The Canadian Election Thread. (Or maybe not...)

[RickJay]

Perhaps he has learned more today. Or perhaps he just keeps his anti-science views better wrapped up.
EP, your quotes have been demonstrated to clearly not represent his position; you seem to have backed down from your claim that the Conservative Party denied the existence of global warming, or at least you have refused to support it without further comment; and it is at least clear beyond any doubt or question that the current position of the Conservative Party of Canada, with regards to this issue in 2011 - which is when the election this thread is about is taking place - is not one of denial of global warming.

Might I suggest that your claim that there were "years of denial" of Global Warming by the CPC appears to be indisputably false, unless you have evidence to the contrary, and it certainly is not the case that there is any "denial" now, with the general election imminent.

[Cat Whisperer]

In 2002, Harper clearly did not understand the difference between the science of climate change (at that time global warming) and the science behind the greenhouse effect. He conflated the two.<snip>In 2002, did you?

[Euphonious Polemic]

In 2002, did you?

Yes actually, I did.

[Euphonious Polemic]

EP, your quotes have been demonstrated to clearly not represent his position; you seem to have backed down from your claim that the Conservative Party denied the existence of global warming, or at least you have refused to support it without further comment;

I actually said:

They (Conservative party) think that the IPCC is composed entirely of stupid scientists, and that Conservative ideology must be correct in terms of global warming.

So, a bit over the top, yes, I admit.

The initial point was made when you pretty much stated that anyone who did not agree to the CPC platforms was stupid and gullible.

[bashere]

Okay, believing that you can spend billions on new and upgraded social services with no possible means of paying for them other than on the backs of future generations or declaring bankruptcy isn't a valid point of view. It is lunacy. There are ample examples around the world right now when this is done that even the most die hard socialist should take pause. But not in Canada. Somehow in Canada we think that money behaves differently for us.

But there is no problem spending billions on new fighters and on prisons? That won't bankrupt us, but the NDP will? A couple billion in oil subsidies are no problem, but spend that two billion on aid to seniors and the economy will crash?

[Le Ministre de l'au-delà]

I thought you might be interested in this link... The CBC News Platform Tracker (http://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/canadavotes2011/platforms/infogrid/) - an interactive summary of the Conservative, Liberal, NDP and Green platforms.

[Le Ministre de l'au-delà]

I don't think voters are stupid and ignorant; I am astonished by the short memories, however (especially blaming the Conservative government for creating budgets that the Liberals, NDP and Bloc demanded).

I can't answer for everyone in the Liberal party, of course, but when I was thinking of an economic stimulus, I was thinking more along the lines of some of the necessary infrastructure projects that we'd been holding off on. I wasn't particularly thinking of spending oodles of cash in Tony Clement's riding to show them how grateful I was that they'd voted Conservative.

[Leaffan]

But there is no problem spending billions on new fighters and on prisons? That won't bankrupt us, but the NDP will? A couple billion in oil subsidies are no problem, but spend that two billion on aid to seniors and the economy will crash?

Sooner or later we need to upgrade the military jets; we still haven't received the Sea King replacements cancelled by Chretien in 19 fucking 93!

New prisons? So fucking what? As our population increases, and as historic infrastructures decline, do you not think that providing suitable incarceration facilities would be required?

Ah, fuck it.

[Frank]

New prisons? So fucking what? As our population increases, and as historic infrastructures decline, do you not think that providing suitable incarceration facilities would be required?
I'd agree with that, just as I'd agree that new suitable replacements are required for the aging infrastucture of roads, electricity, sewer, water, etc. I'd merely ask, where is it said that the new prisons are replacements and not additions?

[bashere]

Sooner or later we need to upgrade the military jets; we still haven't received the Sea King replacements cancelled by Chretien in 19 fucking 93!


Sure. Right now, according to Harper, it is a time for austerity. That means "later". Or he's lying, and perhaps isn't a good choice for prime minister.


New prisons? So fucking what?


So, that's fucking money that could be better used for other fucking things, that's So Fucking What.

However, I now have a response to conservatives with concerns about the NDPs budget - so fucking what?


As our population increases, and as historic infrastructures decline, do you not think that providing suitable incarceration facilities would be required?


As you are almost certainly aware, Harper has passed or is passing legislation that will increase the prison population out of proportion with the population growth. This requires (not, as your post indicates, population growth, but actual changes to crime bills) more fucking prisons. Now, you might happily say "so fucking what" as Harper uses fear mongering to buy votes (what was stockwell's quote? There is a lot of crime, it's just not reported?), and then builds prisons in Northern Ontario to buy votes there, but many other people don't. They are prepared to risk the almost certain armaggedeon of an NDP minority in the hope that money isn't wasted on stupid things, which will happen if Harper gets his majority.


Ah, fuck it.

Don't tell me, I know this one. Harper being asked his sixth question of the day?

[newcomer]

I'd agree with that, just as I'd agree that new suitable replacements are required for the aging infrastucture of roads, electricity, sewer, water, etc. I'd merely ask, where is it said that the new prisons are replacements and not additions? There was a funny segment about elections and politics on CBC - let it burn in righteous fire of non-funding - where reporter went to Vaughan, Ontario, the electorate of the former Toronto Police Chief, Jualian "I catch criminals with my bare hands" Fantino.

Now, his slogan and primary banner under which he is seeking to become MP is to, yes, "fight the crime". So, reporter went around asking people if they are aware that in Vaughan there is no crime to speak of. People would look at him somewhat phased with crime stats in Vaughan but they would still mainatan that Fantino's message is spot on - kinda like "you can never take a rest fighting crime". It was surreal.

On another note, Fox News North a.k.a. Sun TV had a breaking news that in 1996 Jack Layton was bad, bad bad, bad... the decency has left the building. I want to meet a person who will change their vote based on this kind of propaganda and scare mongering. I always thought that's for Americans, let them have it, but, no, it appears that gullibility is the decease of the 21st century. And it's spreading ...:(

[Leaffan]

I'd agree with that, just as I'd agree that new suitable replacements are required for the aging infrastucture of roads, electricity, sewer, water, etc. I'd merely ask, where is it said that the new prisons are replacements and not additions?

Yeah? So what if they are? The police, the courts, the judges decide who gets incarcerated, not the Prime Minister's office.

This government is forward-thinking and saying that as the population of the country increases, we should start planning for an increased number of prison spaces.

If the same fucking argument was made for hospitals or schools (which happens daily) then no one would flinch. What makes increasing prison space relative to increased population projections such a taboo subject?

Oh, crime is decreasing..... Fuck off. The population of Canada is increasing and if we don'y RIGHT NOW plan for the future then we'll have more prisoners than prison space very shortly. How can you deny that these demographics are upon us? How?

[RickJay]

The initial point was made when you pretty much stated that anyone who did not agree to the CPC platforms was stupid and gullible.
I did not say or even imply anything of the sort. That is a ridiculous accusation and I ask that you retract it at once. Where on earth did you get this from?

[Leaffan]

As you are almost certainly aware, Harper has passed or is passing legislation that will increase the prison population out of proportion with the population growth.

Give me a cite for this please.

ETA: Now!

[bashere]

ETA: Now!


Um. No. Internet tough guys bore me.

[Frank]

Oh, crime is decreasing..... Fuck off.
I note that as the election draws nearer, one Canadian conservative in particular is losing his cool.

[Leaffan]

Um. No. Internet tough guys bore me.

In other words, unsubstantiated bullshit allegations.

[Frank]

I did not say or even imply anything of the sort. That is a ridiculous accusation and I ask that you retract it at once. Where on earth did you get this from?
Euphonious Polemic, "stupid and gullible" came from a post of yours to Leaffan, which he agreed with. RickJay, despite his obvious distaste for the Liberals and NDP, has never said or implied such.

[bashere]

Yeah? So what if they are? The police, the courts, the judges decide who gets incarcerated, not the Prime Minister's office.


Um, yes. No one has disputed that. However, the legislator writes the laws, including those things that are felonies, and the sentencing guidelines.

To quote the National Post (that's a iittle to the left of the Sun; will that be an okay cite)

"Ottawa is scrambling to expand the penitentiary system as quickly as possible to house a surging inmate population. One legislative change alone — the abolishment of the two-for-one pre-trial custody credit — is expected to add 4,000 more inmates to the system over the next five years, according to estimates by the Parliamentary Budget Officer."

( link: http://www.nationalpost.com/news/canada/Harper+government+announce+more+prison+expansions/4083169/story.html ).

Sure, 400 people a year isn't a lot, even at 35 grand a pop, but it isn't "so fucking what" territory.


This government is forward-thinking and saying that as the population of the country increases, we should start planning for an increased number of prison spaces.



If the same fucking argument was made for hospitals or schools (which happens daily) then no one would flinch. What makes increasing prison space relative to increased population projections such a taboo subject?


You are correct. Well, sort of. We're closing schools here in Toronto. People would flinch if we tried to open more. But your general point is true. Prisons are not schools. Well, except for "how to commit more crime.


Oh, crime is decreasing..... Fuck off.


You should probably consider going outside and enjoying the night air. Seriously. Yes, crime is at it's lowest in 30 years, and dropping. That means we need fewer, not more prisons.


The population of Canada is increasing and if we don'y RIGHT NOW plan for the future then we'll have more prisoners than prison space very shortly. How can you deny that these demographics are upon us? How?

Crime is dropping faster than population is increasing. How can you deny that?

[bashere]

In other words, unsubstantiated bullshit allegations.

I refused to provide a cite "Now!". You continue the internet tough guy thing.

[Leaffan]

Crime is dropping faster than population is increasing. How can you deny that?

Show me the money.

[bashere]

Show me the money.

Since I'm not the one trying to spend billions to build more prisons, how about you show me a cite?

Specifically, that without Harper's changes to the federal crime code (that's written by the legislator - glad we cleared that up), prison populations would climb.

[bashere]

I note that as the election draws nearer, one Canadian conservative in particular is losing his cool.

Dude, check out the name. He's been in a bad mood since 1967

[Leaffan]

Since I'm not the one trying to spend billions to build more prisons, how about you show me a cite?

Specifically, that without Harper's changes to the federal crime code (that's written by the legislator - glad we cleared that up), prison populations would climb.

That's not how it works. You said "Crime is dropping faster than population is increasing. How can you deny that?"

I asked you to provide a cite regarding this knowledge. If you can't substantiate it then retract it.

[Frank]

I asked you to provide a cite regarding this knowledge. If you can't substantiate it then retract it.
Look, dude. You're the one who believes it necessary to spend the money on more prison spaces. Justify it.

[bashere]

That's not how it works. You said "Crime is dropping faster than population is increasing. How can you deny that?"

I asked you to provide a cite regarding this knowledge. If you can't substantiate it then retract it.

And you said:


The population of Canada is increasing and if we don'y RIGHT NOW plan for the future then we'll have more prisoners than prison space very shortly. How can you deny that these demographics are upon us? How?


Provide a cite or retract it.

[Leaffan]

Look, dude. You're the one who believes it necessary to spend the money on more prison spaces. Justify it.

Well, from the above linked article of bashere:

There are roughly 13,500 inmates in 54 institutions. In many prisons, inmates are already double bunked, living two to a cell designed for one. The practice contravenes international standards on the treatment of prisoners and is known to fuel tension and violence.

[Leaffan]

Suddenly I hear crickets chirping.

[bashere]

Suddenly I hear crickets chirping.

Actually, that's the sound of me doing dishes.

crime rate, Canada, 2008

http://www.statcan.gc.ca/daily-quotidien/080717/dq080717b-eng.htm

A 7% drop. Why don't you show me the population increase so I can get the rest of my dishes done?

[Frank]

Suddenly I hear crickets chirping.
Gosh, a whole five minutes while I was off reviewing the "Game of Thrones" thread? So sorry. I shall from now on offer you my undivided attention. Or not.

Look, making room for the prisoners already in jail is one thing. I've clearly stated that I agree with that. Your argument is that Canada needs to make room for many more anticipated prisoners. Planning for the future, right? Why do you anticipate many more prisoners?

[Leaffan]

Actually, that's the sound of me doing dishes.

crime rate, Canada, 2008

http://www.statcan.gc.ca/daily-quotidien/080717/dq080717b-eng.htm

A 7% drop. Why don't you show me the population increase so I can get the rest of my dishes done?

No.

How about you think about it, do the math and get back to me tomorrow. You made the accusation that:

As you are almost certainly aware, Harper has passed or is passing legislation that will increase the prison population out of proportion with the population growth.

It's up to you to prove that: not me.

[bashere]

No.

How about you think about it, do the math and get back to me tomorrow. You made the accusation that:


It's up to you to prove that: not me.

The quote that I cited says that the changes in two-for-one legislation adds 4,000 people over 5 years.

[Frank]

It's up to you to prove that: not me.
You're no longer worth attempting to carry on a reasonable discussion with. You are refusing to justify your stance; you make no arguments for it, and are demanding that we argue against reasons you've got buried in a jar in your back yard.

bashere may find this more interesting than doing the dishes; I do not find it more interesting than . . . well, almost anything.

[bashere]

bashere may find this more interesting than doing the dishes; I do not find it more interesting than . . . well, almost anything.

Thank you, Frank. Your point is well made. While not directed at me, reviewing my responses, I am clearly being a jerk, and will bow out of this thread. Leaffan, vote as you will. Please understand that many people disagree, not out of ignorance, but due to different priorities.

[RickJay]

No.

How about you think about it, do the math and get back to me tomorrow. You made the accusation that:


It's up to you to prove that: not me.
Increasing the prison population by 4,000 over 5 years just by cancelling 2-for-1 rules would by itself increase the prison population as fast as population growth in percentage terms.

When one then accounts for the fact that the Tory platform calls for tougher approaches to crime and sentencing across a variety of areas, it's kind of hard to come up with a logical reason why the prison population WOULDN'T go up, unless you can explain some hidden part of the Tory agenda that would reduce inmates in some other way...like, say, a saner approach to drugs, but the Tories don't want that.

[Spoons]

Off on a tangent here, but I and many in my riding are thoroughly disgusted with our local Conservative. I've posted previously about how he won't attend local all-candidates forums. Seems it's been ramped up a notch.

Local citizen Rod Leland tried to get Jim Hillyer, the CPC candidate in our riding, on camera to answer a few questions. Hillyer didn't like this.

"It's a typical media stunt. [Leland] is part of a group of NDP-supporting students that … have been trying to embarrass Jim and bring attention to their issues," said [Ethan Gorner, Hillyer's campaign manager].Um ... aren't the issues what a candidate should address? Let's see ... we have a candidate who won't address the issues in an all-candidates forum, who won't address the issues on the street; and who, if this is any indication, won't address issues anywhere. Who knows what he might not do in Parliament? See what the CBC had to say about Hillyer (http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/calgary/story/2011/04/29/calgary-lethbridge-jim-hillyer-youtube.html).

Sorry, Jim. You've lost my vote. You'll probably win anyway, since, as a Mormon, you have the local Mormon vote, and you'll have the votes of the crusty farmers who've voted Conservative for fifty-plus years because their Daddy told them to. But when I need to write my MP, I expect you to listen to me, regardless of which church I attend (or not), or whether I'm urban or rural.

Jim Hillyer, you're Pit-worthy.

[Ibanez]

Don't tell me, I know this one. Harper being asked his sixth question of the day?

Just an FYI. Layton has been limiting the amount of questions as well recently.

[Le Ministre de l'au-delà]

Here is the YouTube link (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eRqw0xUal4k)to the press conference where Stockwell Day announced the federal funding for new prisons. Now, if the new prisons were intended to replace the old ones, this would have been an ideal time to have said so. Instead, we got into this strange discussion of 'unreported crime' as a justification for building new, larger prisons.

Here is a link (http://www.statcan.gc.ca/daily-quotidien/100720/dq100720a-eng.htm) to the Statistics Canada release showing that crime, including violent crime is down from a peak 2003 and has been trending downward ever since.

And here is a link (http://www4.hrsdc.gc.ca/.3ndic.1t.4r@-eng.jsp?iid=35) to an article from Human Resources Canada about population growth rate. The rate of growth in Canada has declined in recent years. Canada's average annual growth rate from 2000 to 2010 was 1.1%. The growth rate is expected to slow even further over the next several decades (0.9% between 2010 and 2060).

I can't comment on any of bashere's assertions concerning the government increasing the prison population over the last five years. I can only comment that as the youngest of the baby boomer generation are turning 65, seniors homes, palliative care and hospitals would seem to be a better investment than multi-million dollar prisons at this time.

[Euphonious Polemic]

Euphonious Polemic, "stupid and gullible" came from a post of yours to Leaffan, which he agreed with. RickJay, despite his obvious distaste for the Liberals and NDP, has never said or implied such.

Thanks for the clarification.

Sorry Rickjay.

[RickJay]

Merciful mother of God.

The Toronto Star, for longer than my lifetime the Official Liberal Party Newspaper, has endorsed the NDP.

I am honestly shocked by this. The Star is the most blatantly politically biased major newspaper in Canada; their Liberal Party support is evident not just in editorials but in their choices of story, in the pictures they run, in the way every article is written, and many of their articles and columns approach Fox News levels of spin. It's almost as if the paper was actually run by senior Liberals. The Star ALWAYS endorses the Liberals at the federal level; they even endorsed John Turner in 1984 when Turner was probably having trouble getting his family to vote for him.

For the Star to endorse the NDP is a devastating repudiation of the Liberal Party. It is equivalent to a top-five Liberal cabinet minister abandoning the party right now and endorsing another party.

And it's a huge, huge coup for the NDP. The Star is THE vehicle for printed news in Toronto. This actually could swing a few ridings.

The Liberal rank and file needs to rise up and throw out everyone at the top of the party.

[orcenio]

I am honestly shocked by this. The Star is the most blatantly politically biased major newspaper in Canada;I take it that you don't read the National Post? ;)

[RickJay]

I take it that you don't read the National Post? ;)
Sure I do.

They aren't even close. The Post is heavily small-C conservative and they're open and forthright about that fact, but maintains a level of basic honesty most of the time - not always, but usually - and they're happy to rip the CPC on any number of issues. On the bias scale I'd put them way ahead of the Globe and Mail, but not nearly as far as the Toronto Star.

[Le Ministre de l'au-delà]

I was intrigued by the number of articles in the Globe and Mail that were critical of the Conservatives this election. What's up? They're not going to support the Torys? Then they came out with the editorial endorsing the Conservatives on Thursday. So despite all the questions that they themselves have raised, they can't change their stripes. Oh, well...



I was quite heartened, by the way, to read this article in yesterday's Star, about the race in Mississauga-Brampton South and how the Conservative and Liberal candidates have actually been respectful to one another. It's good to see that some candidates get the notion that you should attack the idea and not the person.

[Mona Lisa Simpson]

I am politically left of centre, but I also remember the 1990s in Ontario. but even I am shocked by events of recent days.

The Toronto Star endorsing NDP is like the Pope endorsing Lutheranism*





*Not exactly I know, and please no one come along and give me a history of the Reformation etc and point how NDP was not a reaction to excesses of Liberalism and I am perfectly aware of the CCP and Tommy Douglas etc. Still shocking.

[Cat Whisperer]

So, Prime Minister Jack Layton, eh? I'm going to need a minute here...

[bashere]

I can't comment on any of bashere's assertions concerning the government increasing the prison population over the last five years.

My understanding is that the prison population is expected to raise over the next five, not over the last five. At least that's my reading of my National Post cite. Thank you, though; the rest of your quotes are in line with what I've read.


Just an FYI. Layton has been limiting the amount of questions as well recently.


That's vexatious. And surprising. Thank you for letting me know.

[RickJay]

My understanding is that the prison population is expected to raise over the next five, not over the last five. At least that's my reading of my National Post cite. Thank you, though; the rest of your quotes are in line with what I've read.



That's vexatious. And surprising. Thank you for letting me know.
It strikes me as being a perfectly reasonable response to the demands of the media. There is a limit, after all, as to how much time a party leader can spend in any given day answering questions; he's got stuff to do. With the NDP being a much more serious player now than they were four weeks ago, the number of questions will increase. So it seems to me you HAVE to limit the media's questioning, don't you? How could you not? There's only 24 hours in a day.

1. It's logistically impossible for Layton to answer every question the media would throw at him, and so it's fairer to explain the limits ahead of time rather than just cut them off and run away when he has to get somewhere, and

2. Letting the media know ahead of time that the questions are limited might increase the quality of questions; if they know they're limited, they might not waste his time with stupidities and redundant questions.

The Conservatives went WAY too far early on (they relented later) but in theory limiting questioning is perfectly reasonable and every important politician does it.

[antonio107]

I live in John Baird's riding, and all his signs have a little addendum flag at the top that says "voted best MP of all parties" or something like that...:confused:

Is there a story behind that? Best MP at what? Voted by who? I thought he was supposed to be a jerky jerk bully that everyone hated, but apparently not!

[Muffin]

MacLean's based on IPSOS/Ried's asking MPs to vote on each other: http://www.newswire.ca/en/releases/archive/June2010/02/c9104.html

[The Flying Dutchman]

So, Prime Minister Jack Layton, eh? I'm going to need a minute here...

Be bold.

[RickJay]

It's an amazing thought. I think I need a massage.





:D

[Muffin]

That one sure helps establish SunTV as being at the level of Fox.

[RickJay]

The massage thing is TRUE, at least, if ridiculously irrelevant. Fox doesn't confine itself to reporting things that actually happened.

I'm not an NDP supporter and when I heard the story I was like "So what?" So Jack was in a massage parlour. Hell, maybe there was a happy ending, I dunno. I don't see what it has to do with the election. Is there any evidence at all that the electorate gives a crap?

[The Flying Dutchman]

I don't see what it has to do with the election. Is there any evidence at all that the electorate gives a crap?

He is going to lose some votes over it. If he didn't come up with the word "shiatsu" suggesting an expectation of some form of TCM (which doesn't surprise me considering he is an NDPer) I would be inclined to consider him an adulterer and thus somewhat less than trustworthy. And his wife backs him on it.

I mean we all know what massage parlors are for.

[Euphonious Polemic]

I hope that the "retired cop" who supposedly let someone see his 16 year old notes is feeling quite nervous now that there is an OPP investigation into how this information became public. And I hope that if he is found guilty of a crime, he loses his pension.

I also wonder how accurate his 16 year old notes are, and if they were "embellished" somewhat.

I also am curious about the timing of this revelation, and whether or not the police investigation will be looking into which political party is responsible for it.

[Le Ministre de l'au-delà]

It's an amazing thought. I think I need a massage.







Oh, go ahead - rub it in!!


Wait - let me rephrase that...

[Muffin]

Some licensed physicians sell unneeded prescriptions to drug users, without their honest clients being aware of what the dishonest physician is doing.
Some licensed pharmacists sell non-prescribed drugs to drug users, without their honest clients being aware of what the dishonest pharmacist is doing.
Some registered massage therapists do tricks on the side, without their honest clients being aware of what the dishonest registered massage therapist is doing.
Some media outlets use the timing and choice of stories to spread guilt by association, which is what SunTV has done to Layton.

[Le Ministre de l'au-delà]

It's okay, The Sun had to make up for looking classy over outing Patrick Muttart's PhotoShop experiment.

[Sam Stone]

I don't care whether he got a 'happy ending' or not - it's irrelevant to the campaign. And I really dislike political 'late hits' dropped on the public just before an election when the opposition doesn't have time to respond. It's the worst kind of political dirty trick, but they all do it.

Do we know whether this was the work of the Conservatives or the Liberals?

I'll tell you, the way these campaigns have been run almost makes ME want to vote NDP - until I remember what their platform and ideology is. Politics in Canada can really suck - just like it does pretty much everywhere else.

[Malthus]

Clearly, the medium is the massage.

[Cat Whisperer]

{Groan}
I don't much care about Jack Layton's extracurricular activities. I assume they're all dirty, and am rarely disappointed.

ETA: I mean all politicians are dirty, not all Jack Layton's extracurricular activities. I really couldn't comment on those. :)

[antonio107]

Frankly, at a certain point I have to wonder if this was an NDP orchestrated move. Everyone I've talked to has sympathy for jack, thinking this is a political low blow. I can't see it hurting his poll standings! :)

[Mona Lisa Simpson]

{Groan}
I don't much care about Jack Layton's extracurricular activities. I assume they're all dirty, and am rarely disappointed.

ETA: I mean all politicians are dirty, not all Jack Layton's extracurricular activities. I really couldn't comment on those. :)

Damn your edit. I was having a giggle picturing you and Jack giving each other massages. Oh baby talk to me about cap and trade for carbon emissions. You want a national what plan? Does that feel good. No, no the Canada health act is a sacred trust.

Sorry. Its really boring at my house today. I need some amusement.

[RickJay]

The punchlines just write themselves.

"I thought minorities were smaller!"

"Caucus, dammit! I said CAUCUS!"

"And the bartender said, `that's not all he spoiled'"

"I guess you could say she split the vote."

"It's wasn't MY riding!"

[Marley23]

Oh, crime is decreasing..... Fuck off.
Leaffan, you're not allowed to tell other posters to "fuck off" anywhere on the SDMB. This is a formal warning: don't do this again.

[Sunspace]

I take it that you don't read the National Post? ;)Or the [Toronto | Ottawa | etc] Sun? :)

...and please no one come along and give me a history of the Reformation etc and point how NDP was not a reaction to excesses of Liberalism and I am perfectly aware of the CCP and Tommy Douglas etc. Still shocking.That's CCF. Cooperative Commonweath Federation. I ought to know--my granddaddy was a Tommy Douglas CCFer.

[Hypnagogic Jerk]

Leaffan, you're not allowed to tell other posters to "fuck off" anywhere on the SDMB. This is a formal warning: do this again.
So you want to ban him, eh?

[Mona Lisa Simpson]

Or the [Toronto | Ottawa | etc] Sun? :)

That's CCF. Cooperative Commonweath Federation. I ought to know--my granddaddy was a Tommy Douglas CCFer.

:smack: And I know better too, I wrote a major paper on the CCF in second year university history. Stupid typo. :smack:

[Euphonious Polemic]

I don't care whether he got a 'happy ending' or not - it's irrelevant to the campaign. And I really dislike political 'late hits' dropped on the public just before an election when the opposition doesn't have time to respond. It's the worst kind of political dirty trick, but they all do it.

Do we know whether this was the work of the Conservatives or the Liberals?

I'll tell you, the way these campaigns have been run almost makes ME want to vote NDP - until I remember what their platform and ideology is. Politics in Canada can really suck - just like it does pretty much everywhere else.

I agree with you.

And at this point, we really can't tell if it was done by the Liberal or the Conservatives. But it is telling that we suspect them both....

[Cunctator]

Our resident Canadian secondee has flags all over her desk today (2 May) to mark polling day.

[Leaffan]

Leaffan, you're not allowed to tell other posters to "fuck off" anywhere on the SDMB. This is a formal warning: do this again.

Sure, well, I didn't think that was directed at a specific poster, but OK. I've played by the rules for years here.

That was a kind of interlude and not a direct retort.

I'll be OK after tomorrow.

[Spoons]

Our resident Canadian secondee has flags all over her desk today (2 May) to mark polling day.Gotta love world time zones. It's still the first of May here, and the polls won't open for 13 hours or so in my area. :)

[Frank]

I'll be OK after tomorrow.
I'm sure you'll have no problem with Jack Layton being the next Prime Minister.

Digs aside, I'd like to urge all of you to go vote. I've noticed in the thread that many of you have already voted, and those of you who haven't need to get your rosy red ass off the couch tomorrow and into a polling booth. Just do it!

[Marley23]

So you want to ban him, eh?
:smack:

Sure, well, I didn't think that was directed at a specific poster, but OK. I've played by the rules for years here.

That was a kind of interlude and not a direct retort.

I'll be OK after tomorrow.
That wasn't clear in your post, since bashere specifically had argued that crime was decreasing. In any case it's better if you avoid that kind of turn or phrase when it might look like you're talking to or about another poster.

[Le Ministre de l'au-delà]

If only Marley23 were Bev Oda, he could just insert the necessary "don't" and claim he didn't know where it came from... :D

[Leaffan]

:smack:


That wasn't clear in your post, since bashere specifically had argued that crime was decreasing. In any case it's better if you avoid that kind of turn or phrase when it might look like you're talking to or about another poster.

Thanks.

ETA: One sleepy to go.................

[Spoons]

Digs aside, I'd like to urge all of you to go vote. I've noticed in the thread that many of you have already voted, and those of you who haven't need to get your rosy red ass off the couch tomorrow and into a polling booth. Just do it!I plan to vote tomorrow. My neighbour is a scrutineer at the local polling station, and if he doesn't see me there, he plans to telephone and tell me to get over and vote!

Knowing him, I'm worried that he will stop by to remind me to vote while he is on his way to the polling station--at 7:00 a.m.! (Well, I will have the coffee on if he does.)

[Leaffan]

I plan to vote tomorrow. My neighbour is a scrutineer at the local polling station, and if he doesn't see me there, he plans to telephone and tell me to get over and vote!

Knowing him, I'm worried that he will stop by to remind me to vote while he is on his way to the polling station--at 7:00 a.m.! (Well, I will have the coffee on if he does.)

Plan to vote? Poor wording. I know you'll be out there and I respectfully demand we all do the same.

Bon chance pour tout les parties.

[Le Ministre de l'au-delà]

Vote with your hearts, minds and imaginations, everyone, and may the future bring Canada peace and prosperity. Here's hoping for a House of Commons filled with the most intelligent, passionate representatives from all the parties. Just as a good choir needs basses, tenors, altos and sopranos, it wouldn't be Canada if we didn't have strong people articulating the very different points of view we have all discussed here these last five weeks...

[Leaffan]

Vote with your hearts, minds and imaginations, everyone, and may the future bring Canada peace and prosperity. Here's hoping for a House of Commons filled with the most intelligent, passionate representatives from all the parties. Just as a good choir needs basses, tenors, altos and sopranos, it wouldn't be Canada if we didn't have strong people articulating the very different points of view we have all discussed here these last five weeks...

Well said.

Any for a round of:


Koo Loo Koo Koo Koo Koo Koo Koo!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Koo Loo Koo Koo Koo Koo Koo Koo!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Muffin]

Oh baby talk to me about cap and trade for carbon emissions. You want a national what plan? Does that feel good. No, no the Canada health act is a sacred trust.Well Jack Layton and Olivia Chow are married to each other and were both MPs together . . .

[The Flying Dutchman]

Vote with your hearts, minds and imaginations, everyone, and may the future bring Canada peace and prosperity. Here's hoping for a House of Commons filled with the most intelligent, passionate representatives from all the parties. Just as a good choir needs basses, tenors, altos and sopranos, it wouldn't be Canada if we didn't have strong people articulating the very different points of view we have all discussed here these last five weeks...





And God Save the Queen !

[Le Ministre de l'au-delà]

Well said.

Any for a round of:


Koo Loo Koo Koo Koo Koo Koo Koo!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Koo Loo Koo Koo Koo Koo Koo Koo!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Aw, take off (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ot70G4wSQi0), eh?

:D

[Leaffan]

Aw, take off (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ot70G4wSQi0), eh?

:D

:p

More in common than not.

Take care, mon ami.

[Muffin]

I'm fortunate, in that the candidates for the three main parties in my riding are all good eggs, and the two that are dukeing it out for the win are acquaintances of mine. Its nice to know that whichever one gets elected, he will do a good job at representing my riding.

[Euphonious Polemic]

Originally Posted by Le Ministre de l'au-delà
Aw, take off, eh?
:p

More in common than not.

Take care, mon ami.

Awww, ya bunch of hosers.

awkward man hug (http://www.facebook.com/group.php?gid=2255880875)

ETA: Everyone go vote!

[Uzi]

Classic Canadian comedy.

Wayne & Shuster - The Musical House of Commons (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9OwUW5_7N94)

I was looking for the skit where they were deciding on best how to market the new house of commons TV broadcasts. Wayne did his best monkey faced expression as he pounded on the desk emulating a politician supporting his party's line. Pure comedy gold!

[Spoons]

Plan to vote? Poor wording.Good point, and you're right. How about this: I will vote tomorrow.

[Spoons]

I'm fortunate, in that the candidates for the three main parties in my riding are all good eggs, and the two that are dukeing it out for the win are acquaintances of mine. Its nice to know that whichever one gets elected, he will do a good job at representing my riding.I wish we could say the same here. It looks like the Conservative will get in, but he's refused to attend all-candidates forums, he's apparently played up (if not outright falsified) his educational qualifications, and nobody knows what he does for a living. The local paper's letters page has been mostly "don't vote for this guy" for the past week. Apparently, he spent much of his time courting Mormon voters in this heavily-Mormon riding; which in a weird way, makes sense, as he is a Mormon. But he completely ignored the rest of us, and seems to want nothing to do with the rest of us or the issues we might raise.

And recently, he avoided a "street forum" convened to address the voters that he won't face. It took place outside his campaign office. His campaign manager condescendingly sent pizza for the participants. The Youtube video (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gqzuNwhzmwM), from CTV.

[Frank]

Will bin Laden's death have an affect tomorrow?

[RickJay]

I wish we could say the same here. It looks like the Conservative will get in, but he's refused to attend all-candidates forums, he's apparently played up (if not outright falsified) his educational qualifications, and nobody knows what he does for a living. The local paper's letters page has been mostly "don't vote for this guy" for the past week. Apparently, he spent much of his time courting Mormon voters in this heavily-Mormon riding; which in a weird way, makes sense, as he is a Mormon. But he completely ignored the rest of us, and seems to want nothing to do with the rest of us or the issues we might raise.

When you throw in the NDP candidates who're off in Vegas and have no connection to their ridings, you start to wonder...

... How can a national political party with millions of dollars and decades of time to establish a national organization not be able to find ONE decent human being to run in every riding in the country? One who lives there and has a job?

[RickJay]

Final DemocraticSpace projections:

CPC: 149
NDP: 79
Liberal: 55
BQ: 24
Independent: 1

A majority remains possible, if not terribly likely. The Liberals' chances look really bad.

308 hasn't updated their projections but I don't think they will much differ.

[Le Ministre de l'au-delà]

Final DemocraticSpace projections:

CPC: 149
NDP: 79
Liberal: 55
BQ: 24
Independent: 1

A majority remains possible, if not terribly likely. The Liberals' chances look really bad.

308 hasn't updated their projections but I don't think they will much differ.

Interesting - 308 still has Portneuf-Jacques Cartier with the NDP leading the independent Andre Arthur 31.5 to 28.9 %.

[Spoons]

... How can a national political party with millions of dollars and decades of time to establish a national organization not be able to find ONE decent human being to run in every riding in the country? One who lives there and has a job?A Mormon friend told me that once this (Mormon) guy applied to be the candidate for the Conservatives, he got all the local Mormon CPC-member support. And they outvoted the non-Mormon CPC members to select this guy as the CPC candidate.

It's the way candidate selection works in all ridings for all parties; but still, I'm not happy that religion is playing a role in our riding. :mad: I'm worried that his religion will affect how he deals with us when we need to write our MP--will he ignore all but Mormons who have problems?

[straight man]

At risk of stating the obvious, the news about Bin Laden is going to help out the Conservatives a ton (and potentially the Liberals, too.)

Even before that, I would bet on the Liberals ending up with more seats than the NDP. Either way, there could be a merger coming...

[Cat Whisperer]

Awww, ya bunch of hosers.

awkward man hug (http://www.facebook.com/group.php?gid=2255880875)

ETA: Everyone go vote!
In all fairness, that only looks awkward for one guy. :)

Yeah, go vote! We live in a democracy, dammit! Use it!

[Gorsnak]

At risk of stating the obvious, the news about Bin Laden is going to help out the Conservatives a ton (and potentially the Liberals, too.)

Even before that, I would bet on the Liberals ending up with more seats than the NDP. Either way, there could be a merger coming...

I'm at a bit of a loss for how the bin Laden news is going to swing any votes at all.

Nor do I see how or why the Liberals and NDP would merge.

[straight man]

I'm at a bit of a loss for how the bin Laden news is going to swing any votes at all.

Nor do I see how or why the Liberals and NDP would merge.
Quick answers:

Bin Laden will be on everybody's minds as they vote tomorrow. It will have an inherent pro-incumbent effect, on top of which, the NDP has been strongly against the Canadian presence in Afghanistan, and this news will affect public opinion of that presence. You could see Harper trying to play for that effect in his press announcement (possibly a bit too blatantly.)

There's been increasing talk about "unite the Left" over the last couple years. Particularly if the Conservatives get their majority, but even if they merely get an insurmountable minority, that talk will become a roar pretty quickly. There could also be an effect on the intraparty dynamics —but of course, we'll see.

[Euphonious Polemic]

Final DemocraticSpace projections:

CPC: 149
NDP: 79
Liberal: 55
BQ: 24
Independent: 1

A majority remains possible, if not terribly likely. The Liberals' chances look really bad.

308 hasn't updated their projections but I don't think they will much differ.

308's projections:

CPC: 143
NDP: 78
Liberal: 60
BQ: 27
Green/Independent: 0

Close to DemocraticSpace - mainly 308 calls for 5 more seats for the Liberals and 6 fewer for the Conservatives.

[Shmendrik]

Quick answers:

Bin Laden will be on everybody's minds as they vote tomorrow. It will have an inherent pro-incumbent effect, on top of which, the NDP has been strongly against the Canadian presence in Afghanistan, and this news will affect public opinion of that presence. You could see Harper trying to play for that effect in his press announcement (possibly a bit too blatantly.)

There's been increasing talk about "unite the Left" over the last couple years. Particularly if the Conservatives get their majority, but even if they merely get an insurmountable minority, that talk will become a roar pretty quickly. There could also be an effect on the intraparty dynamics —but of course, we'll see.

How about the opposite effect? "Osama's dead, so now we should listen to the NDP and get out of Afghanistan?"

[antonio107]

I can't believe Jack Layton killed Osama Bin Laden with such a rough happy ending!

Incidentally, my speadreading regiment is going great! No comprehension loss whatsoever! :D

[straight man]

How about the opposite effect? "Osama's dead, so now we should listen to the NDP and get out of Afghanistan?"
Definitely possible. I don't think it will happen too much, unless some very public figures start talking "mission accomplished". I mean, in reality (and I assumed this was where Gorsnak is coming from) getting bin Laden has little to do with the success of the Afghanistan efforts, and indeed the efforts there increasingly have less and less to do with terrorism anyway. It's just that people's opinions of the Afghanistan mission have to be as high as they could ever possibly be at this moment, even if that's not rational.

(It could also make people feel better about the US/Canada GWOT cooperation that Harper loves to push, again not out of rationality.)

[Baffle]

308 has officially called my riding for the Conservative party, by a 0.2% margin that translates to approximately 120 votes. I'm torn between supporting the following:

1. A candidate whose incompetent law firm represented the other side in a lawsuit against my father (who settled favourably). He also implies a desire to close down the factory where I work.

2. A former member of the Canadian Alliance party who personally seems to share very few of my values. (Though he doesn't exactly make that public -- he's very much a stand-in because Stephen Harper can't run here too.) He can't be bothered to make his views known at candidate forums, the internet, or even grant interviews to major local journalists.

3. A social worker, about whom I can learn nearly nothing, and whose party's platform just doesn't quite add up. How can we double pension payments just as a huge cohort of Canadians are entering retirement age? How is this not just a blatant vote-buy?

4. A party that, in addition to promoting an expensive and economically regressive agenda of nonsense, explicitly wants to put me out of work. (Gee, don't they sound swell.)

5. A university student with no oratory ability who received all of 77 votes last election, and wants to, with a 60% increase to minimum wage, a) destroy a lot of low-paying jobs and b) greatly increase the cost of essential purchases.

6. A candidate for a party that seems to exist solely to support other parties, and wants to outlaw a valuable natural resource because it's cute.

7. A candidate who is literally a homeless man, who spends over half the year living in a foreign country, running for a party with a single platform plank.

8. A candidate who I literally know nothing about, and doesn't even appear to live in the riding.

---

The top two are the only two who realistically have a chance of winning. At this point I can't expect either to do much in the way of being a vocal presence for my riding in Parliament, so I really should vote for the parties. Do I vote for the idiot who'll put me out of work, or run the risk of a risk of a majority government implementing policies I can't abide?

[antonio107]

Personal vendetta trumps ideological standoff. At least that's my two cents. :)

[Baffle]

Personal vendetta trumps ideological standoff. At least that's my two cents. :)

Well, gee, if we go there...

Candidate #2's staff tried to steal a ballot box and shut down a special poll. He's also had his staff engage in intimidation tactics at advance polls throughout Liberal-voting districts of the riding. I guess that's not as directly personal, but it's been to the detriment of people I personally know. And that plus his failure to show up to most of the debates (he claims his campaign is more focused on canvassing -- funny, nobody I know has met him) also shows him to be rather uninterested in the democratic process as a whole.

[straight man]

Well, gee, if we go there...

Candidate #2's staff tried to steal a ballot box and shut down a special poll. He's also had his staff engage in intimidation tactics at advance polls throughout Liberal-voting districts of the riding. I guess that's not as directly personal, but it's been to the detriment of people I personally know. And that plus his failure to show up to most of the debates (he claims his campaign is more focused on canvassing -- funny, nobody I know has met him) also shows him to be rather uninterested in the democratic process as a whole.
That's... some very, very good reasons not to vote for him.

[Mona Lisa Simpson]

I'm fortunate, in that the candidates for the three main parties in my riding are all good eggs, and the two that are dukeing it out for the win are acquaintances of mine. Its nice to know that whichever one gets elected, he will do a good job at representing my riding.

Agreed. One of them gets to help this city no matter what. My side of town, not so much. I will have a bit more to say after the polls close.

[Le Ministre de l'au-delà]

Does anyone have specific information about discussion of regional results on internet message boards? I'm just wondering if, as I believe, we are supposed to wait until 8 PM PDT before any talking about the election results...

[Leaffan]

I can't see how a message board broadcast would be treated any differently than tweets, blogs etc.

Have a read here. (http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2011-05-02/canada-election-result-bloggers-face-fines-under-1938-law.html)

Kennedy’s advice to tweeters, bloggers and Facebook users on Election Day is: “They should be aware that it is an offence.” As for freedom of expression, “Certainly people can express opinion without contravening section 329,” she said.

[antonio107]

Well, gee, if we go there...

Candidate #2's staff tried to steal a ballot box and shut down a special poll. He's also had his staff engage in intimidation tactics at advance polls throughout Liberal-voting districts of the riding. I guess that's not as directly personal, but it's been to the detriment of people I personally know. And that plus his failure to show up to most of the debates (he claims his campaign is more focused on canvassing -- funny, nobody I know has met him) also shows him to be rather uninterested in the democratic process as a whole.

Well, there you go! :D

Seriously though, i'd say that's an argument for third party voting/not voting at all. Do you really want to weigh the options between two candidates, and see which one causes you less grievances? If you vote for the one who wants to put you out of work, seems to me you should get out your resume!

[Spoons]

I'm back from voting. The polls weren't too busy, but it is only mid-morning here. I'm sure they will get busy at the end of the business day, though.

[Grey]

Well this should be interesting. Heck Google even has a Canadian election image up.

So I went and considered what happens to political party funding if 15million people vote as per the 308 link. It’s neat :D
Assume we had roughly 14 million votes cast last election with the following results and funding

Conservative (37.7%) for 5,271,000 votes – $9.2 million
Liberals (26.3%) for 3,676,400 votes - $6.4 million
NDP (18.2%) for 2,545,200 votes - $4.5 million
Bloc (10%) for 1,397,200 votes – 2.4 million

Now lets’ just say that this election will see 15 million votes cast and we’ll use the projected % from 308

Conservative (36.4%) for 5,460,000 votes – $9.6 million
Liberals (22.8%) for 3,420,000 votes - $6.0 million
NDP (27.3%) for 4,095,000 votes - $7.2 million
Bloc (6.7%) for 1,005,000 votes – $1.8 million

The Conservatives and Liberals don’t see massive funding jumps at all here. The NDP funding jumps by $2.7 million or enough for 27 people at $100k LLR

The Bloc loses $700k of funding or 30%. That, to me, seems huge as the available pool of donors is restricted to the 20% or so of the 3 million Quebecers that continue to vote Bloc. Still the Bloc was able to win large numbers of seats prior to the current funding formula, but it does present a challenge to their ability to operate.

[Baffle]

I held my nose and voted. Never missed an election yet. :(

[RickJay]

I'm puzzled as to what "results" I could illegally post on here or Facebook, Twitter, etc. I don't know the results until Elections Canada starts releasing them. I supposed I could tell you who *I* voted for - I wouldn't, but I could - but that doesn't count as a "result," does it?

[Baffle]

In the past, local TV has reported election results in one part of the country before polls have closed further west. This wasn't a big deal because you couldn't get the Thunder Bay station in Kenora anyway. And it's against the law for the Kenora station to broadcast those results. Now, someone in Toronto can post the eastern results three hours before Vancouver's done voting, and (potentially) influence the vote.

It's an antiquated law that just doesn't work in the Internet age (or really the satellite TV age either), and yet there have been prosecutions. Our ministerial friend is merely warning people about that potential -- if you're worried, don't discuss results here until after 8 PM PST.

I'm curious about the satellite TV bit. Do the Westerners who subscribe to timeshifting get those channels blacked out for the time period, or are they visible? I never had TV when I lived out west. Does anyone know?

[Baffle]

And also, here's a cite:

http://www.canadiancommunicationslaw.com/telecomunications/elections-canada-warns-social-media-users-not-to-post-election-results/

[Leaffan]

I'm puzzled as to what "results" I could illegally post on here or Facebook, Twitter, etc. I don't know the results until Elections Canada starts releasing them. I supposed I could tell you who *I* voted for - I wouldn't, but I could - but that doesn't count as a "result," does it?
You wouldn't know the results until Elections Canada starts releasing them, but I'm sure people working at polling stations in the east will have results before the polls close in the west. I think these people are the ones who are being targeted with the "no twittering" barrage of messages this election.

....I'm curious about the satellite TV bit. Do the Westerners who subscribe to timeshifting get those channels blacked out for the time period, or are they visible? I never had TV when I lived out west. Does anyone know?

I imagine they're completely visible, since no station can report results until after the polls close in the west anyway.

[Baffle]

You wouldn't know the results until Elections Canada starts releasing them, but I'm sure people working at polling stations in the east will have results before the polls close in the west. I think these people are the ones who are being targeted with the "no twittering" barrage of messages this election.



I imagine they're completely visible, since no station can report results until after the polls close in the west anyway.

That's never been the case in the past; the CBC's always come on with their election coverage right when polls close, EST. And they've got 10,000 votes counted in all of the Atlantic ridings already, and Peter Mansbridge says something to the effect of, 'Welcome all of you who are just joining us from Ontario and Quebec, the polls are now closed.'

[Leaffan]

That's never been the case in the past; the CBC's always come on with their election coverage right when polls close, EST. And they've got 10,000 votes counted in all of the Atlantic ridings already, and Peter Mansbridge says something to the effect of, 'Welcome all of you who are just joining us from Ontario and Quebec, the polls are now closed.'

That changed sometime ago. I can't find a cite. Perhaps 10 years or so ago I believe they changed the elections act to exclude the publishing of any results until all the polls had closed.

I'll keep looking........

[orcenio]

Cons - 145
NDP - 88
Libs - 50
Bloc - 25
Green - 0

My wild ass guess

[Leaffan]

I guess section 329 of the elections act has always been there, just that in today's connected world it now applies to other broadcast options, like twitter, etc.

I know back in the 90s the CBC would start reporting results as they came in, but only for your time zone or earlier.

The last few elections they don't start reporting anything until all polls close. I can't seem to find out which election specifically this changed on.

[Raygun99]

It's not that as much that all the polls times were changed.
The Eastern, Central and Mountain time polls all close at the same time now, and Pacific polls close a half hour after them. You couldn't do this with the Atlantic polls, because that would mean either having them open until 10:30 p.m. (11 in NL), or opening them at 6:30 a.m. in Mountain time.

[Leaffan]

It's not that as much that all the polls times were changed.
The Eastern, Central and Mountain time polls all close at the same time now, and Pacific polls close a half hour after them. You couldn't do this with the Atlantic polls, because that would mean either having them open until 10:30 p.m. (11 in NL), or opening them at 6:30 a.m. in Mountain time.

Thanks Raygun. That's pretty much all I'm coming up with, which boils down to all the results coming at once, instead of flowing from east to west.

[Cat Whisperer]

I appreciate those changes.

[Muffin]

Wouldn't be a problem if Elections Canada would only release results once all polls across the country are closed.

[dhkendall]

Wouldn't be a problem if Elections Canada would only release results once all polls across the country are closed.

I'd hate to be the Newfoundland candidate waiting for four and a half hours (from 8:00 to 12:30 (aka 8:00 PST)) to hear *anything* about my campaign, and then to have it be very anti-climactic "oh, I lost/won" (who doesn't like seeing those poll numbers go back and forth, especially if you're the candidate)?

[Sunspace]

308 has officially called my riding for the Conservative party, by a 0.2% margin that translates to approximately 120 votes. I'm torn between supporting the following...I'd say you were baffled. :)

[Muffin]

I'd hate to be the Newfoundland candidate waiting for four and a half hours (from 8:00 to 12:30 (aka 8:00 PST)) to hear *anything* about my campaign, and then to have it be very anti-climactic "oh, I lost/won" (who doesn't like seeing those poll numbers go back and forth, especially if you're the candidate)?Let the candidates eat cake. Better they be patient for a few hours than regular folks run afoul of the law for discussing results over the internet.

[Ike Witt]

I wanted to vote for Jack Johnson, but ended up voting for John Jackson.

[Cunctator]

So what time do the polls close?

[Sunspace]

My oh-so-convenient Globe-and-Mail Politics App says 22:00 EDT, but I'm sure it's using my phone's location. So here's the straight dope from Elections Canada (http://www.elections.ca/content.aspx?section=vot&dir=bkg&document=ec90815&lang=e):

Newfoundland Time: 8:30 a.m. – 8:30 p.m.
Atlantic Time: 8:30 a.m. – 8:30 p.m.
Eastern Time: 9:30 a.m. – 9:30 p.m.
Central Time*: 8:30 a.m. – 8:30 p.m.
Mountain Time*: 7:30 a.m. – 7:30 p.m.
Pacific Time: 7:00 a.m. – 7:00 p.m.

This is either Standard time or Daylight time for the various time zones. In each time zone, we start getting media coverage when the polls close. I thought they had it set up so that the polls close at the same instant (just expressed as different times in different time zones), or maybe two different instants, but looking at the list, that doesn't seem to make sense.

[Le Ministre de l'au-delà]

nm - beaten by Sunspace.

[Sunspace]

nm - beaten by Sunspace.I was just replying to your post, which said something completely different than mine. I am now confused.

Edit: the app said, "election results will be available at 22:00 EDT." Not the same thing as the polls closing time...

Area codes I can handle, but I always have to stop and think about time zones...

[Raygun99]

Those poll closing times converted all to EDT:
Newfoundland: 7 pm
Atlantic: 7:30
Eastern: 9:30
Central: 9:30
Mountain: 9:30
Pacific: 10

[Cunctator]

Gosh, that's much later than here, where voting ceases at 6.00pm.

So you've still got a couple of hours before the easternmost provinces finish voting, and then a couple more for the west to finish. Then the counting, which will presumably be close. So probably no result - if any - until late this afternoon perhaps.

[Raygun99]

Yeah, I wouldn't expect anything definitive until after midnight eastern, and possibly after that.

[Le Ministre de l'au-delà]

Depending on how it goes, we'll likely know the make up of the House of Commons within 6 hours. This one will be very interesting, however...

[Le Ministre de l'au-delà]

I was just replying to your post, which said something completely different than mine. I am now confused.



Be not confused - I was responding from memory with information that's about 15 years out of date.

I still remember what it was like tuning in from Manitoba to discover that the Liberals had already won despite not electing a single member west of Winnipeg.

[Raygun99]

Yes, the 1993 election was billed as a potential nailbiter but everyone in the Central timezone and west got to turn into Peter Mansbridge telling us it was over within 5 seconds.

[Cat Whisperer]

I'm glad to hear other people remembering that; I seem to recall winners being announced before polls in the west had even closed.

[mnemosyne]

Got around to voting around 7 or so. It was odd, as there seemed to be a line-up for one polling booth, but none for others...we just walked right up to our assigned one past a line of 15-20 people for another. Our polling station is in an old folk's home, so the experience involves mandatory hand washing with Purell. Ours are the cleanest votes in Canada!

[RickJay]

Depending on how it goes, we'll likely know the make up of the House of Commons within 6 hours. This one will be very interesting, however...
It is entirely possible that whether or not the Conservatives get a majority will come down to whether they win, say, 15 seats in BC versus 13. So it very well could be not just a nailbiter, but the nail-bitingest election in Canadian history.

[Sunspace]

I voted in the advance poll. :)

Edit: there was a lineup even there, even in this small town of Bancroft (pop. 3500).

[Cat Whisperer]

Well, PM Harper finally made it to Calgary. :)

[orcenio]

The East Coast results are pretty interesting...but not TOO interesting... (:p to elections Canada)

[mnemosyne]

Based on your smilie, I can only guess the East has gone entirely Green. It's a code, right? :)

[orcenio]

Based on your smilie, I can only guess the East has gone entirely Green. It's a code, right? :)Oh jeez... Do you WANT me hauled away with my new android tablet confiscated! :eek:

[RickJay]

I got a leak... Good GOD... all the polls were wrong... the very fabric of our country!

NATO will probably attack within hours of this being released. Prime Minister Dogg? Will the secession of Nova Scotia offset Argentinia... damn, I've said too much!

[Sunspace]

I got a leak... Good GOD... all the polls were wrong... the very fabric of our country!

NATO will probably attack within hours of this being released. Prime Minister Dogg? Will the secession of Nova Scotia offset Argentinia... damn, I've said too much!Well, I got a tweet that mentioned Prime Minister Karl... no, I've said too much.

[Le Ministre de l'au-delà]

There have been reports all day (http://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/canadavotes2011/story/2011/05/02/cv-election-polling-pranks-411.html) of voters being given false information about a change in the location of their polling station.

Someone tried to steal the ballot box (http://www.globaltvbc.com/decisioncanada/Votes+secure+ballot+damaged+Glasgow+tries+steal+ballot+Peter+MacKay+riding/4712763/story.html) in Peter MacKay's riding.

More interestingly, there is also a report (http://www.examiner.com/canada-headlines-in-canada/stephen-harper-breaks-election-rules-campaigns-on-radio-on-election-day) that Prime Minister Harper campaigned on the radio this morning, in contravention of Elections Canada rules. I'm waiting to see if this gets picked up and confirmed by mainstream media, or whether this is a last-minute tactic to discredit the Prime Minister. Sadly, either one would seem to be possible with this election.

[Annie]

All my CTV/Global time shift channels have a 'This channel is currently broadcasting out-of-market coverage of the federal election, so go fuck off' placard. Including the one that's suppose to have Castle on right now, so according to Twitter......Slytherin 3, Hufflepuff 2.

[Spoons]

... so according to Twitter......Slytherin 3, Hufflepuff 2.Oh, man! You know what's gonna happen if Slytherin gets in!

[RickJay]

More interestingly, there is also a report (http://www.examiner.com/canada-headlines-in-canada/stephen-harper-breaks-election-rules-campaigns-on-radio-on-election-day) that Prime Minister Harper campaigned on the radio this morning, in contravention of Elections Canada rules. I'm waiting to see if this gets picked up and confirmed by mainstream media, or whether this is a last-minute tactic to discredit the Prime Minister. Sadly, either one would seem to be possible with this election.
According to the report Harper was being intereviewed and said "I hope people vote Conservative" or some such thing.

If that's against the law... well, Jesus, gimme a break. If it had been a paid ad or something that's one thing, but someone asks you for your comments, you say that, and that's against the law? Seriously?

I tried reading the relevant sections of the Criminal Code and couldn't find anything that made that illegal anyway, but it's a tough read.

[Annie]

More interestingly, there is also a report (http://www.examiner.com/canada-headlines-in-canada/stephen-harper-breaks-election-rules-campaigns-on-radio-on-election-day) that Prime Minister Harper campaigned on the radio this morning, in contravention of Elections Canada rules. I'm waiting to see if this gets picked up and confirmed by mainstream media, or whether this is a last-minute tactic to discredit the Prime Minister. Sadly, either one would seem to be possible with this election.

Here's the audio: it's about 24 seconds before the end, (http://www.cknw.com/Channels/Politics_and_Power_BC/story.aspx?ID=1411274) he says 'I encourage people to do like me and vote Conservative' (or close enough, I'm not listening 3 times, sorry).

[Spoons]

I took a look at the Globe and Mail results page. No results there--not that I expected any from the Globe before polls close out here, which they will do in 20 minutes or so. But they seem ready to go. I'll keep monitoring.

[Annie]

Oh, man! You know what's gonna happen if Slytherin gets in!

Even more politicians speaking in Parseltongue? :D

ETA: if you want tweets that aren't all jokes, someone at tweettheresults did put in a useful search parameter.

[mnemosyne]

More interestingly, there is also a report (http://www.examiner.com/canada-headlines-in-canada/stephen-harper-breaks-election-rules-campaigns-on-radio-on-election-day) that Prime Minister Harper campaigned on the radio this morning, in contravention of Elections Canada rules. I'm waiting to see if this gets picked up and confirmed by mainstream media, or whether this is a last-minute tactic to discredit the Prime Minister. Sadly, either one would seem to be possible with this election.

If I read that right, in a very extreme and unlikely hypothetical (if campaigning on the day of the vote counts as one of the "certain offences), the Conservative party could be deregistered and have all its assets liquidated? I know it won't happen (and I don't think it should) but... if it's a possibility, why would you be so stupid as to risk it? I'd like to think the Prime Minister has some clue about how Elections in Canada work, you know?



I've figured out the code. The SDMB has revealed it to me....obviously the coolest party will win, so it's the NDP Orange Crush :cool:

See, it even confirms it with this reference to Layton...:o

Harper ends up :eek::confused::(

Ignatieff ends up :mad:

The Greens must get at least one seat, because they've been praying so much :rolleyes: but end up happy :p:D

And the rest of the population is torn between :dubious::);):smack:

[CarnalK]

According to the report Harper was being intereviewed and said "I hope people vote Conservative" or some such thing.


Well, if you listen to the audio linked above, you'll see Harper is a little more culpable than that. The whole interview was about Osama getting killed and then the convo went something like:

<talk about soldiers being killed in Afghanistan>
Harper: We've always had good people willing to fight to protect our freedoms, such as the right to vote which we're currently exercising.
Good: Did you vote yet?
Harper: Yes I did and I encourage all Canadians to vote. In fact, I'd like them to all vote like I did, Conservative.
Good: Ha ha. Well thank you. We too encourage all of our listeners to vote, but the way that you feel is best.


Not that I think he should be "liquidated" over it or anything.

[Spoons]

Well, polls have closed in MDT. CBC and Global are broadcasting results, but as I type this, CTV seems to be off the air. Wonder what's happening there?

ETA: Just now, CTV is back on. No sound though.

ETA2: Now we've got sound, but no picture. And now, no sound either! This is almost comical.

[Sunspace]

:: seven minutes to go ::
*twitch*

[Annie]

OK, we got Lloyd up in BC, safe to talk

[Euphonious Polemic]

OK, It's 7:03 BC time.

Results please!

[Sunspace]

:: looks at preliminary map from the CBC ::

Holy crap!

[CarnalK]

If it's safe to talk then I just got to say: Bloq be going down! Wowsers.

[Annie]

Jack's moving to Stornoway!

[Leaffan]

Yeahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Meet the new boss. Same as the old boss.




(Windmill.)
(Windmill.)
(Windmill.)
(Windmill.)
(Windmillllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllll.)


Conservative majority predicted by me!




WOW!

[Grey]

Jesus Christ! That's a lot of blue in Southern Ontario, and a lot of orange anywhere else. Where is matt anyway, he should be in here doing flips.

[Sunspace]

No votes for the Communists in Guelph yet...

[Spoons]

Jesus Christ!He's doing well in the Bible Belt ridings, but doesn't seem to be much of a threat elsewhere.

:D

[Grey]

And I see Danny William's ghost continues to haunt the Conservatives in Nfld

[Mona Lisa Simpson]

No votes for the Communists in Guelph yet...

But the guy who used to say "smash the state" in my history classes at Concordia University is going to be an MP.

:confused:

Looks like we are going to have a real right/left split in this country. At least the PM and the opposition are not going to look and sound the same.

[Grey]

He's doing well in the Bible Belt ridings, but doesn't seem to be much of a threat elsewhere.

:DThey shall not know the timing of the coming of my election, nor the swath of popped pundit heads. Yea verily.

[Sunspace]

I'm going to have blue-and-orange-striped dreams, or possibly nightmares, tonight...

[mnemosyne]

With only a few returns, Gilles Duceppe is looking at maybe losing his seat in Laurier-St. Marie. Hélène Laverdière (NDP) has an approx 18% vote lead at the moment. This is....crazy. This neighbourhood and riding is a separatist stronghold both federally and provincially. Based on the people I saw at the polls...it was a young, mixed crowd and I'm not surprised that might not have gone in the Bloc's favour.

[perfectparanoia]

My brain is going to explode. The conservatives could still get their majority AND the NDP could still get 100 seats.

What is going on here?

[orcenio]

The Bloc is dead...

[mnemosyne]

The CTV party leader bobbleheads are freaking me out. But an election isn't an election without Lloyd!!

[drm]

Linda Duncan has a six point lead in the lone non-PC riding in Alberta. Mike Wallace has a slim lead over my brother in Burlington, lets see if he can pull this one out (slight exaggeration, he's running for the green party. He's worked very hard, though.)

ETA: I haven't been following this as closely as I might have (aside from my brother), as work has been ridiculous. If this night ends up much like it seems that it might for the Liberals, is Ignatieff out? (before posting, I realize he's down 5 percent in his own riding)

[Muffin]

Some shenanigans in southern Ontario -- calls were made telling people to go to different polling station: http://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/canadavotes2011/story/2011/05/02/cv-election-polling-pranks-411.html

[Grey]

The Bloc is dead...That seems unlikely to me. Badly mauled perhaps and if the PQ wins the provincial election maybe pushed further from the limelight, but dead is a strong statement.

[orcenio]

That seems unlikely to me. Badly mauled perhaps and if the PQ wins the provincial election maybe pushed further from the limelight, but dead is a strong statement.It is a strong statement, but we are seeing strong results.

[Leaffan]

Terry Milewski is a complete fucking tool.

[Grey]

Yeah I noticed. I mean coupled with a slash to their public funding and it will make for a very interesting Quebec election.

[Spoons]

The CTV party leader bobbleheads are freaking me out. But an election isn't an election without Lloyd!!That's exactly what I was thinking--they are bobbleheads! Good to know I'm not the only one who sees that. And I agree; it is not an election without Lloyd; thus my frustration with CTV upthread.

In other news, just a few minutes ago, I had to run down to the corner store. This store has a little TV for the clerk to watch. When I walked in, there were a few people clustered around the counter and the TV. Were they anxiously monitoring election results? Nope--they were glued to the hockey game. Well, this is Canada during playoff season, after all. :)

[mnemosyne]

The provincial election could still go PQ, simply because of dissatisfaction with the Liberals. This federal election makes that seem less likely (a minority at most, maybe?), but... I actually wouldn't be surprised (though I would be disappointed) if the PQ makes the next provincial government here.

[Le Ministre de l'au-delà]

This is the worst night of my life.


So far.

[CarnalK]

That seems unlikely to me. Badly mauled perhaps and if the PQ wins the provincial election maybe pushed further from the limelight, but dead is a strong statement.

I don't know. If they only end up with 4 seats, none of them Duceppe, they are going to be completely ignored for the next few years. Hard for them to bounce back from that. It reminds me of a bit on Duceppe I read
Gilles Duceppe in a fight for even his own riding (http://www.thestar.com/news/canada/politics/article/983686--gilles-duceppe-in-a-fight-for-even-his-own-riding)
[Duceppe campaign volunteer]Michel Chapdelaine was more blunt. He seems to think the Bloc won’t last beyond this election.

“Never mind the result,” he offered. The Bloc “will understand that it’s no longer their battle. The fight (for sovereignty) is really going to be in Quebec City.”

[Mona Lisa Simpson]

Well the west can't complain this election was decided before they turned on the TV.

[Grey]

The provincial election could still go PQ, simply because of dissatisfaction with the Liberals. This federal election makes that seem less likely (a minority at most, maybe?), but... I actually wouldn't be surprised (though I would be disappointed) if the PQ makes the next provincial government here.I'd almost expect it - the PQ uses the lack of Bloc representation as a reason to vote for them to make some sort of strong statement and ensure Quebec gets what Quebec deserves. Coupled with Charest and really it's never good to have an executive in power too long anyway. I just wish it didn't have to be a choice between Seperatist/Federalist.

[Grey]

I don't know. If they only end up with 4 seats, none of them Duceppe, they are going to be completely ignored for the next few years. Hard for them to bounce back from that. It reminds me of a bit on Duceppe I read
Gilles Duceppe in a fight for even his own riding (http://www.thestar.com/news/canada/politics/article/983686--gilles-duceppe-in-a-fight-for-even-his-own-riding)from my very own federalist soul I dearly hope so - but things tend to lurch on and on.

[Leaffan]

Elizabeth May is a complete fucking tool.

[Annie]

Ewww, CTV unlocked Mulroney from his crypt, where's my remote???

[Spoons]

Ewww, CTV unlocked Mulroney from his crypt, where's my remote???Yes, but he's speaking as an elder statesman--no power, but able to offer commentary. And he's been fair--he's had a lot of good things to say about Jack Layton, and his father, whom Mulroney knew; and was cautious about the Liberal collapse, remarking more on the historical significance than on anything else. He's harmless now, and he's not saying anything out of line. Yet.

[3trew]

Man am I glad I missed that. I'm having enough flashbacks to 1988 as it is.

[Sam Stone]

It looks like a funeral broadcast on the CBC. They're not happy at all.

[mnemosyne]

:(

It's not even mostly the conservative platform that bothers me. It's this particular band of idiots and their lack of transparency and arrogance that pisses me off. This is going to be an...interesting... 4-5 years, and I'm not sure it's going to balance out for the good, but it is what it is. I hope they can prove themselves to be better than what they've shown so far.

One thing, though....I want Harper slapped with a fine for campaigning on Election Day. It's against the law, he's the Prime Minister, he needs to respect Canada and her laws. I don't care if it's a nominal fine...I still want it on the record that he broke the law in order to try and gain power. I can only hope it will serve as a check and balance for the future, though I'm not optimistic. There's no excuse, and this shouldn't be ignored. They campaigned on accountability a few years back...Election Canada is in a position to enforce it, at least once.

[Rysto]

This is a goddamn disaster. The Liberals are decimated and now Harper has the power to administer the coup-de-grace to them by cutting off their funding. We're going to be left with the Conservatives and the unelectable NDP.

[Sam Stone]

CBC just projected a Conservative Majority. Harper's the PM until at least 2015.

[Sam Stone]

I for one welcome our new Conservative overlords.

[Muffin]

This is a goddamn disaster. The Liberals are decimated and now Harper has the power to administer the coup-de-grace to them by cutting off their funding.Nah, the coup-de-grace would be to deport Ignatief's wife.

[Muffin]

Elizabeth May is a complete fucking tool.Who is leading early on at the polls -- wonder if she might win the first Green seat?

[orcenio]

It was a small swing, but it was enough and it was clear. The Tories did it.

[Spoons]

Globe and Mail is reporting that CBC broadcast results before polls closed:

CBC appears to break Elections Act, broadcasts results before polls close (http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/politics/cbc-appears-to-break-elections-act-broadcasts-results-before-polls-close/article2007524/)

[Spoons]

Holy cats! CTV just reported that Ignatieff is losing in his riding!

[mnemosyne]

Globe and Mail is reporting that CBC broadcast results before polls closed:

CBC appears to break Elections Act, broadcasts results before polls close (http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/politics/cbc-appears-to-break-elections-act-broadcasts-results-before-polls-close/article2007524/)

:eek: "premature transmission", eh? :D

[Annie]

It was a small swing, but it was enough and it was clear. The Tories did it.

The Reform party, aka the pig in Tory lipstick

[Shmendrik]

CBC has the BQ currently leading in 2 ridings?

[Gorsnak]

Can't believe the CBC has May listed as "Other" instead of Green. Lazy lazy.

Not thrilled about a Conservative majority, but quite tickled at the collapse of the Bloc.

[Leaffan]

:(

It's not even mostly the conservative platform that bothers me. It's this particular band of idiots and their lack of transparency and arrogance that pisses me off. This is going to be an...interesting... 4-5 years, and I'm not sure it's going to balance out for the good, but it is what it is. I hope they can prove themselves to be better than what they've shown so far.

One thing, though....I want Harper slapped with a fine for campaigning on Election Day. It's against the law, he's the Prime Minister, he needs to respect Canada and her laws. I don't care if it's a nominal fine...I still want it on the record that he broke the law in order to try and gain power. I can only hope it will serve as a check and balance for the future, though I'm not optimistic. There's no excuse, and this shouldn't be ignored. They campaigned on accountability a few years back...Election Canada is in a position to enforce it, at least once.
Sore loser. As usual.

Can't blame the refs this time.

[mnemosyne]

Sore loser. As usual.

Can't blame the refs this time.


WTF Leaffan? Uncalled for.

[Leaffan]

A Conservative majority is the best thing that has happened in decades.

I, for one, am thrilled at the direction of the country for the next 4 years.

[Hypnagogic Jerk]

Sore loser. As usual.

Can't blame the refs this time.
Yeah, that's how we stupid worthless frogs are. Have we ever done anything good in this country ever since inventing poutine?

[Leaffan]

WTF Leaffan? Uncalled for.

No. You're a perpetual whiner. Calling my party a "band of idiots." Go away.

[perfectparanoia]

A Conservative majority is the best thing that has happened in decades.

I, for one, am thrilled at the direction of the country for the next 4 years.

I suppose only time will truly tell but I believe you are incorrect, sir.

[Euphonious Polemic]

Elizabeth May is a complete fucking tool.

Sadly, her opponent is a corrupt little shitbag.

[drm]

WTF Leaffan? Uncalled for.

Based on his username, he has very little good in his life. Let him have this one.

[Euphonious Polemic]

A Conservative majority is the best thing that has happened in decades.

I, for one, am thrilled at the direction of the country for the next 4 years.

I'm going to guess that we will not be allowed to see what is happening for the next 4 years. There is transparent government, opaque government, and the totally light-free government that we'll be getting.

[Gorsnak]

The best things that have happened to Canada for decades are: 1) free trade with the rest of North America, and 2) the federal government digging itself out of deficit. If I'm not mistaken, both Blue and Red parties had something to do with both of those.

[detop]

No. You're a perpetual whiner. Calling my party a "band of idiots." Go away.

You should be happy. Me, I call them "vermin".

[Cunctator]

A very interesting outcome. Clearly not as close as predicted.

Not yet being reported in the Australian papers. Fairly typical.

[mnemosyne]

No. You're a perpetual whiner. Calling my party a "band of idiots." Go away.

This from a man who called a political party leader in another riding "a fucking tool" because he disagreed with her. High road, much?

I'm not going anywhere.

[perfectparanoia]

Seriously, we elected Harper again? I was pretty disappointed in Americans when they reelected GWB. Now, I see that we Canadians may be cut from a similar cloth.

I blame Ignatieff (or, rather the party that made him their leader, I suppose).

[Gorsnak]

You guys wanna get a room maybe? The tone in here is getting unpleasant.

I've just found another silver lining: my favourite racist idiot Jim Pankiw is polling dead last in Saskatoon-Humboldt with 2% of the vote.

[mnemosyne]

Duceppe has officially been upset by Hélène Laverdière.

[drm]

Ignatieff just gave his sell job on him keeping his job. He's remarkably uncharismatic. Really wish they've handed the whole thing over to Rae. I've always liked him.

[Spoons]

Tomorrow's Globe and Mail editorial was just published online maybe ten minutes ago: Stephen Harper’s double victory (http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/opinions/editorials/stephen-harpers-double-victory/article2007628/). No commentary from the Toronto Star yet--thought they might have something, as somebody (RickJay?) reported a few days ago that the Star, a longtime Liberal paper, was endorsing the NDP this time around.

[Sam Stone]

Holy cow Ignatieff is a terrible speaker. He's a decent guy and a good writer, but he's a walking soporific. Who ever thought he'd make a good leader for the party?

The content of his speech is pretty good, though. Gracious without sacrificing principle. He's going out with style. Too bad half his audience will be asleep before he gets to the end.

[Spoons]

A very interesting outcome. Clearly not as close as predicted.

Not yet being reported in the Australian papers. Fairly typical.Well, you've got us here on the SDMB to keep you informed. Glad to know you're interested and following--and just because I'm interested, could you post what you do find in the Australian media?

[RickJay]

This is a goddamn disaster. The Liberals are decimated and now Harper has the power to administer the coup-de-grace to them by cutting off their funding. We're going to be left with the Conservatives and the unelectable NDP.
I remember when the Liberals said the NDP couldn't form the Opposition.

Well, heck, I remember when people said the Liberals would be in power in perpetuity.

Brother, if the last five weeks should have taught us anything, it's that you shouldn't make predictions about who can or can't be elected.


And guys, seriously, stop insulting each other. You look awful. It's an election. We have peacefully chosen who shall lead our government, and done it peacefully, graciously, efficiently, for the 41st time in a democratic history over a century long. We will do it again, and again, and again. Someone will win, and someone will lose. Start learning to be a good loser and a gracious winner, because if you want to keep living in Canada and being a part of the political process, you're going to be happy and disappointed with many, many elections to come.

[Cunctator]

Well, you've got us here on the SDMB to keep you informed. Glad to know you're interested and following--and just because I'm interested, could you post what you do find in the Australian media?It's made the papers now. The Australian (conservative leaning, nationwide paper) has this short summary. (http://www.theaustralian.com.au/news/breaking-news/canadas-stephen-harper-wins-elusive-majority/story-fn3dxity-1226049107342)

It's all making very interesting lunchtime reading while I scoff my ham and cheese sandwich.

[Mona Lisa Simpson]

What is with Iggy licking his lips every 20 seconds? I kept seeing tongue. *shudder*

[Spoons]

It's made the papers now. The Australian (conservative leaning, nationwide paper) has this short summary. (http://www.theaustralian.com.au/news/breaking-news/canadas-stephen-harper-wins-elusive-majority/story-fn3dxity-1226049107342)

It's all making very interesting lunchtime reading while I scoff my ham and cheese sandwich.Many thanks!

[Shmendrik]

Whether Ignatieff resigns or not, the guy who runs 308 blog definitely should.

[Cat Whisperer]

Well the west can't complain this election was decided before they turned on the TV.Well, we can, but no one's gonna listen. :)

This is a goddamn disaster. The Liberals are decimated and now Harper has the power to administer the coup-de-grace to them by cutting off their funding. We're going to be left with the Conservatives and the unelectable NDP.So all the parties will have to get their own funding instead of sucking the public money tit. I still don't get why that's such a terrible thing.

<snip>
And guys, seriously, stop insulting each other. You look awful. It's an election. We have peacefully chosen who shall lead our government, and done it peacefully, graciously, efficiently, for the 41st time in a democratic history over a century long. We will do it again, and again, and again. Someone will win, and someone will lose. Start learning to be a good loser and a gracious winner, because if you want to keep living in Canada and being a part of the political process, you're going to be happy and disappointed with many, many elections to come.I agree completely. ETA: And yes, I will try to remember that next time my party loses.

[RickJay]

Nobody predicted this. It's genuinely out of the margin of error of any meta-analysis of the polls.

I've got like 8 prediction sites on the Favourites and they all underestimated the Tory bounce and the NDP's astounding success.

[MoodIndigo1]

Sad day indeed. When will we ever get any clear answers from the conservatives about anything now? Harper was already running the country like a despot-- and that while at the head of a minority government. We may be headed for interesting times, and not in a good way.

[mnemosyne]

I will apologize for my strong language in expressing my disappointment in this election result. Given the past - both under Liberal and Conservative governments - I hope Canadians keep their government accountable over the next 4+ years, and that we all end up better off.

[Grapefruit]

I didn't want to see a majority government, and I understand the bitterness of throwing away money on election after election, but I liked the idea of the parties having some semblance of balance in terms of power.

I also don't think I've quite gotten over the shock that the BQ has lost so many seats.

[kingpengvin]

Duceppe just announced he's (obviously) stepping down as leader. Looks like only 3 or 4 at most seats for the BQ... So can we officially call the time of death on that party or is there a chance in 4 years they will return?

[Grey]

So all the parties will have to get their own funding instead of sucking the public money tit. I still don't get why that's such a terrible thing.Well ultimately it was to eliminate the influence of large unions and corporations and thereby reduce their influence in skewing what people wanted in elections.

I'm not sure it couldn't stand a tweak or two but really is it worth it to scrap it and so force the parties to look to larger sources of funding? Especially give the fact that partial public party funding is the least of our current federal spending concerns.

[Cat Whisperer]

You know what occurs to me, this election result being such a surprise might be the result of the older generation not being aware of the power of the internet and social media yet. I run across this at work and in my personal life all the time; they use email and maybe Facebook, but they only dip their toes into the pool.

[kingpengvin]

CBC just called a win for May... a Green party seat.

[kushiel]

You guys wanna get a room maybe? The tone in here is getting unpleasant.

I've just found another silver lining: my favourite racist idiot Jim Pankiw is polling dead last in Saskatoon-Humboldt with 2% of the vote.

I am pleased with Nettie Wiebe's turnout. Some of the Sask ridings have been pretty close between the Tories and NDP, which was the best I could hope for.

Business as usual over here with Ralph. My coworker brought up an interesting idea - Goodale running for Liberal leadership. I don't know if the Liberals would go for a prairie leader though.

[mnemosyne]

Duceppe just announced he's (obviously) stepping down as leader. Looks like only 3 or 4 at most seats for the BQ... So can we officially call the time of death on that party or is there a chance in 4 years they will return?

It will depend on the next 4 years. The impression I get is that the Conservatives are not perceived as being Québec-friendly. There's a worry that the NDP MPs might not be able to continue to represent Québec as strongly as the Bloc has; that's Layton's challenge, basically. If things go wrong - if Québec feels ignored/robbed/marginalized/etc over the next 4 years, it could mean a resurgence of sovereignist sentiment, or perhaps simply a backlash against the NDP...which could benefit the Liberals depending on how they rebuild. Too many possibilities, and they could be dead, but there are so many factors to be considered.


CTV quoted a tweet from someone which is just rather funny (paraphrased) : "the Conservatives are like Nickelback. No one likes them, but they always seem to do well!" I admit....I do dislike Nickelback...!

[kingpengvin]

You know what occurs to me, this election result being such a surprise might be the result of the older generation not being aware of the power of the internet and social media yet. I run across this at work and in my personal life all the time; they use email and maybe Facebook, but they only dip their toes into the pool.


Really? I'd love to see a sample poll of who actually votes compared to all the hot air blown on the social media. My guess is that the old farts probably still show up in greater numbers over the young hipsters tweeting each other about how useless it it is to go out and vote since "they're all liars and crooks anyway"

[Northern Piper]

And guys, seriously, stop insulting each other. You look awful. It's an election. We have peacefully chosen who shall lead our government, and done it peacefully, graciously, efficiently, for the 41st time in a democratic history over a century long. We will do it again, and again, and again. Someone will win, and someone will lose. Start learning to be a good loser and a gracious winner, because if you want to keep living in Canada and being a part of the political process, you're going to be happy and disappointed with many, many elections to come.

Hear, hear! Well said!

[Baffle]

For the first time, I voted for a winning candidate -- in hopes of preventing this Conservative majority, I voted for the idiot over the unprincipled.

My father: "Oh, how nice, the Conservative party is back. I'm glad they're not the Reform any more."

Here's to five more years of police oppression and politics of fear.

[Northern Piper]

One thing, though....I want Harper slapped with a fine for campaigning on Election Day. It's against the law, he's the Prime Minister, he needs to respect Canada and her laws. I don't care if it's a nominal fine...I still want it on the record that he broke the law in order to try and gain power. I can only hope it will serve as a check and balance for the future, though I'm not optimistic. There's no excuse, and this shouldn't be ignored. They campaigned on accountability a few years back...Election Canada is in a position to enforce it, at least once.

mnemosyne, there's no general ban on campaigning on election day. There are restrictions on campaigning in or near individual polling stations (see Canada Elections Act, ss. 165 and 166 (http://lois-laws.justice.gc.ca/eng/acts/E-2.01/page-68.html#h-67)). Now, it used to be customary that politicians would taper off and not campaign on election day, but that was simply a tradition, not a statutory prohibition.

[Baffle]

So much for 308 by the way -- the Liberal won my riding by 10%.

[Gorsnak]

Business as usual over here with Ralph. My coworker brought up an interesting idea - Goodale running for Liberal leadership. I don't know if the Liberals would go for a prairie leader though.
Pretty sure he doesn't want the job, or he would have thrown his hat in the ring one of the last couple rounds.