Muslims in space

[Sapo]

Of the observant variety, of course. Not just nominal muslims.

Have there been any? How could you handle the requirements of prayer during a mission? Aiming at Mecca is easy. A gyroscope will tell you the way and you can float, so it doesn't matter that the floor is not on the right plane. Are LEO runs fast enough that keeping aim would be an issue? (I presume that on a Moon or Mars mission, just aiming at Earth is close enough)

What I think is the important issue is the timing. Can you build a mission schedule around all the breaks that would be needed for prayer? Can you be excused from prayer for something as pressing as a mission critical EVA? Is there wiggle room in time for prayer?

Diet is, I presume, a non-issue.

(and I have a nagging feeling that we have done this one before, btw. If so, links would be appreciated)

[Captain Amazing]

This might help:

http://www.unholylegacy.woerlee.org/images/review-islam-space.pdf

Here's the booklet:

http://www.scribd.com/doc/6652891/A-Guideline-Ibadah-at-Iss

[Dog80]

Am I the only one who finds this combination of leading edge technology and religious superstition weird? :dubious:

[Exapno Mapcase]

Conference on the subject (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Qibla).

Link taken from this previous thread (http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=446675).

Other previous threads.

Can Islam survive in space? (http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=436983)

Colonizing Space and Islam (http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=171597)

[Sapo]

Thanks for the links.

Am I the only one who finds this combination of leading edge technology and religious superstition weird? :dubious:

Maybe not the only one but finding it weird is far from consensus according to sci-fi at least. The idea of spacefaring muslims is rather common.

And if you think about it, it won't be long until the ESA and all its progress is inherited by the growing muslim community in Europe. It is bound to happen.

[Sapo]

Ok, after reading all the jokes about pointing towards Mecca, which is a problem of trivial solution, I guess the answer is that for current astronauts, they fall under the category of travellers and are dispensed from the fasting and prayer duties until their return, right?

[billfish678]

Ok, after reading all the jokes about pointing towards Mecca, which is a problem of trivial solution, I guess the answer is that for current astronauts, they fall under the category of travellers and are dispensed from the fasting and prayer duties until their return, right?


Just wait until you throw in the problems of time dilation and parallel universes.

At least the "Pigggggssss innnn Sppppaaaaace!" crew will be safe from space based cannibalism.

[griffin1977]

Apparently have been three including a Saudi prince (http://www.saudiaramcoworld.com/issue/198601/a.prince.in.space.htm) and most recently a Malaysian (http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/world/asia/article1728698.ece). Both those links say they did pray (and fast for Ramadan), but doesn't say how exactly.

[Magiver]

There's going to be an incident when they meat up with the Muppets (http://muppet.wikia.com/wiki/Pigs_in_Space).

[Captain Amazing]

Ok, after reading all the jokes about pointing towards Mecca, which is a problem of trivial solution, I guess the answer is that for current astronauts, they fall under the category of travellers and are dispensed from the fasting and prayer duties until their return, right?

Read the booklet.

http://www.scribd.com/doc/6652891/A-Guideline-Ibadah-at-Iss

[Exapno Mapcase]

Maybe not the only one but finding it weird is far from consensus according to sci-fi at least.

What in the world, or off of it, does this have to do with reality? Most sci-fi is by idiots and for idiots.

[Science fiction writer speaking]

[Sapo]

What in the world, or off of it, does this have to do with reality? Most sci-fi is by idiots and for idiots.

[Science fiction writer speaking]

Just saying that the idea is not so far out that nobody has thought of it.

[Sapo]

Read the booklet.

http://www.scribd.com/doc/6652891/A-Guideline-Ibadah-at-Iss

Very interesting. So if I understood correctly, they can satisfy their requirements for prayer in a single shortened session with no need to later make up for the "lost" prayer. Is that correct?

[Sapo]

Apparently have been three including a Saudi prince (http://www.saudiaramcoworld.com/issue/198601/a.prince.in.space.htm) and most recently a Malaysian (http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/world/asia/article1728698.ece). Both those links say they did pray (and fast for Ramadan), but doesn't say how exactly.

Shame on the Saudi Prince for hogging all the firsts. First Arab, first muslim and first royalty. That's just showing off.

[AK84]

Its an elementary rule that if you are travelling, or on military operations, or at any job where your presence is critical, you are exempted from fasting or prayer.

Submariners in the Pakistan Navy for instance don't usually know where they are (except for the captain and a couple of officers), not to matter, they are exempt.

[Ponderoid]

Am I the only one who finds this combination of leading edge technology and religious superstition weird? :dubious:

No, but there's been precedent (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apollo_8_Genesis_Reading).

*** Ponder

[Malacandra]

What in the world, or off of it, does this have to do with reality? Most sci-fi is by idiots and for idiots.

[Science fiction writer speaking]

You'd better tell the shade of Heinlein then, over "Stinky" Mahmoud in Stranger in a Strange Land for a start. Swing by Niven and Pournelle on your way back and you can discuss Horace Bury in The Mote In God's Eye into the bargain. Them's some fairly heavyweight idiots.

[Exapno Mapcase]

You'd better tell the shade of Heinlein then, over "Stinky" Mahmoud in Stranger in a Strange Land for a start. Swing by Niven and Pournelle on your way back and you can discuss Horace Bury in The Mote In God's Eye into the bargain. Them's some fairly heavyweight idiots.

I read it wrong. I thought Sapo agreed that it was found weird in "sci-fi." He didn't, so I apologize.

Of course, I consider "sci-fi" to be movies and comic books and the like, not mainstream print authors, and I stand by my statement there.

[Early Out]

Every time I see this thread title, I can't help but think of this: Jews in Space (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-_jLnrUXJNM&NR=1). :D

[Sage Rat]

Am I the only one who finds this combination of leading edge technology and religious superstition weird? :dubious:
Supposedly, algebra was invented specifically to solve the problem of calculating the direction to face to pray to Mecca. In a way it would just be coming full circle.

[Wendell Wagner]

I don't see any mention of calculating the direction to Mecca:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Algebra

Do you have a citation for that?

[Magiver]

If you're facing Mecca, doesn't that also mean you're mooning Mecca since it's widely accepted that the Earth is a sphere?

[Sage Rat]

I don't see any mention of calculating the direction to Mecca:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Algebra

Do you have a citation for that?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Islamic_mathematics#Islam_and_mathematics

Of course a decent argument could be made that the Islamic Golden Age was simply due to the introduction of cheap paper and anyplace with that is going to advance all sciences fairly well.

[Malacandra]

I read it wrong. I thought Sapo agreed that it was found weird in "sci-fi." He didn't, so I apologize.

Of course, I consider "sci-fi" to be movies and comic books and the like, not mainstream print authors, and I stand by my statement there.

Fair enough - you're drawing a line between science fiction and "sci-fi", and I understand the distinction, and would put the authors mentioned above on the same side of the line as you do. :)

Supposedly, algebra was invented specifically to solve the problem of calculating the direction to face to pray to Mecca. In a way it would just be coming full circle.

Yeah. Easy as p.

[Sapo]

If you're facing Mecca, doesn't that also mean you're mooning Mecca since it's widely accepted that the Earth is a sphere?

Unless you are exactly opposite Mecca on the globe, you are always more facing than mooning so the mooning gets canceled out. Plus there is the matter of intention.

[Sapo]

I read it wrong. I thought Sapo agreed that it was found weird in "sci-fi." He didn't, so I apologize.

Of course, I consider "sci-fi" to be movies and comic books and the like, not mainstream print authors, and I stand by my statement there.

Ok. Although by sci-fi I did mean the heavey hitters of print. In fact, this thread was inspired by just having read "Halo" by Charles Stross. Maybe not a heavy hitter yet, but well on his way there if I go by what little I have read of him.

Has there been any mention of muslims in space on pop sci-fi (movies, tv, comics, etc)?

[Wendell Wagner]

Maybe, Sage Rat, but I find that a little strained. The argument appears to be that mathematics advanced during the time of medieval Islam because it was necessary for the calculation of various Islamic ceremonis. Maybe it went the other way. Because the math had been developed, it was possible for the Islamic-related calculations to be made. It's hard to say what influenced what in such periods.

[Malleus, Incus, Stapes!]

I guess Muslims in space would have similar problems to Jews in space.

I once wrote to a rabbi, asking a bunch of questions about observing Judaism in space. I remember him saying that in space you pray towards earth in general, and that you pray according to the clocks on the spaceship. I don't think I got an answer to "What arm would a four-armed Martian use to put on tefillin?", though.