Should We Invite the Whole Class?

[winneee]

My son is turning six in a few months and I have noticed this year that some parents are not inviting the whole class to parties, as in prior years. (He is in Kindergarten and he has been there since PK3). I am still of the mindset that they are so young that I do not want to exclude anyone.

However, my son recently had an incident (at another birthday party) where a kid with some behavioral issues (not terrible, he's more aggressive than the other children, can't keep him hands to himself) crashed into him and accidentally broke my son's arm. I never heard from the child's parents but the child himself apologized when they got back to school (it happened over the holiday break) and my son accepted his apology.

Now my son says that he does not want to invite this particular child to his birthday party. I said OK. Then we went over the class list and there is another child that he does not want to invite because she twisted his finger (another somewhat aggressive child who seems to have some issues with biting and hitting). I said OK again but feel badly about excluding 2 kids out of 18. (We are having the party at our house and can have as many kids as we want).

I have seen him in action with both of the kids and they are friendly. Both seem to be basically good kids. On one hand, I feel that it should be his choice who he wants at his party, ESPECIALLY when both kids in question have been aggressive with him. On the other hand, they are 5 and 6, and maybe I should not let him make this decision when it can cause hurt feelings that he may not understand the decision will cause.

I am really at a loss as to what to do and am curious as to what others would do.

Thanks for any help :)

[Oakminster]

A guy that broke my arm ain't getting invited to my house for any damn reason.

I think your kid is right.

[Hampshire]

Excluding 2 out of 18 kids in the same class seems like a harsh thing to lay on a 5 year-old. I'd either bite the bullet and invite all of them or keep the party small and tell your son to only invite 4-5 kids.

[Grapefruit]

In this case, I think you should invite the whole class. Not that I think everyone should be included just in case some little darling's feelings get hurt... but not inviting two people out of the whole class might create problems down the line. Just think about the two kids that didn't go to the party but have to endure the other kids talking about it. While your kid has the right to have whoever he wants at his party, at the age of six, it's a better opportunity for you to teach him to get to know people better, and give them second chances.

Now, if you were talking about inviting five children out of that class, that would be different.

[Oakminster]

A second chance? WTF, you want the kid to get his OTHER arm broken? Note that I would not be passing out invitations at school, either. Mail them to the invited kids.

[Grapefruit]

A second chance? WTF, you want the kid to get his OTHER arm broken? Note that I would not be passing out invitations at school, either. Mail them to the invited kids.

Did you read the part in the OP where it was an accident? They're kids, accidents happen. I place more blame on the parents not keeping an eye and making sure that it didn't go from rowdy to reckless.

[winneee]

Believe me, I am not taking my son's broken arm lightly. It was a traumatic event (more for me than for him, I think). However, it was an accident. Granted, the accident may not have happened if that particular child were better behaved, but it was still an accident. If he were to be at the party, we will watch him very closely (part of the issue is that whoever takes him to parties doesn't supervise) and ask him/them to leave if he starts acting up. Period.

[Oakminster]

Your kid does not want him there. With damn fine reason. Maybe he's afraid of the arm breaker. Maybe he's mad about getting his arm broken. Whatever. The kid has known behavior problems. Why take a chance?

[Beadalin]

I thought a good rule of thumb is to invite as many kids as the age your kid is turning. So, five or six other kids should be at the party if you're not going to invite the whole class. At six, a kid is old enough to choose his own friends.

And IF you're not going to include the whole class, just distribute the invitations outside of school.

[Rigamarole]

Life is all about exclusion. May as well start 'em young.

[TriPolar]

Definitely don't invite Oakminster.

Otherwise this rule should apply to everybody. If you invite more than half of a group to something, you have to invite the rest. Maybe there's a better way to quantify the cricitical proportion, but if you don't do that it's an intentional insult, and reflects badly on you in the case of a parent.

Of course I intentionally insult people all the time. I don't do everything I should do.

[winneee]

I will definitely mail the invitations versus distributing through school. I am leaning toward telling him to pick ten kids.

Thank you for the replies - it is really helping.

[Suburban Plankton]

So there are two kids that your son does not want to invite. What about all of the others? Is it the case that necessarily "wants" all of them at his party, or is it just that he doesn't "not want" the others? Is he close friends with everyone in his class, or are there a handful of kids that he's particularly close to?

If it were me, I'd have him pick 5 or 6 classmates. But I personally wouldn't want 18 6-year olds running around my house...it would drive me nuts...

[winneee]

Definitely don't invite Oakminster.

Otherwise this rule should apply to everybody. If you invite more than half of a group to something, you have to invite the rest. Maybe there's a better way to quantify the cricitical proportion, but if you don't do that it's an intentional insult, and reflects badly on you in the case of a parent.

Of course I intentionally insult people all the time. I don't do everything I should do.

Make that NINE. I am leaning toward telling him to invite NINE kids. ;)

[winneee]

So there are two kids that your son does not want to invite. What about all of the others? Is it the case that necessarily "wants" all of them at his party, or is it just that he doesn't "not want" the others? Is he close friends with everyone in his class, or are there a handful of kids that he's particularly close to?

If it were me, I'd have him pick 5 or 6 classmates. But I personally wouldn't want 18 6-year olds running around my house...it would drive me nuts...

It is that he doesn't want the two, not that he particularly wants the other 15. I think if I limited it to nine, he would pick out who he really wants, and that probably is the way it should be anyway.

[purplehorseshoe]

I bet your prediction about the other 15 is right. This sounds like a good solution. Oh, and hey - happy birthday MiniWinneee.

[neuroman]

Excluding 2 out of 18 kids in the same class seems like a harsh thing to lay on a 5 year-old. I'd either bite the bullet and invite all of them or keep the party small and tell your son to only invite 4-5 kids.

I think a good rule-of-thumb is either invite half the class or less, or invite them all.

[Shagnasty]

Your kid does not want him there. With damn fine reason. Maybe he's afraid of the arm breaker. Maybe he's mad about getting his arm broken. Whatever. The kid has known behavior problems. Why take a chance?

Your Honor, I object to this line of questioning on the grounds that it is leading the witness.

Sustained.

Ok, little kids get hurt sometimes by other kids. I wouldn't be too happy about a broken arm on one of my snowflakes either but they sound like decent kids that had something unfortunate happen and it hurts both of them. As stated before, you can either have a small party with just a few selected friends from the class or invite the whole class. That is proper etiquette for a small child's birthday party.

[Miss Woodhouse]

You may be able to invite all the people you want to your own home but do you really want to. After you send out 18 invitations you have to deal with 19 Kindergartners running all over your home and keeping them all entertained. There are very few games that work for a group that large and it limits other things as well.

I would let your son invite the kids he actively wants to invite. That means let him invite his friends and that's it. Usually with a kid that age it will be somewhere between five and 10 kids. I make my kids stick to a number very close to whatever age they are turning, so a six year old would get about six friends at a party. (I loosen the rule for my kids when they have a larger group of friends so no one they really like gets left out.) Works well and it allows me to not be as stressed and do a wider variety of activities at the party.

[LavenderBlue]

My daughter just turned eight. We've been inviting all the girls from her class to her birthday party each year and a few others in the neighborhood her age. If it's really a problem then tell him the party is small and he can only invite a few people. We don't have a finished basement so I hold her birthday parties in other places. This year we'll be at the local library on Saturday to celebrate with her friends. Other parents around here also do this. My daughter has been to parties everywhere from stores at the mall to the pool at the local WMHA. It's typically about $10 to $15 a head. In turn places provide pizza, cake, decorations, supervised activities and clean up.

[Ruken]

I thought a good rule of thumb is to invite as many kids as the age your kid is turning. So, five or six other kids should be at the party if you're not going to invite the whole class. At six, a kid is old enough to choose his own friends.I think my parties tended to get smaller as I got older. A party for a Kindergartner with only half a dozen kids would have been a sorry event indeed when I was that age.

We don't have a finished basement so I hold her birthday parties in other places.:confused: What does a basement have to do with it? I don't think I've ever been in a birthday party in a basement.

[Zsofia]

I guess all the other moms lock the kids in the basement with the booze, radon, and dead hookers? I dunno, I didn't grow up in a place where anybody had a basement.

[Markxxx]

I know a lady that I used to talk to awhile back when I used to sunbathe in the park. Her name was Zoda. She was about 75 but didn't look a day over 90. You know the type.

She used to talk to me about, guys with earrings, loose women, people on welfare, etc etc

Oddly enough I noticed how friendly she was with them however. So I asked her, if she didn't like guys with earrings, loose women, people on welfare, why then does she talk to them?

She said:

"Well it would be rude not to. Imagine how awful the world would be if people went around ignoring people and being unkind just because they didn't like them."

Good Point, just because you don't like someone is not a license to be rude or unkind

I think you have to bear this point in mind when you make your decision and your son needs to keep this in mind.

The simple way to figure this out is to sit with you son and figure out the consequnces of his actions.

If you leave out those two kids, what will the result be? Probably he won't be invited to their parties. Can he live with that? Some of the othe children might not want to go to his party if they're friends of the uninvited guests

The bottom line is this: Figure out the consequences of NOT inviting those two kids and the consequnces of INVINTING those kids.

Which one is worse. Choose the lesser of two evils

[handsomeharry]

I think part of a birthday celebration is to honor a child, not those that have done him injury, and not to teach him a life lesson. You want him to learn fair...on his birthday?????
He patently doesn't want the other kids there because he is afraid of them, not because of some policy forced on his young mind by (bad person of your choice.)
If you are using this party to train him, have them do some fun math problems, and give his some healthy carrots and broccoli for their treats.

Don't invite the two, and let him invite the ones that you can afford.

Best wishes,
hh

[handsomeharry]

Your Honor, I object to this line of questioning on the grounds that it is leading the witness.

Sustained.

Ok, little kids get hurt sometimes by other kids. I wouldn't be too happy about a broken arm on one of my snowflakes either but they sound like decent kids that had something unfortunate happen and it hurts both of them.

They sound like decent kids??????

Listen, when I was a kid, I could overlook getting my arm broken accidentally. Maybe we should grant the son the same grace that we would extend to ourselves-let him make decisions that effect himself. There's something not right in the scenario of a 6 year old kid not giving a friend a pass, even for a broken arm. Maybe he knows something that we don't about the goon that broke his arm. Maybe he is some Jekyll and Hyde character that can apologize one day and mop up the playground with him the next day. Maybe the son can tell if an apology wasn't sincere, but was pressured into accepting it, as children are. Maybe the son knows the guy is an oaf that gets everybody around him into trouble. Who knows?
The other kid has anger/biting issues, and has been agressive against the son?
And, apparently against others? That's who I want at MY birthday party!
We should give the kid a break...

Best wishes,
hh

Best wishes,
hh

[winneee]

The Arm Breaker (A.B.) is generally described by the other kids as being "naughty." Prior to this incident, my son has refered to him as "naughty but funny." What I personally have seen is an unsupervised kid who can't afford NOT to have supervision. One time an uncle brought him to a pool party and then sat inside with A.B.'s little sister. Various adults around the pool area had to run interference the whole time. If that had been my party, I think I would have called the mom and said, your son is welcome but he, as all our children do, need to be supervised, espeically around bounce houses, pools, etc. Perhaps if we decide to invite him, I should call the mom with that disclaimer. I don't know.

Point being, I know my son pretty well, and I truly don't think he is in fear of either of these kids. If I believed he was, it would be a no brainer. If anything, he may just be an older soul than I realize and simply not want the drama of them being around. Biter (and A.B.) signed his cast the other day and has been mothering him. I guess I go back to...I'm not sure he really understands the consequences of not inviting them and don't want it to be a rude awakening for him if that's not really where his heart was at.

We are having the party outdoors with a petting zoo so there will be a lot of room for kids.

Again, all your points of view are very helpful and I really appreciate the responses.

[AClockworkMelon]

Disclaimer: I don't have children.

But he sounds like a little shit to me. I wouldn't invite any kid to my home who couldn't be trusted to not harass mine if given a moment's unsupervised access to them. This is your child's birthday and the party is being held for his benefit, not everyone else's. If you're really worried about traumatizing the poor thing by not inviting him to a party then go with the other popular suggestion and just let your kid pick a small number of classmates to attend.

[winneee]

Actually, some of the responses have made me wonder if I completely whiffed on what a challenge it will be to have that amount of kids over. :smack:

Right after my son gets his cast off. :smack::smack:

(And the 18 is just his class, and does not include 6 or so kids he would like to ask from the other class.):eek:

Now I'm beginning to think we go with about 12 (nine from his class and three others), have a nice quiet petting zoo, cake and call it a day.

[LavenderBlue]

I think my parties tended to get smaller as I got older. A party for a Kindergartner with only half a dozen kids would have been a sorry event indeed when I was that age.

:confused: What does a basement have to do with it? I don't think I've ever been in a birthday party in a basement.

I simply meant there's no space in my house big enough to hold eleven active eight year olds. If we had a large finished basement that would solve the problem. We don't have any real open spaces here where kids could play games like twister. When I was a kid a basement is where people traditionally held their children's parties when they had them at home. I could fit the kids in my backyard easily but five inches of snow are predicted in the next two days so I don't think the parents would go for it.

winneee,

Twenty four kids is a lot of kids to have in your house at one time. A quick celebration at a petting zoo sounds like a nice compromise.

[PeskiPiksi]

Another chiming in to support the "only invite a few, or else invite them all" idea. It breaks my heart to sit here and think about those two little kids knowing they've been deliberately excluded from a party that everyone else gets to go to. It would be flat-out mean to do that, and I don't care if it is their birthday, I would never allow my kids to be deliberately mean like that. No matter how "naughty" the kids in question are.

[Wallenstein]

Another thing to bear in mind is that kids that age seem to fall out and make up with each other on a daily basis.

My daughter will be three in April, and already her response to being told off is "you can't come to my party".

Every day she comes back from nursery and announces that one her friends is no longer invited to any future party (due to some minor, everyday issue like not sharing a favourite book, or not being allowed to sit on the red cushion for story-time).

On the other hand, there's usually also a friend who was persona non grata the day before but who is now "my best friend ever".

Personally I would have no problem excluding a really troublesome child, but often that child will be paying the price for bad parenting, so it will seem unfair (but as noted, life sucks sometimes and it's worth getting used to the idea).

[Zsofia]

The 12 idea sounds perfect to me. (Disclaimer: I don't have kids.)

[Anaamika]

I don't have kids either but why the hell would you even consider not backing up your kid 100% in this? The kid broke his arm! I am sorry to be harsh but it just seems like you are trying to be fair out of some misguided sense of adult principles. The kid's six. Let him learn about fair on some other day.

I too am a proponent of only inviting enough kids as matches the kid's age + 1. So in this case, seven kids only.

[sandra_nz]

I think six is old enough to have actual friends, rather than friends-because-they're-near-me, which is what you tend to see with toddlers.

Looking back at my photo album, I tended to have about seven friends over to birthday parties in my childhood, that seems a much more manageable number.

[winneee]

I don't have kids either but why the hell would you even consider not backing up your kid 100% in this? The kid broke his arm! I am sorry to be harsh but it just seems like you are trying to be fair out of some misguided sense of adult principles. The kid's six. Let him learn about fair on some other day.

I too am a proponent of only inviting enough kids as matches the kid's age + 1. So in this case, seven kids only.

Because it was an accident.

[winneee]

Another thing to bear in mind is that kids that age seem to fall out and make up with each other on a daily basis.

My daughter will be three in April, and already her response to being told off is "you can't come to my party".

Every day she comes back from nursery and announces that one her friends is no longer invited to any future party (due to some minor, everyday issue like not sharing a favourite book, or not being allowed to sit on the red cushion for story-time).

On the other hand, there's usually also a friend who was persona non grata the day before but who is now "my best friend ever".

Personally I would have no problem excluding a really troublesome child, but often that child will be paying the price for bad parenting, so it will seem unfair (but as noted, life sucks sometimes and it's worth getting used to the idea).

Exactly. Other than maybe one or two kids who are consistently talked about, his pool of "friends" changes on a daily basis.

[AClockworkMelon]

Yeah, an overly aggressive kid who you admit needs constant supervision accidentally breaks your kid's arm. I wouldn't invite him over.

[Barkis is Willin']

Either invite everyone or else pick 6 or so. I totally get that the kid doesn't want a couple known trouble makers at his party, but you have to realize that excluding only 2 from the class can cause issues. We're talking about kids, so it's not unreasonable to think some of the invited kids might taunt the uninvited kids after the party, which could lead to resentment toward the birthday kid and eventually a division in the classroom. That's probably a worst case scenario, but I think it's worth trying to avoid.

[Cat Whisperer]

<snip> I never heard from the child's parents <snip>
This is the part that made me wonder - your kid breaks another kid's arm (accidentally), and you don't even call up and say how dreadfully sorry you are (the other parents, not you, Winnee)? WTF, man?

As for the original question, I'd say invite everyone or invite only seven to ten. Excluding two from the whole class, even if there are extenuating circumstances, seems kind of mean to me. Of course, I'm the person at work who refuses to clique up and exclude anyone there, either - I hate exclusionary practices. :)

[Hal Briston]

No one else has school rules that cover this? I have no idea how they go about with enforcement, but The Littlest Briston's school has a policy on this -- you have four choices when it comes to inviting classmates:

1: All of them.
2: None of them.
3: All the boys.
4: All the girls.

No picking and choosing allowed. I don't know if this is just a way of giving parents an "out" when their kid wants to invite everyone except that one funny-looking kid who eats paste, nor have I heard of anyone trying to get around the policy (of course, there's only been one birthday party so far, so who knows what the year will bring).

[Barkis is Willin']

No one else has school rules that cover this? I have no idea how they go about with enforcement, but The Littlest Briston's school has a policy on this -- you have four choices when it comes to inviting classmates:

1: All of them.
2: None of them.
3: All the boys.
4: All the girls.

No picking and choosing allowed. I don't know if this is just a way of giving parents an "out" when their kid wants to invite everyone except that one funny-looking kid who eats paste, nor have I heard of anyone trying to get around the policy (of course, there's only been one birthday party so far, so who knows what the year will bring).

I've never heard of this. To what age children do these rules apply? As you indicate, enforcement of such a rule would be impossible. Furthermore, I think it's a little overreaching for a school to dictate who your children can invite to their birthday party. Sheesh.

[PeskiPiksi]

At my niece and nephew's school (they're six, too), they have those rules, too, but it only applies if you're handing out the invitations at school.

[Hal Briston]

At my niece and nephew's school (they're six, too), they have those rules, too, but it only applies if you're handing out the invitations at school.That rang a bell, so I checked with my wife. Bingo -- you can't pick and choose when you're handing them out in school. If you're sending them outside of school, feel free to exclude all the weird kids you want.

[Barkis is Willin']

That rang a bell, so I checked with my wife. Bingo -- you can't pick and choose when you're handing them out in school. If you're sending them outside of school, feel free to exclude all the weird kids you want.

Ah, ok. Fair enough, I guess. Perfectly acceptable for the school to regulate party planning on their time.

[Enderw24]

This is the part that made me wonder - your kid breaks another kid's arm (accidentally), and you don't even call up and say how dreadfully sorry you are (the other parents, not you, Winnee)? WTF, man?

As for the original question, I'd say invite everyone or invite only seven to ten. Excluding two from the whole class, even if there are extenuating circumstances, seems kind of mean to me. Of course, I'm the person at work who refuses to clique up and exclude anyone there, either - I hate exclusionary practices. :)

That's what I came in here to post. WTF indeed. Were they unaware that this kid broke your kid's arm? If so, they needed to have been told. Or were they aware and just didn't give a shit? I'm voting for this choice and my response again is WTF?

[Swallowed My Cellphone]

I thought a good rule of thumb is to invite as many kids as the age your kid is turning. So, five or six other kids should be at the party if you're not going to invite the whole class. At six, a kid is old enough to choose his own friends.
That's what I've always heard. I can't imagine inviting an entire class of six-year-olds. That would require way too much supervision.

[kayaker]

No matter how many kids are invited, at that age there is one thing I'd recommend. As they enter your home, each child gets either 10 mg of Diazepam, or 50 mg of Diphenhydramine. With a cup of juice to wash it down. If the arm breaker attends, give him a lil of each.

Yes, I have kids.

[shiftless]

I thought the rule for kid's parties was age of the kid plus one. So seven kids in this case (6 guests.) Any more than that and you have a mob, not a party.

[RTFirefly]

1: All of them.
2: None of them.
3: All the boys.
4: All the girls. The Firebug would take Option 4, if those were the choices. The little Romeo. :)

[lindsaybluth]

OP, you're gonna get a million answers. I can see both sides of the question, frankly.

My little brother is a sophomore and two of his close friends are on his sports team. They're both seniors. They were wrestling early last summer and one of them injured the other - tore his ACL. They're still best friends, even though the one kid has had a rough season (it's 1/3 of the way through) because he's rehabbing his knee.

Maybe you're right to exclude him, but maybe they would grow to be good friends. Perhaps the parents don't know - if the teachers didn't tell them, they'd have no way of knowing. The kid apologized; accidents do happen.

My little brother was playing floor hockey, tripped over his own feet and a friend's feet and smacked his head on the radiator at school. No concussion, but a big goose egg. I don't think the other kid's parents called my parents.

ETA: It seems like the non-parents are taking the arm breaking more seriously...

[winneee]

I, too, thought/think/will forever think that the parents should have contacted us. It was not the type of thing where my son's arm was bumped and later we figured out it was broken. It was very clearly broken and I was shaken up enough that someone else had to drive us to the hospital. I thought about starting a thread asking whether or not I should call them but didn't.

I honestly had myself convinced that they somehow missed either it happening or the fact that their son was involved and was sure I would get a call once school started again but that hasn't happened. Since their son apologized, I am assuming they know.

[lindsaybluth]

Um, I wouldn't assume their son knows. Their son very well could not have told his parents what happened.

First kid and you had him late in life, eh?

[winneee]

Um, I wouldn't assume their son knows. Their son very well could not have told his parents what happened.

First kid and you had him late in life, eh?

Bingo! :)

[Cat Whisperer]

My WTF doesn't really come from what parents should or shouldn't do, it's what human beings should and shouldn't do - you don't accidentally break someone else's arm without apologizing, and since it was a young child who did the breaking, it was the parents who should have also apologized. It's true I'm not a parent, but when you are, don't you get to apologize for all kinds of things your kids do because you're responsible for them?

[winneee]

My WTF doesn't really come from what parents should or shouldn't do, it's what human beings should and shouldn't do - you don't accidentally break someone else's arm without apologizing, and since it was a young child who did the breaking, it was the parents who should have also apologized. It's true I'm not a parent, but when you are, don't you get to apologize for all kinds of things your kids do because you're responsible for them?

I'm glad that the son apologized and hope with that he has a better understanding of how to be safer when playing. If I were the parent, I would have apologized, too, but I probably would have asked what I could do (if anything) and assured them that I had reinforced playground safety with my son. It sounds cliche, but it really does matter to me that a lesson is learned; i.e., a future accident is avoided, more than who apologizes for what.

[handsomeharry]

Furthermore, I think it's a little overreaching for a school to dictate who your children can invite to their birthday party. Sheesh.

It sounds alright to me. Just make sure the kids have a self-accusation meeting before the cake and ice cream!

Best wishes,
hh

[Rachellelogram]

I've never been party (heh heh) to the notion of inviting an entire class to a party of any kind. My mom would set a kid limit and I would have to pick my best friends (I might be able to wheedle her up one more). It helps, I guess, that my classes were pretty much always 25+ people and my circle of friends was usually small. And I never got a petting zoo. grr.

Anyway, I vote to keep it small, but then I vote against the petting zoo as well. Huge, total overkill unless it's a major party (like 5, 10, or 13). Children of your son's age should be allowed to make (relatively) weighty decisions like who to exclude from their own birthday celebrations.

[treis]

My WTF doesn't really come from what parents should or shouldn't do, it's what human beings should and shouldn't do - you don't accidentally break someone else's arm without apologizing, and since it was a young child who did the breaking, it was the parents who should have also apologized. It's true I'm not a parent, but when you are, don't you get to apologize for all kinds of things your kids do because you're responsible for them?

But there is no guarantee that the parents know what happened. I didn't tell my parents shit when I was growing up, and "I broke a kid's arm" is something I definitely would not have told them.

[Agent Foxtrot]

Your kid is right. Exclude the two who he doesn't want there. They're young, but maybe it'll give them a clue that their behavior has been unacceptable. Either way, they'll get over it.