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poohpah chalupa 11-30-2000 11:15 PM

On the Island of Misfit Toys, in addition to Charlie-In-The-Box and a choo-choo train with square wheels (among others), there was a red-haired rag doll. What was her name and why was she a misfit?
Also, the (flying) Lion King was named King Moon something

Can anyone help here or do I need to impatiently await for some cable network to broadcast it?

Thanks.

astorian 11-30-2000 11:26 PM

I know that King Moonracer was the ruler of the Island of Misfit Toys, but have no idea what was supposed to be that pigtailed doll's defect (other than that she was annoying).

Incidentally, most kid's would probably LIKE a water pistol that squirts jelly!

jayjay 12-01-2000 12:13 AM

Nobody seems to know about the doll. This page, which denotes characters' script names in ALL CAPS, calls her the MISFIT GIRL DOLL and says that producer Arthur Rankin and script writer Romeo Muller both state that the doll's problem is psychological rather than physical, but give no details. There is a link at the bottom of the cited page to a second page continuation.

chique 12-01-2000 04:15 AM

IIRC, the doll's problem was that she was always sad, and who wants to give their little girl a sad doll?

Of course, I'm the one that can never rememeber the name of the elf who wanted to be a dentist, so I'm probably wrong.

screech-owl 12-01-2000 06:08 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by chique
Of course, I'm the one that can never rememeber the name of the elf who wanted to be a dentist, so I'm probably wrong.
Ernie?

AWB 12-01-2000 06:30 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by chique
Of course, I'm the one that can never rememeber the name of the elf who wanted to be a dentist, so I'm probably wrong.
Herbie or Hermey? I think the former, but the IMDb lists the former in the plot and the latter in the cast list.

Why A Duck 12-01-2000 08:23 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by AWB
Quote:

Originally posted by chique
Of course, I'm the one that can never rememeber the name of the elf who wanted to be a dentist, so I'm probably wrong.
Herbie or Hermey? I think the former, but the IMDb lists the former in the plot and the latter in the cast list.

Don't get me started. This one almost cost me a friendship. Every sane person knows the elf is Hermey. Listen to the show, it's obvious.

Of course, this is the same friend that I got into a big argument over the implied race of the anthropomorphic syrup bottle in the Mrs. Butterworth ads. (Don't ask)

ElvisL1ves 12-01-2000 08:28 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by AWB
Quote:

Originally posted by chique
Of course, I'm the one that can never rememeber the name of the elf who wanted to be a dentist, so I'm probably wrong.
Herbie or Hermey? I think the former, but the IMDb lists the former in the plot and the latter in the cast list.

Definitely Herbie.

pldennison 12-01-2000 08:31 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by ElvisL1ves
Quote:

Originally posted by AWB
Quote:

Originally posted by chique
Of course, I'm the one that can never rememeber the name of the elf who wanted to be a dentist, so I'm probably wrong.
Herbie or Hermey? I think the former, but the IMDb lists the former in the plot and the latter in the cast list.

Definitely Herbie.

Definitely Hermey. I have the DVD.

screech-owl 12-01-2000 08:39 AM

Not Ernie.
Not awake yet.
That's what I get for typing before thinking.
Sorry.

We now return you to the Hermey/Herbie debates.







It's Herbie on the closed captioning, but who's gonna believe me.

don Jaime 12-01-2000 10:12 AM

They said "Herbie" on MST3K. That's good enough for me.

Mrs. Butterworth is supposed to be white. I think you're confusing her with Aunt Jemima.

jayjay 12-01-2000 10:23 AM

Same URL as my last post states that it's HERMEY in the script.

jayjay 12-01-2000 10:26 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by don Jaime
They said "Herbie" on MST3K. That's good enough for me.

The Brains have been known to get details wrong on occasion. They completely missed the fact that every exterior shot in "Space Mutiny" was Battlestar Galactica stock footage, which definitely deserved a riff. The script says the elf's name is HERMEY, so that's pretty much the authority.

don Jaime 12-01-2000 10:39 AM

WHOOSH!

poohpah chalupa 12-01-2000 10:48 AM

thanks for the info, jayjay...while it doesn't answer my question, it does put a definitive interpretation (by the creators) to it.
Psychological problems? This opens up a whole can of provocative worms (another misfit toy?). Is she clinically depressed (as alluded to by chique)? Bi-polar? Does she slut around (maybe that's why the elephant is spotted)?

Ukulele Ike 12-01-2000 11:19 AM

Hey! My FATHER'S name was Hymie!

jayjay 12-01-2000 12:07 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by don Jaime
WHOOSH!
Ya know, I hear that sound all the time...usually right after I post something. Wonder what it is?

;)

August West 12-01-2000 01:33 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Ukulele Ike
Hey! My FATHER'S name was Hymie!
Oh, it was not. :)

Elf's name was Hermey (or possibly hermie), we had a three day bar argument about this one once.

poohpah chalupa 12-01-2000 01:43 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by ChiefWahoo
Elf's name was Hermey...we had a three day bar argument about this one once.
oops.
I guess I should've posted this on the GD board.

:D

drpepper 12-01-2000 01:51 PM

My vote is Hermy (with an 'm', anyway).

Also, it's been years since I've seen it, but didn't the doll have a button eye that was hanging by a thread or something?

pldennison 12-01-2000 01:56 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Ukulele Ike
Hey! My FATHER'S name was Hymie!
"Oh, I'm just wild about Hymie,
and he's just wild about me!
Oh, I'm just wild about Hymie,
and he's just wild about,
cannot live without,
he's just wild about me!
H-Y-M-I-E! H-Y-M-I-E-H-Y-M-I-E!
Hymieeeeee!"

--D. Duck

Doctor Jackson 12-01-2000 02:03 PM

Actually, the dolls's name was Hoosier. She was deemed a misfit because, instead of "Mommy!", she said "Daddy!". After all, would you give your daughter a "Hoosier Daddy" doll?

Actually, maybe I just made that up.

Inky- 12-01-2000 03:08 PM

I have it on good authority that the misfit doll was a boy doll trapped in a girl doll's body.

And as for the elf guy, I have him pegged as "Hermie" myself.

City Gent 12-01-2000 03:32 PM

Was it just me, or did the "Abominible (sic) Snowmonster" scare holy hell out of anyone else?

As a young'un, I was in such pants-shitting terror of him that I would refuse to let my parents turn the TV back on once he made his appearance. Happened every year until I was at least...who am I kidding, it still happens.

Oh, and it is definitely "Hermey"

MovieMogul 12-01-2000 03:35 PM

The IMDB lists him as Hermey

Freudian Slit 12-01-2000 04:30 PM

Rudolph's voice was so cute. :)
"Okay, King Moonracer!"

And the little reindeer who couldn't fly...

One question I have: how does the father Reindeer (Donner?) originally cover up Rudolph's nose? Hitting him on the nose? Ah I call child abuse on that....:D

Anake 12-01-2000 04:38 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Zoggie
One question I have: how does the father Reindeer (Donner?) originally cover up Rudolph's nose? Hitting him on the nose? Ah I call child abuse on that....:D
I believe in the cartoon he scraped some mud from the cave ground and put it on Rudolph's blinking nose. I always thought Donner was a bastard, the way he treated his own son. Plus, Rudolph's mom (does she have a name?) never backed Rudolph up.

From,

Anake

PS: It's Hermie.

minlokwat 12-01-2000 06:42 PM

Anyone catch the sinister assassination plot at the end of the cartoon? (Just like the Munchkin suicide on the Wizard of Oz, only different.)

At the end of the cartoon, Santa is flying on his sled and an elf is seen releasing all of the newly-rescued misfit toys.

The elf gives either a parachute or umbrella-like device --which works just as well in the cartoons-- to all of the toys.
Then the elf comes to a bird.

The bird had previously indicated an inability to fly which was the cause of his/her misfit status.

The elf equips all of the other toys with some means of flight except for this one particular toy (watch it and you'll see) who no doubt plummets to an untimely and gruesome death.

While it is possible that during the interim, the bird somehow acquired the ability to fly, that scenario seems highly unlikely.

Any other eagle-eyed observers notice this nefarious twist of events?

DrFidelius 12-01-2000 08:55 PM

FWIW, I have long thought that the doll was a lesbian. Either that or a cross-dresser.

Astroboy14 12-01-2000 10:28 PM

City Gent, not only did the 'bumble scare the hell out of me as a child... I still get goosebumps whenever I see Rudolph!!

DAVEW0071 12-01-2000 10:39 PM

Well, we have it on videotape, and it's traditional to watch it every Christmas season. It's also traditional for Dad (i.e. me) to corrupt the show with my own interpretive salvos. During the Misfit Toy Song, when they get to the part that goes, "A scooter for Jimmy, a dolly for Sue. The kind that will even say, How do you do" I always sing, "The kind that will even say, Up yer wazoo." In a gravelly, Brooklyn truck driver voice. This, in my estimation, makes the doll a real misfit.

Not only that, but I have noticed the assassination plot. I have even gone so far as to make pleading noises when each toy is tossed out of the sleigh and scream piteously as they plummet. It sure livens up the evening and somehow brings the true meaning of Christmas home to my loved ones.

I always thought the elf's name was Herbie, but I defer to the DVD and the IMdB. Also the CIA, the FBI and the FDIC.

Gilligan 12-01-2000 10:43 PM

I just hope Mad TV airs "Raging Rudolph" again this year.

Freudian Slit 12-01-2000 11:17 PM

Yes, Donner wouldn't win father of the year award.

The red haired doll's problems were "psychological"? That just sounds a bit odd- being that this is a kid's TV special. Are we reading into this a bit much, or is Rudolph more profound than we thought?

Oh! And remember the head elf, who was so obsequious around Santa, but a real dictator with the other elves?
"Thank you, Santa!...That sounded TERRIBLE! The tenor section was weak!"
Real ass kisser. :)

If it comes on again this year, I have to watch it. Its been so many years!

ElvisL1ves 12-02-2000 10:40 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Anake
Plus, Rudolph's mom (does she have a name?) never backed Rudolph up.
Maybe she was Olive? The other reindeer?

OK, the elf was Hermie, I give up. My daughter says so.

monkeylucifer 12-02-2000 12:22 PM

Un-named misfit lesbian doll
 
Unfortunately, the doll is not named. If you check out the website for the newly released action figures from the show, you can see that the doll comes packaged with Rudolph, and is refered to as "the Misfit Doll". Hermey comes with dentist's tools and pulled teeth from the Bumble (Bumble sold seperately)!!!!

If you want to learn more about Bumbles and elfs who wish to be dentists, then visit your local library and check out The Enchanted World of Rankin/Bass.

Man, how I live for moments such as this, when my normally useless knowledge sees a brief shining moment in the sun.

Beruang 12-03-2000 10:59 PM

Hermie. Definitely.

I thought it was "King Moonraiser."

The doll is manic-depressive. Watch her mood swings. That makes her a misfit.

"A Cowboy Who Rides An Ostrich" would be a kick-ass name for a rock 'n' roll band.

The annual airing of "Rudolph" on CBS marks the OFFICIAL start of the Christmas season. This year it's on Tuesday, December 5.

Silver and gold, silver and gold...

Beadalin 12-05-2000 05:37 PM

It's going to be on CBS tonight! WOO HOO!

Also, I just bought the Yukon Cornelius and Rudolph figurines (Rudolph's nose lights up!) and the elf is listed as "Hermey" on the back of the boxes. I always thought it was Herbie, but I guess not.

minlokwat 12-05-2000 07:01 PM

Yes it's on tonight, CBS 8:00 EST.

It just occurred to me that we really should have included some SPOILER warnings in this thread. You know... just in case. :-)

BurnMeUp 12-05-2000 07:04 PM

I always thought the "Dentist" angle was a thinly veiled term for homosexuality. Like when Hermie and Rudolf meet and Hermie says "you don't mind that i'm .... a dentist" with his effeminate voice...

it's don't ask don't tell time for Rudolf and Hermie

Freudian Slit 12-05-2000 09:10 PM

So many things i never picked up. Lets ask Esprix what he thinks of Hermie. (Yes, HerMIE.)

Also it was pretty sexist, but in a laughable way.
"Mrs. Donner wanted to go too, but Donner said, 'No, this was men's work."

And...
"They figured they'd best get the womenfolk back to Chrimastown."

Plus Rudolph's mom never had her own name.

Paraphrasing there a bit.
I guess reindeer never had a liberation movement.

My dad was making fun of the movie- since it was a bit hokey looking...but still, its a classic! And I did notice the bit with the owl at the end.

Cabbage 12-05-2000 09:23 PM

Yep, I watched it again tonight for the first time in many years. The bird murder scene was quite cruel. There's the elf, equipping each toy with its own personal umbrella to guide it safely down to earth, until he comes to the bird. The elf even pulls out an umbrella, opens it, holding bird in one hand, umbrella in the other, as if to give one final taunt. The viewer is expecting the elf to hand over the umbrella at any moment, when suddenly, with no change of expression and showing no remorse, the elf simply tosses the bird over the sled, with complete and utter disregard for any sanctity of life.

Oh, the humanity.

Hail Ants 12-05-2000 10:30 PM

My brother was watching this with his kids. He had pounded a few beers and when Mrs. Clause starts shouting, "eat Santa, eat!", he came back with, "yeah, drink Santa, drink!" Been something of a partying catchphrase ever since.

Anyway, is the person (I always assumed a woman) who voiced Rudolph still around? (S)he was somewhat famous in the voiceover business, having done such characters as Speedy the Alka-Seltzer guy and Davie from Davie & Goliath (that religious kid's show).

BobT 12-06-2000 01:30 AM

At the end of the show, Santa's sleigh only has seven reindeer on it.

As for the voice of Rudolph, it was Billie Mae Richards. She was in a movie as recently as 1997.

MovieMogul 12-06-2000 03:51 AM

Quote:

Yep, I watched it again tonight for the first time in many years. The bird murder scene was quite cruel. There's the elf, equipping each toy with its own personal umbrella to guide it safely down to earth, until he comes to the bird. The elf even pulls out an umbrella, opens it, holding bird in one hand, umbrella in the other, as if to give one final taunt. The viewer is expecting the elf to hand over the umbrella at any moment, when suddenly, with no change of expression and showing no remorse, the elf simply tosses the bird over the sled, with complete and utter disregard for any sanctity of life.
I just watched it tonight too and saw something completely different. All the other toys before the bird grabbed the umbrella; it looked like the elf was waiting for the bird to do the same, but the bird looked at the umbrella, and then chose to fly off itself (a miracle!). I also did not see the elf's right arm (the one without the umbrella) move, so IMHO no tossing occurred.

Cabbage 12-06-2000 07:47 AM

Ladies and Gentlemen of the jury, now that the defense has given his closing statement, the case is now in your hands.

Did the elf, as I claim, ruthlessly and maliciously deny this bird an umbrella? An umbrella which would provide him free passage from Santa's sled, down to the surface of the earth. An umbrella, without which my client would most assuredly plummet to certain death upon arrival at his destination, being that he is a bird gifted with swim, however, deprived of flight.

Or, as ArchiveGuy, elf defense attorney, claims, did this bird suddenly gain an ability to fly, and therefore willfully waive any and all rights to possession of the umbrella upon this discovered ability.

I ask you--Has an ostrish ever been known to soar among the clouds? Has an emu ever flapped from treetop to treetop, sailing through the wind? I think not; a bird, at once without flight, shall always be without flight.

Ladies and gentlemen of the jury, I am outraged. If the bird does not fly, it shall surely die.

This case is now yours to decide.

ladybug 12-06-2000 08:45 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Cabbage
Yep, I watched it again tonight for the first time in many years. The bird murder scene was quite cruel. There's the elf, equipping each toy with its own personal umbrella to guide it safely down to earth, until he comes to the bird. The elf even pulls out an umbrella, opens it, holding bird in one hand, umbrella in the other, as if to give one final taunt. The viewer is expecting the elf to hand over the umbrella at any moment, when suddenly, with no change of expression and showing no remorse, the elf simply tosses the bird over the sled, with complete and utter disregard for any sanctity of life.

Oh, the humanity.

I mentioned this in another thread last night. I've watched Rudolph every year for as long as I can remember, but somehow I only noticed the part with the bird about five years ago.

It seems that all these years we've been watching a toy homicide passed off as wholesome family holiday entertainment.

He was pushed, I tell you! Pushed!

poohpah chalupa 12-06-2000 09:10 AM

Guilty!
Hang the bastard elf!

Esprix 12-06-2000 11:14 AM

It was just on TV last night, actually, and I do have the videotape.

Personally I think Hermie and the Charlie-in-a-box have a little something-something going on, knaamean? ;)

Esprix

WIGGUM 12-06-2000 11:14 AM

Some of you are very close, but you simply have the facts mixed up.

The doll was actually a hermaphrodite. I've watched the film frame by frame, and in one scene, a breeze blows the doll's dress up, and both sexual organs are clearly visible for two full frames. Consequently, it is the doll and not the elf who is named "Hermie" for obvious reasons.

Glad to be of help.

Inky- 12-06-2000 12:15 PM

I watched it last night as well and just realized that there were a bunch of really out of date references in it, kind of like those old Bugs Bunny cartoons from WWII or those Woody Woodpecker cartoons where he's stealing ration books.

I got that there was a Phil Silvers elf (of the old Sgt. Bilko show, pretty big in it's day). He was the bald elf with the thick, black glasses who was lazing off and eventually as comeuppance gets stuffed in a bag. But who the heck was/is Burl Ives? How'd he manage to get top billing?

Was Hermie supposed to be based on Liberache?

Was the Charlie in the Box suposed to be Ray Bolger (scarecrow from "Oz") or maybe he might be based on Joe Besser?

Anybody catch any others?

On a side note: I think Santa should have combined the misfit toy bird who swam instead of flying with a toy fish who flew instead of swimming, then given them to a dyslexic kid. Sadly, the swimming bird was killed by the homicidal elf before this could happen.


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