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View Full Version : "Tuna fish" - why aren't any other kinds of fish redundant?


Argent Towers
11-02-2009, 09:05 PM
People often say "tuna fish" when they're talking about tuna. It seems to be chiefly used when referring to the food, and not to the actual living fish. Furthermore it seems only to apply to canned, shredded tuna; you never hear a person (or a menu) speak of tuna fish sushi, seared tuna fish steak, or anything like that. "Tuna" can be high-class fare, but "tuna fish" is the domain of cheap sandwiches alone.

No other fish has this redundant name. Nobody talks about salmon fish, or trout fish, or anything like that. Every now and then you will see "codfish" used, but even that is fairly rare and seems to only be used in conjunction with oil, extract or other products made from the cod - never a food.

Why is this? Does anyone know?

panache45
11-02-2009, 09:23 PM
I've wondered about this myself. But there are fish that have "fish" in their name, like goldfish. I agree that "tuna fish" is redundant.

Rysdad
11-02-2009, 09:29 PM
Gefilte fish?

Well, maybe not. I've never heard of a school of gefiltes.

John Mace
11-02-2009, 09:35 PM
Sunfish. Parrot Fish. Puffer Fish. Starfish (which aren't fish, but still).

Polycarp
11-02-2009, 09:37 PM
Gefilte fish?

Well, maybe not. I've never heard of a school of gefiltes.

Isn't a school of gefiltes where they learn how to make those mail-order coffeemakers? :D

Seriously, I'm under the (possibly mistaken) impression that gefillte- is Yiddish for "filleted" or something similar.

Harmonious Discord
11-02-2009, 09:38 PM
Lionfish

Argent Towers
11-02-2009, 09:43 PM
Sunfish. Parrot Fish. Puffer Fish. Starfish (which aren't fish, but still).

This stuff doesn't really count because if the word "fish" weren't there, the word would have a completely different meaning. The equivalent to what I'm talking about would be to say "sunfish fish" or somesuch.

ETA: a bar here has, on the menu, a "CATFISH FISH SANDWICH".

Harmonious Discord
11-02-2009, 09:49 PM
Perhaps it was to be sure people knew it was the fish and not the cactus fruit which is edible also. Tuna (http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/tuna)

KneadToKnow
11-02-2009, 09:51 PM
Lionfish

I hear you eat those kind of like artichokes, but I've never had the pleasure.

Qadgop the Mercotan
11-02-2009, 09:51 PM
Well, tuna is a type of cactus, too. So if you didn't specify tuna fish, you might mean tuna cactus.

TokyoBayer
11-02-2009, 09:59 PM
Blame REO.

TWDuke
11-02-2009, 10:01 PM
It seems to me that I hear "tuna fish" a lot less often than I used to. It has kind of an old-fashioned ring to me.

Googling turns up many more instances of "tuna sandwich" than "tuna fish sandwich." Similarly, "tuna salad" vs. "tuna fish salad."

On an only slightly related note, the breed commonly known as German Shepherd is called German Shepherd Dog by the American Kennel Club and other registries. In this case, it's a direct translation from the German.

WarmNPrickly
11-02-2009, 10:02 PM
Blame REO.

Speedwagon? What did they do?

Qadgop the Mercotan
11-02-2009, 10:03 PM
Speedwagon? What did they do?
You're kidding, right?

You Can.... (http://www.speedwagon.com/database/showalbum.pl?8)

Yllaria
11-02-2009, 10:16 PM
To be fair, the joke was around long before the band was, so you can't blame them completely.

Captain Amazing
11-02-2009, 10:19 PM
Seriously, I'm under the (possibly mistaken) impression that gefillte- is Yiddish for "filleted" or something similar.

Stuffed.

WarmNPrickly
11-02-2009, 10:48 PM
You're kidding, right?

You Can.... (http://www.speedwagon.com/database/showalbum.pl?8)
Sorry, I am not familiar with the REO Speedwagon discography.

Siam Sam
11-02-2009, 10:53 PM
You can tune a piano, but you can't tuna fish.

Well, someone had to say it!

yabob
11-03-2009, 12:19 AM
Every now and then you will see "codfish" used, but even that is fairly rare and seems to only be used in conjunction with oil, extract or other products made from the cod - never a food.
Food - codfish balls.

(Yeah, I know - you never realized fish HAD them)

Shagnasty
11-03-2009, 12:27 AM
Well, tuna is a type of cactus, too. So if you didn't specify tuna fish, you might mean tuna cactus.

I made that mistake too many times to count in restaurants. I usually just blush when the food comes out and eat it anyway.

Duckster
11-03-2009, 12:33 AM
"Fish, and visitors, smell in three days."
-- Ben Franklin

We have a time limit on this thread, folks.

Cunctator
11-03-2009, 12:59 AM
Is it an Americanism? People here don't add the extra word 'fish'. It's just a 'tuna sandwich', a 'can of tuna' etc.

Girl From Mars
11-03-2009, 01:15 AM
Yeah - I've not heard 'tuna fish' in either the UK, NZ or Australia. Perhaps it comes from advertising in the US, which is why it's more common there?

Chief Pedant
11-03-2009, 05:47 AM
I see the term "tuna fish" most typically applied to canned (or in modern times, packaged) tuna to distinguish the canned fish from, say, salmon.

The term itself has a certain nice roll off the tongue so that it becomes easy to say even when it's clearly redundant.

Harmonious Discord
11-03-2009, 06:28 AM
Tuna is cactus fruit that has been eaten by people in the southwestern USA and Mexico for a long time. I'm sure the addition of the word fish by English speakers was to make sure it was clear they meant the fish and not the fruit. Where would this use of the additional word fish spread from? It would spread from the regions that had Spanish and English speakers. Tuna or Prickly Pear is grown commercially for market like we grow apples in the the northern USA. There is a large enough area of the mixing of cultures to require that distinction of fish after Tuna in common speech.

Anaglyph
11-03-2009, 07:52 AM
You can tune a piano, but you can't tuna fish.

Well, someone had to say it!

Of course you can can tuna fish. How do you think canned tuna (canned tuna) is produced? Tuna canneries can tuna.

Qadgop the Mercotan
11-03-2009, 08:39 AM
Sorry, I am not familiar with the REO Speedwagon discography.
:eek:

Next you'll be telling me that you don't know all the Bee Gees albums, either.

;)

panache45
11-03-2009, 09:34 AM
Stuffed.

Except that gefilte fish isn't stuffed.

Kimstu
11-03-2009, 09:35 AM
Tuna is cactus fruit that has been eaten by people in the southwestern USA and Mexico for a long time. I'm sure the addition of the word fish by English speakers was to make sure it was clear they meant the fish and not the fruit.

I doubt it. The use of names like "tunny fish", German "Thunfisch", Swedish "Tonfisk", etc., by speakers of Germanic languages to refer to the fish Thunnus thynnus appears to have been common long before English speakers in general knew that there was such a thing as the tuna cactus.

The substitution of the word "tuna" in English for its more traditional synonym "tunny" does seem to have been influenced by Spanish-American usage, but that didn't happen till the late 19th century, centuries after the appearance of "tunny fish" and its cognates in Germanic languages.

King Friday
11-03-2009, 09:53 AM
Dolphin fish.

RealityChuck
11-03-2009, 10:17 AM
1. There is nothing wrong with redundancy in language. In fact, it's an important component, not a flaw.

2. "Tuna fish" was just how people decided to use the term. It's likely that, when it was first being served, people didn't know what "tuna" was (it looks like canned tuna is just over 100 years old). So when restaurants first served it (and groceries first stocked it), they called it "tuna fish" to give their patrons an idea of what it was they were serving.

Ludovic
11-03-2009, 10:21 AM
It would be an important distinction if you were visiting the hill of the elves in Aman.

Captain Amazing
11-03-2009, 10:27 AM
Except that gefilte fish isn't stuffed.

You skin and debone the fish, then grind it, mix it with flour or breadcrumbs, and then stuff it back in the skin.

Freudian Slit
11-03-2009, 10:29 AM
I've heard flounder fish.

garygnu
11-03-2009, 10:38 AM
Dolphin fish.
Mahi Mahi: talk about redundancy.

Polycarp
11-03-2009, 11:00 AM
As a matter of usage, the aquatic vertebrate is a tuna (no fish); its flesh, usually canned but sometimes served as a steak, is 'tuna fish' -- much like the distinction between pig and pork, or between cattle and beef.

Colibri
11-03-2009, 11:52 AM
Tuna is cactus fruit that has been eaten by people in the southwestern USA and Mexico for a long time. I'm sure the addition of the word fish by English speakers was to make sure it was clear they meant the fish and not the fruit. Where would this use of the additional word fish spread from? It would spread from the regions that had Spanish and English speakers. Tuna or Prickly Pear is grown commercially for market like we grow apples in the the northern USA. There is a large enough area of the mixing of cultures to require that distinction of fish after Tuna in common speech.

Surely not true. "Tuna fish" was commonly used in New York in the 1950s when I was growing up. We had absolutely no idea that the cactus fruit existed, much less what it was called. I remember seeing some for sale for the first time in a supermarket in the late 1960s or early 1970s, when it was labeled "prickly pear fruit," not "tuna." Tuna fish was used long before there was any need to make the distinction; and when it was, the distinction was made by calling the fruit something else.

Harmonious Discord
11-03-2009, 11:59 AM
It can't be true because you never knew something existed is not true.

The fruit and name has been around for centuries. The need for a distinction would have been generated in the southwest and moved out from there. Only one person selling the stuff canned would have needed to see a reason to add the word fish to the can for distinction and it would have spread.

I'm saying it's a viable reason for the usage and nobody has proven it's not. It should be considered if someone looks for the origin.

WarmNPrickly
11-03-2009, 12:05 PM
Dolphin fish.

er...tuna mammal?

Colibri
11-03-2009, 12:07 PM
It can't be true because you never knew something existed is not true.

The fruit and name has been around for centuries. The need for a distinction would have been generated in the southwest and moved out from there. Only one person selling the stuff canned would have needed to see a reason to add the word fish to the can for distinction and it would have spread.

Even if there were the need for a distinction in the southwest, there is no reason for it to have spread to areas, such as New York or most of the rest of the country where no distinction was necessary. Your explanation is pure speculation, without a shred of evidence in its favor and contradicted by the usage of the word in New York in the 1950s. You're going to have to provide some kind of cite for it to be considered remotely credible.

Kimstu
11-03-2009, 12:40 PM
Yes, the substitution of the word "tuna" for the more traditional English word "tunny" to refer to the tuna-fish does seem to have been influenced by American Spanish-speakers (http://www.agriculturalproductsindia.com/marine-food-supplies/marine-food-supplies-tuna.html), although apparently not with any reference to the tuna cactus:

The word 'tuna' dates back to 1880 in print and its origin is attributed to Spanish American derivation of the English counterpart, tunny.


No, the combination of the word "tuna" with the word "fish" by English speakers did NOT originate as an attempt to distinguish the tuna fish from the tuna cactus. Speakers of Germanic languages, including English, have been using that combination ("tunny-fish", "Thunfisch", etc.) for several centuries. The term "tonny fishe" appears, for example, in an English translation of Plutarch by Sir Thomas North published in 1579.


The fruit and name has been around for centuries. The need for a distinction would have been generated in the southwest and moved out from there. Only one person selling the stuff canned would have needed to see a reason to add the word fish to the can for distinction and it would have spread.

I'm saying it's a viable reason for the usage and nobody has proven it's not. It should be considered if someone looks for the origin.

Your hypothesis is disproven by the evidence given above. English speakers have been commonly using the term "tunny fish" for tuna for centuries before English speakers became aware of the existence or name of the tuna cactus.

Really Not All That Bright
11-03-2009, 12:45 PM
Is it an Americanism? People here don't add the extra word 'fish'. It's just a 'tuna sandwich', a 'can of tuna' etc.
Yes. Cod is rendered the same way in American usage - cod fish, or sometimes even codfish.

Colibri
11-03-2009, 01:18 PM
Yes, the substitution of the word "tuna" for the more traditional English word "tunny" to refer to the tuna-fish does seem to have been influenced by American Spanish-speakers (http://www.agriculturalproductsindia.com/marine-food-supplies/marine-food-supplies-tuna.html), although apparently not with any reference to the tuna cactus:

It should be noted that the word in Spanish is atun. According to Merriam-Webster (http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/tuna), the etymology is:

Etymology: American Spanish, alteration of Spanish atún, modification of Arabic tūn, from Latin thunnus, from Greek thynnos
Date: 1881

In today's Spanish (at least, according to all dictionaries I have available), tuna refers only to the fruit (although there are some slang usages), not the fish, which is atún. The fruit's name is derived from Taino, and entered Spanish about 1555. But in English, it is much more commonly called prickly pear. Merriam-Webster gives the date of prickly pear as 1612.

BMax
11-03-2009, 01:52 PM
Yes. Cod is rendered the same way in American usage - cod fish, or sometimes even codfish.
No doubt to distinguish it from the codpeice.

Shot From Guns
11-03-2009, 02:20 PM
Interestingly, Japanese also makes the distinction between what in U.S. English we'd call tuna vs. tuna fish.

鮪 maguro is used when talking about something like tuna sashimi, a tuna steak, etc.
ツナ tsuna is canned tuna.

Johanna
11-03-2009, 04:36 PM
Imagine if we named all food that way. "Chicken bird salad." "Beef quadruped burger." "Lobster crustacean bisque." "Peanut legume butter sandwich." etc.

Etymologically, the names tuna, tunny, Thunnus, thynnus, etc. may be derived from a word in a Semitic language, possibly Phoenician, that means some sort of sea monster. Compare the similar Hebrew word for 'giant fish', tanin (http://www.balashon.com/2006/11/tuna.html). It can also refer to a giant snake, and the related Arabic word tinnin means 'dragon'. The initial a- in Spanish atun comes from the Arabic definite article al- which is assimilated to the following initial t-, so Arabic al-tun is pronounced "at-tun," and Spanish reduces the doubled consonant sounds to single consonants.

Really Not All That Bright
11-03-2009, 04:39 PM
So what you're saying is... tuna are killers?

Shot From Guns
11-03-2009, 04:41 PM
"Peanut legume butter sandwich."

Ahem.

The Hamster King
11-03-2009, 04:46 PM
Well, tuna is a type of cactus, too. So if you didn't specify tuna fish, you might mean tuna cactus.Or perhaps Tirion Upon Tuna. There's a local deli here that serves that.

Kimstu
11-03-2009, 04:50 PM
"Peanut legume butter sandwich."

Ahem.

But the so-called pea-nut is actually a legume rather than a nut, so adding "legume" to the name is corrective as well as redundant!

Like "crawfish crustacean bisque", for example.

Polycarp
11-03-2009, 04:52 PM
Or perhaps Tirion Upon Tuna. There's a local deli here that serves that.

Do they accept payment in Tolkiens? ')

Leaffan
11-03-2009, 04:54 PM
In Canada we do not say "tuna fish." The term is "tuna."

I am completely aware that in the U.S. you use the redundant term.

What sayest the rest of the planet: fish or no fish?

Kimstu
11-03-2009, 05:09 PM
What sayest the rest of the planet: fish or no fish?

Well, as I think I may have mentioned before, the Germans say "Thunfisch", while the Swedes say "tonfisk", the Icelanders say "túnfiskur", and the Danes and Norwegians say "tunfisk".

Moreover, the rest of the English-speaking world used to say "tunny fish", and they still do sometimes, so you needn't get up on your high horse-mackerel ;) about the "redundancy" of the US name.

astro
11-03-2009, 06:04 PM
It even has it's own song. (http://www.greaseman.org/sounds/jasonz/815-TunaFishSong.mp3)

jakesteele
11-03-2009, 07:02 PM
I don't know much about fish, but does Porky the Pig count?

Skywatcher
11-03-2009, 07:10 PM
It even has it's own song. (http://www.greaseman.org/sounds/jasonz/815-TunaFishSong.mp3)Tuna Grease!

Colibri
11-03-2009, 08:37 PM
I don't know much about fish, but does Porky the Pig count?

No, but Pigmeat Markham (http://blog.wfmu.org/photos/uncategorized/2007/08/21/pigmeat_markham_2.jpg) does.

Siam Sam
11-03-2009, 10:41 PM
In Thai, the word "fish" is appended onto every type of fish, only at the beginning, not the end. The word is pla, and "tuna fish" is pla tuna (they use the English word "tuna"). But pla is stuck on every type of fish -- pla-this and pla-that.

The same with all birds (nok). It's not a parrot, but a "parrot bird" (nok kaew). (That actually translates literally to "glass bird.")

Shot From Guns
11-04-2009, 10:45 AM
But the so-called pea-nut is actually a legume rather than a nut, so adding "legume" to the name is corrective as well as redundant!

Well, yes, but Ye Olden Dayes people didn't know that. So peanut is already kind of doubly including its type in its name (It's a pea! It's a nut!).

In Canada we do not say "tuna fish." The term is "tuna."

So how do you distinguish between the canned/processed kind and the fresh kind?

What sayest the rest of the planet: fish or no fish?

As I've observed upthread, Japanese uses separate terms for canned vs. fresh, but neither of them explicitly includes the word for "fish."

I don't know much about fish, but does Porky the Pig count?

Smokey Bear?

Leaffan
11-04-2009, 11:42 AM
So how do you distinguish between the canned/processed kind and the fresh kind?


I dunno. Tuna is tuna. I suppose we might use tuna steak, or tuna fillet on a menu or something, but a tuna sandwich is a tuna sandwich.

Thudlow Boink
11-04-2009, 12:24 PM
Imagine if we named all food that way. "Chicken bird salad." "Beef quadruped burger." "Lobster crustacean bisque." "Peanut legume butter sandwich." etc."Grape fruit" ;)

tallcoldone
11-04-2009, 01:24 PM
What has two knees and swims? tunny fish.

I keep my tuna fish in my cherrywood cabinet.

Gymnopithys
11-04-2009, 02:31 PM
silverfish (an insect), crayfish

Wile E
11-04-2009, 05:06 PM
I think from now on when I order a turkey sandwich I will say I want a "turkey-bird" sandwich so they won't get it confused with the country.

garygnu
11-04-2009, 05:09 PM
How on earth will you order chili?

Leo Bloom
11-04-2009, 09:46 PM
Although fish wiggle, in a loose manner of speaking, the second fish is left off of tuna wiggle, so in a sense they _should_ use "fish" to make the point of the dish clear.

j_sum1
11-04-2009, 10:47 PM
Jessica Simpson once famously asked if she was eating chicken or fish when chowing into a tin of tuna. It seems the brand name was chicken of the sea and it was more than enough to confuse her. Her husband wasn't able to help her.
And that's what reality tv does for you.

t-bonham@scc.net
11-05-2009, 02:14 AM
2. "Tuna fish" was just how people decided to use the term. It's likely that, when it was first being served, people didn't know what "tuna" was (it looks like canned tuna is just over 100 years old). So when restaurants first served it (and groceries first stocked it), they called it "tuna fish" to give their patrons an idea of what it was they were serving.I think I agree with RealityChuck here. I hear the term 'tuna fish' most often from the older generations. I remember my Grandmother telling me that she remembered when tuna was first introduced, and how there were lots of recipes telling how to use this 'new' food, and how it was an exciting, cutting-edge thing to serve. Including a lot of comments that it could be used in as a replacement for chicken almost any recipe (even to a brand name Chicken of the Sea). This was all astonishing to me, having grown up with various tuna casseroles as a staple of church dinners or pot-luck suppers. As she said, they called it "tuna fish" so people knew what it was -- no one around there had ever heard of "tuna" before.

dtilque
11-06-2009, 02:57 AM
"Grape fruit" ;)
Also kiwifruit.

A variety of berries: raspberry, strawberry, huckleberry, whortleberry, marionberry, blackberry, blueberry, cranberry, etc.

Walnut. And Beer Nuts :)

silverfish (an insect), crayfish
Crayfish are a crustacean.

Thudlow Boink
11-06-2009, 08:31 AM
What has two knees and swims? tunny fish.I didn't get this for the longest time. You mean "tunny" doesn't rhyme with "sunny" or "runny"?

yabob
11-06-2009, 10:39 AM
I didn't get this for the longest time. You mean "tunny" doesn't rhyme with "sunny" or "runny"?
Yeah, that's just lunny.

tallcoldone
11-06-2009, 12:00 PM
Yeah, that's just lunny.

OK, how about toonie fish?

Or, on another phonetic tangent, maybe toonie ghoti?

Johanna
11-07-2009, 05:54 AM
How on earth will you order chili?
"Chili pepper berry con quadruped carne"

As she said, they called it "tuna fish" so people knew what it was -- no one around there had ever heard of "tuna" before.
Your theory actually makes a lot of sense. That reminds me of a novel by Beverly Cleary that was written in the early 1950s (it might have been Beezus and Ramona, I don't remember exactly because I read all the Beverly Cleary books one after another when I was in 3rd grade). They referred to "pizza pie" and to me in the late 1960s, when pizza had become an American staple, "pizza pie" already sounded odd. It was like back then, pizza was still considered an exotic foreign dish that had to have "pie" appended so that americani could understand what it was. Cleary was from Oregon, where it probably took pizza "pie" longer to catch on in the '50s; if she'd been from New York City, there would have been no need to append a food category to its name.

Balthisar
11-07-2009, 09:33 AM
I distinctly recall people saying "tuna fish" when growing up in SE Michigan, but for some reason I've never picked up that habit myself. It's just "tuna" whether it be a fish, steak, or some macerated tissue from a can (also, macerated tissue from a can is the only tuna I really knew when growing up).

Perhaps it was to be sure people knew it was the fish and not the cactus fruit which is edible also. Tuna (http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/tuna)
As has already been pointed out, that's not the case. However, really? Where do we use "tuna" in English to refer to the prickly pear? It's always been "prickly pear" my entire life, and I had no idea that they were called "tunas" until I arrived at tuna HQ in Mexico about 10 years ago.


Dolphin fish.

er...tuna mammal?

I actually came here to mention "dolphin fish" because if you just say that you want to go fishing for "dolphin," people think you're a cruel, heartless bastard. I've always heard of "dolphin fish" when growing up, but for some reason "mahi mahi" seems to have become popularized instead. I also see/hear the Spanish "dorado" being used more and more often on American menus and in speech.

John Mace
11-07-2009, 12:44 PM
Your theory actually makes a lot of sense. That reminds me of a novel by Beverly Cleary that was written in the early 1950s (it might have been Beezus and Ramona, I don't remember exactly because I read all the Beverly Cleary books one after another when I was in 3rd grade). They referred to "pizza pie" and to me in the late 1960s, when pizza had become an American staple, "pizza pie" already sounded odd. It was like back then, pizza was still considered an exotic foreign dish that had to have "pie" appended so that americani could understand what it was. Cleary was from Oregon, where it probably took pizza "pie" longer to catch on in the '50s; if she'd been from New York City, there would have been no need to append a food category to its name.

Although I rarely, if ever, hear "pizza pie" anymore, it's not uncommon to hear a pizza referred to as a "pie". I believe I heard that in a pizza joint commercial just the other day. Something like: "Here at PizzaLand, we make a really good pie." Some of my friends use that term as well.

LSLGuy
11-07-2009, 12:58 PM
At least in the US, the "pie" in "pizza pie" is very regional. In NYC, the pie is almost universal. To the point that if some asks if you want a pie with no other context, pizza is more likely meant than dessert.

In the south or southwest, pie is almost always a baked dessert & pizza almost always has just that one word in its name.

Elsewhere there's a blend. And of course the US is getting ever more homogenized. Whether the use of pie in connection with pizza is growing or shrinking I have no clue.

Balthisar
11-07-2009, 06:39 PM
At least in the US, the "pie" in "pizza pie" is very regional. In NYC, the pie is almost universal. To the point that if some asks if you want a pie with no other context, pizza is more likely meant than dessert.

In the south or southwest, pie is almost always a baked dessert & pizza almost always has just that one word in its name.

Elsewhere there's a blend. And of course the US is getting ever more homogenized. Whether the use of pie in connection with pizza is growing or shrinking I have no clue.

In Michigan -- definitely not the south or the southwest -- I'd expect a pie to be a bona fide pie, not pizza. Pizza's pizza. "Pizza pie" is something that Dean Martin needs for rhyming. Or stereotypical Italians would say.

Siam Sam
11-07-2009, 07:54 PM
At least in the US, the "pie" in "pizza pie" is very regional. In NYC, the pie is almost universal. To the point that if some asks if you want a pie with no other context, pizza is more likely meant than dessert.

In the south or southwest, pie is almost always a baked dessert & pizza almost always has just that one word in its name.

Elsewhere there's a blend. And of course the US is getting ever more homogenized. Whether the use of pie in connection with pizza is growing or shrinking I have no clue.

In Michigan -- definitely not the south or the southwest -- I'd expect a pie to be a bona fide pie, not pizza. Pizza's pizza. "Pizza pie" is something that Dean Martin needs for rhyming. Or stereotypical Italians would say.

Did anyone else grow up with "pot pies"? Little round meat pies you would heat up in the oven pre-microwave days. A smaller, inferior form of the British meat pie found in pubs.

I really like those British and Irish meat pies. There's even an Aussie version here. The best ones, IMHO, are made with Guinness stout. Really.

John Mace
11-07-2009, 07:57 PM
Did anyone else grow up with "pot pies"? Little round meat pies you would heat up in the oven pre-microwave days. A smaller, inferior form of the British meat pie found in pubs.

Yes. We liked them, but I couldn't imagine giving that to a child today. Probably loaded with salt and fat. The British pub food version is probably not much healthier, but they do taste great.

Shot From Guns
11-09-2009, 01:28 PM
Did anyone else grow up with "pot pies"?

We would actually make tuna (hah!) pot pie. These were usually at least partly home-made, though, versus buying a frozen thing you'd pop in the oven, if that's what you meant.

Interestingly enough, while I hated pot pies (something about the way the pastry part would get all slimy on the inside), I loved my dad's pasties.

Wile E
11-09-2009, 02:47 PM
"Chili pepper berry con quadruped carne"

....

That could be a little too non-specific, after all rats, mice and porcupines are quadrupeds but I don't want them in my chili.

Thudlow Boink
11-09-2009, 03:54 PM
Yes. We liked them, but I couldn't imagine giving that to a child today.I give 'em to myself, every once in a while. File under "comfort food."

Johanna
11-15-2009, 12:18 PM
they called it "tuna fish" so people knew what it was -- no one around there had ever heard of "tuna" before.
As another corroborating example, we see the same thing happening in America now with the phrase "chai tea." That always cracks me up, because chai is nothing but the Hindi word for tea itself-- tea in general, any kind of tea at all. A plain Lipton's bag is called chai in Hindi. The Hindi word is unmarked, it's just the everyday generic word. But as a foreignism, a marked form, it becomes taken as a name for some exotic beverage. So we make the redundant phrase "chai tea" so Americans will know what it is. The beverage that Americans call "chai tea" is actually called masala chai in India, because masala means 'spice blend'.

SCAdian
08-30-2012, 11:01 PM
Did anyone else grow up with "pot pies"? Little round meat pies you would heat up in the oven pre-microwave days. A smaller, inferior form of the British meat pie found in pubs.

Yes. We liked them, but I couldn't imagine giving that to a child today. Probably loaded with salt and fat.

I give 'em to myself, every once in a while. File under "comfort food."

Now that they come in cardboard dishes, vice aluminium, and can be nuked, I buy them occasionally for breakfast. Put one in the microwave and let it cook while I go shower....