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Northern Piper
01-19-2009, 12:06 AM
So I would like to be able to sng the first verse of Ar Hyd y Nos (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ar_Hyd_y_Nos):

Holl amrantau'r sr ddywedant
Ar hyd y nos
Dyma'r ffordd i fro gogoniant
Ar hyd y nos.
Golau arall yw tywyllwch
I arddangos gwir prydferthwch
Teulu'r nefoedd mewn tawelwch
Ar hyd y nos.

Can any Welsh speaking Dopers help me with a phoenetic pronunciation? I've fornd a few Youtubes of people singing in the song but it goes by too fast for me.

Thanks!

Northern Piper
01-19-2009, 12:16 AM
and if I can't learn to sng it, at the very least I'd like to be able to sing it... :smack:

Cat Jones
01-19-2009, 12:40 AM
Don't have time right now but I'll PM you later

Cat Jones
01-19-2009, 12:31 PM
PM sent - try this lass, native Welsh speaker for a model Meinir Gwilym (http://fr.youtube.com/watch?v=RMS5eyfzKzk).

fandango
01-19-2009, 02:16 PM
So I would like to be able to sng the first verse of Ar Hyd y Nos (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ar_Hyd_y_Nos):

Holl amrantau'r sr ddywedant
Ar hyd y nos
Dyma'r ffordd i fro gogoniant
Ar hyd y nos.
Golau arall yw tywyllwch
I arddangos gwir prydferthwch
Teulu'r nefoedd mewn tawelwch
Ar hyd y nos.

Can any Welsh speaking Dopers help me with a phoenetic pronunciation? I've fornd a few Youtubes of people singing in the song but it goes by too fast for me.

Thanks!

Okay, I'll give it a shot, but I need to provide a key:
You know how to pronounce the Welsh double-L, right?
OK then.
Key :
LL = welsh double-L
DH = th in "this"
TH = th in "thin"
CH = ch in Scottish "loch"

HoLL amrantai'r saer DHywedant
Ar hud uh nos
Dumar forDH i vro gogoniant
Ar hud uh nos.
Golai araLL ew tywyLLwCH
I arDHangos gwir prudverTHooCH
Taileer nevoeDH mewn tawelooCH
Ar hud uh nos.

Dr. Drake
01-19-2009, 02:38 PM
Holl amrantau'r sr ddywedant
Ar hyd y nos
Dyma'r ffordd i fro gogoniant
Ar hyd y nos.
Golau arall yw tywyllwch
I arddangos gwir prydferthwch
Teulu'r nefoedd mewn tawelwch
Ar hyd y nos.I, too, have pm'd, but just to add my 2:

Ar hyd y nos: the two [y]s are different. "Are heed uh nohss" would be closer, with rolled [r]s.
Dummar forthe i vroh go-ghn-yant
Glay araLL iw tuh whLL ookh: this is harder. "Yw" is a diphthong, like "it'll do" without any of the consonants: i-oo, in one sound.
ee ar thn gohss gweer pruhd vrth ookh
ty leer nv oythe mewn tau l ookhThe [ew] is another diphthong, like "Ex Foo" without the consonants. "Oedd" has the voiced (soft) th, as in English than.

Final [h]s to indicate long English vowels, not a /h/ sound.

Annie-Xmas
01-19-2009, 02:52 PM
Might one of your nice Welsh People provide an English translation?

yabob
01-19-2009, 02:55 PM
The quoted wiki article has a translation.

Annie-Xmas
01-19-2009, 02:59 PM
I meant a literal English translation. I doubt that both the English and Welsh versions used to sing the song just coincidentally happen to rhyme.

Dr. Drake
01-19-2009, 03:10 PM
The quoted wiki article has a translation.That's not a translation, it's merely the English version. A more literal translation of the verse quoted (done rather on the fly, I'm afraid) would be:

Holl amrantau'r sr ddywedant
All the twinkling stars* are saying
Ar hyd y nos
All night long
Dyma'r ffordd i fro gogoniant
Here's the road to the land of glory
Ar hyd y nos.
All night long
Golau arall yw tywyllwch
Darkness is another light
I arddangos gwir prydferthwch
To exhibit true beauty
Teulu'r nefoedd mewn tawelwch**
The family of the heavens (Heavenly family?) in the quiet
Ar hyd y nos.
All night long.

*Still more literally this is "stars' eyelids," but the word for "eyelid" has given words for "doze" and "twinkle," so you'll forgive the poetic license here.
** Lit., "in a quietude," but that doesn't work in English.

A lot of Welsh hymns have English versions whose lyrics are loose verse adaptations rather than direct translations, standard practice for Victorian hymn translators.

Dr. Drake
01-19-2009, 03:16 PM
Incidentally, Wikipedia has a typo: prydferthwch should undergo soft mutation if it follows its adjective, so it should be gwir brydferthwch and pronounced accordingly. A quick google search on both confirms: i arddangos gwir brydferthwch 353 hits, i arddangos gwir prydferthwch only 3 including Wikipedia.

chique
01-20-2009, 08:34 AM
Would any of you nice Welsh speakers like to provide a phonetic translation in the thread instead of via PM? I have no idea how to pronounce fandango's "tywyLLwCH".

Cat Jones
01-20-2009, 03:52 PM
tuwuLLooch - to make the LL curl your tongue up so the underside of the tip touches the roo of your mouth and send the air out either side of your tongue.

THe rest of fandango's post seems straight forward - altho' for musical/dramatic purposes the title, refrain is closer to "Are heed uh norse" - remember the "o" sounds are like "top".