Okay, so what % of women try lesbianism?

[BuddyG]

Several co-workers & I went to a local
pub after work for an informal Christmas
party.

A few hours and several drinks later the
conversation turned to sex - and
specifically how many of the women
had ever been with a women.

About seven gals were present, and to
remain anonymous they wrote YES or NO on napkins. Five of them wrote YES!!

Beyond that, I recall two former girlfriends
who had mentioned to me that they'd
experimented - Typically "once in the dorm at school", or "after the divorce, it just sort of happened".

So... What ARE the statistics on the number
of women that experience lesbian sex?
It *seems* more common than male-male
experimentation, but that's just based
on conjecture.
Is there a pattern? Adolescent experimenting? Drunk & "ahhh, why not",
post-divorce acting out?

Silly but curious.

[voguevixen]

Wow! I guess I may be shallow, but I'm holding out for Elizabeth Hurley. ;) But I guess that's the difference between men and women. Most straight men wouldn't admit to being curious about ANYBODY!

------------------
"There's a snake in my boot!"

[EvilGhandi]

And even less straight men would admit to ever having a snake in their boot.

[handy]

Easy. 5 out of 7, let's see, that would be 71.4%

How many men get turned on wondering how many women are bisexual?

[HeyHomie]

This doesn't add anything to solving the OP's question, but...

I once knew a girl in college who tried it one night, just to see. Mind you, this girl is straight as an arrow and somewhat conservative.

All I managed to get out of her was "It was weird. I didn't dislike it, but I won't do it again. How 'bout those Bears?"

[Cyan]

Been there. Done that. Bought the t-shirt.

I'm straight, but I've been with other women. Guess that makes me bi, official. But I'd never call myself a Lesbian.

Judging from locker room conversations (yes, we do that, too) and other female bull sessions, I'd say that roughly half of us have had some sort of girl-girl experience.

And for the record, I've throughly enjoyed my same-sex adventures, but nothing feels quite so nice as a stiff prick.

[AWB]

While I was in the middle of a long, dry spell, a girl-friend told me about her first same sex encounter that had happened that weekend.

"So are you bi, now?" I asked.

She said, "One isolated incident does not make me bi."

"Well, then, I don't have much of a claim to heterosexuality," I replied.

[Yarster]

This topic of women on women came up at my Christmas party too! (must be the season)

I've always heard the statistic that 1 in 10 is gay in America, but this figure is usually thrown at me by pro-gay groups, so I have no idea how valid it is. I have asked women friends about this, and they don't seem to think it is any more common than male-male encounters that are "one-time". However, I will add the interesting comment that more than one heterosexual woman made, which is that male-male sex is "gross" while female-female sex is "pretty". I think a lot of this may just be a society view though. After all, most pornos (created for a male audience) do have a female-female sex scene, or at least an orgy scene where the females are often fondling each other (the men never do), so we'd be lead to believe this is the accepted standard and should be more common.

I'm inclined to believe it probably is 1 in 10. I'm personally more interested in how many people have been involved in orgies, even if they are just with their significant other the whole time, but in a room full of other people having sex. I know that's hijacking the thread, but I was 'just curious'

[WhiteNight]

I would guess that there are more women than men who've experimented with same-sex partners. Probably a lot more.

Probably because there's more stigma attached to being a gay man. Most people I know, man and women think that F-F sex, if not very erotic (guess which group thinks this...) then at least isn't gross. But, ask that same group about M-M sex and most think it's dirty and icky.

Probably because M-M sex is usually thought to include anal sex, and many people aren't too keen on the idea. (No idea how many of these anti-anal people then go home and have M-F anal sex...)

But, I know a few gay guys who say that anal sex isn't really something they're into. So, maybe people just think M-M sex is gross because they don't understand how it's usually performed.

As for the numbers, I'd guess that seventy five percent or so of the women I know have had at least one lesbian affair. But, as for the number who are practicing lesbians, it's a lot lower. Perhaps close to that 10% number.

I'm sure a lot of the guys in my circle of friends (as in, more than two admitted gays we hang out with) have had some sort of male-male sexual experience. But, with the general stigma attached to it. (Strangely enough, nobody thinks the gays are strange, just that bisexual guys would be. It's weird.)

But, most of them would probably behave differently in a threeway, with one of the people being the same sex as them, because you can experiment without feeling that you're having gay/lesbian sex, it's just a little nibbling or fondling between the main action.

Anyways, to sum up the rambling. Over fifty percent of the women have and admit to it, more probably have. I'd guess about 20% of the guys admit to similar, and probably twice that have done something, but don't admit it.

Yarster:

I don't know anyone who has actually been to an orgy, as in, where there is a room full of people having sex.

Many people (in this same group of friends) have talked about threeways, or two couples having sex together, but not sharing partners. And one guy had sex with his then partner with a few of their friends around (2-3 I'd guess) but not participating.

But then, this group is a little liberal, and fairly younger (18-30 or so) which might skew the numbers a bit.

[Vestal Blue]

Hmmmmm, lesseee, I'm convex and she's concave; That's good enough for me! Where you at, Ladylust?

------------------
VB

"Hey! How 'bout that Toe Jam?"

[DrFidelius]

Resolved:

I will attend more interesting holiday parties this year. We just talked about cars, boats, and how the kids are doing.

[PunditLisa]

Nope, never tried it; A guy I dated approached the subject of a three way, which I told him I'd consider if he got me drunk enough.

But he never got me drunk enough. Which leads me to an off-subject question. Have you ever been SO drunk that you can't remember things. I've had friends that say, "Did I say that?" or "Did I *really* do that?" and I always thought it was a pretty lame excuse.

Or perhaps I can just hold my liquor better.

[DrFidelius]

Lisa:

Maybe the best way to hold your liquor is to grab her ears.

Sorry, I'll go away now.

[The_Peyote_Coyote]

Yes, PunditLisa:
I had several black-out drunks in my 20's. It's a pretty frightening experience, especially when you best friend tells you the next morning that you assaulted someone and you don't even remember it.

------------------
The Coyote gnaws ....
but he does not swallow.

[Yarster]

Well as long I didn't hijack the thread...

Yes, I did once drink and hallucinate something so real I can't believe it didn't happen. My girlfriend broke up with me and my female Hispanic friend took me to a bar where I drank WAY too much. I remember getting in the back of her car so she could drive me home, and then I remember waking up mid-trip back and seeing some other Hispanic guy riding shotgun who my friend was talking to in Spanish and being scared he was carjacking us, but my female friend said she was just giving him a ride home.

When I woke up the next day with the requisite hangover, not only did it turn out the Hispanic guy never existed, but it also turned out my female friend didn't speak Spanish!

[handy]

Scientifically very few people are either straight or gay.

They use a five point scale, 1 all straight, 5 all gay.

Most everyone is between 2 & 4.

[handy]

inclusive.

[Alphagene]

The answer is: what percentage of women have dated me?

Scientifically very few people are either straight or gay.
You'll excuse me for doubting the validity of sexual statistics from a guy named "handy".

------------------
If I wanted smoke blown up my ass, I'd be at home with a pack of cigarettes and a short length of hose.

[BigRoryG]

Most guys will never admit to having any kind of gay thoughts. Personally, I'm not afraid to admit, that every now and then, the occasional effiminate guy will look pretty good to me. Anal sex doesn't really appeal too much, mostly because of a condition i talked about it a previous post... no needto mention it here, but hey, I'll try anything once.

------------------
"C'mon, it's not even tomorrow yet..." - Rupert

If you need a graphic solution, http:\\talk.to\Piglet (http://talk.to\Piglet)

[Cyan]

Ok, BigRory, I'll bite (so to speak).

What's the condition. I even went so far as to search your previous posts for an answer, but couldn't find anything. Fess up. Dirty minds want to know!

[Konrad]

handy sez:
Scientifically very few people are either straight or gay.

They use a five point scale, 1 all straight, 5 all gay.

That's a pretty simplistic, unsupported assertion you made there.

But hey, since you said it's "scientific" it must be true.

[Surgoshan]

Yeah, I've had a blackout before, and the next morning I was scared. I woke up in my room and only had vague memories of tangling with a bush (scratches all over to prove that) and people helping me home (it was cold and I didn't have a jacket, I was lucky). Between 10 and 2 that night, I had no memories. I tried talking to a female friend over AIM and was rather coldly rebuffed, I thought. I thought "Oh no! What did I DO last night?" It turns out that all I'd done was go to sleep and then disappear from the get-together I was at (they didn't see me leave). The strange thing is, my blackout started at the point where I'd only had about 5 shots and a beer (hey, college style), far less than I've had at other times. I attribute it to disease. Still, I've toned down my drinking some. I DON'T want it to happen again. I might not be so lucky next time.

That's enough of my drinking story. Now, about homosexuality. I'd rate myself a two. Oh, if I press that button I'm going to be so embarassed. This is actually pretty hard. You wouldn't believe how much so.

[Markxxx]

The latest theory is among men about 33% have had at least one homosexual experince. about 10% spent a year or less being exclusively gay, and about 1 to 3% of any given population is in fact actually gay.

The study indcated less than 1% of women define themselves as being lesbaian. The trouble is homosexuality is really a self definition.

Women who may kiss another woman may see nothing sexual about it but a man seeing this would think "Oh Lesbian"

Souce=Advocate Magazine.

It seems to me 3% is a resonable figure for men. Take Chgo 2.7 million people that means 27,000 gay men. Seems a resonable estimate.

[astorian]

I don't have the slightest idea what the percentages are, but so far no one has mentioned an important point: lesbianism is the #1 fantasy/turn-on of heterosexual males everywhere.

Now, there may well be a lot of women who tried lesbianism a time or two out of curiosity... but my hunch is, a HUGE percentage of the heterosexual women who've dabbled in lesbianism did so to fulfill a boyfriend or husband's fantasy. A local DJ here in Austin recently joked (probably accurately) that "when you see a personal ad that says 'bi-curious female,' you know what 'bi-curious means? It means 'my damn husband won't shut the F*** up about this!"

[Shayna]

but my hunch is, a HUGE percentage of the heterosexual women who've dabbled in lesbianism did so to fulfill a boyfriend or husband's fantasy.

Of course I can't factually dispute your theory, but I can tell you from conversations with dozens of women friends and acquaintances, your hunch would be wrong. In fact, I can't think of any women I've spoken to about it who haven't admitted to having their own fantasies about at least trying it once. Although I know only one woman who has actually fulfilled that particular fantasy (which is only one of many fantasies we women have without the provocation of you men), myself included.

And for what it's worth, I find M-M sex a turn-on too. I love men's bodies and I love seeing them aroused, so seeing two (or more) of them together -- ooh la la!! And the female friends I've exposed to gay male videos have admitted that, while they either never gave it any prior thought, or thought it would be gross, were also very aroused once they actually saw it.

[handy]

I'm a guy, I tried lesbianism. It's great.

From talking to them, few guys would date a woman with lesbian experience. They would not only have to be concered about the woman around their male friends, but their female friends too.

[WhiteNight]

Handy wrote:

Scientifically very few people are either straight or gay.

They use a five point scale, 1 all straight, 5 all gay.

Most everyone is between 2 & 4 [inclusive].


I think this is a Kinsey finding, isn't it?

I sort of agree with the general idea, that very few people have absolutely no fantasies about same-sex sex, but I have problems with the actual results...

For one, I think a 1-5 is a little granular for this sort of thing, and second I doubt it was conducted properly... I've seen too many psych tests where if you've thought about, as in, wanted to, or just had a philosophical debate about, "some topic", then they check the 'thinks about "some topic"' box.

Some people could have absolutely no desire for members of the same sex, yet think about the act, and the societal consequences a fair bit.

Similarly, you could think about suicide, as in being suicidal, or you could just have a morbid streak and wonder about death, and what sort of mindset someone would have to be in to commit suicide. But both would be checked the same on a psych test.

So, I think the results are semi-correct, in that most people have more than zero thoughts about the same sex, but wrong in the way they stated the results, and in properly disclosing the way the information was gathered.

[Bubba_blue]

Shayna, you bring up (pun NOT intended) a good point. It's assumed by many sex therapists that men love the idea of f/f but women hate the idea of m/m. Even some advice-type people (like the brain-dead girl on MSN Underwire) will assert that women *hate* the idea of gay sex.

Well, bull. I don't know where they get their stats, but at least among my friends m/m is a very common, if not the most common, fantasy. And more; do you really think gay men buy *all* those leather magazines? Heh. According to the editor of one fine publication, well over half of his subscribers are heterosexual women.

We don't talk about it much to men, though, because most guys wouldn't understand. Most of my former bfs have been grossed out by the idea that I like to look at naked men. (Strange, but true. I guess they expected me to get all hot and bothered over pictures of kitchen appliances.)

[Crazybee]

Problem is, a lot of those "scientific" findings were done improperly. We went over this in my Psych class. A hoel chapter devoted to it. Most of those findings are suppoorted by the media and the media rarely cares about accuracy.

Like, the one about how most women would cheat on their husbands and how many actually have. This was widely publicized. Problem is, it wasnt a truely random test. It was done via mail-in questionaires. So, the tested subject base is extremely skewed. You dont know how many of the X amount had ever done such a thing (if 80% had or hadnt that would adverly affect results).

Any ways, being the skeptic that I am I would like to see a reference study, preferably two, that relate to the scale measurement.

CB

[handy]

Surveys suck because of how they word questions & who ever gives the truth about their sexuality?

Better results come from asking if you know anyone who did such & such.

[handy]

The scale is Kinsley, its on the net and its 1 to 6, not one to five: http://www.indiana.edu/~kinsey/ak-hhscale.html

and:
0- Exclusively heterosexual with no homosexual
1- Predominantly heterosexual, only incidentally homosexual
2- Predominantly heterosexual, but more than incidentally homosexual
3- Equally heterosexual and homosexual
4- Predominantly homosexual, but more than incidentally heterosexual
5- Predominantly homosexual, only incidentally heterosexual
6- Exclusively homosexual

amen.

[handy]

BuddyG, you ever do it with two girls?

Which fictional detective said: The client ALWAYS lies; and everybody lies about sex??????????????????????

------------------
Save The Endangered Jackalope! Send Cash Now! If You Do This, I Will Use The Cash To Save Any Jackalope That I Happen To Find! Send Cash Now! Before It's Too Late! My Bills, I Mean The Jackalope's Bills Are Due The 15th Of The Month!
This has been a message from the Illuminated Committee To Save The Jackalope. Fnord.

DISCLAIMER: I LOVE men. I love the hardness of their bodies, and their hairy arms and chests, I love broad shoulders and well-muscled arms. I love it when they pick me up an... (Damn! Enough of that! I'm getting myself all sweaty here....)

Shortly after I lost my virginity (like about two weeks!), I joined a (married) couple in a threesome. It was interesting, it felt kinda good, but I didn't know what the hell I was doing, and although we tried it again once or twice, it never gave me that much of a thrill.

To quote Mr. Michael: "Sex is best when it's ONE-ON-ONE" (and I prefer that the "one" be male).


T

[PunditLisa]

On a related note, friends of ours were surprised when another friend (who I don't know) asked them to do the old wife swap thing.

I must live under a rock, because I thought that that sort of thing went out of vogue in the 70's...

P.S. They declined.

[matt_mcl]

Hi,

My guess is a lot of guys try a homosexual experience, but a) younger than women or b) in a sex-segregated environment.

And IIRC, five times as many men get raped than women. It happens in prison.

[PunditLisa]

Dr. Fidelis, if you feel a rotten tomato being lobbed at you, it was because I *finally* got your joke! Ain't nothing slow about this chick. ;)

[Little Nemo]

And IIRC, five times as many men get raped than women. It happens in prison.

No offense, matt, but I have to question that statistic. I can't believe that over 83% of rape victims could be male and the entire issue would be unknown. In fact, I would question whether there enough men in prison to make that kind of percentage possible even if every prisoner was a rape victim.

[Myron Van Horowitzski]

So the question is: if you asked a group of women whether they'd been with another woman, what percentage of them would answer yes just to yank your chain.

[Atrael]

And what percentage would clap the ever-lovin' hell out of you?

[Atrael]

And what percentage would slap the ever-lovin' hell out of you?

[Yarster]

Two comments:

1) That statistic about men being raped five times as often as women set off my bullshit sensor big time. In fact, I started a thread a while back about homosexuality in prison and this figure never came up (though I fully admit I cannot disprove it)

2) The wife swapping thing. I think this may be a bit more common than you might expect. My wife (who was a virgin prior to meeting me) at one point asked how I felt about it because she was 'vaguely curious' about a cute male friend of ours who also had a girlfriend. After discussing it, however, we both concluded we would get incredibly jealous if we actually knew it was happening and develop complexes along the lines of 'gee, I wonder if my friend is better in bed with my wife than me'. I'm fairly sexually inexperienced myself (only been with one other woman before my wife), but I wonder if we'd feel differently had we both had numerous sexual partners before meeting each other...

[Yarster]

Two comments:

1) That statistic about men being raped five times as often as women set off my bullshit sensor big time. In fact, I started a thread a while back about homosexuality in prison and this figure never came up (though I fully admit I cannot disprove it)

2) The wife swapping thing. I think this may be a bit more common than you might expect. My wife (who was a virgin prior to meeting me) at one point asked how I felt about it because she was 'vaguely curious' about a cute male friend of ours who also had a girlfriend. After discussing it, however, we both concluded we would get incredibly jealous if we actually knew it was happening and develop complexes along the lines of 'gee, I wonder if my friend is better in bed with my wife than me'. I'm fairly sexually inexperienced myself (only been with one other woman before my wife), but I wonder if we'd feel differently had we both had numerous sexual partners before meeting each other...

[Yarster]

Two comments:

1) That statistic about men being raped five times as often as women set off my bullshit sensor big time. In fact, I started a thread a while back about homosexuality in prison and this figure never came up (though I fully admit I cannot disprove it)

2) The wife swapping thing. I think this may be a bit more common than you might expect. My wife (who was a virgin prior to meeting me) at one point asked how I felt about it because she was 'vaguely curious' about a cute male friend of ours who also had a girlfriend. After discussing it, however, we both concluded we would get incredibly jealous if we actually knew it was happening and develop complexes along the lines of 'gee, I wonder if my friend is better in bed with my wife than me'. I'm fairly sexually inexperienced myself (only been with one other woman before my wife), but I wonder if we'd feel differently had we both had numerous sexual partners before meeting each other...

[WhiteNight]

Re Men being raped statistic...

It might be true, if you were to count the number of rapes, not the number of victims.

I would imagine that, except in cases of spousal rape, most rape victims are raped once or twice. But, if you were in prison with someone who was sodomizing you, they'd have access to you every day.

[Little Nemo]

Okay, now that we've cleared up the whole prison rape issue, can we get back to the main point; female posters talking about their lesbian experiences and/or fantasies. Feel free to take your time and describe them in prolonged extensive detail. JPEG's would be a definite plus.

[Alphagene]

This was said many posts back, but I need to comment.

...few guys would date a woman with lesbian experience. They would not only have to be concered about the woman around their male friends, but their female friends too.

This sounds more like a trust problem than a lesbian problem. Any person who is as described above seems to be very untrusting of their girlfriend and of other people around them. They're probably at tad possessive too.

And if you're worried about your male or female friends stealing your gal, maybe you need new friends.

Of course, maybe I'm just paying far too much attention to handy's posts.

------------------
If I wanted smoke blown up my ass, I'd be at home with a pack of cigarettes and a short length of hose.

[Bosda Di'Chi of Tricor]

DrFIDO SuCkS But KonRsAd Od CoOl

LezBoZ ArE CoOl 2

[G.B.H. Hornswoggler]

"KonRsAd Od CoOl" aka (without the demented orthography) "Kornsad od cool?"

[cop voice]
"Hello, Grammar police? I've got an unidentified particle here for pick-up on the SMDB board. Offending particle appears to be acting as a transitive verb. Request flying squad."
[/cop voice]

I've never posted a "your grammar sucks" message before, but what the hell is "od" a typo for?

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...but when you get blue, and you've lost all your dreams, there's nothing like a campfire and a can of beans!

[Alan Smithee]

Ace,

I laughed out loud after reading your post, and then looking at my keyboard. You'll notice that the "o" key is right next to the "i" key. Also, the "d" key is right next to "s". I've never seen or heard of somebody making two typo's in a word with only two letters before. This has to be some kind of a record!

This reminds me of a line I heard on TV once (Family Ties I think). One of the girls in the family (not Malory, the other one), commenting on a boy at her school who writes graffitti on the walls: "You'd think if a word only has four letters, he'd get at least three of them right!" I always wondered how she knew what the word was supposed to be!

[matt_mcl]

Re rape statistics: My bad. Like I said, the statistics were IIRC, and I apparently did not RC.

However, according to the Bureau of Justice (http://www.ojp.usdoj.gov/bjs/glance/rape.htm), rape rates in the general population in 1996 were slightly under 0,1% of persons aged 12 and over.

In the same year, 1 637 928 persons were in jail or prison (Bureau of Justice again (http://www.ojp.usdoj.gov/bjs/glance/corr2.txt)), of whom 364 000 were raped. (Stop Prisoner Rape (http://www.spr.org/sections/about.html)). So 22,2% of prisoners in the US were raped in 1996.

So in 1996 a prisoner was 222 times more likely to be raped than a member of the general population. Seems pretty obvious, I know, but it's still something to think about.

[matt_mcl]

My guess is "od" is a typo for "is", both typing fingers being accidentally shifted one to the right on a standard Qwerty keyboard, due to inclement drunkenness or anencephaly. Make of this what you will.

[funneefarmer]

Bosda, liked the old you better. First MK now you.

Anyhow now that I've lamented the changeover. I'm with Little Nemo, rather than the hard statistics maybe some personal,ummm, testimonials ?

[special]

happily, there's only a couple of sexual experiences i've missed. unhappily, doing/being done by another woman is one of them. {sigh}

thought for a long time my interest indicated i was just confused. after i decided it was a healthy obsession, i was stymied by the fact that i didn't know how to approach another woman w/out scaring her. after the stuff written above, i guess i should just ask around. doesn't appear it would take long to make a hit!

gotta state, tho, whatever it's like, it could never surpass sex w/ a guy. i think . . .