Why limited sales of Girl Scout cookies?

[tdn]

I saw this on TV recently, but now can't remember it.

Why do Girl Scouts only sell cookies at certain times of the year?

[robert_columbia]

<I removed the stupid joke>

Anyway...

Might it be tied to the fundraising cycle?

[tdn]

It definitely is, but why is fundraising a cycle?

[Batfish]

The same reason McRib and Arby-Q only come out occasionally. If they were available all the time no one would think they were special.

Selling goods for fundraising depends on selling mediocre product at premium price.

[tdn]

That makes sense. Basic supply and demand.

[kenobi 65]

Perhaps they believe that the enforced scarcity improves demand. If Thin Mints were available every day, would they be as desired?

Keep in mind that the sales of Girl Scout cookies are done by the individual troops, which means that the girls (and their parents) are responsible for selling the cookies. That's probably not something that you can expect to ask them to do on a continuous basis. And, in many cases, they're probably also doing other fundraiser sales at some point in the year for their schools, their soccer teams, etc.

[FatBaldGuy]

If your friendly neighborhood Girl Scout knocked on your door once a week, or even once a month, how long would it take for you to swear never to buy another Girl Scout cookie?

[tdn]

Keep in mind that the sales of Girl Scout cookies are done by the individual troops, which means that the girls (and their parents) are responsible for selling the cookies.

Yes, I remember hearing that. They also price them that way. I've paid as little as $3 and as much as $6 for a box. There is a 6 month window in which they can be sold, but I think I've only ever seen them in March-ish around here.

[SmartAlecCat]

The same reason McRib and Arby-Q only come out occasionally.

Here's a pretty interesting analysis of McRib availability, including a graph of pork prices vs. McRib availability: http://www.theawl.com/2011/11/a-conspiracy-of-hogs-the-mcrib-as-arbitrage

[dotchan]

I wonder if they timing the sales to coincide around vacation days and/or to avoid inclement weather in certain climates. Unfortunately I only have very fuzzy memories from my days as a Brownie and don't recollect whether or not we ever went door to door in the winter--I lived in Ann Arbor then, and though I loved to play in the snow as much as the next kid I still preferred to stay indoors, especially from January to March-ish.

[Q.N. Jones]

Long-time Girl Scout volunteer here, and involved in business operations. Short answer: it's complicated.

Long answer:

Most councils rely heavily on cookie sales for their fundraising (like 70-80% of revenue). They can't afford to lose that revenue source. We already get a lot of negative feedback from the volunteers and public that it isn't right that salaries and operations are largely funded by an army of child labor.

Mostly we can keep that complaint tamped down because it's only 4-6 weeks a year. Some places sell twice per year, and with that second sale comes an increase in complaints. I believe there is a tipping point at which we would start to see negative press, volunteer burn-out, and boycotts of cookie sales.

We could go to direct sales and cut out the girls, but girls and troops earn part of the value of every box they sell. That money helps fund camp fees and lets leaders pay for activities. Sure, we could still distribute part of the cookie revenue directly to girls, but it would probably be allocated very differently. Either all girls would get some money, or it would be concentrated into paying for some needy girls to go to camp, etc. Girls would lose the ability to determine their own fate re: how much they could pay their own camp fees.

[tdn]

I wonder if they timing the sales to coincide around vacation days and/or to avoid inclement weather in certain climates.

I seem to recall that the sales window is from October to March or something like that. So I don't think it's the weather. But they are in school during those months.

[tdn]

Thank you, Q.N. Jones. That's not what they said on the TV show that I saw!

[Al Bundy]

Christmas and Easter only come once a year too. Retailers and florists make the bulk of their money on certain holidays. If they tried to have a sale all year long it would not be as successful. I mean they do try to have a continual sale and it is in fact not as profitable. I suspect the same thinking applies to the Girl Scouts. They have an organization whose purpose is other than selling cookies. They can do it successfully if they keep it to once a year when people have decided to gain 10# anyway. They let out their belts and their wallets and purses. Then the girls go back to doing whatever Girl Scouts do.

[Duckster]

It definitely is, but why is fundraising a cycle?

Because if it were a treadmill, you wouldn't get anywhere.

:D

[tdn]

That much is plain.

[Q.N. Jones]

Thank you, Q.N. Jones. That's not what they said on the TV show that I saw!

Who is "they"? If it was a Girl Scout representative...well, they have a PR-friendly way of handling this question. And then there is the reality behind the scenes.

[voguevixen]

Here they set up a table outside the doors of the grocery store. Why? I'm already at the grocery store - if I wanted cookies I'd go inside and buy good ones for half the price.

[Ferret Herder]

Plus Grasshopper cookies are basically a damned close or identical version of Thin Mints, last I tasted, and they're right inside the grocery store. But you're there to buy food anyway, and I suspect the thought is that you'll see the cute little girls putting in time to support their troop, and here it's that limited time of the year again, and so maybe you'll spend some money helping them because you might think it's a good cause.

[tdn]

Who is "they"?

It was the narrator on American Eats, who probably did get that from a rep. It could be that the producers of the show know the deeper reasons, but that's not the sort of thing you hear on shows like that.

[RaftPeople]

Here they set up a table outside the doors of the grocery store. Why? I'm already at the grocery store - if I wanted cookies I'd go inside and buy good ones for half the price.

Which grocery store do you go to that has "good" cookies?

Most of the stores I've been to have a 40 foot aisle full of crappy cookies. I like GS cookies.

[JSexton]

Keebler makes cookies identical to several GS cookies year round, notably Samoas.

[Skald the Rhymer]

Christmas and Easter only come once a year too. Retailers and florists make the bulk of their money on certain holidays. If they tried to have a sale all year long it would not be as successful. I mean they do try to have a continual sale and it is in fact not as profitable. I suspect the same thinking applies to the Girl Scouts. They have an organization whose purpose is other than selling cookies. They can do it successfully if they keep it to once a year when people have decided to gain 10# anyway. They let out their belts and their wallets and purses. Then the girls go back to doing whatever Girl Scouts do.

I don't think Christmas and Easter are good comparisons, as neither was established to make money, but your basic point is correct.

[Oakminster]

Because if it were a treadmill, you wouldn't get anywhere.

:D

What if you had a plane on a giant treadmill?

:D

[doreen]

There's also the issue of adjacent councils. Different councils sell different cookies at somewhat different times of the year , so that while cookies may be sold only for a four week period by a particular council , I can probably get cookies at least six months out of the year. ( I live and work in NYC, and my coworkers could have daughters in at least four different councils) I've never seen cookies sold or delivered between May and September- I suspect both because of the effects of heat on chocolate and because many troops suspend meeting during the summer.

[voguevixen]

Keebler makes cookies identical to several GS cookies year round, notably Samoas.

Exactly. Are Samoas the peanut butter ones? Nutter Butters.

[The Other Waldo Pepper]

Exactly. Are Samoas the peanut butter ones? Nutter Butters.

Samoas are the caramel-coconut ones with chocolate stripes on top and a flat chocolate base underneath.

[Dravin]

The Keebler version of Samoas for those curious: http://www.keebler.com/product-keebler-coconut-dreams-cookies-21913.aspx?category=cookies

[OpalCat]

Plus Grasshopper cookies are basically a damned close or identical version of Thin Mints, last I tasted, and they're right inside the grocery store..

I don't think I've ever seen these and I adore Thin Mints. Do you know who makes them or what the packaging looks like? I need to know if my store carries them! Of course then I won't have to worry about resizing my engagement ring since I'll certainly regain the weight if I have nonstop access to Thin Mints!

[OpalCat]

Exactly. Are Samoas the peanut butter ones? Nutter Butters.

I think the GS peanut butter sandwich cookies taste a bit better than Nutter Butters... but they're close.

[Dravin]

I don't think I've ever seen these and I adore Thin Mints. Do you know who makes them or what the packaging looks like? I need to know if my store carries them! Of course then I won't have to worry about resizing my engagement ring since I'll certainly regain the weight if I have nonstop access to Thin Mints!

http://www.keebler.com/WhereToBuy.aspx?product=1124&brand=160

[obfusciatrist]

Which grocery store do you go to that has "good" cookies?

If you like Girl Scout cookies, then all of them? There's nothing magical about Girl Scout cookies, they're the same quality of any other food product that is manufactured in quantities best quantified in scientific notation.

I refuse to buy Girl Scout cookies because I don't want to teach young girls that is ok to prostitute their cuteness for financial gain. (And I only really like the peanut butter ones and I shouldn't eat them in the quantity in which they're sold.)

[OpalCat]

http://www.keebler.com/WhereToBuy.aspx?product=1124&brand=160

Ooooh that says they're available at the grocery store that I typically go to. Now to find them among the 5 million other cookies...

[SnakesCatLady]

*snip*

I refuse to buy Girl Scout cookies because I don't want to teach young girls that is ok to prostitute their cuteness for financial gain. (And I only really like the peanut butter ones and I shouldn't eat them in the quantity in which they're sold.)

It depends on how you look at it. I think it's a good idea that children should learn things they want have to be paid for, and helping to contribute to things they want is positive.

[Skammer]

I don't think I've ever seen these and I adore Thin Mints. Do you know who makes them or what the packaging looks like? I need to know if my store carries them! Of course then I won't have to worry about resizing my engagement ring since I'll certainly regain the weight if I have nonstop access to Thin Mints!
Dollar General sells thin mint cookies as well as other Girl Scout Cookie clones under their "Clover Valley" label. I can't tell the difference.

[Hail Ants]

If you like Girl Scout cookies, then all of them? There's nothing magical about Girl Scout cookies, they're the same quality of any other food product that is manufactured in quantities best quantified in scientific notation.

I refuse to buy Girl Scout cookies because I don't want to teach young girls that is ok to prostitute their cuteness for financial gain. (And I only really like the peanut butter ones and I shouldn't eat them in the quantity in which they're sold.)"...prostitute their cuteness for financial gain." ?!? - Geez, what are you, a femi-nazi? :D

Selling the cookies teaches girls about economics (supply & demand is a good thing) as well as group participation, teamwork, charity, effort and reward etc. It also lets them go out into the world and meet and interact with new & different people. You know, it builds character, helps to make them a well-rounded person? Kinda the whole point of Girl Scouts in general?

I'm the most cynical, sarcastic guy imaginable but even I know this!

And what's with everyone down on the quality of Girl Scout cookies?! I used to buy a bunch every year from my co-workers daughters and Girl Scout cookies are most definitely not generic, "Jim's Kookies" fair. They've always been top-tier quality, akin to Oreos™ or Chips Ahoy™!

Its win-win: The girls get money for supplies, and because you're essentially donating to charity you get to not feel too guilty about buying a case of something that you'd probably never normally fill your shopping cart with (even once a year)!

[obfusciatrist]

"...prostitute their cuteness for financial gain." ?!? - Geez, what are you, a femi-nazi? :D

That's just me saying things to shock my wife, though if it would sell more cookies I'm pretty sure they'd use puppies trained to bark something that sounds like "would you like to buy some cookies" instead of 8-year-olds in pig tails. I don't buy the cookies because I really shouldn't eat the cookies.

Kinda the whole point of Girl Scouts in general?

I thought the whole point was for parents to be able to get all their kids out of the house some weekends a year.


They've always been top-tier quality, akin to Oreos™ or Chips Ahoy™!

I agree that they're just as good as Oreos or Chips Ahoy. I disagree that this is a particularly high bar of quality. It's not a great sign when people buy enough of your baked good product to last the year until the next time they can buy.

[MsRobyn]

At the risk of pointing out the obvious, selling stuff to raise money is a time-honored tradition. Most youth organizations want as many kids to participate as possible, so they charge dues that are nominal. The sprog's soccer league, for example, charges YMCA members $60 for the season. This covers the salary of the coordinators/trainers, some of the equipment, and some of the field maintenance. (They have their own private fields and full-time coordinators/trainers.) If you can't afford the $60 and want your kids to play soccer, they'll work something out. They also have a fundraiser to keep the fee at $60. When Airman and I looked at the Cub Scouts, the dues for each pack were a few dollars per week, but they all sell aggressively. (This was a turn-off for us, for reasons I'll get to shortly. Fortunately, the sprog did not yen to be a Cub Scout, so that spared us all a lot of grief.)

That being said, constant sales of any product by any group burns a lot of goodwill from parents, family and friends. Parents bear the brunt of most sales efforts; they're expected to bring the order sheets and catalogs to work, approach family and friends, collect money, pick up and distribute the stuff when it's delivered, and generally manage the whole shebang. The sprog's room mother has three kids who are in different activities, some of which are supported entirely or partly by sales of stuff. There have been years when her kids were selling something pretty much all of the time. (That the children's fundraising season generally runs concurrent with the school year all but guarantees that this can happen.) When you've got three kids selling (some groups that have siblings as members require each sibling to sell separately), and parents have to manage so many campaigns, they get pissed off because it's their time and energy. One local group increased its sales activities for one reason or another and lost members because the parents weren't willing to spend that time and energy on something that really wasn't essential. (ISTR it was a church-related group.)

Most groups also work with a small handful of companies that handle children's fundraising, so the product selection is limited to candy and snack foods, frozen pizza and cookie dough, magazine subscriptions, and wrapping paper and other "gift" items. There is only so much wrapping paper or even Girl Scout cookies that one person can buy, and when you're inundated with requests to buy stuff for this activity or that troop, you learn to say no, or you buy from everyone at the risk of alienating someone, or you wind up with Very Bad situations where the boss uses his position to force his subordinates to buy stuff from his kids.

From a business standpoint, the Girl Scouts have a winning model. They offer a unique product that most people know and like, that product is strongly identified with that organization, and there are multiple sales channels, including the possibility for an impulse buy if you encounter a table at a supermarket; if you don't know any Girl Scouts, you can still buy cookies from a local troop. That they only sell this product a few weeks out of the year increases its desirability, because people will buy a lot of cookies knowing they won't be able to get them year-round. Finally, there is some transparency in terms of where the money goes, at least at the local level.

And this is a biggie right here: The GSUSA and local councils are tax-exempt organizations and are subject to limitations on their sales at the state and federal levels to make sure they can keep that status. In Pennsylvania (http://www.fundraisetaxlaw.org/pa.html), for example, 503(c)(3) groups, which includes the Scouts, are only allowed to sell for a total of seven days before they have to pay taxes on their sales. (The local troops aren't the ones that pay taxes; this is generally covered either by a higher level of the organization or the distributor.) At the federal level, there is often a fine line between a 503(c)(3) group and a business, and the Girl Scouts have to make sure they toe that line. Limiting the period when cookies are sold is one way of toeing that line.

[obfusciatrist]

Parents bear the brunt of most sales efforts; they're expected to bring the order sheets and catalogs to work, approach family and friends, collect money, pick up and distribute the stuff when it's delivered, and generally manage the whole shebang.

That's something I wonder about, did things change or was my experience as a kid atypical?

There were always a lucky few kids in class who had a parent that would sell for them at work but that was the exception (and we hated them for it because it meant we had no chance at the good prizes). When we kids had a fundraiser, we kids were expected to go out and raise the funds. We went door to door, without parents in tow. We had to go in and ask a store manager if it was ok for us to sit outside and then we did it, sans parents.

Now, the closest I come to a kid trying to sell me something is

<mom whispering in the background>Ask him if he wants to buy cookies.
<kid>Do you want to buy cookies.

And often the only person at the cookie table are the adults while the kids are messing around nearby shouting out '"cookies".


So was this unusual (grew up in the '80s) or is that all a fatality of the recent discovery that if a child is ever out of direct line of sight of an adult they turn to dust and blow away?

[Lasciel]

That's something I wonder about, did things change or was my experience as a kid atypical?



So was this unusual (grew up in the '80s) or is that all a fatality of the recent discovery that if a child is ever out of direct line of sight of an adult they turn to dust and blow away?

(snipped)

Thanks for the laugh! With permission, totally going to steal that line.

In seriousness, I think it's because it's actually easier for the parents to do it themselves. I know it's counterintuitive, but when the kids are really involved, the parent still has to oversee the kid's progress, make sure everything is done properly, nag the kid to actually participate to the desired level, and deal with all the stress from the kid as well as managing all the actual product sales and distribution.

I bet there's also a certain expectation of levels of sales that parents are made very aware of, so the parent can't just let Junior slack off, because Mom will hear about it from the other parents for the rest of her days in that organization. So, the easiest thing to cut out of that whole stressful process is the kid. I think that it's pretty easy to go from "helping" to "doing it myself because if he/she does it he/she'll mess up and then I'll have to re-do it anyway."

[MsRobyn]

Things have changed since you and I were kids. Kids are now strongly discouraged from going door-to-door for "safety reasons", so parents are now being encouraged to bring this stuff to work. Although if a kid was ever kidnapped while going door-to-door, it's news to me.

[boozilu]

Regarding the involvement of parents, it varies by troop. Our Cookie Booths (sales outside the grocery store) are manned by the girls -- they do all of the interaction with customers including making change, with a pair of adults on hand to supervise. The girls also set goals for how to spend the money (camping and activities) and donate part of the proceeds to charity.

We have a few girls whose parents sell a bunch at work, but all girls get involved at some point. It's been great for our girls who are very shy -- it's wonderful to see them open up.

But we couldn't do it all year long. We have at least one meeting reviewing etiquette, safety, picking a charity, setting goals, making signs, etc. for cookie season. The rest of the year we are learning to swordfight, doing service projects, learning pet care, making up plays, camping, going to the zoo, canoeing, attending singalongs, etc.

PS -- our girls are 8!

[Dewey Finn]

Most groups also work with a small handful of companies that handle children's fundraising, so the product selection is limited to candy and snack foods, frozen pizza and cookie dough, magazine subscriptions, and wrapping paper and other "gift" items.
This is one part that I don't like. Sometimes it seems like the fundraising company is taking the majority of the profit and the children and their customers are a captive audience. If, for example, the children are selling candy, perhaps it would be cheaper to buy in bulk from Costco instead of the fundraising company.

[doreen]

This is one part that I don't like. Sometimes it seems like the fundraising company is taking the majority of the profit and the children and their customers are a captive audience. If, for example, the children are selling candy, perhaps it would be cheaper to buy in bulk from Costco instead of the fundraising company.

First off, I absolutely hated fundraising. Every year, I was one of the parents who just wanted to give the $20 profit to the school instead of selling the box of candy. That said, there's a cheaper source for nearly all of the fundraising items , but those cheaper sources don't always work well as fundraisers. For example, when my kids were in school , they sold candy bars. Each child received a box with 40 $1 bars of candy, and each child had to turn in $40 to get another box or at the end of the sale. Any unsold boxes went back to the fundraising company. At my kids' school, it would have been a nightmare keeping track of who got how many bars if the candy was bought in bulk at Costco - someone would no doubt be claiming they got only four ten-bar packages, not five.There was also a wrapping paper/gift sale. I know I can buy wrapping paper/ cheap gifts for less than those catalogs. What I don't know is a place with a consistent enough selection to allow me to take orders in advance and you can't send that stuff home with the kids as easily as you can send the boxes of candy. You can buy from a cheaper source, and hold a sale at the school, but now you've limited your customer base ,need to find parents who will commit a few hours at a specified time to running the sale and run the risk of having unsold merchandise.

I've been involved in just about every sort of fundraiser imaginable- everything from car washes and popcorn/candy sales to raffles that sell only 250 tickets at $100 each and Bingo games with bags of groceries for prizes. Girls Scout cookies was the easiest by far. They sell themselves. My daughter is 22 years old and hasn't been a Girl Scout for nearly 10 years but my coworkers still call me looking to buy cookies