Parents Don't Properly Punish Me-What Should I Do?

[Qin Shi Huangdi]

I feel that my parents don't propery punish me enough, so what should I do? :(:confused:

[heathen earthling]

Punish you for what?

[Marley23]

You should appreciate your parents' kindness and give them some credit for knowing what they are doing.

[AClockworkMelon]

First of all, see if you can do chores or odd jobs around the neighborhood for some money. Save it up until you can afford to buy one of these (http://gd.image-gmkt.com/mi/989/307/401307989.jpg). You can get one from an online sex shop. Then, whenever your parents fail to punish you you can flagellate yourself. Do this while quoting Deuteronomy 21:18-21 repeatedly.

[Qin Shi Huangdi]

Punish you for what?

http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=599969

[MsWhatsit]

Save it up until you can afford to buy one of these (http://gd.image-gmkt.com/mi/989/307/401307989.jpg). You can get one from an online sex shop.

Or a regular sex shop. Let's not be limiting here; the OP might not have a credit card.

[Guinastasia]

http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=599969

Are you growing hair on your palms yet?

[Qin Shi Huangdi]

Are you growing hair on your palms yet?

Not for that but for the other thing I've happened to mention.

[Inner Stickler]

Wouldn't it be more in keeping with your philosophical leanings to not leave punishment up to your parents in the first place?

[Qin Shi Huangdi]

You should appreciate your parents' kindness and give them some credit for knowing what they are doing.

Thank you for the comment.

[Guinastasia]

I'm sorry, that was uncalled for, Qin.

[Qin Shi Huangdi]

I'm sorry, that was uncalled for, Qin.

That's alright.

[Troppus]

You might perform chores/deeds/acts you find boring/tedious/detestable. If you feel you need to make atonement: do so. Mow the lawn. Use the weed-eater. Mop the floor. Clean windows. Making yourself useful and taking some of the burden from your loved ones instead of flogging yourself. Help people. Commit acts of kindness. I guarantee you will reap more reward from kind acts than you will from flogging yourself. Eventually, you will gain control of your emotions and Act Right. Until then: make up for your mistakes and do chores for those who care for you.

[Left Hand of Dorkness]

If the point of the punishment is to correct behavior, then grow up and fix the behavior yourself.

If the point is vengeance, then trust in their power of forgiveness.

If you think you know how to properly punish a teenager, then wait until you've got teenagers of your own and implement your plan.

[Guinastasia]

Sometimes I think you're just too hard on yourself, Qin. Unless your parents are letting you run around wild, staying out all hours and NEVER disciplining you, I think you need to accept that they're judgment.

Have you ever had this talk with them?

[Qin Shi Huangdi]

Sometimes I think you're just too hard on yourself, Qin. Unless your parents are letting you run around wild, staying out all hours and NEVER disciplining you, I think you need to accept that they're judgment.


Actually they barely let me hang out outside at all, they almost always desire some sort of adult supervision over me.

Have you ever had this talk with them?[/QUOTE]

Yes, they don't seem to actually remember this.

[Diogenes the Cynic]

Your parents probably regard the behavioral issues you mention as being part of your Aspeberger's (or at least think it might be) and are uncomfortable about punishing it. The thing is, if you already know and understand that its inappropriate, then you don't need punishment, you just need to stop doing it. If you can't stop doing it, then punishment is even more pointless.

Do you find your parents emotionally responsive to you in general, or do you find them detached? It occurs to me that you might be subconsciously engaging in those behaviors specifically to try to provoke some kind of emotional response from them.

The "burning with lust" thing is completely normal and natural, by the way. It isn't wrong and everybody does it. Your dad does it. Your clergyman does it. President Obama does it. Jesus did it. It's fine.

[chacoguy]

The "burning with lust" thing is completely normal and natural, by the way. It isn't wrong and everybody does it. Your dad does it. Your clergyman does it. President Obama does it. Jesus did it. It's fine.

You failed to mention that girls do too.

[MsWhatsit]

You failed to mention that girls do too.

I think girls are included in the set of "everybody".

[chacoguy]

It seemed reasonable that girls get special mention. :)

[Cat Whisperer]

If the point of the punishment is to correct behavior, then grow up and fix the behavior yourself.<snip>Couldn't have said it better myself. No one punishes me for my own bad behaviour; my punishment is that my actions have consequences (stay up too late, be tired for work tomorrow. Eat crap, get fat and unhealthy. Etc.)

[friedo]

I feel that my parents don't propery punish me enough, so what should I do? :(:confused:

Masturbate. It'll keep you from doing anything else.

[The Tao's Revenge]

I feel that my parents don't propery punish me enough, so what should I do? :(:confused:

Your a kid, you're supposed to be making mistakes. Your also switching into being a teenager. A long time ago I was a kid much like you. I was raised around very conservative religious influences. When puberty hit I had some strange ideas. Beliefs that finding women were attractive were horrible evil sins. That I was weak.

I wasn't weak and neither are you. You're a teenage boy. Your brain is adapting to hormones your body is dumping in its self as it builds its up and you become a man. This is a natural part of growing up. Up until now all your experience has been that of being a boy, with narratives and stories with clear good and bad sides, with things clearly being one or the other. It isn't like that though, it never was, but now you're approaching a point in life where you can truly understand this.

You can't do anything about the hormones in your head. They exist because you're human. Whatever force created you, and every other human, put them there. Judging you for them would be like claiming being tall is a sin. It's just nature, neither good nor evil. What does matter is how you act on them.

[The Second Stone]

If you have done something wrong, correct it. If you've been rude, apologize and work hard not to do it again. You will, so like shampoo, rinse and repeat. That's life. You are human. You will make mistakes and frequently. Take your time, be gentle with others and gentle with yourself. Don't be in a rush when dealing with others. Social interactions are like a very well prepared meal, and should be savored slowly, even when you don't think you will like them. I think this is especially important with Asperger's. Social interaction is the spice of life. Take your time and observe it and people, including yourself. Being 15 isn't easy, but don't make it worse with overwhelming guilt. Repair damage and move on.

[sandra_nz]

Maybe your parents realise that you are growing up, and they want you to learn to regulate your own behaviour and correct your own wrongs.

[Autolycus]

Propounding punishment? Poppycock. Puberty presents pitfalls precipitating plethoric problems. Punishment, perhaps pleasing, perpetuates private pity. Propensity per private pleasure presents present poster problems? Pffft. Perish prevarication. Proceed propery.

[Crowbar of Irony +3]

Punishment is not the issue; moving on and devising plans for forgiveness (forgiving yourself too!), understanding your habits and reparations are more worthwhile than any harsh punishment.

That, and changing your behavior.

[Indygrrl]

Look, you seem to be self-aware enough to know that you do/have done things that you feel warrant punishment. Therefore, you should also be aware enough to stop doing the punishable offenses.
.
In other words, buck up and take responsibility for your own behavior. Don't wait for your parents to "punish" you to stop being a pain in the arse. Just be respectful towards your parents, and if you must misbehave.... stop getting caught!

[Maggie the Ocelot]

Honestly, this is the first time I have *ever* heard Korean-American parents described as "too lenient" by their child.

[Qin Shi Huangdi]

Your parents probably regard the behavioral issues you mention as being part of your Aspeberger's (or at least think it might be) and are uncomfortable about punishing it. The thing is, if you already know and understand that its inappropriate, then you don't need punishment, you just need to stop doing it. If you can't stop doing it, then punishment is even more pointless.

Do you find your parents emotionally responsive to you in general, or do you find them detached? It occurs to me that you might be subconsciously engaging in those behaviors specifically to try to provoke some kind of emotional response from them.



I think they're emotionally responsive when I do tell them about my problems.

[Fear Itself]

I feel that my parents don't propery punish me enough, so what should I do? :(:confused:What do you feel the punishment for presumptuous children should be?

[WhyNot]

I can't tell you why your parents don't punish you, I can only tell you why I don't punish my kids: it doesn't work.

For most people - children or adults or anywhere in between - a problem has to be worried about and solved by somebody. If I as a parent take on that responsibility for things my kid has done, then the kid no longer needs to worry about it. That means the kid won't learn anything about how to deal with it.

On the other hand, if I don't punish my child, that means he needs to figure out how to right the wrong he's done. He did it, he needs to worry about it, and he learns how to fix it. (If he asks, I'll give him ideas for how to fix it, but choosing which one and implementing it are still his job, not mine.) Does this cause anxiety? Absolutely. It's supposed to, as his desire to resolve that anxiety is a far better motivation to change than any pressure I could put on him.

Think of it this way. If you do something wrong and your parents punish you, then what? You're done, that's what. The thing you did wrong is in the past and it's done, and the punishment is served and so it's all over. And what did you learn? Unless you're 2 years old, not much. You may have learned that if you repeat that action, you'll get punished, but you haven't learned how not to repeat that option or what you should do instead.

If you do something wrong and your parents don't punish you, but expect you to fix it, then you learn how to fix it. While you're anxiously stewing over it, you may think of a lot of "I should have done X,Y or Z" instead. Now you know how not to do it again, and what to do instead next time.

It's the difference between the kind of discipline a drill sergeant does to his trainees, and the discipline Jesus had for his disciples. Jesus didn't punish, Jesus taught. Jesus offered insight, and ideas for how to be a better person, but he didn't send Judas to his room without any supper, even though he knew Judas was about to do something very bad to him. He lovingly but sadly allowed Judas to betray him, because if he had done anything else, Judas would not have learned his own lesson and regretted his betrayal in the end.

So, let me ask you: what could you do differently next time? What purpose does smacking your parents serve you? Is it to get their attention? To let them know you're frustrated? Is it because you want them to know you love them? Figure out the purpose, and then you can think of other ways to get that need met. If it's to get their attention, maybe you could call their names or actually say, "I need you to listen to me." If it's because you're frustrated, maybe you could say, "This is very frustrating," or you could count to 50 silently in your head while taking deep breaths. If it's to let them know you love them, maybe you could give them a hug, instead, or write them a letter. See - I don't know what motivates you slapping them, so I can't solve your problem for you. If I - or they - punished you, you wouldn't have to look inside your heart and figure out why you're doing it and what would work better.

[China Guy]

I hope this isn't too personal but are you in an Aspergers support group? Are your parents?

I only ask that because my youngest twin is on the autism spectrum and it's pretty obvious her brain and thought process is not the same as a neurotypical 6 year old. figuring out the way she's wired is part of the process in helping her. For example, punishment is about 99% ineffective in her case.

A support group may help show where you're like others and where your thought process is different, and understanding that is pretty useful for anyone (even for neurotypicals).

[AClockworkMelon]

nm

[Qin Shi Huangdi]

I can't tell you why your parents don't punish you, I can only tell you why I don't punish my kids: it doesn't work.

For most people - children or adults or anywhere in between - a problem has to be worried about and solved by somebody. If I as a parent take on that responsibility for things my kid has done, then the kid no longer needs to worry about it. That means the kid won't learn anything about how to deal with it.

On the other hand, if I don't punish my child, that means he needs to figure out how to right the wrong he's done. He did it, he needs to worry about it, and he learns how to fix it. (If he asks, I'll give him ideas for how to fix it, but choosing which one and implementing it are still his job, not mine.) Does this cause anxiety? Absolutely. It's supposed to, as his desire to resolve that anxiety is a far better motivation to change than any pressure I could put on him.

Think of it this way. If you do something wrong and your parents punish you, then what? You're done, that's what. The thing you did wrong is in the past and it's done, and the punishment is served and so it's all over. And what did you learn? Unless you're 2 years old, not much. You may have learned that if you repeat that action, you'll get punished, but you haven't learned how not to repeat that option or what you should do instead.

If you do something wrong and your parents don't punish you, but expect you to fix it, then you learn how to fix it. While you're anxiously stewing over it, you may think of a lot of "I should have done X,Y or Z" instead. Now you know how not to do it again, and what to do instead next time.

It's the difference between the kind of discipline a drill sergeant does to his trainees, and the discipline Jesus had for his disciples. Jesus didn't punish, Jesus taught. Jesus offered insight, and ideas for how to be a better person, but he didn't send Judas to his room without any supper, even though he knew Judas was about to do something very bad to him. He lovingly but sadly allowed Judas to betray him, because if he had done anything else, Judas would not have learned his own lesson and regretted his betrayal in the end.

So, let me ask you: what could you do differently next time? What purpose does smacking your parents serve you? Is it to get their attention? To let them know you're frustrated? Is it because you want them to know you love them? Figure out the purpose, and then you can think of other ways to get that need met. If it's to get their attention, maybe you could call their names or actually say, "I need you to listen to me." If it's because you're frustrated, maybe you could say, "This is very frustrating," or you could count to 50 silently in your head while taking deep breaths. If it's to let them know you love them, maybe you could give them a hug, instead, or write them a letter. See - I don't know what motivates you slapping them, so I can't solve your problem for you. If I - or they - punished you, you wouldn't have to look inside your heart and figure out why you're doing it and what would work better.

I think the slapping (more like light taps) is almost an instinctive reaction when my parents do the same to me. So I suppose I can learn something called patience and respect for parents.

I hope this isn't too personal but are you in an Aspergers support group? Are your parents?

I only ask that because my youngest twin is on the autism spectrum and it's pretty obvious her brain and thought process is not the same as a neurotypical 6 year old. figuring out the way she's wired is part of the process in helping her. For example, punishment is about 99% ineffective in her case.

A support group may help show where you're like others and where your thought process is different, and understanding that is pretty useful for anyone (even for neurotypicals).

I'm not in a support group because my case isn't severe and I do understand when say my parents verbally rebuke me or so on.

[flatlined]

In my opinion, you should consdier yourself lucky that they even know that you are around. My parents didn't notice when I was gone for days at a time, they just yelled at me when they saw me because I hadn't done the chores.

You need to learn to be self correcting. You know what you shoud be doing, you know how to clean your room and how to study, all that stuff.

You are a strong person, you can deal with this without someone telling you what to do.

[Lynn Bodoni]

If you think you know how to properly punish a teenager, then wait until you've got teenagers of your own and implement your plan. My daughter will be 32 in June. When she was a teen, I usually revoked privileges if I felt she needed to be punished. For instance, she got grounded from watching TV, or she got her bedroom door removed. For extreme misbehavior, I would show up at her high school and hug and kiss her in front of EVERYONE.

[Hennessy]

Two options:

Option 1: Create punishment

What you do is create your own punishment, you don't want to grow up always getting what you want... Your already see yourself as being punished for not being punished...

Option 2: Accept no punishment

If you are questioning whether you need punishment or not, you must feel you do, therefore you have nothing to worry about. Live your life with what makes you happy and don't let no one bring you down, even if they say punishment provides discipline and discipline brings reality or happiness or whatever...

Listen to your heart buddy ol' pal ol' boy.....

Create your own punishment or accept no punishment... Simple, what does punishment mean to you?

[Manda JO]

I think you are looking for a way to "pay" for doing bad things, so that you can keep doing bad things. This is a very dangerous habit. It's the main danger of "punishment" in general, to tell you the truth: if you take away the TV for a weekend when a kid breaks curfew, they don't learn not to break curfew, they learn to only break curfew when it's worth giving up TV for a weekend. It sends the message that wrong actions can be fixed by an equal amount of suffering, like a karmic cash-register.

I kind of wish life worked that way. I wish I could eat a huge slice of cake, and then smack myself across the knuckles until the calories didn't count: I wish I could drink a margarita and then make a big tearful confession and apology to my ob/gyn, have her yell at me and make me feel worse, and then the alcohol wouldn't affect my baby. But life isn't like that. Punishment may pay for sins, but it doesn't fix them, it doesn't make them go away.

I think that when you do something you regret, you want a way to make it not have happened, and in your mind a severe enough punishment will do that. But it won't. It will still have happened, and if you aren't careful that will lead to a cycle of looking for more and more severe punishments in hope that if you suffer enough, you can fix the past. IME, OCD, bulimia, and cutting can all be forms of this kind of thinking.

[LouisB]

You are way too hard on yourself; if your parents don't "punish" you it's probably because, in their judgment you don't need to be punished. If you insist that you need and deserve punishment, you might give some thought to self flagellation.

[Wesley Clark]

dear penthouse

[Wesley Clark]

I'm confused, I thought you (Qin) were a college student living at home. Are you looking to be punished for things you did years ago? Why would it matter now?

If you want to be punished, I'd look at whether you have some self hate issues, and work on self forgiveness first.

[Diogenes the Cynic]

I'm confused, I thought you (Qin) were a college student living at home.
He's 15.

[Qin Shi Huangdi]

He's 15.

Fourteen,

[Vinyl Turnip]

What do you feel the punishment for presumptuous children should be?

Adolescent paleoconservatism and self-loathing exacerbated by an anachronistic Victorian sense of sexual shame.

[pancakes3]

guilt is a punishment. also, maggie, some korean families hold the sons up on a pedestal and don't discipline them at all. in fact, quite the opposite. a lot of korean males i know are as spoiled as any JAP (jewish american princess).

[Alan Smithee]

You know, while I think Qin is way off base with his ideas about sexual morality, he might not be off base on the rest. I had parents who were too lax, and I often asked my mother to be stricter, but she wasn't able. I think it hurt me in two ways.

Firstly, telling Qin that if he can recognize his bad behavior he can change it isn't necessarily true. Behaviors are habits, and can be very difficult to change through a simple act of will, as anyone who's tried to lose weight or quit biting their nails can attest. Behaviors change best through classical conditioning, and most of the tools adults use to make lasting changes in their own habits are, in fact, ways of conditioning themselves by setting up their own punishments and rewards. But conditioning works best when the punishments and rewards come from the outside, and we typically agree that providing them is part of what parents are expected to do. I developed a lot of bad habits that I still struggle with because my parents never did this, and as a teenager I lacked the either will-power or the control over my environment that would allow me to discipline myself effectively. (To give a simplistic example, if my parents wanted to buy me ice cream when I failed to finish a school report, I couldn't necessarily say no, and if they didn't want to take me to get ice cream when I finished my report, I couldn't use ice cream to reward myself either.)

Secondly, punishment serves to communicate a parent's values and concerns and the fact that the parent cares about the child. I was deeply hurt by the fact that my mother was unwilling to punish me, even when I was clear-minded enough to ask for it explicitly. I would therefore challenge her and act out in a sometimes deliberate and sometimes subconscious effort to force her to show her concern for me. I grew up feeling like nothing I did really mattered and that I ultimately had little control over my life or my actions (because if I did have the ability to control my actions, my parents would surely have expected more from me). Again, these are things that still affect me as an adult in my thirties. I can (and have) learned to deal with these emotional issues as an adult, but it was a lot harder as a teenager.

I can easily imagine that a lot of Qin's issues with sexual and religious morality and his desire for strong moral absolutes in religion and politics are a way for him to deal with a lack of moral guidelines enforced by his parents. If his parents cared enough to punish him for hitting, but didn't punish him for looking at girls, that would give him clear signals about what kind of values they want him to have. If they don't punish him for anything, he has to look elsewhere for signals that delineate right from wrong, and as a teenager, he'll naturally be drawn to simple, absolute rules that can be easily internalized: typically either extreme rigidity or extreme libertinism.

[Dr. Crap]

Flagellate yourself in the nude.

[BigT]

You know, while I think Qin is way off base with his ideas about sexual morality, he might not be off base on the rest. I had parents who were too lax, and I often asked my mother to be stricter, but she wasn't able. I think it hurt me in two ways.

Firstly, telling Qin that if he can recognize his bad behavior he can change it isn't necessarily true. Behaviors are habits, and can be very difficult to change through a simple act of will, as anyone who's tried to lose weight or quit biting their nails can attest. Behaviors change best through classical conditioning, and most of the tools adults use to make lasting changes in their own habits are, in fact, ways of conditioning themselves by setting up their own punishments and rewards. But conditioning works best when the punishments and rewards come from the outside, and we typically agree that providing them is part of what parents are expected to do. I developed a lot of bad habits that I still struggle with because my parents never did this, and as a teenager I lacked the either will-power or the control over my environment that would allow me to discipline myself effectively. (To give a simplistic example, if my parents wanted to buy me ice cream when I failed to finish a school report, I couldn't necessarily say no, and if they didn't want to take me to get ice cream when I finished my report, I couldn't use ice cream to reward myself either.)

Secondly, punishment serves to communicate a parent's values and concerns and the fact that the parent cares about the child. I was deeply hurt by the fact that my mother was unwilling to punish me, even when I was clear-minded enough to ask for it explicitly. I would therefore challenge her and act out in a sometimes deliberate and sometimes subconscious effort to force her to show her concern for me. I grew up feeling like nothing I did really mattered and that I ultimately had little control over my life or my actions (because if I did have the ability to control my actions, my parents would surely have expected more from me). Again, these are things that still affect me as an adult in my thirties. I can (and have) learned to deal with these emotional issues as an adult, but it was a lot harder as a teenager.

I can easily imagine that a lot of Qin's issues with sexual and religious morality and his desire for strong moral absolutes in religion and politics are a way for him to deal with a lack of moral guidelines enforced by his parents. If his parents cared enough to punish him for hitting, but didn't punish him for looking at girls, that would give him clear signals about what kind of values they want him to have. If they don't punish him for anything, he has to look elsewhere for signals that delineate right from wrong, and as a teenager, he'll naturally be drawn to simple, absolute rules that can be easily internalized: typically either extreme rigidity or extreme libertinism.

Perhaps, but I didn't think he was saying that his parents don't punish him at all. Just that he thinks he does a lot of things that deserve punishment, but he doesn't get it.

I agree with Dio, actually. His parents are reluctant to punish him for things they think he can't help. I think they are showing their values: only deliberate wrongs need to be punished.

I know that, when I was around his age, I thought my parents were handling things 100% incorrectly. I even stumbled upon my mom's old stash of parenting books, and would count the ways mom deviated from them. I knew everything, my parents nothing. And books were always worth more than experience. (I still find that last one hard to fight sometimes.)

[elbows]

"It's hip to miserable when you're young and intellectual..."

...sorry, I just can't help hearing this song as the score to this thread.

[Alan Smithee]

Perhaps, but I didn't think he was saying that his parents don't punish him at all. Just that he thinks he does a lot of things that deserve punishment, but he doesn't get it.

I agree with Dio, actually. His parents are reluctant to punish him for things they think he can't help. I think they are showing their values: only deliberate wrongs need to be punished.Then they are wrong. Qin obviously feels like he has some control over his actions. When he talks about hitting and cursing at people, he isn't talking about muscle spasms or tics from Tourette's syndrome. He's talking about behaviors he started because he didn't understand they were wrong and that he apparently has trouble stopping. That's just the sort of thing conditioning works wonderfully on, if it is applied properly.

I'm no expert on autism or Asperger's, but it seems to me that giving him the message that these are just things he can't help and shouldn't be expected to control is exactly the wrong thing to do. That doesn't mean he should be made to feel guilty for having inappropriate urges or for not controlling himself perfectly. Punishment doesn't have to be accompanied by anger or shame, either. Particularly with someone like Qin who wants to change his behavior and has the maturity to recognize that he needs discipline, it could be done cooperatively and supportively, by reminding him to take a time out, for example, when he acts out. But the parents should be willing to enforce appropriate and agreed-upon punishment even when it isn't wanted in the moment. That's the whole point of having parents, not just friends who raised you.

[Spectre of Pithecanthropus]

...are as spoiled as any JAP (jewish american princess).

Please refrain from ethnic-oriented epithets. I realize that this is something of a borderline case, because it isn't purely about an ethnic or religious group as such, but rather about a particular cultural subset of that group. Still, it can be inflammatory and is rather gratuitous, so please keep that in mind.

No warning issued.

[Kaio]

If the point of the punishment is to correct behavior, then grow up and fix the behavior yourself.

Beat me to it. If you believe your behavior warrants punishment, then stop behaving that way. You can (and should) moderate yourself.

[athelas]

Like quitting smoking, many people can't just up and change their own behavior - not without superhuman willpower that leaves them in no shape for anything else. Qin is at least self-aware enough to correctly note some things that he can improve about himself - which is pretty mature for a 14-year-old and above the ability of many adults.

I would suggest directly talking to your parents - "I have decided that I need to change my behavior X, and I would like you to help me hold myself accountable to improving." That should get their attention - and if they used to be reluctant to punish behavior they saw as outside your own control, the framing (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Framing_%28social_sciences%29) that you're asking for feedback from them as a favor could make punishment more palatable to them. (Also, you may get surprising feedback about what behaviors you consider problematic that they consider normal, or vice versa.)

If that fails, you'll need to set up some system to self-reinforce, but that's a much harder challenge than having someone else to hold you accountable - the temptation to cheat is much higher. But I'd go ahead and talk to your parents directly first. If you drop indirect hints, they're much less likely to understand the place you're coming from.

[Kaio]

Like quitting smoking, many people can't just up and change their own behavior - not without superhuman willpower that leaves them in no shape for anything else.

Your last two paragraphs contradict this. Of course he's capable of changing his own behavior, as the two methods you suggested are systems for doing that. I never said he had to choose any particular method over another, but that he's capable of making the changes necessary to improve his behavior. In fact, he's the only one who can change his behavior. If that means asking for help, creating an external structure, or what-have-you, who cares -- he's still accountable for changing his own behavior, and it won't happen if he doesn't do something about it himself.

All the punishment in the world won't do a thing for someone who's unwilling take responsibility for his own behavior and change. Conversely, if he is willing, there's a whole slew of things he can do about it. Punishment becomes unnecessary.

[Alan Smithee]

All the punishment in the world won't do a thing for someone who's unwilling take responsibility for his own behavior and change. Conversely, if he is willing, there's a whole slew of things he can do about it. Punishment becomes unnecessary.
Unnecessary, perhaps, but not unhelpful, especially for a child, which Qin still is (barely, but a child nonetheless).

[Angel of the Lord]

Qin, I know you mentioned to Guin that you've talked to your parents. How did you frame it? Did you ask to be punished more, or did you mention specific behaviors that you wanted them to react to?

If you haven't done the latter, you might want to; you could even avoid the word "punish", if you want; you could simply ask them to call you on the behavior when you perform it. Frame it as being something that you personally want to work on. They might be more amenable to helping if your request doesn't come across as a criticism of their parenting.

That being said, if you do, and you still don't, then maybe they don't perceive the action as being as out of line as you do. From what you described, that seems unlikely, but anything's possible. If the "handing" is something they do, they might not see it as bad, regardless of what your intent is when you do it. If that's the case, then it's up to you to exercise self-discipline and try to change your own behavior. That's hard at any age, let alone as a teenager, but it might be your only option.

[Qin Shi Huangdi]

Qin, I know you mentioned to Guin that you've talked to your parents. How did you frame it? Did you ask to be punished more, or did you mention specific behaviors that you wanted them to react to?

If you haven't done the latter, you might want to; you could even avoid the word "punish", if you want; you could simply ask them to call you on the behavior when you perform it. Frame it as being something that you personally want to work on. They might be more amenable to helping if your request doesn't come across as a criticism of their parenting.

That being said, if you do, and you still don't, then maybe they don't perceive the action as being as out of line as you do. From what you described, that seems unlikely, but anything's possible. If the "handing" is something they do, they might not see it as bad, regardless of what your intent is when you do it. If that's the case, then it's up to you to exercise self-discipline and try to change your own behavior. That's hard at any age, let alone as a teenager, but it might be your only option.

Well it was the latter, I don't think I've ever directly told my parents to punish me more.

[Alan Smithee]

What did they say? Do they think you your behaviors don't deserve punishment, that you can't control them, that they punish you for them already, or are they unwilling or unable to mete out punishment?

[China Guy]

Qin, maybe you're overthinking and your parents do have a good handle on things. Or at least doing the best they can. I mean, you do have a lot going on what with Aspergers, puberty, raging hormones, a fundamentalist Christian upbringing and possibly community, not sure if you're in a public high school or other education situation, how involved your parents are, etc. Just being 14 is nearly overwhelming for a lot of 14 year olds, and you have more than "just" that on your plate.

One observation is that you are often quite literal. Someone asks a question and you you give a succinct answer but devoid of backfill that might add some context.

[Guinastasia]

One observation is that you are often quite literal. Someone asks a question and you you give a succinct answer but devoid of backfill that might add some context.

Isn't that a common trait of Aspergers?

[Qin Shi Huangdi]

What did they say? Do they think you your behaviors don't deserve punishment, that you can't control them, that they punish you for them already, or are they unwilling or unable to mete out punishment?

I think they basically didn't want me to dwell on it and simply not do it on the future.

Qin, maybe you're overthinking and your parents do have a good handle on things. Or at least doing the best they can. I mean, you do have a lot going on what with Aspergers, puberty, raging hormones, a fundamentalist Christian upbringing and possibly community, not sure if you're in a public high school or other education situation, how involved your parents are, etc. Just being 14 is nearly overwhelming for a lot of 14 year olds, and you have more than "just" that on your plate.

One observation is that you are often quite literal. Someone asks a question and you you give a succinct answer but devoid of backfill that might add some context.

I do go to a public high school BTW.

But as for being literal, I don't thing its really an Aspergers related problems-I get idioms and jokes for instance. I just prefer simple and blunt answers.

[Alan Smithee]

So why do you want them to punish you? Is it like I speculated, that you want to change your behavior but need help? You feel like they don't care? You feel guilty and want to "pay"? You think they have a moral/religious duty to punish you and they are too lax? What are your reasons?

And whatever they are, did you explain them to your parents? What did they say?

[Nancarrow]

I feel that my parents don't propery punish me enough, so what should I do? :(:confused:

Stop being so fucked up?

Slightly more serious answer: there are plenty of websites out there where you can find ladies who will punish you however you like for a modest fee. Ask your parents if you can borrow the money, and be sure to explain carefully what you need it for. And let me know how it went.

[WhyNot]

Unnecessary, perhaps, but not unhelpful, especially for a child, which Qin still is (barely, but a child nonetheless).

He's a child, sure, but I think once you're old enough to recognize and articulate the need for "punishment", you're a moral agent responsible for your own actions.

You have a very good point that we all benefit from accountability to others when we're trying to change our behavior, though.

[pinguin]

Get a mother-in-law!

[KellyCriterion]

My daughter will be 32 in June. When she was a teen, I usually revoked privileges
Yeah, my mum used this "tactic" on me as well.

I'm convinced it's the main reason I now, as an adult, don't ever show much interest/excitement/anticipation for anything, having decided that if I do, people can use it against me.

[Guinastasia]

I think they basically didn't want me to dwell on it and simply not do it on the future.



I do go to a public high school BTW.

But as for being literal, I don't thing its really an Aspergers related problems-I get idioms and jokes for instance. I just prefer simple and blunt answers.

True, but if someone asks you a question, they often need more than a "simple and blunt answer", you know? ;)

[Qin Shi Huangdi]

So why do you want them to punish you? Is it like I speculated, that you want to change your behavior but need help? You feel like they don't care? You feel guilty and want to "pay"? You think they have a moral/religious duty to punish you and they are too lax? What are your reasons?

And whatever they are, did you explain them to your parents? What did they say?

A mix of most of those reasons, I think.

As for your second question, I didn't ask them in the sense of "Please punish me."

True, but if someone asks you a question, they often need more than a "simple and blunt answer", you know? ;)

Yes, 'tis quite true,. :)