Enterprise Breaking the Ice Spoiler

[carnivorousplant]

Watch for the Vulcan Snoman.

[Sofa King]

And now we know how the kitchen works, and where poop goes.

[Sycorax]

Said it before, I'll say it again...I hate T'Pol. Hate her, hate her, hate her. She ruins the show for me. I was hoping her little dilemma with her betrothed would be a reason to get her off the ship, but no such luck. I liked the bit with Archer telling the school kids how things work -- I've wondered what they do with the poop. And, as has been the case from the get-go, Trip upstaged everybody.

[carnivorousplant]

Originally posted by Sycorax
get her off the ship
It will never happen. Since Seven of Nine, there has to be an attractive woman for the 14 yeat old males. Rats.
So, was the Snowman cool or not? Nice ears.

[Daniel]

I really liked the bit with the 4th grade class. There are some 7th and 8th graders at a middle school in a neighboring city who are going to talk to the ISS astronauts just next week (they practiced with the radios last Thursday).

It was the only time I've thought Star Trek has had some touch with reality. Pretty nifty.

But the Archer-asking-Vulcans-for-help bit seemed like a really dumbed-down reminiscence of Picard asking Q to save him from the Borg.

[carnivorousplant]

yeat? year? teat? Now is that a Freudian slip, or what?

[carnivorousplant]

Originally posted by Daniel
Archer-asking-Vulcans-for-help bit seemed like a really dumbed-down reminiscence of Picard asking Q to save him from the Borg.

I was a tad hacked that she had to talk him into asking. Their lives were at stake, as well as a damn good shutt;e pod.

[Enderw24]

OK, because it's like this sickness that gets into my system that I must purge...my nitpicks:

1) Comets don't naturally have a tail. They only do when there's a sun nearby and the heat melts off ice on the surface. Perhaps there was a sun nearby but it was, to my knowledge, never seen. Which is surprising because part of the plot revolved around the fact that the comet shifted its axis and was rotating towards...what?

2) If the comet was "shedding" wouldn't it be like a blizzard on the surface?

3) As the comet was supposedly shifting, the shadows never moved while they were near the hovercraft.



Other than that, I really liked this episode. At first, the whole segment of Archer talking to the students seemed both stupid and pandering. This isn't what the 4th graders are asking...it's what WE are asking. But, then I realized that the reason we're asking these things is because we're geeks and wanna know everything we can about this universe. Then I relaxed, content in my geekiness, and enjoyed the rest of the episode. An episode that never really did anything, but good drama doesn't mean the ship has to be in danger every episode.

[carnivorousplant]

Why was there GRAVITY on the comet, hunh?
Why was the core sample a meter long? Real core sample fill the pack of a pick up.

^:)^

[Fugazi]

My main beef with this episode is, how does an 82 mile ball of ice have so much gravity? They should have been lucky to stick to the thing, not be falling down holes.

And Ender, there was a sun. Remember when it came rising over the horizon just before the ice cracked. Didn't look that far away either (astronomically speaking)

[Sycorax]

I'm not saying they shouldn't have an attractive female on the ship for the any-year-old males. I liked seven of nine, but then she didn't act like a souless zombie, walking around stiffly, speaking in a monotone with half-closed eyes which I guess are supposed to be sexy but to me looks like she's bored. Trip and the doc...the only likable characters in the show so far, IMHO. (Archer's okay...but he needs to break out of his shell too.)

[Fugazi]

Woo Hoo!! My first simulpost (sp?)

[The Controvert]

yeat? year? teat? Now is that a Freudian slip, or what?

Sometimes a yeat is just a yeat.

[Shakes]

Originally posted by carnivorousplant
Why was there GRAVITY on the comet, hunh?
Why was the core sample a meter long? Real core sample fill the pack of a pick up.

^:)^

Well its far fetched I know but if placed on the rigtht spot of the comet they could have had inertial gravity.

[Badtz Maru]

Originally posted by SHAKES
Originally posted by carnivorousplant
Why was there GRAVITY on the comet, hunh?
Why was the core sample a meter long? Real core sample fill the pack of a pick up.

^:)^

Well its far fetched I know but if placed on the rigtht spot of the comet they could have had inertial gravity.

I don't think so, about the only way you'd have inertial gravity was if the comet was accelerating or decellerating because of some force other than the gravitational pull of another object.

[Saltire]

I was doing ok, letting them get away with walking normally on the comet (which should have very little gravity), but I actually yelled when Travis hurt himself. Just really bugged me.

I also disliked Malcolm's mention of how ice layers are older the deeper you go. That would be true on a planet, with weather, but not on a comet. The whole thing should be essentially the same age, since there's no way for more ice to gather after the formation of the head.

Why have we already had two almost identical scenes of pods falling into holes? One place was brown, the other white, but they looked a lot alike.

On the postitive side, I thought T'Pol was better in this one. She's still not there, but Jolene seems to be improving. I'm not too happy with all the sinister subplots revolving around the Vulcans, though. The writers seem to be building up to something there, but for now they're just annoying me with this stuff.

[Katisha]

Originally posted by Sofa King
And now we know how the kitchen works, and where poop goes.

Poop holds the ship wher it is.

I miss the DFC...

[Fern Forest]

Originally posted by Saltire
***
I also disliked Malcolm's mention of how ice layers are older the deeper you go. That would be true on a planet, with weather, but not on a comet. The whole thing should be essentially the same age, since there's no way for more ice to gather after the formation of the head.
***

That really bugged me too. Simple simple planetary science. And it was a throw away line too.

Poor Trip. They'll probably beam his "Poop question" all over the Earth, in dozens of languages. csg

[Ethilrist]

Originally posted by carnivorousplant
Originally posted by Sycorax
get her off the ship
It will never happen. Since Seven of Nine, there has to be an attractive woman for the 14 yeat old males. Rats.
So, was the Snowman cool or not? Nice ears.

Umm, hi. Before Voyager, there was this show called DS9, and a character named Kira Nereise. But before that there was STNG, and somebody named Counselor Troi. You might want to watch some reruns.

Now, now, Katisha, you know "poop wher it is" captions are red-zoned. Heck with the DFC--I miss IADL.

[pldennison]

Originally posted by Badtz Maru
Originally posted by SHAKES
Originally posted by carnivorousplant
Why was there GRAVITY on the comet, hunh?
Why was the core sample a meter long? Real core sample fill the pack of a pick up.

^:)^

Well its far fetched I know but if placed on the rigtht spot of the comet they could have had inertial gravity.

I don't think so, about the only way you'd have inertial gravity was if the comet was accelerating or decellerating because of some force other than the gravitational pull of another object.

Indeed. Not only that, but you're telling me that that crappy little blast they performed (after which I immediately said to Peta Tzunami, "Why are the pieces falling so fast? Am I supposed to believe it's 1g on the surface of that thing?") provided sufficient energy to change the axis of rotation of an 82km-wide comet? I don't think so.

[carnivorousplant]

Originally posted by Ethilrist
[QUOTE] Kira Nereise.... Counselor Troi. You might want to watch some reruns.


Yeah, and Gene wanted Troi to have four, er, yeats. And she didn't wear a uniform. Maybe you've got something.
Nereise (sp?) was supposed to be Ensign Ro, but the actress had turned down a Trek role and was axed. Anyway, Ro and Kira were strong characters themselves, not relying just on their looks. Whats her name could act when given something to do; the Voyager ep where the Doctor was hidden in her Borg transistors was very good.
My point is that they were given acting parts, when SofN just stuck out her chest for the most part and pouted.

[DSeid]

Well yeah, the inattention to basic science bugs me (especially since all us science geeks were so thrilled with that asteroid landing in real life), but I do like the parallel story lines. As alluded to in the thread title, breaking the ice, two seperate beautiful hunks of ice start to develop some cracks. I think that T'pol will develop nicely. I see her in the seven line but not as the lust object sense but as the "coming to grips with humanity" sense ... like Data and Spock as well. She's not the same caliber of actor as the others, but cut her some slack.

[MrVisible]

In terms of technical nitpicks, y'all are all over it. Gravity. Falling down a hole, hurting yourself, in what should be microgravity. The pod, with thrusters on, not having time to get away when the ice cracked underneath it.

They did allude to a nearby star in some lines in the episode, so that's okay. But...

The shuttles don't have airlocks?

The shuttles that they use for EVA don't have airlocks?

So I'm supposed to believe that every single item in the shuttle is vaccuum-proof? They never anticipate a situation where one crew member has a working EVA suit, and the other doesn't?

And then when they get to the comet, they leave the door open?

But I did enjoy the episode.

[LordVor]

Gravity:

I was assumming that there was artificial gravity gear in their AV suits to let them work normally on the comet (working in microgravity is often much harder). Which doesn't explain why, when they were trying to return to the shuttle, they wouldn't turn the hurt guy's OFF, but hey.

-LV

[fiddlesticks]

Originally posted by LordVor
Gravity:

I was assumming that there was artificial gravity gear in their AV suits to let them work normally on the comet (working in microgravity is often much harder). Which doesn't explain why, when they were trying to return to the shuttle, they wouldn't turn the hurt guy's OFF, but hey.


Nice thought but that would go against Star Trek continuity (horrors!). Remember in First Contact when Worf and the gang travel outside the Enterprise to battle the Borg trying to modify the deflector dish? They used magnetic boots to walk across the ship.

It boils down to the fact that it is really hard and expensive to simulate zero gravity (or near zero-g) in any convincing manner. Other than paying NASA a few million to turn the Vomit Comet into a sound stage like they did for Apollo 13 I don't believe anyone has come up with a good special effect to offset that annoying 1-g pull that you just can't get away from.

[Inky-]

Why in Star Trek have they taken to making the hot, spandex-clad chicks so emotionally detatched!? Can't go having any of that sexual tension stuff spicing up our Klingon story line, God forbid.

I mean, Seven of nine was a Borg (wasn't she?) or half robot or something. This new one is an emotionless Vulcan. They managed to make Kira abrasive while simultaniously making her not-all-that-hot. Ensign Ro was a cold fish.

So I guess the last really hot chick on Star Trak was either Beverly crusher or Deanna Troi.

[Kilt-wearin' man]

Originally posted by Inky-
So I guess the last really hot chick on Star Trak was either Beverly crusher or Deanna Troi. [/B]

Ummm...both of the Dax's were pretty hot (even if Ezri was too helpless) and Leeta was very eye-catching...even if she wasn't in every episode and married a Ferengi...

And then there are the guest stars...

[carnivorousplant]

Originally posted by Inky-

So I guess the last really hot chick on Star Trak was either Beverly crusher or Deanna Troi.

Be sure the kids aren't in the room when you select this link:

http://www.maximonline.com/big_show/remote_patrol/jolene.asp

[vivalostwages]

Originally posted by Sofa King
And now we know how the kitchen works, and where poop goes.

And not a minute too soon, because I've been losing a lot of sleep over those particular issues! :)

[Captain Amazing]

Originally posted by vivalostwages
Originally posted by Sofa King
And now we know how the kitchen works, and where poop goes.

And not a minute too soon, because I've been losing a lot of sleep over those particular issues! :)

Just don't get them confused.

[Inky-]

Originally posted by Kilt-wearin' man
...both of the Dax's were pretty hot (even if Ezri was too helpless) and Leeta was very eye-catching...even if she wasn't in every episode and married a Ferengi.

Touché. I entirely forgot about Dax, and you'll have to remind me, who was Leeta?


Originally posted by Carnivorousplant
Be sure the kids aren't in the room when you select this link:

Ckukka-Wow!

But that's my point. Would you go to he Four Seasons and eat Big-Mac's? Would you buy a Ferrari and hide it in the garage? So why get a super hot girl and cast her as sexy as a post box?

[Tars Tarkas]

who was Leeta?

Leeta (http://www.decipher.com/startrek/cardlists/rulesofacquisition/large/leeta.html) was the Dabo girl played by Chase Masterson, who was going out with Bashir, but ended up marrying Rom and is now First Lady of Ferenginar.

[E-Sabbath]

Originally posted by Captain Amazing
Originally posted by vivalostwages
Originally posted by Sofa King
And now we know how the kitchen works, and where poop goes.

And not a minute too soon, because I've been losing a lot of sleep over those particular issues! :)

Just don't get them confused.

You didn't notice? The poop goes into the biorganic recycler-thing.

The food was previously stated to come out of the biorganic recycler thing.

Ah, realism. Got to love it.

[Yondan]

Originally posted by Etherist
Umm, hi. Before Voyager, there was this show called DS9, and a character named Kira Nereise. But before that there was STNG, and somebody named Counselor Troi. You might want to watch some reruns.

I don't think anyone said this already, but...

Hot chicks in tight uniforms goes all the way back to ST, TOS. Lt. Uhura in that tight miniskirt. Ensign Blondie something or other in another tight miniskirt. Nurse Chapman in a tight miniskirt and misty lens-shots every time she got hot about Spock...and what about that green-skinned babe, huh? Remember her? Or every other female humanoid Kirk managed to seduce on his merry romp through the galaxy?

[vivalostwages]

Originally posted by E-Sabbath
Originally posted by Captain Amazing
Originally posted by vivalostwages
Originally posted by Sofa King
And now we know how the kitchen works, and where poop goes.

And not a minute too soon, because I've been losing a lot of sleep over those particular issues! :)

Just don't get them confused.

You didn't notice? The poop goes into the biorganic recycler-thing.

The food was previously stated to come out of the biorganic recycler thing.

Ah, realism. Got to love it.

I'll never look at Trip's pecan pie the same way again.......

[WarmNPrickly]

I don't know what show you guys have been watching but I always thought that one of the main reasons to watch Star Trek was the funny ways they portrayed women to the mainly sexless geek audience (me included of course). I think they need do develop more of those sexy babes in tights.
I'm not saying I get hot when I watch Star Trek, but the whole thing is kind of funny. I refuse to take seriously the idea that mankind will break light speed within the next one hundered years. Let's face it, Star Trek was developed by screen writers in the 60's who didn't have the faintest idea about the laws of physics, and it is not much better now.
When I watch Star Trek I'm not looking at some attempt to describe a real futur. I'm looking at what some entertainment executive thought the futur might be back in the nineteen sixties. It's fantasy!
So now they have somewhat adapted this theme to the 2000's, but it is still the same show. As far as I am concerned they need to put T'pol in the decon chamber at least once an episode. It could be one of those running jokes. Some people have suggested that Hoshi should go in, but I think she is just too much of a good girl it wouldn't have the same effect. Also, if any natives were to punish them by chaning them to the wall in their underwear and whipping them, commander T'pol had better be there.
Perhapse it's just my natural tendency to go against the grain but I think that commander T'pol is my favorite character on the show. She is stif, snoby, and unnemotional just like a Vulcan should be. I think she is doing an excelent job of playing a Vulcan.

[carnivorousplant]

Originally posted by Christopher
She is stif, snoby,

It is tacky to criticize spelling, especially for me, but please define "snoby".

[The Bad Astronomer]

Originally posted by Christopher
Let's face it, Star Trek was developed by screen writers in the 60's who didn't have the faintest idea about the laws of physics, and it is not much better now.

That's not strictly true. Roddenberry had a far better grasp of physics than, say, most newscasters do. He knew he needed a transporter because a shuttle was too slow (plus it made a great deux ex machina). He knew that you couldn't just go faster than light; you needed a trick to do it. Etc etc.

One of the current writers for Enterprise was the science advisor for Trek for many years. He has a degree in physics and did postgrad work in astronomy. He did what he could within the confines of what TPTB wanted. I have noticed in Enterprise a distinct rise in the level of scientific accuracy, and really, it's my job to notice such things. ;-)

[Sycorax]

I don't think anyone is saying there shouldn't be sexy babes on the ST series; we just want them to have a personality and add something to the plot besides looks. Maybe T'Pol is to men what Spock was to us women -- a challenge. I had the hots for Kirk, but boy I sure wanted a crack at Spock: "I could get thru that aloofness and get those Vulcan hormones stirring..." And I was always hoping he and Christine would get together. He didn't give Kirk orders -- he was respectful and advised. And he acted superior only in the general sense of asserting that Vulcan logic is superior to human emotional responses. I liked the little spats between him and McCoy (and many times, I agreed with Spock). T'Pol comes off as disliking everyone, feeling superior to everyone, and not respecting Archer. She's not a likable character (but I guess men don't care if a woman has a personality or admirable traits as long as she's hot, hmmm?) Maybe there's hope for her, since she didn't want to leave the ship to return to her betrothed.

[TheeGrumpy]

Originally posted by The Bad Astronomer
I have noticed in Enterprise a distinct rise in the level of scientific accuracy, and really, it's my job to notice such things.

I see your point. Alan Shepard has a cameo appearance in every episode, and Alan Shepard was in fact a real guy. Totally accurate!

But it's the maddening inconsistencies that bother me, the ones I can't believe nobody involved with the production noticed. Like the blooper in "Broken Bow" that puts the Klingon Homeworld closer to Earth than Alpha Centauri. Or the terrible backstory in "Terra Nova," which ignores how far away 20 light-years is.

Or in "Breaking the Ice" -- did they ever explain how those childrens' drawings were delivered to Earth's fastest, most remote starship? (Maybe they did; I quit watching around the time Hoshi was doing the video postcard instead of her "top priority" decryption job.) More irritating -- they were all jazzed about a comet, when there are plenty of these in the Solar System, and presumably easy to find elsewhere. Oh, they say it's amazing because it's 82.6 km across -- big, but within the range of comet nucleii already known (http://encke.jpl.nasa.gov/hale_bopp_info.html#big). And they've never heard of anybody landing on a comet before? This'll probably turn out to be an anachronism by the end of the 21st century.

[carnivorousplant]

Marshall Dillon is saddling his horse.
Festus: Matthew, are you goin' after the Dalton brothers what kidnapped Miss Kitty?
Dillon: Yes, Festus.
Festus: But Matthew, there's twenty five of 'em, and they've got a gattlin' gun!.
Dillon: Yes, Festus.
Festus: Matthew, I like Miss Kitty a lot, but she ain't nothin' but an ols whore lady.
Dillon: Yes, Festus but she's the only one in town.

[Santos L Halper]

Originally posted by TheeGrumpy
did they ever explain how those childrens' drawings were delivered to Earth's fastest, most remote starship?

They didn't actually explain it that I can recall, but I assumed the pictures were send digitally and printed out on Enterprise.

Eric

[Tars Tarkas]

Originally posted by carnivorousplant
Marshall Dillon is saddling his horse.
Festus: Matthew, are you goin' after the Dalton brothers what kidnapped Miss Kitty?
Dillon: Yes, Festus.
Festus: But Matthew, there's twenty five of 'em, and they've got a gattlin' gun!.
Dillon: Yes, Festus.
Festus: Matthew, I like Miss Kitty a lot, but she ain't nothin' but an ols whore lady.
Dillon: Yes, Festus but she's the only one in town.

So, are you saying we like these chicks cuz they be the only tail in spacetown? i had fantasies about rubbing asian women with blue goo before the show even aired! of course, i'm a freak!

[carnivorousplant]

Originally posted by Tars Tarkas
are you saying we like these chicks cuz they be the only tail in spacetown?

No. It's the only science fiction program that we know enough about to complain when they screw up.
Although Andromeda does have a singularity weapon...

[TheeGrumpy]

Originally posted by Santos L Halper
I assumed the pictures were send digitally and printed out on Enterprise.

I thought of that too, but it doesn't make sense. Why print them on paper? Doesn't everybody have a display device? Heck, in 150 years the kids will probably use MacPaint instead of crayons. So why bother with hardcopy?

Further, this would seem to close the door on the FTL radio discussion, since Enterprise is receiving messages from Earth less than 3 months into its mission. I can live with them rejiggering established continuity to allow for subspace radio ahead of schedule. But I cannot excuse them (the producers) for failing to exploit a feature that would have made this show unique in the franchise.

[Gala Matrix Fire]

Who cares about the faster-than-light speed, or airlocks, or gravity, or decontamination? I want to know why they can't get some better flashlights.

C'mon, man, even on X-Files their flashlights illuminate better than the ones on Enterprise.

I hope they start lighting the sets better eventually, 'cause I'm already tired of straining my eyes to see what's going on. I'd already have given up on the show if my husband would just stop watching it.

[carnivorousplant]

Flashlights-It may be one of their few accuaracies. Without air to reflect the light, they may not appear the same.

Airlocks-maybe they can be removed to save room and mass.

FTL radio-It was suggested on a board of lesser quality that since the Vulcan monastary had a transmitter, Enterprise uses some Vulcan device to communicate.

Hard Copy-Some of us buy a paper despite the NYT website.

So, do I win a Geek award? Why do we do this? Nobody explains how they had weapons on Bonanza twenty years before they were invented. Hell, nobody noticed.

^:)^

[Santos L Halper]

Originally posted by TheeGrumpy
Why print them on paper? Doesn't everybody have a display device? Heck, in 150 years the kids will probably use MacPaint instead of crayons. So why bother with hardcopy?

How else can they stick them on the fridge with magnets? :)

Eric

[NghtCrwlr]

Let's not forget Jadzia Dax :)

Originally posted by Ethilrist
Originally posted by carnivorousplant
Originally posted by Sycorax
get her off the ship
It will never happen. Since Seven of Nine, there has to be an attractive woman for the 14 yeat old males. Rats.
So, was the Snowman cool or not? Nice ears.

Umm, hi. Before Voyager, there was this show called DS9, and a character named Kira Nereise. But before that there was STNG, and somebody named Counselor Troi. You might want to watch some reruns.

Now, now, Katisha, you know "poop wher it is" captions are red-zoned. Heck with the DFC--I miss IADL.