Fuck Daylight Savings

[friedo]

It is stupid.

[Nobody]

I've been saying for a while now; Either pick DST or standard and stick with it.

Stupid farmers! (Just kidding)

[tomndebb]

Originally Posted by Nobody

Stupid farmers! (Just kidding)

Where does the odd notion that farmers support DST originate?

Farmers generally hate it.

People working in cities can take advantage of later sunlight during warmer months without having to post separate hours on the doors of offices and shops and without negotiating special hours in labor contracts. Farmers still have to go out to feed and milk animals at the same solar time, regardless, but now, some of them have to adjust their chores to match the "new" times that various purchasers will pick up their fresh milk or eggs.

Who started the weird claim that farmers like DST?

[Nobody]

Originally Posted by tomndebb

Where does the odd notion that farmers support DST originate?

Farmers generally hate it.

People working in cities can take advantage of later sunlight during warmer months without having to post separate hours on the doors of offices and shops and without negotiating special hours in labor contracts. Farmers still have to go out to feed and milk animals at the same solar time, regardless, but now, some of them have to adjust their chores to match the "new" times that various purchasers will pick up their fresh milk or eggs.

Who started the weird claim that farmers like DST?

I wasn't serious about bashing farmers, but I did think that DST was for them. Doing some Googling, it's apparently a myth. Guess you learn something new every day.

[standingwave]

Originally Posted by tomndebb

Who started the weird claim that farmers like DST?

I don't know. It's not like it makes the day any longer, as if you can make a rope longer by cutting off one end and tying it on the other. My dad was a farmer and he hated it because it meant that the parts store (we had a pos Case combine) would close an hour earlier than usual according to solar time, the only clock farmers care about.

[Cheesesteak]

Originally Posted by standingwave

I don't know. It's not like it makes the day any longer, as if you can make a rope longer by cutting off one end and tying it on the other.

Let's say you have a rope, and it's 16 units long. You hold the rope at an arbitrary point and realize you want to have more rope on one side, let's call that the "evening" side, what's a person to do? I can't make more rope, it's a conundrum. Wait, I can move my hand a little bit, and by magic, more rope appears on the side I give a crap about. Sure, there's less rope on the other side, but who gives a shit about having a 4:30am sunrise anyway?

[standingwave]

Originally Posted by Cheesesteak

Let's say you have a rope, and it's 16 units long. You hold the rope at an arbitrary point and realize you want to have more rope on one side, let's call that the "evening" side, what's a person to do? I can't make more rope, it's a conundrum. Wait, I can move my hand a little bit, and by magic, more rope appears on the side I give a crap about. Sure, there's less rope on the other side, but who gives a shit about having a 4:30am sunrise anyway?

All Daylight Saving Time does is make everyone get up an hour earlier which you were already free to do. It's silly.

[Michael63129]

Originally Posted by standingwave

I don't know. It's not like it makes the day any longer, as if you can make a rope longer by cutting off one end and tying it on the other. My dad was a farmer and he hated it because it meant that the parts store (we had a pos Case combine) would close an hour earlier than usual according to solar time, the only clock farmers care about.

I know at least one person (on another forum) who actually believed that DST increased the length of the day(light), and was also the reason why it got hotter in the summer. Not kidding.

Anyway, I don't have a problem with adjusting to DST, but it doesn't make much sense to continue it; noon is supposed to be around, well, noon, not an hour after, same for midnight.

PS: Change the clocks well before going to bed, so you go at the "same time" as usual. Or even a day or two early (the change is always on a weekend).

[standingwave]

Originally Posted by Michael63129

I know at least one person (on another forum) who actually believed that DST increased the length of the day(light), and was also the reason why it got hotter in the summer. Not kidding.

Well, there's another argument for getting rid of it. It would help fight global warming.

[tnetennba]

Originally Posted by Nobody

I've been saying for a while now; Either pick DST or standard and stick with it.

Stupid farmers! (Just kidding)

It's actually a product of the industrial era. Farmers don't give a shit.

[Diceman]

Originally Posted by Nobody

I've been saying for a while now; Either pick DST or standard and stick with it.

Stupid farmers! (Just kidding)

Amen! I hate hate HATE having to change all my clocks twice a year. The supposed benefits of DST have never struck me as particularly compelling, either.

We seem to be moving in the direction of lengthening the amount of time we spend on DST (we're already at the point where we spend most of the year on it) so I say just put us on DST year-round and forget about going back to "standard" time.

[Nobody]

There's also the problem of working in the mornings. Sure, when you spring ahead you work one hour less, but heaven help you if you're working and have to fall back an hour.

Thankfully I never worked early mornings during a time change, but at one company I use to work for that ran 24/7 I felt bad for those who did. Especially if they had a 10 or 12 hour work day.

[Uncle Jocko]

Originally Posted by Nobody

There's also the problem of working in the mornings. Sure, when you spring ahead you work one hour less, but heaven help you if you're working and have to fall back an hour.

Thankfully I never worked early mornings during a time change, but at one company I use to work for that ran 24/7 I felt bad for those who did. Especially if they had a 10 or 12 hour work day.

Funny story about that. Well, maybe an amusing tale. Diverting anecdote? Anyway, in my earlier years I worked at several radio stations, and oftentimes that would include the overnight shift. That made the change into and out of DST interesting. You see, each hour of programming had a page containing the commercial spots slated to run in the breaks during that hour. In the spring, at 2 am you'd turn the clock forward to 3 am ... which meant that 2 am page had nowhere to go, as if it was erased from existence! Of course, since it's 2 freakin' a.m., there generally weren't more than one or two spots actually sold in that hour, so it wasn't a big deal to play an extra spot in the hour before or after.

But in the fall ... at 2 am you turn the clocks back to repeat the 1 am hour ... and there weren't any ads to play then at all! An entire hour, commercial free! It would have been sweet, if anyone was actually listening at that time of day ...

[Nobody]

Originally Posted by Uncle Jocko

But in the fall ... at 2 am you turn the clocks back to repeat the 1 am hour ... and there weren't any ads to play then at all! An entire hour, commercial free! It would have been sweet, if anyone was actually listening at that time of day ...

I thought you were going to say that you had to re-run all of the 1:00am commercials all over again.

[Folacin]

Originally Posted by Uncle Jocko

Funny story about that. Well, maybe an amusing tale. Diverting anecdote? Anyway, in my earlier years I worked at several radio stations, and oftentimes that would include the overnight shift. That made the change into and out of DST interesting. You see, each hour of programming had a page containing the commercial spots slated to run in the breaks during that hour. In the spring, at 2 am you'd turn the clock forward to 3 am ... which meant that 2 am page had nowhere to go, as if it was erased from existence! Of course, since it's 2 freakin' a.m., there generally weren't more than one or two spots actually sold in that hour, so it wasn't a big deal to play an extra spot in the hour before or after.

But in the fall ... at 2 am you turn the clocks back to repeat the 1 am hour ... and there weren't any ads to play then at all! An entire hour, commercial free! It would have been sweet, if anyone was actually listening at that time of day ...

One spring, I received a trouble ticket - a mission critical job hadn't run on Sunday. The answer, of course, was that it was scheduled to run at 2:30 am, and there wasn't a 2:30 am that day. There were similar issues in the fall, where jobs scheduled for 1:30 am would run twice.

Note that I wasn't in charge of scheduling - I'd learned to never schedule once a day jobs between 1-3 am.

[johnpost]

do you run a clock shop?

[Sitnam]

Thought it was meant so kids didn't have to wander around in the dark before or after school, that's cool, why not just change the schools hours.

[freckafree]

Originally Posted by Sitnam

Thought it was meant so kids didn't have to wander around in the dark before or after school, that's cool, why not just change the schools hours.

This makes no freakin' sense. One of the things I hate about DST is that we were juuuuuust starting to get enough daylight that I was finishing my morning run in a little bit of light and it was full light by the time my son left for school. Now we're back to pitch blackness for another month.

[HMS Irruncible]

Get rid of the seasonal time change. Get rid of leap seconds. Get rid of time zones and get rid of leap days. Use 24-hour time. If you really, really need to talk about the position of the sun, we have words like "morning" and "summer".

[Sattua]

I hate it too. I lived in Indiana for twenty years before they passed it.

[Engineer Dude]

Originally Posted by Sattua

I hate it too. I lived in Indiana for twenty years before they passed it.

I went to college in Indiana. First 3 years it was standard ("slow") time all the time and then the last year they passed it.

Freshman year, I had a student ticket to all the football games. I didn't realize that the "12:30" that was on the schedule was for everyone else in the U.S. (on DST) and not for the Indiana people. As a result, I showed up for the game 12:30 Indiana time (or 1:30 EST), when I should have showed up 11:30 Indiana time. Grrr.

On the other hand, the fall (of the last year of college after Indiana passed it) semester of college my friends and I did get an extra hour of drinking time. The bars close in Indiana at 3:00 am. Which means that if you go to the bars at, say 11:00 PM, you get 5 hours since the change is from 2:00 am to 1:00 am.

Originally Posted by DianaG

It should be DST all the time, and anyone who says otherwise must be one of those Morning People. Fuck them.

I'd actually prefer that we stay on standard time all the time precisely because I'm not a morning person. In early March (on standard time), there's actually daylight early when I get up for work. Then the hour change hits and it's more difficult to get up when it's dark. The extra hour later in the day then makes it doubly difficult because it hasn't been dark for as long and there's less of a feeling that you need to get to bed.

[carnivorousplant]

Originally Posted by friedo

It is stupid.

Indeed, it fellates with great alacrity. Especially since one has the lights and heat on in the office anyway.

[Frank]

Daylight Savings Time is ridiculous and asinine.

If it's to be used at all, it should only be between the equinoxes. Standard Time lasts three months now. What's "Standard" about that?

[sitchensis]

It is great, an extra hour of usable sunlight.

[Frank]

Originally Posted by sitchensis

It is great, an extra hour of usable sunlight.

What do you use it for in March and November?

[sitchensis]

Originally Posted by Frank

What do you use it for in March and November?

Having an hour of sunlight when I'm awake and not at work.

What do you use timezones for?

[Frank]

Originally Posted by sitchensis

Having an hour of sunlight when I'm awake and not at work.

Ah. Well, that's what getting up early is for.

What do you use timezones for?

Ah. You're an idiot, I see.

[Bosstone]

Whiners. At least your schedule relative to your clock doesn't change.

I live and work in Arizona which doesn't observe DST, but my office's deadlines operate off Central Time. When DST isn't in effect, 8 am Central is 7 am Arizona time. When DST is in effect, 8 am Central is 6 am Arizona. We can't actually change our clocks since, y'know, we have Arizona lives, so that means instead of changing our clocks twice a year we have to adjust our schedules to one hour earlier. Not only do we have to get up when the clock says 4:00 instead of 5:00, it plays merry hell with our non-work schedules since everyone else is happily rolling along on their own Arizona schedules. Compared to what the rest of the nation has to put up with, it's vicious.

[purplehorseshoe]

Originally Posted by Frank

Ah. Well, that's what getting up early is for. . .

Meh. Fuck that noise. I love having the extra time after work to take a walk, putter around the garden, etc. I'm not in the mood for any of that first thing in the morning.

[guizot]

Originally Posted by sitchensis

It is great, an extra hour of usable sunlight.

The "extra" hour you "gain" at one end of the day you just lose at the other--people have to leave their lights on later into the morning. No one is "saving" any light, especially now that so many businesses today operate 24 hours a day. DST only made sense in a society where everything strictly ran by bankers' hours. (And that's why it has little to do with farmers, who operate by the sun, not the clock, and have never had much reason to be overly concerned about the time of day, except possibly for deliveries.)

[Lord Feldon]

Originally Posted by guizot

The "extra" hour you "gain" at one end of the day you just lose at the other

OMG REALLY? I thought my clock could move the sun.

Seriously, everybody knows that. It doesn't need to be self-righteously pointed out every time DST is discussed.

[Alessan]

Actually, fuck Standard Time. You Americans are so lucky to have just three months of it.

I don't need sunlight at the beginning of the day, when I'm bringing the kid to school and getting ready for work. I need it at the end, when I want to go to the beach or for a walk down the boulevard. If the sun starts setting before 7 PM, I feel robbed.

[Ludovic]

Originally Posted by Alessan

Actually, fuck Standard Time. You Americans are so lucky to have just three months of it.

I don't need sunlight at the beginning of the day, when I'm bringing the kid to school and getting ready for work. I need it at the end, when I want to go to the beach or for a walk down the boulevard. If the sun starts setting before 7 PM, I feel robbed.

This. In Florida, when the days are getting shorter, there's still a tiny sliver of sunlight to enjoy at the end of the day, then BAM! Daylight saving ends and you're plunged into sudden darkness at the workday's end.

[guizot]

Originally Posted by Lord Feldon

Seriously, everybody knows that. It doesn't need to be self-righteously pointed out every time DST is discussed.

I get that, but it was actually about the official terminology itself, which they should change to "Spring-summer Time," or something like that. If they did this, then we probably wouldn't get these threads at all.

[cochrane]

Originally Posted by sitchensis

It is great, an extra hour of usable sunlight.

Yeah, and one more hour to run the air conditioner here in the 115° Arizona heat. As if my electric bill weren't already high enough in the summer. Thank something or someone that we don't observe it here.

[gamerunknown]

I've heard that accidents increase after switches which negates any effect on school children.

There have been a few correlations too.

[Rigamarole]

It's actually Daylight Saving Time, not Daylight Savings.

[Frank]

Originally Posted by Rigamarole

It's actually Daylight Saving Time, not Daylight Savings.

Gosh, thanks. I shall immediately reconsider my position now that I know that.

[Lacunae Matata]

Poor Mr. Matata gets hit on both ends of the time change: he's on day shift now, and loses an hour of sleep, and he'll be on nights when the clocks fall back, and has to work the extra hour. (Significant when his department works 12-hour shifts!) When I've worked places that had 24-hour staffing, each shift divided the time - so an eight hour shift would gain or lose 20 minutes, or 30 for 12-hour shifts. Or, as a manager, I'd take the extra hour so that my overnight staff wasn't exhausted.

But yeah, the practical reasons for the time change aren't very applicable now, so DST seems silly and anachronistic ...

[jjimm]

Totally agree. In the UK, being so far north it hardly makes any difference anyway: you get up and go to school/work in the dark and you come home in the dark, DST or not.

From memory they did an experiment where they didn't have it for a while and everyone loved it, but there was a rise in pre-school accidents I believe and it was reintroduced. However this was done when kids actually walked to school rather than got driven in SUVs. I think it's time to revisit it.

It's something to do with lobbying from Scottish farmers or some shit, which makes even less sense as during the winter their daytime only lasts twelve seconds. The other thing is... if it's to do with farmers, why don't the farmers just adjust the time they do stuff?

The only good thing about it is the relief everyone feels when it ends.

[digs]

Originally Posted by jjimm

Totally agree. In the UK, being so far north it hardly makes any difference anyway: you get up and go to school/work in the dark and you come home in the dark, DST or not.

That's sad. Of course, we experience that in the dead of winter (Wisconsin), but to experience it for long periods of time... too bad!

That probably explains why, one day when I was visiting friends outside of London, the sun came out in the middle of the day and shops closed and everyone took a walk or went and sat in the park. It was so smart, but now I understand more of their need for sunlight.

[gamerunknown]

Cecil.

[Valerieblaise]

I get so happy when it starts staying light later into the evening. It means summer's coming and winter's going and yay!!!!!!

I guess I'm saying I disagree with many people in this thread.

[Red Barchetta]

Originally Posted by Valerieblaise

I get so happy when it starts staying light later into the evening. It means summer's coming and winter's going and yay!!!!!!

I guess I'm saying I disagree with many people in this thread.

Nailed it. Now Standard time is the one that needs to go get shot and die.

[Vinyl Turnip]

Originally Posted by sitchensis

It is great, an extra hour of usable sunlight.

Shut up.

Originally Posted by Rigamarole

It's actually Daylight Saving Time, not Daylight Savings.

Shut up!

Originally Posted by Valerieblaise

I get so happy when it starts staying light later into the evening. It means summer's coming and winter's going and yay!!!!!!

SHUT UP!!! SHUT UP!!!!

[Foggy]

I have never really understood the bitching about DSL, it seems such a minor thing, but I do have two solutions to the problem.

A) Correct the Earth's tilt this way we have equal length day & night. This is my preferred method.
or
B) Split the difference: Spring forward half an hour, then leave it that way.



ETA: Why is the time stamp on my post off by 2 hours? It is now 3:23 am. Doesn't the boards update automatically?

[Foggy]

Originally Posted by Foggy

ETA: Why is the time stamp on my post off by 2 hours? It is now 3:23 am. Doesn't the boards update automatically?

Never mind, it fixed itself after I closed the browser and reopen it.

[Neidhart]

I wake up early, and I'd rather have the sun rising before 6 a.m.

I wish they'd go back tolast-weekend-in-April till last-weekend-in-October. Six months on and six months off, so it was symmetrical, and for a while you'd get sunrises as early as 5:15!

[ElvisL1ves]

Where's Grandpa Jones when we need him? Oh, right, he's dead. Wore himself out resetting his clocks.

Time to get rid of Standard Time. More trouble than it's worth.

[Silver Fire]

Between setting the clocks ahead before bed last night and waking up this morning, I forgot entirely about DST. So I woke up about an hour ago all bummed out because, damn it, it's going to be a cloudy, shitty day and it's probably going to snow, like, three feet and I fucking hate MN and blahblah. Crabby.

But no, it just wasn't daytime yet.