I'm Sorry, Diogenes

[5-HT]

As many of you know, Diogenes the Cynic has a longstanding grudge against former Packers and current Jets Quarterback Brett Favre. I have often laughed at the level of his hate for Favre, and at least one time, I even gave him some shit about it.

I want to apologize, DtC. While I have never much liked Favre, the constant failures of my Detroit Lions prevented me from caring that much. The Lions never had a team good enough for Favre to impact our chances, so I grew apathetic towards him.

Well, yesterday my formerly undefeated Fantasy Football team had the misfortune of playing a team who featured Mr. Favre at quarterback.

I take it all back, it's clear to me now that Favre is deserving of any and all scorn that one might heap upon him and the broadcasters who suck his dick on a weekly basis. May a plague of locusts follow him wherever he goes, let shame and misfortune forever befall both the Jets and the Packers. May a tornado strike the town of Kiln, Mississippi, strangely destroying nothing except Favre's childhood home.

You were right all along, Diogenes. Favre is a menace and must be stopped. A pox upon him, and all who support him in his reign of terror.

[Skald the Rhymer]

Can you explain why Favre is so hateful for the nerds among us? All I know about him is that he's blond and was in There's Something about Mary and retired and un-retired in the same year and....well, that's it.

[Lord Ashtar]

Favre threw an unthinkable six touchdown passes yesterday. That'll wipe out virtually any fantasy team he's playing against, and any real team for that matter.

[Skald the Rhymer]

Favre threw an unthinkable six touchdown passes yesterday. That'll wipe out virtually any fantasy team he's playing against, and any real team for that matter.

Um...can you maybe put that in equivalent chess terms? Because I thought that touchdowns only counted if carried across the line of scrimmage or whatever in the player's hands.

[Kid_A]

It really doesn't help when your opponent also has Boldin and Coles. Favre and Coles outscored my whole team.

Stupid SDMB league.

[5-HT]

Um...can you maybe put that in equivalent chess terms? Because I thought that touchdowns only counted if carried across the line of scrimmage or whatever in the player's hands.

TD passes count for both the person who throws it and the person who catches it.

[Amp]

Can you explain why Favre is so hateful for the nerds among us? All I know about him is that he's blond and was in There's Something about Mary and retired and un-retired in the same year and....well, that's it.

Basically he wanted to do two things during Sunday's game, kick ass and chew bubble gum. He ran out of bubble gum before the game even began.

[Sarahfeena]

Um...can you maybe put that in equivalent chess terms? Because I thought that touchdowns only counted if carried across the line of scrimmage or whatever in the player's hands. I'm not sure exactly what you are asking here, but if the quarterback (Brett Favre, for example), throws a pass that is caught in the end zone (by someone on his team, of course), that is a touchdown. Or, if he throws a pass to someone who is not in the end zone, but that player then runs into the end zone, that is also a touchdown.

Can't put it into chess terms, because I know even less about chess than I do about football. :)

[Skald the Rhymer]

TD passes count for both the person who throws it and the person who catches it.

So I gather this means that Favre threw the ball to another player who then carried it over the line to score the point, so they are both credited with the score. No?

[Sarahfeena]

So I gather this means that Favre threw the ball to another player who then carried it over the line to score the point, so they are both credited with the score. No? Sorry, I DID misunderstand your question. You can ignore me now.

[storyteller0910]

Can you explain why Favre is so hateful for the nerds among us? All I know about him is that he's blond and was in There's Something about Mary and retired and un-retired in the same year and....well, that's it.

I'll take a shot at this one.

Imagine, if you will, a... OK, let's say a supervillain. We'll call him Doctor Interception . Now, by supervillain standards, he's really quite good. Coupla really ingenious bank jobs early on, fair bit of murder and mayhem, and actually slaughtered a superhero once. Of course, it was Hawkeye from the West Coast Avengers that he slaughtered, not Spider Man. And other supervillains have managed to slaughter, oh, three or four. And at times he makes some really horrible mistakes, the kind of mistakes that even your average purse snatcher can avoid. He routinely orders his enemies left alive "so they can witness [Doctor Interception's] triumph," for instance. But OK, our supervillain is really pretty skilled at his job, and his Legions of Doom love him to pieces (at least, as much as Legions of Doom can love a man).

Now imagine that the newspapers take an interest in Doctor Interception's career. And for a while, their discussion of his work is about appropriate for his accomplishments. He's described as a "menace" and a "thorn in the side of [the city's] heroes," and that seems about right. But then, after a few years and a few evil schemes, some successful and some less so, you start to notice a change. Suddenly, they're writing about him as if he has a hundred dead superheroes to his credit. They're referring to him as a "Master of Evil" and a "Diabolic Genius." Worse still, eventually the stories stop concentrating even on his actual performance as a villain. Writers start tripping over their own elaborate prose describing his rugged stubble, and even when he forgets to properly load his death ray and gets caught by a junior superhero sidekick, all anyone can talk about is "how much Doctor Interception was enjoying himself burning down that orphanage."

But it gets worse. One particular columnist, one who, mostly, writes well and provides intelligent commentary on the art of murder and mayhem, falls completely in love with Doctor Interception, and devotes endless column inches to the kind of thing you'd be embarassed to find in Penthouse. This columnist is quite popular, and deservedly so, but he abandons all reason in his frantic effort to become Doctor Interception's boot-licking sex slave, and in the process makes his work exponentially less valuable each week.

And then, one year, after yet another humiliating defeat at the hands of, like, Alpha Flight, Doctor Interception decides he's quitting for good. But then he changes his mind. He repeats this process yearly for an estimated 1.21 billion years, and each year, his Chief Henchman - who is waiting to take over the Evil Empire - suffers crushing disappointment. Finally, one year, the shareholders at the Evil Empire - who by the way have been in business way longer than Doctor Interception, and took out a metric assload of superheroes before Doctor Interception was even stealing Payday candy from the Quik-E-Mart, thanks so much, decide that maybe it's time for Chief Henchman to have his chance. So when Doctor Interception says, "I quit," again, the Evil Empire finally says, "OK," and moves on without him.

When, a few months later, Doctor Interception decides he wants to kill some more and the Evil Empire suggests that maybe this wouldn't be the optimal outcome for them but they're open to it, but don't offer him free blowjobs from everyone in the Empire up to and including Chief Henchman, the whole world goes nuts. We get to hear some more about how rugged and populist and just all-around fucking awesome Doctor I is and has always been, and how he MADE the Evil Empire (which was killing its first superhero some years before Dr. I was even born), and how DARE they, and, by the way, Doctor Interception, I think I think I love you.

But there's more. The Evil Empire finally says, "hey, Dr. I, come on back and work with us. Again, we're not thrilled, but here's a check for $14 million." But Dr. I, who is so tough and rugged and wonderful, decides that the only place he wants to be is a member of the X-men, who have been the sworn enemies of the Evil Empire for decades. The Evil Empire manages to ship him off to Avengers West Coast, instead, and he goes, but he whines like a Pomeranian the whole way.

Then he gets there, and in his first mission, the team barely survives their encounter with the likes of Mysterio, for God's sake, and Dr. Interception very nearly dooms them all by his lonesome. In the second mission, they're wiped out completely, thansk in part to Dr. Interception fucking up the safety on the Death Ray again. And then, on Monday morning, here come the articles, again, ignoring what actually happened to focus on Doctor Interception's motherfuckcunting facial stubble.

Don't you kind of want to hit Doctor Interception in the head with a rock right now?

That's Brett Favre.

[5-HT]

I'll take a shot at this one.

Imagine, if you will, a... OK, let's say a supervillain. We'll call him Doctor Interception . Now, by supervillain standards, he's really quite good. Coupla really ingenious bank jobs early on, fair bit of murder and mayhem, and actually slaughtered a superhero once. Of course, it was Hawkeye from the West Coast Avengers that he slaughtered, not Spider Man. And other supervillains have managed to slaughter, oh, three or four. And at times he makes some really horrible mistakes, the kind of mistakes that even your average purse snatcher can avoid. He routinely orders his enemies left alive "so they can witness [Doctor Interception's] triumph," for instance. But OK, our supervillain is really pretty skilled at his job, and his Legions of Doom love him to pieces (at least, as much as Legions of Doom can love a man).

Now imagine that the newspapers take an interest in Doctor Interception's career. And for a while, their discussion of his work is about appropriate for his accomplishments. He's described as a "menace" and a "thorn in the side of [the city's] heroes," and that seems about right. But then, after a few years and a few evil schemes, some successful and some less so, you start to notice a change. Suddenly, they're writing about him as if he has a hundred dead superheroes to his credit. They're referring to him as a "Master of Evil" and a "Diabolic Genius." Worse still, eventually the stories stop concentrating even on his actual performance as a villain. Writers start tripping over their own elaborate prose describing his rugged stubble, and even when he forgets to properly load his death ray and gets caught by a junior superhero sidekick, all anyone can talk about is "how much Doctor Interception was enjoying himself burning down that orphanage."

But it gets worse. One particular columnist, one who, mostly, writes well and provides intelligent commentary on the art of murder and mayhem, falls completely in love with Doctor Interception, and devotes endless column inches to the kind of thing you'd be embarassed to find in Penthouse. This columnist is quite popular, and deservedly so, but he abandons all reason in his frantic effort to become Doctor Interception's boot-licking sex slave, and in the process makes his work exponentially less valuable each week.

And then, one year, after yet another humiliating defeat at the hands of, like, Alpha Flight, Doctor Interception decides he's quitting for good. But then he changes his mind. He repeats this process yearly for an estimated 1.21 billion years, and each year, his Chief Henchman - who is waiting to take over the Evil Empire - suffers crushing disappointment. Finally, one year, the shareholders at the Evil Empire - who by the way have been in business way longer than Doctor Interception, and took out a metric assload of superheroes before Doctor Interception was even stealing Payday candy from the Quik-E-Mart, thanks so much, decide that maybe it's time for Chief Henchman to have his chance. So when Doctor Interception says, "I quit," again, the Evil Empire finally says, "OK," and moves on without him.

When, a few months later, Doctor Interception decides he wants to kill some more and the Evil Empire suggests that maybe this wouldn't be the optimal outcome for them but they're open to it, but don't offer him free blowjobs from everyone in the Empire up to and including Chief Henchman, the whole world goes nuts. We get to hear some more about how rugged and populist and just all-around fucking awesome Doctor I is and has always been, and how he MADE the Evil Empire (which was killing its first superhero some years before Dr. I was even born), and how DARE they, and, by the way, Doctor Interception, I think I think I love you.

But there's more. The Evil Empire finally says, "hey, Dr. I, come on back and work with us. Again, we're not thrilled, but here's a check for $14 million." But Dr. I, who is so tough and rugged and wonderful, decides that the only place he wants to be is a member of the X-men, who have been the sworn enemies of the Evil Empire for decades. The Evil Empire manages to ship him off to Avengers West Coast, instead, and he goes, but he whines like a Pomeranian the whole way.

Then he gets there, and in his first mission, the team barely survives their encounter with the likes of Mysterio, for God's sake, and Dr. Interception very nearly dooms them all by his lonesome. In the second mission, they're wiped out completely, thansk in part to Dr. Interception fucking up the safety on the Death Ray again. And then, on Monday morning, here come the articles, again, ignoring what actually happened to focus on Doctor Interception's motherfuckcunting facial stubble.

Don't you kind of want to hit Doctor Interception in the head with a rock right now?

That's Brett Favre.

That was beautiful.

[mazinger_z]

So I gather this means that Favre threw the ball to another player who then carried it over the line to score the point, so they are both credited with the score. No? To answer your and Sarahfeena's question, yes, in Fantasy Football scoring, Favre gets (depending on scoring, but typically) six points for making the throw, and the receiver gets 6 points as well. If they're both on your FF team, then you just scored 12 points. How many yards did Favre throw for? Personally, I hated Favre just because he was a Packer and seemed to have this insurmountable luck of avoiding bone-crushing, career ending sacks that rightfully should be suffered by him. Then, I got all mushy and gooey for him when his dad died and admitted his addiction to painkillers and came clean about it. Luckily, I also have him on my FF team and scored the highest point total in (my) league history (we pay out a $20 bonus for that).

[5-HT]

To answer your and Sarahfeena's question, yes, in Fantasy Football scoring, Favre gets (depending on scoring, but typically) six points for making the throw, and the receiver gets 6 points as well. If they're both on your FF team, then you just scored 12 points. How many yards did Favre throw for? Personally, I hated Favre just because he was a Packer and seemed to have this insurmountable luck of avoiding bone-crushing, career ending sacks that rightfully should be suffered by him. Then, I got all mushy and gooey for him when his dad died and admitted his addiction to painkillers and came clean about it. Luckily, I also have him on my FF team and scored the highest point total in (my) league history (we pay out a $20 bonus for that).

289 yards. So yeah, the receiver and QB both get points for the yardage as well. Typically, QBs only get a point for every 25 yards while WRs get a point for every 10. That varies by league though.

[Jack Batty]

Can you explain why Favre is so hateful for the nerds among us?

I don't know from Fantasy Football, but I can tell you a great deal of Favre backlash can be directly attributed to ESPN's Chis Berman, who has never not mentioned Bret Favre when talking about ... well, pretty much anything.

The man has a hay-uge man crush on the Farvester.

I was once watching a game, that Green Bay was losing, and the when the other quaterback threw a touchdown pass, Berman actually said something along the lines of, "Wow, he look downright Favre-like on that play."

It's the adulation that gets heaped on the guy that gets irritating.

However, in my opinion, there's shitloads to admire about the guy, so there's that too.

[neutron star]

Um...can you maybe put that in equivalent chess terms? Because I thought that touchdowns only counted if carried across the line of scrimmage or whatever in the player's hands.You're not from this country, are you?

[Sarahfeena]

To answer your and Sarahfeena's question, yes, in Fantasy Football scoring, Favre gets (depending on scoring, but typically) six points for making the throw, and the receiver gets 6 points as well. If they're both on your FF team, then you just scored 12 points. How many yards did Favre throw for? Personally, I hated Favre just because he was a Packer and seemed to have this insurmountable luck of avoiding bone-crushing, career ending sacks that rightfully should be suffered by him. Then, I got all mushy and gooey for him when his dad died and admitted his addiction to painkillers and came clean about it. Luckily, I also have him on my FF team and scored the highest point total in (my) league history (we pay out a $20 bonus for that). I wasn't asking the question, I was trying to sort out if Skald was asking about the rules to football, or the rules to fantasy football. I'm still confused about that one! :)

[Mince]

...and the broadcasters who suck his dick on a weekly basis.


This is just the dick-sucking we see.

[R. P. McMurphy]

Congratulations guys! This thread is LOL funny. A nice respite from some of the nastiness in the place.

Proceed.

[Mince]

Can you explain why Favre is so hateful for the nerds among us?

You don't have to be a nerd to not like football and you don't have to be a non-nerd to like it.



by Lord Ashtar

Favre threw an unthinkable six touchdown passes yesterday. That'll wipe out virtually any fantasy team he's playing against, and any real team for that matter.


by Skald the Rhymer

Um...can you maybe put that in equivalent chess terms?


The white player advanced a pawn to the 8th rank, and subsequently queened, six times.

[Freddy the Pig]

So I gather this means that Favre threw the ball to another player who then carried it over the line to score the point, so they are both credited with the score. No?Or, the other player ran over the line, and then Favre threw him the ball. Either way, the receiver gets credit for a touchdown reception and six points scored. Favre gets credit for throwing a touchdown pass.

In chess terms, imagine if your pieces were a team, and you were tabulating how many times each piece executed a discovered check. One piece moves out of the way and another gives check. So every time you as a team gave dc, one of your pieces would be credited with "giving a dc" and a different piece would be credited with "uncovering a dc".

[Tastes of Chocolate]

storyteller0910, that was fabulous.

[elucidator]

To put it in terms accessible to football geeks, Dopers and chess team nerds: Favre should have employed the Cecilian Defense.

[Really Not All That Bright]

storyteller nailed the answer more perfectly than any answer has ever been nailed.

However, for the TLDR types, I'll give my (shorter) answer:

Brett Favre is the George W. Bush of quarterbacks.

GWB is the millionaire Harvard and Yale-educated son of a President and former head of the CIA who spent virtually his entire career in Washington, yet managed to attain the Presidency passing himself off as a Washington outsider and downhome woodsy good 'ol boy.

Favre is a millionaire a hundred times over with a supermodelish wife, and a total prima donna who has hijacked the Packers' (I hate the Pack, FTR) offseasons and training camps for half a decade- solely to get himself a few more column inches in Sports Illustrated and an extra mention on the Milwaukee network affiliate nightly newscasts- but who passes himself off as a downhome "aw shucks" woodsy good ol' boy.

They are, in short, the antithesis of the thinking-man's President/QB (Gerald Ford and Peyton Manning, in case you're wondering): they both bring out the stupid in people.

[Lord Ashtar]

Brett Favre is the George W. Bush of quarterbacks.

I guess we're not allowed to have a thread around here that doesn't have political snark in it anymore. Good on you for bringing us up to code, RNATB. :rolleyes:

[Really Not All That Bright]

I guess we're not allowed to have a thread around here that doesn't have political snark in it anymore. Good on you for bringing us up to code, RNATB. :rolleyes:
If you read the rest of my post, you'll note that the comparison centers on how brilliant GWB's campaign strategy was, not on his character/skills/intellect/whatever. I suppose you could say I'm snarking about the electorate, but honestly, you're kind of missing the point.

[wolfman]

Storyteller you forgot the part where he has the record for the most money ever stolen in a career from a bank, using the plan of loading up a truck with gold bars and throwing it through the vault door, then taking the money.

[storyteller0910]

Storyteller you forgot the part where he has the record for the most money ever stolen in a career from a bank, using the plan of loading up a truck with gold bars and throwing it through the vault door, then taking the money.

SNORF. Awesome.

[Iggins]

The team with the Farvester lost in my fantasy league. Ran into a guy with Brees, Gore, Greg Jennings, and Mushin Muhammad.

For what that's worth to the anti-Favre faction...

[Diogenes the Cynic]

For the record, I've never really hated Favre himself, just the ridiculous adulation and knob polishing from the sports media.

The only thing that amazes me about Favre tossing 6 TD's yesterday is that he never did it against the Vikings. We've had some of the most porous, spacious defensive secondaries in NFL history. How did that never happen to us?

[Snowboarder Bo]

storyteller0910 wins this thread, hands down. :p

[elucidator]

...We've had some of the most porous, spacious defensive secondaries in NFL history. How did that never happen to us?

Pity?

[Captain Carrot]

storyteller, I know nothing about sports, but for that story you are my hero. +10 Internets!

[Rapier42]

I'll take a shot at this one.

*applause*

Encore, encore!

[pepperlandgirl]

storyteller left out the part where Doctor Interception cries every time something doesn't go his way. Besides that, it's perfect.

[The Second Stone]

Since there has been a request, let me put this in chess terms.

You, a man in your early 80s, decide to play Gary Kasparov, and spot the young'un a rook. (That's the one that looks like the castle tower.) You then proceed to advance six of your pawns to the eighth rank and avoid the embarrassment of stalemating Kasparov.

[Skald the Rhymer]

Sorry, I DID misunderstand your question. You can ignore me now.

You answer was useful. I am just that ignrant about football.

[Risha]

Did that contest for best SDMB post of the year ever get off the ground? Because I think that storyteller0910 has a solid shot at the title.

[Sarahfeena]

You answer was useful. I am just that ignrant about football.Oh, good...glad I could help. I wasn't sure if you were asking how a touchdown is scored, what the term "threw for a touchdown" refers to, or how you score it in fantasy football. I THOUGHT it was the first, but then I wasn't sure.

I think where you are getting confused is that there is a rule that once the ball crosses the line of scrimmage, you can't execute a forward pass...at that point, you can only run with it (or passing it backwards, I think, is OK, too).

[What Exit?]

storyteller0910, your post just got linked to in the The SDMB 2008 Awesome-est Post of the Year (http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=476578) thread and I had to say, "Awesome Post! Wow."

I know this thread is just over the border of Zombiehood for the pit but I also noticed it is barely a pit thread and there were no hostilities between posters.

[don't ask]

I'll take a shot at this one. <snip>
That's Brett Favre.

You may be right but that isn't the official bio, is it?

[Bryan Ekers]

You may be right but that isn't the official bio, is it?

According to Frank Miller, it is.

[Vox Imperatoris]

You answer was useful. I am just that ignrant about football.

I still don't think anyone has actually explained throwing a pass for a touchdown: in addition to being scored by holding the ball and moving across the goal line, a touchdown can also be scored if someone throws the ball to another guy already standing on the other side of the goal line (and he catches it, of course). You don't need to actually move over the line with the ball in your hands; it just has to be over the line in someone's hands at some point.

Valete,
Vox Imperatoris

[tim314]

Um...can you maybe put that in equivalent chess terms? Because I thought that touchdowns only counted if carried across the line of scrimmage or whatever in the player's hands.

For starters, I think perhaps you're confusing "line of scrimmage" and "goal line".

Line of scrimmage = where the play starts
Goal line = where the end zone starts

End zone = the area at the end of the field that you must reach to score

To score a touchdown you have to have the ball in the end zone, and in possession of one of your players. (The player himself doesn't have to be standing in the end zone. For instance, he can dive towards the goal line and reach out with the hand holding the ball so that the ball crosses the plane defined by the goal line. That counts as a touchdown, even if the player's body lands just short of the goal.)

Each attempt to score or advance the ball is a "play". When someone refers to a football "play", think of it like "one move" in chess. Except that in football, the one team is making their offensive move and the other team making their defensive move at the same time. After a certain number of failed offensive moves, the other team gets a turn to play offense.

There are two basic types of offensive plays: passing plays and running plays. In a passing play, the quarterback (passer) throws the ball to a receiver, who then runs toward the goal line. In a running play, the ball is handed to a runner and carried toward the goal line on foot (sometimes, the quarterback does this himself instead of handing off).

Thus, you can score if a pass is caught in the end zone, or if it's carried across the goal line by a runner or by a receiver who caught a pass outside the end zone. Both of these count for the same number of points (6, with a chance to go for 1 or 2 additional points on a following play).

Fantasy Football is different. In fantasy football, fans draft a team of players and compete with their friends. How many points your fantasy team gets is based on how well the players on your team performed in their real games that week. However, since you draft your own teams, players who play on the same real team may be on different fantasy teams.

E.g., Fantasy Owner A may have Real Team X's quarterback, and Fantasy Owner B may have Real Team X's receiver. Thus, if the quarterback throws a touchdown pass to the receiver, this earns Fantasy points for the quarterback (and thus for Fantasy Owner A) and for the receiver (and thus for Fantasy Owner B). This kind of double counting only happens in Fantasy Football though. In real football, the quarterback and receiver are on the same team, so there's no need to give separate points to both the quarterback and receiver. Instead, 6 points are assigned to the team as a whole.

[Captain Carrot]

You don't have to be a nerd to not like football and you don't have to be a non-nerd to like it.
The white player advanced a pawn to the 8th rank, and subsequently queened, six times.

I don't think that's analogous. In my experience, football teams often score touchdowns, but chess players rarely queen even one pawn, let alone 6. (I think because the advantage of having a[nother] queen is almost always outweighed by the focus on promoting that one piece to the exclusion of developing other material, and the extreme likelihood, given how limited the pawn's move is, that the effort will fail.)

[SleepyDuck]

Well, I might've zombified this thread (had I known it existed) but for a completely different reason.

Before the regular season started, yet after the latest and most cringe-worthy Favre dramatics (You football fans know what I'm talking about) I predicted loudly and largely that
* Aaron Rodgers would have a better season than Brett Favre
* The Packers would have a better season than the Jets
This proclamation was based partly on my premier pigskin prognostication prowess, partly on my newly intensified Favre hatred.

As for my prediction, not so much. But in the meanwhiles, something even more incredible happened, something only the NFL bookers could pull off.

Chad Pennington (AKA the guy the Jets cut loose because they now had The Messiah at quarterback) leads the Miami Dolphins (AKA the worst team in the league last year) in to the Meadowlands and stamps a big red official "DENIED" on the Jets' playoff proposal.

Now THAT's how schaudenfreude is done.

[Malacandra]

I don't think that's analogous. In my experience, football teams often score touchdowns, but chess players rarely queen even one pawn, let alone 6. (I think because the advantage of having a[nother] queen is almost always outweighed by the focus on promoting that one piece to the exclusion of developing other material, and the extreme likelihood, given how limited the pawn's move is, that the effort will fail.)

Well, with some minor disagreement. Pawn promotion rarely comes up in the middlegame not because the advantage of having another queen is outweighed by anything but because it may well not be achievable at that time. It is a major theme in the endgame but may well not actually take place simply because the weaker side resigns once promotion cannot be averted.

No first-class game has ever featured six queens on the board at one time (there have been a couple of instances of three queens versus two, and a reasonable-sized handful of two versus two) as, firstly, no strong player needs to be more than one queen up to win in less time than it would take to promote six pawns and, secondly, no such player would be so ill-mannered as not to resign when a queen down and in a position when he was helpless to prevent an arbitrary number of additional promotions.

At lower level, it's another story. Only the other week on Gameknot someone insisted on carrying on against me when he was down by nearly a Queen-equivalent and I had a promotion in the offing - even after I'd queened he still played on for a couple of moves before wandering off and letting his time run out. But I guess no-one amasses rating points by resigning, and he could always hope that I would suffer a debilitating aneurism or walk in front of a steamroller. :D

Pawn promotion as an implied threat is a huge strategic consideration in chess, though, which is why strong players will run the risk of a quick mate rather than concede a material disadvantage that renders eventual defeat inevitable. Even the SDMB's resident FIDE Master would not have bothered to play on against me in the game mentioned above. (He'd not have been in that position in the first place, as I know very well, but that's another story.)

[Sailboat]

I don't think that's analogous. In my experience, football teams often score touchdowns

Haven't been following the Redskins this season, I take it?

[What Exit?]

Well, I might've zombified this thread (had I known it existed) but for a completely different reason.

Before the regular season started, yet after the latest and most cringe-worthy Favre dramatics (You football fans know what I'm talking about) I predicted loudly and largely that
* Aaron Rodgers would have a better season than Brett Favre
* The Packers would have a better season than the Jets
This proclamation was based partly on my premier pigskin prognostication prowess, partly on my newly intensified Favre hatred.

As for my prediction, not so much. But in the meanwhiles, something even more incredible happened, something only the NFL bookers could pull off.

Chad Pennington (AKA the guy the Jets cut loose because they now had The Messiah at quarterback) leads the Miami Dolphins (AKA the worst team in the league last year) in to the Meadowlands and stamps a big red official "DENIED" on the Jets' playoff proposal.

Now THAT's how schaudenfreude is done.

Agreed and I am neither a Favre hater or a Jet Hater. I just got such a huge sense of schadenfreude on behalf of Pennington that I thought it reached near epic proportions. (Epic proportions would include at least a trip to the Superbowl for Pennington & Dolphins now.)

[Gangster Octopus]

Well, I might've zombified this thread (had I known it existed) but for a completely different reason.

Before the regular season started, yet after the latest and most cringe-worthy Favre dramatics (You football fans know what I'm talking about) I predicted loudly and largely that
* Aaron Rodgers would have a better season than Brett Favre
* The Packers would have a better season than the Jets
This proclamation was based partly on my premier pigskin prognostication prowess, partly on my newly intensified Favre hatred.

As for my prediction, not so much. But in the meanwhiles, something even more incredible happened, something only the NFL bookers could pull off.

Chad Pennington (AKA the guy the Jets cut loose because they now had The Messiah at quarterback) leads the Miami Dolphins (AKA the worst team in the league last year) in to the Meadowlands and stamps a big red official "DENIED" on the Jets' playoff proposal.

Now THAT's how schaudenfreude is done.

Wel, Rodgers did have a considerably better season than Favre.

[Marley23]

That was beautiful.
I'm applauding too. Only on this board do you get people explaining football via supervillains and politics with analogies from Lord of the Rings. It's possibly the dorkiest thing on the planet, but it's fun.

[EddyTeddyFreddy]

Did that contest for best SDMB post of the year ever get off the ground? Because I think that storyteller0910 has a solid shot at the title.

Oh, man, YEH! You don't even have to be a fan of either football or comic book heroes to cheer for that! Frakkin AWESOME.

[TroubleAgain]

storyteller0910, your username is quite apt. Good post!

[Captain Carrot]

politics with analogies from Lord of the Rings. I must have missed that.

[Skald the Rhymer]

I'm applauding too. Only on this board do you get people explaining football via supervillains and politics with analogies from Lord of the Rings. It's possibly the dorkiest thing on the planet, but it's fun.

Actually, that's not true. I was watching C-Span this morning and a member of the Obama transition team was making just that analogy, arguing that the Bush admnistration's black & white view of the world was LotR-like. I also recall a Republican senator--it may have been Bill Frist, as I would have found that especially annoying--saying that Iraq was Mordor.

ETA: actually it was Rick Santorum (http://www.salon.com/politics/war_room/2006/10/17/santorum/).

[Marley23]

I must have missed that.
I saw it a bunch of times in GD over the last six months or so.

Here's one example. (http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?p=10336266&post10336266) Here's another. (http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?p=9866374&post9866374)

Skald, I was thinking of the combination of the two. But yeah, when a guy like Santorum starts talking about Lord of the Rings, you know the geeks won.

[Skald the Rhymer]

I saw it a bunch of times in GD over the last six months or so.

Here's one example. (http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?p=10336266&post10336266) Here's another. (http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?p=9866374&post9866374)

Skald, I was thinking of the combination of the two. But yeah, when a guy like Santorum starts talking about Lord of the Rings, you know the geeks won.

I'm a nerd, not a geek, but even if I were, I wouldn't want to count Santorum among my brethren.

[Really Not All That Bright]

Before the regular season started, yet after the latest and most cringe-worthy Favre dramatics (You football fans know what I'm talking about) I predicted loudly and largely that
* Aaron Rodgers would have a better season than Brett Favre
* The Packers would have a better season than the Jets
This proclamation was based partly on my premier pigskin prognostication prowess, partly on my newly intensified Favre hatred.

As for my prediction, not so much. But in the meanwhiles, something even more incredible happened, something only the NFL bookers could pull off.
You were right on the money with prediction 1....

Rodgers threw for more yards (4,038 to 3,472), more touchdowns (28 to 22), fewer picks (13 to 22), more yards per attempt (7.5 to 6.7), and had a much better passer rating (93.8 to 81).

The only statistical categories in which Favre did better are sacks allowed (34 to 30) and completion percentage (65.7 to 63.6). The completion percentage is essentially meaningless considering Rodgers' higher yards per attempt number anyway. Rodgers also ran for 200+ yards and 4 touchdowns to Favre's 43/1.

Actually, Rodgers had an unbelievable season; most quarterbacks never throw for 4,000 yards or 25 touchdowns, and Rodgers did both in his first season as a starter- and under a bigger microscope than maybe any quarterback ever! Even more impressive is throwing only 13 picks, despite throwing deep and throwing a lot; all three of the guys who threw for more yards (Brees, Warner, Cutler) threw more picks.

Prediction 2 wasn't that far off; neither the Jets nor the Packers made the playoffs, although the Jets obviously got closer, and while Rodgers was clearly one of the Packers' best players, Favre was equally clearly one of the Jets' worst.

Hopefully, good ol' stubbly drama queen Number 4 will hang it up this offseason and go back to cutting down trees or whatever he does in Mississippi when he's not attention whoring.