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View Full Version : Could my kid have O.C.D. ?


Grrr!
10-25-2001, 11:39 PM
I have a 3.5 year old boy. I took him out to eat this evening and when we get to the restruant I tried to take his jacket off and he just looses it; I mean this boy just wasn't whiney he was all out boo hooing. Now my kid is not normaly a whiney kid usauly when I tell him stuff like "time for bed" or " no you can't have another cookie" he normaly accepts it. and if he doesn't, I just count to three (which means to him he's about to get an attitude adjustment from yours truely) and he pipes down. Today when we were in the restraunt none of that worked. This isn't the only thing that leads me to believe that he might have Obssesive Cumpulsive Disorder (O.C.D.) There have been a few nights where he would not let me take his shoes off for bed. (wtf?) Also he does stuff since he was 2 like if he sees any cabinet doors open; he's got to close them same with drawers. If I put his clothes or any of his toys where they don't belong he gets really upset. And which by the way when I say "belong" I mean the place he designates for them, which could be aywhere!

My wife says 3.5 y/o is to young to tell but I'm not so sure so I figred I'd leave it to you guys for some imput. Thanks.

Markxxx
10-25-2001, 11:56 PM
Doesn't sound terribly like OCD but here is a decent site

http://www.nami.org/helpline/ocd.htm

The big problem with OCD in kids is that the drugs to treat it, while sucessful effect the brain and of course children's brains are developing. Try a http://www.google.com search with children and OCD in the search area.

astro
10-26-2001, 12:11 AM
He might be inherently anal, which in some contexts might bode postively for for future career prospects, or he might just be being fussy or just a brat but he's still just a little child. Don't obsess. Kids go through stages.

A kid that is likely to keep his room neat and make sure his homework is done correctly is not necessarily a "bad thing". Trust me on that one.

Primaflora
10-26-2001, 12:15 AM
What you describe doesn't sound like OCD. It sounds like a 3.5 year old kid to me. Any tourette's or OCD in the family? Has he recently had strep? Does he argue a lot?

Is he an anxious kid? 3.5 is very young to dx OCD - my kid was dx'ed at 7. I'd suspected he had it since he was 5 but the rituals didn't really begin until about 6.

It's a hell of a condition to live with as a family. Drugs and behaviour modification are the treatment. The drugs are a worry with such a young kid (and fWIW I doubt anyone would prescribe for a 3 yo) but the alternative can be worse. We were facing agoraphobia, severe anxiety and 6-7 hours a day devoted to rituals.

JillGat
10-26-2001, 12:34 AM
[[Has he recently had strep? Does he argue a lot?]]
Primaflora

What do either of these have to do with it?
Jill

Spanky The Dolphin
10-26-2001, 01:13 AM
That thing about the toys kinda sounds like autism to me.

whistlepig
10-26-2001, 01:26 AM
Based on what you said:

Nope, not OCD, not autistic. Definitely not autistic. Sounds like a normal three year old going through stages of development.

Your post could be a call to my work phone. I'd tell you the same things (though ask more questions). If you want to email me further, it's in my profile.


Whistlepig

Primaflora
10-26-2001, 01:33 AM
Spanky - no it doesn't. It really doesn't sound autistic at all.

Jill - oppositional behaviour is a symptom of anxiety in kids with OCD. When my kid is unmedicated he argues and argues endlessly. He tries to micromanage the whole household so as to relieve his anxiety.

Strep's been linked to a syndrome known as PANDAS. I did a search on google but I turned up so much stuff on it I'm reluctant to link to any one site. Not all paediatric OCD is PANDAS but it's a fascinating issue.

whistlepig
10-26-2001, 01:43 AM
PANDAS? Do tell. At least an explanation of the acronym.

SHAKES - tune out. Ignore the following.

We are currently at 8 posts. I predict that before 15 posts we will see:

a post on not giving kids meds. bonus point for personal anecdote, double bonus point for a relatives/friends kids

a post about social norms and diagnosing kids

But that's just my cynicism. Buck a point, per post.

15 posts and under or over 15? Who's in?

Primaflora
10-26-2001, 03:08 AM
yeah whistlepig :) the social norms one will be here shortly I'm sure. Haven't I already covered personal anecdote? <G>.

PANDAS is Paediatric Autoimmune Neuropsychiatric Disorder Associated with Strep. It's where the OCD is a sequelae to strep infection. This page has details if you scroll down far enough
http://www2.mc.duke.edu/depts/psychiatry/pcaad/abstracts/ocd
kabs.htm

I found so many interesting links that I didn't want to pick the best but that one will do.

I'm in. Meds saved my kid's life and my life. I tell ya anyone who deals with severe paediatric OCD and doesn't use meds is guilty of child abuse.

handy
10-26-2001, 09:19 AM
Kids usually have some quirks & it's best not to give them too much attention otherwise they keep doing them for attention.

As for OCD, there isn't any medical test for it; but you can look at ocdfoundation.org for some hints.

As you can read there, first there is an obsession & then there is a compulsion. There is also OCDPD where people don't have ocd but act like they do.

Grrr!
10-26-2001, 09:22 AM
Originally posted by Primaflora
yeah whistlepig :) the social norms one will be here shortly I'm sure. Haven't I already covered personal anecdote? <G>.

PANDAS is Paediatric Autoimmune Neuropsychiatric Disorder Associated with Strep. It's where the OCD is a sequelae to strep infection. This page has details if you scroll down far enough
http://www2.mc.duke.edu/depts/psychiatry/pcaad/abstracts/ocd
kabs.htm

I found so many interesting links that I didn't want to pick the best but that one will do.

I'm in. Meds saved my kid's life and my life. I tell ya anyone who deals with severe paediatric OCD and doesn't use meds is guilty of child abuse.

Wow! My kid does have problems with sinus congestion. We are constantly having to put him on antibiotics. Hmm have to look in to that, I never even heard of PANDAS before.

Qadgop the Mercotan
10-26-2001, 09:26 AM
If you're really concerned (and since you're posting here I suspect you are) why not just cut to the chase and take your kid to a competent physician? Perhaps a pediatrician with a good grounding in development and behavior. Or even a good old family doc. I suspect they'll tell you the kid sounds pretty normal for the developmental age, but you'll get the benefit of a one-on-one evaluation. Here you'll just get flooded with conflicting data.

Qadgop, MD

grettle
10-26-2001, 10:23 AM
in regards to the strep and OCD are related, i am a living example. i would get strep throst at least twice a year until i was in middle school and i have been diagnosed with acute OCD.
back to the OP, which doesn't mention anything about strep throat, my 3-year old niece is OCD, she has to wear the uniform she has designated for a certain day (she cannot wear friday's uniform on monday if she didn't have school on friday, she has to wear the one she has picked as always monday) she also freaks out if the toys are not put back where she wants them, and she tries to perfect her little sisters ways too. as well as tell her parents how to do things. . . but that's probably just her nature, not part of OCD.
to close, she is a normal little kid, sut she just has to have things a certain way to be comfortable. as i am a functioning college student, but there are things that i have to have a certain way to be more comfortable. OCD can be life-altering, but more often then not, just as any psychological disorder, it is just one more challenge to everyday life, to be taken in stride and not used as an excuse or something to keep you worrying about.

J248974
10-26-2001, 10:31 AM
Um, did you ask him why he would not take off his jacket? It has been a long time since I was around such young kids, but I recall that they can get attached to some favorite item of clothing and not want to take it off for long periods of time.

I also recall whiny children from years back, in restaurants and such, resisting efforts from their parents to put on or take off clothing, like in the winter, and Momma or Poppa giving them a smart swat on the butt, which often ended the struggle. (60% of parents currently spank their kids, with the rate increasing). I recall my parents doing the same with my siblings, and myself, as children.

OCD? Um, probably not. Some exotic syndrome? Probably not. Going through a 'bratty' stage? Probably so. All kids usually do at about that age. He might be testing the limits of your authority against his, something that happens normally.

I know of children, very young, who threw fits of crying and fighting when they did not get their way, but the folks stopped them very quickly with swats on the butt. The kids learned that screaming fits would get them nothing but a sore butt and the fits stopped. There was and is nothing unusual with that, but if the fits are tolerated, then problems with the kid verses authority shows up later on.

Rillian
10-26-2001, 11:17 AM
J248974 wrote:
60% of parents currently spank their kids, with the rate increasing(emphasis is mine)

Cite please?

booklover
10-26-2001, 11:57 AM
The thing about OCD is that if your child had it, he would exhibit the same behavior EVERY night, not just a couple nights a week. He just sounds a fussy/uptight...sounds like a fairly typical 3 1/2 year old to me.

I have OCD and have exhibited symptoms since I was a child--not conclusively proven link, but I had strep throat & subsequent penicillin allergy when I was a toddler. There seems to be a link for some people....

handy
10-26-2001, 05:45 PM
If you want, there is a newsgroup, alt.support.ocd

Im still under the assumption that ocd comes from the folks, either learned or genetic.

Primaflora
10-26-2001, 06:03 PM
well I'm glad you said it was an assumption handy because at least you're not trying to assert an opinion as a truth are you?

There's a genetic component to OCD. However I'm not aware of any research showing that OCD is a learned behaviour. Probably a parent with OCD could exacerbate OCD behaviour in a susceptible child but I sincerely doubt you could create a child with OCD from scratch.

And handy? OCD can appear in families without OCD and where the parents have not done anything which by anybody's standards could create OCD. I'm not being personally defensive here BTW. There's a very clear genetic line in my SO's family of OCD. But having lived with a child with OCD and watched it develop, I can't imagine how anyone could develop it as a result of parenting practices. It's an internally driven obsessional syndrome. You could presumably make a child wash their hands repeatedly but I don't think you could make them obsess about washing their hands.

DSeid
10-26-2001, 08:53 PM
Speaking with my pediatrician hat on, the best advice you've gotten is talk about it with your pediatrician, someone who knows about the rest of your kids development and history, including family history.

3 and a half is awfully early to be talking about OCD ... the behaviors you describe DO occur in kids later given that label ... And in other kids ... And in gifted kids. What does he like to do? What kind of jokes does he appreciate? What is his play like? These are only a few of the areas that your real doctor will want to talk to you about before attempting to approach labelling.

Even if the label WAS correct, meds at this age are usually reserved for those kids who are debiltated by the condition, not just annoying their folks. It sounds like you do a good job of choosing your battles and following through when needed. That's likely the best approach at this age, in any case.

Good luck and enjoy your child.

Guinastasia
10-26-2001, 09:49 PM
Originally posted by Spanky The Dolphin
That thing about the toys kinda sounds like autism to me.


No, he's being a three year old. Kids are anal about stuff like that. I remember throwing a fit if my mom didn't call my stuffed animals by the right name, or if she said I was four about two weeks before my birthday. I remember throwing a tantrum when she told a librarian I was seven-a month before I turned seven. ;) Or I had to have my sash tied perfectly-it's just kids. Kids are anal-they make a much bigger deal out of things. Relax-it's normal.

Kids like to have control over their own environment. They like routine and rules-it's comforting and a way for them to keep things in control. I believe there's a word for it, but I don't remember-oversimplification? Something like that.


I'm OCD and that doesn't sound remotely like it.



Im still under the assumption that ocd comes from the folks, either learned or genetic.


Try chemical imbalance.