How can people live like this!?

[Waxwinged]

So... Yesterday, myself and a couple of other ladies from the animal rescue group we're all a part of, went to save some animals. The place was way in the middle of nowhere, hidden by trees. The place made a junk yard look decent-- trash all over the place, remnants of vehicles and mobile homes, and a regular home that was a toxic hazard on the inside. (Junk to the walls and a layer of animal crap to boot).

There were numberless cats that looked like skeletons with skin over them, crawling with fleas, suffering from eye and respiratory infections. Were any of them fixed? Of course not! There were also a handful of dogs on rather short chains.

The owner was moving out of town and was going to abandon them all, but got talked out of it and contacted us instead. We got out a handful of cats that were deemed 'adoptable'. A couple of the dogs are going to be shipped out to rescues in another part of the state. Most of the animals will be left to die.

From what I understand, such situations are not uncommon out here, and it makes me want to vomit. How can anyone be so irresponsible with animals? So foolish about their own habitation? Is the concept of "don't shit where you eat" unfamiliar to them?

*Headdesks.*

[Otara]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Animal_hoarding

Read about this?

Otara

[Waxwinged]

Yeah. Knowing about it doesn't make the final results any less disturbing, though.

[lieu]

Most of the animals will be left to die.I assume you mean euthanized?

[saje]

Where are you? Please tell me these animals will be taken out of that situation and either be rehabbed or euthanized. Please tell me there are charges pending on the owners?

[Rhythmdvl]

Where are you?



Most of the animals will be left to die.

Sparta?

[Snow Pea]

So... Yesterday, myself and a couple of other ladies from the animal rescue group we're all a part of, went to save some animals.

Do you also say things like "Yesterday myself went to the grocery store"?

[Inner Stickler]

Because that's the important part of the story, here, Snow Pea.

[kaylasdad99]

No, it isn't but it's got the potential to be VERY distracting, which doesn't do the REAL most important part of the story any favors.

Nor does the ambiguously-phrased fragment "left to die."

[Cat Whisperer]

Where are you? Please tell me these animals will be taken out of that situation and either be rehabbed or euthanized. Please tell me there are charges pending on the owners?
Yes, please tell us they will be euthanized - "left to die" sounds like your group just walked away and left the starving cats to continue starving. I'm an animal lover and I would find it very hard to kill an animal, but I'd still find a way to put a bullet in their brains before I'd leave them to starve to death.

[Claire Beauchamp]

Hoarding, whether of animals or inanimate objects, is a mental illness. That's pretty much it. When you are inside the illness, the question of "how can you live like this?" often doesn't make a lot of sense. Or, it does, but the person feels helpless to do anything about it. Easy to look in from the outside and judge, but that's not productive or helpful.

[billfish678]

No, it isn't but it's got the potential to be VERY distracting, which doesn't do the REAL most important part of the story any favors.


I dunno about you, but my brain doesn't go into a tailspin everytime I see errors.

[Inner Stickler]

No, it isn't but it's got the potential to be VERY distracting, which doesn't do the REAL most important part of the story any favors.
Only to people with nothing better to do than play english teacher. Or do you really think people are sitting out there thinking over the story confused as to whether waxwinged was including herself in the group going to the animal hoarder? Answer: no, no one is confused about that.

I will agree that "left to die" is ambiguous.

[Snow Pea]

Only to people with nothing better to do than play english teacher. Or do you really think people are sitting out there thinking over the story confused as to whether waxwinged was including herself in the group going to the animal hoarder? Answer: no, no one is confused about that.



Yourself isn't really a stickler, then?

[Cat Whisperer]

He tries to keep it on the inside. :)

[saje]

Myself wants to get away from the grammatical nitpicking and back to the question of where and in what condition are those animals!

[Really Not All That Bright]

Myself approves of Snow Pea's grammar intervention, and my other self approves of rescuing cats.

[Little Nemo]

I have to wonder to what degree this person considered these animals to be pets.

There used to be a bunch of feral cats at a place I worked. One guy felt sorry for them and began bringing in catfood and feeding them. And of course, learning there was a place where they were fed, a group of cats started accumulating in that area around feeding time.

Now if somebody had come upon this scene, they would have found a couple of dozen cats, many with health problems. And if they decided this guy was their "owner" they would have considered him to be a hoarder and a horrible owner for letting his "pets" exist in such poor condition. But the reality was that the cats were already in poor condition before he came along and he was just making some attempt to help them.

Same thing with the trailer owner. He or she may have started leaving food out for a couple of local strays and never planned on assuming overall responsibility for a pack of animals. Is he really a worse person than the guy in the trailer next door who throws rocks at any stray animal he sees and chases them off his property?

[EmAnJ]

I assume you mean euthanized?

I HOPE you mean euthanized, and not left to suffer.

[Rushgeekgirl]

Where I live the animal shelter won't pick up cats unless someone is bitten so they may very well be left to die.

[purplehorseshoe]

I have to wonder to what degree this person considered these animals to be pets.

There used to be a bunch of feral cats at a place I worked. One guy felt sorry for them and began bringing in catfood and feeding them. And of course, learning there was a place where they were fed, a group of cats started accumulating in that area around feeding time.

Now if somebody had come upon this scene, they would have found a couple of dozen cats, many with health problems. And if they decided this guy was their "owner" they would have considered him to be a hoarder and a horrible owner for letting his "pets" exist in such poor condition. But the reality was that the cats were already in poor condition before he came along and he was just making some attempt to help them.

Same thing with the trailer owner. He or she may have started leaving food out for a couple of local strays and never planned on assuming overall responsibility for a pack of animals. Is he really a worse person than the guy in the trailer next door who throws rocks at any stray animal he sees and chases them off his property?

According to the OP, the dogs were on (short) chains, so, no, as far as the dogs. As for the cats, I'd assume that any cat left outside could at least catch a mouse or sparrow or lizard here and there, so since they were described as walking skeletons, in the sentence just after a description of the interior of the dwelling, I assumed they were indoors.

Trapped. :(

[chiroptera]

I'm also hoping "left to die" is a euphemism for "euthanised."

[jtgain]

Has anyone mentioned that they hope the cats were euthanized instead of left to starve to death? I haven't seen it posted yet.

[Autolycus]

Has anyone mentioned that they hope the cats were euthanized instead of left to starve to death? I haven't seen it posted yet.

Myself and yourself both!

[Jamaika a jamaikaiaké]

Do you also say things like "Yesterday myself went to the grocery store"?

This is completely irrelevant. Just because "Myself went to the store" is ungrammatical does not necessarily imply that "Myself and Jim went to the store" is ungrammatical. In fact, in dialects where the second usage is allowed, the first is still prohibited. And just because you are not familiar with the usage does not make it universally ungrammatical. And even if it were, your nitpicking is a hijack here.

[SeaDragonTattoo]

Um, hello?

Hellooooooooo

Who writes an OP like that and then disappears?

"Left to die" ????? WTF? If a "rescue" did that around here, there would be criminal charges against them as well as the supposed owner if they knowingly left trapped animals to starve. That's what county and state authorities are for, and why they need to be called, so actual rescues with a tiny bit more resources can at least put down the animals that need it.

[flatlined]

I agree that the hijack about grammer is kinda lame. A very good online friend is Polish and one of the smartest people I've ever met. The only time I ever correct him about his typing is when he asks me to, or if what he has typed was so hard to understand that I had to ask him to explain.

To the OP...where are you generally? If you are in the US, I might be able to find other rescue groups to help with the starving animals. There are non-US rescue people here as well. (waves at Kinki and hopes the efforts are still going as well as they could.)

Collectors (which is what we call them here) are usually suffering from a mental disease, much like HoardersI. Collectors keep animals, Hoarders keep stuff. In my experience, and sadly I know way too much about this, Collectors do not move off and leave their animals behind. I doubt that Hoarders nove away from their stuff either.

It takes a special kind of asshole to just move away and leave dogs tied to trees, horses in pens and cats locked up anywhere.

If anyone wants to hear some of the heart breaking stories I have of collectors and animals, I will share if asked. Every time our rescue group has gone in to take/euth animals, law enforcement has been involved because the collector just cannot see how much the animals are suffering.

[flatlined]

Um, hello?

Hellooooooooo

Who writes an OP like that and then disappears?

"Left to die" ????? WTF? If a "rescue" did that around here, there would be criminal charges against them as well as the supposed owner if they knowingly left trapped animals to starve. That's what county and state authorities are for, and why they need to be called, so actual rescues with a tiny bit more resources can at least put down the animals that need it.

Carefully doesn't say the T word. Its possible that the OP is in a different country.

I was proud of my response, btw. Because I just cannot fathom any rescue group who would just leave animals to die. We do this because we love them all. We (rescue groups) don't just walk away from a situation like this. We make phone calls, we get out our traps, we bribe the vet to come to the site and euth them as we bring them out. We don't leave animals to suffer and die.

But this is how we do it here. Things are different in other places.

[Snow Pea]

Just because "Myself went to the store" is ungrammatical does not necessarily imply that "Myself and Jim went to the store" is ungrammatical.

Except that it is.

[straykat23]

I dunno about you, but my brain doesn't go into a tailspin everytime I see errors.

Mine do.

[flatlined]

Mine do.

sighs about the grammer people.

Yes, it is wrong. I tend to just deal with it.

My Polish friend will type "I'll talk to you in a morning" when he means "in the morning"

He will type "does your cats remember you if you came home" which means "did your cats remember you when you got home"

If I only chatted to people who knew proper spelling, grammar and sentence structure, my online world would be badly limited.

Of course, your online experience is different than mine, and what you want is different than what I want. For me, the content is much more important than the mistakes.

[kaylasdad99]

flatlined, I'm sorry, but that's just not the same thing at all. Your Polish-speaking friend is simply having a little trouble with syntax.

Anyone who says "Myself and <other person[s]> [performed action X] " is patently just trying to demonstrate that they're too educated to say "Me and <other person[s]> [performed action X]..."

It's the pedantry overlaid with the error that's so distracting, to me, at least.

I'd love to be familiarized with a dialect where it's not incorrect, Jamaika a jamaikaiaké.

[6ImpossibleThingsB4Breakfast]

Um, hello?

Hellooooooooo

Who writes an OP like that and then disappears?

Obviously one of the dogs that was left to die.

[eulalia]

This is completely irrelevant. Just because "Myself went to the store" is ungrammatical does not necessarily imply that "Myself and Jim went to the store" is ungrammatical. In fact, in dialects where the second usage is allowed, the first is still prohibited. And just because you are not familiar with the usage does not make it universally ungrammatical. And even if it were, your nitpicking is a hijack here.

But it would have been much more interesting if she had said, "I and I."

[friedo]

Only to people with nothing better to do than play english teacher.

"English" is a proper noun.

[Waxwinged]

Who writes an OP like that and then disappears?

My apologies-- it's been a crazy couple of days. Here's an attempt at a logical response, while the coffee's brewing.


I assume you mean euthanized?

No, not euthanized. The couple currently taking care of/cleaning up the place is saying they'll feed them-- even so, with all the health problems, it's not likely that any individual animal in that batch would last more than a couple of years, if that. (For what it's worth, one of the fellow rescue people is going back there tonight to drop off some flea topical and take another look at the remaining dogs.)

Let me outline the scene here.

We are in the middle of nowhere, Appalachia. The area is poor, with low population of people and a very high population of stray/abandoned animals.
There are two rescues in the area, both tiny, and run by retirees. One does catch-spay/neuter-release, and is doing a good job of keeping the stray cats fixed around town. That still leaves the immense, mountainous countryside, and the person doing #1’s trapping only goes out there if she gets contacted by someone who is feeding a stray cat regularly. (Guarantees capture, I guess?)
The second one is an actual pull-from-the-pound rescue, one that deals with abandoned animals, animals that are about to be put down, etc. They are in touch with rescues in more populated areas an hour or more away, and bus some animals out to the latter every week. The ones that can’t be found a better-suited rescue (the vast majority, from non-descript cats that are a dime a dozen around here, to pitbull and hound mixes), end up staying with members locally. This means that everyone in the group who –could- take an animal in had already done so, and some had taken on more than they probably should have. At this point, the group is forced to discriminate as to what animals they take in. As mentioned before, it’s a low-population area with limited possibility for adopting critters out.


Trapped.
To clarify—the cats are outdoor-cats, though they do have access to the house. The feces thing was primarily from a small dog that was kept as indoor-only. With that sort of concentration of cats, I would think that wildlife around there’s pretty wary..

Same thing with the trailer owner. He or she may have started leaving food out for a couple of local strays and never planned on assuming overall responsibility for a pack of animals. Is he really a worse person than the guy in the trailer next door who throws rocks at any stray animal he sees and chases them off his property?
From what I understand, the original owner was taking on kittens/local abandoned animals, but not making much of an effort to take care of them in any way. Or to fix them. Which is something they could’ve done, since most of those cats were tame.


sighs about the grammer people.

There's better things to get RO'd about than grammer. ;) For what it's worth, English is my second language, and 've never gotten some gramm-er-tical things down.


I was proud of my response, btw. Because I just cannot fathom any rescue group who would just leave animals to die. We do this because we love them all. We (rescue groups) don't just walk away from a situation like this. We make phone calls, we get out our traps, we bribe the vet to come to the site and euth them as we bring them out. We don't leave animals to suffer and die.

I know it sounds awful to leave the animals in that parasite-infested place, but at least the present caretakers are promising to feed them. That's a lot more than most cats in the area could brag about.


Flatlined

Please do share your stories. I don't think most people realize how common these situations are.


Moral of the story: Animal hoarders suck. Adopt an adult nondescript tabby kitty today!

[Waxwinged]

Missed the edit window:
I don't think I can properly explain the severity of the problem to someone living in a city. Heck, back when I lived in a 70k-sized-place, there was a number of strays-- but they'd get picked up by animal control, or taken in by someone in need of a pet, or killed by a car within a few days. Out here, there's a lot of wilderness. So cats stick around, multiply, kittens go feral. Heck, we live 5 minutes from the center of town, and see about 6 different cats on a regular basis. None have collars (Collar!? On a cat? Around here? Not bloody likely!), all but one (who realized he could mooch off of us, and is in the process of being converted to a lap-cat) are feral. There's an actual feral cat -colony- at the nearby grocery store, with about 8 adult cats that are fixed, and a handful of kittens that Org #1's in the process of trapping. Did I mention that this store is within walking distance, and none of those 8 are the 6 we see regularly?

[lieu]

"No, not euthanized. The couple currently taking care of/cleaning up the place is saying they'll feed them-- even so, with all the health problems, it's not likely that any individual animal in that batch would last more than a couple of years, if that. "

That's what we were looking for, Waxwinged, some indication the ones worst off weren't simply being left to die on their own through starvation or whatever. Thanks for making the resolution clear and, of course, most of all for what you and your friends have done. Yours is indeed an admirable effort.

[Jamaika a jamaikaiaké]

I'd love to be familiarized with a dialect where it's not incorrect, Jamaika a jamaikaiaké.

Upon further consideration, I retract my claim that it is grammatical. I agree that it stems from a hypercorrection (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hypercorrection), and even though I don't have a problem with it, I'm not willing to defend such a claim.

However:

Except that it is.

This makes no sense as a response to the sentence you quoted. Also, I still stand by that sentence. The ungrammaticality of the one phrase doesn't directly imply the ungrammaticality of the other.

[Darth Panda]

Myself can beat up yourself.

[saje]

Waxwinged, I know a bit about what you face there, as I currently live in semi-rural TN and have spent many years in extremely out-there northern Maine. Where I live is becoming suburbs, but we are surrounded by surprisingly backwoods areas, and though the area is becoming more citified, old habits die hard. One of those old habits is taking in animals on a whim, and then spending as little money as possible on them, allowing them to fend for themselves for the most part. It's incredibly frustrating and sad. I wish people who struggle to make ends meet for themselves and their kids would not add animals into the mix, but at the same time I can't fault people for wanting an animal in their lives, and doing the best they can (from they way they were taught) to care for them.

I hope somebody can keep half an eye on those folks, and make sure the critters left are at least being fed and have shelter for the winter.

[KinkiNipponTourist]

Waxwinged, thank you so much for what you do. I live in Japan (hiya flatlined! when you coming to visit, honey?) and am doing volunteer work with animals displaced after the earthquake and tsunami that hit us back in March.

Basically, animal shelters don't exist here. I'd tell stories, but I end up on long crying jags, so I'll spare you that.

Something I've noticed after the disaster here is that people get into OMG!CRISIS!!! mode, and can't get out. So they spend more effort going and trying to rescue every single animal they find--admirable in itself--but spend less effort taking care of that animal once it's been rescued. So you end up with traumatized cats basically living in cages for weeks, if not longer. No play time, no socialization time, no exercise. Some cats were feral, others were pets--but this situation does neither any favors. They're warm and fed, but quality of life otherwise is pretty poor.

People start with the best of intentions, but things quickly spin out of control. If you have limited resources, like in your situation, sometimes it's better to leave cats who can take care of themselves, and do what you can for those who can't. It's not an easy thing though, is it?

Anyway, I'm glad to hear your story and hang out with you and flatlined here. Take care.

[Any Other Name]

It's not just rural areas where animal control and animal shelters won't help with cats and hoarders. My daughter was involved in a case where a relative living in a house had accumulated 20 some cats. They had been fed but not cared for, and the building was a disaster.

Animal control would not come unless one of the cats had bitten someone. My daughter and her husband captured many. They found that each shelter would only take 1,2, or 3 cats. They drove all over distributing cats to various shelters.

The remaining cats were picked up by animal control after my son-in law was bitten by one of the cats. A series of painful rabies shots were required.

This was in New York City. I would not have expected that city-run shelters would refuse cats.

No one was interested in taking action against the hoarder.

[Cat Whisperer]

Well, that all just sucks. I hate to think of animals suffering, but I guess you can't save all of them.

[YogSosoth]

Basically, animal shelters don't exist here. I'd tell stories, but I end up on long crying jags, so I'll spare you that.


Sorry, but I'm curious about this statement. Do you mean that animal shelters don't exist in Japan or that they don't exist due to the earthquake and tsunami? I can't imagine a rich, first world nation not having shelters for animals. What do they do with the strays?

[purplehorseshoe]

...Animal control would not come unless one of the cats had bitten someone. . .

The remaining cats were picked up by animal control after my son-in law was bitten by one of the cats...

<black humor hat> That was easy-peasy. Problem solved itself. </black humor hat>

I didn't know shelters had a limit like that. What happens if you find a litter of four kittens?

[KinkiNipponTourist]

Sorry, but I'm curious about this statement. Do you mean that animal shelters don't exist in Japan or that they don't exist due to the earthquake and tsunami? I can't imagine a rich, first world nation not having shelters for animals. What do they do with the strays?

Shelters don't exist here, period. All we have is animal control, where animals are gassed after a short period. Strays? The official policy is "don't feed them." That's it. One ward of Tokyo has actually made feeding stray cats subject to penalties.

After the tsunami, we went to visit a guy running a makeshift shelter--his people would sneak into the zone (the area around the nuclear power plant, where the government forcibly kept residents out), rescue stray dogs, and treat/feed them, post pics online for owners to see, etc. He would only allow us to visit on the condition that we tell not make his location public. Why? I asked. Because people will fucking load up their animals and dump them here, he replied.

Strays are routinely dumped. My cats were discovered in a cardboard box left in front of a convenience store some 3 years ago. Traditionally, litters of kittens are often left at temples/outside of vets' offices/dumped in the river/passed along to research centers.

[YogSosoth]

Shelters don't exist here, period. All we have is animal control, where animals are gassed after a short period. Strays? The official policy is "don't feed them." That's it. One ward of Tokyo has actually made feeding stray cats subject to penalties.

After the tsunami, we went to visit a guy running a makeshift shelter--his people would sneak into the zone (the area around the nuclear power plant, where the government forcibly kept residents out), rescue stray dogs, and treat/feed them, post pics online for owners to see, etc. He would only allow us to visit on the condition that we tell not make his location public. Why? I asked. Because people will fucking load up their animals and dump them here, he replied.

Strays are routinely dumped. My cats were discovered in a cardboard box left in front of a convenience store some 3 years ago. Traditionally, litters of kittens are often left at temples/outside of vets' offices/dumped in the river/passed along to research centers.

Hmm, never knew that about Japan. That's kind of messed up, considering their reverence of Hello Kitty and tentacle porn. I guess if she didn't have a job as a mascot they'd gas her too

[flatlined]

Who writes an OP like that and then disappears?

My apologies-- it's been a crazy couple of days. Here's an attempt at a logical response, while the coffee's brewing.


I assume you mean euthanized?

No, not euthanized. The couple currently taking care of/cleaning up the place is saying they'll feed them-- even so, with all the health problems, it's not likely that any individual animal in that batch would last more than a couple of years, if that.

I'm having to type with kittens on hands, please forgive my bad coding.

Thank you for the update. Sick feral cats don't live long, but they do breed. The heartbreaking thing is that the poor kittens will suffer before they die. I have hand caught feral kittens in the past. Their eyes were swollen and covered with gunk, eyelids half way sealed closed. 3 or 4 months old and they couldn't run away from me because they were so sick. Its heartbreaking.

If you had more traps/money, could your group manage to have them euthed? From what you have said, vets are probably also in short supply.

To clarify—the cats are outdoor-cats, though they do have access to the house. The feces thing was primarily from a small dog that was kept as indoor-only. With that sort of concentration of cats, I would think that wildlife around there’s pretty wary..

Sick cats are not very good hunters. My colony is healthy and fixed and well fed. I often see Steve (the alpha cat) hanging out about a half a mile away when I drive home. Steve manages to get to the feeding station at dinner time, it takes him less than half an hour to get there. Sick cats can't cover that much territory.

I know it sounds awful to leave the animals in that parasite-infested place, but at least the present caretakers are promising to feed them. That's a lot more than most cats in the area could brag about.

You are trying. You are doing your best. We have to do triage. It sucks. We aren't just rescuing one cat at a time, we are doing the best we can for all of them and sometimes we just have to make heartbreaking choices.

Thank you. Offers you a sloppy biker hug for your efforts and the hurt in your heart.

Moral of the story: Animal hoarders suck. Adopt an adult nondescript tabby kitty today![/QUOTE]

I totally agree with you here.

One of those old habits is taking in animals on a whim, and then spending as little money as possible on them, allowing them to fend for themselves for the most part. It's incredibly frustrating and sad. I wish people who struggle to make ends meet for themselves and their kids would not add animals into the mix, but at the same time I can't fault people for wanting an animal in their lives, and doing the best they can (from they way they were taught) to care for them.

word. I so want to bitch slap people who call us and say that they got a kitten from a parking lot for their kids and now have kittens and kittens and more kittens because they couldn't afford 30 bucks to have their female fixed. The people who say they did it so their kids would be able to "witness the miracle of birth" have a special place in hell in my mind.

It's not just rural areas where animal control and animal shelters won't help with cats and hoarders. My daughter was involved in a case where a relative living in a house had accumulated 20 some cats. They had been fed but not cared for, and the building was a disaster.

Please tell your daughter thank you for me. I know how bad that was. I know how hard that was. There is nothing worse than finding the collector's house by smelling it from the road.

Once of the places we cleaned out had cats in the walls. They had peed and clawed up the drywall so much that they made holes and climbed into the walls and peed. They also peed on the bed that the woman was sleeping in.

I'm pretty good with pee. I can tell the difference from the smell if its human, cat, dog or equine poop and pee just from the stench. I've been involved in rescue over 12 years. (OMG, I'm getting so old). When I walked into that house, I puked into my carrier. I don't know why I bothered to use the carrier because nobody would have noticed the mess on the layer of cat poop and puke.

The woman who owned the house moved out and bought another house. Which she filled with cats. The house we cleaned out was torn down because it couldn't be fixed. I've drove by the new house, its is very pretty from the outside, this woman has lots of money. I could smell the cat pee with my windows rolled up.

No one was interested in taking action against the hoarder.

The only reason Law Enforcement gets involved with hoarders here is because us rescue people get noisy. It really ticks us off that the neighbors don't complain because "they don't want to get involved".

Kinki, this post is getting tldr, so I'm going to not quote you and just say that I understand your tears.

Waxwinged, I second everything Kinki said. Thank you so much.