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View Full Version : But...But... They're made of *MEAT*


Mangetout
07-29-2008, 01:39 AM
As mentioned in some other thread, I'm currently out of (looking for) work - one of the effects of this is a bit of an economy drive... well, actually and economy walk - I'm going on foot wherever possible.

So yesterday I walked the few miles to the bank and shops - it was a nice day, so this was quite pleasant. On the way home I witnessed a fatal accident.

No humans came to harm though - the victim was a member of the quite considerable population of a wood pigeons we have around here. It struck the car windscreen and was propelled high into the air, descending in a fluttery parabola through a cloud of feathers to land on the path directly across the road from me, where it lay fluttering and twiching.

The driver pulled over and stopped - an elderly lady. Thinking about the distress suffered by all parties, I crossed the road, with the intention of putting the obviously-mortally-wounded pigeon out of its misery (and saving the woman the upset of seeing it suffer), but by the time I got across, it had already expired.

So there's me. Mangetout, standing over the lifeless, plump body of a young wood pigeon. Anyone that has known me for more than a second will know exactly what thoughts were running through my head. For those that have just met me, allow me to fill in the blank: I was thinking "Hmmm... a little red wine, some garlic and mushrooms and a slow braise in a low oven..."

My reverie was interrupted by the arrival on scene of the driver. "Ohhh, poor thing!", she said.

"Don't worry, it was an accident - there's nothing you could have done to avoid it," I reassured her

"I'll take it home and bury it," she replied

"Don't worry yourself, I'll deal with it," I said

"I'll bury it in the garden," she said, appearing not to have heard me

"It's OK," I told her, as gently as I could, "I'll take it home and cook it - might as well make some use of all this,"

"Oh, I couldn't possibly let you do that," she replied

I tried weakly responding with "It's really not any trouble... ", but she had already picked it up and that was the end of the matter. What a waste. I should have just picked it up and run with it while I had the chance.
Edit/Delete Message

Derleth
07-29-2008, 01:41 AM
You don't know of Terry Bisson by any chance, do you? (http://www.terrybisson.com/meat.html) Because that's what I thought this would be about.

Jragon
07-29-2008, 01:51 AM
You don't know of Terry Bisson by any chance, do you? (http://www.terrybisson.com/meat.html) Because that's what I thought this would be about.
Phew, glad I wasn't the only one that expected that.

nd_n8
07-29-2008, 05:48 AM
Phew, glad I wasn't the only one that expected that.
I just figured he'd been over to my MySpace page (http://www.myspace.com/nd_n8)(Made Of Meat video available).

I didn't see the thread mentioned in the OP but have read the solicitation on Atomicshrimp.com, hope the job search is going well.

CairoCarol
07-29-2008, 05:54 AM
Mmm, pigeon. I love pigeon. Especially in Chinese restaurants.

I wonder though, is it safe to eat any old pigeon whose expiration you have just witnessed? You know it's fresh and didn't die of a disease, but ... maybe it just ate pigeon poison 10 minutes ago somewhere else? And wild birds are supposed to be incredible disease carriers, aren't they?

I also wonder, maybe the old lady wanted to eat the pigeon?

nd_n8
07-29-2008, 06:10 AM
Yeah, maybe "Bury it in the garden" was a euphamism for "Drop it in a pot with some carrots and 'taters, maybe a bay leaf and a clove of garlic or two."

Mangetout
07-29-2008, 06:26 AM
I wonder though, is it safe to eat any old pigeon whose expiration you have just witnessed? You know it's fresh and didn't die of a disease, but ... maybe it just ate pigeon poison 10 minutes ago somewhere else? And wild birds are supposed to be incredible disease carriers, aren't they?People shoot and eat wood pigeon around here, so I think it would be as safe as any other - I passed another dead pigeon on the way home that had also clearly been struck by a car, but as I didn't know how long it had been there, I left it for the foxes.

I also wonder, maybe the old lady wanted to eat the pigeon?
Maybe, but I think not in this case - she seemed genuinely upset.

Maybe I should have been the one to say I'd take it home and give it a respectful burial.

Bear_Nenno
07-29-2008, 06:52 AM
How much meat is there on a pigeon?

3acresandatruck
07-29-2008, 07:52 AM
How much meat is there on a pigeon?I think they're referred to as squab (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Squab_%28food%29) when eaten. They aren't huge, but there's enough meat to make it worthwhile. No firsthand experience, but I've always heard it's quite popular in the mid-East. Usually the images I see show them being spit-roasted whole or spatchcocked and grilled.

Sarahfeena
07-29-2008, 08:07 AM
Wow. You really WILL mange tout!

nd_n8
07-29-2008, 08:36 AM
Wow. You really WILL mange tout!
Yeah but really, who amongst us hasn't eaten road kill at least once or twice in our lives?

Anyone?

Anyone at all?

Just me, a deer and a couple of rabbits then?

pbbth
07-29-2008, 08:52 AM
You want pigeon? Come to my place, I have more pigeons than I know what to do with and would LOVE to get rid of a few! (I live in NYC, the flying rat capital of the world.)

don't ask
07-29-2008, 09:02 AM
Lovely OP, quite a joy. Treat yourself to a game bird next time you are in town....you deserve it.

unstrung
07-29-2008, 09:05 AM
A while back (in the old days, when I was gainfully employed), I took a trip to Hong Kong to help set up a database for one of my company's satellite offices. Over the course of my stint there, I befriended a couple of the tech guys, who were super-cool in showing me the fun places to go in the area.

One place they took me to was a Vietnamese restaurant, and as we perused the menu, they suggested the fried pigeon to me. Of course, I eagerly accepted. Now, I can't speak to any local food traditions, Chinese, Vietnamese, or otherwise. But at this particular restaurant, they pretty much fry up the whole pigeon for you. You get a whole bird encased in the breading or whatever - including beak, eyes, etc. I'm pretty sure they took me there so they could have a laugh, but little did they know that I would dig in without so much as a hint of hesitation.

Sure, this is slightly off-topic. But I guess my point is that pigeon can be pretty damn tasty...

Pushkin
07-29-2008, 09:08 AM
Just me, a deer and a couple of rabbits then?

Where my parents come from, you hit a deer on the road and you pay the Duke of Abercorn for the experience. After that, you'd bloody well better be getting the deer to eat.

But to the OP, my mum has standing orders that if any of us hit a pigeon with the car, we bring it home for her to eat.

Szlater
07-29-2008, 09:21 AM
I think they're referred to as squab (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Squab_%28food%29) when eaten.

Not in the UK. It's just pigeon. At least according to the River Cottage Meat Book (http://www.amazon.co.uk/River-Cottage-Meat-Book/dp/0340826355).

Szlater
07-29-2008, 09:24 AM
Where my parents come from, you hit a deer on the road and you pay the Duke of Abercorn for the experience.

Three questions come to mind.

Firstly, how much of the car would survive?

Secondly, how much of the front seat occupants would survive or be in a position to make use of the freshly killed venison?

Thirdly, how does one despatch a wounded deer using tools that an average someone in the UK would have in their car?

Wile E
07-29-2008, 09:38 AM
Ick. I know some people eat them but after seeing a whole bunch of sick and injured ones over many years and all the things that crawl around on them and in them, I don't even like touching them so I am certainly not going to eat them. You may have my share of any dead pigeons you find.

By the way, make sure you clean them outside in case they have pigeon flies (http://creatures.ifas.ufl.edu/livestock/pigeon_fly.htm). These things are extremely annoying and like to fly right at you and run around on you. :eek: I can deal with maggoty wounds but pigeon flies make me run screaming from the room. If they get loose in the building they will hang around to torment you for a while, usually patiently waiting on a wall until you walk by so they can fly at you again.

3acresandatruck
07-29-2008, 10:28 AM
Three questions come to mind.

Firstly, how much of the car would survive?

Secondly, how much of the front seat occupants would survive or be in a position to make use of the freshly killed venison?

Thirdly, how does one despatch a wounded deer using tools that an average someone in the UK would have in their car?The car takes a hit, but it's not like running into a horse or a cow on the road. When I moved out here, the neighbors said you're better off to hit the brakes and hit the deer. Don't swerve, you might go off the road or hit someone else. Wear your seat belt and chances are you'll be fine, barring some kind of freak accident. Here's (http://www.khqa.com/news/news_story.aspx?id=21272) a nice article that includes pointers on the proper way to hit a deer. One lady in the article had hit more than a few deer. And, it includes this important legal advice:in Missouri, there's no fine for not reporting a hit deer. But if you keep the any part of the deer, you must report it to the Missouri Department of Conservation.I don't know if it's legal to kill one that's injured and down, even if it did seem more merciful.

Cervaise
07-29-2008, 10:29 AM
Yeah but really, who amongst us hasn't eaten road kill at least once or twice in our lives?Heck, if it smells like there's some flavor left, I'll pry the gum off the bottom of the theater seat.

vetbridge
07-29-2008, 10:49 AM
They aren't huge, but there's enough meat to make it worthwhile.
Actually, there are some meat breeds of pigeon bred specifically for size. The giant runt (http://www.pigeoncote.com/lancast/lancas2.html) is one example.

Chimera
07-29-2008, 11:33 AM
I think it would have been funnier if you had actually said the thread title to her as she was walking away with the dead bird.

Bobotheoptimist
07-29-2008, 12:36 PM
Aren't wild pigeons frequently syphilitic? Or is that just a problem when training falcons? Or was that something else entirely, maybe a dream or ...

Who are you people? Why are you following me?

The Weird One
07-29-2008, 12:54 PM
Aren't wild pigeons frequently syphilitic?
Are you suggesting that the great Henry VIII boinked a wild pigeon?






Because it wouldn't surprise me in the least.

Unintentionally Blank
07-29-2008, 12:56 PM
Phew, glad I wasn't the only one that expected that.

Thirded.

To Serve Man.....it's a COOKBOOK!

eleanorigby
07-29-2008, 12:59 PM
Yeah but really, who amongst us hasn't eaten road kill at least once or twice in our lives?



Um, me? I haven't eaten roadkill, I haven't had (or wanted) a three way, I don't like Star Wars or Firefly or Buffy and I am not amused or diverted by porn.



And yet I am a Doper. Odd, that.




:cool:

Mangetout
07-29-2008, 01:00 PM
I have contemplated eating feral city pigeons (and may still do this sometime), but this bird was a wild wood pigeon - in all probability no more or less dirty or diseased than any other wild animal taken for food here (such as rabbit or pheasant).

There's enough meat on an average young pigeon for a light lunch for one - most of it is on the breast and in fact some people don't bother plucking and drawing the birds, but just cut out the breast and discard the remainder.

Szlater
07-29-2008, 01:00 PM
Aren't wild pigeons frequently syphilitic? Or is that just a problem when training falcons? Or was that something else entirely, maybe a dream or ...

Who are you people? Why are you following me?

I doubt the spirochetes (Treponema pallidum) that cause syphilis would survive cooking. I can't find any references to pigeons carrying or transmitting syphilis, I do know that rabbits can incubate it though and it can't be cultured in vitro.

Drunky Smurf
07-29-2008, 01:18 PM
Three questions come to mind.

Firstly, how much of the car would survive?

Secondly, how much of the front seat occupants would survive or be in a position to make use of the freshly killed venison?

Thirdly, how does one despatch a wounded deer using tools that an average someone in the UK would have in their car?
1. I hit a deer going 25 mph, I was actually breaking and slowing down at the time so it might have been slower than that, in a VW bug. The right fendor and headlight were totaled. The hood was a goner too but other that that the car was fine.

2. We were freaked out because the deer didn't die and it lifted its head up and looked at us, with out making a sound, as we got out of the car. That was spooky but other than that we were fine.

3. I had a tire iron I could have used to finish it off but it's stomach was all ripped open and guts were spread out and we figured it would die real soon anyways plus we were spooked as all get out as it was staring at us so we just called animal control and told them were the deer was.

BTW my friend who was riding with me has a dad that hunts, deer included, got all mad at us because we didn't pile the deer in the back of my bug and bring it back to his house for skinning and eating. Sorry but I am not piling a deer with open stomach and guts hanging all over the place into the back of a bug.

chowder
07-29-2008, 01:27 PM
Yeah but really, who amongst us hasn't eaten road kill at least once or twice in our lives?

Anyone?

Anyone at all?

Just me, a deer and a couple of rabbits then?
Never eaten road kill but I've twatted a few pigeons in my time and once I totalled a hedgehog.....quite accidentally I assure you

MissMossie
07-29-2008, 01:42 PM
Never eaten road kill but I've twatted a few pigeons in my time and once I totalled a hedgehog.....quite accidentally I assure you
You've done what to pigeons?

Szlater
07-29-2008, 01:48 PM
You've done what to pigeons?

Struck with a great deal of force.

For example: "He called me a "twat", so I twatted him in the face."

MissMossie
07-29-2008, 01:54 PM
Struck with a great deal of force.

For example: "He called me a "twat", so I twatted him in the face."
Thanks for the clarification. I was imagining actions that aren't legal in most countries.

Cat Whisperer
07-29-2008, 01:59 PM
Hitting a deer might be okay (but I still don't recommend it for your car), but hitting a moose can kill you. It's the long legs - your car takes out the legs, and the body of the moose comes through the windshield. It's really not good for anyone involved. On the other hand, moose are really good eating. (That's the second time I've posted that in the last little while. Weird.)

The Weird One
07-29-2008, 02:03 PM
Um, me? I haven't eaten roadkill, I haven't had (or wanted) a three way, I don't like Star Wars or Firefly or Buffy and I am not amused or diverted by porn.
Weirdo. :p

Pushkin
07-29-2008, 02:52 PM
Three questions come to mind.

Firstly, how much of the car would survive?

Secondly, how much of the front seat occupants would survive or be in a position to make use of the freshly killed venison?

Thirdly, how does one despatch a wounded deer using tools that an average someone in the UK would have in their car?

If it was Dad in one of his old Volvos, the chances of car and occupants surviving are quite high. I don't know if its an UL or not, but allegedly the boxy shape of old Volvos was there to cut the legs out from underneath a moose so that the body would roll over the bonnet and over the roof.

With regards finishing off the poor beast, Dad always carries around a Leatherman in the car. He would need Mum to do the slashing of the throat though, he gets pretty squeamish, as do I.

nd_n8
07-29-2008, 04:47 PM
If it was Dad in one of his old Volvos, the chances of car and occupants surviving are quite high. I don't know if its an UL or not, but allegedly the boxy shape of old Volvos was there to cut the legs out from underneath a moose so that the body would roll over the bonnet and over the roof.

With regards finishing off the poor beast, Dad always carries around a Leatherman in the car. He would need Mum to do the slashing of the throat though, he gets pretty squeamish, as do I.
Great, now I have a mental image of a sweet ol' Irish mum, her silver hair in a bun, wearing a blue gingham dress and carrying a small, smart black handbag. She reaches into the bag, pulls out a Leatherman, grabs the moose from behind the head and slits the throat in one swift, Rambo-like stroke. The moose struggles to bellow as streams of crimson life flow out of it's neck and into it's severed trachea, gurgling and filling the lungs with ichor. As the mighty moose tries one last surge to stand the sweet ol' Irish mum lifts her pettycoat and delivers a spinning back kick, finishing it off. She dusts herself off, fixes her stockings, pulls out a small compact and readjusts her hair then sits back into the car humming "Just a Closer Walk With Thee".

Nice image, thanks :dubious: :D

Bobotheoptimist
07-29-2008, 05:49 PM
Sounds like my grandmother, except I don't think she'd ever deliver a spinning roundhouse kick whilst wearing a dress. That'd be unladylike, but some conservative slacks are just the thing...
The whole time she'd be tut-tutting the menfolk for being such wimps.

lizardling
07-29-2008, 05:51 PM
Hitting a deer might be okay (but I still don't recommend it for your car), but hitting a moose can kill you. It's the long legs - your car takes out the legs, and the body of the moose comes through the windshield. It's really not good for anyone involved. On the other hand, moose are really good eating. (That's the second time I've posted that in the last little while. Weird.)

Not to mention the *size* of the average moose. :eek:

I was looking at the website of some WI processor and they had a shot comparing sirloins from a moose versus that of a deer. Given that a deer might be a undred fifty before processing and a moose is consider'ble bigger... yeah.

BellRungBookShut-CandleSnuffed
07-29-2008, 07:46 PM
Yeah but really, who amongst us hasn't eaten road kill at least once or twice in our lives?

Anyone?

Anyone at all?

Just me, a deer and a couple of rabbits then?
I didn't know deer and rabbits ate roadkill? And what were you doing eating roadkill with some deer and rabbits when you could have killed them and eaten them while they were distracted?

Weirddave
07-29-2008, 08:02 PM
You don't know of Terry Bisson by any chance, do you? (http://www.terrybisson.com/meat.html) Because that's what I thought this would be about.
I thought someone would link to the video of that story (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gaFZTAOb7IE).

Pushkin
07-30-2008, 03:18 AM
Nice image, thanks :dubious: :D

We used to have giant Elk (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Irish_Elk) on our island, not any more. Not saying there's any link between that and the mental image above, just giving other large mammals that make for our shores a heads up.

Wallenstein
07-30-2008, 05:02 AM
We were camping last weekend in woods near Coventry, and one of the lads turned up with 17 freshly-shot woodpigeons.

We got them ready for the pot by snapping the wings off at the shoulder, then shoving a thumb in under the breast bone and pulling up to remove the whole breast.

Then peel the skin (incl. feathers) off the breast and trim off the meat.

Quickly seared on a griddle and nibbled, or chucked into the pot with some muntjac, neck of lamb and a bunch of veg.

Really tasty and v. cheap - most hunters will give you them for free if you ask nicely.

Mangetout
07-30-2008, 05:16 AM
We got them ready for the pot by snapping the wings off at the shoulder, then shoving a thumb in under the breast bone and pulling up to remove the whole breast.I heard someone talking about this technique on the River Cottage Message Board - are you a member there?

Wallenstein
07-30-2008, 06:04 AM
I heard someone talking about this technique on the River Cottage Message Board - are you a member there?
I browse quite a bit, but not a member yet.... although I spotted your AS screen name in a couple of the "Wild Larder" threads :-)

This technique was shown by Gordon Ramsey on F-Word recently, which is why people know about it, but the lad who showed us has been doing it this way for years.

Takes literally 30 secs to prepare each bird - it's the first time I'd tried to prepare a fresh bird (of any sort) and it was v. easy. You have to get your thumb right under the ball-joint in the shoulder - one twist and it just pops out, then you can pull off the wings.

You need a bit of force to get your thumb in under the breast, but once you're in it will lift out fairly easily. Skin and feathers peel off in one go, and then you need a sharp knife to cut out the meat.

Obviously, the fresher the bird the simpler it is... your car casualty would be perfect :)

The other method is to remove some feathers on the breast, then use a sharp knife to split the skin down the middle of the breast. Once it's peeled back you can cut out the breast meat in situ, but it's a lot more faffy.

Given that you generally dispose of the rest of the bird, there's no problem in pulling it apart to get the decent meat.

Martiju
07-30-2008, 06:06 AM
Lovely OP, quite a joy. Treat yourself to a game bird next time you are in town....you deserve it.

My guess is that Mangetout wouldn't say no to any game bird he met in town...

;)

yep, read through the whole thread just so I could do that one...

Mangetout
07-30-2008, 06:18 AM
I browse quite a bit, but not a member yet.... although I spotted your AS screen name in a couple of the "Wild Larder" threads :-)

This technique was shown by Gordon Ramsey on F-Word recently, which is why people know about it, but the lad who showed us has been doing it this way for years.

Takes literally 30 secs to prepare each bird - it's the first time I'd tried to prepare a fresh bird (of any sort) and it was v. easy. You have to get your thumb right under the ball-joint in the shoulder - one twist and it just pops out, then you can pull off the wings.

You need a bit of force to get your thumb in under the breast, but once you're in it will lift out fairly easily. Skin and feathers peel off in one go, and then you need a sharp knife to cut out the meat.

Obviously, the fresher the bird the simpler it is... your car casualty would be perfect :)

The other method is to remove some feathers on the breast, then use a sharp knife to split the skin down the middle of the breast. Once it's peeled back you can cut out the breast meat in situ, but it's a lot more faffy.

Given that you generally dispose of the rest of the bird, there's no problem in pulling it apart to get the decent meat.Thanks for that. I reckon if it was just the one bird, I'd probably pluck it or at least skin it so as to be able to make stock from the carcass after removing the breast meat (also, I'd keep the liver and heart, as these are tasty) - if I bagged a whole pile of them, I might be tempted to keep just the breasts.

nd_n8
07-30-2008, 06:30 AM
My guess is that Mangetout wouldn't say no to any game bird he met in town...

;)

yep, read through the whole thread just so I could do that one...
I don't understand all this talk about bagging game birds.

I mean, British women may not be my cup of tea but they're not all that bad looking.

vetbridge
07-30-2008, 07:05 AM
My guess is that Mangetout wouldn't say no to any game bird he met in town.
I might be tempted to keep just the breasts.
:eek: :eek: :eek:

Pithy Moniker
07-30-2008, 07:13 AM
There was a (very much alive) pigeon sitting on my storage building yesterday afternoon. Thanks to this thread my first thought was, "I wonder if he'd be good to eat."

Caractacus Pott
07-30-2008, 07:53 PM
Thanks for that. I reckon if it was just the one bird, I'd probably pluck it or at least skin it so as to be able to make stock from the carcass after removing the breast meat (also, I'd keep the liver and heart, as these are tasty) - if I bagged a whole pile of them, I might be tempted to keep just the breasts.You want a pile of dead birds? Follow me to work. I've had a few of the buggars crash right into my car despite my best efforts to dodge 'em and it looks like mine isn't the only car they're bouncing off of. Today was different; there were little balls o' fur between the villages. I guess the wee bunnies turned right to go into the field across the streat instead of left into the hedgerows. Thankfully my tires are clear of bunny fur. For now.

Lok
07-31-2008, 01:42 AM
Three questions come to mind.

Firstly, how much of the car would survive?

Secondly, how much of the front seat occupants would survive or be in a position to make use of the freshly killed venison?

Thirdly, how does one despatch a wounded deer using tools that an average someone in the UK would have in their car?
I hit a buck once. In an AMC Pacer (http://blog.hemmings.com/wp-content/uploads/2006/11/AMC%20Pacer%201977.jpg). At 55 mph at dusk. The first time I saw the deer, its head was coming through my windshield in front of my face. The low bumper caused it to more or less roll up the hood of the car, with the head hitting right in front of my face, then it flipped right on up and over, landing on the other side of the road. I didn't need to worry about making sure it was dead, the impact apparently broke its neck.

In Ohio at the time, you could keep the deer if you reported it. So I traded an 8 year old car for a 9 point buck, dressed out at 150 pounds. We ate venison for quite a while. Not a recommended method of shopping, but it was effective.

JR Brown
07-31-2008, 11:51 AM
Not in the UK. It's just pigeon. At least according to the River Cottage Meat Book (http://www.amazon.co.uk/River-Cottage-Meat-Book/dp/0340826355).

A great Veddy British author name there (Hugh Fearnley-Whittingstall, for those too lazy to click). My eyes/contacts are a bit dry just this second and my vision is a tad blurry in consequence, so I at first interpreted the cover photo as a nice little old lady holding the big chunk of ex-cow. It went well with the OP.

JRB

Wallenstein
08-01-2008, 09:13 AM
A great Veddy British author name there (Hugh Fearnley-Whittingstall, for those too lazy to click). My eyes/contacts are a bit dry just this second and my vision is a tad blurry in consequence, so I at first interpreted the cover photo as a nice little old lady holding the big chunk of ex-cow. It went well with the OP.

JRB
Also known as "Hugh Fearlessly-Eats-it-all" :)

GorillaMan
08-02-2008, 04:32 PM
How much meat is there on a pigeon?
Enough to form a hearty meal for one.

Never eaten road kill but I've twatted a few pigeons in my time and once I totalled a hedgehog.....quite accidentally I assure you
I regard it as an unproductive week if I haven't created at least one piece of crow-food. Early mornings at this time of year proves to be a good one, with sleepy pigeons sitting out in the early sunshine falling on the open space formed by tree-lined roads.

Having said that, hitting a pheasant when driving at 80+ isn't an amusing experience, even if it does produce a spectacular cloud of feathers.

Szlater
08-02-2008, 05:04 PM
Having said that, hitting a pheasant when driving at 80+ isn't an amusing experience, even if it does produce a spectacular cloud of feathers.

There was one of those traffic police programmes on a couple of months ago that featured a motorcyclist that was hit by a pheasant. Went right through his visor, and smashed his face up pretty badly (he survived). I think the pheasant had just had enough of life and decided to go out in a blaze of glory.