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-   -   How do prisoners make alcohol in jail? (http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=251516)

chefIL11 04-17-2004 06:16 PM

How do prisoners make alcohol in jail?
 
I saw on a documentary that prisoners attempt to make alcohol in their cells... I also saw that they make it in a bag. How do they do this?

Joey P 04-17-2004 06:23 PM

Pruno

Larry Mudd 04-17-2004 06:29 PM

Just about anything can be fermented to make alcohol. Materials are purloined from the kitchen and brewed anywhere something can be hidden.

My brother spent some time in prison and told me about a jailhouse brew that he and some of his peers went in on -- it consisted of a can of tomatos mixed with sugar and yeast in a thick poly bag, sealed up and hidden in a toilet tank in one of the cells. Word came down that a cell-to-cell search was being made, so the conspirators drank their brew early. There were two downsides to the early consumption: the alcohol level was not all that it could be, and the yeast was still active, so they all ended up feeling a bit gassy.

But hey, you drinking something that spent a long time fermenting in a damned toilet, you're obviously not that fussy.

Qadgop the Mercotan 04-17-2004 06:42 PM

The diabetics will often request glucose tablets, ostensibly to take if their blood glucose runs low, but in really to use to make hooch.

The soak basins issued for foot soaks figure in the process too.

I had to learn a lot after I started practicing in a prison.

bookbuster 04-17-2004 07:10 PM

In The Great Escape they used potatoes.

Reeder 04-17-2004 07:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bookbuster
In The Great Escape they used potatoes.

Which makes a really bad tasting wine.

Padeye 04-17-2004 10:00 PM

Same way sailors do I figure. Something with sugar and a bit of yeast. Pineapple is effective if particularly vile. IIRC it had a heady bouquet somewhere between JP5 and 130 octane aviation gasoline.

David Simmons 04-17-2004 11:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Padeye
Same way sailors do I figure. Something with sugar and a bit of yeast. Pineapple is effective if particularly vile. IIRC it had a heady bouquet somewhere between JP5 and 130 octane aviation gasoline.

People who want a drink will drink almost anything. I was in Greensboro, NC at the Overseas Replacement Depot and guys used to go down town and buy moonshine. I didn't drink at the time but tasted some of it. Most of it tasted to me like dirty socks smell.

I don't know whether the guys really liked it or it tasted better because they thought they were getting away with something.

And the funny thing is, they could have gone to the Officer's Club and gotten good liquor.

casdave 04-18-2004 08:35 AM

In UK prisons this stuff is called 'hooch'

Anything with any form of sugar content can and is used, suger from the kitchens is the most common, but molasses feed used for farm animals is used too.

More sophisitcated prisoners can use grain boiled and mashed up, but these last two are only found in prisons with farms attatched.

Sugar is by far the most common method of producing alchohol, inmates will collect it and store it for use.

It is usual for oranges, or pretty much any fruit to be used to give it some kind of passable flavour.

The places selected for brewing determine how quickly it can be consumed, anywhere warm is favourite, but staff know this and so the best places are always under surveillance.

Containers are very often 5 litre containers which normally contain cleaning fluids such as disinfectant, floor polish and the like.
These are rinsed out but can leave the mark of their previous contents on the brew.

Prison staff try to ensure that empty potential hooch containers are slashed apart, I have seen rubbish bags used as liners for holes in the ground for the fermentation stage, these are camaflaged over with a thin layer of soil, greenhouses are the favourite place for this activity.

Many prisons make their own bread so yeast is not a problem, but if this cannot be obtained then mouldy bread yeast cultures are used, also yeast extracts such as marmite are used to start of the frementation process.

Hooch is often adulterated even more to make it more potent, I have heard of cases where anti-freeze has been obtained from prison vehicles to fortify it.

In low category prisons getting hold of alchoholic beverages is not difficult so hooch is fairly uncommon, but the higher security rated prisons it is a consant hunt for the stuff.

Inmates try to make it for certain times of the years, such as Christmas and news years eve, and since it usually takes about a week to ten days fermentation before the hooch can be decanted we usually do sweeps to find it during the run up to known hooch festival times.

Hooch is not the major problem in UK jails as it once was as it has long been surpassed by hard drugs, still, it does cause staff hassle as inmates are not the most intelligent of drinkers(or indeed as examples of humanity) and they can become aggressive, or make themselves seriously ill.

xvxdarkknightxvx 04-18-2004 10:37 AM

Why aren't inmates allowed to make their own alcohol in jail?

casdave 04-18-2004 03:27 PM

It can be a cause of serious disorder, stand outside a nightclub when they are clearing out and you will probably see a few drunken brawls.

The prisoners are not exactly concerned with the quality of the liquor, they take it just like any drug, to get as intoxicated as possible as fast as possible.
The stuff they make can be dangerous to health, and the way they consume it makes the risks far greater.

Why should they be able to have alchohol in prison, part of the principle of prison is denial of goods and services, so this means they have restrictions on all their possessions and these are used to provide incentive for good behaviour.

Markxxx 04-18-2004 07:57 PM

Well usually they get Lizzie to agree to make it. Then some big thug like Monnie pressures Wonky Lynn Warner into bringing in yeast from the outside job she conveniently works at. But then something usually happens and then Judy has to dump the hootch that's left after Noeline gets drunk and bashes in the new color TV making Erica, the Governour stupid.

But Judy left some hootch and they rest of the gang hid it int he fire extinguisher which when Steve used it to put out a fire sent him backwards toward the fall and yet after he fell he STILL landed on his back.

All I learned about Prison I learned from Prisoner Cell Block H.

:)

jaykay197575 07-08-2016 05:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by chefIL11 (Post 4766437)
I saw on a documentary that prisoners attempt to make alcohol in their cells... I also saw that they make it in a bag. How do they do this?

Right...you get a 5 litre tub, easily available from the cleaners, collect about 15 oranges, again easily gotten when they have the fruit option at mealtimes, about 1-2 kilo's of sugar and yeast or marmite, easily gotten from the kitchens. squeeze all the oranges into the tub, add the marmite or yeast and half the sugar, fill ip[ up halfway, and cook it every night using hot water in a mop bucket, after 4 days add the rest of the sugay and fill container right up, remember to spear holes in the lid or it will explode, give it another 6 days of cooking at night time, then drain and drink...it gets u rat-arsed but the hangover is hardcore...also when youve drained, keep the dregs at the bottom and just add more oranges and sugar to kick it off again...hope this helps

pulykamell 07-08-2016 06:24 PM

Zombie notwithstanding, why are you cooking it? Or do mean merely warming it up a bit to speed up fermentation? Because once you get in the 50C range, you're killing your yeast. And does Marmite even have live yeast cultures? I would imagine with all the salt and heat processing, it'd be dead, and any fermentation you happen to get is just happenstance.

bob++ 07-08-2016 06:34 PM

It would seem not:
Quote:

[They] add salt to a suspension of yeast, making the solution hypertonic, which leads to the cells shrivelling up; this triggers "autolysis", in which the yeast self-destructs. The dying yeast cells are then heated to complete their breakdown, and since yeast cells have thick cell walls which would detract from the smoothness of the end product, the husks are sieved out.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marmite

D.E.S.K.Top668 07-08-2016 07:05 PM

THIS is a funny, yet informative, article about the production of prison wine and a review of the result.

Peace - DESK

usedtobe 07-08-2016 08:18 PM

Hell - since I really should have asked way back when:

How do these rigs ensure ethanol (aka 'grain alcohol') instead of methanol (aka 'wood alcohol')?
I was under the impression that the heat at which the mash is cooked determined this for your basic moonshine - but I'm guessing thermometers aren't exactly common in cell blocks.
My best guess: You have to really try (i.e. increase heat, add ?) to get methanol, and whatever comes out of these 'cell block stills' is not heated enough to produce methanol.

And is the stuff called "alcohol" used as rubbing for sore muscles, cleaning stuff, etc. even vaguely related to either ethanol or methanol?

pulykamell 07-08-2016 09:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by usedtobe (Post 19464376)
Hell - since I really should have asked way back when:

How do these rigs ensure ethanol (aka 'grain alcohol') instead of methanol (aka 'wood alcohol')?
I was under the impression that the heat at which the mash is cooked determined this for your basic moonshine - but I'm guessing thermometers aren't exactly common in cell blocks.
My best guess: You have to really try (i.e. increase heat, add ?) to get methanol, and whatever comes out of these 'cell block stills' is not heated enough to produce methanol.

And is the stuff called "alcohol" used as rubbing for sore muscles, cleaning stuff, etc. even vaguely related to either ethanol or methanol?

Unless I'm misunderstanding, most of the stuff you get in cell blocks is not distilled. It's just fermented. That's what pruno and things of that nature are. Stick a bunch of sugar-rich liquid in a bag, throw in some yeast (or hope to get some natural yeast), wait, and you should get something in the 5%-15% ABV range through the process of fermentation. Concentrating further is a bit more complicated and does require a still or freeze distillation (which tends to concentrate the stuff that gets you really bad hangovers.)

usedtobe 07-08-2016 09:07 PM

Aha!

Fermentation vs distillation.

Should have seen that. Old age - it's not for the weak.

Melbourne 07-08-2016 11:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by usedtobe (Post 19464376)
Hell - since I really should have asked way back when:

How do these rigs ensure ethanol (aka 'grain alcohol') instead of methanol (aka 'wood alcohol')?
I was under the impression that the heat at which the mash is cooked determined this for your basic moonshine - but I'm guessing thermometers aren't exactly common in cell blocks.
My best guess: You have to really try (i.e. increase heat, add ?) to get methanol, and whatever comes out of these 'cell block stills' is not heated enough to produce methanol.

And is the stuff called "alcohol" used as rubbing for sore muscles, cleaning stuff, etc. even vaguely related to either ethanol or methanol?

iso-propyl alcohol, Has an -ol connected to an ixo-propyl, instead of connected to a methy or ethyl group. Drinking and fuel alcohol is fermented: alcohols for other use are produced by industrial chemical reaction.

Velocity 07-08-2016 11:17 PM

Man........is the need for alcohol that desperate?

Qadgop the Mercotan 07-09-2016 11:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Velocity (Post 19464641)
Man........is the need for alcohol that desperate?

Yes. That's what alcoholism is, a desperate desire for it.

Leo Bloom 07-09-2016 02:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Velocity (Post 19464641)
Man........is the need for alcohol that desperate?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Qadgop the Mercotan (Post 19465268)
Yes. That's what alcoholism is, a desperate desire for it.

Quoted for impact and example of truth.

People will attempt to eat rocks for hunger--and a pathology can be as essential as any instinctive life force.

As a personal aside, as shocking to me, perhaps, as this is to Velocity, is learning about the desperate and almost unthinkable ways the mentally ill will endeavor to end their lives.

HoneyBadgerDC 07-09-2016 02:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jaykay197575 (Post 19464078)
Right...you get a 5 litre tub, easily available from the cleaners, collect about 15 oranges, again easily gotten when they have the fruit option at mealtimes, about 1-2 kilo's of sugar and yeast or marmite, easily gotten from the kitchens. squeeze all the oranges into the tub, add the marmite or yeast and half the sugar, fill ip[ up halfway, and cook it every night using hot water in a mop bucket, after 4 days add the rest of the sugay and fill container right up, remember to spear holes in the lid or it will explode, give it another 6 days of cooking at night time, then drain and drink...it gets u rat-arsed but the hangover is hardcore...also when youve drained, keep the dregs at the bottom and just add more oranges and sugar to kick it off again...hope this helps


I have never heard of cooking brew. Grains are cooked only in the begaining to extract sugars. The only other reason for cooking is to distill the alcohol after the yeast has quit working.

Gilbert1984 07-12-2016 06:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Joey P (Post 4766452)

The original article contains this epic quote (epic to speakers of English English as opposed to American English)

"the Peter J. Pitchess Detention Center in Santa Clarita Valley -- hatched a scheme to let inmates pick grapes at a winery and shag golf balls at a local driving range."

I didn't know it was physically possible to "shag golf balls".

Atamasama 07-12-2016 11:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by D.E.S.K.Top668 (Post 19464273)
THIS is a funny, yet informative, article about the production of prison wine and a review of the result.

Peace - DESK

Thank you for this by the way. Very entertaining.

Irishman 07-12-2016 06:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pulykamell (Post 19464212)
Zombie notwithstanding, why are you cooking it? Or do mean merely warming it up a bit to speed up fermentation?

Considering their only source of heat is the hot water tap in their cell, they aren't so much cooking it as heating to aid fermentation.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Velocity (Post 19464641)
Man........is the need for alcohol that desperate?

You don't know the half of it. A cop at one of those anti drug seminars explained some of the bad shit people were doing for a high or to get drunk. Take a foot long loaf of french bread, trim the ends to make a cylinder, pour a bottle of liquid shoe polish through the bread, drink what comes out at the bottom.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gilbert1984 (Post 19470992)
The original article contains this epic quote (epic to speakers of English English as opposed to American English)

"the Peter J. Pitchess Detention Center in Santa Clarita Valley -- hatched a scheme to let inmates pick grapes at a winery and shag golf balls at a local driving range."

I didn't know it was physically possible to "shag golf balls".

Yeah, I caught that one.

pulykamell 07-12-2016 07:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Irishman (Post 19472744)
Considering their only source of heat is the hot water tap in their cell, they aren't so much cooking it as heating to aid fermentation.

I was wondering because hot water from a tap (around 50C) gets into the yeast killing territory. I guess if you just dunk it in that water, you'll be fine and speed the process up. Might affect the flavor negatively a bit but, well, flavor is not what we're going for in prison hooch, after all....

silenus 07-12-2016 07:30 PM

So, we've established that:

1. people will go to great lengths to alter their reality, if only for a little while
2. fermentation is a basic principle that can be practiced just about anywhere
3. jayjay197575 doesn't know what it is talking about
4. When given a choice, the red is preferable to the white
5. zombies like hooch too

si_blakely 07-13-2016 05:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by usedtobe (Post 19464463)
Fermentation vs distillation.

Remember that distillation is just concentrating the products of fermentation.

So while yeast mainly produce ethanol during anerobic digestion, they do also produce some methanol. The problem is that methanol is rather toxic, and the concentration provided by distillation is enough to make the end result lethal, if the early fraction (containing most of the methanol) is not discarded.

Leo Bloom 07-13-2016 11:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Irishman (Post 19472744)
...You don't know the half of it. A cop at one of those anti drug seminars explained some of the bad shit people were doing for a high or to get drunk. Take a foot long loaf of french bread, trim the ends to make a cylinder, pour a bottle of liquid shoe polish through the bread, drink what comes out at the bottom...

What part of the precipitate of shoe polish gets you high? Real question.

Little Nemo 07-13-2016 12:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gilbert1984 (Post 19470992)
The original article contains this epic quote (epic to speakers of English English as opposed to American English)

"the Peter J. Pitchess Detention Center in Santa Clarita Valley -- hatched a scheme to let inmates pick grapes at a winery and shag golf balls at a local driving range."

I didn't know it was physically possible to "shag golf balls".

To clear up any confusion among non-Americans, shagging balls means retrieving balls after they've been hit out into a field. It started as a baseball term.

Atamasama 07-13-2016 02:39 PM

Well, a rich gal will drink good pineapple juice
And a poor gal will do quite the same.
Yeah, but my gal she drinkin' old shoe polish
You know she'd get drunk just the same
- My Gal, The Lovin' Spoonful

Shoe polish often contains ethanol and methanol to speed the drying process. It's something you drink when you'd rather be dead than sober, like kerosene or sterno.

skdo23 07-13-2016 03:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Irishman (Post 19472744)
You don't know the half of it. A cop at one of those anti drug seminars explained some of the bad shit people were doing for a high or to get drunk. Take a foot long loaf of french bread, trim the ends to make a cylinder, pour a bottle of liquid shoe polish through the bread, drink what comes out at the bottom.

I've heard stories of soldiers doing the same thing w/ Aqua Velva during WWII.

pulykamell 07-13-2016 04:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by si_blakely (Post 19473443)
Remember that distillation is just concentrating the products of fermentation.

So while yeast mainly produce ethanol during anerobic digestion, they do also produce some methanol. The problem is that methanol is rather toxic, and the concentration provided by distillation is enough to make the end result lethal, if the early fraction (containing most of the methanol) is not discarded.

My understanding is that typically the stories you hear about people going blind or dying from illegal spirits is because they've been cut with antifreeze or industrial methanol, not improperly distilled. I've researched this before and it seems that even if you don't discard the "heads," you'll at worst suffer from a nasty hangover and the amount of alcohol you would need to drink to get methanol poisoning would kill you before you reach that point.

si_blakely 07-14-2016 03:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pulykamell (Post 19475048)
My understanding is that typically the stories you hear about people going blind or dying from illegal spirits is because they've been cut with antifreeze or industrial methanol, not improperly distilled. I've researched this before and it seems that even if you don't discard the "heads," you'll at worst suffer from a nasty hangover and the amount of alcohol you would need to drink to get methanol poisoning would kill you before you reach that point.

Yeah, there isn't too much detail on how much methanol you can get in fermented beverages, and I did search. I would suspect that when distilling a large batch of mash directly into a jug, the "heads" could well be collected into a single jug that might have sufficient methanol toxicity. But I also know that the bigger risk for drinking moonshine was distillers using piping with lead in it, or car radiators with glycol residue, even if they did not cut the product with methanol.

Hypno-Toad 07-14-2016 10:50 AM

I imagine that this is part of why cheap-ass wines like MD20/20 are so bad. They skip the expense of removing the head or tail of the distilling run and pass the misery on to the consumer.

pulykamell 07-14-2016 11:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hypno-Toad (Post 19476742)
I imagine that this is part of why cheap-ass wines like MD20/20 are so bad. They skip the expense of removing the head or tail of the distilling run and pass the misery on to the consumer.

Wines are not distilled. ETA: But, wait, is Mad Dog fortified? So, maybe, but I would suspect that cheap grain spirits industrially distilled would be careful to keep the methanol content down.

Velocity 07-14-2016 12:26 PM

Not to hijack, but is it common for alcoholic criminals to emerge from prison de-toxed, due to being deprived of alcohol?

Leo Bloom 07-14-2016 01:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Irishman (Post 19472744)
...A cop at one of those anti drug seminars explained some of the bad shit people were doing for a high or to get drunk. Take a foot long loaf of french bread, trim the ends to make a cylinder, pour a bottle of liquid shoe polish through the bread, drink what comes out at the bottom...

Quote:

Originally Posted by Leo Bloom (Post 19474109)
What part of the precipitate of shoe polish gets you high? Real question.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Atamasama (Post 19474728)
Well, a rich gal will drink good pineapple juice
And a poor gal will do quite the same.
Yeah, but my gal she drinkin' old shoe polish
You know she'd get drunk just the same
- My Gal, The Lovin' Spoonful

Shoe polish often contains ethanol and methanol to speed the drying process. It's something you drink when you'd rather be dead than sober, like kerosene or sterno.



Thanks. So it's not the precipitate, it's the solvent...and, FTR, the separated components were trapped by baguette-filtration, meaning they weren't precipitates by definition, and I was unwisely showing off some misunderstood fancy vocabulary.

So I learned two things. Three, if you count learning there is even such a thing as bread filtration.


ETA: Four, counting the song reference.

Melbourne 07-15-2016 06:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by usedtobe (Post 19464376)
How do these rigs ensure ethanol (aka 'grain alcohol') instead of methanol (aka 'wood alcohol')?
I was under the impression that the heat at which the mash is cooked determined this for your basic moonshine

The heat at which the mash is fermented is one factor in determining how much methanol you get.

Hypno-Toad 07-15-2016 09:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pulykamell (Post 19476789)
Wines are not distilled. ETA: But, wait, is Mad Dog fortified? So, maybe, but I would suspect that cheap grain spirits industrially distilled would be careful to keep the methanol content down.

Yeah, I was thinking of fortified wines like MD20/20, Night Train, and Thunderbird.

pulykamell 07-15-2016 09:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hypno-Toad (Post 19481088)
Yeah, I was thinking of fortified wines like MD20/20, Night Train, and Thunderbird.

Sure. I just doubt that they're fortifying it with methanol or poorly distilled alcohol or anything of the sort. I assume they just get some cheap Everclear-type grain alcohol and throw it in the mix.

bobot 07-15-2016 10:04 PM

Here's one for anyone who would like to try the play at home version that requires no dirty socks. Or toilets.
(Warning: 20 min long video)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RWGxmdtybs0

Leo Bloom 12-01-2016 04:49 PM

Serve with Spread:
Finding their jailhouse diet bland, monotonous, and insubstantial, inmates in the California penal system invent alternative meals. “Spread,” the generic term for these creations, describes the inmate-created foods most often built around a single ingredient, instant ramen noodles.

Beginning with this noodle base, the inmates concoct variations that approximate their favorite foods on the outside, often those with distinctive flavorings and textures. Kermit Sanders, an inmate at San Francisco County Jail 5, or cj5, as it is known for short, describes the culture of spread:

"I learned about spreads when I came to prison. Spread consists of institutional canteen commissary food items. Basically soups. Top Ramen noodles. And then from there you go to the other stuff: tuna, beef, chicken, tamales, herrings. And different things like that. You got chili-bean spreads, you got tamale spreads, you got seafood spreads.

My favorite is Going-Down-South Hog Spread. You take pig skins. On the average, when I fix spread for just me and someone else, I would take two bags of pork skins, two bags of jalapeño pretzels, four beef sticks, and I would take a big bag of Cheese Crunchies. I would grind all that down with the Top Ramen, and I call that Down-South spread, ’cuz it’s full of pork....
Full article: "“Breaking Bread with a Spread” in a San Francisco County Jail," Sandra Cate, Gastronomica: The Journal of Food and Culture, Vol. 8, No. 3 (Summer 2008), pp. 17- 24

Chronos 12-01-2016 06:34 PM

If these guys can make tasty meals (well, tastier than the normal prison fare, at least) with cheap ingredients available on the inside, why not make it official and give them jobs in the prison kitchen?

UltraVires 12-01-2016 07:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Qadgop the Mercotan (Post 19465268)
Yes. That's what alcoholism is, a desperate desire for it.

In fairness, incarceration might cause the most temperate of people to seek an escape through intoxication. The only reason that prisoners make alcohol is the reason why alcohol was the first drug invented: it's easy.

An alcoholic cannot ever drink enough. Mixing up some toilet mash isn't exactly how true alcoholics do things.

I'm not saying that these guys are not alcoholics, its just that drinking nasty prison booze doesn't necessarily make one an alcoholic.

Leo Bloom 12-01-2016 08:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chronos (Post 19823233)
If these guys can make tasty meals (well, tastier than the normal prison fare, at least) with cheap ingredients available on the inside, why not make it official and give them jobs in the prison kitchen?

A number of cases have arisen regarding a particular prepared food stuff widely served to prisoners in solitary confinement. Eg,


Nutraloaf:
Recipe courtesy of the Pennsylvania Department of Corrections:

Recipe makes 21 servings.

10 ½ cups reduced fat milk, 2%
26 ¼ cups white rice, cooked
5 ¼ cups potatoes, grated raw, flesh and skin
5 ¼ carrots, grated
5 ¼ cabbage, shredded
15 ¾ cups oatmeal, dry
15 ¾ cups garbanzo beans, with liquid, mashed
1 ½ cups margarine

Preheat oven to 350 degrees. Combine all ingredients thoroughly in mixing bowl. Place paper liners in loaf pans, scale 29-30 oz. of batter into lined loaf pan. Bake for one hour and 15 minutes. Place on wire rack and cool thoroughly.
Similar-in-style recipes, 1 meat, 1 vegetarian, are printed in this court document after inmates sued the director of the dept. of corrections claiming, among other things, cruel and unusual punishment.

In 2015 NY Prison menus were challenged as well;New York Prisons Take an Unsavory Punishment Off the Table has other references and a recipe.

slash2k 12-01-2016 08:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chronos (Post 19823233)
If these guys can make tasty meals (well, tastier than the normal prison fare, at least) with cheap ingredients available on the inside, why not make it official and give them jobs in the prison kitchen?

Where do you think they're "acquiring" a lot of the ingredients for these spreads?


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