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pkbites
06-06-2011, 02:19 AM
Just saw the flick Drive Angry (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lshkRGT9uXA). Like almost all Nicholas Cage movies it had no artistic or socially redeeming qualities whatsoever, a weak plot, and was a hellovalot of fun. Fast cars, hot chicks, and lots & lots of guns and explosions! (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O2-hiHUh4UQ&NR=1&feature=fvwp) :cool:

At one point in the movie the "Accountant" refers to the devil as "Satan". Which brings me to my question:

Somewhere in the world there are people who actively worship "Satan". Why? If one believes that the devil of the bible exists, isn't this an admission that the god of that bible also exists? Therefore, wouldn't worshiping said devil be the most dangerous risk in the universe?

Also, would "Satan" actually want to be called "Satan"? Wouldn't he rather have his worshipers call him Lord, or at very least his original name of Lucifer?

Mosier
06-06-2011, 04:01 AM
Are you sure of your premise, that people actually worship the Satan described in Christian lore? The church of Satan certainly doesn't. It's a counter-Christian movement, sure, but they don't believe in Jesus or Satan as actual entities. They don't actually worship anything, as far as I know.

Alessan
06-06-2011, 04:05 AM
Somewhere in the world there are people who actively worship "Satan". Why? If one believes that the devil of the bible exists, isn't this an admission that the god of that bible also exists? Therefore, wouldn't worshiping said devil be the most dangerous risk in the universe?


I understand that some Satanists see the world as dualistic, with evil being equally as powerful as good. By that logic, worshipping Satan is no more risky that worshipping God.


Also, would "Satan" actually want to be called "Satan"? Wouldn't he rather have his worshipers call him Lord, or at very least his original name of Lucifer?


I suppose they think it's cool to say that they worship the Enemy (Satan in Hebrew) of God. Besides, it's not as if "God" is His real name, either.

Sage Rat
06-06-2011, 04:44 AM
The Church of Satan is basically comprised of two sets of people. The first group are bright but fairly narcissistic libertarian-sorts who feel that anyone stupid enough to think the whole Satan Worship thing is real deserve what they get, and so they sell merchandise, books, and ceremonial equipment to the second group. At a guess, the second group are probably mostly sycophants and while they probably don't reaaaally believe that they're studying magic, they think that they're supposed to keep the image alive and tell everyone that magic is real, etc.

None of them think that they're worshiping the Christian Satan. They will quite pointedly tell you that the name just happens to be the same, and nor are they lying.

blindboyard
06-06-2011, 04:57 AM
There are certain heretics, the name escapes me for the moment, who worship Lucifer due to thinking he created our spirits, while the Abrahamic god created the world, the physical world which they see as evil and burdensome upon our otherwise pure and free spirits. Therefore the god is evil and the devil good, to their way of thinking. Bogomiles, maybe?

Sage Rat
06-06-2011, 05:13 AM
Bogomiles, maybe?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bogomiles

No, they were anti-Satan. They just thought he had about equal power as God.

Der Trihs
06-06-2011, 05:15 AM
There are certain heretics, the name escapes me for the moment, who worship Lucifer due to thinking he created our spirits, while the Abrahamic god created the world, the physical world which they see as evil and burdensome upon our otherwise pure and free spirits. Therefore the god is evil and the devil good, to their way of thinking. Bogomiles, maybe?Sort of. Bogomilism (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bogomilism) was part of a larger movement called Gnosticism (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gnosticism) that often believed that the world was created by a lesser evil god, which they sometimes considered to be Satan. As Sage Rat says though, they didn't approve of him.

DrFidelius
06-06-2011, 07:39 AM
As Mark Twain said:
"I have no special regard for Satan; but I can at least claim that I have no prejudice against him. It may even be that I lean a little his way, on account of his not having a fair show. All religions issue bibles against him, and say the most injurious things about him, but we never hear his side. We have none but evidence for the prosecution and yet we have rendered the verdict. To my mind, this is irregular. It is un-English. It is un-American; it is French."

ITR champion
06-06-2011, 09:15 AM
Are you sure of your premise, that people actually worship the Satan described in Christian lore? The church of Satan certainly doesn't. It's a counter-Christian movement, sure, but they don't believe in Jesus or Satan as actual entities. They don't actually worship anything, as far as I know.
Satan worshippers are one of those groups who are far more numerous on television than in real life, just like "eco terrorists" and serial killers.

BrainGlutton
06-06-2011, 09:21 AM
. . . or at very least his original name of Lucifer?

"Lucifer" is not "his original name." (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lucifer)

Sitnam
06-06-2011, 09:49 AM
The Bible is gods book, his point of view. I'd like to hear the other side of the argument.

ETA: or what DrFidelius said....

Czarcasm
06-06-2011, 01:06 PM
This discussion reminds me of Harlan Ellison's Deathbird.

Mithrander
06-06-2011, 03:50 PM
Somewhere in the world there are people who actively worship "Satan". Why? If one believes that the devil of the bible exists, isn't this an admission that the god of that bible also exists? Therefore, wouldn't worshiping said devil be the most dangerous risk in the universe? You're looking at this from the wrong point of view. First, I can't speak for thiestic satanists. They seem to me like wiccans bad-ass brothers, and I have a hard time taking them seriously. (The theistic satanists, not the wiccans) The general gist I have gathered is that they don't believe that God is involved in this universe, while the devil is. Thus, serving the devil can have rewards in this world, instead of waiting on pipe dreams for the next one.

Any of the 'real' satanists I know (myself included) don't literally worship the christian character known as Satan. We are more athiest or agnostic than thiest. Our problem with north american culture is that it is dominated by judeo-christian thinking and moraility. Satanism is a complete rejection of that. It replaces the sheep/herd mentality that has been pounded into you by society since the day you were born with self-empowerment as the ultimate goal of life. Replace abstinance with indulgance, replace turning the other cheek with vengance. I've heard it called egotism with ritual, which is probably as good a description as any.

Lord Ashtar
06-06-2011, 03:54 PM
The Bible is gods book, his point of view. I'd like to hear the other side of the argument.

[Devil's Advocate]

Kevin Lomax: In the Bible you lose. We're destined to lose, dad!

John Milton: Well, consider the source, son!

[/DA]

Mr. Miskatonic
06-06-2011, 03:58 PM
I read a 19th century travelougue where the traveler was making his way through Turkey. He described some of the foothills people as being active Satan worshipers. The reasoning they used was that God (Allah) was a nice deity and wouldn't do anything to them, but the Devil was a meanie and would make their lives miserable so they effectively worshiped the Devil to keep him away.

Chronos
06-06-2011, 04:15 PM
Doubtless you could find a few people, scattered here and there, who actually do worship the Judeo-Christian Satan. Those people would all be crazy. As for why they do it, well, see the previous sentence.

BrainGlutton
06-06-2011, 04:49 PM
I read a 19th century travelougue where the traveler was making his way through Turkey. He described some of the foothills people as being active Satan worshipers. The reasoning they used was that God (Allah) was a nice deity and wouldn't do anything to them, but the Devil was a meanie and would make their lives miserable so they effectively worshiped the Devil to keep him away.

Sounds more like something the Muslim locals would have told him about a group of reputed "Satan worshipers" -- e.g., the Yazidis. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yezidi)

BrainGlutton
06-06-2011, 04:50 PM
Doubtless you could find a few people, scattered here and there, who actually do worship the Judeo-Christian Satan. Those people would all be crazy. As for why they do it, well, see the previous sentence.

Or, see The Devil's Disciple, (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Devil%27s_Disciple) by George Bernard Shaw.

Bosda Di'Chi of Tricor
06-06-2011, 05:19 PM
I read a 19th century travelougue where the traveler was making his way through Turkey. He described some of the foothills people as being active Satan worshipers. The reasoning they used was that God (Allah) was a nice deity and wouldn't do anything to them, but the Devil was a meanie and would make their lives miserable so they effectively worshiped the Devil to keep him away.
You refer to the worshipers of Maluk Tuus.

BrainGlutton
06-06-2011, 05:20 PM
You refer to the worshipers of Maluk Tuus.

a/k/a Yazidis.

Polycarp
06-06-2011, 05:23 PM
The Bible is gods book, his point of view. <snip>

You knew it was coming, didn't you?

Cite?

:D

Skald the Rhymer
06-06-2011, 05:24 PM
I suppose they think it's cool to say that they worship the Enemy (Satan in Hebrew) of God. Besides, it's not as if "God" is His real name, either.

Policy requires me to make a comment about Athena at this point. I have a headache, though, so it's just pro forma.

Bosda Di'Chi of Tricor
06-06-2011, 05:34 PM
You knew it was coming, didn't you?

Cite?

:D

<SLAPS Polycarp With Loaves & Fishes>

LonesomePolecat
06-06-2011, 10:38 PM
Cite?
I'm not sure what cite or cites are appropriate, or exactly what it is that you wish to be explained by a cite. I do think, however, that we can show that Yahweh of the Old Testament was certainly preceded by far more ancient gods, gods who were worshiped before the human race itself even existed, and it certainly seems that Yahweh made claims—or perhaps claims were made for him by the more zealous of his worshipers--which serious scholarship can easily show to be false. That Yahweh was himself not by any means the oldest of all the gods, and being known only to men was certainly not the creator of the cosmos we inhabit and contemplate with dull incomprehension and fearful wonder, is amply demonstrated by the Necronomicon of the mad Arab, Abdul al Hazrad. One quote in support of this proposition is as follows:

Nor is it to be thought...that man is either the oldest or the last of earth’s masters, or that the common bulk of life and substances walks alone. The Old Ones were, the Old Ones are, and the Old Ones shall be. Not in the spaces we know, but between them, They walk serene and primal, undimensioned and to us unseen. Yog-Sothoth knows the gate. Yog-Sothoth is the gate. Yog-Sothoth is the key and guardian of the gate. Past, present, future, all are one in Yog-Sothoth. He knows where the Old Ones broke through of old, and where They shall break through again. He knows where They have trod earth’s fields, and where They still tread them, and why no one can behold Them as They tread. By Their smell can men somtimes know them near, but of Their semblance can no man know, saving only in the features of those They have begotten on mankind; and of those are there many sorts, differing in likeness from man’s truest eidolon to that shape without sight or substance which is Them. They walk unseen and foul in lonely places where the Words have been spoken and the Rites howled through at their Seasons. The wind gibbers with Their voices, and the earth mutters with Their consciousness. They bend the forest and crush the city, yet may not forest or city behold the hand that smites. Kadath in the cold waste hath known Them, and what man knows Kadath? The ice desert of the South and the sunken isles of Ocean hold stones where Their seal is engraven, but who hath seen the deep frozen city or the sealed tower long garlanded with seaweed and barnacles? Great Cthulhu is Their cousin, yet can he spy Them only dimly. Iš! Shub-Niggurath! As a foulness shall ye know Them. Their hand is at your throats, yet ye see Them not; and Their habitation is even one with your guarded threshold. Yog-Sothoth is the key to the gate, whereby the spheres meet. Man rules now where They ruled once; They shall soon rule where man rules now. After summer is winter, and after winter summer. They wait patient and potent, for here shall They reign again.

As Yahweh is obviously a patron god only of human beings, it is clear that the Old Ones can cast aside Yahweh with as little effort as a man may kick a cat out of his way. That the Old Ones are ultimately the true masters of space and time lurking behind the very fabric of existence itself is demonstrated by yet another quote from the Necronomicon:

The nethermost caverns...are not for the fathoming of eyes that see; for their marvels are strange and terrific. Cursed the ground where dead thoughts live new and oddly bodied, and evil the mind that is held by no head. Wisely did Ibn Schacabao say, that happy is the tomb where no wizard hath lain, and happy the town at night whose wizards are all ashes. For it is of old rumour that the soul of the devil-bought hastes not from his charnel clay, but fats and instructs the very worm that gnaws; till out of corruption horrid life springs, and the dull scavengers of earth wax crafty to vex it and swell monstrous to plague it. Great holes secretly are digged where earth’s pores ought to suffice, and things have learnt to walk that ought to crawl.

Given that these passages from the most ancient sources, interpreted and quoted by the deranged al Hazrad in his master work of esotericism and occultism drawing upon sources that he did not dare even name, show that Yahweh, far from being the author of all existence, is at best a minor player, it necessarily leads us to the tragic and disturbing conclusion that the followers of his revelations and word are poor wretches deceived by a lowly and insignificant deity worthy only of contempt, and of all sentient beings in all time and space are the most to pitied.

Smapti
06-06-2011, 10:56 PM
According to this performance of a "Satanic mass" (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2rEOqCNgqEQ) performed by Coven (a '60s pop group best known for "One Tin Soldier"), the idea seems to be that Satan represents free will and personal choice as opposed to blind devotion to an arbitrary authority who says "Worship me or suffer". Whether this is a legitimate representation of what devil-worshippers believe, or whether Coven were legitimate Satanists at all, I don't know.

XXX19
06-06-2011, 11:11 PM
Speaking of 60s pop groups, the Stones were one that worshipped Satan and wrote SYMPATHY FOR THE DEVIL.

Jagger sings in the 3rd person pretending to be Lucifer who was there when Christ died.

They really believed in the devil, so did the Columbine shooters who went after Christians in the school.

Satanism and voodoims is dominant in New Orleans and many Christians including Frank Graham believed God brought Katrina along like he poured salt over Sodom and Gemorrah.

The occult is big world wide and the inverted star is one of their most powerful symbols.

Lucifer was created by God and was his most powerful angel, very handsome - not red with the horns you see pics of. Thats from middle age and mythology. Gabriel and Michael
were his other top angels. They've been fighting Satan ever since he revolted and fell.

He was very handsome and powerful and was the angel who found earth and God made him the guardian of it. That's how he knew where Adam and Eve were.

Lucifer thought since God expelled him from heaven after revolting vs him and thousands of angles, God would expell man to hell too but God loved man so much he gave him a second chance thru his son who died on the cross but just as Christ had to die and rise, so would man with believers rising.

Lucifer didn't count on that.

Believers believe that the Bible is God's word, his letter to the Christians and to the world to explain how it was created and how it will end.

BrainGlutton
06-06-2011, 11:16 PM
Speaking of 60s pop groups, the Stones were one that worshipped Satan and wrote SYMPATHY FOR THE DEVIL.

Jagger sings in the 3rd person pretending to be Lucifer who was there when Christ died.

They really believed in the devil . . .

No, they didn't.

XXX19
06-06-2011, 11:20 PM
Here's some lyrics to the song. Mick was asked to write the song. They believed in these words.

They even hired the Hells Angels in California as body guards and many got hurt. There was always sombody that got hurt at a Stones concert.


Please allow me to introduce myself
Im a man of wealth and taste
Ive been around for a long, long year
Stole many a mans soul and faith
And I was round when jesus christ
Had his moment of doubt and pain
Made damn sure that pilate
Washed his hands and sealed his fate
Pleased to meet you
Hope you guess my name
But what's puzzling you
Is the nature of my game

BrainGlutton
06-06-2011, 11:28 PM
Here's some lyrics to the song. Mick was asked to write the song. They believed in these words.

No more than Ozzy Osbourne believes he's a werewolf.

XXX19
06-06-2011, 11:29 PM
Everyone's favorite of the 70s, The Eagles, also wrote songs
about Satan.

Hotel California is hell.

Note last line - everyone checks out but nobody leaves.

http://www.azlyrics.com/lyrics/eagles/hotelcalifornia.html

BrainGlutton
06-06-2011, 11:33 PM
Everyone's favorite of the 70s, The Eagles, also wrote songs
about Satan.

Writing a song about Satan does not make you a Satanist.

You do understand that, don't you?

XXX19
06-06-2011, 11:38 PM
Here's Keith Richards saying he is close to Satan and has even seen him several times.
Now you can stay in self denial all you want.

_______________________________

Keith Richards (2002): "Sympathy is quite an uplifting song. It's just a matter of looking the Devil in the face. He's there all the time. I've had very close contact with Lucifer - I've met him several times. Evil - people tend to bury it and hope it sorts itself out and doesn't rear its ugly head. Sympathy for the Devil is just as appropriate now, with 9/11. There it is again, big time. When that song was written, it was a time of turmoil. It was the first sort of international chaos since World War II. And confusion is not the ally of peace and love. You want to think the world is perfect. Everybody gets sucked into that. And as America has found out to its dismay, you can't hide. You might as well accept the fact that evil is there and deal with it any way you can. Sympathy for the Devil is a song that says, Don't forget him. If you confront him, then he's out of a job." (thanks, Bertrand - Paris, France, for above 2)

BrainGlutton
06-06-2011, 11:45 PM
Here's Keith Richards saying he is close to Satan and has even seen him several times.
Now you can stay in self denial all you want.

_______________________________

Keith Richards (2002): "Sympathy is quite an uplifting song. It's just a matter of looking the Devil in the face. He's there all the time. I've had very close contact with Lucifer - I've met him several times. Evil - people tend to bury it and hope it sorts itself out and doesn't rear its ugly head. Sympathy for the Devil is just as appropriate now, with 9/11. There it is again, big time. When that song was written, it was a time of turmoil. It was the first sort of international chaos since World War II. And confusion is not the ally of peace and love. You want to think the world is perfect. Everybody gets sucked into that. And as America has found out to its dismay, you can't hide. You might as well accept the fact that evil is there and deal with it any way you can. Sympathy for the Devil is a song that says, Don't forget him. If you confront him, then he's out of a job." (thanks, Bertrand - Paris, France, for above 2)

:rolleyes: Do you understand the concept of a metaphor?

XXX19
06-06-2011, 11:46 PM
Bob Dylan, Madonna and Jay Z in the occult?

http://www.henrymakow.com/does_bob_dylan_worship_satan_1.html

BrainGlutton
06-06-2011, 11:47 PM
Bob Dylan, Madonna and Jay Z in the occult?

On the whole, I should think not. (Kabballah don't count.)

Furthermore, you should also understand that a great many people are "in the occult" but are not Satanists by any definition but Jack Chick's.

XXX19
06-06-2011, 11:50 PM
I said someone asked Mick to write the song.
It was the founder of the Church of Satan and
who wrote the Satanic Bible. Jagger glady accepted the request.

SYMPATHY FOR THE DEVIL is the anthem of the Satanic Church. See original pic of the album. Also see their symbols such as the inverted star I mentioned above.

Their other song, Satanic Magities Request leaves no doubt as to their allegiance.

Chilling stuff.

http://www.jesus-is-savior.com/Evils%20in%20America/Rock-n-Roll/rolling_stones.htm

BrainGlutton
06-06-2011, 11:54 PM
I said someone asked Mick to write the song.
It was the founder of the Church of Satan and
who wrote the Satanic Bible. Jagger glady accepted the request.

Anton Szandor LaVey (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anton_Szandor_LaVey) asked Jagger to write "SFTD"? That would be a fascinating (and spiritually irrelevant) bit of musical history if true; but around here, you have to bring a more credible cite than . . . any you have brought so far in this thread.

Gilles de Rais
06-06-2011, 11:54 PM
The occult is big world wide and the inverted star is one of their most powerful symbols.


The occult is big world wide but only Satanists use the inverted pentagram as their symbol.

Other occult groups use other symbols - a slew of them found here. (http://symboldictionary.net/?page_id=1603)

Many of us within the occult care little for self-styled satanists as it is a philosophy oft-generated from Christianity, which we have little regard for.

BrainGlutton
06-06-2011, 11:55 PM
The occult is big world wide but only Satanists use the inverted pentagram as their symbol.

Wiccans use the pentagram -- might be point-up or point-down depending on the season.

Sitnam
06-06-2011, 11:57 PM
nm

XXX19
06-06-2011, 11:58 PM
Here are some specific Bible verses on Lucifer. Like I mentioned above, he was in Eden, Genesis said it was on the 6th day.

Like man, Lucifer and the angels were created perfect but God gave them a free will and they, like man, rebelled but God loved man so much he gave him a second chance.

When these performers write these songs praising Satan, they are glorifying him
whether they believe in him or not. They are committing blasphemy, the only
unforgiveable sin and they will join their idol in hell and he can't wait to meet them.

Christians glorify or try to glorify God, not Satan. Sometimes they fail but often they succeed.


http://www.angelfire.com/mi/dinosaurs/lucifer.html

Czarcasm
06-07-2011, 12:06 AM
I do think, however, that we can show that Yahweh of the Old Testament was certainly preceded by far more ancient gods, gods who were worshiped before the human race itself even existed..No.
No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no.

I will be billing you for the whiplash collar.

Gilles de Rais
06-07-2011, 12:10 AM
Wiccans use the pentagram -- might be point-up or point-down depending on the season.

Wiccans NEVER wear the pentagram with the point down.

30+ years in "the community" and "the season" has nothing to do with it.

BrainGlutton
06-07-2011, 12:22 AM
They are committing blasphemy . . .

I don't think it ought to be blasphemy, just saying "Jehovah" . . .

rat avatar
06-07-2011, 12:35 AM
Not being a theist I must let you guys in on a secret.

Some times we get tired of being told that we are evil, are going to the hell and that we worship the "devil".

Remember your religions primary method of keeping you from questioning your faith is to warn of a great evil that works how??....by making you question your faith, so often these "devil worshiper" claims are your creations, we just go with them or you don't listen to us explain that if you don't believe in gods you don't pray to any god.

From what I understand "satan" is a hebrew word that is basically the noun form of oppose. Some times when those who have tried to convert me get a little frustrated and ask me if I am a follower of satan or straight out state that I am.

Having read the story of Job being tested, I must say I find that character much less repugnant than Yahweh.

XXX19
06-07-2011, 12:28 PM
Blasphemy is taking credit from God and giving it to Satan which is what these performers
have done. That is why it is unforgiveable.

Job is one of the greatest stories ever written. The point is we all will be tried and tested
because of our sin but we will prevail in he end like Job. He lost everything but it was
all returned because he kept his faith never doubting God. He might have had questions
but he never doubted God.


Job is often where Christians turn to in difficult times and sustains them.

God made a deal with Satan that he could test Job, take his health, his family anythign but
no him and he didn't.

But Satan sure tried.

I've proved without a doubt with direct quotes from performers themselves that these performers were/are satanists, just like some
people in here.

BrainGlutton
06-07-2011, 12:36 PM
Job is one of the greatest stories ever written. The point is we all will be tried and tested because of our sin . . .

:rolleyes: Read the story again.

BrainGlutton
06-07-2011, 12:37 PM
When these performers write these songs praising Satan, they are glorifying him whether they believe in him or not. They are committing blasphemy, the only unforgiveable sin and they will join their idol in hell and he can't wait to meet them.

Wherever they're headed, it's better than anywhere Jesus can take you.

The_Peyote_Coyote
06-07-2011, 01:07 PM
XXX19: The Stones didn't hire the Hell's Angels; the Grateful Dead's road manager (Rock Scully, I think) did.

kanicbird
06-07-2011, 01:09 PM
Somewhere in the world there are people who actively worship "Satan". Why? If one believes that the devil of the bible exists, isn't this an admission that the god of that bible also exists? Therefore, wouldn't worshiping said devil be the most dangerous risk in the universe?

Also, would "Satan" actually want to be called "Satan"? Wouldn't he rather have his worshipers call him Lord, or at very least his original name of Lucifer?

2 reasons come to mind. One is it seems a lot cooler and a quicker way to get to the supernatural then through Christianity. There is summoning demons, witchcraft, voodoo and those things seem to be impressive.

And

Satan has a lot of sway of how God is defined to people who don't know God. The God as described by the world, including many christian sects say that God destroyed Sodom for it's sin. Therefor they believe god= bad, so satan = good. Those who know God know that Satan had a contract to destroy the city, but God rescued the people through Lot's wife, who was made into a pillar in God's temple and salt of the earth for looking back in compassion on the city's people.

rat avatar
06-07-2011, 01:13 PM
Blasphemy is taking credit from God and giving it to Satan which is what these performers
have done. That is why it is unforgiveable.

Job is one of the greatest stories ever written. The point is we all will be tried and tested
because of our sin but we will prevail in he end like Job. He lost everything but it was
all returned because he kept his faith never doubting God. He might have had questions
but he never doubted God.


Job is often where Christians turn to in difficult times and sustains them.

God made a deal with Satan that he could test Job, take his health, his family anythign but
no him and he didn't.

But Satan sure tried.

I've proved without a doubt with direct quotes from performers themselves that these performers were/are satanists, just like some
people in here.


I have read several Christmas stories to my niece and nephew, this does not imply that I am either a christian and/or a santaist.

Czarcasm
06-07-2011, 01:19 PM
Those who know God know that Satan had a contract to destroy the city, but God rescued the people through Lot's wife, who was made into a pillar in God's temple and salt of the earth for looking back in compassion on the city's people.Cite? Was this whispered to you and/or mystically implanted into your brain, or did you read it somewhere?

kayaker
06-07-2011, 01:19 PM
You're looking at this from the wrong point of view. First, I can't speak for thiestic satanists. They seem to me like wiccans bad-ass brothers, and I have a hard time taking them seriously. (The theistic satanists, not the wiccans) The general gist I have gathered is that they don't believe that God is involved in this universe, while the devil is. Thus, serving the devil can have rewards in this world, instead of waiting on pipe dreams for the next one.

Any of the 'real' satanists I know (myself included) don't literally worship the christian character known as Satan. We are more athiest or agnostic than thiest. Our problem with north american culture is that it is dominated by judeo-christian thinking and moraility. Satanism is a complete rejection of that. It replaces the sheep/herd mentality that has been pounded into you by society since the day you were born with self-empowerment as the ultimate goal of life. Replace abstinance with indulgance, replace turning the other cheek with vengance. I've heard it called egotism with ritual, which is probably as good a description as any.


Having read some of Anton Levay's writing, I think you have answered the OP here.

BrainGlutton
06-07-2011, 01:55 PM
Cite? Was this whispered to you and/or mystically implanted into your brain, or did you read it somewhere?

Anyone who knows kanicbird knows that "those who know God" does not necessarily mean those who know Scripture.

kanicbird
06-07-2011, 02:32 PM
Blasphemy is taking credit from God and giving it to Satan which is what these performers
have done. That is why it is unforgiveable.

This describes the counterfeit miracles described in the NT, not sure I would say it is the unpardonable sin.

kanicbird
06-07-2011, 02:44 PM
Cite? Was this whispered to you and/or mystically implanted into your brain, or did you read it somewhere?

Usually a waste of time with you, hope you prove me wrong:

We know (I Hope) that the Lord tried to get Abraham to save S&G, but Satan was able to stop Abraham at 10 righteous people. If Abraham's faith was stronger he would realize that he was speaking to his daddy and could have easily said 1 righteous person, or if there is none send me, and the city would have been saved. You can see the timidness of Abraham as he made the request to God.

On to Lot's wife:

Luke 17:32 Remember Lot’s wife! 33 Whoever tries to keep their life will lose it, and whoever loses their life will preserve it.


Lot's wife did indeed risk her life disobeying a direct order from the angels.

But there is much more to this.

But Lot’s wife looked back, and she became a pillar of salt.

In the OT when the Lord kills someone the Lord does not make them a piller, nor salt. They normally fall, or are swallowed up by the ground. The go down. But a pillar goes up.

The Lord used a pillar of fire to guide the Israelites through the desert, it was a beacon and those who followed were protected and delivered from Pharaoh's army.

Simularally in the NT, Jesus said to His people I will make you a pillar in my temple.

Pillars are a good thing.

Salt, Jesus said of His people you are the salt of the earth and the light of the world.

Lot's wife looked back in compassion, and was used by God to save the people of Sodom.

---

Lot who followed the instructions of the angels ended up living in a cave impregnating his 2 daughters forming 2 evil tribes. So Lot was not on the Lord's path, and shouldn't have listened to the angel in regards to looking back.

---

God judges the heart, and if your heart is right there is no sin in any action in His eyes. Lot's wife acted with Love and God used her.

XXX19
06-07-2011, 09:57 PM
I have read several Christmas stories to my niece and nephew, this does not imply that I am either a christian and/or a santaist.


But you are if you say you met satan and have seen him
several times like Keith Richards said. See quote above.

Czarcasm
06-07-2011, 10:03 PM
Usually a waste of time with you, hope you prove me wrong:

We know (I Hope) that the Lord tried to get Abraham to save S&G, but Satan was able to stop Abraham at 10 righteous people.Since the first sentence was so ridiculously bass ackwards to the nth degree, I decided to take a break and have a nice cold Johnny Appleseed(appletini made with Applejack) to see if it would help. Unfortunately, it didn't help.
Fortunately, now I don't care.

XXX19
06-07-2011, 10:04 PM
Here are some verses that say blasphemy is unforgiveable. It is blasphemy vs the spirit that is unforgiveable and that is taking credit away from God and give it to Satan which is what the Stones did, at least in two albums plus others like AC/DC in Highway To Hell, and Madonna singing love songs to Satan. She will find there is no love when she goes to hell.

Here are the verses.



LUKE 12:10, "And everyone that says a word against the Son of Man, that will be forgiven; But he that blasphemes against The Holy Spirit will not be forgiven.

MARK 3:29, "Whoever blasphemes against The Holy Spirit will never have forgiveness, but is guilty of everlasting sin."

MATTHEW 12: 31-32 "Therefore I say to you, any sin and blasphemy shall be forgiven men, but blasphemy against the Spirit shall not be forgiven. And whoever shall speak a word against the Son of Man, it shall be forgiven him; but whoever shall speak against the Holy Spirit, it shall not be forgiven him, either in this age, or in the age to come".

Czarcasm
06-07-2011, 10:07 PM
Here are some verses that say blasphemy is unforgiveable. It is blasphemy vs the spirit that is unforgiveable and that is taking credit
away from God and give it to Satan which is what the Stones did,
at least in two albums plus others like AC/DC in Highway To Hell,
Madoona singing love songs to Satan. She will find there is no love when she goes to hell.

Here are the verses.



LUKE 12:10, "And everyone that says a word against the Son of Man, that will be forgiven; But he that blasphemes against The Holy Spirit will not be forgiven
.
MARK 3:29, "Whoever blasphemes against The Holy Spirit will never have forgiveness, but is guilty of everlasting sin."
MATTHEW 12: 31-32 "Therefore I say to you, any sin and blasphemy shall be forgiven men, but blasphemy against the Spirit shall not be forgiven. And whoever shall speak a word against the Son of Man, it shall be forgiven him; but whoever shall speak against the Holy Spirit, it shall not be forgiven him, either in this age, or in the age to come".Is there a particular sect you belong to, or is this all of your own making? It would be nice if I knew if there were any written ground rules that we could follow along with.

Attack from the 3rd dimension
06-07-2011, 10:24 PM
Here are some specific Bible verses on Lucifer. Like I mentioned above, he was in Eden, Genesis said it was on the 6th day.


Satan isn't mentioned until Chronicles, and only becomes a real player in Job.

The serpent is mentioned in Genesis 3, which is after the sixth day. You could say that he was created on the sixth day, but only by inference from Genesis 1:24 "Let the land produce living creatures according to their kinds: the livestock, the creatures that move along the ground, and the wild animals, each according to its kind." Anyway, there's no particular reason to think 'the serpent' equals 'Satan'.

And, if you're going that route, you have to explain how humanity was created twice, at Genesis 1:27 [So God created mankind in his own image, in the image of God he created them; male and female he created them. ] and again at Genesis 2:5 (Adam) [Now no shrub had yet appeared on the earth and no plant had yet sprung up, for the LORD God had not sent rain on the earth and there was no one to work the ground, 6 but streams came up from the earth and watered the whole surface of the ground. 7 Then the LORD God formed a man from the dust of the ground and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life, and the man became a living being. ] and 2:22(Eve) [So the LORD God caused the man to fall into a deep sleep; and while he was sleeping, he took one of the manís ribs and then closed up the place with flesh.]

But hey, that would take reading the bible, so you'll probably not answer this.

xoferew
06-07-2011, 10:38 PM
But you are if you say you met satan and have seen him
several times like Keith Richards said. See quote above.

Wait, I've met and seen lots of people and I don't worship them. Surely you are not saying that just believing in the existence of Satan is a sin?

BrainGlutton
06-07-2011, 10:39 PM
But you are if you say you met satan and have seen him
several times like Keith Richards said. See quote above.

Once again, please get out a dictionary and look up "metaphor."

BrainGlutton
06-07-2011, 10:41 PM
Here are some verses that say blasphemy is unforgiveable.

That all means nothing at all, you know, save to persons who already accept Scripture as authority. If you want to reach the rest of us, you'll have to come up with something else.

BrainGlutton
06-07-2011, 10:47 PM
Surely you are not saying that just believing in the existence of Satan is a sin?

Some Christians would say it is a sin doubt Satan's existence (you have to take the whole package, all or nothing). Others would say it is not an essential doctrine. But all Christians would say it is a sin to believe Satan can ever be as strong, or stronger, than God. The RCC classes that as a named heresy -- Manichaeism (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Manichean), I think.

Suburban Plankton
06-07-2011, 11:06 PM
It is blasphemy vs the spirit that is unforgiveable and that is taking credit away from God and give it to Satan which is what the Stones did, at least in two albums plus others like AC/DC in Highway To Hell, and Madonna singing love songs to Satan. She will find there is no love when she goes to hell.Are you going to tell us about KISS? They are Knights In Satan's Service, aren't they?

XXX19
06-07-2011, 11:29 PM
Satan isn't mentioned until Chronicles, and only becomes a real player in Job.

The serpent is mentioned in Genesis 3, which is after the sixth day. You could say that he was created on the sixth day, but only by inference from Genesis 1:24 "Let the land produce living creatures according to their kinds: the livestock, the creatures that move along the ground, and the wild animals, each according to its kind." Anyway, there's no particular reason to think 'the serpent' equals 'Satan'.




And, if you're going that route, you have to explain how humanity was created twice, at Genesis 1:27 [So God created mankind in his own image, in the image of God he created them; male and female he created them. ] and again at Genesis 2:5 (Adam) [Now no shrub had yet appeared on the earth and no plant had yet sprung up, for the LORD God had not sent rain on the earth and there was no one to work the ground, 6 but streams came up from the earth and watered the whole surface of the ground. 7 Then the LORD God formed a man from the dust of the ground and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life, and the man became a living being. ] and 2:22(Eve) [So the LORD God caused the man to fall into a deep sleep; and while he was sleeping, he took one of the man’s ribs and then closed up the place with flesh.]

But hey, that would take reading the bible, so you'll probably not answer this.





The serpent is mentioned in the 6th day and Satan was the serpent. That doesn't mean he was created on the 6th
day but in Eden.

Everyone knows that but you. And it depends on the interpretation of the GAP theory
and who believes in it.

XXX19
06-07-2011, 11:33 PM
Every believer believes in this story.

http://www.gotquestions.org/Satan-serpent.html

Czarcasm
06-07-2011, 11:37 PM
Every believer believes in this story.

http://www.gotquestions.org/Satan-serpent.htmlNope. Unless you are actually saying something ridiculously circular like "People that believe this believe this", then, no. Not every believer in Christianity believes that interpretation.

XXX19
06-08-2011, 12:07 AM
They're not believers to begin with if they don't believe in he serpent story.

Satan was in the garden as the guardian and that was before he fell.

Then he took the disguise of the serpent to deceive Eve and Adam in Genesis.

Then again, with the way Post Modernists believe and are re-writing scripture you might be right.

Czarcasm
06-08-2011, 12:10 AM
They're not believers to begin with if they don't believe in he serpent story.

Satan was in the garden as the guardian and that was before he fell.

Then he took the disguise of the serpent to deceive Eve and Adam in Genesis.

Then again, with the way Post Modernists believe and are re-writing scripture you might be right.Again, what Christian sect and/or church do you belong to?

XXX19
06-08-2011, 12:12 AM
Rock is the Devil's Music.

David Bowie, Rolling Stone Mag, 1976.

Manson, an ordained "reverend" in the Church of Satan, mutilates himself on stage (1 Kings 18:28), rips-up the Holy Bible, and spews "blasphemies" against the Lord Jesus Christ.

and - hopefully I'll be the person to bring an end to Christianity. Spin Magazine, 1996.


http://www.jesus-is-savior.com/Evils%20in%20America/Rock-n-Roll/satanic_quotes.htm

Measure for Measure
06-08-2011, 12:40 AM
From what I understand "satan" is a hebrew word that is basically the noun form of oppose. Some times when those who have tried to convert me get a little frustrated and ask me if I am a follower of satan or straight out state that I am.

Having read the story of Job being tested, I must say I find that character much less repugnant than Yahweh. In Job, I understand that the adversary is called, The Satan, suggesting that it referred to a title, not an individual. "Special prosecutor" might be a reasonable translation. But in Matthew, Revelations and Paradise Lost, the word Satan refers to an individual.

BrainGlutton
06-08-2011, 12:46 AM
They're not believers to begin with if they don't believe in he serpent story.

Satan was in the garden as the guardian and that was before he fell.

Then he took the disguise of the serpent to deceive Eve and Adam in Genesis.

Then again, with the way Post Modernists believe and are re-writing scripture you might be right.

The way the KJV actually reads, you are probably wrong.

Measure for Measure
06-08-2011, 01:09 AM
Somewhere in the world there are people who actively worship "Satan". Why? Scripture says that we should not worship Satan: rather we should emulate Saint Paul and secure a practical working relationship with him. Consider 1 Timothy, chapter 1. There were two, Hymenaeus and Alexander who had lost their way: thus Saint Paul, acting as a good Christian, "...turned [them] over to Satan, so that they may learn not to blaspheme."

According to Holy Scripture, Satan opposes, but he also teaches.

BrainGlutton
06-08-2011, 01:50 AM
Scripture says that we should not worship Satan: rather we should emulate Saint Paul and secure a practical working relationship with him.

I would be very wary of emulating any practical working relationship of Saint "It is good for a man not to touch a woman" Paul. Unless you're dealing with South Park Satan. ;)

Even then ya gotta be careful. His breakups are fierce.

coremelt
06-08-2011, 03:39 AM
Two pages and I can't believe no one has mentioned "the great beast 666" Aleister Crowley himself.

Crowley's "Thelema" religion is completely non-christian, but he freely encouraged people to think of him as a satanist because, hey, it made for great publicity.

He was in many ways the first and most successful media whore of his age, and self promoting himself as "the wickedest man alive" was a key part of that. Read one of his Biographies for the full details. There's quite a few, but this one is easy to get hold of and well written:

http://www.amazon.com/Do-What-Thou-Wilt-Aleister/dp/0312288972

XXX19
06-08-2011, 03:51 AM
Satan was a cherubim of the highest order and a guard.

XXX19
06-08-2011, 03:59 AM
Make that cherub which is singular for cherubim. He guarded the
tree of life.

Czarcasm
06-08-2011, 07:13 AM
Make that cherub which is singular for cherubim. He guarded the
tree of life.What religion taught you this?

DrFidelius
06-08-2011, 07:23 AM
Once again, please get out a dictionary and look up "metaphor."

From what I can see, Biblical literalists do not understand metaphors or accept that they are a useful rhetorical teaching tool. The contortions they go through to justify their iron-clad interpretations MUST have been inspired by Satan; I cannot believe that a merciful God would encourage them to fan-wank the Bible to that degree.

Gyrate
06-08-2011, 08:15 AM
What religion taught you this?
I think Thomas Aquinas came up with the "Satan was one of the Cherubim" theories, possibly based on Ezekiel 28:13-14: 13.Thou hast been in Eden the garden of God; every precious stone [was] thy covering, the sardius, topaz, and the diamond, the beryl, the onyx, and the jasper, the sapphire, the emerald, and the carbuncle, and gold: the workmanship of thy tabrets and of thy pipes was prepared in thee in the day that thou wast created.

14. Thou [art] the anointed cherub that covereth; and I have set thee [so]: thou wast upon the holy mountain of God; thou hast walked up and down in the midst of the stones of fire.However, Ezekiel 28:12 specifies that this line was to be directed at the King of Tyre, not Satan. However, given XXX19's tendency towards literalism I suspect this isn't a compelling rebuttal.

Alessan
06-08-2011, 08:22 AM
Make that cherub which is singular for cherubim. He guarded the
tree of life.

Satan was a cabbage?

Attack from the 3rd dimension
06-08-2011, 08:33 AM
Every believer believes in this story.


http://www.gotquestions.org/Satan-serpent.html


Every true Scotsman believes that story.

The way the KJV actually reads, you are probably wrong.

Thank you for pointing this out.

I think Thomas Aquinas came up with the "Satan was one of the Cherubim" theories, possibly based on Ezekiel 28:13-14: However, Ezekiel 28:12 specifies that this line was to be directed at the King of Tyre, not Satan. However, given XXX19's tendency towards literalism I suspect this isn't a compelling rebuttal.

Hardly a tendency towards literalism. More a tendency towards cherry-picking, hand waving and plastering over problems that don't fit her answers. I'm assuming she's a she, or a porn star, based on the Xs.

Shodan
06-08-2011, 08:42 AM
However, Ezekiel 28:12 specifies that this line was to be directed at the King of Tyre, not Satan. There are actually two prophecies in Ezekiel 28 aimed at Tyre. The first is aimed at the ruler, or prince, of Tyre, and condemns him for thinking himself a god. The second prophecy is aimed at the king of Tyre, and describes him as much closer to a cherub or higher order of being, that was cast out of heaven for pride.

A traditional interpretation is that the devil is behind what the ruler/prince of Tyre is up to. Thus the twofold prophecy and condemnation.

Regards,
Shodan

BrainGlutton
06-08-2011, 09:21 AM
From what I can see, Biblical literalists do not understand metaphors or accept that they are a useful rhetorical teaching tool.

Jesus did.

Latro
06-08-2011, 09:23 AM
What period was Ezekiel written?
I'm a bit confused. King of Tyros would place it before the Persian period, else he would be a satrap. Then Alexander destroyed the place and never had a king again.

Gyrate
06-08-2011, 09:27 AM
Jesus did.
And look at what happened to him!

Czarcasm
06-08-2011, 10:25 AM
And look at what happened to him!You nailed that one.

BrainGlutton
06-08-2011, 10:27 AM
You nailed that one.

:dubious: Don't make me cross.

Laughing Lady
06-08-2011, 11:09 AM
I've proved without a doubt with direct quotes from performers themselves that these performers were/are satanists, just like some
people in here.

Stuff like this is why I am laughing. Thanks for your help.

Latro
06-08-2011, 11:16 AM
What period was Ezekiel written?
I'm a bit confused. King of Tyros would place it before the Persian period, else he would be a satrap. Then Alexander destroyed the place and never had a king again.

nm.
found it. 'twas during the Babylonian exile. Shortly before the Persians arrived.


djeez if I had to wait for you guys to provide answers....

CurtC
06-08-2011, 11:44 AM
Anyway, there's no particular reason to think 'the serpent' equals 'Satan'.

To the Jews, you're right - my understanding is that they view this as a story about a talking snake, similar to the talking donkey later in the OT.

But for Christians, there are a couple of verses in Revelation that imply that the serpent was Satan.

And this thread got a lot more fun when XXX19 showed up. Keep it coming!

Imago
06-08-2011, 12:23 PM
Going back to the OP, there are people known as Luciferians who (apparently) believe in the same theistic duality as Christians, but consider Lucifer/Satan to have done the right thing for humanity by getting Eve to eat the forbidden fruit (in serpent guise of course). They consider suffering necessary for growth, and value knowledge highly. Luciferians seem to take a revisionist view on most of the texts dealing with Satan. That's maybe the closest thing we'll ever see to actual worship of the Judeo-Christian devil, though of course they don't go around eating infants and mutilating cattle or painting pentagrams on the walls in goat blood.

Most religions that have been around long enough to be argued about have an RHP ("Right-Hand path"), which is to say the traditional interpretation of that particular religion's texts, and an LHP ("Left-Hand path"), which is a re-interpretation, revision or otherwise nontraditional interpretation of those same texts- often considered heresy by their RHP counterparts. Within the Christian tradition you have your run-of-the-mill Christians walking the RHP, and Luciferians walking the LHP. But it's not a uniquely or even especially Judeo-Christian thing; you could be a LHP Norse Pagan if you think Loki was a hero and Odin was a dick, for example, though your RHP peers are less likely to call that blasphemy than a Christian in the same situation might be. Note that this doesn't necessarily mean LHP people lean left politically, or that RHP people are on the political right.

Skald the Rhymer
06-08-2011, 01:47 PM
I do think, however, that we can show that Yahweh of the Old Testament was certainly preceded by far more ancient gods, gods who were worshiped before the human race itself even existed.

Who was worshipping these gods you speak of?

Skald the Rhymer
06-08-2011, 01:50 PM
From what I can see, Biblical literalists do not understand metaphors or accept that they are a useful rhetorical teaching tool. The contortions they go through to justify their iron-clad interpretations MUST have been inspired by Satan; I cannot believe that a merciful God would encourage them to fan-wank the Bible to that degree.

I have known Biblical literalists who claim that any statement not literally true is sinful. Specifically I am thinking of a friend of my father's, whom I heard, when I was a boy, deliver a passionate sermon on why it was wrong for church's to put on Christmas pageants, because when the leads said, "I am Joseph!" and "I am Mary!" they were lying.

Attack from the 3rd dimension
06-08-2011, 04:40 PM
To the Jews, you're right - my understanding is that they view this as a story about a talking snake, similar to the talking donkey later in the OT.

But for Christians, there are a couple of verses in Revelation that imply that the serpent was Satan.

And this thread got a lot more fun when XXX19 showed up. Keep it coming!

If we're going to start acting like Revelation is scripture then it's all down hill from here.

In all seriousness, the bits in Revelation seem very ex post facto to me.

Kobal2
06-08-2011, 05:30 PM
Who was worshipping these gods you speak of?

Dinosaurs, man. Very pious people. Not many people know that.

Kobal2
06-08-2011, 05:34 PM
From what I can see, Biblical literalists do not understand metaphors or accept that they are a useful rhetorical teaching tool. The contortions they go through to justify their iron-clad interpretations MUST have been inspired by Satan; I cannot believe that a merciful God would encourage them to fan-wank the Bible to that degree.

Wait, what ? Didn't The Jesus teach almost entirely in metaphors ?

Skald the Rhymer
06-08-2011, 05:38 PM
Wait, what ? Didn't The Jesus teach almost entirely in metaphors ?

I know ministers who say no, that all the parables were actual incidents which Christ knew about because of his omniscience.

xoferew
06-08-2011, 07:09 PM
I'm still confused about Keith Richards being a Satanist because he (claims he) met Satan. So did Jesus, if you believe the bible. I'm pretty sure Jesus wouldn't be considered a Satanist by most definitions. I also remember as a child being given creepy religious magazines for kids where Satan would whisper things directly to children, scaring the pants off them. (Not literally -- no kiddie porn was involved. Pants remained on.) He would urge them to do dreadful immoral things like attend a Halloween costume party where fortunetelling or kissing would occur. The kids eventually pulled it together and escaped the clutches of Satan. I didn't get any sense that they were evil for having met him. But anyway, I would guess that Satan is pretty free to speak to or appear to whoever he likes unless God has a special no-call list for certain people. As a child I was always terrified that Satan would speak to me personally. (The magazine had helpful tips though, for what responses to give in such an event.)

Kobal2
06-08-2011, 07:41 PM
I know ministers who say no, that all the parables were actual incidents which Christ knew about because of his omniscience.

But that's... why would...I don't even... *head asplode*
You know, people make me sad sometimes.

gravitycrash
06-08-2011, 08:01 PM
Blasphemy is taking credit from God and giving it to Satan which is what these performers
have done. That is why it is unforgiveable.

Job is one of the greatest stories ever written. The point is we all will be tried and tested
because of our sin but we will prevail in he end like Job. He lost everything but it was
all returned because he kept his faith never doubting God. He might have had questions
but he never doubted God.


Job is often where Christians turn to in difficult times and sustains them.

God made a deal with Satan that he could test Job, take his health, his family anythign but
no him and he didn't.

But Satan sure tried.

I've proved without a doubt with direct quotes from performers themselves that these performers were/are satanists, just like some
people in here.

Wow. Where did you come from?

BrainGlutton
06-08-2011, 09:09 PM
Wow. Where did you come from?

:eek: Things are bad enough! Don't ask XXX19 to recite his Catechism!

BrainGlutton
06-08-2011, 09:11 PM
Wait, what ? Didn't The Jesus teach almost entirely in metaphors ?

Similes, mainly. "The Kingdom of Heaven is like unto a mustard seed" and so on.

BrainGlutton
06-08-2011, 09:50 PM
What period was Ezekiel written?

Well, Ezekiel saw the wheel, way up in the middle of the air, which would place him post-Montgolfier at the earliest.

Alan Smithee
06-08-2011, 10:20 PM
Make that cherub which is singular for cherubim. He guarded the
tree of life.What religion taught you this?
Satanism.

XXX19 obviously knows what he's talking about, since he's a practicing Satanist himself. He says so here: Damn, I forgot KISS because I thought they were rock.

Lick it up, lick it up, oh, oh, oh.
Lick it up, lick it up, oh, oh, oh


and AC/DC who had some of the biggest metal hits of the 20th Century
and the place goes nuts when I sing Highway to Hell and TNT.

Highway to hell, highway to hell, I'm on the highway to hell.
No stop signs, speed limits, nothings gonna slow me down

And my friends are going to be there too and Im going all the
way down

http://www.kidzworld.com/article/5281-pioneers-of-heavy-metal

XXX19
06-09-2011, 01:37 AM
I'm still confused about Keith Richards being a Satanist because he (claims he) met Satan. So did Jesus, if you believe the bible. I'm pretty sure Jesus wouldn't be considered a Satanist by most definitions.


Keith Richards was glorifying Satan with his comments. Why do some of you have
a big problem with that. You just don't want to admit the Stones were Satanists along with so many other performers.

When Jesus met Satan it was on the moutain top while he was fasting. Satan
knows how to attack our weaknesses. Jesus was hungry and tired. Satan said
to bow to him and offered rewards but Jesus knew he had more rewards where
he was. In the end, God said his is my son with whom I am well pleased.

So Jesus meeting Satan like that was a confrontation where Satan tried to seduce
him. Satan already had Keith and Mick in the fold.

Also, don't forget that Jesus drove the demons out of people and even gave the
power to his disciples who did the same. The demons were Satans storm troopers
fallen angels from heaven.

Jesus knew Satan well and defeated him and will finally destroy Satan in the end.
See Revelation 19-20.

And Satan sure believes in Jesus.

XXX19
06-09-2011, 01:50 AM
Satanism.

XXX19 obviously knows what he's talking about, since he's a practicing Satanist himself. He says so here:

I touched a nerve.

:D


One must know the enemy to fight him.

I READ THE BOOK ROMMEL. I READ HE BOOK. GEN GEORGE S. PATTON.

XXX19
06-09-2011, 02:45 AM
What took you so long? That's been up a while. I know the words to
many of the songs and have listened to them. That's why Ive been able to say so much
here or I wouldn't have been able to make any comments.

Alan Smithee
06-09-2011, 03:28 AM
You don't just know them, you sing them. So do you really glorify Satanism, or are you pulling our leg about the artists really worshipping Satan? From what you've posted, it seems like you're either a Satanist, a hypocrite or a troll, unless I've misunderstood something.

I have no beef of you're a Satanist. It's always struck me as a bit silly, but otherwise harmless, and it's always good to have posters who can explain less common belief systems.

BrainGlutton
06-09-2011, 09:48 AM
Apparently there are some people (nowadays, at least -- any claims of ancient family tradition are probably bogus) who literally worship Satan as a deity. See Theistic Satanism. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Theistic_Satanism)

CapnPitt
06-09-2011, 04:43 PM
_______________________________

Keith Richards (2002): "Sympathy is quite an uplifting song. It's just a matter of looking the Devil in the face. He's there all the time. I've had very close contact with Lucifer - I've met him several times. Evil - people tend to bury it and hope it sorts itself out and doesn't rear its ugly head. Sympathy for the Devil is just as appropriate now, with 9/11. There it is again, big time. When that song was written, it was a time of turmoil. It was the first sort of international chaos since World War II. And confusion is not the ally of peace and love. You want to think the world is perfect. Everybody gets sucked into that. And as America has found out to its dismay, you can't hide. You might as well accept the fact that evil is there and deal with it any way you can. Sympathy for the Devil is a song that says, Don't forget him. If you confront him, then he's out of a job." (thanks, Bertrand - Paris, France, for above 2)

Did you really read this? "If you confront him, he's out of a job." He's saying don't forget about evil in the world, confront it...that's a way of doing good. Stand up to evil.

And as was mentioned earlier, I really don't think you understand what a metaphor is.

BrainGlutton
06-09-2011, 06:18 PM
Did you really read this? "If you confront him, he's out of a job." He's saying don't forget about evil in the world, confront it...that's a way of doing good. Stand up to evil.

Actually, that's very WWJD. In fact, that's exactly WJ did when Satan tempted Him. Had no idea Keith Richards was such a saintly dude! :)

XXX19
06-10-2011, 06:04 AM
Did you really read this? "If you confront him, he's out of a job." He's saying don't forget about evil in the world, confront it...that's a way of doing good. Stand up to evil.

And as was mentioned earlier, I really don't think you understand what a metaphor is.

And you don't know hat Anton Lavay recruited the Stones into the occult and
Sympathy is their anthem. Lavay doesn't consider it a metaphor.

BTW, The Stones made over $200M between 1964 and 1970 and went broke and none of them know where their
money went.

Van Moorison was married in the Church of Satan and both he and his wife
drank each other's blood standing in the middle of the satanic symbols.

A man was also killed when the Stones performed Sympathy.

Likie I mentioned violence has always been at the Stones concerts and they
even hired the Hells Agnels as body guards in Calif and some people got
hurt there as well. Somebody always go hurt at a Stones concert, even at
one of their concerts near in in DC.

Van Morrison suddenly died one night presumably by an OD like Jimmie Hendrix and Janis Joplan.

But as Moorison sang one of Frank's tunes - That's Life, if you know what I mean.
One of my fav tunes.



http://www.jesus-is-savior.com/Miscellaneous/satanic_roots_of_rock.htm

XXX19
06-10-2011, 06:16 AM
I'm riding high in April and shot down in May.
But if there's one thing I know, I'll pick myself up and get back in the race.

Well, ole Van didn't pick himself up and get into the race that time and
he's down there with his pal Lennon and Satan.

Gyrate
06-10-2011, 06:49 AM
And you don't know hat Anton Lavay recruited the Stones into the occult and
Sympathy is their anthem. Lavay doesn't consider it a metaphor.

BTW, The Stones made over $200M between 1964 and 1970 and went broke and none of them know where their
money went.

Van Moorison was married in the Church of Satan and both he and his wife
drank each other's blood standing in the middle of the satanic symbols.

A man was also killed when the Stones performed Sympathy.

Likie I mentioned violence has always been at the Stones concerts and they
even hired the Hells Agnels as body guards in Calif and some people got
hurt there as well. Somebody always go hurt at a Stones concert, even at
one of their concerts near in in DC.

Van Morrison suddenly died one night presumably by an OD like Jimmie Hendrix and Janis Joplan.

But as Moorison sang one of Frank's tunes - That's Life, if you know what I mean.
One of my fav tunes.



http://www.jesus-is-savior.com/Miscellaneous/satanic_roots_of_rock.htmWe've already debunked a number of your assertions, despite what someone has written on a website. Repeating them does not make them true.

And I'm pretty sure that bearing false witness is a big no-no regardless of which branch of Christianity you follow. I am quite disappointed in you.

The Other Waldo Pepper
06-10-2011, 06:57 AM
Van Morrison suddenly died one night presumably by an OD like Jimmie Hendrix and Janis Joplan.

But as Moorison sang one of Frank's tunes - That's Life, if you know what I mean.
One of my fav tunes.



http://www.jesus-is-savior.com/Miscellaneous/satanic_roots_of_rock.htm

As far as I know, Van Morrison is alive and well.

I'm riding high in April and shot down in May.
But if there's one thing I know, I'll pick myself up and get back in the race.

Well, ole Van didn't pick himself up and get into the race that time and
he's down there with his pal Lennon and Satan.

When, exactly, do you think ole Van died?

Gyrate
06-10-2011, 07:06 AM
Van Morrison has an album called "Pay the Devil". Did you see that? He used the word "Devil" right there, right out in front of everyone. Clearly he has died and gone to hell and been replaced by a Satanic simalcrum. It's a pity they couldn't make a more coherent, less irritating one but that's Satan for you - always looking to ruin nice things.

DrFidelius
06-10-2011, 07:48 AM
I see it now. XXX19 may be a tool of Satan, doing his work on the Earth, spreading disinformation, fomenting strife, and trying to make Christianity look ignorant and unappealing.
By seeming to obsess over easily debunked urban legends and celebrity gossip, The Deceiver is attempting to divert attention form those who are actually advancing his causes; the hypocrites, the fear-mongerers, the deliberately ignorant, and those who would sell the Word for fame or personal glory.
Vade retro satana! Your poor attempt at misdirection cannot fool anyone who approaches God with an open mind and heart!

I command you, unclean spirit, whoever you are, along with all your minions now attacking this servant of God, by the mysteries of the incarnation, passion, resurrection, and ascension of our Lord Jesus Christ, by the descent of the Holy Spirit, by the coming of our Lord for judgment, that you tell me by some sign your name, and the day and hour of your departure. I command you, moreover, to obey me to the letter, I who am a minister of God despite my unworthiness; nor shall you be emboldened to harm in any way this creature of God, or the bystanders, or any of their possessions.

Latro
06-10-2011, 08:08 AM
I can feel the air clear already!

That's the last we'll see of Satan ont these boards!!

Where would we be without our good loyal Doctor......

Attack from the 3rd dimension
06-10-2011, 08:09 AM
We've already debunked a number of your assertions, despite what someone has written on a website. Repeating them does not make them true.

And I'm pretty sure that bearing false witness is a big no-no regardless of which branch of Christianity you follow. I am quite disappointed in you.

BURN!


I command you, unclean spirit, whoever you are, along with all your minions now attacking this servant of God, by the mysteries of the incarnation, passion, resurrection, and ascension of our Lord Jesus Christ, by the descent of the Holy Spirit, by the coming of our Lord for judgment, that you tell me by some sign your name, and the day and hour of your departure. I command you, moreover, to obey me to the letter, I who am a minister of God despite my unworthiness; nor shall you be emboldened to harm in any way this creature of God, or the bystanders, or any of their possessions.

Whoa! Double-Burn!





I just felt this thread didn't have enough grade-school dynamic.

XXX19
06-10-2011, 08:24 AM
I see it now. XXX19 may be a tool of Satan, doing his work on the Earth, spreading disinformation, fomenting strife, and trying to make Christianity look ignorant and unappealing.
By seeming to obsess over easily debunked urban legends and celebrity gossip, The Deceiver is attempting to divert attention form those who are actually advancing his causes; the hypocrites, the fear-mongerers, the deliberately ignorant, and those who would sell the Word for fame or personal glory.
Vade retro satana! Your poor attempt at misdirection cannot fool anyone who approaches God with an open mind and heart!

I command you, unclean spirit, whoever you are, along with all your minions now attacking this servant of God, by the mysteries of the incarnation, passion, resurrection, and ascension of our Lord Jesus Christ, by the descent of the Holy Spirit, by the coming of our Lord for judgment, that you tell me by some sign your name, and the day and hour of your departure. I command you, moreover, to obey me to the letter, I who am a minister of God despite my unworthiness; nor shall you be emboldened to harm in any way this creature of God, or the bystanders, or any of their possessions.




And if anyone is without sin, let him cast the first stone.

XXX19
06-10-2011, 08:25 AM
Speaking of Van, Brown Eye Girl, is a song about heroin.

Heroin is brown.

Like I said, Van ODed.

You see, I do know metaphors. I really do.


That is not spreading dis-information.

Nope, I"m still here

DrFidelius
06-10-2011, 08:33 AM
Speaking of Van, Brown Eye Girl, is a song about heroin.

Heroin is brown.

Like I said, Van ODed.

You see, I do know metaphors. I really do.


That is not spreading dis-information.

Nope, I"m still here

Van Morrison came out with a Live at the Hollywood Bowl DVD in 2009. When did he die? I didn't see it on the Entertainment News. I am shocked and saddened.

kayaker
06-10-2011, 08:45 AM
Van Morrison came out with a Live at the Hollywood Bowl DVD in 2009. When did he die? I didn't see it on the Entertainment News. I am shocked and saddened.

Van the Man is very much alive.

EinsteinsHund
06-10-2011, 08:45 AM
Speaking of Van, Brown Eye Girl, is a song about heroin.

Heroin is brown.



Do you know what else was brown? Right, the shirts of ... Nah, don't wanna go there.

saoirse
06-10-2011, 08:49 AM
Speaking of Van, Brown Eye Girl, is a song about heroin.

Heroin is brown.

I always thought it was about buttsex.

In any case, if Satan-worship led to drug overdose, what would Kieth Richards be doing alive? And are you actually just trolling about Van Morrison being dead? He's not, you know.

Gyrate
06-10-2011, 08:50 AM
He's got a concert in London next week (Sunday 19 June). Honestly - unless you're posting from his hotel room next to his still-warm corpse, I'm pretty sure he's not dead.

If you can't get the solid verifiable facts correct, there's no point in believing the rest of your more spurious assertions.

Marley23
06-10-2011, 09:06 AM
So do you really glorify Satanism, or are you pulling our leg about the artists really worshipping Satan? From what you've posted, it seems like you're either a Satanist, a hypocrite or a troll, unless I've misunderstood something.
Unless you're posting in The BBQ Pit (our own little circle of Hell), don't accuse other posters of trolling.

XXX19, you've confused Van Morrison with Jim Morrison. Van Morrison (Gloria, Into the Mystic, Moondance, and Brown Eyed Girl, which is not about heroin) is alive and well. Jim Morrison (The Doors) died in 1971.

BrainGlutton
06-10-2011, 09:11 AM
And you don't know hat Anton Lavay recruited the Stones into the occult and
Sympathy is their anthem. Lavay doesn't consider it a metaphor.

:confused: Hell/Heaven yeah LeVay considered Satan a metaphor! Have you ever read anything he wrote?!

BrainGlutton
06-10-2011, 09:13 AM
I'm riding high in April and shot down in May.
But if there's one thing I know, I'll pick myself up and get back in the race.

Well, ole Van didn't pick himself up and get into the race that time and
he's down there with his pal Lennon and Satan.

If you have to choose between spending eternity in Heaven with Jesus or in Hell with John Lennon, pick John.

BrainGlutton
06-10-2011, 09:15 AM
Speaking of Van, Brown Eye Girl, is a song about heroin.

Heroin is brown.

:confused: No, your post is brown.

DrFidelius
06-10-2011, 09:18 AM
I always associate "That's Life" with Sinatra, not Morrison. I guess I need to expand my musical horizons -- I seem to have very few Satanists on my MP3 player - too much Big Band, Broadway show tunes and bagpipe music.

(Were ABBA Satanists? I've got a lot of their songs.)

Gyrate
06-10-2011, 09:42 AM
XXX19, you've confused Van Morrison with Jim Morrison.:smack: Yeah, Jim's dead and heroin was probably involved. He didn't sing "Brown Eyed Girl", of course. And I doubt he was a Satanist; more likely he was just seriously screwed up.

You want a song about heroin with "brown" in the title? Try "Golden Brown" by The Stranglers. Catchy tune. They're still touring. Their drummer must be about 73 by now. Also unlikely to be Satanists.

And sadly I associate "That's Life" with David Lee Roth. Curse you, 1980s music scene! Satan may well have been involved there.

Marley23
06-10-2011, 09:47 AM
:smack: Yeah, Jim's dead and heroin was probably involved. He didn't sing "Brown Eyed Girl", of course. And I doubt he was a Satanist; more likely he was just seriously screwed up.
No, he wasn't a Satanist any more than Mick and Keef or John Lennon or Madonna. But I can imagine somebody with XXX19's mixed-up views believing that Jim Morrison was a Satanist. I can't picture Van Morrison as a Satanist. For that matter I have no idea where he got the idea that Brown Eyed Girl was about heroin. Brown Sugar, the Stones song, is probably about heroin.

Marley23
06-10-2011, 09:54 AM
A man was also killed when the Stones performed Sympathy
This is also wrong. Meredith Hunter was killed while the Stones were playing Under My Thumb. Sympathy for the Devil was played earlier in the concert.

Somebody always go hurt at a Stones concert
Yes, that's why they make tens of millions of dollars every time they tour. Something always goes wrong at their shows.

CurtC
06-10-2011, 09:54 AM
Do you know what else was brown?

What XXX19 is full of?



XXX19, you've confused Van Morrison with Jim Morrison. Van Morrison (Gloria, Into the Mystic, Moondance, and Brown Eyed Girl, which is not about heroin) is alive and well. Jim Morrison (The Doors) died in 1971.

But he didn't just type "Van" instead of "Jim." He wouldn't have brought up Brown Eyed Girl (which is not about heroin) if he had been thinking Jim. And Van Morrison seems to be pretty religious, if we go by some of his more recent songs. Would a Satanist sing Did Ye Get Healed or Whenever God Shines His Light?

If you live the life you love
You get the blessing from above
He heals the sick and heals the lame
Says you can do it too in jesus name

Hell lift you up and turn you around
And put your feet back on higher ground

EinsteinsHund
06-10-2011, 09:55 AM
You want a song about heroin with "brown" in the title? Try "Golden Brown" by The Stranglers. Catchy tune. They're still touring. Their drummer must be about 73 by now. Also unlikely to be Satanists.


Got one more: "Brown Sugar" (http://www.metrolyrics.com/brown-sugar-lyrics-zz-top.html) by ZZ Top. Also still touring, also known for a lot of things, but not for being Satanists.

njtt
06-10-2011, 10:01 AM
Van Morrison came out with a Live at the Hollywood Bowl DVD in 2009. When did he die? I didn't see it on the Entertainment News. I am shocked and saddened.

Ah yes, but he is talking about Van Moorison, the bovine star, best known for the album Moooondance. Van Moorison was clearly a tool of the devil. He even had horns!

I always thought it was about buttsex.

I myself am quite convinced of the, admittedly highly counter-intuitive, hypothesis that it is actually about a girl with brown eyes.

BrainGlutton
06-10-2011, 10:08 AM
Yes, that's why they make tens of millions of dollars every time they tour. Something always goes wrong at their shows.

You know they'll never live down Altamonte.

Hiring the Hell's Angels for security?!

EinsteinsHund
06-10-2011, 10:18 AM
Ah yes, but he is talking about Van Moorison, the bovine star, best known for the album Moooondance. Van Moorison was clearly a tool of the devil. He even had horns!

:D Well played.

Marley23
06-10-2011, 10:46 AM
But he didn't just type "Van" instead of "Jim." He wouldn't have brought up Brown Eyed Girl (which is not about heroin) if he had been thinking Jim. And Van Morrison seems to be pretty religious, if we go by some of his more recent songs. Would a Satanist sing Did Ye Get Healed or Whenever God Shines His Light?
Yes, it's an extensive screwup and it's pretty funny. He evidently doesn't know Jim Morrison and Van Morrison are two different people. I guess he's picturing a guy whose real name was James Van Morrison, or that Jim Morrison lived in a van or something.

I myself am quite convinced of the, admittedly highly counter-intuitive, hypothesis that it is actually about a girl with brown eyes.
I have no idea where you're gettign that.

You know they'll never live down Altamonte.

Hiring the Hell's Angels for security?!
As noted upthread, that was the Grateful Dead's idea. I'd say it was the worst idea they ever had, but they let Bob Weir sing.

Gyrate
06-10-2011, 10:52 AM
(Were ABBA Satanists? I've got a lot of their songs.)You wouldn't think so. (http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/01006d.htm)Abba is the Aramaic word for "father." The word occurs three times in the New Testament (Mark 14:36; Romans 8:15; Galatians 4:6).

DrFidelius
06-10-2011, 11:15 AM
Unless you're posting in The BBQ Pit (our own little circle of Hell), don't accuse other posters of trolling.

XXX19, you've confused Van Morrison with Jim Morrison. Van Morrison (Gloria, Into the Mystic, Moondance, and Brown Eyed Girl, which is not about heroin) is alive and well. Jim Morrison (The Doors) died in 1971.

I thought so; I am relieved to know that my information on Van is accurate as of this time.
But this continued mis-statement on XXX19's part leads me to doubt the veracity of any other pronouncements made. A simple Google would have told himher that (s)he was citing the wrong Morrison; how much else might (s)he be passing along without fact-checking?

CapnPitt
06-10-2011, 11:17 AM
Speaking of Van, Brown Eye Girl, is a song about heroin.

Heroin is brown.

Like I said, Van ODed.

You see, I do know metaphors. I really do.


That is not spreading dis-information.

Nope, I"m still here

Dude (or Dudette, as the case may be), seriously, you are spreading disinformation. Like everyone else said, Van is alive and I'm positive it's not because he rose from the dead. The killing at Altamont was during "Under My Thumb," not "Sympathy."

Also, people get hurt all the time at large gatherings (sometimes even, very unfortunately) getting killed. The Who in Cincinnati springs to mind. But who knows, according to you they're probably Satanists too and they needed the blood sacrifice and it had nothing to do with poor crowd control and the idiotic idea of festival seating. Heck, I'm sure that people have even sprained ankles or worse at the Thomas Road Baptist Church.

And now I do believe you know metaphors but only choose to use them when it's convenient to you and you ignore them when it's inconvenient.

BrainGlutton
06-10-2011, 11:27 AM
The killing at Altamont was during "Under My Thumb," not "Sympathy."

Still fits.

Marley23
06-10-2011, 11:31 AM
Still fits.
The title could be Satan-y if you wanted it to. The actual song doesn't fit, and the OP was going on about that song in particular.

CapnPitt
06-10-2011, 11:44 AM
Almost every song could be Satan-y if you apply logic like XXX19's.

Let's see: "The Old Rugged Cross." Well the word rugged has two lower case g's in it which are directly in the middle of the word. Since these extend below the line, this means that we should invert meanings in the song. So rugged in these sense means inverted which means the inverted cross, which is a sign of Satan (and also proves that the Pope is the Whore of Babylon because this sign (supposedly of St. Peter) is on his chair). Then we continue to invert meanings in the lyrics and boy howdy, do we find ton's of Satanic issues there. Inverting means that you'll cling to the treasures of earth at the expense of the promise of the true cross.

See...easy peasy.

I can't wait 'til we get to the part of this thread about backward-masking.

Marley23
06-10-2011, 11:47 AM
I can't wait 'til we get to the part of this thread about backward-masking.
I'm hoping we don't get there until I have a chance to start drinking.

Czarcasm
06-10-2011, 11:49 AM
I'm hoping we don't get there until I have a chance to start drinking.
I just realized what "Abba" spelled backwards is!

Bosda Di'Chi of Tricor
06-10-2011, 11:59 AM
In the minds of certain kinds of people, there are no Facts, only Truth.

Unfortunately the vast majority of such people are acquainted with neither.

XXX19
06-11-2011, 12:55 AM
Unless you're posting in The BBQ Pit (our own little circle of Hell), don't accuse other posters of trolling.

XXX19, you've confused Van Morrison with Jim Morrison. Van Morrison (Gloria, Into the Mystic, Moondance, and Brown Eyed Girl, which is not about heroin) is alive and well. Jim Morrison (The Doors) died in 1971.

Thank you. Got first names wrong. Like I keep saying, you gotta know what the enemy is saying. I have and know all he words.

Someone else agrees with me.


Answer:
what is the meaning of brown eyed girl by van morrison?
I believe the meaning is Morrison's love for heroin. The word "girl" is interpreted as drugs that work on the brain's hypothalamus region. Another example is the words "slippin' and a slidin'" means using a needle for injecting heroin inside your body. Morrison uses brown because heroin is normally a brown color


Read more: http://wiki.answers.com/Q/What_is_the_meaning_of_brown_eyed_girl_by_van_morrison#ixzz1OwKY9sg6

Measure for Measure
06-11-2011, 02:50 AM
Someone else agrees with me.


Answer:
what is the meaning of brown eyed girl by van morrison?
I believe the meaning is Morrison's love for heroin. The word "girl" is interpreted as drugs that work on the brain's hypothalamus region. Another example is the words "slippin' and a slidin'" means using a needle for injecting heroin inside your body. Morrison uses brown because heroin is normally a brown color


Read more: http://wiki.answers.com/Q/What_is_the_meaning_of_brown_eyed_girl_by_van_morrison#ixzz1OwKY9sg6 FWIW, the contributor of that unsubstantiated interpretation has a trust level of zero, according to your link.

Over at wiki, I see that Brown Eyed Girl was recorded in 1967. It has aged fairly well I think. http://www.answers.com/topic/brown-eyed-girl Paul Williams included "Brown Eyed Girl" in his book Rock and Roll: The 100 Best Singles,[23] writing that:

I was going to say this is a song about sex, and it is, and a song about youth and growing up, and memory, and it's also ó very much and very wonderfully ó a song about singing.

Attack from the 3rd dimension
06-11-2011, 05:40 AM
what is the meaning of brown eyed girl by van morrison?
I believe the meaning is Morrison's love for heroin. The word "girl" is interpreted as drugs that work on the brain's hypothalamus region. Another example is the words "slippin' and a slidin'" means using a needle for injecting heroin inside your body. Morrison uses brown because heroin is normally a brown color


You and your friend should look up Occam's Razor. The devil uses it to keep true believers from being convincing.

DrFidelius
06-11-2011, 09:24 AM
Thank you. Got first names wrong. Like I keep saying, you gotta know what the enemy is saying. I have and know all he words.

Someone else agrees with me.


Answer:
what is the meaning of brown eyed girl by van morrison?
I believe the meaning is Morrison's love for heroin. The word "girl" is interpreted as drugs that work on the brain's hypothalamus region. Another example is the words "slippin' and a slidin'" means using a needle for injecting heroin inside your body. Morrison uses brown because heroin is normally a brown color


Read more: http://wiki.answers.com/Q/What_is_the_meaning_of_brown_eyed_girl_by_van_morrison#ixzz1OwKY9sg6

I hope you can understand our reaction to this, but you must realize that if you are demonstratably wrong on something as trivial as the name and fate of a musical performer, we may question why we should trust your statements on something as vital as the fate of our immortal souls.

Both God and the Devil are said to be in the details, and if the little things are clearly incorrect then we are justified in feeling doubts about the big cases built from those details.

Please take some time for yourself and consider the sources you have placed your trust in. I am no expert on salvation, but I honestly do not think that following falsehoods, no matter how sincere or well-intentioned, will help at the Last Judgement.

kayaker
06-11-2011, 09:50 AM
I have and know all he words.

Masculine nouns?

CapnPitt
06-11-2011, 10:20 AM
Thank you. Got first names wrong. Like I keep saying, you gotta know what the enemy is saying. I have and know all he words.

Someone else agrees with me.


Answer:
what is the meaning of brown eyed girl by van morrison?
I believe the meaning is Morrison's love for heroin. The word "girl" is interpreted as drugs that work on the brain's hypothalamus region. Another example is the words "slippin' and a slidin'" means using a needle for injecting heroin inside your body. Morrison uses brown because heroin is normally a brown color


Read more: http://wiki.answers.com/Q/What_is_the_meaning_of_brown_eyed_girl_by_van_morrison#ixzz1OwKY9sg6

Got the first names wrong?!?!?! You got more than that wrong. You started off with the premise that Van Morrison was dead from an overdose when it was Jim. Then you ran with Van Morrison. You should be running with the Jim Morrison argument and apologizing for taking us on a Van Morrison tangent. ODing on heroin was your lever into this and then when you're shown that you had the wrong dead guy, you continue on with the guy who's alive.

And as for some anonymous person on wiki answers agreeing with you, remember that the plural of anecdote is not data. Further, go on the web and see if you can find two people who agree that lizard-people run the one-world government. It's easy.

Attack from the 3rd dimension
06-11-2011, 10:56 AM
Further, go on the web and see if you can find two people who agree that lizard-people run the one-world government. It's easy.

The lizard people are Satan in the garden.

Gyrate
06-11-2011, 11:20 AM
The lizard people are Satan in the garden.Satan did it in the garden with the apple!

Of course, this is the solution for every game of Biblical Cluedo so there's not much demand for the game.

blindboyard
06-11-2011, 12:36 PM
I'm not sure his first name was "Van". Transit to his friends, perhaps.

Now Jim Morrison, his dad was an Admiral who had something to do with Tonkin Gulf, maybe there's some devil connections there, given all the bloodshed that led to. Much more indicative, I'd have thought, than a song which is (n't) about heroin. And Woody Harrelson's dad was a professional killer who killed a federal judge for a drug lord. Families, eh? Anyway, singing about drugs isn't exactly prima facie proof of devil worship, especially if you don't actually do it.

Marley23
06-11-2011, 01:38 PM
Thank you. Got first names wrong.
You didn't just get the names wrong, you confused two different people. Van Morrison is alive and there's nothing Satanic about him. Jim Morrison wasn't a Satanist, but he did do the dark poet thing. There's no reason to include Van Morrison in this silliness.

Someone else agrees with me.
Two people can be ridiculously wrong just as easily as one person can. There's no reason to interpret "girl" as "drugs that work on the hypothalamus" when the more obvious interpretation is that it means "female human being." The rest of the lyrics don't suit your interpretation. The full verse is:

"Standin' in the sunlight laughin'
Hidin' behind a rainbow's wall
Slippin' and a-slidin'
All along the waterfall"

Please tell me how it makes sense if read as:

Standin' in the sunlight laughin'
Hidin' behind a rainbow's wall
[Injecting heroin]
All along the waterfall

XXX19
06-11-2011, 01:58 PM
I was referring to the guy who sang with the Doors. When I typed it I made a mistake.

It's a matter of interpretation just like a lot of scripture. You have yours and we have ours.

I just saw this same thread on from 2007 and you were saying the same things then.

But when a guy says he has met Satan several times he is talking about the real thing especially when he's associated
with the guy who started the church.

When a performer has 3 dice on his arm that equals 666 he is talking about the real thing - the anti-Christ.

Just my humble freaking opinion but I've enjoyed this thread.

Kobal2
06-11-2011, 01:59 PM
It's a rock 'n roll song, it's not scripture.

Marley23
06-11-2011, 02:29 PM
I was referring to the guy who sang with the Doors. When I typed it I made a mistake.
Then Brown Eyed Girl is irrelevant to your thread even if it was about heroin.

It's a matter of interpretation just like a lot of scripture.
Yes and no. You can interpret a song however you like. When you talk about what the artist intended to say when he wrote it, you're entering a different realm - there are right answers and wrong answers there. What you've said about all these performers is factually incorrect.

But when a guy says he has met Satan several times he is talking about the real thing especially when he's associated
with the guy who started the church.
The comment was an obvious metaphor.

When a performer has 3 dice on his arm that equals 666 he is talking about the real thing - the anti-Christ.
Manson does not believe in that stuff, and he does most of it to be provocative.

Just my humble freaking opinion but I've enjoyed this thread.
You can't defend a statement that is factually incorrect by saying it's just your opinion.

xoferew
06-11-2011, 07:52 PM
I get that some people pretend to be Satanists in order to shock their parents or sell records, and I get that some atheistic people subscribe to the Church of Satan as a life philosophy, but what would be the allure of Satan worship to people who believe in the basic mechanics of Christianity and thus believe that they are condemning themselves to an eternity of horrific torture, which seems to be what XXX19 is talking about. I mean, even a small child grasps that it's not worth it to steal the twix bar if it means daddy's going to whack them with a belt later. Why would any rational person be interested in the deal? I wouldn't think Satan would get many takers by actually meeting with people. Better to just seduce them into a sinful life without the Satan-worshiping part, and collect their soul at the end.

Measure for Measure
06-11-2011, 10:16 PM
There's a FAQ on Theistic Satanism here: http://theisticsatanism.com/varieties/FAQ-TS.html

They contrast themselves with LeVay, whom they call a symbolic Satanist. The problem here is that nearly all theistic Satanists (1) have had profound spiritual experiences involving Satan, yet (2) regard at least some aspects of Christian theology as absurd. Hence we all must reinterpret the figure of Satan somehow. Even those who claim to be "Bible based" theistic Satanists reinterpret Christian theology enough so that they can see Satan as having at least a chance - if not a guarantee - of winning. So, on what reasonable basis can we classify some interpretations as "true Satanism" and others as not "true Satanism"? I see no good way to draw the line without getting into endless bickering. Furthermore, in my opinion, none of us can really be sure of our interpretation. Hence my preference for an inclusive definition.

Theistic Satanism is not one single religion. It is a category of religions and spiritualities with the common feature of revering Satan in one way or another. Perhaps it might be more accurate to speak of Satanisms (plural) than Satanism (singular). My summary of Vera is that Theistic Satanists interpret the Dark Lord as a sort of Prometheus character, one who rebels against the Gods in order to extend liberty to humans.

BrainGlutton
06-11-2011, 10:35 PM
Another example is the words "slippin' and a slidin'" means using a needle for injecting heroin inside your body.

:confused: I suppose it could, but in context . . . the interpretation should really be a "horses, not zebras," thing. And in this usage "horse" does not mean H; it means F.

BrainGlutton
06-12-2011, 01:08 AM
There's a FAQ on Theistic Satanism here: http://theisticsatanism.com/varieties/FAQ-TS.html

They contrast themselves with LeVay, whom they call a symbolic Satanist. My summary of Vera is that Theistic Satanists interpret the Dark Lord as a sort of Prometheus character, one who rebels against the Gods in order to extend liberty to humans.

A cult of that kind -- the Gnostic-derived Church of Saint Satan and Pandaemons, described by a local Calvinist bishop as "Christian diabolism" -- features in one of the stories in The Adventures of Doctor Eszterhazy, (http://www.amazon.com/Adventures-Doctor-Eszterhazy-Avram-Davidson/dp/0913896284) by Avram Davidson (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Avram_Davidson) (set in 19th-Century Europe, in the Triune Monarchy of Scythia-Pannonia-Transbalkania). It's well worth a read if you can get hold of it.

BrainGlutton
06-12-2011, 01:13 AM
Masculine nouns?

No, carnal verbs.

santiago42
06-12-2011, 10:27 PM
Here's Keith Richards saying he is close to Satan and has even seen him several times.
Now you can stay in self denial all you want.

_______________________________

Keith Richards (2002): "Sympathy is quite an uplifting song. It's just a matter of looking the Devil in the face. He's there all the time. I've had very close contact with Lucifer - I've met him several times. Evil - people tend to bury it and hope it sorts itself out and doesn't rear its ugly head. Sympathy for the Devil is just as appropriate now, with 9/11. There it is again, big time. When that song was written, it was a time of turmoil. It was the first sort of international chaos since World War II. And confusion is not the ally of peace and love. You want to think the world is perfect. Everybody gets sucked into that. And as America has found out to its dismay, you can't hide. You might as well accept the fact that evil is there and deal with it any way you can. Sympathy for the Devil is a song that says, Don't forget him. If you confront him, then he's out of a job." (thanks, Bertrand - Paris, France, for above 2)

Keith Richards has also admitted to taking a LOT of drugs. Keith himself probably isn't that certain of what and/or who he's seen.

Grendel's Father
06-13-2011, 11:05 AM
Wiccans NEVER wear the pentagram with the point down.

30+ years in "the community" and "the season" has nothing to do with it.

Guess you were never a second degree Gardnerian (which could arguably be considered the "true" or at least "original" form of Wicca).

http://symboldictionary.net/?p=1893
A “point down” pentacle is nothing new- nor is it necessarily Satanic when it appears as such. Historical depictions of the pentagram were as likely to be points down as point up- a distinction between one or the other was rarely made by the ancients. Even today, one must not assume a point down pentagram is Satanic, as it is just likely to be Masonic, Wiccan, or simply upside-down. Some inexperienced Wiccans will occasionally claim that a point down pentacle is Satanic, but such a symbol has at times represented the Wiccan horned God, and is still today an emblem of the Second Degree initiation in Gardnerian Wicca.
(bolding mine)

BrainGlutton
06-13-2011, 11:15 AM
Wiccans NEVER wear the pentagram with the point down.

30+ years in "the community" and "the season" has nothing to do with it.

*sniff* I see no reason to waste time talking to a heretic.

Recovering Republican
06-14-2011, 08:32 AM
Just saw the flick Drive Angry (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lshkRGT9uXA). Like almost all Nicholas Cage movies it had no artistic or socially redeeming qualities whatsoever, a weak plot, and was a hellovalot of fun. Fast cars, hot chicks, and lots & lots of guns and explosions! (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O2-hiHUh4UQ&NR=1&feature=fvwp) :cool:

At one point in the movie the "Accountant" refers to the devil as "Satan". Which brings me to my question:

Somewhere in the world there are people who actively worship "Satan". Why? If one believes that the devil of the bible exists, isn't this an admission that the god of that bible also exists? Therefore, wouldn't worshiping said devil be the most dangerous risk in the universe?

Also, would "Satan" actually want to be called "Satan"? Wouldn't he rather have his worshipers call him Lord, or at very least his original name of Lucifer?

Frankly, I read the bible and have a hard time figuring out which one was the "Evil" one again.

God kills millions of people in the bible, everything from killing everyone in the world in the flood to the folks in Sodom for throwing a killer Oscar Party (or something) to killing David and Bathsheba's baby to show David it was wrong for him to take Urriah's wife.

The number of people Satan kills in the Bible? Ten. The children of Job whom he offs by having a roof fall in on them at dinner, on a bar bet with God that he could get Job to curse God.

Kobal2
06-14-2011, 08:51 AM
Yeah, but that's just proof the Bible is a spawn of the Devil, to discredit God.

(I'm not even kidding - some people really believe that.)

BrainGlutton
06-14-2011, 09:38 AM
Just saw the flick Drive Angry (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lshkRGT9uXA). Like almost all Nicholas Cage movies it had no artistic or socially redeeming qualities whatsoever, a weak plot, and was a hellovalot of fun. Fast cars, hot chicks, and lots & lots of guns and explosions! (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O2-hiHUh4UQ&NR=1&feature=fvwp) :cool:

At one point in the movie the "Accountant" refers to the devil as "Satan". Which brings me to my question:

Somewhere in the world there are people who actively worship "Satan". Why? If one believes that the devil of the bible exists, isn't this an admission that the god of that bible also exists? Therefore, wouldn't worshiping said devil be the most dangerous risk in the universe?

Also, would "Satan" actually want to be called "Satan"? Wouldn't he rather have his worshipers call him Lord, or at very least his original name of Lucifer?

Sounds like you missed the single most important line in movie:

The Satanic cultists are about to sacrifice the baby. Piper is convinced: "They can do it! They've found a way to bring Hell to Earth!"

THE ACCOUNTANT: Let me let you in on a little secret, Miss. The Dark Lord . . . Satan . . . Beelzebub . . . Lucifer . . . he's really just the warden of a very large prison. He's a quiet man, actually, thoughtful, and he's well-read. And I happen to know that the idea of murdering children in his honor annoys him greatly.

Sitnam
06-14-2011, 12:57 PM
I touched a nerve.

:D


One must know the enemy to fight him.

I READ THE BOOK ROMMEL. I READ HE BOOK. GEN GEORGE S. PATTON.
You know we aren't taking you seriously, right?

CurtC
06-14-2011, 01:43 PM
The number of people Satan kills in the Bible? Ten. The children of Job whom he offs by having a roof fall in on them at dinner, on a bar bet with God that he could get Job to curse God.

And even with Job's family, God told Satan to do it: "The LORD said to Satan, 'Very well, then, everything he has is in your power, but on the man himself do not lay a finger.'"

If you put someone up to a crime, aren't you also culpable when they carry it out?

Czarcasm
06-14-2011, 01:53 PM
And even with Job's family, God told Satan to do it: "The LORD said to Satan, 'Very well, then, everything he has is in your power, but on the man himself do not lay a finger.'"

If you put someone up to a crime, aren't you also culpable when they carry it out?Not if you pay the victim off after the fact, apparently.

BrainGlutton
06-14-2011, 02:02 PM
The real question here is what Satan is, assuming he exists. He is variously and, when you think about it, inconsistently conceived of as:

1) God's dutiful tempter/tester -- the "Shaitan," the "Adversary," more like a prosecuting attorney than the Enemy of Mankind; that's role he plays in Job.

2) The tempter-for-the-sake-of-tempting-and-damning -- that's the role he plays in Faust. This one is the Enemy of Mankind. Why -- why he wants to draw more and more souls into Hell -- is not entirely clear. In Marlowe's Doctor Faustus, Mephistopheles seems to be in love with Faustus and catching his soul is the only way he can think of to consummate his love; but that's rather a special case without broader theological implications; Mephistopheles himself explains his interest, or that of demons in souls generally, in "misery loves company" terms, which might have broader theological implications. In The Screwtape Letters demons are hungry to get souls because souls are their food, but the less said the better of a God Who would set things up that way.

3) God's dutiful jailer/torturer -- simply the warden of a very large prison, Hell. A warden, if his job is secure, ordinarily cares little how many more prisoners will come his way.

4) The Avatar of Evil -- this Satan has to be evil because he is evil, just by definition, like Ahriman in Zoroastrianism. He embodies the principle of evil in the universe. Whatever God loves, he hates, and vice-versa. This at least provides a convenient explanation as to why Satan wants more souls, etc., he's just evil.

5) The Rebel -- The Man Who Would Be King, divine-scale version; that bright angel who durst defy th'Omnipotent to arms, who accounts it better to reign in Hell than serve in Heaven. This is the Satan with whom many humans -- especially Americans -- can really identify.

Which is worth worshiping?

CurtC
06-14-2011, 05:57 PM
Not if you pay the victim off after the fact, apparently.

I guess I was thinking that it was Job's family who were the victims.

But I do like how God makes everything right in the end, by giving Job a new family. "Sorry about all that murdering your family and everything, Job. But here - have a new wife! She's younger and prettier!"

It's as if someone intentionally totals your old junker car and makes up for it by giving you a new one. It's all OK because wives and children are just property.

Recovering Republican
06-15-2011, 07:26 AM
I guess I was thinking that it was Job's family who were the victims.

But I do like how God makes everything right in the end, by giving Job a new family. "Sorry about all that murdering your family and everything, Job. But here - have a new wife! She's younger and prettier!"

It's as if someone intentionally totals your old junker car and makes up for it by giving you a new one. It's all OK because wives and children are just property.

I don't think he got a new wife, I think he got replacement children. In fact, there are passages in the book where he's sitting in a pile of filth and his wife is cursing him out.

Which again, in the context of that time period where they had a 70% infant mortality rate, people probably didn't get that attached to children to start with.

CurtC
06-15-2011, 11:15 AM
Thanks for the correction. I was thinking he had his whole family wiped out.

BrainGlutton
06-15-2011, 11:39 AM
Thanks for the correction. I was thinking he had his whole family wiped out.

He should be so lucky.

CapnPitt
06-15-2011, 11:40 AM
Did pkbites ever get a sufficient answer to this? I got lost in the XXX19 derailing.

BrainGlutton
06-15-2011, 12:16 PM
Did pkbites ever get a sufficient answer to this? I got lost in the XXX19 derailing.

The question was, "If one believes that the devil of the bible exists, isn't this an admission that the god of that bible also exists? Therefore, wouldn't worshiping said devil be the most dangerous risk in the universe?" That might not be an answerable question in any scientific sense, but I daresay it has by now been addressed from every angle conceivable.