table long enough to see that the player made a bet for each hand, and there were multiple people playing. The dealer had one card and each player got a card. If the player got a higher card, they were paid, if not, the money was taken away. If there was a battle, the player had to put up another bet unit.Probably it was: If there is a battle, the player can choose either to relinquish a portion of the original bet or double it and see who wins the battle. I shared a poker table with a guy who swore by Casino War. He'd get up every once and a while and use his "system" on it for a bit. But, as long as he kept coming back to the poker table to give me his money, I didn't mind. :)

Schnitte
07-23-2008, 08:01 AM
If there is a battle, the player can choose either to relinquish a portion of the original bet or double it and see who wins the battle.

Maybe I'm missing something here, but I don't see where the house edge in this game comes from. My impression is that the player's chance of winning a single deal at war (or battle, or high-card, or whatever you call the game) is exactly the same as the chance of loosing (should be something like 6/13 each fopr winning and loosing, with the remaining 1/13 being the chance of a tie). Card counting or other seemingly advanced techniques can't alter this - even if you memorized perfectly all the cards dealt so far, and you know the exact percentage of remaining high and low cards, the chances are still the same for the player and the dealer to be dealt the higher card. The option to double the bet in the case of a tie doesn't alter this, because the player still has the same chance of winning the doubled bet or losing it.

All this is assuming, of course, that payouts are 1:1.

Freddy the Pig
07-23-2008, 08:37 AM
I only play when I get a mysterious phone call telling me, "Freddy . . . why don't you pass the time by playing a little solitaire?"

If you play the Vegas way that means you only get to go through the deck once and not three times.No, Vegas is three times through. One time and you'd have no chance.

Pasta
07-23-2008, 08:45 AM
All this is assuming, of course, that payouts are 1:1.The payout on a battle is only the original bet amount rather than the doubled amount.

Elendil's Heir
07-23-2008, 08:49 AM
I only play when I get a mysterious phone call telling me, "Freddy . . . why don't you pass the time by playing a little solitaire?"
....

Is that a movie quotation?

Freddy the Pig
07-23-2008, 09:08 AM
Is that a movie quotation?It's from the original Manchurian Candidate.

Elendil's Heir
07-23-2008, 09:50 AM
Ah, thanks. Thought it sounded familiar.

:: looking furtively over my shoulder for Angela Lansbury ::

Snarky_Kong
07-23-2008, 11:35 AM
I only play when I get a mysterious phone call telling me, "Freddy . . . why don't you pass the time by playing a little solitaire?"

No, Vegas is three times through. One time and you'd have no chance.

Read what I was replying to. What I said is accurate. Using Vegas rules if you draw 3 you go through the deck 3 times, if you draw 1, one time.

BwanaBob
07-23-2008, 12:46 PM
Read what I was replying to. What I said is accurate. Using Vegas rules if you draw 3 you go through the deck 3 times, if you draw 1, one time.

Ifyou play the draw 3 way, what happens say on the second time through when you get to the end of the deck and only have 1 or 2 cards? When my brother taught me the game 40 years ago, he said you put the 1 or 2 cards on top of the pile and draw 3. I've had other people claim you draw the 2nd or the lone card (depending on what was left over). Which way is correct AFA the casinos go?

Kid_A
07-23-2008, 01:07 PM
After some googling (http://www.roziturnbull.com/bill/Solitaire/solitaire.htm) I found that the house edge is:

Draw three cards, around the deck thrice: 2.76%
Draw one card, around the deck once: 17.01%

I'm not an expert in probability or statistics but it makes sense to me.