hmm - maybe calling your opponents Anti-American isn't such a good strategy after all

[Northern Piper]

The Republican National Congressional Committee has suspended its campaign funding in Representative Bachmann's district: GOP Pulling Its Ads From Bachmann's Race, Media Buyers Say (http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2008/10/22/gop-pulling-its-ads-from_n_136941.html).

The pullout follows a surge in fundraising by her Democratic opponent, after her comments about Obama and liberals being anti-American:In the days following her appearance on Hardball, however, Bachmann has watched as her challenger, El Tinklenberg raised more than a million dollars off her incendiary remarks. That surge in fundraising put Bachmann's re-election in a far less certain position. Bachmann tried to stem the bleeding by telling the press she was sorry for her remarks. But with the national party now apparently pulling the plug, the situation has gone from bad to worse.

[Hamlet]

Americans love being able to be righteously outraged. It brings an intoxicating sense of being right while others are wrong. It reinforces beliefs, gives a sense of power, and is almost addictive.

And it is a great motivator.

The Civil Rights movement used it very effectively to finally institute changes in segregated South. Dozens of preachers became mega-millionaires playing it up for the "Moral Majority". And the Republican party has wielded it to increase fundraising for decades. Now it appears that the Democrats are finally catching up.

Sure using righteous indignation politically leads to divisiveness, unwillingness to compromise, and a breakdown of honest debate and discussion. Which, as we've seen over the last 3 elections, is having dire consequences for political discourse in our country.

[Captain Carrot]

Lying about it probably didn't help either.

Dear politicians: if you say something dumb on camera, it will be caught, and it will be on youtube soon. You can't just pretend you never said it like in 1998. When you try, you look like an idiot, and you're underestimating our intelligence.

[descamisado]

Bad, bad Tweety Bird. He set a twap and forced her to walk rrrriiiiggghht into it, sputterin' and spittin' all the way.

"I tought I saw a lunatic. I did, I did!"

[Richard Parker]

Sure using righteous indignation politically leads to divisiveness, unwillingness to compromise, and a breakdown of honest debate and discussion. Which, as we've seen over the last 3 elections, is having dire consequences for political discourse in our country.

What if your righteous outrage is at the very divisiveness and breakdown of honest discussion? Does that just replace the old division with a new one? I'm not so sure.

[jayjay]

Lying about it probably didn't help either.

Dear politicians: if you say something dumb on camera, it will be caught, and it will be on youtube soon. You can't just pretend you never said it like in 1998. When you try, you look like an idiot, and you're underestimating our intelligence.

I think you've hit on the one huge change in society that's going to make bullshit-as-usual politics difficult from here on out. Having a resource that removes the average bullshitter politician's ability to wave his/her hands and make the quote go away is absolutely delicious.

[elucidator]

You mean it doesn't work any more? Oh, frabjous day, I chortle in my glee!

[Dangerosa]

I think you've hit on the one huge change in society that's going to make bullshit-as-usual politics difficult from here on out. Having a resource that removes the average bullshitter politician's ability to wave his/her hands and make the quote go away is absolutely delicious.


The other change, people have a ton of "news" to choose from via the internet, and they "choose" it by reading about it on blogs, getting emails from their friends - its viral. Used to be if the campaign wanted the news cycle to be about taxes, they just gave the reporters taxes. Any other conversation was parried, delayed. You had to be persistent and it had to be big to get more attention. And to get big attention, it had to last long enough for new magazines to write about it and get published.

Now, if the "people" decide to engage in RO about "anti-American witch hunts" or be bemused about $150,000 spending sprees, its much harder to parry and turn the conversation.

Today, someone is seeing Bachmann on Hardball for the first time, because some friend sent them the link. It hasn't died a quiet death as the news cycle moves on. They started sharing it the minute it happened - and they haven't stopped.

[Beware of Doug]

Can we just take Michele Bachmann and Jean Schmidt (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jean_Schmidt) and chain them up in a (figurative, political) dungeon somewhere where they're subjected to (ideological) starvation and regular (notional) beatings?

[Hamlet]

What if your righteous outrage is at the very divisiveness and breakdown of honest discussion? Does that just replace the old division with a new one? I'm not so sure.Is this like the "can you be tolerant of intolerance" stuff?

[Mosier]

Americans love being able to be righteously outraged. It brings an intoxicating sense of being right while others are wrong. It reinforces beliefs, gives a sense of power, and is almost addictive.

And it is a great motivator.

The Civil Rights movement used it very effectively to finally institute changes in segregated South. Dozens of preachers became mega-millionaires playing it up for the "Moral Majority". And the Republican party has wielded it to increase fundraising for decades. Now it appears that the Democrats are finally catching up.

Sure using righteous indignation politically leads to divisiveness, unwillingness to compromise, and a breakdown of honest debate and discussion. Which, as we've seen over the last 3 elections, is having dire consequences for political discourse in our country.

Yeah, that's it. It's not calling your political opponents "Anti-American" that's divisive and causing dire consequences, it's being outraged at being called anti-American that's REALLY dividing us. /rolleyes

[jayjay]

Is this like the "can you be tolerant of intolerance" stuff?

If a Republican cuts down a tree in the forest after having tied up, blindfolded and earplugged the Democrat, will he lie about the tree making a sound?

[Richard Parker]

Is this like the "can you be tolerant of intolerance" stuff?

You tell me. It's your argument. I and the other in this thread have taken you to be saying that righteousness at division itself causes division.

[descamisado]

Americans love being able to be righteously outraged. . . .

And it is a great motivator.

The Civil Rights movement used it very effectively to finally institute changes in segregated South.You say that last part like it's a bad thing.

[Merkwurdigliebe]

This chick is all kinds of crazy. She deserves to lose and lose badly. Coming from the South, I always assume the worst of wignuttery is always going to be Southern, but sometimes I'm pleasantly surprised.

Seriously, this divisive bullshit has to end. It's about time the majority of Americans wake up and realize that they are F#@^$&% us over while they have us fretting over gun-rights (which will never change) and gay marriage.

[scr4]

Other times Bacchmann has been in the news include:

Trying to get a kiss from Bush (?):
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=930gQZmC6iE

The "caribou love the oil pipeline" remarks:
http://thinkprogress.org/2008/06/20/bachmann-caribou-coffee/

[Voyager]

I think the Republicans are proving that you can underestimate the intelligence (and tolerance) of the American public. They get nastier and nastier and their poll numbers drop and drop, and they appear to be too stupid to make the connection. Maybe if McCain and Bachman get thrashed, Rove's disciples will find it tough to get jobs.

[Tuckerfan]

Maybe if McCain and Bachman get thrashed, Rove's disciples will find it tough to get jobs.

*pats Voyager on the head*

You kids and your wishful thinking.

[Nobody]

Look, Bachman was simply taking care of business. And if you think what she said was horrible, well then, you ain't seen nothing yet.

[Napier]

>Yeah, that's it. It's not calling your political opponents "Anti-American" that's divisive and causing dire consequences, it's being outraged at being called anti-American that's REALLY dividing us. /rolleyes

Mosier, thank you for that. I watched Bachman that night on Hardball and sent Tinklenberg $50. Hamlet had me feeling rather pawnlike, there. Now I feel better again. The presidential race cost over a billion, whereas this little creepshow was but a million. I'd have had to donate $50,000 to participate similarly - and I can't afford to get anywhere near the current legal limit as it is. What a nice way for us little people to feel part of the whole process. The Bachmans of the world create little political kiddie pools, so everybody can have fun!


>And if you think what she said was horrible, well then, you ain't seen nothing yet.

"Horrible"'s a pretty wide bucket. Chinese abuse of intellectual property law is horrible. The Holocaust was horrible. The first few minutes after waking from surgery is often kind of horrible.
So, where, Nobody, do you think people are going? Who's going to step up to the plate now? What will no longer be sacred? What will we see? More particularly, is there a particular political show to watch for it???
I can't wait. I've always had this, I dunno, this thing for moral failure. I can't get enough. It's like cinnamon scent drifting from a bakery to me. Way back in 2001 - remember summer of 2001? Remember? So long ago. Bill Clinton was telling Gary Condit, "Hell, Gary, at least when I was done with them they were still breathing!" Life seemed so simple then, but also so safe, almost boring. The entertainment value of politics has become so concentrated, it's like tasting the snaps on a 9V battery. Like they used to answer about why they listened to the Howard Stern show, "I want to see what he'll say next!"

[The Second Stone]

Americans love being able to be righteously outraged. It brings an intoxicating sense of being right while others are wrong. It reinforces beliefs, gives a sense of power, and is almost addictive.

And it is a great motivator.

The Civil Rights movement used it very effectively to finally institute changes in segregated South. Dozens of preachers became mega-millionaires playing it up for the "Moral Majority". And the Republican party has wielded it to increase fundraising for decades. Now it appears that the Democrats are finally catching up.

Sure using righteous indignation politically leads to divisiveness, unwillingness to compromise, and a breakdown of honest debate and discussion. Which, as we've seen over the last 3 elections, is having dire consequences for political discourse in our country.

Well Obama uses wrongeous dignation, so there. Frankly, I'm not unhappy that people are calling Bachman and her fellow travellers on their divisive bullshit.

[Shayna]

Look, Bachman was simply taking care of business. And if you think what she said was horrible, well then, you ain't seen nothing yet. Indeed. Tom Harkin's opponent actually called him "the Tokyo Rose of Al Qaida", and then some. http://iowaindependent.com/7444/reed-calls-harkin-tokyo-rose-of-al-qaida

Republican Senate candidate Christopher Reed called incumbent Democrat Tom Harkin “Tokyo Rose” and “anti-American” because he provides “aid and comfort to the enemy.”

The statement came during a debate aired on Iowa Public Television and moderated by the Des Moines Register columnist David Yepsen.

“We’re taking advice from somebody who has an eight-year history of becoming the Tokyo Rose of Al-Qaida and Middle East terrorism,” said Reed, a political newcomer from Marion.

Yepsen asked what Reed meant by the term “Tokyo Rose.”

“Providing aid and comfort to the enemy,” Reed said, later adding Harkin has sided with the enemies of the United States.

. . . This year's crop of Republicans is particularly vile.

[kaylasdad99]

If it makes you feel any better, Nobody, I saw what you did there.

:)

Maybe the next step for Bachman is going to be using quotes from The Turner Diaries to support her positions.

[Biffy the Elephant Shrew]

Jean Schmidt (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jean_Schmidt)

The only congressperson on my blocked email list! I have no idea why I was getting emails from her; I've never even been to her state.

[Nobody]

If it makes you feel any better, Nobody, I saw what you did there.

:)

Maybe the next step for Bachman is going to be using quotes from The Turner Diaries to support her positions.
Maybe that'll kick things into overdrive.

[C K Dexter Haven]

Americans love being able to be righteously outraged. It brings an intoxicating sense of being right while others are wrong. It reinforces beliefs, gives a sense of power, and is almost addictive.

And it is a great motivator. Oh, it's not just Americans. Remember the huge to-do within the Muslim world following the Danish cartoons depicting Mohammaed? Happens in other countries as well, although no examples immediately come to mind.

[DanBlather]

Oh, it's not just Americans. Remember the huge to-do within the Muslim world following the Danish cartoons depicting Mohammaed? Happens in other countries as well, although no examples immediately come to mind.Try refering to a Scotsman as English.

[DanBlather]

"Horrible"'s a pretty wide bucket. Chinese abuse of intellectual property law is horrible. The Holocaust was horrible. The first few minutes after waking from surgery is often kind of horrible.
So, where, Nobody, do you think people are going? Who's going to step up to the plate now? What will no longer be sacred? What will we see? More particularly, is there a particular political show to watch for it???
I can't wait. I've always had this, I dunno, this thing for moral failure. I can't get enough. It's like cinnamon scent drifting from a bakery to me. Way back in 2001 - remember summer of 2001? Remember? So long ago. Bill Clinton was telling Gary Condit, "Hell, Gary, at least when I was done with them they were still breathing!" Life seemed so simple then, but also so safe, almost boring. The entertainment value of politics has become so concentrated, it's like tasting the snaps on a 9V battery. Do you write for a living? 'Cause you should.

[drastic_quench]

I think you've hit on the one huge change in society that's going to make bullshit-as-usual politics difficult from here on out. Having a resource that removes the average bullshitter politician's ability to wave his/her hands and make the quote go away is absolutely delicious.
"These aren't the lunatic remarks you're looking for."