PDA

View Full Version : a fragmented music scene


Acco40
08-29-2001, 11:33 AM
What is the next big sound?

Currently, I'm looking around and I hear a latin-type sound a la Ricky Martin, boy-band supergroups, and a hard metal sound.

Radio sucks. (Where's the middle ground?)

Well, I'll tell you straight out I have never been particularly fond of any of the above. I'm ready for a new rise in "alternative" (read as: not the new Creed album), but a true alternative from the banal drivel that currently pollutes our airwaves.

Recently, and not so recently, I've discovered Air, Sigor Ros, Radiohead, and others. I (did) like the alternative rock of the early to mid-90's, too.

So anyone think they can nail the next big sound, or is it dancing monkey-boys for some time to come?


___________________

Cranky is a goddess here too? Greedy greedy, she.

bdgr
08-29-2001, 11:44 AM
Im working on starting a new band thats kinda of a mix between the talking heads, the allman brothers, and parliment.....


It'll be the next big thing really....


Now if I can just find some lyrics.....

pezpunk
08-29-2001, 11:50 AM
one word,

EMO

Acco40
08-29-2001, 11:53 AM
bdgr:

Cool! And I can play the turntable! Apparently, it's a musical instrument now.

Wink wink, dalovin'dj...

Acco40
08-29-2001, 11:57 AM
pezpunk:

Electric Light Orchestra is the next big thing? Oh, wait. That would be ELO. Sorry.

What is EMO?

Ethilrist
08-29-2001, 12:07 PM
Emo Phillips. Very goofy comedian.

pezpunk
08-29-2001, 12:17 PM
okay apparently it required more than one word :)


emo - short for "emotional." Emo is a broad title that covers a lot of different styles of emotionally-charged punk rock.


Quote above is from this (http://www.fourfa.com) site. The recent interest in bands like The get up kids, Hot Water Music, and the promise ring. Make EMO a very strong candidate for "the next big thing". I think bands like blink 182 and sum 41 hitting it big is heading us into a direction for harder more aggressive music.

Totoro
08-29-2001, 12:23 PM
Emo? Nah, emo hit it's peak with Weezer. I think the next big thing is going to be...

Really Really Black Metal.

Thats the super charged thing that people will start getting into. Bands like Cradle Of Filth or Dimmu Borgir should become huge.

[side note/hijack]
I just think the idea for Dimmu Borgir is really cool. They're anti-christian, pro-norse gods. Odin RULES!
[/side note/hijack]

black rabbit
08-29-2001, 12:30 PM
Originally posted by pezpunk
one word,

EMO

::shoots self in head::

Now I regret bitching about the Scandanavian Explosion. If this is what we get instead, then, by all means, go Hellacopters!!!

I want my TURBONEGRO back.

pezpunk
08-29-2001, 12:34 PM
Originally posted by Totoro
Emo? Nah, emo hit it's peak with Weezer. I think the next big thing is going to be...


Weezer is not quite the emo I was refering to. They are WAY to overproduced and poppy to be real emo. I think this comparison is like saying that dance music wont be the next big thing because it hit it's height with Ricardo (Rico Suave).

If we HAVE to bring up weezer though, need I remind ya that they have been popular twice now so don't count em out.

Jack Batty
08-29-2001, 12:57 PM
Hey, I actually have a real answer ...

Here is the theory - take whatever type of music is popular at any given time, and the "next big thing" will be it's polar opposite.

We've gone in myriad circles ever since the 70's. From singer-songwriters, to disco, which swung to punk and new wave, to pure pop, to metal and hair bands, to grunge, and into bubble gum. Which is where we seem to be stuck, with the Brittney's and NSYNC's and the Aguilera's and the O-Towns.

So ... my prediction is ... Speed Metal/Industrial hybrid.
I can't even really thing what it might sound like, but it will be all over the friggin' place inside of a year. Mark my words.

Acco40
08-29-2001, 01:26 PM
Jack Batty:

I'm not entirely sure that speed metal can ever become mainstream. It'll always be a strong genre of music DGMW, and indeed its popularity may spike again soon... but to overtake the pop gods? I dare not think it so.

No widespread appeal.

I could (and have been) wrong before though.

Case in point:

Two? years ago. College town, walking down the street late on Saturday night. I hear backstreet boys. But not the radio version. I walk up to this house where a party is going on (doors wide open) and there are 4 drunk frat boys standing on top of this table singing loudly to backstreet boys... and get this --- the girls are going for it! They are all over these guys.

I mean, this was possibly the most ridiculous thing I've ever seen in my entire life, yet... it was happening, right there in front of me!

I couldn't believe then. I can't believe it now. So if that type of music could (somehow) become Popular, capital "P" thank you very much, maybe there is hope for death metal yet... I just won't be on that bandwagon, cowboy.

bdgr
08-29-2001, 02:17 PM
Originally posted by Acco40
bdgr:

Cool! And I can play the turntable! Apparently, it's a musical instrument now.

Wink wink, dalovin'dj...

Cool...ya'll in Texas?

Maeglin
08-29-2001, 02:21 PM
So ... my prediction is ... Speed Metal/Industrial hybrid.

I've been waiting for years for industrial to truly make it big.

Not gonna happen. And quite frankly, I like it that way.

23skidoo
08-29-2001, 02:26 PM
Music is kind of like fashion: very few real innovators, mostly just people "polishing up" 15 year old ideas.

Ramones + 15 years = Green Day and Blink 182 on the radio.

Heavy Metal was big around 1985. Nü metal is popular today.

So if my calculations are correct, the "next big thing" will be... lessee... an updating of the synthesizer-heavy "new wave" sound from years gone by. I predict it will be called "Neo-wave".

black rabbit
08-29-2001, 02:42 PM
Originally posted by 23skidoo
I predict it will be called "Neo-wave".

Pretty close:
http://neussubjex.net/feat/neoteric/neoteric.html

HalberMensch242
08-29-2001, 08:32 PM
Omg..we're talkin about EMO..excellent!!!

Here is my input, a lot of the bands in the emo scene have an enormous amount of talent and are liable to take the sound to the mainstream, although some might argue that already happened with bands like Jimmy Eats World and New Found Glory. BUt as most emo fans would tell you, those bands only represent the fringe of the emo movement. My personal faves are Saves The Day, who are an amazing quartet, with a killer singer and some irrestiable tunes. These guys put on one of the best live shows i've ever seen and says alot cause i've seen Rammstein in concert ;). Alkaline Trio is slightly leaning more to the punk side, as far as the vocals and instrumentation goes, but the lyrics and attitude is all emo. These guys might make some commercial headway. Bright Eyes is basically a one man project, and this guy is amazing, poignant lyrics, heart wrenching vocals..totally Emo. So..in conclusion..i'm with pezpunk..Emo shall make its mark!!!

HalberMensch242
08-29-2001, 09:17 PM
Ok..i'll still stand by my statement that Emo will be the next big thing, but "future pop" might make some headway especially in Europe. This a term coined by Ronan from VnV nation, which basically describes bands like COvenant, Apoptygma Berzerk, And One , Mesh, De/Vision, Neuroticfish, Icon of Coil, and VnV Nation(obviously). All these bands have seem to be a hybrid of modern day EBM, synth-pop resonations and strong pop sensibilities. The new VnV album will sell extremly well in the alternative market in europe, that might eventually carry over to the US. So maybe skedoo is right, a synthetic revolution is around the corner.

Junior Spaceman
08-30-2001, 01:44 AM
Originally posted by Totoro
Really Really Black Metal.

Thats the super charged thing that people will start getting into. Bands like Cradle Of Filth or Dimmu Borgir should become huge.
This might have been true eight years ago, but most of the big black metal bands ended up either dead, in prison, or in pink makeup. Most of the mainstream music fans probably think they went as far as you could go when they bought their Marilyn Manson records (coming to a garage sale near you).

On second thoughts, the fact that the music is way past its use-by-date and watered down means that now is probably the time when it will become popular (see Metallica and Pantera for other examples).

It seems the next big thing will be the continued rediscovery of old, neglected music now that there's money to be made by putting it on CD. Here goes - Lee Hazlewood will be bigger than Ricky Martin.

Kyomara
08-30-2001, 04:08 AM
Emo has been exactly where it's going to stay in terms of popularity, and I don't see how it's going to get any bigger. Underground music must by definition change in order to gain mainstream acceptance.

By the way...I have just joined a Japanese emocore band. I can't wait. I'm going to write them all sorts of sensetive weepy little boy lyrics, like an emocore Blondie. How much fun is this going to be?

pezpunk
08-30-2001, 09:37 AM
Originally posted by Kyomara
Emo has been exactly where it's going to stay in terms of popularity, and I don't see how it's going to get any bigger.

Well, I would say that the introduction of bands like Alkaline trio, new found glory, and jimmy eats world to the MTV audience will certainly help! Slowly but surely those bands are becoming pretty damn popular. I agree that emo has always been underground wether it was fugazi and dag nasty until now. Then again, up until 1992 all punk was underground. Green day was unheard of. Nirvana? Who were they? Sonic who?
So I wouldn't could EMO out yet.

For the record I am not a huge emo fan. I like it. I just am placing an opinion about the next trend

bdgr
08-30-2001, 10:07 AM
Originally posted by pezpunk
[B Then again, up until 1992 all punk was underground. Green day was unheard of. [/B]

Real punk still is. Trying playing the exploited or The Dead Kennedys or Bad Brains on main stream radio. Aint gonna happen. I wouldnt exactly call Green Day, or Nirvana punk....Punkish maybe.....(I kinda like green day, and some Nirvana). Bad Brains...Try playing "Pay to cum", or "California, Uber Alles", or "Too Drunk to Fuck" or "Lets Start a War" or "Holiday in Cambodia" on the radio...now thats punk.

pezpunk
08-30-2001, 10:41 AM
Originally posted by bdgr
Originally posted by pezpunk
[B Then again, up until 1992 all punk was underground. Green day was unheard of.

Real punk still is. Trying playing the exploited or The Dead Kennedys or Bad Brains on main stream radio. Aint gonna happen. I wouldnt exactly call Green Day, or Nirvana punk....Punkish maybe.....(I kinda like green day, and some Nirvana). Bad Brains...Try playing "Pay to cum", or "California, Uber Alles", or "Too Drunk to Fuck" or "Lets Start a War" or "Holiday in Cambodia" on the radio...now thats punk. [/B]

ABSOLUTELY! I couldn't agree more! However we are discussing the "next big thing". If the music industry decides to call it punk, then that's what it's called. As far as green day though they had a pretty good run in the punk scene before making it big. Real "Punk" is not neccesarily dead... just resting. In the late seventies when it all began, it made sense. Once comercialism seeped in, it ceased to be "punk". It became style. That's a thread in itself.

bdgr
08-30-2001, 11:05 AM
Originally posted by pezpunk

ABSOLUTELY! I couldn't agree more! However we are discussing the "next big thing". If the music industry decides to call it punk, then that's what it's called. As far as green day though they had a pretty good run in the punk scene before making it big. Real "Punk" is not neccesarily dead... just resting. In the late seventies when it all began, it made sense. Once comercialism seeped in, it ceased to be "punk". It became style. That's a thread in itself. [/B]

Glad to see another lover of the clasics.


What was it Jello said? "Punks not dead it just deserves to die, when it becomes another stale cartoon". from Chicken Shit Conformist.

Kids today, they don't know what real punk is...Why, Back in my day....oh shit, I'm old arent I? How'd that happen? Seems like just yesterday I was sleeping in a burned out house in a big pile of straight edge punks, huddled togeather for warmth, wishing I could find a Hammerskin who wore my size docs so I could get some new boots, and now I find myself working for a defense contractor in a cubicle, listening to California uber alles on mp3 while I worry about how to pay my mortgage and my credit card bills. Damnit all.........This wasnt supposed to happen.....I wanna be young again....at least they let me wear my docs.....

pezpunk
08-30-2001, 11:28 AM
Glad to see that I wasn't the only one who struggled with buying Circle Jerks Group sex on cd! It was so hard to resist when it came with wild in the streets included!!!!

Real "Punk" is somewhat laughable in digital form. It's best on a shitty tape recorded from a friends recording.

Tansu
08-30-2001, 11:47 AM
Originally posted by HenrySpencer
Here goes - Lee Hazlewood will be bigger than Ricky Martin.

I hope so! Lee Hazlewood is brilliant.

bdgr
08-30-2001, 12:00 PM
Originally posted by pezpunk
Glad to see that I wasn't the only one who struggled with buying Circle Jerks Group sex on cd! It was so hard to resist when it came with wild in the streets included!!!!

Real "Punk" is somewhat laughable in digital form. It's best on a shitty tape recorded from a friends recording.

of a friends recording. Remeber when the DKs put out that tape with one side "intentionally left blank for your convienence". I still have my wore out copy of "Bedtime for democracy" on cassette, as well as "Lets start a war"(cant you just feel the love between Jello and Wattie?) and a vinyl version of Never mind the bullocks, and Where were you in 77. I used to "let them eat Jellie Beans" on vinyl,till somebody stole it. If fact, most of my old stuff got ripped off by this psycho chick I let crash at my place(I used to let everybody crash at my place) I bought Never Mind the Bullocks on cd at a pawn shop, because I couldnt stop laughing at the idea of putting the pistols on cd. And I remember seeing Gen X on cd, and saying "whats the fucking point" loud enough to get kicked out of Sound WHorehouse. I mean, Gen x was worthless on vinyl, why go digital.

MrVisible
08-30-2001, 12:09 PM
I have to admit to not caring at all what the next big thing is. Why should anyone care what trend corporate music pushers are going to shove down our throat next? All that'll happen is that they'll pick up a random easily-identifiable subculture, tout it as innovative, flood the airwaves with one good tune and eight jillion crap ripoffs, and then market the hell out of the clothing and accessories associated with the new "movement".

A fragmented music scene is perfect. That's the way it should be. The music out there right now is astonishing. Jets to Brazil. Bright Eyes. Wheat. Low. Mogwai. Radar Bros. Red House Painters. Spinanes. Califone. I'd much rather have a bunch of diverse bands making a living off of their music, than one hyped band gobbling up all the profits of the music scene for a couple of years.

Now that radio is being challenged by the internet, the bands out there have an outlet, a way to reach an international audience that's into them. I think that's what's causing the lack of centralization in the music scene; devoted fans can find a huge variety of music in any style they want, and are no longer limited to the selection available on the radio.

If there's never another "big thing", I'll be a happy man.

pezpunk
08-30-2001, 12:19 PM
Originally posted by bdgr
I mean, Gen x was worthless on vinyl, why go digital.

THAT'S HILARIOUS! I almost brought up Billy Idol as an example of how punk went downnhill when it started to parody itself! I also almost put in the bit about the Dead Kennedy's tape (In god we trust). "bedtime for democracy" is a great album! I haven't heard it in a looooong time?

Could we hijack this thread any more? ;)

MR VISIBLE: JETS TO BRAZIL Best album I have heard in YEARS is Orange Ryhming Dictionary. It has not left my car for at least 2 years. Some of the most beautiful and moving lyrics I have ever heard. Of course you do know that Blake Schwarzenbach, the singer, was the singer/guitarist of Jawbreaker who can easily be considered......... you guessed it............. EMO

BAM! It all comes full circle! :D

erislover
08-30-2001, 12:25 PM
The relative success of Modest Mouse and Sunny Day's return (though they became more indie rock than emo) is hopefully indicative of emo's rising tide ;)

Incidentally, keep up the emo band names if we could as I am no longer in a situation which allows for keeping with the times music-wise.

However, as with all underground--> above ground phenomena I don't doubt that when/if (when, damn it, when!) emo takes the stage all the "old schoolers" will be crying "Sell out!"

I remember what happened to Green Day. I never stopped liking them, and have never been afraid to admit it.

I'm also hoping for girl metal/punk bands, in all their forms, to start kicking girl pop off the stage. Though I shouldn't hold my breath for bikini kill or red aunts to take enter stage, I hope Kitty starts z trend in that.

I want a steel cage match between Spears and any of my girls! :p Winner plays the concert!

pezpunk
08-30-2001, 12:34 PM
Originally posted by erislover

Incidentally, keep up the emo band names if we could as I am no longer in a situation which allows for keeping with the times music-wise.


Sorry to hijack further but I would be remiss not to mention 2 of the best new bands I have heard recently.

Q AND NOT U - On Dischord. Not really emo.
THURSDAY - From my NJ!!! (YAY!) If you like Sunny Day you will LOVE Thursday. They are a harder more straightfoward SDRE.

Last hijack......maybe :)

hmmmmm maybe hijacks should be legal in this forum.....it allows for free flow of thought. This is about art right?

bdgr
08-30-2001, 05:37 PM
Originally posted by pezpunk
[Could we hijack this thread any more? ;)
[/B]

I bet we could. did you ever listen to the Prarie Home Invasion, with Jello, and Mojo Nixon. Great stuff. I also have almost all of Jello's spoken word cds. The man is either brilliant, or seriously disturbed. I havent figured out which. Anyway, one of the spoken word talks a lot about his run in with Tipper and crowd, and how they tried to prosecute him for including H.R. Giegers painting in Frankenchrist. I love the part were the wanna arrest Gieger for obscenity, and they ask Jello where they can find him.

Kyomara
08-30-2001, 10:16 PM
any underground sound has to be cleaned up and packaged right to be the next big thing. The question is whether it is still what it used to be once it has been processed for mass consumption. I have no issues at all with selling out...well, a few maybe, but not to the point that I would put someone down for it. But what I'm getting at is the fact that, for example, Green Day is pop in a punk vein, but not really punk rock. Their roots are in the right place, but some changes had to take place before that type of music was widely accepted.

If Modest Mouse becomes increasingly popular by changing their sound, are they still emo? In fact, were they ever emo?

And now I have sufficiently confused myself with my own bullshit rhetoric. How great is this? Feel free to disregard me.

rackensack
08-30-2001, 11:02 PM
Originally posted by bdgr
Seems like just yesterday I was sleeping in a burned out house in a big pile of straight edge punks, huddled togeather for warmth, wishing I could find a Hammerskin who wore my size docs so I could get some new boots, and now I find myself working for a defense contractor in a cubicle, listening to California uber alles on mp3 while I worry about how to pay my mortgage and my credit card bills.

Or as Joe Strummer put it:

But I believe in this and it's been tested by research
That he who fucks nuns will later join the church . . .
--"Death or Glory", The Clash

HP Ellison
08-31-2001, 12:35 AM
Emo probably will become the next big thing; it seems to successfully bridge the gap between boybands and punk, both of which seem to be rather popular. Sorry to any emo fans; I don't really have anything against it, but from what I've experienced, the songs seem to basically be about unrequitted love set to loud abrasive guitars. Sure, there are some good emo bands out there; Weezer (yes, weezer IS emo), and Last Great Liar. I agree with the black metal, too. First it was Korn, but then they became far too popular and sold out. So then the fans migrated to Limp Bizkit, but then they had a song on the Mission:Impossible soundtrack, and that was it for them. Now it seems to be Slipknot. Slowly but surely, they're making their way to My Dying Bride. Hell, maybe even The Swans will become popular some day!

black rabbit
08-31-2001, 12:49 AM
I doubt any ICP-type band will every become popular... everybody hates the juggalo kids too much. I almost admire them...

Acco40
08-31-2001, 07:53 AM
Originally posted by pezpunk:

Could we hijack this thread any more?

You guys aren't hijacking. I'm just sittin' back enjoying the conversation.

I had never heard of emo before so, I'm that much better off already! I'm gonna check it out.

pezpunk
08-31-2001, 08:33 AM
Originally posted by HP Ellison
Sorry to any emo fans; I don't really have anything against it, but from what I've experienced, the songs seem to basically be about unrequitted love set to loud abrasive guitars.

If you are interested, you may want to check out Hot Water Music. They aren't sappy in the least. Small Brown Bike is a good one too but only their first album "our own wars".

So...... anyone think Krishnacore has a chance of seeing any popularity?

Maeglin
08-31-2001, 08:58 AM
Would any of the emo experts qualify Vast for me? A friend of mine is really into them, and even jaded ol me finds the first album really compelling.

Too bad the second one blew....

erislover
08-31-2001, 10:18 AM
When I think Emo I think Promise Ring, Cap'n Jazz (GOD their anathology album is awesome), Sunny Day's "diary" and the pink album, Modest Mouse (sorry, I only actually own the Lonesome Crowded West but his singing style and the loud/soft pattern kinds signifies emo to me).

I don't think emo is all about sappy punk love songs. I think of it more like poetic angst... what new goth would be if it were cool. I think emo carried on the tradition of early Bauhaus style-stuff, but decidedly edgier, while what people today call goth seem more like a fetishists' version of bad metal.

A Cap'n Jazz song that always sorta does it for me states, "When I fly and look down, I'd swear that's not me." Your standard disconnected, ostracized, but decidedly not-violent sorta thing. Ghandi would like emo.

HalberMensch242
08-31-2001, 10:38 AM
Originally posted by Maeglin
Would any of the emo experts qualify Vast for me? A friend of mine is really into them, and even jaded ol me finds the first album really compelling.

Too bad the second one blew....

VAST..emo?! Me thinks not, although i myself was a huge fan of their 1st album, they are a far cry from emo. VAST is more in the alternative/pseudo-industrial/esoteric catagory.

Hell, maybe even The Swans will become popular some day!

Haha..oh man..would these happen at same time as Coil produces an NSYNC slbum? :)

bdgr
08-31-2001, 03:58 PM
Originally posted by rackensack
Originally posted by bdgr
Seems like just yesterday I was sleeping in a burned out house in a big pile of straight edge punks, huddled togeather for warmth, wishing I could find a Hammerskin who wore my size docs so I could get some new boots, and now I find myself working for a defense contractor in a cubicle, listening to California uber alles on mp3 while I worry about how to pay my mortgage and my credit card bills.

Or as Joe Strummer put it:

But I believe in this and it's been tested by research
That he who fucks nuns will later join the church . . .
--"Death or Glory", The Clash


I'm so depressed.....damn......

Kyomara
09-02-2001, 11:05 PM
Originally posted by HP Ellison
Sure, there are some good emo bands out there; Weezer (yes, weezer IS emo
In an absolute spirit of friendly debate (I swear), could you possibly be any more blatantly wrong? Emo traces back to Hardcore and Wash DC Dischord bands. Though there are naturally pop influences in the melodies, the structures are totally different from the 70's power-pop in which Weezer deals. Weezer owes much more to Cheap Trick and Chicago than to Fugazi...if they owe anything to Fugazi at all. And Rivers Cuomo's lyrics are far too clever and catchy to be Emo, which tends to have more weepy, self-consciouly "poetic" lyrics.

Now take it back.*

(*not that I have a problem with emo, just that I can't stand it when a situation is so grossly misinterpreted...)

Totoro
09-02-2001, 11:57 PM
No, Dammit! Emo isn't a fucking sound, it's a sense! It's the "lemme be your boyfriend" shit! That's why they call it EMO! EMOTION! Duh, monkey nuts!

And who bashed ICP? Bring it!

HP Ellison
09-03-2001, 01:52 AM
(Hijacking ensues)
Very well, I shall delve into this a bit further. Weezer is what every emo band wants to be. The flavor of punk is there; distortion is meant to be abrasive, and the "fuck the world" attitude still rests somewhere back in the wings. Weezer is also not afraid to wear their hearts on their collective sleeves. The songs are on a more personal level, preferring heartbreak to rampant social commentary. Now, every self-declared emo band I've ever seen seems to have an identity crises that Weezer lacks. They want to sing songs of love and loss, but don't want to be perceived as pussies by the punk and hardcore fans, so they try and add an element to their songs that, in my humble opinion, rarely works. I can't tell you how many times I'll listen to an emo song that begins like your friendly every-day average rawk love song and then loses the plot amidst a hail of misplaced distortion and screamed vocals. When this happens, it's painfully obvious to me that these poor souls are trying to force themselves to incorporate genres of music that they really aren't feeling. Now, some emo bands are capable of sidestepping this; they can successfully write melodic punk love songs without giving a damn about paying their dues to whatever genre spawned them. Weezer is like this. Weezer might not sound a lot like many other less-known emo bands because they've synthesized several different types of music into one sound, and therefore don't suffer from a total crisis of identity. They are fully-realized emo. Now, granted, we could get into a big debate on whether this makes them something else entirely, but that's for another thread.