Mafia: Mutiny on the SS Insipid [Game Over]

[Chronos]

Oh, and I thought I asked this before, but it looks like I didn't: Ichini, will you be online during the Night? Since doctors are now allowed to report their results at Night, there's no problem with the same person being Doctor and Engineer, so I'm inclined to promote you, as long as you'll be able to do the Engineering watching.

[Ichini Sanshigo]

The beginning of next week is going to be a bit hectic, but I should find the time to get online.

Now I'm wondering if I should have investigated Cookies, who seems to have benefitted from that strange computer glitch. Dagnabit!

[Scuba_Ben]

In response to the examination:

Unvote Scuba_Ben
And given that that removes my only reason for voting for em,

Unvote ColdPhoenix

[Scuba_Ben]

We have under 40 hours to go, and I don't think anybody's said anything that makes me suspect them.

[Chronos]

I think I forgot to unvote ColdPhoenix, too, come to think of it.
Unvote ColdPhoenix

My vote on Hal stands, though, since he actually used the mason claim itself as a basis of suspicion. Yes, it should be taken with a grain of salt, but Town should always give Mason claims the benefit of the doubt for at least a Day.

Meanwhile, it's really looking like Inner Stickler isn't coming back. If he's Town, we're pretty much screwed: With him not participating, and if we have two Scum, we need each and every genuine Townie to agree on the lynch or we lose right now, and if there are three Scum and he's a Townie and not playing, then we've already lost and just haven't found out yet. So our only real hope for winning is if he's Scum. Ordinarily, he might be a good candidate for the Brig, except with himself as Security, that's not going to happen. So I think our only hope, faint though it be, is to
Vote Inner Stickler

Scuba, if you can't find a case, then you might consider doing like you did yesterDay, and just vote for everyone except yourself, me, and Ichini. Another Townie abstaining from the vote is pretty much guaranteed to sink us.

[Chronos]

Pleo, I know you don't do substitutions, but can you PM Stickler to remind him that he's in the game?

[ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies]

[b]Vote Inner
Vote Darth
Vote Hal [b]

Lurking sucks, especially with such close margins of error when we need everyone's views and potentially key investigation results being denied to us as well.

[Darth Sensitive]

Coming back to the game after a hectic as hell move in/training week. At least I'm now in my dorm with reliable internet.

So. I'm summarizing my thoughts on the day. Chronos (as doc) confirms Ichini. Chronos and Scuba confirm each other as masons. Then Ichini goes to examine scuba. So if we can confirm one of them then they're all confirmed - but we most likely need to lose one for solid proof, or we can get another doc to confirm, as 4 scum working together would already have a win. It's a terribly ballsy play for 3 scum to make that play, so I'm inclined to trust them, but I'm stilling keeping a suspicious mind. If we can get somebody who isn't those three into the doctor spot, I'd be a whole lot more comfortable. It's probably preferable that someone who's alignment we know ends up in the engineer spot, which makes the promoting Ichini to engineer, making DarkCookie the future doc slightly preferable to putting Hal there with Ichini as the head ensign.

[ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies]

Unvote Darth

That seems reasonable, but I'm still inclined to target you if I were the Doc.

[ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies]

Unvore Darth

[Chronos]

It's a terribly ballsy play for 3 scum to make that play, so I'm inclined to trust them, but I'm stilling keeping a suspicious mind. If we can get somebody who isn't those three into the doctor spot, I'd be a whole lot more comfortable.I know I'm not exactly impartial, but I think it was a mistake for Ichini to examine us toDay, and I think it'd be an even bigger mistake for anyone else to examine us toMorrow. Going from almost-certain to completely-certain about some players doesn't give very much information. Of course, it's quite possible that one of us will be Night-killed, or that something else will come up before toMorrow that would moot the entire question-- A Day is a long time.

It occurs to me, meanwhile, that putting Ichini in the Engineer's seat gives the Muties a very strong incentive to off her toNight: That would get rid of the closest thing we have to a confirmed Townie, without risk of a meddling Engineer seeing them do it. The other possibility I'm considering for use of my power would be to promote or demote Inner Stickler out of the Security position, if he's not lynched: We might need to use the Brig in the endgame, which means we'd need somebody awake in that seat.

[Chronos]

Oh, and from the previous page but which I must have missed on first read:
Quoth Cookies:And could someone explain how putting votes on Scuba and Cold Phoenix yesterday being passed through some maths makes me likely to be scum?It doesn't make you likely to be Scum-- You're pretty middle-of-the-road as far as my program results go. It's Darth that looks scummy.

[Darth Sensitive]

Course, I can't figure out how those maths make me look scummy, but I'm not really worrying about it at the moment, as there are more pressing problems at the moment.

It occurs to me, meanwhile, that putting Ichini in the Engineer's seat gives the Muties a very strong incentive to off her toNight: That would get rid of the closest thing we have to a confirmed Townie, without risk of a meddling Engineer seeing them do it.

True, but it would also confirm that the two masons are actually masons, which I think is a net gain for the town.

[Chronos]

The thing is, I think it's pretty likely that the Muties will off one of the three of us anyway. And if they're going to do so, I'd prefer to have a chance to see who did it. Alternately, if the possibility of the Engineer observing scares them into killing someone else instead, then we'll be as good as confirmed toMorrow, which would put us into the very strong situation where half of the folks in the game are confirmed.

[Darth Sensitive]

Alternately, if the possibility of the Engineer observing scares them into killing someone else instead, then we'll be as good as confirmed

Of course, if you three were the scum, that's the kind of thing you would want the town to think. It's WIFOM predicated on us knowing your status, and the scum playing the way you want them to.

[Chronos]

No, as in, if all three of us are alive toMorrow, when there are six players, then either we're Town, or Town can't win, so everyone might as well just assume we're Town. Yes, the Mutie win condition technically requires a strict majority, but the lynch also requires a strict majority, so if Scum are half the Town, they can block all lynches and force a win.

[Darth Sensitive]

Unless we manage to lynch or brig a scum?

[ColdPhoenix]

So there are two groups (from my perspective) that I should focus my votes on one or the other.

Chronos
Scuba_Ben
Ichini Sanshigo

The "loyal" group, who I am most suspicious about as it all seems too tidy. Probably me being paranoid though...

Inner Stickler
ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies
Hal Briston
Darth Sensitive

The unknowns. Two of whom aren't saying much.

Even though I'm most suspicious of the "loyals", I'm going to vote for the lurkers this time. If we lynch another town today, and the game's not over, then I'm going to be targeting Chronos and Scuba...

So I'll leave my votes on Inner Stickler and Hal Briston.

[Inner Stickler]

My internet broke! Waah! The ethernet port on my computer is being a bastid. (If anyone knows how to make it recognize when the cable is plugged in, please let me know.)

Ok, info relaying time. I targeted Chronos last Night and he interacted with Diggit. So I'm thinking mutie.

Vote Chronos
Vote Scuba

[ColdPhoenix]

I've been suspicious of them for a while.... and I don't like the way they seem to vote for anyone who votes for them. Scares people off as one vote for them means two for you.

There may be no "mafia" at all. Could be that they (Chronos, Scuba and Ichini) lucked out with a doctor, examined Ichini so he came back "loyal" and then made up this mafia thing. It's always seemed a little too tidy. Those three "confirmed", but only their word for it.

Will have a look at what's gone on again, have a little think and come back.

[ColdPhoenix]

I'm going to go with my gut on this one. Even before this mafia proclamation came out I was suspicious of them. (Or is Inner scum playing on the voiced suspicions about Chronos/Scuba?)

Unvote Inner
Unvote Hal

Vote Scuba

Inner, why not throw Chronos in the brig?

[ColdPhoenix]

Sry

Vote Scuba

[Scuba_Ben]

My internet broke! Waah! The ethernet port on my computer is being a bastid. (If anyone knows how to make it recognize when the cable is plugged in, please let me know.)

Ok, info relaying time. I targeted Chronos last Night and he interacted with Diggit. So I'm thinking mutie.

[]Vote Chronos[/]
[]Vote Scuba[/]

Which could also mean that Diggit interacted with Chronos.

Since I know Chronos is Loyal (a fact only certain to him and me), I have to assume that Inner Stickler is on The Other Team.

Vote Inner Stickler and run the risk of OMGUS.

Vote count, please? I want to know how close we are to lynching somebody. It's Day 2, we need information.

I also haven't seen much from Hal in a few real-time days. I don't like Lynch the Lurker, but I think he's high on the vote count list.

Vote Hal Briston

AOP: It's possible (but highly unlikely, IMnshO) that Chronos is both my school Mate (mason) and Mutineer. There's enough other nonstandard rules -- but this possibility would screw over the mason role.

[Darth Sensitive]

Which could also mean that Diggit interacted with Chronos.

But there wasn't a record of any interaction with Chronos' claimed investigation.

[Scuba_Ben]

But there wasn't a record of any interaction with Chronos' claimed investigation.

Which Pleo said was a Day action, not a Night action. So the Doc's examination wouldn't show up on the Engineer's monitoring.

[Scuba_Ben]

ABWOP: Pleo said so in the PM I paraphrased in #145 (http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=11429856&postcount=145)

[Darth Sensitive]

Good catch.

[Chronos]

Well, I know absolutely certainly that I did nothing to DiggitCamara, and unless "hacker" is an extremely complicated power, I'm pretty sure that Diggit didn't do anything to me, either. Which means that Inner Stickler is lying. Fortunately, as it happens, I'm already voting for him, so I don't need to change my vote.

Meanwhile, I also don't think that Scum would try a one-for-one trade with a Mason unless there were three of them, since two confirmed Townies, one known Scum, one hidden Scum, and two unconfirmed Townies would be terrible odds for them toMorrow. So I'm now pretty sure that there are three Scum total.

With this new information (but not yet incorporating toDay's votes), the results of my program:
Without assuming me innocent a priori:
Inner Stickler |ComeToDarkCookies |Hal Briston |
ColdPhoenix |Inner Stickler |Darth Sensitive |
Inner Stickler |ComeToDarkCookies |Darth Sensitive |
Inner Stickler |Hal Briston |Darth Sensitive |
ColdPhoenix |Chronos |Scuba_Ben |
Ichini Sanshigo |Chronos |Scuba_Ben |
Inner Stickler |Chronos |Scuba_Ben |
Chronos |ComeToDarkCookies |Scuba_Ben |
Chronos |Hal Briston |Scuba_Ben |
Total number of possibilities: 9
ColdPhoenix 2
Normal Phase 0
Ichini Sanshigo 1
Inner Stickler 5
Chronos 5
ComeToDarkCookies 3
DiggitCamara 0
Hal Briston 3
Darth Sensitive 3
Scuba_Ben 5

With assuming my innocence:
Inner Stickler |ComeToDarkCookies |Hal Briston |
ColdPhoenix |Inner Stickler |Darth Sensitive |
Inner Stickler |ComeToDarkCookies |Darth Sensitive |
Inner Stickler |Hal Briston |Darth Sensitive |
Total number of possibilities: 4
ColdPhoenix 1
Normal Phase 0
Ichini Sanshigo 0
Inner Stickler 4
Chronos 0
ComeToDarkCookies 2
DiggitCamara 0
Hal Briston 2
Darth Sensitive 3
Scuba_Ben 0


Now, the way I see it, if we can convince the rest of the Town to trust me and vote for Stickler, then we're pretty well set. On the other hand, if folks trust Stickler instead and we do nothing else, then we're lost, since we'd go into toMorrow with three Scum who could block the vote, and we couldn't brig any of them since Stickler would be Security.

Therefore, I would like to ask for a bit of insurance: If the vote is such that Scuba is going to be lynched, I will put in an order for Stickler's promotion, and I request that ColdPhoenix put in an order for Stickler's arrest before Nightfall. If Stickler is correct and Scuba comes up Scum, then the Security Officer toMorrow will of course not execute the arrest order, and there's no harm done. On the other hand, if (as I know to be the case) Scuba comes up Town, then just after the spacing, Stickler will no longer be Security, his guilt will be evident, and whomever is Security will be able to arrest him.

[Chronos]

...And I just realized that I still have an arrest order out for me, which Stickler can execute as soon as he realizes it too. So I'd better put in my order now:

Promote Inner Stickler

And I would really prefer if ColdPhoenix retract that arrest order on me, too.

[Pleonast]

A little over three hours until the end of the Day.

Day Two Current Vote Count

8 players outside the Brig => 5 votes to lynch. No one is lynched with the current votes.

Hal Briston (3): Scuba_Ben [70-211+273], ColdPhoenix [156-271], Chronos [223], ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies [257].
Inner Stickler (3): Scuba_Ben [70-211+273], ColdPhoenix [156-271], Chronos [255], ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies [257].
Darth Sensitive (2): Scuba_Ben [70-211], Chronos [93-226+232], Ichini Sanshigo [168], ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies [257-260].
ColdPhoenix (2): Scuba_Ben [70-211+224-253], ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies [95], Inner Stickler [158], Chronos [223-255].
Scuba_Ben (2): Scuba_Ben [70-89], Darth Sensitive [79-174], ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies [137-229], ColdPhoenix [156-250+272], Hal Briston [175-236], Inner Stickler [269].
Chronos (1): Scuba_Ben [70-94], ColdPhoenix [87-100], Inner Stickler [269].
Ichini Sanshigo (0): Scuba_Ben [70-148].
ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies (0): Scuba_Ben [70-211+224-230], ColdPhoenix [87-116], Chronos [223-231].

Doctor Ichini Sanshigo is examining Scuba_Ben [245].

Arrest warrants:
Chronos by ColdPhoenix [169].

[Chronos]

Oh, and one more thing: Inner Stickler had activity on the Board (http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=11440759&postcount=222) as of just before midnight of the 13th, eastern time. So his internet was working then, and he had a chance to report his engineering results, but did not. That should look extremely suspicious.

[ColdPhoenix]

Oh, and one more thing: Inner Stickler had activity on the Board (http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=11440759&postcount=222) as of just before midnight of the 13th, eastern time. So his internet was working then, and he had a chance to report his engineering results, but did not. That should look extremely suspicious.

Good point!

Unvote Scuba

Vote Inner

I don't believe I can rescind your arrest warrant Chronos. I can release people from the brig or order arrests, but once the arrest is issued it can't be rescinded.

[Scuba_Ben]

Oh, and one more thing: Inner Stickler had activity on the Board (http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=11440759&postcount=222) as of just before midnight of the 13th, eastern time. So his internet was working then, and he had a chance to report his engineering results, but did not. That should look extremely suspicious.
Even More Suspicious (tm): Inner Stickler's last four posts as of now were:
http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/search.php?searchid=4540149

* 8/17 8:34 AM EDT, this thread
* 8/16, 12:34 AM, Why the hate for the DMV? (http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=528279)
* 8/16, 12:08 AM, same thread.
* 8/11 8:15 AM, this thread

Therefore, Inner Stickler had Internet access as of midnight (Eastern time) Sunday morning. The excuse about how his Internet connection was down, reported more than 24 hours after his previous post on the SDMB, is a major contradiction.

Inner Stickler, care to rebut?

[Scuba_Ben]

ABWOP: Inner Stickler needs one more vote to meet the lynch threshold. I would like to hear from the three people who haven't voted for him why they are not voting for him, or why they change their minds and vote for him.

[Chronos]

I don't believe I can rescind your arrest warrant Chronos. I can release people from the brig or order arrests, but once the arrest is issued it can't be rescinded. From the first post:1. Captain
Each Day you may issue the order to arrest any one crew-member. Also, each Day you may cancel any one arrest order. It is up to the Chief of Security to actually detain the crew-member. These actions are public. Place your orders in bold green in the game thread like this,
arrest/release Pleonast
Once issued, these orders may not be rescinded. They take effect immediately.So you can't rescind the order (that is, say you changed you mind and take it back to warrant someone else instead), but you can issue a separate order to cancel it. At least, that's the way I'm reading it.

[Chronos]

Oh, one more thing:
Unvote Darth Sensitive
Unvote Hal Briston

I'm still suspicious of both of them, and will likely re-vote both of them toMorrow if I'm still alive, but right this moment, it doesn't make sense to lynch anyone but Stickler, since I'm certain about him, but not certain about the other two.

[Pleonast]

90 minutes left.

Day Two Current Vote Count

8 players outside the Brig => 5 votes to lynch. No one is lynched with the current votes.

Inner Stickler (4): Scuba_Ben [70-211+273], ColdPhoenix [156-271+282], Chronos [255], ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies [257].
Hal Briston (2): Scuba_Ben [70-211+273], ColdPhoenix [156-271], Chronos [223-286], ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies [257].
ColdPhoenix (2): Scuba_Ben [70-211+224-253], ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies [95], Inner Stickler [158], Chronos [223-255].
Darth Sensitive (1): Scuba_Ben [70-211], Chronos [93-226+232-286], Ichini Sanshigo [168], ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies [257-260].
Scuba_Ben (1): Scuba_Ben [70-89], Darth Sensitive [79-174], ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies [137-229], ColdPhoenix [156-250+272-282], Hal Briston [175-236], Inner Stickler [269].
Chronos (1): Scuba_Ben [70-94], ColdPhoenix [87-100], Inner Stickler [269].
Ichini Sanshigo (0): Scuba_Ben [70-148].
ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies (0): Scuba_Ben [70-211+224-230], ColdPhoenix [87-116], Chronos [223-231].

Doctor Ichini Sanshigo is examining Scuba_Ben [245].
XO Chronos is promoting Inner Stickler [279].

Arrest warrants:
Chronos by ColdPhoenix [169].

[Chronos]

Man, I really hope that Ichini sees this thread in time to cast a vote.

[Scuba_Ben]

Just in case of any last-moment vote throwing,
Unvote Hal Briston

[Scuba_Ben]

Ichini is online right now. Pours sake and attempts to summon player

Darth Sensitive was last active 11:04 EDT this morning.

[Ichini Sanshigo]

Honestly, I'm torn between Darth Sensitive (for reasons given before), and Inner Stickler. Not that it would make much of a difference, but I'd still like to wait to hear from Inner Stickler. I know his lack of activity is suspicious, but I kinda have a bad feeling about this. I mean, I been on the board, lurking here and there in the BBQ Pit, for example, but without checking the game thread because I knew reading and posting here would take much more time that I could spare at the moment. I'm giving him 40 more minutes, and then I'll cast a vote one way or the other.

[Scuba_Ben]

Ichini, you are allowed to vote for multiple players, you know. That's how I got in trouble Yesterday-cycle.

So vote them both!

[Ichini Sanshigo]

Gawd, the grammar, it burnssss!

've
than
and subtract a few commas


Just for my own peace of mind.

[Ichini Sanshigo]

Ichini, you are allowed to vote for multiple players, you know. That's how I got in trouble Yesterday-cycle.

So vote them both!


Oh yeah! As you can see, I'm still getting used to mini-game rules. :smack:

[Scuba_Ben]

Hal's online also. How do I summon him to this thread -- offer roast lamb?

[ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies]

who is what now? I'm supposed to be leaving

I'm highly suspicious of Inner Stickler.

[Scuba_Ben]

Cookies, care to elaborate? Especially because we're not supposed to talk substance during Night-cycle.

[ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies]

Sorry, though I had more time.

[Scuba_Ben]

Night-cycle doesn't start for about 40 minutes. Plenty of time......

[Darth Sensitive]

Am on iPod. vote inner stickler

The story isn't adding up well for him. Can't type much, but this doesn't invalidate idea of chronos being killer. Lynch should confirm 3x people either way unless we have screwy masons.

[Scuba_Ben]

The lynch need not confirm Chronos and me as Loyal, regardless of its result. Unless I've missed something else.

And as I typed this up, I realized what that something would be: Ichini will report me as Loyal, unless something messes with eir examination. That will confirm that Ichini, Chronos, and myself are all on the same side.

Should Inner Stickler come up Mutie, that would confirm that Ichini, Chronos, and I are not Muties, as 4 Scum in a 10 person game is highly overbalanced. (But didn't we get into trouble with Scum numbers balancing out in Lost Mafia?)

[Pleonast]

30 minutes to go.

Day Two Current Vote Count

8 players outside the Brig => 5 votes to lynch. Inner Stickler will be lynched with these votes.

Inner Stickler (5): Scuba_Ben [70-211+273], ColdPhoenix [156-271+282], Chronos [255], ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies [257]. Darth Sensitive [300].
ColdPhoenix (2): Scuba_Ben [70-211+224-253], ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies [95], Inner Stickler [158], Chronos [223-255].
Hal Briston (1): Scuba_Ben [70-211+273-289], ColdPhoenix [156-271], Chronos [223-286], ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies [257].
Darth Sensitive (1): Scuba_Ben [70-211], Chronos [93-226+232-286], Ichini Sanshigo [168], ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies [257-260].
Scuba_Ben (1): Scuba_Ben [70-89], Darth Sensitive [79-174], ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies [137-229], ColdPhoenix [156-250+272-282], Hal Briston [175-236], Inner Stickler [269].
Chronos (1): Scuba_Ben [70-94], ColdPhoenix [87-100], Inner Stickler [269].
Ichini Sanshigo (0): Scuba_Ben [70-148].
ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies (0): Scuba_Ben [70-211+224-230], ColdPhoenix [87-116], Chronos [223-231].

Doctor Ichini Sanshigo is examining Scuba_Ben [245].
XO Chronos is promoting Inner Stickler [279].

Arrest warrants:
Chronos by ColdPhoenix [169].

[Ichini Sanshigo]

Vote Inner Stickler
Vote Darth Sensitive

[Scuba_Ben]

And it's Dusk. How'd we do?

[Pleonast]

Day Two Final Vote Count

8 players outside the Brig => 5 votes to lynch. Inner Stickler will be lynched with these votes.

Inner Stickler (6): Scuba_Ben [70-211+273], ColdPhoenix [156-271+282], Chronos [255], ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies [257]. Darth Sensitive [300], Ichini Sanshigo [303].
ColdPhoenix (2): Scuba_Ben [70-211+224-253], ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies [95], Inner Stickler [158], Chronos [223-255].
Hal Briston (1): Scuba_Ben [70-211+273-289], ColdPhoenix [156-271], Chronos [223-286], ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies [257].
Darth Sensitive (1): Scuba_Ben [70-211], Chronos [93-226+232-286], Ichini Sanshigo [168], ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies [257-260].
Scuba_Ben (1): Scuba_Ben [70-89], Darth Sensitive [79-174], ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies [137-229], ColdPhoenix [156-250+272-282], Hal Briston [175-236], Inner Stickler [269].
Chronos (1): Scuba_Ben [70-94], ColdPhoenix [87-100], Inner Stickler [269].
Ichini Sanshigo (0): Scuba_Ben [70-148].
ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies (0): Scuba_Ben [70-211+224-230], ColdPhoenix [87-116], Chronos [223-231].

Doctor Ichini Sanshigo is examining Scuba_Ben [245].
XO Chronos is promoting Inner Stickler [279].

Arrest warrants:
Chronos by ColdPhoenix [169].

The Mutinous crew-member Inner Stickler boldy steps through the airlock, and promptly explosively decompresses himself, leaving a fine mineral dust on the side of the ship.

The current ship roster is

01. ColdPhoenix -- Captain
02. Chronos -- Executive Officer
03. ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies -- Chief of Security
04. Ichini Sanshigo -- Head of Engineering
05. Hal Briston -- Ship's Doctor
06. Darth Sensitive -- Crew-member
07. Scuba_Ben -- Crew-member

Night Two ends in about 24 hours on Tuesday August 18, noon PT (3pm ET).

[Scuba_Ben]

Woo-hoo! One down.

Now waiting on Ichini's exam report.

[Chronos]

On the down side, Scuba, this means you'll have to clean out the airlock again. Yes, you. Rank hath its privileges :)

[Scuba_Ben]

Bugger. I make it all the way to Ensign 1/c and I still have to do all the scut work.

Clean Floyd
Clean decks
Clean out airlock
Rearrange tools in Engineering by color and length

[Darth Sensitive]

Hey now! Tools need to be arranged by the size of the head. Then length, then color.

[Ichini Sanshigo]

Hey! Get out of my workspace! I like my tools in completely random order. It's easier to find them that way, dontcha know! ;)

Also, my investigations showed that Scuba Ben is loyal. Barring some strange twist like a false result or backstabbity school chum ("You've changed man! You've changed!"), Chonos is likely loyal as well.

[ColdPhoenix]

Excellent news! :)

This reveals a lot, though I will leave further discussion until day.

[Scuba_Ben]

> FLOYD, ARRANGE TOOLS

Floyd says, "Floyd arrange all of those? Floyd is a robot, not a decor arranger."

Anybody else want to describe their day?

[ColdPhoenix]

10.00: Wake up
10.00-10.45: Breakfast
10.45 - 11.00: Wander round barking pointless orders at everyone
11.00: Declare that I'm off to the captain's suite to do some "strategic thinking"
11.00-12.30: Massage from pleasurebots
12.30 - 14.00: Decadent lunch in my suite
14.00 - 16.00: Relax in my sauna
16.00 - 18.00: Watch a movie
18.00 - 20.00: Dinner with the officers
20.00 - 23.30: Hit the ships bar for several drinks after "a hard day's work"
23.30: Trip over Scuba, scrubbing the corridor floor. Lambast the lazy cretin for not getting it done earlier.
23.35 - 01.00: Watch porn.
01.00: Go to bed.

[Chronos]

I hate to admit it, Scuba, but I don't get the whole Floyd thing. Presumably it's the same reference as the Ensign 3/c bit? A text adventure game, maybe?

[Pleonast]

I'm having lunch with several old colleagues today, so the new Day will be delayed a bit.

[Scuba_Ben]

I hate to admit it, Scuba, but I don't get the whole Floyd thing. Presumably it's the same reference as the Ensign 3/c bit? A text adventure game, maybe?
Planetfall, by Infocom (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Planetfall)

[Pleonast]

Day Three Duty Cycle begins now. The ship's computer lists the ship's complement.01. ColdPhoenix -- Captain
02. Chronos -- Executive Officer
03. ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies -- Chief of Security
04. Hal Briston -- Head of Engineering
05. Darth Sensitive -- Ship's Doctor
06. Scuba_Ben -- Crew-memberBe sure to send condolences to the family of Loyal crew-member Ichini Sanshigo, who was "suppressed" by the fire control system.

Carry-over votes are

6 players outside the Brig => 4 votes to lynch.

ColdPhoenix (1): ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies [95].
Hal Briston (1): ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies [257].

Arrest warrants:
Chronos by ColdPhoenix [169].

The Day ends Friday, August 21 at noon PT (3pm ET).

[Chronos]

I can't say I'm surprised, since this means we don't get an engineering report toDay. I would have liked to have moved her out of the engineering slot, but it was looking pretty desperate there yesterDay, and I felt I had to put in the order to get Stickler out of security while I still could, before he arrested me (and I'm still not sure why he didn't).

Now that we have the known Scum out of the way, I will resume my other cases from yesterDay:
Vote Darth Sensitive
Vote Hal Briston

Meanwhile, I note that the two Night-kills we've seen thus far have both been done using the ship's systems. This is probably just me being paranoid, and if so, I expect it won't count, but inspired by Alien and 2001, I'll also
Vote the Ship's Computer

[ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies]

If anyone expects to start using the power of the brig, being involved in that decision I personally request some input from everyone with a pulse as to what we should do and why.

[Scuba_Ben]

I can't say I'm surprised, since this means we don't get an engineering report toDay. I would have liked to have moved her out of the engineering slot, but it was looking pretty desperate there yesterDay, and I felt I had to put in the order to get Stickler out of security while I still could, before he arrested me (and I'm still not sure why he didn't).
I'm curious too. But Stickler's well and truly gone.

The thing is, Chronos, the promotion doesn't take effect until end of Day-cycle. So Stickler could still have thrown you into the brig and forced us to waste actions Today to let you out.

[Chronos]

The thing is, Chronos, the promotion doesn't take effect until end of Day-cycle. So Stickler could still have thrown you into the brig and forced us to waste actions Today to let you out.Yes, and that would have sucked. But at least it would have been possible for Town to release me.

Again, though, I realize too late that I made the wrong move. As soon as Stickler threw me in the brig, he would have been out of the Security position, and his successor (presumably Cookies) would have had the power to release me. This mistake, again, was due to me not having long enough to think it over.

[Scuba_Ben]

If we started with a vastly overpowered 4 Mutineers, we've been at Lynch or Lose since Day 2.
3 starting Muties -- 1 mislynch left.
2 starting Muties -- 2 mislynches left.

What we know:
Ichini was Loyal, and reported me as Loyal.
I have reported Chronos as Loyal.

And now it occurs to me that if I had been promoted Yesterday, I'd be Doctor, and could confirm or reject someone. The first two Days we gave a free pass to the Doctor and the examination subject. Which, at the moment, means Darth Sensitive could choose someone else to survive.

Therefore, I recommend:
* Sensitive, please provide a good rationale for whomever you choose to examine.
* And please hold off on your selection as long as you reasonably can, until it's fairly clear whom we lynch today.

And now to review Chronos's reason against Sensitive.

[Chronos]

If we started with a vastly overpowered 4 Mutineers, we've been at Lynch or Lose since Day 2.If we had 4 mutineers, Scum could have forced a win yesterDay, no matter what Town did: They could have all outed themselves at the beginning of the Day and it wouldn't have mattered, since they would just refuse to lynch themselves, refused to execute a Brig order against themselves, and forced us into a situation this Morning where there were 4 Scum, 3 Town for the win.

[Scuba_Ben]

Good point, Chronos.

Therefore we started with 2 or 3 Mutineers, and have 1 or 2 left.

I'd like to hear what ColdPhoenix has been sitting on all Night-cycle.

(And the -cycle thing is from Paranoia.)

[ColdPhoenix]

Not much new for you I'm afraid.

From my perspective it's now confirmed that Scuba, Chronos and Ichini are (were in Ichini's case) loyal. Makes it a lot easier for me to target my votes!

I found Cookies' non-voting and mistaking the time when it was clear Inner was scum suspicious. That said, I've spent the whole game until now thinking the Masons were scum so my suspicions aren't worth much...

Am tempted to vote for Darth too.

Finally, in case it works:

Release Chronos

[ColdPhoenix]

Release Chronos

[Scuba_Ben]

ColdPhoenix, you've got a good point about DarkCookies. She had vague suspicions of Inner Stickler, but didn't post them, even when reminded that there was plenty of time before Dusk.

For now: Vote ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies

I'm up in the air about Sensitive.

Chronos, please cross check ColdPhoenix. I would hate to be led down the wrong path by Scum for a third game.

[ColdPhoenix]

How can Chronos crosscheck me?

[Hal Briston]

Woohoo! We nailed scum!
D'oh! I have no business using the word "we".

Ah well...my apologies once again. Work was more hectic than expected, and out family trip to Sesame Place was moved up to earlier in the week. But I'm back, and will hopefully be more useful.

By the by, after doing a quick scan of the thread (which was basically "look for my name"), I need to point out that noting if somone is online or not isn't always useful. If they're not online, well, that tells us something. But if they are online, that doesn't always mean they're actually using the Dope. I practically always scan as being online, just because the Dope is always in an active window. Doesn't mean I'm actually using it, though.

Ok, serious reread time.

[Scuba_Ben]

Simple. By providing better analysis than I can do.

Just check my Mafiascum history for details.

[ColdPhoenix]

Simple. By providing better analysis than I can do.

Just check my Mafiascum history for details.

Ah! Okay. :D

[Chronos]

I found Cookies' non-voting and mistaking the time when it was clear Inner was scum suspicious.Cookies voted. She already had a vote in place on Stickler when he came forward with his claim, and didn't remove it.

Now, that is perhaps slightly suspicious of her, since her original reason for voting Stickler was lurking, and she kept her vote on him after he showed without making clear why she was still suspicious of him. But I'd still like to hear what she has to say on the matter before I find it suspicious enough for a vote.

Chronos, please cross check ColdPhoenix. I would hate to be led down the wrong path by Scum for a third game.My gut feeling is positive on him: Yes, he was a little more suspicious of us than I think was justified, but he acted on those suspicions in a measured way (keeping open the possibility that we were Town, too), and didn't try to hold onto a grudge once the evidence came in. He also looks pretty good in my vote analysis (which, again, I must remind myself and everyone else is still in beta test)-- The only scenario where he comes up Scum is one where Darth is also Scum.

The player I'm currently least certain about (one way or the other) is Cookies. Given my philosophy that detectives should target the least certain player, that's whom I would prefer Darth investigate (though, as someone posted earlier, he should postpone his investigation until it's pretty clear who we're going to lynch-- Not much point in killing the patient).

[Pleonast]

Day three Current Vote Count

6 players outside the Brig => 4 votes to lynch. No one is lynched with these votes.

Hal Briston (2): ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies [257], Chronos [318].
ColdPhoenix (1): ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies [95].
Darth Sensitive (1): Chronos [318].
ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies (1): Scuba_Ben [327].

Arrest warrants:
Chronos by ColdPhoenix [169] cancelled by ColdPhoenix [325].

[ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies]

I did vote. I found Inner stickler's late arrival with such potentially important information about Chronos to be hard to swallow, add fuel to the fire with people finding evidence that he had been online. Keeping the investigation results out of the game for so long was crappy play.

I was in the middle of departing my mother's house when I logged in to see what was going on, but I wasn't clear and how much time I had left at the time that I posted. Reading Scuba Ben's response very quickly, I though I my post was already 6 minutes into Dusk which is why I did not post again.

I'd appreciate not getting votes for reasons that don't exist (like my not voting for Inner when I was) so I shall be leaving my vote on ColdPhoenix for now. And I'm leaving my vote on Hal as well in hopes for some participation.

[Chronos]

Now, if you want to be suspicious of someone for not voting, how about Hal Briston? So far as I can tell, his sole contributions to the thread have been:
1: Sowing misinformation about who the Mutineers might be (http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?p=11420624#post11420624), on the assumption that some of the officers, but not the captain, must have been in on it. OK, this might have been an innocent mistake, but it didn't help anything, regardless.
2: Voting ScubaBen (http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?p=11433798#post11433798) for his "vote everyone" tactic.
3: Casting further suspicion on Scuba and I because of the mason claim
4: [url="http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?p=11444302#post11444302"]Unvoting Scuba Ben (http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?p=11438326#post11438326)
Thus leaving himself with no votes in place at all on Day 2, which, I must point out, is strictly worse than voting for everyone (the only reason he gave for the one vote he did cast, on Day 1).

How about it, Scuba, ColdPhoenix, Darth? Anyone else want to put a little pressure on Hal for his non-participation?

[Chronos]

That third link should be Casting further suspicion on Scuba and I because of the mason claim (http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?p=11438326#post11438326)

[ColdPhoenix]

Cookies voted. She already had a vote in place on Stickler when he came forward with his claim, and didn't remove it.


Good point. I hadn't noticed that. That looks very good for her.

Following that, in my view the scum has to be either Hal or Darth (or both?).

Evidence in my favour (for others) is that Inner only voted for Scuba, Chronos and myself. I don't think he'd have voted for me at the start (when it looked like I would be lynched) if I were scum.

Agreeing with Chronos, I'm happy to start with Hal.

Vote Hal Briston

[Scuba_Ben]

Chronos, good catch about Hal.

Vote Hal Briston

I'm slightly inclined to de-suspect Cookies and ColdPhoenix per the past few posts. So at the moment, my #2 suspect is Darth Sensitive by process of elimination.

Unvote ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies

Who would be better for Doc Sensitive to examine Today -- Cookies or ColdPhoenix? Who is less certain and would give better information?

I probably won't be on the boards much today before Dusk. (But at least I'll make Lieutenant 1/c!)

[Chronos]

Wait, I think we can crack this open completely. To review the facts: We currently have 6 players alive, two of whom are confirmed Town, and either one or two of whom are Scum. The plan:

1: We lynch Hal and arrest Darth, or the other way around.
2: With the arrest, Scuba (whom we know we can trust) becomes Doctor
3: Doctor Scuba investigates Cookies
4a: If Cookies comes up guilty, we of course lynch her toMorrow
4b: If Cookies comes up innocent, and there's a murder toNight, then it must have been committed by ColdPhoenix, so we lynch him toMorrow
4c: If Cookies comes up innocent, and there's no murder toNight, then the last mutineer must be the guy we threw in the Brig, so we lynch him toMorrow.

To break this down, according to every possible arrangement of Scum:
1: ColdPhoenix alone is Scum-- We mislynch toNight, but can afford the mislynch. When everyone but him is accounted for and we still get a kill, we learn in time that he's guilty and kill him for the win.
2: Cookies alone is Scum-- We mislynch toNight, but learn she's Scum from the investigation, and kill her toMorrow for the win.
3: Hal alone is Scum-- We win when we lynch him.
4: Darth alone is Scum-- We have no night-kill, since he's in the Brig, and lynch him from there for the win.
5: Darth and Hal are the two Scum-- We've killed one and brigged the other, so there's no Night-kill, and we kill the guy in the brig for the win.
6: Darth and ColdPhoenix are the Scum-- ColdPhoenix is the only unconfirmed who could have done the murder, so we lynch him toMorrow, and deal with Darth in the brig at our leisure
7: Darth and Cookies are the Scum-- We learn that Cookies is guilty, and lynch her toMorrow, and deal with Darth in the brig at our leisure
8: Hal and ColdPhoenix are the Scum-- ColdPhoenix is the only unconfirmed who could have done the murder, so we lynch him toMorrow for the win
9: Hal and Cookies are the Scum-- We learn that Cookies is guilty, and lynch her toMorrow for the win
10: ColdPhoenix and Cookies are the Scum-- In this case and this case alone do we lose. But I think that, given the voting record, it's extremely unlikely that ColdPhoenix and Cookies are both Scum together. So this case is a risk I'm willing to take.

[Scuba_Ben]

Ooh, very good thought at the plan. Give me a minute or five to review it.

[Scuba_Ben]

Having read through the plan, I endorse.

[Scuba_Ben]

And after another two minutes of thought, I found the possible weakness:

ColdPhoenix is Captain. Cookies is Security. If exactly one of them is Scum, they would definitely not be okay with this plan.

Readies the Suspecting Finger of Suspicion

[Chronos]

And after another two minutes of thought, I found the possible weakness:

ColdPhoenix is Captain. Cookies is Security. If exactly one of them is Scum, they would definitely not be okay with this plan.

Readies the Suspecting Finger of SuspicionIf either of them is Town, that one should know that the plan is no-fail, so either of them refusing to go along would be enough reason for me to switch my vote to that person.

[Pleonast]

Day Three Current Vote Count

6 players outside the Brig => 4 votes to lynch. Hal Briston will be lynched with these votes.

Hal Briston (4): ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies [257], Chronos [318], ColdPhoenix [337], Scuba_Ben [338].
ColdPhoenix (1): ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies [95].
Darth Sensitive (1): Chronos [318].
ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies (0): Scuba_Ben [327-338].

Arrest warrants:
Chronos by ColdPhoenix [169] cancelled by ColdPhoenix [325].

[Scuba_Ben]

Oops, I just saw the flaw in your plan, Chronos: ColdPhoenix already used his Day-power as Captain this Day-cycle; IIRC, he can't issue an arrest warrant Today.

Then I checked the rules to make sure, and found I was wrong.

The Captain may issue one arrest warrant per Day, and may cancel/release one arrest warrant per Day.

So your plan is still a Very Good Idea.

[ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies]

I understand wanting to investigate me, but we could also lynch Hal or Darth and brig + investigate the other to potentially narrow down some of the possible outcomes of what may or may not go down at Night.

Just something to consider. Brigging or killing a townie at this point would be bad, but this way we can at least ensure if whoever is in the brig should stay there or not.

[Chronos]

We're getting to the point where brigging someone itself gives useful information. If we brig someone and there's still a night-kill, then that means that there's someone not in the brig who's still Scum. Combine that with an investigation of someone else, and we can get pretty much all we need.

Just to make things clear, here: I have no problem whatsoever with Townies ending up dead or in the Brig, so long as Town still wins the game. In some of the scenarios I outlined, Townies end up killed or brigged, but as long as Cookies and ColdPhoenix aren't both Scum, Town still wins in all of them.

[ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies]

Actually, Scuba will get to double dip for investigations as Doctor and Engineer as soon as we brig whoever we decide to brig. Using the Engineers' powers on the person in the brig would be a waste since they can't do anything anyway. So it boils down to a decision of whether to use the Doctor investigation on me, Cold, or whoever is in the brig. And then following up with a decision on who to do the Engineer lookup on between any of the three of us left who isn't in the brig.

[Scuba_Ben]

I disagree with Cookies after some thought. The intent of throwing one player out the airlock, a second in the brig, and a third into the exam room is to find out information about three players at the cost of one.

Examining whoever's in the brig only finds out information about two players.

And here's the weakness: If there is no overnight murder, the Scum might have passed on their kill to frame whoever's in the brig.

Also, don't worry too much about me double-dipping. I expect the Mutineers to kill either Chronos or myself; given Chronos's mostly-foolproof plan, I'm the more likely target.

In case the Mutineers don't kill me as Engineer, who should I monitor? The obvious choice is Chronos, but there's other choices too.

I'm waiting on input on the plan from the other two players, especially ColdPhoenix who would have to give the arrest order.

[Scuba_Ben]

10: ColdPhoenix and Cookies are the Scum-- In this case and this case alone do we lose. But I think that, given the voting record, it's extremely unlikely that ColdPhoenix and Cookies are both Scum together. So this case is a risk I'm willing to take.

I think we can protect against this.

1. Throw Hal out the airlock and Darth Sensitive in the brig (or vice versa).
2. I examine Cookies Today. (So far as Chronos described.)
3'. Cookies comes up Mutineer. So we throw her out the airlock Tomorrow.
4'. Also lock ColdPhoenix in the brig Tomorrow. If the game does not end, then the situation is two untrusted players in the brig (of whom at least one is a Mutineer), and one practically confirmed player outside it (Chronos or me). The free player can then space both people in the brig without interference.

Actually, we may want to throw ColdPhoenix in the brig anyway, in the other situation: Cookies comes up Loyal, so again the situation would reduce to all non-confirmed players in the Brig and only confirmed Loyal players free.

Chronos, please check my reasoning carefully. Logic bit us in the stern last game.

Cookies and ColdPhoenix, please also check this plan. Do you see any way it would not clinch the game for the Loyalists?

[Chronos]

If Cookies and ColdPhoenix are both Muties, then we can't throw anyone in the Brig toMorrow, since they're Captain and Security. So that'd leave us at three live players toMorrow, two of whom are Muties. Game over. I could get Cookies out of the Security slot, but the only way to get the Captain out of his seat is to lynch him, and I don't think that's a good plan.

I think that we just don't have enough bits to guarantee victory in all scenarios. No matter what we do, there is going to be some scenario where we lose. But I think that Cookies/ColdPhoenix is the least likely of the ten possible scenarios, so we should go for the plan that only loses in that case.

Also, if we both brig and lynch toDay, then we won't have an engineer toNight:
Every crew-member has a rank. The top-five ranked living crew-members are officers, with special abilities. Crew-members advance to fill missing offices. Crew-members in the Brig cannot be officers, but will regain their former position if released. If there are fewer than five crew-members available to be officers, the Head of Engineering and Ship's Doctor positions will not be filled. If there are only two crew-members available, the Executive Officer will also take on the Chief of Security's authority. If there is only one, the Captain will be vested with the power of both the Executive Officer and Chief of Security. If somehow all living crew-members are in the Brig, the ship's fail-safe protocols will automatically release all prisoners.(emphasis mine). So if we lynch and arrest, then toNight we'll have four free, living players, who will be Captain, XO, Security, and Redshirt. Which isn't all that big a deal, since any confirmed player in the Engineer's seat will be sure to be Night-killed anyway.

[Scuba_Ben]

So if Cookies and ColdPhoenix are both Muties (which you find unlikely), we'd have to jettison one of them Today.

Otherwise -- it's a good plan in its current form.

Cookies? ColdPhoenix? Your thoughts?

[ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies]

Seems straightforward to me.

[ColdPhoenix]

The plan sounds like a winner.

Arrest Darth Sensitive

Actually, we may want to throw ColdPhoenix in the brig anyway

Good luck with that one! ;) :D

[Scuba_Ben]

Now all we need is Cookies to do her part.

[Darth Sensitive]

Seems my previous post that would have been at the top of this page was hamstered :( Said about the same thing, but it's that much closer to being official now

Well, I guess that I'm getting brigged, so this vote is a formality, but I do stand behind it.

Vote Hal

[Pleonast]

A little over three hours left ToDay.

Day Three Current Vote Count

6 players outside the Brig => 4 votes to lynch. Hal Briston will be lynched with these votes.

Hal Briston (5): ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies [257], Chronos [318], ColdPhoenix [337], Scuba_Ben [338], Darth Sensitive [356].
ColdPhoenix (1): ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies [95].
Darth Sensitive (1): Chronos [318].
ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies (0): Scuba_Ben [327-338].

Arrest warrants:
Darth Sensitive by ColdPhoenix [354].
Chronos by ColdPhoenix [169] cancelled by ColdPhoenix [325].

[Hal Briston]

Ah well...worst personal performance ever. My apologies to the crew -- looks like I ended my hiatus a bit too soon.

Anyway, apart from nailing crew Today, the plan is reasonably solid.
Vote Darth

One thing to take away from this for Tomorrow -- examine those most vocal for my lynch. I'm not saying I don't deserve it, but lynching the head of engineering is a huge boon to scum who no longer have to worry about a possible report on their activities in the morning.

[Scuba_Ben]

Hal, whoever we lynch, as long as somebody is in the brig, there's no Engineer Tonight.

Your number just came up first.

But I'm getting suspicious of Cookies not showing up this morning to follow through on the plan.

[Darth Sensitive]

Well, as promotion/brigging is concurrent with the end of day, Scuba won't get a chance to make the investigation. I'll go with the conventional wisdom and

Investigate ColdPheonix

Class time!

[Scuba_Ben]

As I understand it, the brigging takes effect immediately. Darth Sensitive may have goofed.

Fortunately, this doesn't affect the situation too much, unless Darth Sensitive and ColdPhoenix are both Mutineers. In which case, there will likely be a false report of ColdPhoenix as Loyal.

Still, we need Sensitive in the brig to make the whole plan work.

[Darth Sensitive]

Are you serious?

Damnitdarthfailsatrules :(

[Scuba_Ben]

Double checking...

The arrest orders take place immediately.

The exam may be ordered at any time; the result is available just after Dusk.

[ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies]

Throw Darth in the Brig which should take effect immediately as far as I understand.

[Scuba_Ben]

Just in case we get very very lucky:

Examine ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies

But I doubt that will succeed. Now waiting for the action update....

[Pleonast]

Day Three Current Vote Count

5 players outside the Brig => 3 votes to lynch. Hal Briston will be lynched with these votes.

Hal Briston (4): ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies [257], Chronos [318], ColdPhoenix [337], Scuba_Ben [338], Darth Sensitive [356-364].
Darth Sensitive (2): Chronos [318], Hal Briston [358].
ColdPhoenix (1): ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies [95].
ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies (0): Scuba_Ben [327-338].

Doctor Darth Sensitive examines ColdPhoenix [360].

Arrest warrants:
Darth Sensitive by ColdPhoenix [354] and ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies [364].
Chronos by ColdPhoenix [169] cancelled by ColdPhoenix [325].

With the arrest the new crew listing is
01. ColdPhoenix -- Captain
02. Chronos -- Executive Officer
03. ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies -- Chief of Security
04. Hal Briston -- Head of Engineering
05. Darth Sensitive -- Brig
06. Scuba_Ben -- Ship's Doctor

[Scuba_Ben]

It looks like the Day-cycle is pretty much set.

For discussion over the next two hours: Did Darth Sensitive truly goof at the rules? Or was that a Scum tell?

(And it's entirely possible that e made a mistake on the rules and is also a Mutineer.)

[ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies]

I don't know what to make of it, but I'm glad he's in the brig at least. There's wine spilled all over the table now.

[Chronos]

First of all, it should have been clear to Darth that Brigging takes effect immediately. Second, even if it wasn't clear, he should have asked for clarification before acting. Third, when he did act, he wasn't acting according to "conventional wisdom" in investigating ColdPhoenix, since the plan everyone else agreed to was to investigate Cookies. If Hal comes up Scum and there's still a Night-kill, then I'll trust Darth, but be extremely upset at him for messing up a perfectly good plan. In any other circumstance, though, I'm now absolutely certain that he's Scum, and if Hal comes up innocent, we won't have any way of knowing whether Cookies or ColdPhoenix is the last Scum.

I'm trying to think of a way we can both Brig and Lynch someone toMorrow. I can promote Cookies out of Security, putting either myself or Scuba (depending on who survives) in that position toMorrow, but that's not quite enough. I was planning that I could start off voting for ColdPhoenix, and unvote him iff he issues an arrest warrant for himself, but that wouldn't work, because as soon as he's arrested, it would become impossible to lynch Cookies.

[Chronos]

On thinking about this some more, the XO won't have any power toMorrow, since toMorrow will be the last Day anything matters. And I trust myself and Scuba_Ben more than Cookies, so I'd rather have one of us in the Security seat, since it's conceivable that Security might still be able to do something. Therefore,

Promote Cookies

Now, then. What I'm thinking is that toMorrow, if Hal is innocent and there's still a Night-kill, I'll ask ColdPhoenix to put out a warrant on himself, and Cookies to vote for herself. If either doesn't cooperate, I'll vote for that person. Then, at the last minute, if everyone's still in compliance, I'll make a post executing the arrest order and voting for Cookies. That will leave me, a confirmed Town, as the sole remaining player outside the Brig, which is effectively a Town win condition. Of course, if Scuba is alive instead of me, he could do the same thing.

This is vulnerable to Cookies, if she's Scum, unvoting herself at the last minute, but I think I have better odds of beating that than I do of picking between the two of them.

Man, I hope Hal is Scum.

[Scuba_Ben]

That's better than any plan I'd have, Chronos. If I'm Alive Tomorrow, I'll do as you suggest.

[ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies]

Sounds good to me.

[Pleonast]

Less than one hour remaining.

Day Three Current Vote Count

5 players outside the Brig => 3 votes to lynch. Hal Briston will be lynched with these votes.

Hal Briston (4): ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies [257], Chronos [318], ColdPhoenix [337], Scuba_Ben [338], Darth Sensitive [356-364].
Darth Sensitive (2): Chronos [318], Hal Briston [358].
ColdPhoenix (1): ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies [95].
ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies (0): Scuba_Ben [327-338].

Doctor Darth Sensitive examines ColdPhoenix [360].
XO Chronos promotes ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies [370].

Arrest warrants:
Darth Sensitive by ColdPhoenix [354] and ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies [364].
Chronos by ColdPhoenix [169] cancelled by ColdPhoenix [325].

[Hal Briston]

Did Darth Sensitive truly goof at the rules? Or was that a Scum tell?Both, would be my guess. I think it was a goof made by scum.Man, I hope Hal is Scum.Cue disappointment in 24 minutes.

[Chronos]

Both, would be my guess. I think it was a goof made by scum.Only in the sense that it's possible to accidentally make the right move, if that. It was a move that hurt Town, but of course, that's exactly what Scum wants to do. He even got the right timing on it: He couldn't have done it after the order was executed, but if he had done it before the warrant was issued, we could have switched to lynching him and arresting someone else instead.

[Pleonast]

Day Three Final Vote Count

5 players outside the Brig => 3 votes to lynch.

Hal Briston (4): ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies [257], Chronos [318], ColdPhoenix [337], Scuba_Ben [338], Darth Sensitive [356-364].
Darth Sensitive (2): Chronos [318], Hal Briston [358].
ColdPhoenix (1): ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies [95].
ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies (0): Scuba_Ben [327-338].

Doctor Darth Sensitive examines ColdPhoenix [360].
XO Chronos promotes ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies [370].

Arrest warrants:
Darth Sensitive by ColdPhoenix [354] and ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies [364].
Chronos by ColdPhoenix [169] cancelled by ColdPhoenix [325].[/quote]

After much planning and plotting, the crew reaches a firm consensus and out the lock goes the Loyal crew-member Hal Briston. You can just barely discern his lips mouthing "I told you so...".

The ship's computer reassesses the situation and orders, with the result:01. ColdPhoenix -- Captain
02. Chronos -- Executive Officer
03. ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies -- Chief of Security
04. Scuba_Ben -- Crew-member
05. Darth Sensitive -- BrigWith insufficient crew, some posts go empty.

Night Three will end on Monday, August 24 at noon PT (3pm ET).

[Hal Briston]

"I told you so...".If only I had told more. Ah well...back into hiatus until I'm sure I can fully participate.

Go crew!

[Scuba_Ben]

And now... Darth Sensitive's report.

We'll do our best to avenge you, Hal.

[Pleonast]

01. ColdPhoenix -- Captain
02. Chronos -- Executive Officer
03. ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies -- Chief of Security
04. Scuba_Ben -- Crew-member
05. Darth Sensitive -- BrigWrong, wrong, wrong!

This is correct:

01. ColdPhoenix -- Captain
02. ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies -- Executive Officer
03. Chronos -- Chief of Security
04. Darth Sensitive -- Brig
05. Scuba_Ben -- Crew-member

[Chronos]

Man, I knew we couldn't trust the ship's computer!

[Darth Sensitive]

And now... Darth Sensitive's report.

We'll do our best to avenge you, Hal.

ColdPhoenix is not scum.

[Pleonast]

The blinking lights of the ship's duty cycle switch to Day. A new roster is presented:01. ColdPhoenix -- Captain
02. ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies -- Executive Officer
03. Scuba_Ben -- Chief of Security
04. Darth Sensitive -- Crew-memberUpon seeing the new list, every scrambles to see what happened. Loyal crew-member Chronos has been jettisoned out the aft torpedo tube. If he survived the launch and the short traverse, he certainly did not survive the impact with the asteroid currently being targeted. And a malfunction in the Brig's circuits seems to have released Darth Sensitive.

Day Four has now started and will end Thursday August 27 at noon PT (3pm ET).


4 players outside the Brig => 3 votes to lynch. No one is lynched with these votes.

ColdPhoenix (1): ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies [95].

Arrest warrants:
Darth Sensitive by ColdPhoenix [354].

[Scuba_Ben]

Possibilities:

1. Sensitive's report was honest; ColdPhoenix is not Scum.
1a. ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies is the only Scum.
1b. Sensitive is Scum (unlikely).
1c. Both Cookies and Sensitive are Scum.

2. Sensitive's report was dishonest; ColdPhoenix is Scum.
For this to happen, Sensitive would also have to be Scum.

If two players were Scum, we'd be dead already. Therefore it has to be only one.

Case 1b is unlikely because a player in the Brig cannot use their Night actions. Therefore, Sensitive would not have been able to either kill or release emself.

Therefore, Cookies is Scum.

Vote ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies

As for the brig malfunction -- someone has a special ability as a Night action to release one or more players from the Brig. Obviously, it's not me; it's unlikely to be Sensitive. I don't think it matters whether it's CP or Cookies.

I would love to see this scenario run again with 15-ish players.

[ColdPhoenix]

Interesting. If Darth was still in the brig we'd have the game sown up.

As I see it we must have only 1 scum. If there were 2 then we'd have lost now. As (from the mutineer PM):
"You win when, at any time, the number of mutineers not in the Brig is greater than or equal to the number of loyal crew-members not in the Brig." (Am I right in assuming that we'd have lost now rather than tonight if there were 2 scum?)

Chronos was town so Scuba is definitely town
As Darth confirmed I am not scum then I am definitely town. If I were scum then Darth would be town and would have identified me as scum.

So the choice is between Cookies and Darth.

Does Darth's release tell us anything? If he were scum could he have killed Chronos if he were only released at the end of night? If not, does that mean Cookies is scum? Was he released because he was scum?

[Pleonast]

Since I'm getting confusion from all quarters, let me remind all of you:
Important tweak to the rules: The mutineers must have a strict majority of players outside the Brig to win.

[ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies]

Interesting. If Darth was still in the brig we'd have the game sown up.

As I see it we must have only 1 scum. If there were 2 then we'd have lost now. As (from the mutineer PM):
"You win when, at any time, the number of mutineers not in the Brig is greater than or equal to the number of loyal crew-members not in the Brig." (Am I right in assuming that we'd have lost now rather than tonight if there were 2 scum?)

Chronos was town so Scuba is definitely town
As Darth confirmed I am not scum then I am definitely town. If I were scum then Darth would be town and would have identified me as scum.

So the choice is between Cookies and Darth.

Does Darth's release tell us anything? If he were scum could he have killed Chronos if he were only released at the end of night? If not, does that mean Cookies is scum? Was he released because he was scum?

Darth is not confirmed, and that means neither are you. But nice try in trying to dodge the rule clarification. I had forgotten it myself and have been furiously PMing with Pleo.

What doesn't make sense from where I'm sitting, under the belief that there are 2 scum left with Scuba and I, is why you didn't just release Darth from the Brig yesterday instead of waiting to somehow release him in the Night? Coupled with the other mystery of why Inner didn't put Chronos in the Brig when he could have, there must be some funky limitations or requirements for what the mutineers can do with respect to the Brig.

Since I doubt you're willing to arrest yourself or your scum buddy Darth, all I can do at this point is vote for you both, but by all means feel free to make me wrong in that doubt.

Vote Darth

[ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies]

And Scuba, I highly recommend taking another look at things.

[ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies]

Really, Scuba. Truly. And quickly.

[Scuba_Ben]

There is a certain thought to re-arrest Sensitive.

It does work both ways, with the rule tweak.

Either Cookies or ColdPhoenix killed Chronos.

If ColdPhoenix is Scum, so is Darth Sensitive.
Cookies could be Scum by herself, or with Darth Sensitive.
Three possibilities.

And this is why I'm annoyed that Darth Sensitive "misunderstood" the rule about the timing of the Doctor's action.

Vote Darth Sensitive

I'll have to reevaluate Cookies, and the margin is too small to contain my analysis for now.

[ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies]

Are you worried he'll get out again or something? Even if he was able to, they'd assumedly have to burn a half-cycle to get him out again. Why not brig him just to be safe?

[Pleonast]

Dagnamit, I think someone has been hacking my brain and not the ship's computer...

01. ColdPhoenix -- Captain
02. ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies -- Executive Officer
03. Darth Sensitive -- Chief of Security
04. Scuba_Ben -- Crew-member

If I make another mistake on the roster, I think we can assume the super-secret Brain Slug faction has won.

[ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies]

How the heck did we all miss that? Looks like I'm the only one likely to see the inside of a cell today.

I don't understand why, Scuba, if you suspect Darth enough to vote for him, that you are giving his results on ColdPhoenix the benefit of the doubt.

[Darth Sensitive]

How the heck did we all miss that? Looks like I'm the only one likely to see the inside of a cell today.

I don't understand why, Scuba, if you suspect Darth enough to vote for him, that you are giving his results on ColdPhoenix the benefit of the doubt.

Who is "we" kemosabe?

[ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies]

"We" = anyone posting between #382 and #391 but not realizing you had been both released from the brig and demoted. I only noticed the release.

Sorry to exclude you from the club, but you have to arrive early to ride this party train.

[Darth Sensitive]

"We" = anyone posting between #382 and #391 but not realizing you had been both released from the brig and demoted. I only noticed the release.

Sorry to exclude you from the club, but you have to arrive early to ride this party train.



Personally, I just pmed the mod.

[ColdPhoenix]

a player in the Brig cannot use their Night actions. Therefore, Sensitive would not have been able to either kill or release emself.
...
As for the brig malfunction -- someone has a special ability as a Night action to release one or more players from the Brig. Obviously, it's not me; it's unlikely to be Sensitive. I don't think it matters whether it's CP or Cookies.


I missed this post last night as I just posted and logged off. Good point about the secret power.

Why would someone release Darth? I can't see town releasing him as we don't know his alignment for sure. That means scum released him. Scum released him for one of two reasons:
- to get their fellow scum out to aid in voting/killing
- to cast suspicion on Darth (if Darth's town) so that we lynch him tonight

Either ways, I'm now pretty sure that Cookies is scum, unsure about Darth and pretty sure Scuba is town.

In case Cookies isn't lynched I'll at least get an arrest warrant out there as it may help:

Arrest Cookies

But lynch is best:

Vote Cookies


But nice try in trying to dodge the rule clarification. I had forgotten it myself and have been furiously PMing with Pleo.

What doesn't make sense from where I'm sitting, under the belief that there are 2 scum left with Scuba and I, is why you didn't just release Darth from the Brig yesterday instead of waiting to somehow release him in the Night?
Yeah, you foiled my dastardly plan... Why are you so convinced that there are 2 scum? Know something I don't? Why the furious pming? Thought the game was over? I didn't release Darth because I thought he may be scum.

[ColdPhoenix]

Darth,

I see you're online. What are your thoughts on arresting Cookies?

[ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies]

I'm convinced there are 2 scum left, and that you are one of them, because

a) I know I'm loyal
b) I'm as convinced as I can be (within the realm of gastardly error) that Scuba is loyal
c) Chronos died
d) Darth was in the Brig at Dusk
e) The game wasn't declared over at Dawn

I was not the only one who had forgotten the rule clarification, hence my PMing Pleo to try and figure out what was going on. Without the reminder of the rule clarification it seemed like the game should have been over, Town wins, woot. But the game wasn't over.

Darth couldn't have killed Chronos because he was in the Brig, so someone who wasn't me and very-probably-wasn't-Scuba did it, which leaves you.

If there was only 1 scum left and Darth is Town, the game would've been over as soon as he was released, however he was released.

Anything else would involve some very gastardly reconciliation of events in the Night with respect to the limitations of the Brig, clandestine releases by Night out of the Brig, the ability to kill, and how any of those things impact that key phrase of the win condition of "at any time".

[ColdPhoenix]

That pretty much sums up where I am too (only in reverse).

Though I am unsure about your point (e). Why would Town have won the game if there were still scum alive even if they were in the brig.

The difference between our position is that I am not 100% convinced that Darth is scum (though I think he very well may be).

I guess it all comes down to Scuba and who he believes?

[ColdPhoenix]

I thought I’d have a look at where people have placed their end day vote.
I’ve looked at myself, Cookies and Darth as we’re still in the game. I’ve excluded Scuba as we’re all pretty sure he’s town. I’ve included Inner as he is our only confirmed scum.

What it shows is that Cookies and Inner have voted for me every time. Looks good for me (especially day one where I was almost lynched) that Inner was voting for me. Doesn’t look good for Cookies that she was voting in alignment with Inner.

I voted for Inner every time. Looks good for me. But Cookies and Darth also voted for inner in the Day 2 lynch.

Darth only voted twice but couldn’t vote day 3 as was brigged. Both votes were for the person who was lynched and quite late in the day. Does this indicate a less involved town player or scum jumping on the bandwagon?

Day One Final Vote Count
Normal Phase (6): ColdPhoenix [156], Inner Stickler [158], Darth Sensitive [176].
ColdPhoenix (4): ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies [95], Inner Stickler [158].
Scuba_Ben (4): ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies [137], ColdPhoenix [156]
Inner Stickler (2): ColdPhoenix [156].
Hal Briston (2): ColdPhoenix [156].

Day Two Final Vote Count
Inner Stickler (6): ColdPhoenix [156-271+282], ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies [257]. Darth Sensitive [300]
ColdPhoenix (2): ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies [95], Inner Stickler [158].
Hal Briston (1): ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies [257].
Scuba_Ben (1): Inner Stickler [269].
Chronos (1): Inner Stickler [269].

Day Three Final Vote Count
Hal Briston (4): ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies [257], ColdPhoenix [337]
ColdPhoenix (1): ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies [95].

[Pleonast]

Day Four Current Vote Count

4 players outside the Brig => 3 votes to lynch. No one is lynched with these votes.

ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies (2): Scuba_Ben [383], ColdPhoenix [396].
Darth Sensitive (2): ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies [386], Scuba_Ben [389].
ColdPhoenix (1): ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies [95].

Arrest warrants:
Darth Sensitive by ColdPhoenix [354].
ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies by ColdPhoenix [396].

[Scuba_Ben]

I guess it all comes down to Scuba and who he believes?
The Loyal crew are screwed. :( (See my endgame play in Lost Mafia.)

I don't hear either ColdPhoenix or Dark...Cookies (1) proposing a pro-Crew reason to release Darth Sensitive, or (2) admitting to doing so. So I'll go the other way:

Darth, what message did you receive when you were released from the Brig?

Firm logic, as always starting with restating the obvious:
* Chronos was Night-killed.
* Tf. either ColdPhoenix or Dark...Cookies is a Mutie.
* Whoever that was, probably released Darth Sensitive.
* Darth Sensitive is almost certainly a treasonous mutineer.
---> So who is his team-mate?

Sensitive being Scum does not automatically prove ColdPhoenix being Scum.

But this morning, it's what I'm leaning towards.

Unvote ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies
Vote ColdPhoenix


Also-also:Now, then. What I'm thinking is that toMorrow, if Hal is innocent and there's still a Night-kill, I'll ask ColdPhoenix to put out a warrant on himself, and Cookies to vote for herself. If either doesn't cooperate, I'll vote for that person. Then, at the last minute, if everyone's still in compliance, I'll make a post executing the arrest order and voting for Cookies. That will leave me, a confirmed Town, as the sole remaining player outside the Brig, which is effectively a Town win condition. Of course, if Scuba is alive instead of me, he could do the same thing.

I am now very suspicions of ColdPhoenix for issuing an arrest warrant for Cookies and not himself. Why did you do so, Phoenix?

[Darth Sensitive]

Cold not warranting himself is smart if cold doesn't know the person with the ability to arrest is protown.

Regarding my release, I simply asked the computer to "pretty please open the door" and it did.

[Scuba_Ben]

Sensitive, are you claiming a counter-Brig power?

Would such a power be pro-Crew or anti-Crew? And which are you?

[Darth Sensitive]

No power. I just ended up outside.

[Scuba_Ben]

Let's try this again.

Chronos discounted the idea that ColdPhoenix and Dark...Cookies are both Muties.

So I see four possibilities:

1. ColdPhoenix is a Mutineer, and therefore so is Darth Sensitive.
2. Dark...Cookies is the sole Mutineer.
3. Dark...Cookies and Darth Sensitive are both Mutineers.
4. Darth Sensitive is the sole Mutineer, and was able to both let himself out of the Brig and Night-kill Chronos. But this interferes with the rule that a player in the Brig can't take Night actions.

In cases 1 and 3, the Loyal Crew's pooch is truly screwed, barring some tiebreaker. In fact, in case 1, the Mutineers can force a win Today-cycle. So I dearly hope that ColdPhoenix is Loyal -- it's the only way us Crew can win.

For completeness: Darth Sensitive reported ColdPhoenix was not Scum. Either this was an accurate report, or Sensitive and ColdPhoenix are both Scum, or somebody has a power to interfere with the Doctor's exam. And nobody has claimed a power role.

In fact: Anybody with a power role, preferably a verifiable one, this would be a very very good time to claim.

Seeing as ColdPhoenix being Scum practically clinches a win for Scum, and my only chance to win is if he's Loyal:

Unvote ColdPhoenix

And still wondering about Dark...Cookies.

[ColdPhoenix]

I am now very suspicions of ColdPhoenix for issuing an arrest warrant for Cookies and not himself. Why did you do so, Phoenix?
Why would I issue an arrest warrant for myself? I know I'm loyal and there are at least 1 and potentially 2 scum on the loose?


1. ColdPhoenix is a Mutineer, and therefore so is Darth Sensitive.
...
In fact, in case 1, the Mutineers can force a win Today-cycle.

Quite right. If we were both scum them we could force a win. So we're not both scum. So we're either both town or opposing alignments. If I were scum and Darth town then he would have identified me as such. Therefore I'm town, Darth is unconfirmed and Cookies is looking dodgy.

As Darth is security I'd like him to arrest Cookies. It will be a pro-town move.

[Scuba_Ben]

1. ColdPhoenix is a Mutineer, and therefore so is Darth Sensitive.
in case 1, the Mutineers can force a win Today-cycle.

Quite right. If we were both scum them we could force a win. So we're not both scum. So we're either both town or opposing alignments. If I were scum and Darth town then he would have identified me as such. Therefore I'm town, Darth is unconfirmed and Cookies is looking dodgy.
It did occur to me that if you and Darth are both Scum, you could spend the whole Day gloating. You two haven't started gloating, so this case is not likely.

CP Scum, DS Scum -> win for Scum, no way Crew can win, so go ahead and gloat.
CP Scum, DS Town -> DS would have identified CP as Scum. This did not happen.
CP Town, DS unknown -> game continues

I agree with your conclusion, ColdPhoenix. Either DS is Scum, Cookies is Scum, or both. I am leaning towards DS being Scum with some Brig-negating ability.

But in case he's not:

Darth Sensitive, please arrest either yourself or Dark...Cookies. Then we can lynch the other.

[Pleonast]

Day Four Current Vote Count

4 players outside the Brig => 3 votes to lynch. No one is lynched with these votes.

Darth Sensitive (2): ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies [386], Scuba_Ben [389].
ColdPhoenix (1): ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies [95], Scuba_Ben [402-406].
ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies (1): Scuba_Ben [383-402], ColdPhoenix [396].

Arrest warrants:
Darth Sensitive by ColdPhoenix [354].
ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies by ColdPhoenix [396].

[Scuba_Ben]

Any pair of Scum that includes Darth Sensitive is a probable sure win for Scum, as he is Security and can arrest (or not) Dark...Cookies as necessary.

Chronos discounted the pair of ColdPhoenix and Dark...Cookies. However, if they ARE both Mutineers, Darth Sensitive can arrest Cookies and not vote.

However, Darth arresting Cookies is not meaningful, as it does not indicate whether Darth is Loyal or Scum.

Darth not arresting Cookies would be a strong indicator that Darth knows (or strongly believes) that Darth and Cookies are on the same side.

So. Darth, Cookies, how can you two demonstrate whether you two are on the same side or not, and which side that would be?

[ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies]

I have no idea why Darth hasn't put me in the brig, nor do I have any way for any confirming to take place without someone either dying or ending up in the brig.

[ColdPhoenix]

If Darth doesn't brig Cookies then as far as I'm concerned he's scum and I will be voting accordingly.

[ColdPhoenix]

Cookies, will you promote Scuba into security. If not, why not?

[Scuba_Ben]

I'm not sure that will make a difference, ColdPhoenix. The promotion takes effect at the end of the Day, after the spacing.

The only way I become Security during the Day is for somebody to get arrested.

[Darth Sensitive]

As the only person who's been in the brig, it sucks.

No porn, beer, or video games. I wouldn't wish that on anybody.

[ColdPhoenix]

Okay, we're screwed. They're both scum.

[Darth Sensitive]

Says the person who thinks I'm scum but isn't voting for me...

[ColdPhoenix]

Yeah, posted that quickly last night. I've got plenty of time to vote.

Vote Darth

If Cookies promotes Scuba then I'll think her a lot less scummy.

[Scuba_Ben]

And following up from my #408 wherin I reason that ColdPhoenix is Loyal:

Vote ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies

Just to make sure that if only one of you is Scum, I'm voting to space whichever of you it is.

[ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies]

I'm happy to do it, but I don't see that it will accomplish anything. Why would it make you feel better about my loyalty?

[ColdPhoenix]

Because then we have someone we know is loyal in security.

Please promote Scuba then.

[Pleonast]

Day Four Current Vote Count

4 players outside the Brig => 3 votes to lynch. Darth Sensitive is lynched with these votes.

Darth Sensitive (3): ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies [386], Scuba_Ben [389], ColdPhoenix [418].
ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies (2): Scuba_Ben [383-402+419], ColdPhoenix [396].
ColdPhoenix (1): ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies [95], Scuba_Ben [402-406].

Arrest warrants:
Darth Sensitive by ColdPhoenix [354].
ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies by ColdPhoenix [396].

[Pleonast]

One hour left until the end of the Day.

[Pleonast]

The Mutinous Ring-Leader Darth Sensitive is hustled out the airlock. The few remaining crew head to their Night-time stations, full of trepidation, for the Mutiny has not yet been quashed.

At the next Morning, Loyal Crew-member ColdPhoenix follows a bloody trail to an equipment locker. He has a gut-wrenching feeling, in part because of finding Loyal Mate Scuba_Ben stuffed within. In part because he now knows he is the last Loyal crew. And in part because Mutinous Cracker ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies is holding a plasma torch to his midsection.

The Mutiny has succeeded!


Thanks, everyone for playing. You're welcome to read the forbidden thread (http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=526950), the moderator's board (http://pleonast.proboards.com/index.cgi?board=insipid), and the scum board (http://pleonast.proboards.com/index.cgi?board=mutiny).

Comments, complaints and suggestions are very much welcome.

[Ichini Sanshigo]

Gosh darnit! Great game, Pleo.

[ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies]

Whew. I have been dealing with my laptop and cell phone being stolen out of my (locked and in line-of-sight of my dentist's receptionist desk at 7:00am this morning) truck. I was planning on removing my vote on Darth at the last minute. Glad that didn't end up humping us. :( All is fair, I suppose. Winning with 2 scum alive would have been a little salty in the wound. :D I kid, I kid.

Good game everyone. Thanks for thinking it up, Pleo. The dynamics of the officer powers makes this setup extremely attractive and scalable for future itterations, I think. I hope the future mods out there are taking notes!

[ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies]

I'm thinking this was a bit balanced in favor of scum, but I don't know if I'm capable of being objective. I was sure the Muties were screwed when Inner didn't get Chronos in the brig.

[ColdPhoenix]

As expected... What I don't understand is why the pretence?

[Scuba_Ben]

Good game. (You scurvy scallawags.)

I am now 2-0 when I die early, and 0-2 when I survive to the end.

Out of curiosity, what did Ring-Leader and Cracker do for the Muties, and Hacker for the Crew?

[Chronos]

I'm thinking this was a bit balanced in favor of scum, but I don't know if I'm capable of being objective.I'm inclined to agree, since it looks to me like Town basically did everything right. We only made two mislynches, and one of those, we brigged a Mutie at the same time, so it's really more like one-and-a-half mislynches. Town really shouldn't lose at that rate.

[Chronos]

Oh, and the secret boards aren't accessible.

[Tom Scud]

Agreeing with Cold that I don't really understand why Cookies and Darth didn't just dance a little "we're gonna kill you" dance once Darth was confirmed in the security chair. Worried about a day-kill or vig or something?

[ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies]

The pretense was fear that you or Cold had something like a day-kill or a night protection.

[ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies]

Cracker was me, who broke Darth out of the brig. One Night only I could break out anyone I wanted to. Ring-leader was Darth, who would have investigated as Loyal.

I'm not exactly sure what Diggit's Hacker power was described as in his PM, but we all saw it in action.

You'll see this once you get into the Scum boards, but we had our share of goofs as well. Inner missed his chance to do a scummy investigation (though that was moot as we were already killing Diggit) and I still don't know why he didn't put Chronos in the brig when he had the chance. He was already going to be sacrificed. I exposed ignorance of the town win condition in my "why I know there are 2 scum left" post towards the end, and if Darth had ever turned up dead, I think the repeated nudges for someone to investigate him would have looked pretty bad for me.

We got really lucky with Hal. :D

[Chronos]

Even a night protection wouldn't have been enough to save us: The Scum block the day-kill, the protector stops the night-kill, and we're back where we started. Continue play until the protector guesses wrong, and then Scum wins. Really, Town's only hope was a Vig. Which we didn't have, so we didn't have any hope at all.

[ColdPhoenix]

It was an enjoyable game! :D

[Normal Phase]

Hacker could make one change in position for any player. He used it to move Ichini Sanshigo to the Doctor position for day two. I thought that was a really great move, and was sort of baffled that no one guessed exactly what had happened. The other thing that I was wondering about that day was why no one ever brought up how utterly hosed Scuba and Chronos would have been with a false-mason claim if there had been any real ones around to counterclaim -- probably revealing too much about myself here in terms of how to be sure to fool me in the future, but I'd have been arguing strongly for their being Town on that basis.

As for what I did while I actually was still in the game: seems my scum-dar is so far better at picking out special town roles than scum ones. Sorry about that. :)

[Normal Phase]

Oh, and thanks Pleonast for a game that was a lot of fun to (mostly) watch. I'd love to see it run again (with changes as necessary to the hidden roles, and a few more players, preferably).

[Chronos]

Hacker could make one change in position for any player. He used it to move Ichini Sanshigo to the Doctor position for day two. I thought that was a really great move, and was sort of baffled that no one guessed exactly what had happened.I dunno, I think my guess (http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=11438248&postcount=205) was pretty close.

[Normal Phase]

Oh, it was. :) But in any case I expect the Mason claim, coming at the same time, moved the discussion mostly on to other things.

I think you and Scuba did well with that, by the way. Even right down to the fact of you both having gotten some suspicion on Day One, much as that must not have been in your plans. It kept the both of you and Ichini alive that night, I'd guess (though I haven't read that part of the scum boards).

[Pleonast]

I think the tipping point of the game was the decision to make a certain three-player confirmed bloc rather go for an uncertain four-player confirmed bloc. If you go back and reread, you'll see that scummy Cookies was pushy for the former. While the latter might seem less helpful, spreading the confirmations out make it harder for scum to kill without revealing more.

The Loyals also made a mistake of spacing Hal and brigging Darth instead of the reverse. It seemed like the lynching of Hal was primarily for information, which is fine by itself, but several town had expressed suspicion of Darth. It's always better to lynch who's the most suspicious, especially near the end game when the cost of mislynch is very high.

The fact that the town had only two mislynches from the start is a necessity of a small game. To give the town three would have meant only two scum and it would have been two easy for the town to create a large pool of confirmed. In hindsight, I probably should have made the minimum size to be 11, giving the town a half mislynch more and a better chance to win on the last Day.

I found the last option that was keeping the board closed. It shouldn't require a membership to read now.

[Pleonast]

Also for balancing, I was assuming the Town would take the tactic of using the XO to switch in a new Doctor each Day. In the best case, scum would reach a point where they could not kill a townie without confirming another one or more. The fact that the "town"'s power roles are out in the open and basically unkillable is a huge advantage to the town. Even if the role is occupied by scum, the openness would force them to pretend to act in the town's interest.

Another thing is that the player rank adds another complication to the scum's Night kill choice. They have to consider the rank changes as well as player skill and confirmation status. Basically, it makes harder for them to pick an "optimal" kill.

[DiggitCamara]

Hacker could make one change in position for any player. He used it to move Ichini Sanshigo to the Doctor position for day two. I thought that was a really great move, and was sort of baffled that no one guessed exactly what had happened. The other thing that I was wondering about that day was why no one ever brought up how utterly hosed Scuba and Chronos would have been with a false-mason claim if there had been any real ones around to counterclaim -- probably revealing too much about myself here in terms of how to be sure to fool me in the future, but I'd have been arguing strongly for their being Town on that basis.

As for what I did while I actually was still in the game: seems my scum-dar is so far better at picking out special town roles than scum ones. Sorry about that. :)

Confirminating the move. I thought that it was crucial to have Loyal Crew in that position, and a pretty well known one at that. I was debating whether I should send myself there but I wasn't confirmed. And then I died.

[Chronos]

The Loyals also made a mistake of spacing Hal and brigging Darth instead of the reverse. It seemed like the lynching of Hal was primarily for information, which is fine by itself, but several town had expressed suspicion of Darth. It's always better to lynch who's the most suspicious, especially near the end game when the cost of mislynch is very high.Before Darth used up the investigation, I was indifferent as to which way we did it, and went along with killing Hal rather than Darth since that seemed to be the easier one to get the rest of Town to agree to. After Darth used up the investigation, I would have preferred that it be the other way around, but it was too late to swap by then: ColdPhoenix had already issued the warrant, and so couldn't switch it to Hal instead, and I thought it better to get both rather than just one. And I figured that Darth being in the brig was almost as good as him being dead, since I didn't know he could be broken out.

I'm on record in the game, of course, as promoting that we spread out the Doctor investigations further. But no crying over spilt milk, I suppose.

And incidentally, not to gloat, but I'd like to point out that my vote-analysis program worked beautifully: The three Scum were all in the top four suspects, with Hal looking bad mostly just because he was playing so little. One very pro-Town aspect of these game rules is that the multiple votes get a lot of information out, very quickly.

[Pleonast]

I love the multi-vote system; I'm using it in all my future games. I think storyteller used it first. Besides making the vote analysis more interesting, it encourages players to participate more. By making votes "cheap" (since everyone can have as many as they like) it pushes player to vote more. And more votes means more discussion and even more votes. It makes for extra bookkeeping for the moderator, but it's worth it.

Plug for my next game: Conspiracy 3: Three is the Charm (http://psychopathgame.proboards.com/index.cgi?board=game16) over on our off-site Mafia board.

[Chronos]

It makes for extra bookkeeping for the moderator, but it's worth it.Oh, and I wanted to thank you for the detail you put into your vote counts. It made it a heck of a lot easier for me than digging through my notes to see who voted for whom and when.

The flip side of the coin is that the majority requirement made it a lot harder for Town: We weren't seeing who we could get the most votes on, but seeing if there was anyone we could get above the threshold at all. That's probably a fair trade-off for the advantages of multi-vote, though.

[Pleonast]

I put the detail in because I track it anyway and it makes it easier for counting mistakes to be corrected. As a player I like to do voting analysis similar to what you do, so I like to encourage other as well.

The majority requirement I'm a little iffy on. In my previous game (Munchkin) I didn't require it. That led to lazy players letting the lynch be decided by a third or fewer players. By requiring a majority, it forces players to actually commit to the lynch. I think it's actually pro-Town (in the early game at least) because it generates a bigger voting record to work with.

In my next game, I'm changing the requirement to one-half the players (so 3 out of 6, instead of 4). Requiring an actual majority makes it tough for the town when it's near end game. This is especially true for a mini-game which basically starts out in "mid"-game.

[ShadowFacts]

While my monitoring of this game fell off a bit toward the end, I did try to keep current and I enjoyed watching it spoiled. I think it's a set-up definitely worth trying again, though I think I would set 15 players as the minimum. The position changing really added a whole new strategy element that was fun to watch everyone work with.

Nice job, Pleo!

[Meeko]

Having only skimmed this games three or four times, I can only imagine what advanced Mafia games and "Meeko" would look like.