My new standard for biggest asshole hereabouts: Carol Stream

[lissener]

http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=478939

Starting post#8 and continuing. Unabated. Seriously, WTF? I'm all for sinking to pitful behavior in the pit when someone deserves it, but this looks more like a random attempt to start a pileon on an innocent bystander. Fortunately, Carol Stream remains the biggest asshole in the thread; no one is taking her bait. Still, is the "don't be a jerk" rule completely suspended in the pit? or are there standards of jerkishness even here?

[Red Barchetta]

Wow, Carol Stream was being a class A douche-wagon in that thread. Even I, as an editor, have no problems with how other spell and/or use grammar. As long as the point is conveyed, anything else is practically irrelevant.

[DianaG]

You know what? Carol Stream is an asshole. But this thread is still kinda dumb, for two reasons.

1. I have no problem with calling out an OP as abysmal as the one in that thread. Yeah, it's "a message board, not a MENSA test", but that doesn't make it okay to post that unholy mess.

2. Carol Stream falls firmly within the group of posters that always make me think "You know, people, if you just fucking ignored her/him, maybe s/he'd go away." Seriously... why do people engage? What an incredibly fruitless endeavor.

[alice_in_wonderland]

Ya know, I'm not sure I've ever seen Carol Stream posting without being a class A douche-wagon.

Frankly, I don't think she has it in her.

[Frank]

As long as the point is conveyed, anything else is practically irrelevant.
Well, the point wasn't conveyed to me. My eyes glazed over somewhere in the middle of it. It was horrible writing all the way around; spelling and grammar and thought and presentation were all notably awful.

[Red Barchetta]

1. I have no problem with calling out an OP as abysmal as the one in that thread. Yeah, it's "a message board, not a MENSA test", but that doesn't make it okay to post that unholy mess.

I do, at least in the manner Carol Steam did. Not everyone has an excellent grasp on writing clearly, and who's to say why that might be? Maybe english is a second language? Or perhaps they, like my father (one of the smartest men I know), suffered a medical condition which greatly diminished their ability to spell?

Regardless of the matter, I don't think it's right to harp on someone when they're merely trying to seek out help or information. If you don't like it, don't read it.

[lissener]

Well, the point wasn't conveyed to me. My eyes glazed over somewhere in the middle of it. It was horrible writing all the way around; spelling and grammar and thought and presentation were all notably awful.
--which was corrected, non-judgmentally, twice. Carol Stream didn't even come into the thread until after Bryan Ekers and I had offered revisions of the OP.

CS, however, seems intent on--as far as I can tell--suggesting that the OP is somehow faking something? Lying about something? Her location? Her background? Whatever; CS isn't all that interested in the content of the OP. She's only interested in being an asshole.

[Alice The Goon]

Well, duh. You're just now catching on to her?

Ninety-nine percent of posts I've ever seen her make have been assholish. Now when I see that she's posted something, I automatically click on it just to see what kind of bitchy, asshole thing she's saying this time. She never disappoints, either.

[Projammer]

Yeah, while Clippy tied himself into a pretzel and died around the third sentence of the OP, it was because of CS that I stopped reading the thread.

If I had gone any further I would have had to add her to the ignore list.

No validation for that kind of behavior at all.

In other words, how sad must her life be that she must act like this.

[kaylasdad99]

CS, however, seems intent on--as far as I can tell--suggesting that the OP is somehow faking something? Lying about something? Her location? Her background?That was my initial impression, as well*, and when I composed a post to katpohl, I originally included an aside to Carol Stream, asking her to "shit or get off the pot," so to speak.

Fortunately for me, there was a bit of a glitch in getting it posted, and by the time it was able to post, she appeared to have dialed back some on the attitude. (http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=10086808&postcount=28)

Anyway, to the OP (of this thread): I don't really see Carol Stream as being in the top ten, much less the new setter-of-the-bar.





*(sort of; I felt that Carol Stream was perhaps preparing to cast doubt on the story itself.)

[eleanorigby]

Note to thread: Carol Stream may be male. It's one of the top ten secrets of the intarwebs. Carol Stream is a suburb of Chicago, for you folks playing along at home. (no, I don't know how a town got such a silly name).

Just FYI: in post #28, CS turns the tables on us all and goes for nice. She shoots, she scores! And the crowd goes wild! :D

[Kat]

I'm just surprised that Carol Stream has never encountered the spelling "Racheal" before.

[lissener]

It's a suburb named after the daughter of a crook, so I still presume female.

[Argent Towers]

All I care about, is whether or not Carol Stream is a girl or a boy, and if she's a girl, whether she's hot. I don't give a tinker's damn about anything else, I just want to fucking know what gender this poster is.

[Carol Stream]

I'm just surprised that Carol Stream has never encountered the spelling "Racheal" before.

Just give me one example, please.

[runner pat]

Note to thread: Carol Stream may be male. It's one of the top ten secrets of the intarwebs. Carol Stream is a suburb of Chicago, for you folks playing along at home. (no, I don't know how a town got such a silly name).

Just FYI: in post #28, CS turns the tables on us all and goes for nice. She shoots, she scores! And the crowd goes wild! :D

The town was named after the developer's daughter.

Wiki. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carol_Stream,_Illinois)

[Telperien]

Just give me one example, please.

Perhaps it's an alternate spelling of the far more usual "Rachael"?

[Carol Stream]

It's a suburb named after the daughter of a crook, so I still presume female.
Cite that he is a crook? And I don't care if it's the Pit. Put up, or shut up.

[Carol Stream]

Perhaps it's an alternate spelling of the far more usual "Rachael"? Did you read the OP? There was an awful lot of "alternative" spelling going on there.

[Green Bean]

There was a thread recently where Carol was asked about her gender. She refused to answer. Shortly thereafter, and I don't remember whether it was in that thread or another, she referred to her husband.

So she's female.

Well, either that or she's a male in a same-sex marriage, but given her posting history, I highly doubt that.

[lissener]

Cite that he is a crook? And I don't care if it's the Pit. Put up, or shut up.
My grandfather was police commissioner of Wheaton when Carol's daddy was doing his dirt. Beyond that I'm not all that interested in changing your worldview, hun.

[Diogenes the Cynic]

I can't believe I'm going to defend her, but I don't think Carol was particuarly out of line in tht thread. The OP was a mess -- a grammatical and stylistic eyesore which was difficult to read. Carol was a little unsympathetic, maybe, and not exactly on topic, but she wasn't wrong, in my opinion. Some paragraph breaks would have been nice, and I too wondered if the name "Racheal" was misspelled.

By the way, I believe Carol once let slip that she has a husband, so I assume she's either a woman or a gay man. Considering her politics, I would bet on the former.

[Duck Duck Goose]

Just give me one example, please.
Google, "Racheal".

Baby names.
http://www.babynameshub.com/baby-names-girls/Racheal.html
http://www.thinkbabynames.com/meaning/0/Racheal

Real people.
http://www.rachealsphotography.com/
http://www.rachealcogan.com/
http://www.racheal.cx/
http://www.absolutearts.com/portfolios/r/rachealyang/
http://www.imdb.com/name/nm1351833/
http://www.rachealwoodcoaching.com/default.aspx
http://www.rachealward.com/

And that's just from the first two pages of Google hits.

[Diogenes the Cynic]

I'm just surprised that Carol Stream has never encountered the spelling "Racheal" before.
I've never encountered it before either and I'm well read and well travelled.

[zagloba]

Just give me one example, please.Google is your friend -- 1,290,000 hits

[Diogenes the Cynic]

Google, "Racheal".

Baby names.
http://www.babynameshub.com/baby-names-girls/Racheal.html
http://www.thinkbabynames.com/meaning/0/Racheal

Real people.
http://www.rachealsphotography.com/
http://www.rachealcogan.com/
http://www.racheal.cx/
http://www.absolutearts.com/portfolios/r/rachealyang/
http://www.imdb.com/name/nm1351833/
http://www.rachealwoodcoaching.com/default.aspx
http://www.rachealward.com/

And that's just from the first two pages of Google hits.
It's still wrong. :p

[Bryan Ekers]

My effort to parse the OP:


Carol Stream sucks!




Beyond that, I have nothing to contribute to this or the other thread.

[Carol Stream]

Never mind.

[lissener]

My effort to parse the OP:


Carol Stream sucks!
So does Carol Stream.

[Tapioca Dextrin]

All I care about, is whether or not Carol Stream is a girl or a boy, and if she's a girl, whether she's hot. I don't give a tinker's damn about anything else, I just want to fucking know what gender this poster is.

I believe she looks like the love child of Ann Coulter and Katherine Harris.

[lissener]

I believe she looks like the love child of Ann Coulter and Katherine Harris.
Oh. A boy.

[Carol Stream]

So does Carol Stream. That comment is exremely rude, don't ya think?

[LurkMeister]

I've never encountered it before either and I'm well read and well travelled.
Well I guess that settles it, then. Diogenes has never encountered that particular spelling, so anyone who chooses to use it is obviously wrong.

But then we all know that he's the final arbiter of all that is right. He must be, because he keeps telling us so.

[lissener]

That comment is exremely rude, don't ya think?
Yes. (By the way, you should proofread.)

[Carol Stream]

Yes. (By the way, you should proofread.)

By the way, you should get a real job.

[pulykamell]

Just give me one example, please.

You can also go here (http://ssdi.rootsweb.ancestry.com/), type "racheal" for first name, leaving everything else blank, to find all the dead Racheals you want.

"Racheal" is a variant form of "Rachael." It looks weird to my eyes, too, but I have encountered this spelling before, and it's certainly out there.

[Diogenes the Cynic]

Well I guess that settles it, then. Diogenes has never encountered that particular spelling, so anyone who chooses to use it is obviously wrong.

But then we all know that he's the final arbiter of all that is right. He must be, because he keeps telling us so.
That's not what I meant. I just meant that it's not incredible that someone might not have seen it before.

[LurkMeister]

My apologies, then.

[Carol Stream]

You can also go here (http://ssdi.rootsweb.ancestry.com/), type "racheal" for first name, leaving everything else blank, to find all the dead Racheals you want.

"Racheal" is a variant form of "Rachael." It looks weird to my eyes, too, but I have encountered this spelling before, and it's certainly out there.

Do you really think the person in question is actually a "Racheal"? More likely, the OP just can't spell.

[lissener]

Do you really think the person in question is actually a "Racheal"? More likely, the OP just can't spell.
Awesome, I can bow out now. Carol Stream clearly has this under control.

[Carol Stream]

Awesome, I can bow out now. Carol Stream clearly has this under control.

How is the video store going? Mom & Dad must be soooo proud.

[LurkMeister]

I was wondering how long that would take.

[Hostile Dialect]

Well, the point wasn't conveyed to me. My eyes glazed over somewhere in the middle of it. It was horrible writing all the way around; spelling and grammar and thought and presentation were all notably awful.

Agreed. OTOH, there's no reason Carol Stream has to be such a douchebag. On the gripping hand, she's always a douchebag. You can tell she's only a Republican because she likes watching less fortunate people suffer. I think the most important point is this, though:

If you don't like it, don't read it.

Exactly. If I hadn't scrolled down to see Carol Stream's response, I wouldn't have caught the two excellent translations, and if I hadn't seen those, I wouldn't have bothered trying to parse the OP. Why burst a blood vessel? Leave that to VCO3.

All I care about, is whether or not Carol Stream is a girl or a boy, and if she's a girl, whether she's hot. I don't give a tinker's damn about anything else, I just want to fucking know what gender this poster is.

Classy.

[Argent Towers]

Well, they call me the Gentleman...

[Enter the Flagon]

How is the video store going? Mom & Dad must be soooo proud.

Up until this thread, I was agnostic on the question of Carol Stream's doucheitude. Call me a convert. :p

[The Flying Dutchman]

http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=478939

Starting post#8 and continuing. Unabated. Seriously, WTF? I'm all for sinking to pitful behavior in the pit when someone deserves it, but this looks more like a random attempt to start a pileon on an innocent bystander. Fortunately, Carol Stream remains the biggest asshole in the thread; no one is taking her bait. Still, is the "don't be a jerk" rule completely suspended in the pit? or are there standards of jerkishness even here?

Frankly I'm amused by your OP. Carol's posts in that thread would actually pass the rules in any other forum as she's criticizing the posting not the poster in that thread. You on the other hand are definitely trying to start a pile on on Carol including charging her with felatio.

Other than the blatant hypocracy(I may have mispelled), your OP complies with pit standards so I won't call for your banning. Please carry on for my amusement.

[Rubystreak]

Just give me one example, please.

I had a student named Racheal this year. Of course, you could call me a liar too, but it's true. She and her parents weren't going to be members of MENSA either anytime soon, but that's how she spelled her name. I've also had students named Micheal and Adrein. Your criticism is bullshit.

[Miller]

I've never encountered it before either and I'm well read and well travelled.

I had a boss named Micheal once. He was head of Quality Assurance. The sign on his door said:

Quality Assurance Manager
Micheal Smith

...which I always found funny.

[lissener]

How is the video store going? Mom & Dad must be soooo proud.
Thanks. My dad decapitated my mom in a video store. In Carol Stream. Thanks for understanding.

[Bryan Ekers]

Well, they call me the Gentleman...
Nobody does that, you big fat liar. I hope you have asbestos pants.

[Rubystreak]

In case Carol Stream wasn't willing to take me at my word that I've personally known a Racheal, and that people actually spell it that way, here (http://www.rachealcogan.com/) are (http://rachealanilyse.com/home.html) some (http://www.myspace.com/ungezogenfrau) examples (http://www.racheal.cx/). Which you easily could have Googled up yourself if you were actually interested and not being a douchebag.

You can admit you were wrong and apologize to katpohl anytime, Carol Stream. But of course, you never will, because you are a troll. Moving on...

[Alice The Goon]

I come across misspelled names quite a bit- I think it's hilarious. It's like a walking advertisement to people for your whole life that your parents are/were stupid. I especially love Jaime for Jamie. The other day I had to call the mom of a Jaime and I pronounced it the normal (Spanish) way: Hi-may. The mom corrected me, "Actually, it's Jamie." "Oh!" I said, "Is it misspelled on her chart here, J-a-i-m-e?" I guess I need to get a life, but it amused me for a few seconds. Especially since I have a Jamie of my own, and I spelled it right.

I'll agree with the pittee that the poster of the original thread pitting Racheal can't spell very well and has some problems with punctuation and proper grammar. But given Carol's history of thread-shitting, and given that it's pretty much all she ever does on this board, I will agree with the OP of this thread- Carol Stream is an asshole. I won't go so far as to call her a troll, but so far she walks like a duck.

[Bryan Ekers]

I come across misspelled names quite a bit- I think it's hilarious. It's like a walking advertisement to people for your whole life that your parents are/were stupid. I especially love Jaime for Jamie. The other day I had to call the mom of a Jaime and I pronounced it the normal (Spanish) way: Hi-may. The mom corrected me, "Actually, it's Jamie." "Oh!" I said, "Is it misspelled on her chart here, J-a-i-m-e?" I guess I need to get a life, but it amused me for a few seconds. Especially since I have a Jamie of my own, and I spelled it right.
Hey, be careful about that - you might get the hose again.

[Alice The Goon]

Hey, be careful about that - you might get the hose again.

What? I was genuinely concerned that a chart might have a misspelling of a name! Really! :p


You should just feel lucky that your parents didn't name you Brain. Or did they?

[pulykamell]

Do you really think the person in question is actually a "Racheal"? More likely, the OP just can't spell.

I don't care if the person in that OP is "Rachael," "Rachel," "Racheal," "Rachelle" or any of a million other variants. I was addressing your request for a citation for the name "Racheal" only.

[Abby_Emma_Sasha]

I don't care if the person in that OP is "Rachael," "Rachel," "Racheal," "Rachelle" or any of a million other variants. I was addressing your request for a citation for the name "Racheal" only.

<hijack> The actress Rachael Leigh Cook pronounces her name as one would say Rachel, but whenever I see it I can't help but pronounce it Ray- shall. Cute spellings bug me.</hijack>

Sincerely,
Abbye_Ehmmae_Sahshuh

[Mosier]

How is the video store going? Mom & Dad must be soooo proud.

How's the view from the high road?

By the way, you've been an insufferable asshole in every post so far between this thread and the one that spawned it. You're not even particularly clever about it, either.

[Bites When Provoked]

'Racheal' is a real name like 'Micheal' is a real name. In other words, it's not. Unless the parents are illiterate or, at the very least, dyslexic, of course.

Bottom line: you can't get an 'al' sound out of an 'eal'. Unless her name is pronounced 'Raych-eel', the name is not written in any way that makes sense.

Seriously, if we start defending nonsensical spellings on the basis of the 'parents must be right', we may as well just start naming children 'Throatwarbler Mangrove' and be done with it.

What's more likely? That 'Racheal' is a perfectly valid and sensible spelling that nonetheless defies any known rules of spelling vs vocalisation... or that the parents were idiots?

[Bill Door]

What? I was genuinely concerned that a chart might have a misspelling of a name! Really! :p


You should just feel lucky that your parents didn't name you Brain. Or did they?

I believe Bryan was making a joking reference to the fact that the villain in The Silence of the Lambs was named Jame Gumb, as his name had been mispelled on his birth certificate. Whenever I see Captain Stottlemeyer I always hear "It puts the lotion on its skin or else it gets the hose again."

[LurkMeister]

Whether the parents were idiots who can't spell is irrelevant to Carol Stream's assholish behavior. He/she got all huffy about how "Racheal can't possibly be a real name" and refused to back down from her stance that "nobody spells it that way" in the face of cites from several people that some people spell it that way.

And on the issue of strange name spellings, we've had any number of threads about them, and while the "parents are idiots or illiterate" reason for some names is not discounted, I don't remember anyone in any of those threads frothing at the mouth about how some name "couldn't possibly be a real name".

[Abby_Emma_Sasha]

I believe Bryan was making a joking reference to the fact that the villain in The Silence of the Lambs was named Jame Gumb, as his name had been mispelled on his birth certificate. Whenever I see Captain Stottlemeyer I always hear "It puts the lotion on its skin or else it gets the hose again."


Ahh, shame on me. I thought there was some backstory on Alice The Goon that I was not aware of. "The Hose" would have made more sense to me though, if the name had been spelled J-A-M-E.

Still, I wish I had gotten the reference.

I got post 666! Cool! I wanna keep this for a while. Don't anybody post anything I want to respond to.

[Southern Yankee]

This probably isn't the place for a serious question, but what constitutes a "real" name? Common usage? I always thought the spelling of a a name was up to the person doing the naming. Sure, it may look wrong, or peculiar, but are there really rules about it? I've seen many people use novel spelling in an attempt to stand out or be creative. They weren't all stupid.

[Abby_Emma_Sasha]

This probably isn't the place for a serious question, but what constitutes a "real" name? Common usage? I always thought the spelling of a a name was up to the person doing the naming. Sure, it may look wrong, or peculiar, but are there really rules about it? I've seen many people use novel spelling in an attempt to stand out or be creative. They weren't all stupid.

No, they are not all stupid or uneducated. Some people think they are being cool, or different, or just counter culture when naming their kids.

I know of people much more intelligent than I, who give their kids weird names and/or spellings. I think this is a bid that the sprogs will not be ordinary, but everybody is doing the creative spelling, so the extraaordinary may become rote.

Uncommon names are fine with me: Chloe, Tabitha, Justine, Desiree... those are all fine names. Spell them correctly and I have no problem.

[Merijeek]

How's the view from the high road?

By the way, you've been an insufferable asshole in every post so far between this thread and the one that spawned it. You're not even particularly clever about it, either.

But at least she doesn't work at a video store! She's doing a real woman's work and pumping out the next generation of Librul Hatrz!

-Joe

[Abby_Emma_Sasha]

Oh hello, I'm Abby. Just for shits and grins could Carol Stream tell me what he/she does for a living? I am just curious.

[brownie55]

'Racheal' is a real name like 'Micheal' is a real name. In other words, it's not. Unless the parents are illiterate or, at the very least, dyslexic, of course.

Bottom line: you can't get an 'al' sound out of an 'eal'. Unless her name is pronounced 'Raych-eel', the name is not written in any way that makes sense.

Seriously, if we start defending nonsensical spellings on the basis of the 'parents must be right', we may as well just start naming children 'Throatwarbler Mangrove' and be done with it.

What's more likely? That 'Racheal' is a perfectly valid and sensible spelling that nonetheless defies any known rules of spelling vs vocalisation... or that the parents were idiots?
What's your take on Brett Favre then?

[Merijeek]

Oh hello, I'm Abby. Just for shits and grins could Carol Stream tell me what he/she does for a living? I am just curious.

Seeing as how "it" only admitted "its" gender by accident, I doubt you'll get a profession.

And if you do, I'll bet it'll be as believable as "Pulitzer Prize-winning test pilot and kickboxing champion".

-Joe

[Diogenes the Cynic]

What's your take on Brett Favre then?
That's a mispronunciation, not a misspelling.

[Abby_Emma_Sasha]

What's your take on Brett Favre then?


Ooh Ooh can I play here? Brett Favre is a family member of some people I know from long time ago. Yes, in the dark ages of the early 1970s, in Pass Christian, Mississippi, I was a young student. I had no idea about football, I still have no idea about football. Hey, you want to know what I know about Brett Favre... His mom is nice. That is all.

[wring]

How is the video store going? Mom & Dad must be soooo proud.
How's the view from the high road?

By the way, you've been an insufferable asshole in every post so far between this thread and the one that spawned it. You're not even particularly clever about it, either.
Ok, I agree that Carol Stream is an ass, but I've suddenly noticed that lissener (who is not unacquainted w/assholeness himself) has been recently and strongly defended when folks post stuff about his occupation as an insult, as here. Where was all this concern when it was standard anti Guin posting about her lack of job or K-Mart job or her living w/her parents?

I agree it's an incredibly lame way to attack a poster, but I don't recall that similar attacks on Guin were at all derided.

[Vinyl Turnip]

Ok, I agree that Carol Stream is an ass, but I've suddenly noticed that lissener (who is not unacquainted w/assholeness himself) has been recently and strongly defended when folks post stuff about his occupation as an insult, as here. Where was all this concern when it was standard anti Guin posting about her lack of job or K-Mart job or her living w/her parents?
I agree. This nascent strain of gentility must be stopped immediately. Let's not unsay things we shall ought to have said, people.

[SmartAleq]

But at least she doesn't work at a video store! She's doing a real woman's work and pumping out the next generation of Librul Hatrz!

-Joe

Well, SHE might call it that, but where I come from we just call it pooping and it don't count.

I'm guessing very low level functionary in city government, works behind a counter where she arbitrarily says "no" to perfectly innocuous requests, just to be a total cunt, then regales anyone unfortunate enough to be trapped in the lunchroom with her with the endless tale of how she "really told that guy off." Can't be fired because she's been there donkey's years and the union would kick up a fuss but also can't transfer anywhere else because nobody would take that big of a twat on as an employee and everyone in town knows who she is. Pesters every new hire about stapling forms the "right way" and won't shut up, ever, because she's the only one in the office who knows how to do anything--according to her. Hates her job but can't get anything better in the private sector due to arrogance, assholish behavior at interviews and the inability to write more than two simple sentences in a row. Will probably die of an aneurysm brought on by her own bile, while screaming incoherently at a barista who got her morning coffee drink slightly wrong. Hasn't had sex since Reagan was in office and the husband has a room in the basement piled high with nudie mags and twenty different types of lotion--door is padlocked because the last time she got in there she threw out his entire collection of Playboys dating back to the sixties. He probably cleans his shotgun a lot but hasn't gotten up the balls to use it yet.

[Sleeps With Butterflies]

There was a thread recently where Carol was asked about her gender. She refused to answer. Shortly thereafter, and I don't remember whether it was in that thread or another, she referred to her husband.

So she's female.

Well, either that or she's a male in a same-sex marriage, but given her posting history, I highly doubt that.

She's a woman.

To be honest, it's just a quirk of mine. My husband likes to order "variations" of what's on restaurant menus. I generally remove myself to the Ladies to avoid it altogether. Does that make me a bad person?

From this post (http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=9030450&postcount=182 ) I remember because I hadn't been here long, and I was shocked at the foolishness she spouted. I remember thinking "Huh, there IS someone for everyone out there. Even hateful bitches."

[Merijeek]

I agree it's an incredibly lame way to attack a poster, but I don't recall that similar attacks on Guin were at all derided.

I think that lissener is a trumped-up farty little squirt with delusions of grandeur.

That being said, he's being attacked by someone who won't even fess up to their gender, much less the super awesome career that he/she/it surely enjoys. It's easy to say "Yer such a looser, working at a video store" when nobody knows you're actually a professional nothing.

-Joe

[Miller]

I agree it's an incredibly lame way to attack a poster, but I don't recall that similar attacks on Guin were at all derided.

My recollection is that those attacks were similarly received.

[Cluricaun]

I find the whole thing surreal because I work in Carol Stream Illinois, that's where I am right now.

[kaylasdad99]

Columbia House?

[Merijeek]

Columbia House?

He's already giving us reasons to hate him - are you trying to add more!?!?!

-Joe

[NinetyWt]

The other day I had to call the mom of a Jaime and I pronounced it the normal (Spanish) way: Hi-may. The mom corrected me, "Actually, it's Jamie." "Oh!" I said, "Is it misspelled on her chart here, J-a-i-m-e?" I guess I need to get a life, but it amused me for a few seconds. Are you saying that you purposefully belittled that woman?

On the subject of 'real' names: Who gives a shit how people spell their kids' names? Or what they name them? Name your kid what you want and go about your business. Jeebus.

[Cluricaun]

Columbia House?

Got a penny?

No, not Columbia House. ;)

[Squink]

Got a penny?
It's now 49 cents each for the first five, and they're DVD's, not records.

[elucidator]

You leave Carol Stream alone! (sob) She works so hard, she tries so hard (blubber), and you bastards just tear her down! (sob)....

[Hampshire]

Uncommon names are fine with me: Chloe, Tabitha, Justine, Desiree... those are all fine names. Spell them correctly and I have no problem.

But as Southern Yankee asked, is there really a "correct" was to spell a name or is it more of a "traditional" way to spell a name?

It may bug you to hell if kids are name Chloey, Tabeetha, Justyne, and Deziray but as long as they are on a birth certificate you can't really say they are incorrect.
You can just say they weren't spelled in the traditional way.

[pulykamell]

<hijack> The actress Rachael Leigh Cook pronounces her name as one would say Rachel, but whenever I see it I can't help but pronounce it Ray- shall. Cute spellings bug me.</hijack>


Huh. I thought "Rachael" was the more historical or "proper" spelling, but looking online, it looks like "Rachel" is much more common and has a longer pedigree, although the "Rachael" spelling does go back to the 1800s at least. I never thought of it as a "cute" spelling, but perhaps it is. Does anyone know how far back "Rachael" goes? Is the spelling just a corruption (influenced perhaps by "Michael") or was the "ae" phonologically correct at some point?

[Cluricaun]

It's now 49 cents each for the first five, and they're DVD's, not records.

That would make sense, being that the internet would have blown their entire business model to shreds.

[eleanorigby]

I find the whole thing surreal because I work in Carol Stream Illinois, that's where I am right now.


Well, look around you. Any disgruntled, pissy looking middle aged females about? And swirling vortexes of dark matter?
Look harder, man--she's bound to be there somewhere! Use your eyes, good sir!


Thought: maybe Carol Stream IS the Carol Stream (Jay's fruit of loins)--the daughter whose name is forever immortalized in strip malls, Orange Julius, and ranch houses. Oh, to be Carol now that the Coral Cove is open! It just doesn't get any better....

[Cluricaun]

Well, look around you. Any disgruntled, pissy looking middle aged females about?

Of course, I'm at work. :p

Here's the actual person Carol Stream (http://www.carolstream.org/images/Slide7a-Large.jpg) that I found doing a Google image search. That's one of the stranger captions to a picture that I've seen in a while.

[Zebra]

The one and only google ad reads


Pig Roast
Roast or Smoke a whole pig Portable and easy to clean.

[Hilarity N. Suze]

"Racheal" is a variant spelling, kind of like "Shelia." I have seen both of these spellings, but in every case I know about they have been wrongfully applied to people whose actual names were "Rachael" and "Sheila."

However, since the spellings are out there, some person will apply them to some poor innocent offspring, so they will go through life advertising to people who know better that their parents were poor spellers, if not outright stupid. (I say this because I know people who are very bad spellers, but they know it, and not being stupid they bothered to make sure their children's names at least looked like names.)

But "Jaime" pronounced "Jamie"? That's more a cutesy spelling, like "Jacque" for "Jackie." Irritating but not indicative of stupidity.

I did have to laugh at the idea of lissener's candidate for biggest asshole. I thought lissener himself was firmly esconced in that position, and apparently is intent on maintaining that top spot.

[Yeticus Rex]

I've always seen it spelled Carole. Carol is certainly spelled incorrectly. I've traveled the whole internets, and have never seen it spelled Carol. Something doesn't add up here. :dubious:

[Santo Rugger]

The one and only google ad reads


Pig Roast
Roast or Smoke a whole pig Portable and easy to clean.
Close.
pig roast

A sexual encounter in which a woman is put on her hands and knees and penetrated from both ends, generally resembling a pig being roasted on a spit.

[muttrox]

I can't believe I'm going to defend her, but I don't think Carol was particuarly out of line in tht thread. The OP was a mess -- a grammatical and stylistic eyesore which was difficult to read. Carol was a little unsympathetic, maybe, and not exactly on topic, but she wasn't wrong, in my opinion.

True, but she's not being pitted for being wrong, she's being pitted for being an asshole.

[Merijeek]

True, but she's not being pitted for being wrong, she's being pitted for being an asshole.

Hah! I'm sure we all know she's really being pitted because this place is a veritable hotbed of pinko terrorist liberal groupthink, and she's just a loyal Conservative Guardian of America.

-Joe

[BrainGlutton]

http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=478939

Starting post#8 and continuing. Unabated. Seriously, WTF? I'm all for sinking to pitful behavior in the pit when someone deserves it, but this looks more like a random attempt to start a pileon on an innocent bystander. Fortunately, Carol Stream remains the biggest asshole in the thread; no one is taking her bait. Still, is the "don't be a jerk" rule completely suspended in the pit? or are there standards of jerkishness even here?

Come, now. Isn't Shodan a bigger asshole? Carol is a creature of such negligible mind that she hardly seems to merit serious consideration for that or any other distinction. Same with Clothahump.

[What Exit?]

Come, now. Isn't Shodan a bigger asshole? Carol is a creature of such negligible mind that she hardly seems to merit serious consideration for that or any other distinction. Same with Clothahump.
Nope, Carol is bitter and fairly nasty. Shodan and Clothahump just have some unpopular (on this board) views. They are not by nature of posting in the same league as Carol who seems to be little better than a troll most of time.

You should not conflate opposing world view with the nastiness that Carol brings to this board.

[tds1273]

I believe she looks like the love child of Ann Coulter and Katherine Harris.

Even if it was proven that 'she' was in fact a 'he', I don't think I could ever move beyond my mental image of her as simply: Nancy Grace with a keyboard, which I think might actually be the same thing as the unholy hell spawn you described.

[Guinastasia]

Ok, I agree that Carol Stream is an ass, but I've suddenly noticed that lissener (who is not unacquainted w/assholeness himself) has been recently and strongly defended when folks post stuff about his occupation as an insult, as here. Where was all this concern when it was standard anti Guin posting about her lack of job or K-Mart job or her living w/her parents?

I agree it's an incredibly lame way to attack a poster, but I don't recall that similar attacks on Guin were at all derided.

Funny you should mention that. I generally find lissener rather pretentious and insufferable at times (and I know he feels generally the same about me). But recently, when those very same comments you mentioned above, wring, where thrown my way (in a thread that had nothing to do with said issues), he pretty much said the same thing you did.

It's a standard technique around here when someone doesn't have a good argument-throw the same old, tired shit around, that usually sounds like a playground, "Yeah, well you're stupid!" NOT just about me or lissener, but anyone here.

-Guin, the virgin who works part-time at a local museum and lives at home with her parents, at age 30. :D

(As for Carol Stream, well, her posts are her cite.)

[Algher]

Just gotta toss this in:

Popularity of the female name Racheal Year of birth Rank
1997 990
1996 836
1995 764
1994 719
1993 672
1992 666
1991 652
1990 637

http://www.ssa.gov/cgi-bin/babyname.cgi

You know, in the whole ignorance fighting thing and all that.

[Alice The Goon]

Are you saying that you purposefully belittled that woman?

On the subject of 'real' names: Who gives a shit how people spell their kids' names? Or what they name them? Name your kid what you want and go about your business. Jeebus.


I didn't belittle her- I merely asked her if we had a misspelling. I live in a city where half the citizens are Hispanic, and Jaime is the Hispanic version of James. It's not an actual variation of Jamie.

I'll be looking for you in the threads regarding stupid names people give their kids, defending them, then. See you there!

[Revenant Threshold]

Nope, Carol is bitter and fairly nasty. Shodan and Clothahump just have some unpopular (on this board) views. They are not by nature of posting in the same league as Carol who seems to be little better than a troll most of time.

You should not conflate opposing world view with the nastiness that Carol brings to this board. I'd agree with you on Shodan, but not Clothahump. Shodan's views may be unpopular, but he's willing to explain them, and mock people amusingly while doing so, as well as not being an idiot. Clothahump's as bad as Carol Stream, though he forgoes the nastiness for drivebys.

[Guinastasia]

Shodan also isn't really a dick in non-political threads. I've never seen Carol Stream NOT act like a cunt muffin.

[eleanorigby]

I just have to say that I would pronounce Racheal as "Ray/cheel" and not "Ray/chell".

It looks wrong and sounds more wrong. Ugh.



Carole is a variation of Carol or vice versa, btw.

[What Exit?]

I'd agree with you on Shodan, but not Clothahump. Shodan's views may be unpopular, but he's willing to explain them, and mock people amusingly while doing so, as well as not being an idiot. Clothahump's as bad as Carol Stream, though he forgoes the nastiness for drivebys.
Look for Clothahump's posts in the forums like Cafe, MPSIMS and IMHO, not only is he not a near troll like Carol, he is even (IMHO) a nice guy who happens to be pretty far to the right of me. I have seen no signs that Carol is not nasty 90% or the time or better. I don't recall Clothahump ever derailing a thread like Carol has done plenty of times (thus my trolling accusation). I do recall him make a few posts, especially in the pit that I 100% disagreed with, but I could actually say the same thing about our socialist friend BrainGlutton who I first replied to.

[Green Bean]

She's a woman.

From this post (http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=9030450&postcount=182 ) I remember because I hadn't been here long, and I was shocked at the foolishness she spouted. I remember thinking "Huh, there IS someone for everyone out there. Even hateful bitches."Ah, thank you. My search-fu was weak that day.

And anybody looking for more evidence that Carol Stream is just a nasty nasty person should take a look at that thread. Sheesh!

p.s. In that thread, she also elicited some uncharacteristic snark from Polycarp:Well, this explains some of the arguments you've had with people in the past. You cannot read plain English prose. I do feel sorry for you. There are good remedial courses for correcting this deficiency.
Hee!

[Revenant Threshold]

Look for Clothahump's posts in the forums like Cafe, MPSIMS and IMHO, not only is he not a near troll like Carol, he is even (IMHO) a nice guy who happens to be pretty far to the right of me. I have seen no signs that Carol is not nasty 90% or the time or better. I don't recall Clothahump ever derailing a thread like Carol has done plenty of times (thus my trolling accusation). I do recall him make a few posts, especially in the pit that I 100% disagreed with, but I could actually say the same thing about our socialist friend BrainGlutton who I first replied to. Clothahump does have normal moments - he's interesting whenever martial arts come up, for instance (I think that's him?). But put him in a thread with politics or religion and it'll be a one sentence "This is stupid, anyone who disagrees with me is stupid". Even Carol has points to make, though they may be done assholishly.

[What Exit?]

Clothahump does have normal moments - he's interesting whenever martial arts come up, for instance (I think that's him?). But put him in a thread with politics or religion and it'll be a one sentence "This is stupid, anyone who disagrees with me is stupid". Even Carol has points to make, though they may be done assholishly.
I have noted that his opinions on movies are usually sound. Not dumbed down and not too intellectual. His comments on books have been useful and as you mentioned he is indeed good at providing facts about martial arts.

His politics are not mine and I sit somewhat to the right on the dope, though I think I have drifted to the left for the US. On religion, I tend to agree with him, but I am not adamant about or as vociferous, so those don't bother me much. In fact I always find it humorous that his fairly right wing political beliefs puts him in more often than not with the Theocrats that he despises so much.

[The King of Soup]

It's all a matter of luck. Mostly, I've encountered Clothahump being funny and smart and generous with his time and knowledge, and mostly I've encountered -- let us just say, another poster -- as a self-centered moron who dispenses old, tired insults before disappearing through the same trap door he first used seven years ago. The latter always runs and hides, so let him.

Carol Stream is a different story altogether. I still don't believe the username belongs to a woman, because I've never met a female under the age of a hundred and fifty-nine that harbors the vile attitudes s/he espouses, but that's the problem with this kind of judgment -- the only way to be normal is to go along with all kinds of foolishness, and who's to say that the pressures on Carol Stream are any worse than those on any high-school freshman? It's enough to know that there's no hint of strength of character there: that there will never be an opinion divergent from the bigoted substream that thinks school integration is still a controversial issue.

[NinetyWt]

I didn't belittle her- I merely asked her if we had a misspelling. I live in a city where half the citizens are Hispanic, and Jaime is the Hispanic version of James. It's not an actual variation of Jamie.

I'll be looking for you in the threads regarding stupid names people give their kids, defending them, then. See you there!

Yes, I knew that Jaime is a Hispanic name. A fellow student I worked with at Uni was a Venezuelan named Jaime.

I've already been in those threads, with a point of view of "who gives a shit". Here's three posts, from a couple of 'names' threads in the last six months:

1 (http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=9779286&postcount=22)
2 (http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=9782458&postcount=68)
3 (http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=9920208&postcount=20)

I don't think I have a problem with your judging the name to be spelled in a stupid manner; you're entitled to your opinion. I *do* get irritated at folks spreading unpleasantness unnecessarily. I'm still not sure whether you were making fun of the woman or not. I guess it doesn't matter anyway.

[Sam Stone]

I'm just surprised that Carol Stream has never encountered the spelling "Racheal" before.

Even more surprising is Carol Stream's notion that a spell checker can somehow tell you how a person's proper name should be spelled.

[billfish678]

Shodan also isn't really a dick in non-political threads. I've never seen Carol Stream NOT act like a cunt muffin.


Do they sell those at Starbucks? They sound rather uncommon and expensive.

Blll

[hawthorne]

Things can be rare, yet common and cheap, billfish678.

[Cat Whisperer]

I just have to say that I would pronounce Racheal as "Ray/cheel" and not "Ray/chell".

It looks wrong and sounds more wrong. Ugh.<snip>
That's my problem with so-called unusual spellings of names - don't expect the rest of the world to change the English language for your "creative" naming. Not to mention that it would also be valid to pronounce Racheal as Ray-Keel (with the CH making a K, as in trachea). Or even Ray-Kee-All. Or Rah-kee-all. No, I'm no fan of names that try to force a pronunciation.

[Alice The Goon]

Do they sell those at Starbucks? They sound rather uncommon and expensive.

Blll



They taste like risotto.

[WhyNot]

That's my problem with so-called unusual spellings of names - don't expect the rest of the world to change the English language for your "creative" naming. Not to mention that it would also be valid to pronounce Racheal as Ray-Keel (with the CH making a K, as in trachea). Or even Ray-Kee-All. Or Rah-kee-all. No, I'm no fan of names that try to force a pronunciation.
My daughter's name is a Celtic spelling (I'm so, so sorry!) and it's all her father's fault - he was teaching a course in Irish history and enamored of all things Celtic at the time.

Still, it doesn't actually break the laws of English like Racheal does. It just has to be pointed out to people: "Caileigh. C-A-I-L-E-I-G-H....Look, how do you spell "Gail"? And how do you spell "Leigh"? Knock off the G, stick a C on the front and you're good to go."

But I really don't blame people who get it wrong. It is unusual, and I knew that when I filled out the birth certificate form. I suppose Kaylee would be easier for the nurses at the pediatrician's office, but I just think it looks...cheap.

[Vinyl Turnip]

They taste like risotto.
In comedy, this is what we refer to as a "callback"!

[eleanorigby]

Kaylee does look cheap--perhaps too phonetical. Or maybe it reminds me of Kaybee toys. My first thought is that Caileigh is pronounced "Calley" (Cal/lee), but other than that, there's no big issue there, IMO.


I could more easily read Racheal as Rak-ee-al than Rachel. Poor kid.

One of my sister's names was Leigh. She not only got called "lay" a lot, she also got a notice that she had to register for the draft! :eek:

And just for the record, my name is Eleanor. No one spells it right. Few pronounce it correctly (3 syllables, there's an OR at the end, not and ER), so I know something of the pain of uncommon names. At least my parents didn't get jiggy with it and do Ellynore or Aelinor etc. Elenore is the French version, IMS.

[billfish678]

They taste like risotto.


They do?

The whole thing?

Or just the tops or the stumps?

If its just the stumps we may need to reconsider the plan to give the homeless the stumps....of course I am not a big fan of pasta, so skin off my back either way :)

Blll

[WhyNot]

Kaylee does look cheap--perhaps too phonetical. Or maybe it reminds me of Kaybee toys. My first thought is that Caileigh is pronounced "Calley" (Cal/lee), but other than that, there's no big issue there, IMO.
When it's printed, "Calley" is the most common pronunciation I hear. I think the "i" looks too much like an "l" in most fonts, so people think it's Calleigh.

[DianaG]

When it's printed, "Calley" is the most common pronunciation I hear. I think the "i" looks too much like an "l" in most fonts, so people think it's Calleigh.
Left to my own devices, I'd have pronounced it "Kylee". Pretty name, either way.

[Jackmannii]

I can live with "Racheal".

There should however be some form of punishment for naming your kid "Chasity". Maybe the stocks.

I would feel bad for the paragraph and spelling-challenged person who started the other thread, but my sympathy drained out when she used the phrase "ya no".

Ya no?

[Cluricaun]

Kaylee does look cheap--perhaps too phonetical.

You leave my Kaylee (http://www.imdb.com/character/ch0003812/) alone! ;)

[WhyNot]

You leave my Kaylee (http://www.imdb.com/character/ch0003812/) alone! ;)
That's actually where we got the name, but not the spelling. :D In Lord Joss's defense, "Kaylee" is only a nickname, and I think Kaywinnet Lee is a shiny name! But I couldn't go that odd for my kid.


Hey, wasn't there a Pit thread around here somewhere?

[eleanorigby]

You leave my Kaylee (http://www.imdb.com/character/ch0003812/) alone! ;)


Thank god she's fictitious.

I know a Kayleigh. Poor thing.


the "ya no" shook me badly, too.

I think so, WhyNot, but this is more interesting and fun than just kvetching about posters who are just special. ;)

[Yeticus Rex]

This thread makes me want to go on an erotic journey from Milan to Minsk.

[Ensign Edison]

Huh. I thought "Rachael" was the more historical or "proper" spelling, but looking online, it looks like "Rachel" is much more common and has a longer pedigree, although the "Rachael" spelling does go back to the 1800s at least. I never thought of it as a "cute" spelling, but perhaps it is. Does anyone know how far back "Rachael" goes? Is the spelling just a corruption (influenced perhaps by "Michael") or was the "ae" phonologically correct at some point?

All I have to offer in this thread, aside from my general glee whenever Carol Stream is skewered, is that Alexander Hamilton's mother's name was Rachael Levine. He was born in 1757, not sure about her.

[Zoe]

I seem to remember from a semantics course that proper names may be pronounced and spelled as the possessor of the name chooses. I've mentioned before knowing a Bishop whose last name was spelled "Vander Horst." It was pronounded as if it were "Van Draws." His brother pronouned it just the way it looks. Both of them were correct.

You may also change the spelling of your name and be correct. It doesn't depend on whether or not it has been spelled that way previously. (You don't have to consider the superiority of someone else's opinion.)

It is considered incorrect if someone pronounces or spells your name in any way other than the way that you have chosen.

I just noticed a headline that says that the Swedes have relaxed the laws on giving children unusual names such as "Budweiser." People want to name their babies after fast foods. Remind me to have little Chili Pepper baptized.

[Sampiro]

All I have to offer in this thread, aside from my general glee whenever Carol Stream is skewered, is that Alexander Hamilton's mother's name was Rachael Levine. He was born in 1757, not sure about her.

No, she wasn't born in 1757 but in fact several years earlier.

I seem to remember from a semantics course that proper names may be pronounced and spelled as the possessor of the name chooses. I've mentioned before knowing a Bishop whose last name was spelled "Vander Horst." It was pronounded as if it were "Van Draws." His brother pronouned it just the way it looks. Both of them were correct.

That's correct- the person or place it applies to calls its pronunciation. Common examples:

Beauchamp (family name)- pronounced beech-ham
Strahan- pronounced "strawn"

I lived in Lafayette, Alabama when I was a kid- it's pronounced lah-FAIT. It's not too far from the Piedmont [PEED-mont] but thousands from Piedmont [pee-AID-moan].

Georgia place names:

Cairo (pn. KAY-ro)
Buena Vista (rhymes with tuna mister)
Schley- (sly)
Perry- parry
Albany- all-BENNY

[crowmanyclouds]

They taste like risotto.... I am not a big fan of pasta, ...Pasta :confused:.

Anywho, I hear one week out of every month Starbucks has raspberry jelly filled cunt muffins and occasionally cream filled ones ... if they get lucky.

CMC +fnord!

[What Exit?]

I seem to remember from a semantics course that proper names may be pronounced and spelled as the possessor of the name chooses. I've mentioned before knowing a Bishop whose last name was spelled "Vander Horst." It was pronounded as if it were "Van Draws." His brother pronouned it just the way it looks. Both of them were correct.

You may also change the spelling of your name and be correct. It doesn't depend on whether or not it has been spelled that way previously. (You don't have to consider the superiority of someone else's opinion.)

As someone whose last name does not look like the way we pronounce it to 99% of Americans and as someone that purposely gave my daughter an very uncommon spelling of an already uncommon name, I agree with you 100%.

My last name appears to have three general pronunciations. The purely Italian way with the rolling R, the slightly Americanize way losing the rolling R and the more Anglicized version which still treats a final i like a long e.

My daughter's name is extremely rare. I think I checked the census and found only 6 listed. I am sure a pedantic person would hate that we chose it.

[descamisado]

Does anybody remember the Reader's Digest bit about girl who was given the mainstream name of "Yvonne" but as she got older, in order to stand out, she changed the pronunciation to "Why-Von-Knee"?

[pulykamell]

Pasta :confused:.


Ya know, it seems obvious that risotto is rice, not pasta, (given the name) but apparently it's a common enough confusion. (http://www.wisegeek.com/is-risotto-rice-or-pasta.htm) Maybe familiarity with orzo (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Orzo) is part of the reason.

[Monstera deliciosa]

Does anybody remember the Reader's Digest bit about girl who was given the mainstream name of "Yvonne" but as she got older, in order to stand out, she changed the pronunciation to "Why-Von-Knee"?


Thankfully, I've never heard of that. However, what really irks me is the number people who don't seem to know that an initial "y" can have a long "ee" sound and so pronounce the name Yuh-von. I'm not talking about women with the name who might pronounce it that way (I have never come across this, but if they exist, it is their prerogative to pronounce it as they wish) but outsiders who do so. Ugh!

[Bryan Ekers]

Huh. From Algher's link, I see that as of 2006, "Bryan" has eclipsed "Brian".




In your FACE, I-boys!

[Ensign Edison]

No, she wasn't born in 1757 but in fact several years earlier.

I said he was, not his mother, but I assume you typoed and refer to the small controversy over the matter of whether Hamilton was born in 55 or 57. I believe it was 1757 for reasons that would be an even bigger derail, but I'm fairly confident no real consensus has ever been reached.

[jali]

No, she wasn't born in 1757 but in fact several years earlier.



That's correct- the person or place it applies to calls its pronunciation. Common examples:

Beauchamp (family name)- pronounced beech-ham
Strahan- pronounced "strawn"

I lived in Lafayette, Alabama when I was a kid- it's pronounced lah-FAIT. It's not too far from the Piedmont [PEED-mont] but thousands from Piedmont [pee-AID-moan].

Georgia place names:

Cairo (pn. KAY-ro)
Buena Vista (rhymes with tuna mister)
Schley- (sly)
Perry- parry
Albany- all-BENNY


Another Georgian pronunciation: Villa Rick - ah (Villa Rica)

[Inner Stickler]

I said he was, not his mother, but I assume you typoed and refer to the small controversy over the matter of whether Hamilton was born in 55 or 57. I believe it was 1757 for reasons that would be an even bigger derail, but I'm fairly confident no real consensus has ever been reached.I thought Sampiro was just riffing on the fact that your sentence kind of reads like Alexander Hamilton and his mother may have both been born in the same year.

[Sarahfeena]

Another Georgian pronunciation: Villa Rick - ah (Villa Rica) Illinois has some great regional pronunciations, caused by pioneer types who didn't know how to pronounce French names. A friend from out of state laughed at our pronunciation of the town of Des Plaines, for example (esses are not silent...it's pronounced exactly how it looks). Don't know why that's more laughable than the standard pronunciation of Detroit, but apparently it is!

My personal favorite is a town south of the city called Bourbonnais. Locals have always pronounced it Burr-BONE-iss, although news anchors always seem to use the French pronunciation.

[Daithi Lacha]

Perry- parry

This probably stems from one of the vowels shifts in the English language that has the Britons saying "clark" for "clerk" and "darby" for "derby." Now, is it pronounced with the nasalized "a" like a "parry" in fencing? Or is it closer to "porry?"

[jjimm]

It's a suburb named after the daughter of a crook, so I still presume female.Daughter of a brook, surely?

[Ensign Edison]

I thought Sampiro was just riffing on the fact that your sentence kind of reads like Alexander Hamilton and his mother may have both been born in the same year.

Then I should win an award for incredibly nerdish message-board-related myopia in this whoosh.

[Inner Stickler]

Then I should win an award for incredibly nerdish message-board-related myopia in this whoosh.Well, at any rate, I now desire to learn more of this controversy about the birth year of Hamilton.

[Merijeek]

Kaylee does look cheap--perhaps too phonetical.

Ahem.

-Joe

[Sampiro]

Well, at any rate, I now desire to learn more of this controversy about the birth year of Hamilton.

Short version, his d.o.b. was always recorded as January 11 but the year was sometimes listed as 1755 and sometimes as 1757, and he was equally evasive about his exact age. One theory is that he was born in 1755 but that when he attended school in America as a teenager he was embarassed by being older than his classmates and so he dropped two years, while another is that he was born in 1757 but tacked on two years to see more mature when he was on Washington's staff. No way to know for certain. His tomb inscription (http://www.findagrave.com/cgi-bin/fg.cgi?page=gr&GRid=437) does not give a birthdate but states he was 47 at his death in 1804 (making him the same age as his wife).

There's also some question of his paternity. His account was that his father was James Hamilton, a merchant with business interests in the Lesser Antilles (where Alex was born) and a younger son of a Scottish nobleman (Alexander Hamilton, Laird Ayrshire), but there's some dispute about this. One account I read stated that his father (who never married Hamilton's mother) probably was a merchant named James Hamilton but that he was not from a noble family- just a Scot named James Hamilton (and Alexander being a very common name in Scotland it's coincidence Hamilton shared a given name with Lord Hamilton). Whoever he was, he was a deadbeat dad who left when his son was a child and he went to live with his maternal uncle in St. Croix.

The social climbing Hamilton, extremely sensitive about his illegitimacy, wanted to ennoblize it a bit and found the Ayrshire Hamiltons in a British peerage book. He rarely spoke of his childhood after marrying into the rich and aristocratic (by American standards) Schuyler family. He did financially support his father (who turned up in America when Hamilton was an adult) in his last years.

[Cat Whisperer]

I seem to remember from a semantics course that proper names may be pronounced and spelled as the possessor of the name chooses. I've mentioned before knowing a Bishop whose last name was spelled "Vander Horst." It was pronounded as if it were "Van Draws." His brother pronouned it just the way it looks. Both of them were correct.

You may also change the spelling of your name and be correct. It doesn't depend on whether or not it has been spelled that way previously. (You don't have to consider the superiority of someone else's opinion.)

It is considered incorrect if someone pronounces or spells your name in any way other than the way that you have chosen.<snip>
I do pronounce names the way the possessor wants it, but that doesn't mean that I don't think they're kinda silly to force English speaking people to pronounce English letters in ways that we don't normally pronounce them. I'll give people more of a pass for last names than first names, too, since last names have possibly been around a long time, and first names are usually chosen to be different.

Sampiro, I'm having a real problem trying to pronounce Bourbonnais as anything but Bor'-bon-ay. I may not speak French, but a lot of their pronunciations stick in the Anglophone population of Canada.

[WhyNot]

My personal favorite is a town south of the city called Bourbonnais. Locals have always pronounced it Burr-BONE-iss, although news anchors always seem to use the French pronunciation.
Are you pulling our legs, 'Feena? I've never heard it like that, or even, actually, just Bourbonnais. It's always "Bradley Bur-bow-nay" for Bradley/Bourbonnais. But, I admit, I've only known students and other transients through there, not locals.

[eleanorigby]

My personal favorite is a town south of the city called Bourbonnais. Locals have always pronounced it Burr-BONE-iss, although news anchors always seem to use the French pronunciation.


They must be local locals, because here in the very southern tip of Cook County, we pronounce it "bur/bin/nay".

Daughter of a brook, surely?

Wins the thread.

[Vinyl Turnip]

Huh. From Algher's link, I see that as of 2006, "Bryan" has eclipsed "Brian".




In your FACE, I-boys!
"And sometimes Y," grumbled I bitterly to the other vowels. "We should only be so lucky."

[Ensign Edison]

Damn you, Sampiro! No one is ever going to ask that question in my presence ever again! You took my one chance.

[samclem]

I'm originally from Virginia. If you encounter the (last)name Taliaferro(a very old 17th century name there), how would you pronounce the name of the owner? Give up?

TOL-ih-ver.

Of course, you could always accuse the owner of the name of not knowing how to spell/pronounce his/her name. Or, you could slam his ancestors of being ignorant peasants, not up on spelling. Or, you could just say you learned a new thing and walk away enlightened.

[Frank]

Of course, you could always accuse the owner of the name of not knowing how to spell/pronounce his/her name. Or, you could slam his ancestors of being ignorant peasants, not up on spelling. Or, you could just say you learned a new thing and walk away enlightened.
Or you could say that Robert Heinlein already did a riff on Tallifero.

[Sarahfeena]

WhyNot and Eleanor, the people I have heard saying it that way are older farm folk in that general area (my mother is from farm country down there). Being from the NW burbs myself, I don't think I've heard it actually said by anyone else other than the newspeople I mentioned before. Seeing as how you are both from the south side and have probably heard a lot more people saying it than I have, I'm going to assume that what I've heard was an aberration (or a joke?)

[E-Sabbath]

Don't forget the ever popular Featherstonehaw.

British, pronounced 'Fanshaw'

[wring]

in my screen name, the "w" is silent.

[Squink]

in my screen name, the "w" is silent.So it's pronounced 'Topo Gigio', then?

[pulykamell]

Don't forget the ever popular Featherstonehaw.

It's usually "Featherstonehaugh," but same difference.

[SisterCoyote]

So it's pronounced 'Topo Gigio', then?

No, we've been over this. It's "Throatwarbler Mangrove," but with a silent "w". Sheesh.

I used to live on a street called "Erbes." This was in Southern California, so you'd expect it to be pronounced in the Spanish fashion: "Air-bes."

No. It was pronounced just like it's spelled. Like "herbs" but without the h.

"Bumblefuck," in other words.

[E-Sabbath]

Thank you, pulykamell. I meant that, but typed incorrectly.

[Malacandra]

It's usually "Featherstonehaugh," but same difference.
Whereas ISTR from a reputable source (Guinness Book of Records, 1971 edition) that "Fetherstonehaugh" is pronounced "Freestonehuw" - that "a" makes a world of difference.

[Sophistry and Illusion]

I'm originally from Virginia. If you encounter the (last)name Taliaferro(a very old 17th century name there), how would you pronounce the name of the owner? Give up?

TOL-ih-ver.

Of course, you could always accuse the owner of the name of not knowing how to spell/pronounce his/her name. Or, you could slam his ancestors of being ignorant peasants, not up on spelling. Or, you could just say you learned a new thing and walk away enlightened.
Hey, my wife grew up in southwestern Virginia, and was good friends with some Taliaferros, including the one the Salem Civic Center is named after.

Also, if you visit Virginia, you will be able to find such lovely locations as Buena Vista (pronounced Byoona Vissta) and Buchanan (pronounced Buck-annan).

[neutron star]

I lived in Lafayette, Alabama when I was a kid- it's pronounced lah-FAIT. And in Louisiana, it's LAFFY-ette.

[wring]

No, we've been over this. It's "Throatwarbler Mangrove," but with a silent "w". Sheesh.


Unless, of course, you live in England, in which case the "b" is silent. And it's a soft g.

I live in MI, where we have a city named Charlotte. Pronounced Shar- lot (accent on the lot).

[Cat Whisperer]

My username is British - I pronounce it Ffffff. Betchall didn't know that. :D

[NinetyWt]

And in Louisiana, it's LAFFY-ette.

And in Lafayette County, Miss., its' "luh-FET". Reminds me of Bobba Fett for some reason. :p

[LifeOnWry]

I remember a thread in which the OP said yes, her name was spelled Caroline, but pronounced Carolyn and she'd appreciate it if, once people were told that, they would remember it. Several posters insisted that she was simply spelling her name WRONG and how dare she insist on pronouncing it that way when everyone knows that "I-N-E" is ALWAYS ALWAYS ALWAYS pronounced with a long "I" sound. Sure, SHE may pronounce her own name that way, but that was her affectation and it was ridiculous of her to expect other people to go along with her. I believe someone even said something about the LAWS of ENGLISH.

Then I said my daughter's name is Katherine, and so far no one has ever pronounced it with a long "I" sound.

I'm no fan of creative spellings (despite my own name*) but I'm pretty sure you're allowed to spell your name any goddamn way you want.





(*My name is not spelled the standard way, but it's only half of my full first name.)

[pseudotriton ruber ruber]

I said my daughter's name is Katherine, and so far no one has ever pronounced it with a long "I" sound.

I work with someone named "Katherine" who pronounces it "KatherEEEEEn."

Makes me scrEEEEEEEm.

[Zoe]

Sarahfeena: Illinois has some great regional pronunciations, caused by pioneer types who didn't know how to pronounce French names.

I've been trying to think of an area that was settled by non-pioneer types.

[Sophistry and Illusion]

I've been trying to think of an area that was settled by non-pioneer types.
Do penal colonies count?

[Carson O'Genic]

Penises always pioneer, such eager flag planters.

[Bites When Provoked]

What's your take on Brett Favre then?Honestly, I've never heard of him (or is it her?) but the name's spelled correctly at least.

[Bites When Provoked]

"Racheal" is a variant spelling, kind of like "Shelia." I have seen both of these spellings, but in every case I know about they have been wrongfully applied to people whose actual names were "Rachael" and "Sheila.".If it was just a variant spelling (Rachel/Raichel or Sheela/Sheala) it wouldn't be so bad (well, okay, 'Sheala' is bloody 'orrible), but misspellings like 'Racheal' and 'Shelia' just can't be read in any (sensible) way to align with the pronunciation they're being given.

I'm perfectly okay with someone telling me that 'Aisling' is pronounced 'Ashlyn' because it's Celtic, for example. But to my knowledge there's no language in which Racheal is pronounced 'Ray-chell', nor one in which 'Shell-ee-ah' (or is it 'Shell-eye-ah'?) becomes 'Shee-la'.

If it turns out I'm wrong, and somewhere in the world you actually get 'Shee-la' out of 'Shelia', then I'll immediately build a bridge and get over this little pet hate.

My best friend's brother has a daughter named 'Sarai'. I'm assured it's pronounced 'Sarah'. To me, it just looks like they ran out of room on the birth certificate and only got the first stroke of the ending letter. :D

[Sarahfeena]

I've been trying to think of an area that was settled by non-pioneer types. Aw, Zoe, it's so sweet of you to try to help me with the lack of precision in my writing. I'll try harder, but I'm afraid I might be a hopeless case. :(

[eleanorigby]

Aw, Zoe, it's so sweet of you to try to help me with the lack of precision in my writing. I'll try harder, but I'm afraid I might be a hopeless case. :(


No, you're not. The Pilgrims were not pioneers. Mostly they were completely clueless and lost. If the Indians hadn't helped them, they'd have been dead in a year, IMO.

And Australia was not first colonized by pioneers, but by "hardened" convicts who were also clueless as to botany, most hunting skills and other survival needs.

What were we talking about again? Oh, pitting CS. Carry on!

[zagloba]

My best friend's brother has a daughter named 'Sarai'. I'm assured it's pronounced 'Sarah'. To me, it just looks like they ran out of room on the birth certificate and only got the first stroke of the ending letter. :DSarai was the name of Abram's wife before God changed their names to Abraham and Sarah.

[Polycarp]

The ex-wife of one of my boys has two daughters (one his, her older sister the product of a romance before they married). Their names are Katelynn and Jazzmine. And yes, she knows how to spell the standard names of like/similar pronunciation; she wanted unique names for her girls.

Our church's secretary is a Shelia, spelled that way. We formerly knew a DeWayne, a nice guy who was forever correcting the over-officious "correction" of his given name to Duane or Dwayne.

Carol Stream has seemed to me someone who was invincibly convinced of the absolute rightness of her own opinions, and the terrible error of anyone who dared disagree -- and belligerent in stating them, to boot. I may be misreading her, but she's shown little if any willingness to convince others to agree with her by sweet reason -- she said it, so by the Almighty it must be so!

[dropzone]

I'm going to assume that what I've heard was an aberration (or a joke?)I'm from the West and Northwest burbs so the first time I heard of that town was when Little Tommy and Your Ol' Uncle Lar told us about Contented Linda Grace of Bourbonnais and they pronounced it "bur-bun-nay." You're not telling me that Larry Lujack was lying to us, are you?

(shrugging) Pronounciations change. When "Dragnet" was still on the radio Los Angeles was still pronounced with a hard G.

ETA: No, Contented Linda Grace was not going to be alright.

[Sarahfeena]

I'm from the West and Northwest burbs so the first time I heard of that town was when Little Tommy and Your Ol' Uncle Lar told us about Contented Linda Grace of Bourbonnais and they pronounced it "bur-bun-nay." You're not telling me that Larry Lujack was lying to us, are you? Uncle Lar would NEVER lie to us! Not even about intermingling of the species!

But what does he know? He's not from here, and when he did live here, he lived in Palatine, which is where I'm from. A long way from Burr-bone-iss! :)

As I said to WhyNot and Eleanorigby, it seems that, at least in the Chicago area, bur-bun-nay is the standard pronunciation. I have heard it pronounced the other way, but I can't prove it, so what can I say?

[dropzone]

Oh yeah? Spent much of my youth in Arlington Heights, but the DJs around me were a bit downmarket from Lujack.

[Sarahfeena]

Oh yeah? Spent much of my youth in Arlington Heights, but the DJs around me were a bit downmarket from Lujack. Great town...my dad grew up there (proud grad of the long-closed Arlington HS), and we lived there until I was 7.

(To everyone else...fascinating, I know. :) )

[kaylasdad99]

Carol Stream has seemed to me someone who was invincibly convinced of the absolute rightness of her own opinions, and the terrible error of anyone who dared disagree -- and belligerent in stating them, to boot. I may be misreading her, but she's shown little if any willingness to convince others to agree with her by sweet reason -- she said it, so by the Almighty it must be so!Careful, Poly, she might come in and revoke your Christianity!

:D

[LifeOnWry]

Oh yeah? Spent much of my youth in Arlington Heights, but the DJs around me were a bit downmarket from Lujack.

I babysat once for Lujack's stepson. I believe the moniker "little snot-nose" was coined for him, and then later applied to Tommy Edwards.

(I'm originally from the NW side of Chicago, then out to the 'burbs, briefly up to Lake County -where my younger sister was one of the down market DJs- then out thisaway.)

[Miller]

The ex-wife of one of my boys has two daughters (one his, her older sister the product of a romance before they married). Their names are Katelynn and Jazzmine. And yes, she knows how to spell the standard names of like/similar pronunciation; she wanted unique names for her girls.

Workin' in a Jazzmine,
Goin' down down down.
Workin' in a Jazzmine,
Whoop! About to slip down.

[Bites When Provoked]

Sarai was the name of Abram's wife before God changed their names to Abraham and Sarah.Ahh, now it makes sense. They're* extremely religious types.

Just out of curiosity, do you know if Sarai is actually pronounced Sarah in that case? From what you've suggested, it would seem even less likely that the pronunciations would be the same, or there'd be no point in God changing their names.

Unless he's the kind of god who'd rename Jazzmyne to Jasmine simply because the wrong spelling offended Him ...

.... in which case ...

.... hey, maybe I was made in His image! :D

[cochrane]

Honestly, I've never heard of him (or is it her?) but the name's spelled correctly at least.
It's understandable you've never heard of Brett Favre, given your location. He's a popular NFL quarterback here in the States. And you're right, however the family prefers to spell the name is the correct spelling. However, it is pronounced "Farv", (sounds like Harv) which is opposite from the way it looks in print. So people often joke that he doesn't know how to spell "Farv".

[dropzone]

Great town...my dad grew up there (proud grad of the long-closed Arlington HS), and we lived there until I was 7.When was he there? Class of 72, myself.

[Sarahfeena]

When was he there? Class of 72, myself. He's a tad bit older...class of '50, I think? He was born in 1932.

Go Cardinals! :)

[dropzone]

Oh, so that places you more my age. Gotcha. ;)

I suppose we should let this thread die. Never was much of a Pitting, anyway. They are more fun when people disagree but everybody agrees about Carol.

[Daithi Lacha]

Just out of curiosity, do you know if Sarai is actually pronounced Sarah in that case? From what you've suggested, it would seem even less likely that the pronunciations would be the same, or there'd be no point in God changing their names.

I went to school with a Sarai in the early 70's; her name was pronounced like "SARE-ee."

[eleanorigby]

I suppose we should let this thread die. Never was much of a Pitting, anyway. They are more fun when people disagree but everybody agrees about Carol.


There's something about Carol.....

[Sarahfeena]

Oh, so that places you more my age. Gotcha. ;) No way, old timer...I graduated in '85! My parents were old when they had us. :)

I suppose we should let this thread die. Never was much of a Pitting, anyway. They are more fun when people disagree but everybody agrees about Carol. A (belated) thread death is ok by me!

[rayh]

Carol (http://www.risa.co.uk/sla/song.php?songid=23023)


Sometimes it seems unimaginable
That you were ever any other way
With your white rose face and your orphan clothes
Embroidered jeans and silver chains
You're a well known face in all the hang-out places
Where the lost souls congregate
You sit all night, but you talk too fast
I don't know what you're trying to say

Oh Carol, I think it's time for running for cover, a-ha
Believe me, you're everyone's and nobody's lover, a-ha
You've got a one-way ticket for all your yesterdays

[descamisado]

And in Lafayette County, Miss., its' "luh-FET". Reminds me of Bobba Fett for some reason. :pI was coming in here to say that about my home county and high school (go, Commodores!). Yep, that's it, although a slight variation is "luh-Fete" (almost the same tihing) but with the second syllable pronounced somewhere between a stretched out "Fete" and "Fayette." I feel like a phony nowadays when I say "Lafayette" and try to pronounce it the more proper way.

BTW, I plan to take you up on the "drank" you promised to buy me if I'm ever down Jackson way.

AND . . . How did Martha Grimes' "Ruthven" come to be pronounced "Riven," huh?

[Polycarp]

I was coming in here to say that about my home county and high school (go, Commodores!). Yep, that's it, although a slight variation is "luh-Fete" (almost the same tihing) but with the second syllable pronounced somewhere between a stretched out "Fete" and "Fayette." I feel like a phony nowadays when I say "Lafayette" and try to pronounce it the more proper way.

BTW, I plan to take you up on the "drank" you promised to buy me if I'm ever down Jackson way.

AND . . . How did Martha Grimes' "Ruthven" come to be pronounced "Riven," huh?

***picks some bluegrass, sings in Earl Scruggs voice ***

"Come and listen to my story of a boy named Five;
Sometimes 'twas hard for him to stay alive.
So he packed his bags and left the place called Lafayette,
'Cause they kept on tellin' him he should be straight."

:D

[NinetyWt]

***picks some bluegrass, sings in Earl Scruggs voice ***

"Come and listen to my story of a boy named Five;
Sometimes 'twas hard for him to stay alive.
So he packed his bags and left the place called Lafayette,
'Cause they kept on tellin' him he should be straight."

:D

That made my head hurt, trying to make Lafayette and straight rhyme! :p

BTW, I plan to take you up on the "drank" you promised to buy me if I'm ever down Jackson way. Come on down! Strangely enough, I am s'posed to be in NYC at Xmas time. Tribeca, to be exact.

[descamisado]

***picks some bluegrass, sings in Earl Scruggs voice ***

"Come and listen to my story of a boy named Five;
Sometimes 'twas hard for him to stay alive.
So he packed his bags and left the place called Lafayette,
'Cause they kept on tellin' him he should be straight."

:DPolycarp, you sho' is a mess. Gwone way from heah nye!