Nude swimming lessons at the Y?!

[tarragon918]

Apparently, swimming lessons were given at the YMCA - back in the day - with both instructor(s) and class in the nude. I don't know why they wouldn't wear bathing suits. It seems very strange to me, and I hope that doesn't brand me as prudish or anything - it just seems strange.

Anyone have any experience with this, or could confirm it? One of my brothers did confirm that nude swims were par at the YMCA, of course not when they were open for family swim or for women/girls to be there. Heh.

Color me ... confused is probably the closest.

[Beware of Doug]

Males used to have to conform to certain Spartan ideals regarding exercise. This was one.

[Shagnasty]

Young man, there's a place you can go.
I said, young man, when you're short on your dough.
You can stay there, and I'm sure you will find
Many ways to have a good time.

It's fun to stay at the Y-M-C-A.
It's fun to stay at the Y-M-C-A.

They have everything that you need to enjoy,
You can hang out with all the boys ...

[CalMeacham]

We've had discussions about nude swimming classes at high schools as well as the Y on this Board before, and people havve substantiated it with cites. It surprises me -- we always used suits at our Y, and I'd never seen pictures of nude swimming before, or heard of it.

Actually, the idea of high school swimming is pretty cool, and goes back quite a ways in many towns. I would've killed to have it n our school. Nude or not.

[IvoryTowerDenizen]

Funny, we were just talking about this today at my great-nieces bday party. (weird, huh?). My BIL did this in college swimming back in the early 70s. He was taking lifeguard lessons and they all had to swim nude!

[alphaboi867]

Schools used to do it too. It simply wasn't though necessary for males to wear bathing suits when no females were present. Women & girls were supposed to be modest, men & boys weren't supposed to give a damn if someone saw them naked. There were hygienic reasons as well; swimsuits used to be made of wool and pool filters couldn't handle that. No dealing with wet suits left in lockers or people wearing dirty suits in the pool. Pre-pool showering used to be enforced more as well. According to my father nobody (boys, teachers, or parents) thought it was a big deal.

[Philster]

Yep. Saw it in the early 70's. It was just normal. No fibers for the pool filter from the older/basic natural-fiber material, and there were no plastic shopping bags to throw your wet stuff into....and no Rubbermain containers!

I heard it was done in all boys schools just for the reasons above, too.

[astro]

Apparently, swimming lessons were given at the YMCA - back in the day - with both instructor(s) and class in the nude. I don't know why they wouldn't wear bathing suits. It seems very strange to me, and I hope that doesn't brand me as prudish or anything - it just seems strange.

Anyone have any experience with this, or could confirm it? One of my brothers did confirm that nude swims were par at the YMCA, of course not when they were open for family swim or for women/girls to be there. Heh.

Color me ... confused is probably the closest.

In most non-competitive indoor swimming scenarios the only practical reason for wearing a suit is that women might see you. In non-female environments why bother?

[Captain Carrot]

I don't particularly want anybody seeing me naked.

[Manda JO]

I don't particularly want anybody seeing me naked.

Social attitudes about male nudity have become increasingly restrictive over the last 50 years: look at how shorts have gotten longer, for example. Also, you rarely see men in public--even in their front yards--without a shirt. I noticed a few years back that people that play pick-up games like Ultimate now carry 2 shirts with them, a dark and a light, for when they divide into teams. Just a decade ago, it was more likely to be "shirts" vs. "skins".

[panache45]

We had mandatory nude swimming in high school (early 60s). Only the boys; girls had a different pool and wore suits & caps.

[panache45]

Actually, the idea of high school swimming is pretty cool, and goes back quite a ways in many towns. I would've killed to have it n our school. Nude or not.
Each semester we had swimming every day for 6 weeks. It was mandatory, and you couldn't graduate if you didn't know how to swim.

[tarragon918]

My HS didn't have a pool and therefore no swimming; we only belonged to the Y for a short time (jr. high years for me). It's funny that one brother remembers the nude swims and the other brother doesn't--both of them (they're 11 months apart in age) took lessons together, at the same Y.

I've since read on other forums (a link provided me by one of my brothers) about gym classes held in the nude - instructor also nude. Okay, that is beyond the border in my book. Especially if it's an all-boy school. Good Og!

[CalMeacham]

Each semester we had swimming every day for 6 weeks. It was mandatory, and you couldn't graduate if you didn't know how to swim.


We had the same thing at MIT.



But the closest institutional pool to my high school was miles away.

[Kimmy_Gibbler]

I've since read on other forums (a link provided me by one of my brothers) about gym classes held in the nude - instructor also nude. Okay, that is beyond the border in my book. Especially if it's an all-boy school. Good Og!

Why? Because it'll devolve into an aquatic fuckfest? Because it'll turn them into fags?

You say you don't want to come off as prudish, but then you say such silly, silly things like this.

[Johnny L.A.]

I was going to ask about the YWCA, but it was addressed in post #6.

But I'd still like to have a box lunch at the Y.

[tarragon918]

Why? Because it'll devolve into an aquatic fuckfest? Because it'll turn them into fags?

You say you don't want to come off as prudish, but then you say such silly, silly things like this.

I just don't see any reason why a PE class would need to be taught in the nude ... to students also nude. That is why it is beyond the border, imnsho apparently. A teacher is also a person of authority, which can be used the wrong way.

I'll grant that my idea of modesty probably differs from others--but nude gym class is beyond a modesty issue with me. LOL

[sunstone]

Nude swimming for males sure was the norm at the Y in my youth. There was no stigma or thoughts that it would lead to any sort of heightened sexuality.

Actually, I prefer to swim nude. It increases the feeling of freedom that swimming and paddling around gives in the first place. Good thing for the neighbors that my backyard has high fences.

[Walloon]

A nude gym class sounds painful — too much flippy floppy, you know?

[Justin_Bailey]

Why? Because it'll devolve into an aquatic fuckfest? Because it'll turn them into fags?

You say you don't want to come off as prudish, but then you say such silly, silly things like this.

Dial back the crazy just a little bit. Why would asking about nude swimming at the Y (which is seen as very irregular today) be seen as prudish? I'd say anyone born in the last 40 years would have no idea such a thing ever occured and being dumbfounded at students forced to take a swim class in the nude... taught by nude teachers... is a pretty understandable reaction.

[Walloon]

Nude swimming was the norm for men and boys for thousands of years. The men's swimsuit wasn't invented until the 19th century, but even then was used only when swimming in mixed company. It has only been since the 1960s that swimsuit wearing has predominated in even all-male settings.

[Markxxx]

Yeah I've heard of it into the 70s. We didn't have a pool at our school but others did this.

But then again we had to take showers at school (that's another thread)

I think it was somewhat more common to swim naked in outdoor areas, like lakes, so this was seen as an extention. You always here jokes on TV shows from the 50s and 60s where guys swim with no suits. So it was there.

I think part of it is also guys will dare each other. I recall when I was the night manager at a hotel, we had a pool outside and I got there at 10:30pm and I pick up the phone and a near hysterical woman is yelling "AH, there's naked men in the pool." I'm like "great way to start my shift."

So I go down to the pool and there are 4 BOYS about 10 years old and I they're in the water and I'm like "Are you naked in there." They're half smiling and say "No," I reply, "then why are you're swimsuits on the chairs."

I smiled at them and told them to put their trunks on if they want to swim at the pool.

Now you just know one of the boys dared the others to swim naked. So you know guys even young ones will do this.

[panache45]

For the record: our swimming teacher was not nude, just the kids. Except once, when he had trouble explaining how to do something, so he just stripped and dove in.

[alphaboi867]

A nude gym class sounds painful — too much flippy floppy, you know?

Only swimming lessons were in the nude. It's not schools used to have boys playing basketball or wrestling naked (now that's homoerotic).

[Kalhoun]

Schools used to do it too. It simply wasn't though necessary for males to wear bathing suits when no females were present. Women & girls were supposed to be modest, men & boys weren't supposed to give a damn if someone saw them naked. There were hygienic reasons as well; swimsuits used to be made of wool and pool filters couldn't handle that. No dealing with wet suits left in lockers or people wearing dirty suits in the pool. Pre-pool showering used to be enforced more as well. According to my father nobody (boys, teachers, or parents) thought it was a big deal.

My dad said they did the nekkid swimming at Lane Tech high school back in the 40s. That's just how it was done.

[Freudian Slit]

Why? Because it'll devolve into an aquatic fuckfest? Because it'll turn them into fags?

You say you don't want to come off as prudish, but then you say such silly, silly things like this.

Well, is it prudish to think it's weird for women to also be nude for swimming? if so, what's the difference, now that we're culturally enlightened enough to know that the whole women are more modest thing is bunk?

[Kimmy_Gibbler]

Well, is it prudish to think it's weird for women to also be nude for swimming? if so, what's the difference, now that we're culturally enlightened enough to know that the whole women are more modest thing is bunk?

If the ladies want to swim naked, more power to them, I say.

To the poster who asked me to "dial back the crazy": I'm sorry, but I just don't think that nude swimming classes, or naked people in general, are that wacky or potentially harmful ... no matter how many ominous italics and ellipses you use.

[joebuck20]

Howabout if you got an erection? (You know everyone here is wondering about that, but afraid to ask)

[runner pat]

Howabout if you got an erection? (You know everyone here is wondering about that, but afraid to ask)

I think the unheated pool would at least reduce that problem.

[Freudian Slit]

If the ladies want to swim naked, more power to them, I say.


Okay. I guess I don't think swimming nude is awful. Just...odd, I s'pose.

Howabout if you got an erection? (You know everyone here is wondering about that, but afraid to ask)

Or...SHRINKAGE?!

[glee]

I went to an English State School (all boys) from 1964-1972.
We wore swimming trunks (and would have been astonished and embarrassed if it were otherwise).

[RealityChuck]

Or...SHRINKAGE?!Men didn't look at other men's penises. To do so would get you called a faggot. You were supposed to look elsewhere.

[Walloon]

Only swimming lessons were in the nude. It's not schools used to have boys playing basketball or wrestling naked (now that's homoerotic).See post #13 above.

[Le Ministre de l'au-delà]

Howabout if you got an erection? (You know everyone here is wondering about that, but afraid to ask)


In sailing, it's called a Keel.

[Voyager]

We had the same thing at MIT.

Very common. And absurd. At MIT my friend, who was on the fencing team and far more athletic than I am, had big problems with the swimming test.

This goes way back also. My mother-in-law, who went to college in the mid '30s, never did learn how to swim. To let her pass the test they eventually let her do the laps holding on to a stick, to let the coach drag her across the pool.

In a rare "post is my cite" I swam nude at the Y in 1958 or 1959. I certainly don't remember the instructor being nude. The last day the parents were supposed to show up to watch us - I got conveniently sick. I don't know if we'd have been allowed to wear swimming suits then.

[dragonlady]

My parents went to the same high school that I did, (not at the same time as I did, you wags!)
Both of them tell of nude male swimming in the mid 50's. I never thought to ask about the teacher. My Mom said the girls dance studio windows were painted black because they overlooked the pool and in the mid 70's they still were. Both black and overlooking the pool.
So it lends a certain reasonableness, since why else would you paint out perfectly good windows?

[Justin_Bailey]

To the poster who asked me to "dial back the crazy": I'm sorry, but I just don't think that nude swimming classes, or naked people in general, are that wacky or potentially harmful ... no matter how many ominous italics and ellipses you use.

Do you really not understand why someone born in the last 40 years would think nude high school swimming is weird? And why it doesn't have anything to do with homophobia or prudishness?

[Kimmy_Gibbler]

Do you really not understand why someone born in the last 40 years would think nude high school swimming is weird? And why it doesn't have anything to do with homophobia or prudishness?

Read for comprehension, JB: No, I don't.

[Justin_Bailey]

Read for comprehension, JB: No, I don't.

Then calling you out of touch is an understatement.

[Freudian Slit]

Read for comprehension, JB: No, I don't.

But nothing else is done naked. Why swimming?

[Kimmy_Gibbler]

But nothing else is done naked. Why swimming?

I don't understand why you seem to think that swimming attire and other attire should necessarily be equated. Moreover, I doubt that if like the Greek of yore, our gymnasiums (get it?) were redoubts of nudity, that would relieve your qualms. (Well, actually, if this were the conventional practice, I think you wouldn't have qualms, just Amazonian tribesmen can look at a bare-breasted matron without batting an eye. However, were we to switch to this now and overnight, I don't think you would say, "At last, consistency!")

Considering that nudity is the default attire of human beings, does there really need to be elaborate justifications? I think a lot of this comes down to "I don't want people to see me naked" which I think originates in prudishness. But I'm told that it doesn't, so do enlighten me.

[DMark]

I went to a rather large public high school in Illinois in the late 60's and guys swam nude for their swimming classes, but the girls got a generic swim suit that they more or less "shared" (each class had the girls just grab one out of the pile).

The rationale back then was they didn't want stinking swim suits hanging in the few lockers they had, and what was the big deal about it?

Yes, it was odd...and people still don't believe me when I tell them all of our swim classes were in the nude. And in Illinois, let me tell ya you NEVER wanted to be stuck in the first 8:30 AM swimming class...that water was freezing and everybody's pee pee was about the size of a pea.

I also remember the infamous day when the school bells weren't working and the girls swim class came marching in as the boys were still in the pool.

One other memorable moment was when one of the, uh, rather well endowed guys in my swim class got an erection. Coach made him stand on the diving board until it went down...but this guy seemed to like the attention and when coach wasn't looking, was actually giving himself a few strokes...the rest of us were laughing hysterically...ah, good times, good times.

I heard they only changed this policy in the 80's when they build additional lockers near the pool area. Plus they put in dryers to throw your swimsuits and towels in when you are done.

[Freudian Slit]

I don't understand why you seem to think that swimming attire and other attire should necessarily be equated. Moreover, I doubt that if like the Greek of yore, our gymnasiums (get it?) were redoubts of nudity, that would relieve your qualms. (Well, actually, if this were the conventional practice, I think you wouldn't have qualms, just Amazonian tribesmen can look at a bare-breasted matron without batting an eye. However, were we to switch to this now and overnight, I don't think you would say, "At last, consistency!")

Well, we do everything else in clothes. Why not go to the movies or ball games nude?

DMark, I think sharing a swimsuit with another girl might skeeve me even more. Ugh. Can anyone say yeast infection?

[Walloon]

"Skeeve"?

[Justin_Bailey]

Considering that nudity is the default attire of human beings, does there really need to be elaborate justifications? I think a lot of this comes down to "I don't want people to see me naked" which I think originates in prudishness. But I'm told that it doesn't, so do enlighten me.

Nudity is not the default attire of human beings, it's the initial attire of human beings. It's a slight, but very important, difference.

As for I think this is weird, it would be because it was never done when I was in high school (in the late 90s). They didn't even require us to shower after gym (and no one wanted to anyway because no one worked up that much of a sweat in gym class).

Beyond that, gym class has always been co-ed. From when I was a wee lad all the way up to my graduating year. Having segregated gym class seems almost quaint to me, and more than a little old fashioned.

[Walloon]

You had co-ed gym classes in high school? We had boys gym classes from 7th through 12th grade. Did your high school have co-ed basketball and soccer teams? No? Well, that sounds more than little old fashioned to me…

[Kimmy_Gibbler]

Well, we do everything else in clothes. Why not go to the movies or ball games nude?

Gosh! I guess your computer must have redacted the first sentence of my post that you're responding to.

[Freudian Slit]

Gosh! I guess your computer must have redacted the first sentence of my post that you're responding to.

Well, why IS swimming attire different from other attire?

[Justin_Bailey]

You had co-ed gym classes in high school? We had boys gym classes from 7th through 12th grade. Did your high school have co-ed basketball and soccer teams? No? Well, that sounds more than little old fashioned to me…

Cute. And completely misses the point of why naked swimming doesn't happen anymore in gym class.

[Kimmy_Gibbler]

Well, why IS swimming attire different from other attire?

Well, for starters, swimming costumes get sopping wet whereas other activities don't saturate them as much. I suppose chemicals and fibers might be imported into the pool in an undesirable way; again, this isn't a concern in other contexts.

Why go butt booty nekkid in the shower? Why not wear shower shorts, a la JD from Scrubs? I've read posts asserting that it's "weird" for people to be unclothed in a locker room. Do you think so?

I guess I just don't subscribe to this body ressentiment and corresponding slave morality, to get Nietzschean about it.

[cjepson]

I don't understand why you seem to think that swimming attire and other attire should necessarily be equated. Moreover, I doubt that if like the Greek of yore, our gymnasiums (get it?) were redoubts of nudity, that would relieve your qualms. (Well, actually, if this were the conventional practice, I think you wouldn't have qualms, just Amazonian tribesmen can look at a bare-breasted matron without batting an eye. However, were we to switch to this now and overnight, I don't think you would say, "At last, consistency!")

Considering that nudity is the default attire of human beings, does there really need to be elaborate justifications? I think a lot of this comes down to "I don't want people to see me naked" which I think originates in prudishness. But I'm told that it doesn't, so do enlighten me.

From the OP, what we're talking about is nude adult males teaching swimming to nude juvenile males. If I understand correctly, you said (post #38) you can't understand why anyone would find that strange. For my part, I can't imagine anywhere in the US, at any rate, where that prospect wouldn't foam the brains of some parents these days.

[Kimmy_Gibbler]

From the OP, what we're talking about is nude adult males teaching swimming to nude juvenile males. If I understand correctly, you're saying you can't understand why anyone would find that strange. For my part, I can't imagine anywhere in the US, at any rate, where that prospect wouldn't foam the brains of some parents these days.

I don't doubt that some people would react that way. It is a pretty big leap from knowing that to understanding why they freak out about it. Look, I knew that Janet Jackson's boob debacle in the Superbowl would cause a shitshow, but I sure don't understand why it did.

[tarragon918]

What was freaking me out was the possibility of pedophilia, which has nothing to do with someone being gay. If there are some who don't see a concern with that, then chalk it up to a simply a difference in opinion. I am allowed to think that it is odd, and leave it at that.

FTR, I'm going on 57, so have been around the block for a while, but had never heard of nude swimming lessons/nude swims at the Y, nor nude gym classes. I do not recall anything like that happening with girls classes/lessons.

[cuberdon]

Well, my Dad went to college in the early 1960's in Ohio, and for one of his compulsory PE classes he took swimming, for which they (all men, I'm pretty sure) did not wear suits.

Fencing and bowling though, they were dressed.

[cwthree]

Why go butt booty nekkid in the shower? Why not wear shower shorts, a la JD from Scrubs?Heck, I'll give you an even older example. My dad was in the Navy in the late 1960's. On one of his assignments, his ship hosted a contingent of Pakistani sailors. Dad was surprised to discover that they did not shower nude, but instead, being Muslim, wore shorts to cover themselves even in the shower.

[Kimmy_Gibbler]

Heck, I'll give you an even older example. My dad was in the Navy in the late 1960's. On one of his assignments, his ship hosted a contingent of Pakistani sailors. Dad was surprised to discover that they did not shower nude, but instead, being Muslim, wore shorts to cover themselves even in the shower.

And we make fun of Scientology.

[Colibri]

I went to Cornell from 1969-1973. You had to pass the swim test in order to graduate, so since I didn't know how to swim very well I had to take the class my freshman year for PE. The classes were held in the nude, although the instructor wore a swimsuit. I think you were allowed to wear a suit if you wanted to, but nobody in my class did. Suits were also optional during the men's swimming hours at the Men's Gym. (There were times for mixed swimming when everyone of course wore a suit.)

In the women's swim classes, they had to wear one-piece tank suits issued by the school, which all the women hated. This being the beginning of Women's Lib, about 1972 some of the more radical feminists, my girl friend among them, decided to "liberate" the pool in the Women's Gym by storming the pool naked.

My girl friend tipped me off when it was going to be, so I stationed myself by one of the big windows on the second floor of the Women's Gym to watch the revolution unfold. (I had some PE classes there, since the Women's Gym had facilities that the Men's Gym didn't.)

At the appointed time, I heard a huge hubbub in the direction of the locker room, and all the women in the pool jumped out and looked toward the doors. A couple of the life guards had seen the troop of naked women coming down the corridor and blocked them before they made it to the pool. What a disappointment!:D

I don't think that the women ever did get the right to swim naked in their pool, most likely because of those big windows on the second floor.

[bit24sh0cker]

I don't particularly want anybody seeing me naked.

Ditto on that. I think if this were the "norm" I'd never be in a pool again!

[Walloon]

Well, we do everything else in clothes. Why not go to the movies or ball games nude?The nude swimming that we are talking about here was always done in same-sex contexts. Going to the movies or ball games are mixed-sex events.

[Walloon]

Okay. I guess I don't think swimming nude is awful. Just...odd, I s'pose.Once you've swam in the nude, you'll never think it odd again. It feels lovely.

[Olentzero]

Just to add to the mix illustrating social attitudes toward nudity, my apartment here in Stockholm looks out towards the schoolyard of the preschool where my stepsons go. Yesterday was a scorcher of a gorgeous day so the teachers broke out the hose and sprinklers to let the kids run around. I heard the usual hubbub of delighted shouts and screams so I went to look... and saw some thirty to forty naked toddlers and children of both sexes running around the yard. It's not a secluded area either; on the other side of the fence the yard was bounded by public footpaths and there are apartment houses running the length of one of them.

Blew my mind. First thing I thought of was "How fast would every last relevant law enforcement and social work organization be screeching into the driveway back home in the States?" Here it's no big deal. In fact my wife was telling me that a couple companies had tried to introduce two-piece bikinis for girls that age here and failed miserably because Swedes were all "What's wrong with letting 'em run around topless? Jeez."

[Freudian Slit]

Once you've swam in the nude, you'll never think it odd again. It feels lovely.

I can't argue with that. No bunching, no sitting around in a wet suit afterward.

[shiftless]

Back in the late 60's, early 70's the Boy's Club I went to allowed nude swimming. It was only boys there and, I think, the concept was that a lot of the inner-city boys didn't have swim suits, maybe not even any shorts that would work. Creeped me out then and creeps me out now that thay made a point of says "it's OK to swim naked if you want" but that was probably for a real, non-creepy purpose. Really, if you are poor and you've never been to a pool before, what's the likelyhood that you own a bathing suit? Still - you wouldn't have caught me doing it.

[supergoose]

I think a lot of this comes down to "I don't want people to see me naked" which I think originates in prudishness. But I'm told that it doesn't, so do enlighten me.

Well, for me, it's not liking my body, which I hear is rampant these days. If I thought I was hot, I'd gladly go naked and enjoy being seen. I definitely don't, though, and am therefore ashamed of my naked body. Given how we're (in the US, at least) inundated with images of the perfect (genetically-lucky, surgically altered and airbrushed) female and male body and that pretty much all nudity is associated with sexuality and that it's normal (especially in such a culture) to wish to be sexually attractive and consider it important, it doesn't surprise me that I and many others would not want to be seen naked by just anyone. Maybe that's the definition of prudishness to you, but I think dismissing it as just that is overly simplistic and entirely overlooking the cultural context. Which is where the idea that you're out of touch comes from (probably - I don't claim to speak for anyone else).

[supergoose]

Plus, we're also taught from a young age to cover our "private parts" and not let anyone, and I mean anyone, aside from maybe your Mom and Dad and the doctor, take such abusive liberties as to insist to see them. Basically, it's the OMG-PEDOPHILE!!! effect. Which then causes us to even see little kid nudity through a sexual context, which we wish to protect them from, so we insist that they be covered up too, and round we go. And since we've grown up with it, it's by default normal, so anything else is seen as weird and possibly threatening, which is pretty much just the human nature response to anything different.

(Missed the edit. Sorry.)

[Walloon]

We as a society have become over-sexualized.

[Zsofia]

Once you've swam in the nude, you'll never think it odd again. It feels lovely.
At the spa at Caesar's Palace in Vegas, if you're getting a massage or something you have free admission to the spa facilities, which are like the world's most awesome Roman baths. It's all clothing optional, and I didn't know going in (like most people) so I certainly didn't have a swimsuit or anything. It was weird at first, but everybody else was doing it and in the end I decided it was awesome.

[Spectre of Pithecanthropus]

, Also you rarely see men in public--even in their front yards--without a shirt. .

The trend to obesity may be a factor. I think I'm the only 51-y.o. guy in my zip code who doesn't have a gut billowing out and down.

[Spectre of Pithecanthropus]

Young man, there's a place you can go.
I said, young man, when you're short on your dough.
You can stay there, and I'm sure you will find
Many ways to have a good time.

It's fun to stay at the Y-M-C-A.
It's fun to stay at the Y-M-C-A.

They have everything that you need to enjoy,
You can hang out with all the boys ...
To be clear, "back in the day" was a LOT farther back than around 1980 when this song was recorded. I do recall, though, the Y making you wear one of their Speedo style suits when you used their pool. This would have been back around 1966 when I was eight. Nobody really thought anything of it then anyway; male swim attire was a lot more revealing generally.

What I find funny about the manpri trunks that most men wear today is that after swimming they often hike them way up so they can tan the upper thighs. If these guys want to tan, then why do they have to swim in elephant tarps?

[panache45]

One other memorable moment was when one of the, uh, rather well endowed guys in my swim class got an erection. Coach made him stand on the diving board until it went down...but this guy seemed to like the attention and when coach wasn't looking, was actually giving himself a few strokes...the rest of us were laughing hysterically...ah, good times, good times.
A similar incident happened at our school, but with a not-so-funny outcome. If a kid had a doctor's note excusing him from swimming, he had to spend the period walking around the pool, nude. There was a guy who was VERY well-endowed and very self-conscious about it, and while he was walking around the pool the other kids started teasing him, and he ran into the locker room. From there, nobody ever found out what happened to him. There were rumors that he had taken his own life, but I don't know if they were true. I think he just ran away.

[Walloon]

An essay and historical pictures on this topic. Note: of course, nudity in the photos.

http://

tonysand.wordpress.com/2009/03/20/

[NinjaChick]

I went to Cornell from 1969-1973. You had to pass the swim test in order to graduate, so since I didn't know how to swim very well I had to take the class my freshman year for PE.<snip>
Cornell University? Ivy League Cornell in NY?

What in god's name was the logic in wasting people's time, at a school of that academic caliber, with a mandatory swimming test? I can kind of sort of understand offering PE (though I think that's crazy too), but requiring you to swim? "Well, I've finished all the requirements of my architecture degree - all the design classes, the mechanics and engineering requirements - but I can't get my degree yet because I don't know how to swim." Is that really how it worked?

[JFLuvly]

I must admit that the thought of nude swimming classes for students seems odd and I'm 42, never heard of it. I guess thats the way they did it then and was accepted as the norm, somewhat like wearing a suit today is the norm. Times change and that leads me to this:

I have always played alot of hockey and it's was always the norm for people to be naked in the dressing room waiting for a shower after hockey, just standing aroud having a beer and chatting. This past year I witnessed something I have never seen before....some 16-17 year olds were playing a rental with us and when they got in the shower afterwards they wore their underwear the whole time. The times they are a changin'....Again.

[IvoryTowerDenizen]

Cornell University? Ivy League Cornell in NY?

What in god's name was the logic in wasting people's time, at a school of that academic caliber, with a mandatory swimming test? I can kind of sort of understand offering PE (though I think that's crazy too), but requiring you to swim? "Well, I've finished all the requirements of my architecture degree - all the design classes, the mechanics and engineering requirements - but I can't get my degree yet because I don't know how to swim." Is that really how it worked?

My college, while not an Ivy, is a top tier college and also required a swim test (I graduated in 1989, so it isn't some archaic rule). Many colleges do this. I don't quite understand why it would be linked to the caliber of the college anyway... if you go to a "lesser" college, you need to know how to swim, but not if you go to an Ivy?

[Walloon]

And then there's Harvard's parallel parking test.

[Kimmy_Gibbler]

Cornell University? Ivy League Cornell in NY?

What in god's name was the logic in wasting people's time, at a school of that academic caliber, with a mandatory swimming test? I can kind of sort of understand offering PE (though I think that's crazy too), but requiring you to swim? "Well, I've finished all the requirements of my architecture degree - all the design classes, the mechanics and engineering requirements - but I can't get my degree yet because I don't know how to swim." Is that really how it worked?

Chicago doesn't let you graduate without passing the swim test either. During orientation, you take the test. If you don't pass, you take swimming in your first year. I've never heard of anyone failing the swim test.

I don't think including a fitness component is particularly misguided. And swimming is probably just as useful as some of the other stuff in the Core. I would say knowing how to swim, and more generally, inculcating a habit of regular, moderate physical exercise, is as important to leading the good life (the aim of classical education since Socrates) as reading snippets of medieval Italian correspondence (as I did in Western Civ, second quarter, with J. Kirshner).

[Kimmy_Gibbler]

Outside edit window: I've never heard of anyone failing the swim class. One of my friends showed up drunk to his swim test and quite naturally failed the test.

[sunacres]

Well, for me, it's not liking my body [...] Maybe that's the definition of prudishness to you, but I think dismissing it as just that is overly simplistic and entirely overlooking the cultural context. Which is where the idea that you're out of touch comes from (probably - I don't claim to speak for anyone else).

I want to offer an appreciation of supergoose's very thoughtful post.

Those of us over 50 really did grow up when nudity was not the problem that it is today, and it is clear that young people have become more prudish, cultural context notwithstanding. Somehow, despite the freewheeling attitudes that me and my peers grew up with, we also spawned a generation of play-dated, pedophile-fearing, hyper-sexualized children.

I'm surprised that we haven't heard more from the naked ladies. My school (UC Berkeley) had a women's pool which, back in my day at least, was always nude. Those of us working at odd hours in the architecture tower found the view most inspiring.

[flickster]

Took swimming lessons at the Y via our scout troop, and yes, nude swimming.

Explanation at the time related to the pool filters and their inability to handle the lint from the suits (as already mentioned)

Date was probably early 60s

[BigT]

I'll just offer this: I have to fight to not consider the use of the word "prude" as being bigoted. My experience is that it is a word used to belittle others who have a different moral standing than your own.* So it doesn't surprise me that, if you ask someone if they are being prudish, they are going to say no.

*For example:
"Why won't you come to this party and drink and smoke with us? Are you a PRUDE?" No. I just don't like consuming foreign substances that override my self control, causing me to do things I may regret later. YMMV.

[DaphneBlack]

Cornell University? Ivy League Cornell in NY?

What in god's name was the logic in wasting people's time, at a school of that academic caliber, with a mandatory swimming test? I can kind of sort of understand offering PE (though I think that's crazy too), but requiring you to swim? "Well, I've finished all the requirements of my architecture degree - all the design classes, the mechanics and engineering requirements - but I can't get my degree yet because I don't know how to swim." Is that really how it worked?

It still works that way. Swim test during orientation and two semesters of PE -- but PE is defined very broadly and there is a bewildering array of options. All sorts of outdoor activities, sports, massage training (yes!) and hiking classes.

I never heard of anyone failing the swim test -- it was all of three laps.

Cornell '04

[NinjaChick]

It still works that way. Swim test during orientation and two semesters of PE -- but PE is defined very broadly and there is a bewildering array of options. All sorts of outdoor activities, sports, massage training (yes!) and hiking classes.

I never heard of anyone failing the swim test -- it was all of three laps.

Cornell '04
That just seems so odd to me. Was there any reason given as to why you had to know how to swim?

[Manda JO]

That just seems so odd to me. Was there any reason given as to why you had to know how to swim?

It's a very old-school thing: my impression (and Wiki bears this out, somewhat (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cornelliana#Swim_test)) is that it started around the turn of the century at women's colleges, where part of the whole reform movement in women's education was the idea that women needed to be physically fit--and swimming as a focus has several advantages: 1) it was a modern sort of exercise (basketball was also popular for women), it was hygienic (no sweating), and it had a practical application (not drowning).

[flickster]

That just seems so odd to me. Was there any reason given as to why you had to know how to swim?

Seems like a grand idea to me. Maybe we could cut down on the accidental drownings that take place annually if other schools followed suit (no pun intended)

[DaphneBlack]

We were told, and it seemed plenty sensible to me, that the 'Cornell ethos' (which was about a broad educational philosophy) included the swim test and some 'physical education' because education was about mind and body. Also Cornell is situated in an area with a lot of beautiful outdoor settings, the enjoyment of which would be drastically lessened if you were unable to swim or uncomfortable around water.

[Bradvsfw]

The history of men and boys swimming naked goes back over 300 years. In the 1800s and 1900s (Victorian and Edwardian eras), it was indeed very common for boys up until puberty (and sometimes even beyond) to swim and "sea-bathe" with girls their age, all the while stark naked (although girls were always clothed).

A huge archive inclusive of actual history book passages, news articles, old photographs and vintage film archives that evidence can be found here:

https://sites.google.com/site/historicarchives4maleswimming/home

[alphaboi867]

I'm a little curious, what exactly were you googling Bradvsfw that led to you revive 2 different zombie threads, on the same exact topic, in 2 different forums? And you had a link prepared (nice site BTW).

[denquixote]

I never swam nude but I know that growing up in the 50's, as a Catholic, I was not permitted to join th Y because that is what they did there. I always thought it was strange, but never thought about the filter issue. But our county pool did not seem to have any such issue and there were thousands there on occasion.

[Flyer]

Those of us over 50 really did grow up when nudity was not the problem that it is today, and it is clear that young people have become more prudish, cultural context notwithstanding.

I don't understand how anybody could think this. I'm willing to concede that there is SLIGHTLY more modesty in swimming than there used to be, but in every other facet of life there is much less modesty than there used to be. I'm considerably younger (33) than a lot of you on this board, yet even in my lifetime I have noticed shorts getting shorter and shorter. It's quite common now for teenage girls to wear shorts that are SO short that they have practically no inseam at all--for all practical purposes, they're not much more than underwear with pockets.

If you think that people who are willing to go half or two-thirds naked in public are "prudish," then you have a very warped view of what's appropriate.

[BMalion]

I swam nude at the Y for swimming lessons as a little boy in Ohio in the early 1960's

And then went co-ed skinny-dipping at a late night pool party in the 1970's :D

[Icerigger]

Same here, naked swiming lessons around 1969 or 1970 the instructor however had swim trunks. I remember being very embarrassed.

[BMalion]

Well, skin is the Devil's slipcover.

[SpoilerVirgin]

Colleges have swim tests, as opposed to just offering swimming as a P.E. option, because it prevents people from drowning. My father had an overprotective mother who never let him swim. Consequently he got to college (Stanford, in his case) without knowing how. He vividly remembers having to learn to swim in order to pass a mandatory swim test, and is self-conscious about his swimming abilities as a result. But at least he is in less danger if he falls out of a boat, or otherwise accidentally ends up in the water. I do think it's a great idea, and should be mandatory at as many schools as possible.

My college had a mandatory swim test, but I was exempt since I had a Red Cross swim card.

Note: Ask Dad if swim class was done in the nude when he was in college.

[Voyager]

We had the same thing at MIT.

I passed, no problem, but a friend failed, despite the fact that he was a far better athlete than me. He was tall, and thin, and on the fencing team, and sank like a stone.

As for the Y, I personally swam nude there during lessons in the late 1950s. The last day of classes they invited parents - I managed to get sick that day. I never learned there, I learned at day camp with a suit on.

My mother-in-law went to a woman's college in eastern PA in the 1930s. They made her take a test also, and she always failed. They finally stuck a broomstick into the back of her suit and dragged her from one end of the pool to the other so she could graduate.

[Roderick Femm]

I don't understand how anybody could think this. I'm willing to concede that there is SLIGHTLY more modesty in swimming than there used to be, but in every other facet of life there is much less modesty than there used to be. I'm considerably younger (33) than a lot of you on this board, yet even in my lifetime I have noticed shorts getting shorter and shorter. It's quite common now for teenage girls to wear shorts that are SO short that they have practically no inseam at all--for all practical purposes, they're not much more than underwear with pockets.

If you think that people who are willing to go half or two-thirds naked in public are "prudish," then you have a very warped view of what's appropriate.I think it's the younger generation of males that are more - something, not sure if prudish is the right word, maybe shy or worried about catching teh gay or something. You just don't see young men showing a lot of skin, not like young women.

I went to college in 1967 and had to take a nude swim class (because I couldn't pass the test). When we arrived for class we would usually find the teacher doing laps in the nude. Then he would get out, go suit up, and come back and teach the class. I guess the difference was when he was teaching he wasn't in the pool.

Even though I am gay, by the way, I never got the slightest thrill or titillation from looking at the other guys. I think just because the milieu was too public and non-sexual.

I did, however, get a weird feeling from the teacher once (or maybe it was my evil mind reading into it). He was teaching some kind of frog kick, or something, and each of us had to lay on a table while he held our feet to make sure we were pushing them in the right direction. I was last, and I could swear that as we stopped and he let go, he gave me some kind of look that didn't seem to fit the situation. I can't describe it better than that, I was very naive and a virgin at the time, so who knows.

As to the prudishness of young men these days, I remember when I was in high school (mid 60's) many or most of the boys wore their jeans so tight you could tell what religion they were. Now, of course, baggy is in and has been for some time. I don't think those kinds of tight pants will ever come back (darn it); tight pants are perceived as being only for women.

Then there's the towel dance in the gym locker room. We had to shower in my high school gym class, and anyone who did the towel dance would have been laughed out of school. Now it's far more common than casual nudity in all of the gyms I have been in since I started going back to gyms.

Them's my thoughts on the matter.


Roddy

[BMalion]

We also had to all shower together after gym class.

Part of growing up.

[Phèdre nó Delaunay]

It's quite common now for teenage girls to wear shorts that are SO short that they have practically no inseam at all--for all practical purposes, they're not much more than underwear with pockets.

If you think that people who are willing to go half or two-thirds naked in public are "prudish," then you have a very warped view of what's appropriate.

This isn't new. We wore those back in the 70s too. They weren't short enough unless you could see the curve of the buttocks out the bottom of the leg holes. The thing is, GUYS shorts were just about that short too. So yeah, a lot more "prudish" these days.

[grude]

I think it is related to the growing awareness of male homosexuality, it makes younger guys absurdly paranoid about stuff like lockerooms and shorts.

Shit I heard several guys say they don't watch hetero porn, they only watch lesbian porn(designed for hetero males) because like omg a PENIS omg barf.:rolleyes:

OMG walk around in shorts that show my ankles? Are you crazy some homo could get aroused looking at my body!:rolleyes:

[Terraplane]

As to the prudishness of young men these days, I remember when I was in high school (mid 60's) many or most of the boys wore their jeans so tight you could tell what religion they were. Now, of course, baggy is in and has been for some time. I don't think those kinds of tight pants will ever come back (darn it); tight pants are perceived as being only for women.

Skinny jeans (https://www.google.com/search?um=1&hl=en&safe=off&biw=1745&bih=868&tbm=isch&q=skinny+jeans+men&revid=551328621&sa=X&ei=eeMbUMujLIWy2QXA34HwAg&ved=0CGIQgxY) are pretty popular among a certain crowd.