AirTran doesn't care about turtles!

[AClockworkMelon]

Story here.

Originally Posted by Yahoo!

ATLANTA (AP) -- A caged, 2-inch turtle traveling with a 10-year-old girl caused a crew to turn around a taxiing plane, take the girl and her sisters off the flight and tell them they couldn't bring their pet along.

The sisters threw the animal and cage in the trash and returned to their seats crying Tuesday after AirTran Airways employees on the jetway said they couldn't care for the turtle while their father drove to retrieve it. Two days later, however, Carley Helm was reunited with Neytiri even though at first the family thought the pet was emptied with the trash.

Clearly AirTran Airways is populated with life-hating jerks straight out of Avatar. The adorable bundle of joy (appropriately named Neytiri) managed to survive (I'd argue this proves the existence of God), thankfully. I'm boycotting AirTran (unless they're providing the cheapest flights available- then I'll fly AirTrain... begrudgingly).

[cwthree]

They don't hate turtles. It's just that if they make an exception for a 2-inch turtle confined to a cage that can fit under the seat, they'll have to allow someone else's pet 400-pound gorilla with aggression-control issues to wander freely throughout the cabin and cockpit.

[AClockworkMelon]

Agree completely. I think it's nuts that Yahoo! would make a report that's sympathetic to the pet's owners. You can't expect the employees to be qualified to decide between which pets are and aren't allowed.

[Attack from the 3rd dimension]

Originally Posted by cwthree

They don't hate turtles. It's just that if they make an exception for a 2-inch turtle confined to a cage that can fit under the seat, they'll have to allow someone else's pet 400-pound gorilla with aggression-control issues to wander freely throughout the cabin and cockpit.

Or they could have done it and not mentioned it to anyone, particularly anyone with a gorilla.

[DCnDC]

Besides, they have free wireless. I fly JetBlue whenever possible though.

[WhyNot]

Y'know, I have to side with the airline here. Their prohibition, as reported, is against reptiles in the cabin because they carry salmonella. Who wants to be the one to allow the cute little 10 year old with her adorable turtle, only to have the one take the other out of its sweet little cage and start handling it? And then passing it to another passenger to coo over, and then NOT WASHING THEIR HANDS because it's a bitch to get into the bathroom on the airplane and they'll do it just as soon as they get off the plane (promise!) in a real bathroom... And now they're touching the call lights and the table trays and the drink cart...

You wanna decontaminate a whole plane sticky with salmonella and then wade through the lawsuits from everyone who gets sick? I don't. And if I see an easy way to minimize that risk, like not letting animals known to commonly carry the bacteria onto the plane to start with, I'm going to go with that.

'Sides, unless she hatched the turtle from an older turtle, that's an illegal turtle in (most of? all?) the US. You can't legally buy or sell a turtle under 4 inches as a pet anywhere I know.

(And I would have made her wash her hands after discarding the turtle, too. But I'm mean like that.)

[tdn]

I've had with all these mother fuckin' gorillas on this mother fuckin' plane.

[Llama Llogophile]

I work in the aviation industry, and this sort of thing is solidifying my feeling that we are going batshit insane. It was that way to some extent before 9/11, but ever since then it's gotten worse.

This airline, in their zeal to enforce a minor rule, tells a kid to throw their pet in the trash. That's crazy on several levels.

Yes, I understand why the rules are there. Yes, I understand that you have to be careful about making exceptions. But this strikes me as rigid to the point of brain dead and stupid. Ditto for the passengers sitting on a stifling plane in Connecticut the other day.

I'm reminded of the Taliban going around beating bedridden hospital patients because they were unable to kneel and pray. There comes a point where an overly zealous approach to enforcing the rules keeps you from functioning in the world properly. That's where we are in aviation, and I'm getting sick of it.

[Ludovic]

Originally Posted by tdn

I've had with all these mother fuckin' gorillas on this mother fuckin' plane.

I've had with all these monkey fightin' gorillas on this monday to friday plane.

FTFY.

[Ferret Herder]

Ya know, AirTran may not be entirely evil here, judging by the article - among other things they insist that they did not tell the sisters to throw away the animal, only that it could not go on the plane with them, and that they were offered at least twice a free rebooking for later:

While the sisters say they were told to put the animal in the trash, AirTran says they chose that themselves, despite an offer to fly later at no extra charge.

and

The airline, a unit of AirTran Holdings Inc. discovered Wednesday that the ramp supervisor had rescued the turtle from the trash "out of his own compassion" and given it to another crew member, who took it home for her 5-year-old son, White said.

AirTran told that crew member the original owners wanted it back, and the airline arranged for the turtle to fly as cargo to Milwaukee on Thursday, White said.

Sorry, but taking random live animals onto a plane without clearing it beforehand is so not a wise move; they don't even let you have 3.5 oz of a moisturizer on flights. The airline claims they didn't say "throw your turtle away or else!" and the 22-year-old says she made a snap decision. And yes, the potential of salmonella all over a plane is just asking for lawsuits out the wazoo for AirTran.

[Markxxx]

I always get a kick out of people who feel they can do what they please because they feel like it.

Of course the parents NEVER know. Like I worked in a suburban Chicago hotel (Red Roof Inn) and on the weekends parents would come rent rooms and their kids would have parties. I recall one time the kid had cocaine and other drugs and got busted. Of course the mother swore she had no way of knowing.

I told her and the cops,"Of course you knew. That's why you rented a room instead of having the party at your own home, a few blocks away. You didn't want those drugs at your house."

The staff of the airline probably said "Sorry you can't take that turtle on borad." Child replies, "What will I do I guess I'll have to throw him out." As if that is going to cause sympathy. Now the child tells the story that the airline said "throw your turtle away."

[MacTech]

Of course, if the pet turtle in question was actually Gamera (a *far* better name for a turtle...), it wouldn't have to be checked as luggage, heck, the girls could probably fly to their destination via "Gamera Air"...

[audit1]

Gamera is really neat.

[Boyo Jim]

Honestly, I'd rather they let the turtle fly and tossed the kids. But that's just me. Quieter is better.

[MacTech]

Originally Posted by Boyo Jim

Honestly, I'd rather they let the turtle fly and tossed the kids. But that's just me. Quieter is better.

Your ideas intrigue me and I wish to subscribe to your newsletter....

[Boyo Jim]

Originally Posted by MacTech

Your ideas intrigue me and I wish to subscribe to your newsletter....

Silence is Golden Magazine. I plan to offer a package deal to parents, or really to anyone who wants kids to be less bothersome. Two simultaneous surgeries: one "fixes" kids so their parents don't have to worry about being surprise grandparents, and the other is what I call a "voiceboxectomy".

The magazine discusses several issues, the most important being how to change the laws so any adult can order these procedures for any child, related or not.

Later we'll get around to discussing whether figuring out how to reverse the procedures is worth investinging in.

[d8uv]

Jesus, that's cold-blooded.

[Ferret Herder]

Originally Posted by audit1

Gamera is really neat.

He is filled with turtle meat!

[KarlGrenze]

I'm a bit concerned about the size of the turtle being reported. I thought selling turtles under 4 inches was a no-no.

Also, the Salmonella risk.

And AirTran is not very sympathetic to pets, period.

[BigT]

Originally Posted by Markxxx

I always get a kick out of people who feel they can do what they please because they feel like it.

Of course the parents NEVER know. Like I worked in a suburban Chicago hotel (Red Roof Inn) and on the weekends parents would come rent rooms and their kids would have parties. I recall one time the kid had cocaine and other drugs and got busted. Of course the mother swore she had no way of knowing.

I told her and the cops,"Of course you knew. That's why you rented a room instead of having the party at your own home, a few blocks away. You didn't want those drugs at your house."

The staff of the airline probably said "Sorry you can't take that turtle on borad." Child replies, "What will I do I guess I'll have to throw him out." As if that is going to cause sympathy. Now the child tells the story that the airline said "throw your turtle away."

Really? Your first instinct is to assume the person is lying with the flimsiest of evidence? I would never have a party at my house because it looks so awful. We rent a church for out Thanksgiving party every year.

What I'm saying is that there are plenty of reasons to rent a hotel room that have nothing to do with drugs. Unless there is more information you are not telling us, I have no idea why you would jump to that conclusion. I'd be much more likely to believe the kid pulled a fast one on the mom, as parents of troublemaking kids almost always think their kids are angels.

[E-Sabbath]

So, what you're saying is that they're all replicants?

[Boyo Jim]

All I know for sure is that it's turtles all the way down.

[Autolycus]

Originally Posted by AClockworkMelon

The adorable bundle of joy (appropriately named Neytiri) managed to survive (I'd argue this proves the existence of God).

God is a giant, blue, space turtle?

[Sailboat]

Originally Posted by Ferret Herder

Sorry, but taking random live animals onto a plane without clearing it beforehand is so not a wise move; they don't even let you have 3.5 oz of a moisturizer on flights.

Yes. I never understand people who claim to love a pet but do not use their supposedly advanced brains to think about that pet's welfare.

I also don't understand anyone who would throw away a live pet, or any adult (even airline industry employees) who would permit it. The result of not being able to take your turtle on the flight is you don't get to fly; it is not "you get taught that killing a life you are responsible for will fix your own problems or reward you in some way." Seriously, who would teach children -- even other peoples' children -- that for any reason* it's okay to kill their pet? You have a pet? Fine. That pet's life and well-being come before your desire to travel, period.

*ignoring bizarre cases someone might make up just for the sake of argument, like "would you kill the turtle to stop the Holocaust?"

You're going to make sociopaths out of people if you even let them off the hook for doing this, much less encourage it. And even if "discarding" the turtle was entirely the girls' idea, the airline personnel shouldn't let them back onto the plane until they are sure the turtle's welfare has been arranged for, or they should call Animal Control, not turn a blind eye. Would they tell someone to leave a dog in a parked car in the airport parking lot for a week?

[Enderw24]

I'm not sure how to feel about this story.

Let's get the opinion from a qualified expert

[3waygeek]

Originally Posted by DCnDC

Besides, they have free wireless. I fly JetBlue whenever possible though.

Funny -- I fly AirTran fairly often, and I've never gotten free wireless -- it's usually $7.95 per flight or $34.95 per month.

[Athena]

Originally Posted by 3waygeek

Funny -- I fly AirTran fairly often, and I've never gotten free wireless -- it's usually $7.95 per flight or $34.95 per month.

It depends on the route - they tend to run free wireless specials on certain city pairs. For example, for a long time they offered free wi-fi on flights between Boston and Baltimore.

[Acid Lamp]

Originally Posted by WhyNot

Y'know, I have to side with the airline here. Their prohibition, as reported, is against reptiles in the cabin because they carry salmonella. Who wants to be the one to allow the cute little 10 year old with her adorable turtle, only to have the one take the other out of its sweet little cage and start handling it? And then passing it to another passenger to coo over, and then NOT WASHING THEIR HANDS because it's a bitch to get into the bathroom on the airplane and they'll do it just as soon as they get off the plane (promise!) in a real bathroom... And now they're touching the call lights and the table trays and the drink cart...

You wanna decontaminate a whole plane sticky with salmonella and then wade through the lawsuits from everyone who gets sick? I don't. And if I see an easy way to minimize that risk, like not letting animals known to commonly carry the bacteria onto the plane to start with, I'm going to go with that.

'Sides, unless she hatched the turtle from an older turtle, that's an illegal turtle in (most of? all?) the US. You can't legally buy or sell a turtle under 4 inches as a pet anywhere I know.

(And I would have made her wash her hands after discarding the turtle, too. But I'm mean like that.)

Sigh.

First of all, Salmonella is present everywhere, it's concentration is higher only in reptile feces, not on the skin of the creature. Aquatic turtles can carry the bacteria in higher quantities on their skin due to poor hygienic practices of the owner. This is usually only a problem if the poor creature is swimming in a literal soup of feces, and is easily remedied by a simple water change and rinse. Secondly, you'd have to literally place the bloody thing in your mouth to transmit enough bacteria to make you ill; it was this exact fad practice that led to the 4 inch rule. That size being determined to be too large to place in a child's mouth. You have no more chance of catching salmonella from handling a normally cared for small turtle than anywhere else. Lastly, it's not illegal to sell or possess a small turtle, it simply must be sold for "educational purposes".

[WhyNot]

Originally Posted by Acid Lamp

Sigh.

First of all, Salmonella is present everywhere, it's concentration is higher only in reptile feces, not on the skin of the creature. Aquatic turtles can carry the bacteria in higher quantities on their skin due to poor hygienic practices of the owner. This is usually only a problem if the poor creature is swimming in a literal soup of feces, and is easily remedied by a simple water change and rinse. Secondly, you'd have to literally place the bloody thing in your mouth to transmit enough bacteria to make you ill; it was this exact fad practice that led to the 4 inch rule. That size being determined to be too large to place in a child's mouth. You have no more chance of catching salmonella from handling a normally cared for small turtle than anywhere else. Lastly, it's not illegal to sell or possess a small turtle, it simply must be sold for "educational purposes".

And it was (is) an aquatic turtle in a very small tank, which may indeed have had elevated levels of feces, we just don't know. And I said "as a pet", which "educational purposes" isn't. So I'm not really seeing where you're disagreeing here.

Sigh yourself. I don't expect minimum wage counter drones to distinguish between relative levels of risk and make truly informed decisions. I expect them to listen to the lawyers, who see any increased risk and too much increased risk. You don't fly with reptiles in the passenger compartment. Check him with the dogs and cats if you have to. Send him as cargo (which is what they eventually did). Whatevs. I'm sure she's a charming child, but she isn't exempt from the rules, which do have some rational basis.

[Sailboat]

Originally Posted by WhyNot

You don't fly with reptiles in the passenger compartment.

Says who?

[Acid Lamp]

Originally Posted by WhyNot

And it was (is) an aquatic turtle in a very small tank, which may indeed have had elevated levels of feces, we just don't know. And I said "as a pet", which "educational purposes" isn't. So I'm not really seeing where you're disagreeing here.

Sigh yourself. I don't expect minimum wage counter drones to distinguish between relative levels of risk and make truly informed decisions. I expect them to listen to the lawyers, who see any increased risk and too much increased risk. You don't fly with reptiles in the passenger compartment. Check him with the dogs and cats if you have to. Send him as cargo (which is what they eventually did). Whatevs. I'm sure she's a charming child, but she isn't exempt from the rules, which do have some rational basis.

Dear og. Look, People buying them for their children to have as a pet is a qualified educational purpose. If it wasn't we wouldn't be allowed to sell them. As a former owner of an exotic pet store that specialized in reptiles I am very familiar with this law. As to Salmonella, it's a cultural meme that has little basis in actual reality and the law was written as a knee jerk reaction to a few isolated cases. Salmonella is spread through direct contact, it's not like a turtle is a walking airbomb of lethal bacteria that infects everything by it's mere presence.

I agree that they ought to go in cargo, that's where all our animals rode in shipping. What I don't agree with is hysterical germa-phobic policy making that has only the most cursory basis in reality. That sort of thinking results in species bans, zero tolerance rules and the like. So do me a favor and don't get uppity when I try to fight a little ignorance.

[WhyNot]

Originally Posted by Sailboat

Says who?

See?! See what could happen?! There could be turtles everywhere, giving whole new meaning to "turtles all the way DOWN!"