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ITR champion 10-19-2018 10:08 PM

The Kamala Harris thread
 
A new poll of 2020 Democratic Presidential contenders shows no surprises for the top two spots. Joe Biden has a big lead at #1 and Bernie Sanders sits comfortably at #2. But at #3, surprisingly, is Kamala Harris with 9%. This is much better than she's done in previous polls and ahead of other contenders such as Elizabeth Warren. So perhaps it's time to start taking Harris seriously.

It seems she'll be advertising herself as a no-nonsense, won't-back-down progressive and indeed, there are some cases where she has been such. For example, she has always opposed the death penalty, even when it earned her aggressive disagreement from Dianne Feinstein.

There have been plenty of cases, however, where she brought her no-nonsense, won't-back-down attitude to the opposition of what progressives would normally support. As prosecutor and attorney general in California, she got felony conviction rates to go up, and bragged about it. Then there's the Daniel Larsen case, in which an innocent man was sent to prison, and later had his conviction overturned. The Attorney General's office under Harris fought to keep him in prison for years, even after the case brought down a torrent of publicity. Jacobin magazine has compiled a long list of reasons why progressives might not be so happy with Harris' record, ranging from police shootings to mass incarceration and basic civil rights of prisoners. And then there's her refusal to prosecute certain banks that went on crime sprees during the financial crisis. (One of the worst offenders was run by Steve Mnuchin, currently a member of Trump's cabinet.) It's not hard to imagine some of these things coming back to haunt her, much as the Goldman Sachs issue haunted Hillary.

In a perfect world there would be no need to mention the fact that Harris would be the first woman of color to make a serious run for the presidency. Today's media environment is far from perfect, however. She could easily collect countless accolades from the New York Times and other legacy media sources, all focused on the "historic" nature of her candinacy. But there seems to be a large and growing gap between the media and Democratic voters. The media has an obsession with identity characteristics of candidates; the voters want policy, especially younger voters. In 2016 younger Democratic voters preferred Bernie to Hillary, even among women.

Most media profiles that I've read describe Harris as black. A few mention that her heritage is half South Asian. One hesitates to mention that by physical appearance, she does not look black, though she does meet the census bureau's official definition of being black. It would be interesting to know how many black people feel what this Kos diarist feels:
As someone who cloaks herself in Blackness, Harris should understand that she was a central cog in the wheel of Black Incarceration. Either she does not, which is nearly impossible to believe considering her schooling and her association with Black culture, or she does understand and chooses to continue both racist and segregationist policies. And here is where my problems begin with Senator Harris.

Senator Harris is NOT by any stretch a Black woman. She is not African American, as was Barack Obama, though she does seek to emulate his meteoric rise to power. The junior senator from California is an Indian/Jamaican American. Not black. Not Black. Not African American.
I don't know whether enough people feel that way to have a meaningful effect in the primary, but certainly racial identity is a fraught topic that produces strong reactions, as Elizabeth Warren is finding out right now.

HurricaneDitka 10-19-2018 10:34 PM

I hope she wins (the primary)

John Mace 10-20-2018 10:19 AM

Oy. She doesn't "look black"? Does Valerie Jarrett "look black"? Not only is Jarret black, in the common parlance of race in America, but she's one of the few blacks whose "family lore" of some Native American ancestry is proven out by DNA testing.

Anyway, it would be a mistake for the Democrats to nominate her as their presidential candidate in 2020. I think she's just too liberal for the role given the realities of the Electoral College. The Democrats need to remember: It's the Electoral College, stupid!

RTFirefly 10-20-2018 10:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by John Mace (Post 21277674)
Oy. She doesn't "look black"?

Saw plenty of her during the Kavanaugh hearings (which probably caused a bump in her support; she favorably impressed me). The only way I'd have known she was black is that I've already been informed of the fact.

HurricaneDitka 10-20-2018 11:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by John Mace (Post 21277674)
... Anyway, it would be a mistake for the Democrats to nominate her as their presidential candidate in 2020. ...

Not to derail this thread, but as a quick sidebar: Who do you think it would not be a mistake for the Dems to nominate in 2020?

RTFirefly 10-20-2018 11:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ITR champion (Post 21277221)
A new poll of 2020 Democratic Presidential contenders shows no surprises for the top two spots. Joe Biden has a big lead at #1 and Bernie Sanders sits comfortably at #2. But at #3, surprisingly, is Kamala Harris with 9%. This is much better than she's done in previous polls and ahead of other contenders such as Elizabeth Warren. So perhaps it's time to start taking Harris seriously.

People with high name recognition are always high up in the polls at this point in the cycle. At this point in the 2004 cycle (the last cycle that wasn't effectively narrowed way down on the Dem side before it really began), Joe Lieberman was comfortably ahead. So that's why Biden and Sanders are up there, and the TV exposure that Harris got during the Kavanaugh hearings probably explains why she's ahead of the rest of the pack - for the moment.
Quote:

There have been plenty of cases, however, where she brought her no-nonsense, won't-back-down attitude to the opposition of what progressives would normally support. As prosecutor and attorney general in California, she got felony conviction rates to go up, and bragged about it. Then there's the Daniel Larsen case, in which an innocent man was sent to prison, and later had his conviction overturned. The Attorney General's office under Harris fought to keep him in prison for years, even after the case brought down a torrent of publicity. Jacobin magazine has compiled a long list of reasons why progressives might not be so happy with Harris' record, ranging from police shootings to mass incarceration and basic civil rights of prisoners. And then there's her refusal to prosecute certain banks that went on crime sprees during the financial crisis. (One of the worst offenders was run by Steve Mnuchin, currently a member of Trump's cabinet.) It's not hard to imagine some of these things coming back to haunt her, much as the Goldman Sachs issue haunted Hillary.
Obviously very few potential 2020 primary voters are focusing on her California record at this point, because very few potential 2020 primary voters are thinking about 2020 more than superficially at this point. (I've got November 6, 2018 on my mind right now; 2020 can wait.)

Plenty of time for issues like this to be raised during the primary campaign.

AK84 10-20-2018 11:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HurricaneDitka (Post 21277704)
Not to derail this thread, but as a quick sidebar: Who do you think it would not be a mistake for the Dems to nominate in 2020?

Not John Mace but they need find the whitest, blandest man they can.

Arjuna34 10-20-2018 11:26 AM

Also not John Mace, but I'd suggest Jim Webb.

RTFirefly 10-20-2018 11:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Arjuna34 (Post 21277720)
Also not John Mace, but I'd suggest Jim Webb.

Jim Webb's got a pile of problems, which were evident in the 2016 primary season. (I've managed to forget what they were, but he's not the guy that more than a handful of Dems are looking for.)
Quote:

Originally Posted by AK84 (Post 21277718)
Not John Mace but they need find the whitest, blandest man they can.

Sure, so they can bore their own voters to death while the GOP base shows up.

As a Dem primary voter, my attitude is: we'll see who catches fire next year.

voltaire 10-20-2018 11:55 AM

Who needs John Mace? Booker/Biden, Biden/Booker is the dream team ticket - who gets which job almost doesn't matter. They could even go gimmicky and say Biden takes the top spot for the first term, then steps into the supporting role for the next two!

ETA: Ok, maybe just the next one, I got a little carried away... :)

Ulfreida 10-20-2018 11:57 AM

I'm from California and Kamala Harris favorably impressed me -- smart, principled, energetic, and not tied to Big anything. She is not as easy to pigeonhole as Warren and Sanders.

I'm sure the Right will hate her to death for being a woman far more than being any non-white race.

snowthx 10-20-2018 12:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ulfreida (Post 21277764)
I'm from California and Kamala Harris favorably impressed me -- smart, principled, energetic, and not tied to Big anything. She is not as easy to pigeonhole as Warren and Sanders.

I'm sure the Right will hate her to death for being a woman far more than being any non-white race.

Agree. They will find ways to portray her as an uppity woman, and at that an uppity black woman, to feed their base.

IMHO, I like Harris, but I fear she may be too polarizing a figure. For the Democrats to win the election, they need cross-over appeal to people in the center, as well as from the moderate right. Does Harris appeal to anyone other than progressives and liberals? I just remember the old saying "Democrats fall in love, but Republicans fall in-line".

AK84 10-20-2018 12:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ulfreida (Post 21277764)
I'm from California and Kamala Harris favorably impressed me -- smart, principled, energetic, and not tied to Big anything. She is not as easy to pigeonhole as Warren and Sanders.

I'm sure the Right will hate her to death for being a woman far more than being any non-white race.

:dubious:
She is basically a female, Democratic Ted Cruz (look it up, their professional background is spookily similar). She’ll get evicerated by Trump, like he did.

Lamoral 10-20-2018 12:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AK84 (Post 21277718)
Not John Mace but they need find the whitest, blandest man they can.

White, maybe...though I don't think it's as important as some do. Man, yes. Bland, NO. We don't want another Tim Kaine. We need someone with the moxie and aggression and charisma necessary to go toe-to-toe with Trump and make him choke on the debate stage.

Lamoral 10-20-2018 12:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RTFirefly (Post 21277761)
Jim Webb's got a pile of problems, which were evident in the 2016 primary season.

Pile of problems, no. His only problem was that he was very rigid and seemed uncomfortable on the debate stage - something that could be solved with proper coaching and guidance and practice. I think a guy who made it through the Naval Academy and the Vietnam War can be taught those things. He'd be a killer candidate against Trump. The problem is, he's too conservative of a Democrat to get nominated.

Tamerlane 10-20-2018 01:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ulfreida (Post 21277764)
I'm from California and Kamala Harris favorably impressed me

Are you from the SF area? Just curious, because see below.

Quote:

Originally Posted by snowthx (Post 21277779)
Does Harris appeal to anyone other than progressives and liberals?

Man, San Francisco progressives did not much like Kamala Harris :p. But then SF progressives tend to think of Dianne Feinstein as Republican-lite. Not saying they represent progressives in general - they very much do not. The Bay Area left skews harder left than much of the national progressive left. Still, it always tickles me seeing the disconnect between how local politicians are viewed and categorized versus wider state and national takes. From the New Yorker on San Francisco:

All of San Francisco’s eleven supervisors are liberal Democrats. The city has not had a Republican mayor since 1964. Somehow, rather than bringing unity, this common ground is scored with difference. The supervisors are said to be divided into progressives, who lean furthest left, and moderates, who lean somewhat less so. The distinction mostly comes down to positions on development (progressives are bullish on subsidized housing; moderates accept more market-rate), local business (moderates embrace growth), tech (progressives are wary), and policing (moderates favor heavier enforcement, sometimes for managing homelessness).

Kamala Harris was considered part of the "moderate" wing. Here's a view from the harder left.

guizot 10-20-2018 01:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by John Mace (Post 21277674)
Oy. She doesn't "look black"?

Well, I don't need to tell you that Obama is just as much "white" as he is "black," but people call him "black" because, in popular discourse, whiteness is a measure of "purity." It's just like people saying "minorities" when what they really mean is "non-whites." "Whites," as defined by the Census, are less than 50% of Los Angeles, so they're only a plurality, but everyone still understands the term "minority" to mean "non-whites." These terms are often just as much about ideological underpinnings as they are about anything concrete in the real world.

Rick Kitchen 10-20-2018 01:27 PM

Senator Harris's mother is Shyamala Gopalan, born in India. Her father was born in Jamaica.

voltaire 10-20-2018 01:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AK84 (Post 21277798)
She’ll get evicerated by Trump, like he did.

Or, she'll evicerate Trump... as B&B's Attorney General. ;)

DrDeth 10-20-2018 03:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ITR champion (Post 21277221)
But at #3, surprisingly, is Kamala Harris with 9%. This is much better than she's done in previous polls and ahead of other contenders such as Elizabeth Warren. So perhaps it's time to start taking Harris seriously.

It seems she'll be advertising herself as a no-nonsense, won't-back-down progressive and indeed, there are some cases where she has been such. For example, she has always opposed the death penalty, .

When I ask "but what has Harris done?" the usual answers are "she's black", "a woman" and 'a progressive".

Yes, she opposed the Death penalty, which means she joins about half of America. The difference is, she ran for AG, and took a oath to uphold the laws of California- which include the Death penalty.

Most here in CA view her as a "San Francisco Liberal", which is by no mean complimentary. In fact , in CA she isnt all that popular. Yes, she won, but against no GOp candidates and had three times the cash as her democratic opponent.

She is violently against guns, and in fact took advantage of a weird legal loophole to ban the sale of all new handgun models in CA, as she ruled that microstamping was available, and thus no new gun models could be sold without it: (wiki) Dealers may not sell any new handgun unless it is listed in the state Department of Justice roster of handguns certified for sale. Listed handguns must include certain mechanical features and pass a set of laboratory tests. Private party transfers, curio/relic handguns, certain single-action revolvers, and pawn/consignment returns are exempt from this requirement.[39] Sale to law enforcement personnel are exempt from list restrictions.

Microstamping
On May 17, 2013, the state attorney general began enforcing a new law requiring that semi-automatic pistols incorporate microstamping.[40] With this technology, very small markings are engraved, using a laser, on the tip of the firing pin and on the breechface of the firearm. When the gun is fired, these etchings may be transferred to the primer by the firing pin, and to the cartridge case head by the breechface, using the pressure created when a round is fired. If successful, this imprints two identifying numbers, unique to that gun, on each spent cartridge casing.[41] This requirement applies to new guns being added to the California Department of Justice's roster of handguns certified for sale; semi-automatic handgun models already listed on the roster are not required to incorporate microstamping. Note of interest - this law was passed in 2007 and the wording in the law stated that it shall become effective when there are at least two companies, unencumbered by a patent, employing this technology. To date, no manufacturer offers this technology in firearms available to the public.[42]

Ulfreida 10-20-2018 04:06 PM

ha ha, "violently" against guns. You're a riot with the punning.

John Mace 10-21-2018 09:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RTFirefly (Post 21277699)
Saw plenty of her during the Kavanaugh hearings (which probably caused a bump in her support; she favorably impressed me). The only way I'd have known she was black is that I've already been informed of the fact.

Perhaps I wasn't clear, but the point is that there isn't a certain way to "look black" because being black in America is more than just how strangers perceive you. Sure, that's part of it, maybe even a big part of it, but it's not all of it. When you live in a household where one parent is obviously black, you're going to get treated differently growing up no matter what you look like. Also, keep in mind that lots of black women straighten their hair. I don't know that Harris does, but you might perceive her differently if she wore her hair short and natural.

I wasn't meaning to imply that anyone seeing a picture of Harris would immediately think "oh, she's black". And, btw, I'm probably not telling you anything you don't know. I just wanted to clear up where I was coming from.

Budget Player Cadet 10-21-2018 10:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ITR champion (Post 21277221)
the voters want policy

...I'm not sure where you get this impression. The candidate who ran on "policy" in the last election lost toe the candidate whose list of policies was 8 vague goals he was obviously incapable of actually doing. People may not give a shit about identity, but they super don't give a shit about policy.

septimus 10-21-2018 10:27 AM

I want to see Ms. Harris on the stage. She may make a good Veep pick. No, do not offer her the #1 job until she's served as V.P.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tamerlane (Post 21277836)
Kamala Harris was considered part of the "moderate" wing. Here's a view from the harder left.

It's hard to do anything of consequence without offending someone. Ms. Harris does have achievements to be proud of:
Quote:

[As District Attorney for San Francisco, Kamala Harris launched the Back on Track program which led to the] city’s recidivism rates dropping from 54 percent to 10 percent in six years.
What has Bernie Sanders done that has had direct effect on the real world?

But because 13 years of consequential decisions as a top prosecutor will inevitably have controversy, the GOP will find "liberal" actions to be enraged about, and the Bernie-Bro types will find "non-liberal" decisions to hate. Maybe all the D's can hope for now is a relatively inexperienced person with little in the way of record, good or bad. Is that why the young Senator Obama could run successfully?

septimus 10-21-2018 10:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DrDeth (Post 21277998)
...
On May 17, 2013, the state attorney general began enforcing a new law requiring that semi-automatic pistols incorporate microstamping. ...

UIAM, this is grossly misleading. Things are not so dire for gun lovers as this sounds. The Glock-19 with a ten-round magazine, for example, is quite legal despite lack of "miicrostamping."

septimus 10-21-2018 10:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by guizot (Post 21277852)
Well, I don't need to tell you that Obama is just as much "white" as he is "black,"

Nitpick. While genealogists haven't found a white ancestor for Obama's father, Obama's mother is almost certainly 11-gt granddaughter of John Punch, a black slave. This would make the 44th President 50.0061% black and only 49.9939% white. :D

BTW, John Punch wasn't just some miscellaneous slave; he has the "distinction" of being called the "first black slave" in the American colonies! His legal status was the same as two white men, but justice was dispensed unequally:
Quote:

Originally Posted by Virginia Governor's Council, pronouncing sentence in 1640 on three servants who had fled from the planter to whom they were indentured

Whereas Hugh Gwyn hath by order from this Board brought back from Maryland three servants formerly run away from the said Gwyn, the court doth therefore order that the said three servants shall receive the punishment of whipping and have thirty stripes apiece. One called Victor, a Dutchman, the other a Scotchman called James Gregory, shall first serve out their times with their master according to their Indentures, and one whole year apiece after the time of their service is expired by their said indentures in recompense of his loss sustained by their absence, and after that service to their said master is expired, to serve the colony for three whole years apiece. And that the third being a negro named John Punch shall serve his said master or his assigns for the time of his natural life here or elsewhere.[


WillFarnaby 10-21-2018 10:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ulfreida (Post 21277764)
I'm from California and Kamala Harris favorably impressed me -- smart, principled, energetic, and not tied to Big anything. She is not as easy to pigeonhole as Warren and Sanders.

I'm sure the Right will hate her to death for being a woman far more than being any non-white race.

Big Slave Firefighting not a thing yet? Big Non-Violent Incarceration?

DrDeth 10-21-2018 02:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by septimus (Post 21278887)
UIAM, this is grossly misleading. Things are not so dire for gun lovers as this sounds. The Glock-19 with a ten-round magazine, for example, is quite legal despite lack of "miicrostamping."

Yes, because it is a older design and thus is on the list.

DrDeth 10-21-2018 02:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by septimus (Post 21278886)
I want to see Ms. Harris on the stage. She may make a good Veep pick. No, do not offer her the #1 job until she's served as V.P.



It's hard to do anything of consequence without offending someone. Ms. Harris does have achievements to be proud of:

What has Bernie Sanders done that has had direct effect on the real world?
?

Yes, I think Harris as Veep would be good.


Well, yes, Back on Track is a pretty good idea, but it is not her idea. She did push for it to be implemented, so she gets some credit.

septimus 10-21-2018 03:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DrDeth (Post 21279190)
Yes, because it is a older design and thus is on the list.

Yes, obviously. California was trying to use its economic might to influence future gun design. Texas uses its economic might to get creationism into school textbooks, Caliifornia uses its to reduce gun violence. Potato Potahto ?

Wesley Clark 10-21-2018 04:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HurricaneDitka (Post 21277250)
I hope she wins (the primary)

A lot of us were hoping that Trump would win the primary too.

Look how well that turned out for Trump's political opponents.

DrDeth 10-21-2018 04:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by septimus (Post 21279298)
Yes, obviously. California was trying to use its economic might to influence future gun design. Texas uses its economic might to get creationism into school textbooks, Caliifornia uses its to reduce gun violence. Potato Potahto ?

Well, you see, microstamping is pretty useless as a LE tool, and it simply isnt technologically feasible. It wont "reduce gun violence".

RTFirefly 10-21-2018 05:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lamoral (Post 21277815)
Pile of problems, no. His only problem was that he was very rigid and seemed uncomfortable on the debate stage - something that could be solved with proper coaching and guidance and practice.

I didn't watch any of that. He's got policy problems.

split p&j 10-21-2018 05:13 PM

None of them are black, they are only seen as black because of the one drop rule which goes way back in the US. Black people have accepted them as black in the US because there is basically no other choice here. In other countries they would not be considered to be black.

This has caused problems. You have real black people comparing themselves look wise to people that are not actually black, but society says they are. So you see black people wanting to have that look, but they can't. This is where the whole good hair bad hair with black people thing comes from. This is of course by design.


To explain my thoughts on this further, I consider Native Americans to be white. Same with Asians, Iraqi's, Syrians, Pakistanis ect. It really goes by the hair. The fact that white people don't see this is a problem with white people.

iiandyiiii 10-21-2018 06:49 PM

I like Harris and I am open to supporting her, should she run. I'll see what all the candidates say on the issues, and I'll look at their record, and I'll choose the one I think has the best combination of matching my stances on the issues and strong likelihood of beating Trump.

asahi 10-21-2018 07:18 PM

What the Democrats need is a tough guy who can somehow be progressive. Biden and Sanders are too old, and Harris isn't a tough guy. I'm sorry, but a liberal female isn't going to win the White House, and that's because not enough white women would support her.

iiandyiiii 10-21-2018 07:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by asahi (Post 21279556)
What the Democrats need is a tough guy who can somehow be progressive. Biden and Sanders are too old, and Harris isn't a tough guy. I'm sorry, but a liberal female isn't going to win the White House, and that's because not enough white women would support her.

Predictions this early are absolutely meaningless. Tons of Democrats thought there's no way a black candidate could win in '08. And tons of Democrats thought there's no way any Democrat could lose against Trump.

asahi 10-21-2018 08:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by iiandyiiii (Post 21279567)
Predictions this early are absolutely meaningless. Tons of Democrats thought there's no way a black candidate could win in '08. And tons of Democrats thought there's no way any Democrat could lose against Trump.

2020 won't be 2008. People don't understand what's about to happen.

TimeWinder 10-21-2018 08:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by iiandyiiii (Post 21279567)
Predictions this early are absolutely meaningless. Tons of Democrats thought there's no way a black candidate could win in '08. And tons of Democrats thought there's no way any Democrat could lose against Trump.

It's increasingly unclear that any of them did.

TheMysteryWriter 10-21-2018 08:30 PM

I got a funny email a couple months ago from some financial company selling info products to conservatives. And according to them Kamala Harris Is Worse Than Oprah, and she is probably going to win and turn America into a dystopian paradise. She will run on a platform where she promises to erase all student debt and she will usher in universal healthcare and universal basic income for everyone. It made me wish very much I was living in their nightmare. :D

iiandyiiii 10-21-2018 08:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by asahi (Post 21279642)
2020 won't be 2008. People don't understand what's about to happen.

Agreed, and you are included in the category of "people".

asahi 10-21-2018 09:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by iiandyiiii (Post 21279693)
Agreed, and you are included in the category of "people".

None of the Democrats believed to be in the running are going to beat Trump.

iiandyiiii 10-21-2018 09:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by asahi (Post 21279724)
None of the Democrats believed to be in the running are going to beat Trump.

We'll see. Such sweeping predictions this early are entirely meaningless. Not even worth discussing.

DSeid 10-21-2018 10:19 PM

Item the first: Betting markets (e.g. Predictit) have had her leading for a long time now, long before the polls had her high on the list. I am not too familiar with her myself but those I know who are are very impressed. Obviously those who bet have been long before the hearings. I'm willing to see if those assessments are based on good cause or not.

Item the second: I've NOT every heard that she "cloaks herself in Blackness" other than that "Kos diarist" cited in the OP. She would not be running as the Black candidate and could not expect the level of Black support that Obama got. As for how one self-identifies - Obama had an appearance that in America had others labelling him as such and embraced the label. Harris? I have no idea. I know that she overtly embraces and identifies with both aspects of her identity more than Obama ever did, and is a member of both the Congressional Asian Pacific American Caucus and the Congressional Black Caucus. I think by each she would call herself a "woman of color".

Item the third: I endorse the statement that "2020 won't be 2008. People don't understand what's about to happen." Among those people clearly is asahi. And myself. What I do know is that in 2016 Trump won among voters who wanted a change. My guess is there are lots of people who still want a change.

Item the forth: Harris straddles several of the channels. With a big field dividing the channels that may play to her advantage.

Pleonast 10-22-2018 09:41 AM

I'm a huge fan of Kamala Harris, ever since I heard some interviews of her when she was running for Attorney General. She has what it takes to be president. In an ideal world, after being elected senator twice, she'd run for president in 2024 at the end of Hillary's terms.

But we're not in that world. She should definitely run for president in 2020. She's been twice elected to statewide office in the most populous state. She has executive and legislative experience. She's not beholden to any wing of the Democratic party, which means she can unite that party. Republicans will complain about any Democratic candidate; Democrats should pay them no heed.

Even if she doesn't win the primary, a good showing will get her the vice presidential slot, or set up a future presidential run. Democrats will be wasting her talents in the Senate, but I'll be happy to keep returning her there.

Ruken 10-22-2018 11:53 AM

I honestly didn't know much about her at all before opening the thread and subsequently reading up on her. So thanks, ITR champion for pointing her out, regardless of what I end up thinking. It's really not useful for anyone to be all "not Warren/Biden/XYZ" without offering alternatives, and I'm currently being one of those people.

PastTense 01-21-2019 12:17 PM

Updating:
Quote:

Kamala Harris announced Monday that she is running for president in 2020, arguing that the time has come to fight against what she views as the injustices of the past two years of the Trump presidency.
https://www.cnn.com/2019/01/21/polit...020/index.html

Johanna 01-21-2019 01:08 PM

It think it's no surprise she's nearing the top of the polls. She inherently has great appeal like Obama did. I'm really excited she's running and I'm going to be cheering her on for all I'm worth.

aceplace57 01-21-2019 01:09 PM

Harris takes office in 2017. The voters deserve a Senator that will actually represent them instead of using the office as a platform for bigger things.

Hillary served a full term and was in her 2nd when she ran. That's a lot more responsible approach.

Folacin 01-21-2019 01:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by aceplace57 (Post 21443540)
Harris takes office in 2017. The voters deserve a Senator that will actually represent them instead of using the office as a platform for bigger things.

Hillary served a full term and was in her 2nd when she ran. That's a lot more responsible approach.

I agree with this. One of the (many) things I dislike about my new Senator Josh Hawley is how he ran in 2016 for Missouri AG specifically decrying people using one office as a ladder to a higher one, and then immediately began planning to run for the Senate.


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