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  #1  
Old 08-02-2016, 09:53 PM
Ukulele Ike Ukulele Ike is online now
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No olives?!? What goes in the Martini, then?

I don't care for lemon peel. If I want boozy lemonade, I'll make a Tom Collins.

No green olives in the fridge tonight. No pickled onions for a Gibson.

So I made a big dollop of iced gin with a splash of vermouth and dropped a piparra in the bottom of the glass. That's a small mild Basque pepper pickled in vinegar. It was EXCELLENT. I may dub it the "Ukulele Ike."

What other pickled things have you put in your Martinis when no olives were available? Or WOULD you?

I wouldn't use a kosher half-sour; it would displace too much gin.
  #2  
Old 08-02-2016, 09:55 PM
The Other Waldo Pepper The Other Waldo Pepper is offline
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I've never tried 'em, but my father swears by pickled pearl onions.
  #3  
Old 08-03-2016, 08:21 AM
RealityChuck RealityChuck is offline
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Originally Posted by The Other Waldo Pepper View Post
I've never tried 'em, but my father swears by pickled pearl onions.
That's a Gibson, not a martini.
  #4  
Old 08-03-2016, 09:29 AM
Ike Witt Ike Witt is offline
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What is the difference between a Gibson and a Martini? Is is just the garnish?
  #5  
Old 08-08-2016, 03:54 PM
RealityChuck RealityChuck is offline
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Originally Posted by Ike Witt View Post
What is the difference between a Gibson and a Martini? Is is just the garnish?
Pretty much. Both are gin and vermouth, plus garnish. There are variations in the ratios of gin to vermouth, but martinis have variations of that, too. Wikipedia gives the same ratio of gin and vermouth for both drinks: 6:1.

Of course, nowadays, martini usually signifies "vodka martini," just as it used to signify "dry martini." "Martini" was the name of a different drink with a 1:1 ratio of gin and sweet vermouth.
  #6  
Old 08-10-2016, 10:02 AM
MacLir MacLir is offline
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Originally Posted by RealityChuck View Post
Pretty much. Both are gin and vermouth, plus garnish. There are variations in the ratios of gin to vermouth, but martinis have variations of that, too. Wikipedia gives the same ratio of gin and vermouth for both drinks: 6:1.

Of course, nowadays, martini usually signifies "vodka martini," just as it used to signify "dry martini." "Martini" was the name of a different drink with a 1:1 ratio of gin and sweet vermouth.
Couldn't possibly have to do with the best known brand of vermouth being Martini & Rossi …
  #7  
Old 08-02-2016, 10:10 PM
TriPolar TriPolar is online now
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Best bet is a vodka martini, hold the vermouth and the garnish.
  #8  
Old 08-04-2016, 11:37 AM
DrDeth DrDeth is offline
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Best bet is a vodka martini, hold the vermouth and the garnish.

We call that "straight vodka". There's no martini there. It's like "a margarita , hold the triple sec and lime, no salt". aka straight tequila.
  #9  
Old 08-02-2016, 10:25 PM
Ukulele Ike Ukulele Ike is online now
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Thanks for nothing, buddies.

I said "no pickled onions," and cold vodka in a glass is a drink only fit for a pig of a Krushchev. Unless I have a spread of good caviare and pickled mushrooms.
  #10  
Old 08-02-2016, 10:34 PM
teela brown teela brown is offline
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I'll bet one of those little French cornichons would go well. They're pretty tiny, too, so they won't take up too much room.
  #11  
Old 08-02-2016, 10:36 PM
madmonk28 madmonk28 is offline
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Cold vodka is not a martini, it's cold vodka is for people who don't like booze. Try a pickled jalapeño or cherry pepper.
  #12  
Old 08-02-2016, 10:39 PM
Little Nemo Little Nemo is online now
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Wouldn't be a problem around here. I'd just run over to the local Walmart (which is open twenty-four hours a day) and buy a jar of olives.

This is what you get for choosing to live in a small town that doesn't offer the conveniences of modern living.
  #13  
Old 08-12-2016, 10:21 PM
Mona Lisa Simpson Mona Lisa Simpson is offline
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Wouldn't be a problem around here. I'd just run over to the local Walmart (which is open twenty-four hours a day) and buy a jar of olives.

This is what you get for choosing to live in a small town that doesn't offer the conveniences of modern living.
I would say not living near a Walmart is a feature, not a bug.

I am in Vancouver, the Walmart is pretty far away AND I would go to a 24 hour pharmacy with a decent grocery selection.
  #14  
Old 08-12-2016, 10:30 PM
Ukulele Ike Ukulele Ike is online now
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I would say not living near a Walmart is a feature, not a bug.
Little Nemo, he was makin' wit da jokes.

I usually go to an olive bar in Greektown (up in Astoria, Queens) or to the local Whole Foods or other goormay shop, and fill a container half-and-half with green olives in garlic and green olives in Mediterranean herbs, then shake them together.

These are very good indeed either as table olives or in a Martini. The only drawback is when you drink outside, and the little vegetal herb flecks float up and you think you got a fly in your booze.
  #15  
Old 08-13-2016, 05:46 AM
Martini Enfield Martini Enfield is offline
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What goes in a Martini?

Depending on the variant, usually a .577/450 Boxer or a .303 British cartridge; although Turkish ones used an 11.43x55 rimmed cartridge or the 7.63x53mm Argentine round.

It's OK, I'll get my coat.
  #16  
Old 08-03-2016, 11:28 AM
JRDelirious JRDelirious is offline
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Originally Posted by madmonk28 View Post
Cold vodka is not a martini, it's cold vodka is for people who don't like booze. Try a pickled jalapeño or cherry pepper.
Ya got it, a martini contains gin (default) or vodka, plus a measurable, detectable amount of vermouth. Garnished iced vodka/gin is not a martini.
  #17  
Old 08-08-2016, 06:21 PM
wolfpup wolfpup is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ukulele Ike View Post
Yeah...you can have a Martini with a twist of lemon or a Martini with an olive, but you have to call a Martini with a pickled onion a Gibson.
Quote:
Originally Posted by JRDelirious View Post
Ya got it, a martini contains gin (default) or vodka, plus a measurable, detectable amount of vermouth. Garnished iced vodka/gin is not a martini.
My standard martini used to be ice, vodka, a splash of vermouth, and an olive. But now the olive has been superseded by a far superior garnish -- it's technically a pickled onion, but no ordinary picked onion! It's a Sable & Rosenfeld tipsy onion -- soaked in a vermouth-laden pickling broth. It's sometimes hard to find so I have many jars in reserve. There is no comparison with an ordinary pickled onion which tends to be harsh and strongly flavored -- these are beautifully mild and ooze vermouth flavor --just perfect for a martini even if some insist on calling it a Gibson, and I don't even bother with vermouth now.

Last edited by wolfpup; 08-08-2016 at 06:21 PM.
  #18  
Old 08-02-2016, 11:22 PM
standingwave standingwave is offline
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No olives?! Where are you, Korea? Without olives, a martini just doesn’t quite make it: https://youtu.be/2lDyDx32YJE#t=2m40s

__________
If you must, this sounds interesting... (but to hell with vodka, I'd make it with gin.)

Garlic Black Pepper Vodka Martini

2 ounces vodka, Hangar 1 used here*
1/2 ounce dry vermouth, Vya Extra Dry used here
1 garlic clove, sliced
2 grinds black pepper, on the coarse side

In a shaker 2/3 filled with ice, combine vodka, vermouth, garlic slices and black pepper. Shake hard for 20 seconds and strain into a chilled cocktail glass. Optionally add the garlic slices back to the glass.
  #19  
Old 08-02-2016, 11:27 PM
Aspenglow Aspenglow is offline
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No vodka.

In the absence of an olive, I'd use a pickled green bean. Or two. (Also delicious in Bloody Marys!)
  #20  
Old 08-03-2016, 02:16 AM
TYphoonSignal8 TYphoonSignal8 is offline
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Pickled ginger.
  #21  
Old 08-03-2016, 02:37 AM
Channing Idaho Banks Channing Idaho Banks is offline
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Pickled tomato. Or Pickled herring.
  #22  
Old 08-05-2016, 12:46 PM
Vinyl Turnip Vinyl Turnip is offline
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Pickled ginger.
No need for name-calling.
  #23  
Old 08-05-2016, 12:53 PM
dougie_monty dougie_monty is offline
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No need for name-calling.
Maybe Ginger SHOULD lay off the sauce.
  #24  
Old 08-03-2016, 04:07 AM
Smapti Smapti is offline
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Never tried it, but for some reason I'm thinking a cube of bleu cheese would work well.
  #25  
Old 08-03-2016, 08:19 AM
yo han go yo han go is offline
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Raw chicken heart just scratched from your bare foot would also be a good alternative. (Might be that we are escalating this to quickly)

Last edited by yo han go; 08-03-2016 at 08:20 AM.
  #26  
Old 08-03-2016, 10:24 AM
Ukulele Ike Ukulele Ike is online now
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Yeah...you can have a Martini with a twist of lemon or a Martini with an olive, but you have to call a Martini with a pickled onion a Gibson.
  #27  
Old 08-04-2016, 09:13 PM
wolfman wolfman is online now
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Originally Posted by Ukulele Ike View Post
Yeah...you can have a Martini with a twist of lemon or a Martini with an olive, but you have to call a Martini with a pickled onion a Gibson.
So If you made one with an olive half and an onion half stuck together you'd have a Martison?
  #28  
Old 08-03-2016, 11:06 AM
DrFidelius DrFidelius is offline
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I have a copy of an ultimate martini book around here somewhere. If I can find it I can read off some of the alternative garnishes.

One I remember is to use some hot sauce instead of vermouth and garnish with a shrimp. I think this would work better with a vodka martini than most gins.
  #29  
Old 08-03-2016, 12:11 PM
Ukulele Ike Ukulele Ike is online now
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Originally Posted by DrFidelius View Post
One I remember is to use some hot sauce instead of vermouth and garnish with a shrimp.
A COOKED shrimp, I hope.

At what point does changing the garnish (or the vermouth ingredient) change the name of the drink? There's an English thing where they put a few dashes of bitters into a glass of gin, but that's just called a "pink gin."

If you put a whiskey sour into a tall glass, filled it with ice, and topped it with seltzer, you'd have a John Collins, the whiskey alternative to a Tom Collins. But making the same drink with vodka or rum yields a Vodka Collins or a Rum Collins....no proper Christian name given.

A Gimlet is a whiskey sour made with gin. A Daiquiri is a Gimlet made with rum.

I think I need to go lie down.

Last edited by Ukulele Ike; 08-03-2016 at 12:13 PM.
  #30  
Old 08-03-2016, 11:42 PM
JRDelirious JRDelirious is offline
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Originally Posted by Ukulele Ike View Post
If you put a whiskey sour into a tall glass, filled it with ice, and topped it with seltzer, you'd have a John Collins, the whiskey alternative to a Tom Collins. But making the same drink with vodka or rum yields a Vodka Collins or a Rum Collins....no proper Christian name given.

A Gimlet is a whiskey sour made with gin. A Daiquiri is a Gimlet made with rum.

I think I need to go lie down.
Y'know, you didn't have to sample them all.
  #31  
Old 08-11-2016, 05:18 AM
Major Matt Mason Major Matt Mason is offline
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Originally Posted by Ukulele Ike View Post
A Gimlet is a whiskey sour made with gin. A Daiquiri is a Gimlet made with rum.
And if you stir it with a chopstick, it's a hickory daiquiri, doc.

-MMM-

(gag stolen from Spider Robinson)
  #32  
Old 08-11-2016, 08:26 AM
Ike Witt Ike Witt is offline
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A Gimlet is a whiskey sour made with gin.
I am pretty sure that is wrong.
  #33  
Old 08-11-2016, 10:15 AM
bump bump is offline
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I am pretty sure that is wrong.
Indeed.

A gimlet is gin with Rose's Lime Juice, a bottled lime cordial product (you've seen it, I'm sure).

A whiskey sour made with gin would be, appropriately enough, a gin sour.

http://www.esquire.com/food-drink/dr...cocktail-0912/
  #34  
Old 08-11-2016, 08:57 PM
Ukulele Ike Ukulele Ike is online now
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Originally Posted by Ike Witt View Post
I am pretty sure that is wrong.
Yeah, I was generalizing. A whiskey sour is lemon juice, sugar, and booze. As bump said, a Gimlet should have Rose's Lime Juice, which is lime juice and sugar in a bottle.

If you have no Rose's, you could make a Gimlet with fresh lime juice and sugar (a gin Daiquiri!), which is probably a superior drink.

What I was getting at in my "liquor semantics" post is that all three of these cocktails are "punch." Without the "weak" part. You know the old mnemonic rhyme....One of sour, two of sweet, three of strong, and four of weak.
  #35  
Old 08-11-2016, 10:08 PM
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How about one of those hard-boiled eggs soaked in beet juice?

"We're gonna need a bigger martini glass."
  #36  
Old 08-12-2016, 10:14 AM
bump bump is offline
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Originally Posted by Ukulele Ike View Post
Yeah, I was generalizing. A whiskey sour is lemon juice, sugar, and booze. As bump said, a Gimlet should have Rose's Lime Juice, which is lime juice and sugar in a bottle.

If you have no Rose's, you could make a Gimlet with fresh lime juice and sugar (a gin Daiquiri!), which is probably a superior drink.

What I was getting at in my "liquor semantics" post is that all three of these cocktails are "punch." Without the "weak" part. You know the old mnemonic rhyme....One of sour, two of sweet, three of strong, and four of weak.
Cocktail naming is all in the details though; technically a vodka martini is a "Kangaroo", not a martini of any kind. And for that matter, to be a cocktail, it pretty much has to follow the "spirits, bitters, sweetener" formula, where the sweetener can be sugar, like in an Old Fashioned, or some sort of vermouth, like in a Manhattan or Martini. Leaving the ibtters out makes it some kind of mixed drink (in a very pedantic and nitpicking sense).

I'm not sure they really count as "punch"- punches are more about that ratio above than anything else- to be a punch, it would be more like a Tom Collins or a gin fizz than anything else- something like 0.5 oz lime juice, 1 oz sugar, 1.5 oz gin, and 2 oz water/soda-water. Which I suspect would be too sweet, and not sour enough.
  #37  
Old 08-04-2016, 12:58 PM
Little Nemo Little Nemo is online now
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One I remember is to use some hot sauce instead of vermouth and garnish with a shrimp.
A Treiftini.
  #38  
Old 08-04-2016, 08:58 PM
harmonicamoon harmonicamoon is offline
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A friend of mine would make martunis with a pickled tomato. I never really liked martunis, but I loved those pickled tomatoes. They were about the size of a nickel. Delicious.
  #39  
Old 08-15-2016, 05:38 PM
gazpacho gazpacho is offline
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A friend of mine would make martunis with a pickled tomato. I never really liked martunis, but I loved those pickled tomatoes. They were about the size of a nickel. Delicious.
Where they green tomatoes? If they were then they probably were tomolives.
http://oldsouth.com/product/6-pack-tomolives-32oz/
  #40  
Old 08-16-2016, 10:39 AM
dougie_monty dougie_monty is offline
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Where they green tomatoes? If they were then they probably were tomolives.
http://oldsouth.com/product/6-pack-tomolives-32oz/
I love you, tomolive, you're always a day away...
  #41  
Old 08-04-2016, 10:49 AM
Tim R. Mortiss Tim R. Mortiss is offline
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My first choice of martini garnish is always a pickled mushroom. Blue cheese stuffed olive is second.

But I have had a very nice martini garnished with a black olive stuffed with salmon mousse. That was good!
  #42  
Old 08-04-2016, 11:10 AM
Duke of Rat Duke of Rat is offline
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I'd think any pickled veggie would do in a pinch, it's the vinegary whang that the olive brings to the drink that you're after, right?
  #43  
Old 08-04-2016, 11:20 AM
dougie_monty dougie_monty is offline
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How about a cherry?
In one old magazine cartoon a hostess tells her shocked guests, some of whom have already started sipping their martinis,
"I was out of olives, so I used clams."
  #44  
Old 08-04-2016, 09:07 PM
Ukulele Ike Ukulele Ike is online now
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I'd think any pickled veggie would do in a pinch, it's the vinegary whang that the olive brings to the drink that you're after, right?
Good point. You want a lashing of salt and vinegar as you sip the last of the drink.

Still, you want to avoid certain flavors. I have some cornichon-sized garlic-dill pickles that are extremely delicious, but I don't think I want garlic or dill in my aperitif.

The piparra, though, was delightful.
  #45  
Old 08-04-2016, 11:37 AM
pulykamell pulykamell is online now
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Actually, a gin sour is a different drink than a gimlet. Similar, sure, but not the same. If I ask for a gimlet and get gin and sour, it's getting sent back. Gin and Rose's for me, or Roses cut with lime juice if you're feeling fancy. I've made it with homemade like syrup, but I just need the Rose's for it to taste right to me.
  #46  
Old 08-08-2016, 05:26 PM
bump bump is offline
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Actually, a gin sour is a different drink than a gimlet. Similar, sure, but not the same. If I ask for a gimlet and get gin and sour, it's getting sent back. Gin and Rose's for me, or Roses cut with lime juice if you're feeling fancy. I've made it with homemade like syrup, but I just need the Rose's for it to taste right to me.
Yup. And a daiquiri is essentially a rum sour made with lime juice instead of lemon (or vice-versa; I think the daiquiri came first).

Cocktails/mixed drinks come in "families", which means that they're essentially the same drink, but made with slightly different ingredients. So a daiquiri and a whiskey sour fall into the same family- both are spirits, sour & sugar. Similarly, the older versions of the Martini (gin, vermouth, orange bitters) fall very squarely into the same family as the Manhattan (bourbon, red vermouth, aromatic bitters).

Garnishes typically aren't the decisive factor in the naming of a drink; most of the older ones (like say.. pre-Prohibition) had fast and loose garnishing rules- if you read the old books, there are rarely any hard and fast rules- they suggest things like nuts as garnishes in martinis, etc...
  #47  
Old 08-04-2016, 12:07 PM
AllShookDown AllShookDown is offline
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I have no idea but I got an olive in my manhattan when I ordered one at a craft beer bar because I just couldn't choke down another bitter craft beer.
  #48  
Old 08-04-2016, 12:55 PM
OldGuy OldGuy is offline
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If you use a black olive it could be an Althea Gibson.

Though that name is likely too old for most of you.
  #49  
Old 08-04-2016, 09:06 PM
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Too bad I just threw out an old jar of pickled jalapeno slices. I'd experiment and let you know.
  #50  
Old 08-05-2016, 11:01 AM
Duke of Rat Duke of Rat is offline
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Too bad I just threw out an old jar of pickled jalapeno slices. I'd experiment and let you know.
I love using jalapeno stuffed olives, something about the heat/booze just does it for me.
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