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-   -   Hoarding and untidiness in teenage rooms. Are they modern illnesses (https://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=877631)

Nansbread1 06-24-2019 12:23 PM

Hoarding and untidiness in teenage rooms. Are they modern illnesses
 
Lets look at Hoarding at home. Some of the TV programmes ( usually within the last decade) shows Hoarders to be mainly older folk who cannot control their untidy homes and make it even more untidy, room by room until they have access to only a few metres of the room. I am sure you have seen these programmes. So is this a modern day illness? Or was it reported in 18th century and earlier.

A similar vein. Teenage rooms, including my own children in their twenties, are an incredibly terrible mess. All their clothes on the floor food and used dishes and cutlery on every inch of space. Most parents know this and live with it. Is this also a relatively modern illness? Considering that children with own rooms is a relatively modern phenomena. Have there been any studies on why teenagers are unable to see the filth around them?

Dinsdale 06-24-2019 12:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nansbread1 (Post 21714299)
...Mist parents know this and live with it. Is this also a relatively modern illness? Considering that children with own rooms is a relatively modern phenomena. ...

Not sure what you mean by relatively modern. My kids are in their late 20s-early 30s, and most of their contemporaries had their own rooms. We did not live with what you describe. ISTR some parents talking about their kids not keeping their rooms clean. I never understood that. My kids didn't have the choice. And they were not allowed to take food to their rooms.

Each parent is relatively free to fuck up their kids how they wish! ;)

Great Antibob 06-24-2019 12:48 PM

How would you really tell? Having enough possessions to be capable of being untidy is itself a modern condition. The items you did have were used regularly. If you had sufficient possessions lying around not being used daily, you were probably also wealthy enough to have servants tidy up for you.

Also, this does seems like stereotyping. Plenty of teenagers don't live in squalor and keep tidy rooms. Then again, complaining about how "kids these days" are different from past generations has also been going on for thousands of years.

ETA: when you do achieve a certain level of wealth and status, it's not really considered 'hoarding' anymore. Note the extensive collections held by the nobility and royalty of Europe, much of which served no better purpose than taking up an increasing amount of space rather than being actively enjoyed.

Darren Garrison 06-24-2019 01:13 PM

Well, the average teen being rich enough to accumulate lots of material goods and have a personal space to scatter them is pretty modern. For most of history, they would be living 20 to the room and own two rags and a stick.


(ETA or what the post above mine said.)

Machine Elf 06-24-2019 01:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Great Antibob (Post 21714371)
ETA: when you do achieve a certain level of wealth and status, it's not really considered 'hoarding' anymore. Note the extensive collections held by the nobility and royalty of Europe, much of which served no better purpose than taking up an increasing amount of space rather than being actively enjoyed.

Owning a large, well-curated collection is not considered hoarding.

Compulsive hoarding happens when you gather or keep irrationally large amounts or types of objects to the point that it causes you distress or impairs your safety, health, or ability to live a normal life. It's not the simple laziness of teenagers, it's a major mental illness. If you tidy a teenager's room, they won't give a damn. If you try to tidy a hoarder's house, they are likely to have a major panic attack and do their damnedest to stop you because one of these days they might need that very thing you're trying to discard.

Signs and Symptoms of Compulsive Hoarding

AIUI, one of the earliest well-documented cases of hoarding was the Collyer brothers, who died amidst their hoard in 1947.

Colibri 06-24-2019 01:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Machine Elf (Post 21714475)
AIUI, one of the earliest well-documented cases of hoarding was the Collyer brothers, who died amidst their hoard in 1947.

Whom my parents used to reference when discussing the state of my room when I was a teen in the 1960s.:D

Voyager 06-24-2019 03:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Colibri (Post 21714540)
Whom my parents used to reference when discussing the state of my room when I was a teen in the 1960s.:D

Mine too. I know messy rooms were a thing 60 years ago when I was a kid. I was perfectly neat, of course. :D

I suspect there were shouts of "get these bones out of your part of the cave" quite a while ago.

Machine Elf 06-24-2019 03:35 PM

OK, I found a much earlier reference to hoarding: Dante's Inferno.

Quote:

Here too, I saw a nation of lost souls,
far more than were above: they strained their
chests against enormous weights, and with mad howls
rolled them at one another. Then in haste
they rolled them back, one party shouting out:
“Why do you hoard?” and the other: “Why do you waste?”
“Hoarding and squandering wasted all their light
and brought them screaming to this brawl of wraiths.
You need no words of mine to grasp their plight.”
See also Hoarding in History. Bottom line, hoarding ain't a modern thing at all.

Machine Elf 06-24-2019 03:41 PM

See also The Evolution of Hoarding, which delves into the cultural and historical factors that feed into our perceptions of hoarding and the kinds of behaviors that compulsive hoarders engage in.

RickJay 06-24-2019 03:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nansbread1 (Post 21714299)
A similar vein. Teenage rooms, including my own children in their twenties, are an incredibly terrible mess. All their clothes on the floor food and used dishes and cutlery on every inch of space. Most parents know this and live with it. Is this also a relatively modern illness? Considering that children with own rooms is a relatively modern phenomena. Have there been any studies on why teenagers are unable to see the filth around them?

The teenager's room as a disaster zone has been a common thing for as long as there have been teenagers with their own rooms.

As has been pointed out, messiness is not "hoarding" in any useful sense of that term.

EdelweissPirate 06-24-2019 05:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nansbread1 (Post 21714299)
Teenage rooms, including my own children in their twenties, are an incredibly terrible mess. All their clothes on the floor food and used dishes and cutlery on every inch of space. Most parents know this and live with it. Is this also a relatively modern illness?

No; it’s not modern. In fact, anthropologists and evolutionary psychologists have determined that immature prefrontal cortexes inhibit not only tidiness, but also the ability to get off your lawn.

In all seriousness, the kids are all right. They always have been, regardless of their elders’ moral panics.

doreen 06-24-2019 05:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dinsdale (Post 21714309)
Not sure what you mean by relatively modern. My kids are in their late 20s-early 30s, and most of their contemporaries had their own rooms.

"Relatively modern" is well, relative and of course, also depends on socioeconomic class.. My late 20 year old kids had their own rooms - but it was because I only had two of them - if I had three, two of them would have had to share. Most of my contemporaries did not have their own rooms until an older sibling or two moved out unless they were the only sibling of their gender.

Omar Little 06-24-2019 06:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nansbread1 (Post 21714299)
A similar vein. Teenage rooms, including my own children in their twenties, are an incredibly terrible mess. All their clothes on the floor food and used dishes and cutlery on every inch of space. Most parents know this and live with it. Is this also a relatively modern illness? Considering that children with own rooms is a relatively modern phenomena. Have there been any studies on why teenagers are unable to see the filth around them?

Any adults living in your home should be under a form of rental agreement, that lays the requirements for occupying space there (i.e. the amount of rent due, conditions of cleanliness, responsibilities of shared spaces, etc.), violations of which can result in eviction.

Nava 06-24-2019 11:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RickJay (Post 21714812)
The teenager's room as a disaster zone has been a common thing for as long as there have been teenagers with their own rooms.

And little kids, and tweens, and...

My extended family included homes you could visit with little to no warning, others you could not. A time that we visited one of these impressed me mightily by having a collection of used toilet paper rolls living atop the washer in the bathroom; to this day I don't know whether they bred or simply hadn't been cleaned out in months. The only room which wasn't a disaster area was the kitchen. I took one look around and understood perfectly well why we always met those particular cousins anywhere but at their home.

BigT 06-25-2019 12:20 AM

It's just an issue of a teenager's priorities, and possibly a lack of discipline. If it's clean enough for them to use, then they just don't see the point in doing any extra work. Plus teens aren't the best long term planners, so realizing that it will eventually build up to be more of a chore they will be forced to deal with just often isn't on the radar.

And the teen brain continues well into the mid-twenties, as the whole "18 means you are an adult" is an entirely arbitrary concept not related to biology, which is why the number has been different in different eras, and even now isn't consistent across all places for all issues.

BigT 06-25-2019 12:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Omar Little (Post 21715073)
Any adults living in your home should be under a form of rental agreement, that lays the requirements for occupying space there (i.e. the amount of rent due, conditions of cleanliness, responsibilities of shared spaces, etc.), violations of which can result in eviction.

In my experience, people don't become that formal unless absolutely necessary.

And I don't know anyone who suddenly changes the entire housing relationship with their kid like that at an arbitrary age. Humans don't generally want to completely uproot a system that is currently working. They'll tweak it first to accommodate new situations. So, for example, they have to get a job or go to college. Maybe they pay some rent. Maybe their chores increase. But nothing formal.

As for the concept of eviction, most parents don't want to consider it. And, most of the time, such talk is completely unnecessary. Most kids want to move out.

No, I've never known anyone to go formal tenant/lessor unless the kid (or other relative) was clearly taking advantage of the relationship. Or as a sort of face saving measure if the adult kid winds up having to move back home for financial reasons.

chappachula 06-25-2019 02:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nava (Post 21715573)
a collection of used toilet paper rolls living atop the washer in the bathroom

Please tell me that you meant "empty" toilet paper rolls, not "used". :)

We used to collect 'em when I was five or six...they're very useful for playing with.


(Play the "telephone" game, use them as binoculars to spy on adults in the next room, stack them up like pyramids, make a chain out of them by running a string through them, so you can........hmm...well, ya know, I never did figure out why my sister did that... :) )

Nava 06-25-2019 03:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by chappachula (Post 21715678)
Please tell me that you meant "empty" toilet paper rolls, not "used". :)

Empty would be minus the cadaver...

chappachula 06-25-2019 03:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nava (Post 21715686)
Empty would be minus the cadaver...

mmm---a cadaver.....Now that would have been a good toy!

Nava 06-25-2019 04:27 AM

Piling up several of them atop the washing machine might have been complicated, though. At least it was a front loader, you wouldn't need to move the corpses out of the way any time you wanted to break up another pair of socks.

Royal Nonesutch 06-25-2019 07:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dinsdale (Post 21714309)
And they were not allowed to take food to their rooms.

I can understand not allowing a 5 year-old to have food in their room, but when the kids were 15, were they still not able to take something to eat into their room as long as they were responsible and cleaned up when they were done?

Did you (the parent) ever take a snack into your bedroom?

ftg 06-25-2019 08:07 AM

For most families up until modern times teens would not have had a bedroom to themselves.

Greater affluence and modern small family sizes would allow a kid to have a room of their own.

(And rich families of yore that could afford it would have had domestic help to clean up after them.)

My mother's family once lived in a two room shack for 8 people total. It's now a very small one-car garage. Even one person being messy was intolerable. (They even lived in a tent for a short while before that.)

I think the "luxury" of being a messy teen is for the most part modern.

Oredigger77 06-25-2019 08:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Royal Nonesutch (Post 21715818)
I can understand not allowing a 5 year-old to have food in their room, but when the kids were 15, were they still not able to take something to eat into their room as long as they were responsible and cleaned up when they were done?

Did you (the parent) ever take a snack into your bedroom?

I certainly wasn't allowed food in my room at any point growing up. I suppose I could have snuck food up there and then cleaned up really well but it was certainly easier to just eat straight out of the refrigerator.

I didn't care about cleanliness until I was 25 or so and had just bought a house and I wanted to keep it in good shape so I hired a weekly housekeeper. Really there is no benefit to cleanliness aside from maintaining your home. The little bit of good feeling I have coming home to a clean house is completely erased if I'm the one who has to do the cleaning. When I was a kid I only cleaned as much as my parents made me and once I was in college I didn't clean until I had a reason to.

D'Anconia 06-25-2019 08:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Royal Nonesutch (Post 21715818)
I can understand not allowing a 5 year-old to have food in their room, but when the kids were 15, were they still not able to take something to eat into their room as long as they were responsible and cleaned up when they were done?

Did you (the parent) ever take a snack into your bedroom?

We eat at the kitchen table, or less often, in the dining room. Not in the family room, and never upstairs in the bedrooms.

The mess, the smells, the potential for bugs, ugh.

Nava 06-25-2019 08:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Oredigger77 (Post 21715922)
I certainly wasn't allowed food in my room at any point growing up.

We were allowed "stuff you eat" but not "meals". Your midafternoon sandwich, yes, if you were capable of eating it without the room looking like Hansel and Gretel just went through. Your drink, yes, again so long as there hadn't been any accidents involving liquids since we could remember. But not anything you'd eat out of a bowl or plate. I think we've actually yelled at Mom more often for leaving candy wrappers and yoghurt containers in the living room than at any other family member for leaving food debris anywhere.

pulykamell 06-25-2019 08:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Royal Nonesutch (Post 21715818)
I can understand not allowing a 5 year-old to have food in their room, but when the kids were 15, were they still not able to take something to eat into their room as long as they were responsible and cleaned up when they were done?

I'm trying, but I can't for the life of me remember ever eating anything in my room, either. Certainly not a meal. Maybe a bag of chips, but I don't remember that, either. I don't remember it being expressly forbidden, though. I just don't think it occurred to me to eat in my room. (Unlike now, when I eat in my "room"/office quite frequently.)

TRC4941 06-25-2019 09:38 AM

Both of my kids had sloppy rooms when they were teenagers. Clean and dirty clothes on the floor drove me nuts. My daughter was the worst. She'd clean it after she was threatened - no going out with friends unless your room gets cleaned up. But it was back in all its glory within a couple of days. I just learned to keep her door closed so I wouldn't have to look at it and realize that I didn't have to sleep in there (thank God).

She now had her own home and it always immaculate.....except for the kids' rooms. Haha - payback stinks!

I too think it's a more modern thing. I always shared a room with a sister (60s -70s). Our room would get messy but not too horrible. We'd be told to clean it on occasion. But another thing is our mom did not work outside of the home for most of our childhood. Which was much more common back then. Mom had the time to keep the house clean. These days, parents barely have time to make meals.

And going back further in time, kids didn't have the number of toys and clothes they have now. Look at the closets of an older home. They were the size of a broom closet (if that's even a thing anymore!) People only had a couple of changes of clothes. It's pretty hard to leave a pile of clean clothes mixed with dirty clothes and wet towels when you only have one outfit for school/church and one for play and probably only a couple of towels for the entire family.

kayaker 06-25-2019 10:52 AM

My son and daughter each had their own bedrooms and they kept them pretty neat. They also would periodically want to "remodel", changing the theme of their room, color of the walls, etc. I played along.

ftg 06-25-2019 12:00 PM

Another tale about how different things were.

In order to have a messy room you need to have things. Kids 100 years ago generally didn't have enough stuff to make a proper mess.

One specific example, again from my mother: I was scanning and tagging family pictures years ago. One was a grade school group picture. I asked her when that was taken. She knew it was 6th grade. Why? She was wearing her 6th grade dress. The only dress she wore to school that year.

It's hard to leave a big pile of clothes on the floor when you only have a handful of items.

This also reminds me of a related thing. The junk on farms. All the old family farms, their neighbors, etc. had a bunch of junk just lying around. Old farm equipment that hadn't been used in decades. Rusting out trucks and cars. Just random crap.

I wonder if pre-industrial age farmers kept around so much stuff.

doreen 06-25-2019 12:45 PM

Quote:

We eat at the kitchen table, or less often, in the dining room. Not in the family room, and never upstairs in the bedrooms
.
Quote:

I certainly wasn't allowed food in my room at any point growing up. I suppose I could have snuck food up there and then cleaned up really well but it was certainly easier to just eat straight out of the refrigerator

With these two quotes in particular , I can't help but wonder if you are strictly talking about meals. I've certainly known people who restricted small children's eating to the kitchen/dining room, but I can't say I've ever known a family where the older children and adults sat at the kitchen table to eat popcorn. Nor can I really imagine what "clean up really well" means if you're talking about eating a candy bar.

Nava 06-25-2019 01:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kayaker (Post 21716298)
My son and daughter each had their own bedrooms and they kept them pretty neat. They also would periodically want to "remodel", changing the theme of their room, color of the walls, etc. I played along.

My mother had a great solution when I started wanting to put up posters: large cork planks. We could do anything we wanted regarding reorganizing stuff in closets and shelves, and on the corks. If we wanted to go beyond that... where's the money? No money? Well, when you have the money I'll call the painters. The corks in my old room got removed a long time ago, those in my brothers' old room are still there and now get reorganized by the grandkids.

Quote:

Originally Posted by doreen (Post 21716545)
I can't say I've ever known a family where the older children and adults sat at the kitchen table to eat popcorn. Nor can I really imagine what "clean up really well" means if you're talking about eating a candy bar.

For the first, I've never known a family which ate popcorn in the house. For the second, allow me to introduce you to my mother and her mother, and to their trails of wrappers (mom) and fruit peels (both).

TRC4941 06-26-2019 09:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nava (Post 21716666)
My mother had a great solution when I started wanting to put up posters: large cork planks. We could do anything we wanted regarding reorganizing stuff in closets and shelves, and on the corks. If we wanted to go beyond that... where's the money? No money? Well, when you have the money I'll call the painters. The corks in my old room got removed a long time ago, those in my brothers' old room are still there and now get reorganized by the grandkids.



For the first, I've never known a family which ate popcorn in the house. For the second, allow me to introduce you to my mother and her mother, and to their trails of wrappers (mom) and fruit peels (both).

What :confused: You've never heard of people eating popcorn in the house?!

Nava 06-26-2019 09:07 AM

I've heard of it, and seen it in movies. I've never met anybody who did, AFAIK. Some of my American coworkers may have, I guess.

doreen 06-26-2019 10:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nava (Post 21716666)
For the first, I've never known a family which ate popcorn in the house. For the second, allow me to introduce you to my mother and her mother, and to their trails of wrappers (mom) and fruit peels (both).

"Clean up really well" strikes me as being more involved than throwing a fruit peel or wrapper in the trash. That seems like it would be ordinary "cleaning up".

Colibri 06-26-2019 01:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nava (Post 21718226)
I've heard of it, and seen it in movies. I've never met anybody who did, AFAIK. Some of my American coworkers may have, I guess.

If you know any Americans at all, I assure you know a lot of people who did it. Where do you think people eat most microwave popcorn? About 70% of popcorn in the US is eaten in the home. And Americans have done that since forever. We made Jiffy Pop since the 1950s. And most popcorn consumed at home is probably eaten in the living room while watching TV.

Guinastasia 06-26-2019 11:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by D'Anconia (Post 21715946)
We eat at the kitchen table, or less often, in the dining room. Not in the family room, and never upstairs in the bedrooms.

The mess, the smells, the potential for bugs, ugh.

No popcorn or chips in front of the TV? Seriously? I keep a bottle of water beside my bed, in case I get thirsty at night.

Colibri 06-27-2019 12:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Guinastasia (Post 21720022)
No popcorn or chips in front of the TV?

The only proper way to eat popcorn is with a fork.

Oredigger77 06-27-2019 09:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by doreen (Post 21716545)
.



With these two quotes in particular , I can't help but wonder if you are strictly talking about meals. I've certainly known people who restricted small children's eating to the kitchen/dining room, but I can't say I've ever known a family where the older children and adults sat at the kitchen table to eat popcorn. Nor can I really imagine what "clean up really well" means if you're talking about eating a candy bar.

When I was small enough that my parents supervised me eating candy at say Halloween or Easter it would be eaten at the dinning room table once I was old enough to procure my own candy (16+) I really didn't eat it any more or if I did it would be at a gas station while I was running around I certainly wouldn't save it to bring back to my room.

As far as popcorn, I wasn't watching movies in my bedroom so that was done in the living room where food was ok. Heck, most of our dinners were eaten in front of the TV. I guess i have the opposite problem, why would you bother to carry something small to your room instead of eating it where you got it from and if it is something like ice cream or popcorn why aren't you sitting some where with a table so you don't drop any on the floor? I've got a coffee table that has a top that lifts up to a comfortable eating height in front of my tv for exactly this reason.

TRC4941 06-27-2019 09:15 AM

Just about all manner of snacking is done in the living room in front of the TV at my house. Same when I was a kid. I don't think I could watch a movie without eating some kind of snack. Popcorn, chips, pop, pizza rolls, ice cream, Twizzlers, and hard to believe, but sometimes................ even fruit!

It's just me and my husband at home now so we even eat our dinner while we watch TV unless it's something overly messy like sloppy joes or tacos or something that involves cutting like steak or pork chops. Pizza is the best thing to eat while watching TV.

aruvqan 06-27-2019 09:24 AM

Born 1961, always had my own bedroom [except for the couple of years I was in boarding school, that is.] We were never allowed to eat in our bedrooms unless we were bedridden-sick, though a glass of water was OK. We had a 'playroom', my brother and I each had a toy chest and bookshelves of our own - and not the plethora of toys that kids of the 70s and 80s seem to have had. We were raised to pick up after ourselves, and we also didn't have huge wardrobes - 3 or 4 dressy sets mainly for holidays or formalish occasions like out to fancy dinner. We had school clothes - most of my years I had specific uniforms, and typically 5 sets of uniforms and 3 sets of athletic gear for phys ed classes and team uniforms for sports. I had 4 or 5 sets of 'play clothes; for hanging around being a kid, and 3 or 4 swimsuits. I started doing my own laundry when I was 10, and kept my room tidy though Mom did the vacuuming and dusting. To this day I can clean just fine, I simply hate to do it. Mom had maids off and on over the years, but I still had to keep my stuff picked up. We turned the play room into a tv and hang out room when we grew out of toys.

doreen 06-27-2019 01:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Oredigger77 (Post 21720470)
As far as popcorn, I wasn't watching movies in my bedroom so that was done in the living room where food was ok. Heck, most of our dinners were eaten in front of the TV. I guess i have the opposite problem, why would you bother to carry something small to your room instead of eating it where you got it from and if it is something like ice cream or popcorn why aren't you sitting some where with a table so you don't drop any on the floor? I've got a coffee table that has a top that lifts up to a comfortable eating height in front of my tv for exactly this reason.

Because plenty of people ( including children and teenagers) do in fact watch movies or do homework or use a computer or whatever .. in their bedroom.

Colibri 06-27-2019 01:29 PM

Since the factual question in the OP hasn't been addressed for several days, let's move this to IMHO.

Colibri
General Questions Moderator

aceplace57 06-27-2019 04:56 PM

Messy teenage rooms have been a thing for almost a hundred years. (that's roughly when people could afford extra possessions)

It's true there's more electronic gadgets and accessories lying around.

But very little has changed since my parents childhood. Most Kids are naturally messy and that behavior has to be monitored and corrected by their parents.

pulykamell 06-27-2019 05:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nava (Post 21718226)
I've heard of it, and seen it in movies. I've never met anybody who did, AFAIK. Some of my American coworkers may have, I guess.

I assure you, the vast majority of your American coworkers have. Now, I don't like popcorn. It's a pointless snack to me. But it still somehow ends up in my house every once in awhile. (Last time being for my daughter's 5th birthday, somebody sent us a dozen bags of various types of flavored popcorn.) But even growing up, to European-born parents, we occasionally had microwave popcorn in the house.

manson1972 06-27-2019 08:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nava (Post 21718226)
I've heard of it, and seen it in movies. I've never met anybody who did, AFAIK. Some of my American coworkers may have, I guess.

You don't eat popcorn when watching a movie? Is that just an American thing?

Guinastasia 06-28-2019 09:46 PM

This thread gave me a craving for popcorn, which I am sitting on my bed, eating in front of my laptop.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Colibri (Post 21718948)
We made Jiffy Pop since the 1950s. And most popcorn consumed at home is probably eaten in the living room while watching TV.

Never having had Jiffy Pop, I must ask -- is it REALLY as much fun to make as it is to eat? ;)

Colibri 06-28-2019 10:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Guinastasia (Post 21723807)
Never having had Jiffy Pop, I must ask -- is it REALLY as much fun to make as it is to eat? ;)

Yes! That was the best thing about it! It was as much fun to make as it was to eat! You got a real feeling of accomplishment when the foil inflated.

Making stovetop popcorn with just oil and a pan is I think something of a lost art. We didn't do it when I was a kid, but I learned to do it in college. I've met people who didn't know that you could even make popcorn that way.

Spectre of Pithecanthropus 06-28-2019 10:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Machine Elf (Post 21714776)
Quote:

Originally Posted by Dante Aligheri

Here too, I saw a nation of lost souls,
far more than were above: they strained their
chests against enormous weights, and with mad howls
rolled them at one another. Then in haste
they rolled them back, one party shouting out:
“Why do you hoard?”

OK, I found a much earlier reference to hoarding: Dante's Inferno.



See also Hoarding in History. Bottom line, hoarding ain't a modern thing at all.


I've always interpreted this to mean hoarding gold or money, as a miser.


From what I've seen and read, modern-day pathological hoarding could not exist without the mass production of cheap goods. The Collyer brothers did have a number of interesting artifacts from earlier in their lives, but most of the space in their house was taken up by things like old newspapers. Langley Collyer saved years and years of newspapers, as he said, so his brother could "catch up on the news" when he recovered his eyesight.

nearwildheaven 06-29-2019 04:26 PM

Extend this to automobiles when the kids are old enough. My friend's daughter was called into the office when the school's social worker saw her car; the SW wrote down the license plate number and was concerned that she might be living in her car, because she had so much junk in it. THAT prompted her to shovel it out.

Said friend's stepson, who is the same age (literally 1 day apart!) used to have a biohazard sign on his door. Not a poster for the band Biohazard; literally a poster with that circle thing on it.

carrps 06-29-2019 04:50 PM

Re: popcorn. I've been known in the past to have popcorn for dinner. I like popcorn. If I'm feeling flush, I'll splash out on some Garrett's Chicago Mix. Yummers!


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