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03-28-1999, 09:29 AM
In Indiana you have to be 18yo to ring up alcohol sales on a register. (legal drinking age 21) The <18's can bag the beer but can not touch the beer button. What's with this? Their is no age limit on ringing up tobacco sales.(legal age 18 in IN)

03-28-1999, 09:39 AM
Is it somehow related to contributing to the delinquency of a minor? I know here in Texas you can take an underage person into a liquor store but they cannot carry the liquor out of the store. One time I had my 17 yr. old in there with me and I had bought several things. I had to make two trips to the car because they wouldn't allow him to carry it.

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Kathy

03-28-1999, 11:23 AM
In Indiana you have to be 18yo to ring up alcohol sales on a register. (legal drinking age 21) The <18's can bag the beer but can not touch the beer button. What's with this? Their is no age limit on ringing up tobacco sales.(legal age 18 in IN)

I live in Ohio, and one of my uncles lived in Indianapolis for a few years. One weekend when I was 12 years old, we went to visit him and to see the Bills play the Colts. Afterwards, we decided to go out for an early dinner, and ended up at a place that was set up somewhat like an Applebee's, with a restaurant that had a bar in the middle.

About halfway through the meal, a manager came up and asked for my ID. My parents looked confused and said "She's 12 years old and she's drinking Coke, why do you want her ID?" The man replied by saying that in Indiana law, people under 21 couldn't be in a place with a visible bar. Needless to say, we were rather upset, considering the fact that the hostess had let us in and seated us, and the waiter had taken our order and given us food before anyone had bothered to tell us we weren't allowed to eat there. By the time they determined that we HAD to leave, we were almost finished with the meal. We left...without paying.

After this, my uncle described one of the other more idiotic Indiana liquor laws. Not only can you not buy alcohol at all on Sundays (that's the case in a few states), but the beer and wine in supermarkets is actually TAKEN OFF THE SHELVES. Walk into a grocery store on Sunday, and there are a few shelves that are completely bare.

All this makes me glad that a) I live in Ohio, which has rather permissive liquor laws, and b) I'm going to be of age in a week.



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--elm

I'm trying to see things from your point of view, but I can't get my head that far up my ass.

03-28-1999, 11:27 AM
I had the misfortune to work in a large chain store (whisch shall remain nameless). It seemed like to me that the intentionally made the job harder on the cashiers. We also had to call an older employee to the register if someone bought alcohol. They had to type a special code into the register to allow the sale, verifying that they, and the purchasor were over the age of 21. We were allowed to bag it, afterward, but running it across the scanner was forbidden under pains of a long lecture. We also were not allowed to scan tobacco if we were under the age of 18. This was the store's rule, not the law, and no one I asked seemd to know why.
I checked out the Ohio Revised Code, (which is a nifty book to have in your posession). It states in 4301.22 "No intoxicating liquor shall be handled by any person under twenty-one years of age, except that a person undeer 18 years of age or older employes by a permit holder may handle or sell beer or intoxicating liquors in sealed containers in connection with wholesale or retail sales, and any person ninteen years or older may handle liquor in open containers when acting in the capacity of a server in a hotel, resturant club, or night club . . . This section does not authorize persons under 21 years of age to sell intoxicating liquor across a bar." I think that most stores believe that it is the law, and enforce it accordingly. They just never bother to check.

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lissa

03-28-1999, 11:29 AM
Don't feel bad about the bar, Drain Bead. If they were so negligent as to let you in, serve you, etc, then they deserve to lose money. I suspect that they usually ignore this law, but for some reason decided otherwise for you. Maybe the state inspector had scheduled a visit that day. ;)

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"I had a feeling that in Hell there would be mushrooms." -The Secret of Monkey Island

03-28-1999, 11:47 AM
In Pacific Grove, California,they just now made a new law that states clearly that the police can arrest a person under 21 for drinking privately in their house. However, if the underage person is sitting in public, say on the steps of the police station and drinking alcohol, the police can only write a citation.

Yeah, dumb laws from dumb city councils. Can't wait till they arrest everyone in church for serving diluted port wine during communion to the kids.

03-29-1999, 12:26 AM
I would assume that the law prohibiting underage people from ringing up alcohol sales is meant to prevent them from ringing it up for themselves. I know there's lots of ways around this, but that's laws for you.

03-29-1999, 02:19 PM
How about the California law that says you can't sell alcohol to an intoxicated person? Not very good for repeat business. Is it like that everywhere? An intoxicated person cannot buy gasoline either, regardless of wheather they're driving or not. Not a bad idea, actually.

Markxxx
12-24-1999, 11:43 PM
We have a Dominick's grocery store that won't sell anyone alcohol unless they produce an ID. I was behind one guy who was old enough to be God's grandfather and they refused him. He was upset.

BobT
12-25-1999, 01:33 AM
When I worked at a drive-in store in California, the boss, aka my father, told us that it was a state law that people buying beer had to come in to the store to buy it. We couldn't bring it out to the car. I never found that law on the books, but it seemed to make sense. Supposedly, watching someone walk in to the store would give you a chance to judge if they were intoxicated.

So was my father telling the truth or did he misinterpet some long ago California law>

Commander Fortune
12-25-1999, 10:50 AM
In Colorado -

I believe you only have be 18 to sell liquor in a grocery or liquor store. However, you have to 21 to sell/serve liquor in a restaurant. Unopened container vs. open container.

The last time I managed a restaurant, an 18-year-old could bus empty cocktail glasses, but technically wasn't supposed to bus beer bottles. The reason I was told is that because beer bottles are often made of colored glass, it is difficult to see if they are empty. Don't know if it's that way still or even if that was just the paranoid restaurant owner's interpretation of the law.

The only liquor you can actually purchase in a grocery store here is 3.2 beer. Gross. You must be 21 to purchase it. We used to call 3.2 beer "training beer" because by the time you're starting to get really drunk - it makes you hurl. Prior to the changes in the law in the mid 1980's, you could purchase/drink 3.2 beer from age 18 on, but you couldn't have anything else until you were 21. Having "watered down beer" taught the young-uns how to drink properly.

Some of the club stores (e.g.: Sam's club) have liquor stores within their stores. After talking to the employees at one of them (I was curious why Sam's Club apparently could[/] sell liquor, but not Safeway, for example) I was told that the liquor store is a completely separate entity which leases their space from Sam's club. You do not have to be a member of Sam's club to enter the premises to shop in the liquor area. In fact, the liquor area is surrounded by a ridiculously tall chain link fence (yes, inside the store) that has a gate with a ridiculous weight of chain and a padlock on it...as if. Must be for Sundays.

Until the laws changed in the mid-80, you could not purchase liquor at all, anywhere, on Sundays. (BLACK SUNDAY) Now, since the changes, on Sundays you can go out, drive to a bar, and get shitty drunk, but you still can't purchase liquor at a liquor store on Sundays and take it home to get shitty drunk, -the liquor stores are required to be closed on Sunday. However, you [b]can purchase 3.2 beer in the grocery store on Sundays (I think) or, if your like me and wouldn't touch 3.2 unless you were near death of dehydration, you can drive the 85 miles or so to Wyoming if there is some sort of mixed drink emergency.

It is illegal to serve or sell liquor to a "visibly intoxicated" person. In fact, in Colorado, there a lg. fine associated with it if you are caught in the act, and if the person leaves your establishment and then is involved an accident, the server can be held liable. The drinker/driver and their victim can both seek criminal and civil remedy from the server as well as the owner of the establishment.

Serving an individual who is underage is a mandatory $1000.00 fine, and in Boulder (a college town) the police (who have nothing better to do like solve terrible, brutal murders) conduct frequent stings on both liquor stores as well as restaurants.

Commander Fortune
12-25-1999, 10:52 AM
Well I hosed the codes on that one.

*Drink mutsh?*

voguevixen
12-26-1999, 12:23 AM
As a kid in Indiana I never saw any stores where the liquor was removed from the aisles on Sundays, but I do remember some stores where the liquor aisle was roped off. I guess it depends on if they have enough liquor for an entire aisle or not. I DO remember that once my great aunt couldn't make us cookies for our visit because she was out of vanilla and they wouldn't sell it to her on Sunday because it had alcohol in it! I assumed the not having a minor ring up alcohol would have something to do with them selling it to underage friends. Having an "adult" come over to push the key would nip that in the bud.

I was at a mom & pop restaurant in Lake Tahoe over the summer where one of the kids was working the register. They served bottled beer from the ice-maker chest (I think that may be against a health code -- I know we weren't allowed to put bottled water in the ice at my theater.) The kids would serve you your soda as they rang up your order, but if anyone bought a beer, they had to walk behind the counter and grab their own. One of the customers ahead of me was European and he was completely befuddled as to why the gal couldn't just reach behind her and pass him the damn beer, lol.

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"Witnesses said
the chained helmets,
which directly faced each
other on their platforms,
seemed increasingly angry
and agitated in the
moments leading up to the
disaster."

Cooper
12-26-1999, 12:30 AM
Lissa - Its probably not so much that they believe the law is different than it is, but that legal counsel advised them they created an exposure by having a minor sell liquor.

The scenario they would be afraid of is a minor sells liquor to someone who should be buying it (a minor or intoxicated person) and that person goes and kills themself or someone else in a car accident. The store's liability could be greater than if they had adults monitoring the sale of alcohol and were taking all 'reasonable and prudent' precautions to ensure alcohol was not sold to the wrong person.

Believe me, a major chain store has a legal counsel that reviewed and recommended a policy for the store concerning sale of alcohol.

12-27-1999, 04:12 AM
Damn there's some crazy liquor laws on the books!

I experienced quite a culture shock regarding these laws when I moved from a place where every liquor store was owned by the state and you couldn't even sell beer in a supermarket or convenience store to a state where they have drive-thru liquor stores! You can pull right up to the window, buy a frozen daquiri, and drive away sipping on it.

And I always wondered what the big deal about selling alcohol after 2AM was. Is there a logical reason for this? The only place I know of to get alcohol at any hour of the day or night is the orgiastic city of New Orleans, which is not surprising.

Would it be legal for a bar to sell a customer a six-pack of beer in a cooler of ice at 1:59 AM and then let the customer sit in the bar and drink all night? I mean the alcohol was sold before 2, right ?

HeyHomie
12-27-1999, 09:33 AM
Well, I don't know how it is statewide, but when I lived in Joplin, MO (Jasper County) the Wal-Mart cashier, if she was under 21, could ring up all of your purchases except for the booze and then call over an older cashier to do it. Now, in Crawford County, if you're purchasing booze, you can't go to a line that has an underage cashier! They have a big sign that says (paraphrased): "Cashier under 21. Alcohol purchases, please go to another aisle."

OpalCat
12-27-1999, 10:27 AM
After this, my uncle described one of the other more idiotic Indiana liquor laws. Not only can you not buy alcohol at all on Sundays (that's the case in a few states), but the beer and wine in supermarkets is actually TAKEN OFF THE SHELVES. Walk into a grocery store on Sunday, and there are a few shelves that are completely bare.

Wow! That would be hard to do in Arizona, where grocery stores typically have several aisles or a whole section for liquor... Actually it wasn't until I was about 22 or so when I went to Texas to dance for a month for the first time that I realized that liquor laws varied from place to place. I was shocked that you couldn't buy, say, a bottle of vodka at the grocery store. Seemed silly to me. I live in Virginia now and it seems silly to me here, too. In AZ you couldn't buy alcohol after 1am, here in VA the state-owned (!?!?!) liquor stores close at NINE PM and aren't open at all on Sundays.

Oh, and Texas is WEIRD. It varies from place to place...sometimes within the same city! And the time you're allowed to buy something can vary depending on what it is... like you can buy beer and wine later than you can buy liquor...

Very strange.

Oh, in AZ you have to be 21 to buy any alcohol at all, and 19 to serve it.

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Kent4mmy
12-27-1999, 10:56 AM
In my part of NY, hard liquor is not sold in supermarkets or convenient stores...only beer and wine coolers. Liquor stores are open 8-9am to 9pm and closed on Sunday. You cannot purchase beer or wine coolers from the supermarket before noon on Sunday. Bars are open until 4am mon-sat and close early on Sunday. You must be 21 to purchase alcohol of any (drinking) kind. The BAC limit is 0.10 for legal driving (about one beer)If you claim to be an alcoholic, you cannot be arrested for public intoxication (you are simply exhibiting symptoms of the disease of alcoholism). And, I think, teens caught drinking and driving get their licences yanked for a year on the first offense.

Arken
12-28-1999, 08:02 AM
Wow, guys... you must have gone to the part of Indiana that I'm not from.

First of all, yes, you cannot sell liquour in Indiana on sundays... EXCEPT:

Establishments serving hot food (popcorn is excepted) are allowed to sell liquour. Several bars in my town with small kitchens stay open on sunday. You are not allowed to buy carry-out liquour from these establishments.

Secondly, no, the stores do not have to take the liquour off their shelves on sunday. That would be time-consuming and ridiculous, especially in liquour stores where the contents of the shelves is only liquour.

Thirdly, the story about your aunt not being able to buy vanilla extract on Sunday is nuts. They want to stop you from buying alcoholic beverages, not anything in the world with alcohol in it! I've never bought vanilla extract, but I've certainly bought scope, rubbing alcohol and even cakes with brandy in them on sundays. Not sure about cooking sherry. The leagal types basically just don't want you to get schnockered on the sabbath.

Fourthly, minors ARE allowed to be within sight of an open bar if they are working or if the open bar is in a private club. As someone who performed in several bars when he was under 21, I know this.

Lastly, although we have the sunday blue laws, Indiana is fairly tolerant compared to many states. Of course, we have the aforementioned alcohol on sundays if you serve food law. Also, bars are open 'till 3 a.m. the rest of the week and liquour stores are open 'till midnight.

So... we're not all THAT bad.

voguevixen
12-28-1999, 02:11 PM
That is a TRUE story about my aunt. Why would I make up something that lame? This was in absolute Podunk and they do whatever the hell they want.

12-29-1999, 11:22 AM
In Virginia, you can't drink publicly without a permit. Organized festivals have roped-off areas where their permit allows drinkers to drink. But as a private citizen having a picnic in the park, you can't pull out a brewsky and drink it.

Restaurants that serve alcohol and have outdoor seating must have that area marked off with a rope/chain/half-height wall. Once, I was once drinking a beer on a patio area. I wanted to talk to a friend on the other side of it, and the easiest way over there was to walk on the public sidewalk and go around the chained area. As I was talking to her, the waitress came out and told me I had to be within the chained area to drink. I stepped over the chain, but put my feet exactly back where they were, so the chain was against the back of my calves. "That's better," she said after I'd moved.

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Everybody got to elevate from the norm - Rush

BurnMeUp
12-29-1999, 11:56 AM
In Utah where i used to live, the same held true for people selling liquor in stores, in fact if you ordered a drink in a restaraunt and the server was underaged, they had to have another server bring it to you.

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I didn't *get* anything... I had to pay $50 and pick up the garbage!