What are the Occupiers up to?

[What the .... ?!?!]

Are there any significant occupations ongoing?

Have their plans for the political conventions been announced?

[BrainGlutton]

Apparently they're planning something for May Day.

What YOU Can Do on May Day

April 19th, 2012 · Ella · direct action 11 comments - Tags: #M1, #M1GS, american spring, direct action, general strike, may day, occupy movement

May Day is an international day of celebration to honor the labor movement. This year the Occupy movement has made a call for mass action—the May First General Strike (#M1GS): a day without the 99%. Over 115 US cities have organized in solidarity with this call to action.

A general strike is a way to build and demonstrate the power of the people. It’s a way to show this is a system that only exists because we allow it to. If we can withdraw from the system for one day we can use that day to build community and mutual aid. We can find inspiration and faith—not in any leaders or bosses but in each other and in ourselves.

[John Mace]

They're occupied with something else.

[Happy Lendervedder]

Originally Posted by John Mace

They're occupied with something else.

Does that me they're pre-occupied?

[What the .... ?!?!]

Originally Posted by BrainGlutton

Apparently they're planning something for May Day.

Wow that's Tuesday. I hadn't heard...... must not be on their mailing list.

Don't the Communists usually do something on May Day too?

[BrainGlutton]

Originally Posted by What the .... ?!?!

Wow that's Tuesday. I hadn't heard...... must not be on their mailing list.

Don't the Communists usually do something on May Day too?

May Day is celebrated as International Workers' Day in 80 countries (but not this one, we had to put our "Labor Day" in September for some reason), so, yeah.

[Gyrate]

I predict a lot of well-meaning earnest people will come out and march, and then a small contingent of violent dickheads will spoil it for everyone.

Again.

[Chronos]

May Day is celebrated as International Workers' Day in 80 countries (but not this one, we had to put our "Labor Day" in September for some reason)

Because we were afraid of the communist association with May Day, and needed something else to preempt it.

[elucidator]

...and then a small contingent of violent dickheads will spoil it for everyone.

Certainly what I would expect, been a pattern going back to Bad Old Days. But it seems to me that this last set of Occupy protests bent the paradigm a bit, the attention whoring shit disturbers were much less in evidence. And I think I may know why.

The first Occupy gatherings were more or less spontaneous, propagated by Twitter, Inyer Facebook, so on. Not through the "traditional" lefty conduits, which had two beneficial effects. First off, it reached people who do not pay attention to standard political activity, who are not advised through political outlets, left or right. As a result, the asshole fringe was just as uninformed and clueless as the rest of us.

Second, it allows a more non-political discussion. As it happens, most of these problems, if not all, are the result of rightish ideology. That's a true fact, you could look it up. But by eschewing "agenda" and ideology, Occupy got to concentrate on publicizing the problems, without necessarily offering a solution, or offering the solution.

Progressivism is, to one degree or another, a matter of faith. We believe that reasonable and well meaning people, given the facts, will come to very similar conclusions as we have, since we are reasonable and well meaning people. Of course, its taking a lot longer than we thought...

But, if we can simply lay out the problem of too much money in too few hands, the solution to that problem is bound to be somewhat progressive. In our outreach, we may not need to assert our solutions in order to get people activated and relevant. We don't need an agenda. We simply need to state the problems clearly, and let non-political people go through the reasoning processes so that they arrive where we are already sitting, waiting.

Progress by stealth. People are suspicious of agenda, as well they might be. Occupy activities were relentlessly mocked for lacking a clear and stated agenda, but maybe they are on to something, there.

[BrainGlutton]

Originally Posted by Gyrate

I predict a lot of well-meaning earnest people will come out and march, and then a small contingent of violent dickheads will spoil it for everyone.

Again.

Bear in mind that no violent dickheads spoiled the first OWS occupation, except those wearing blue uniforms.

[Gyrate]

I deliberately did not exclude members of the police force from the category of "violent dickheads". I haven't forgotten Ian Tomlinson.

[Justin_Bailey]

Originally Posted by BrainGlutton

Apparently they're planning something for May Day.

I expect what the Occupiers are doing, but that sounds all kinds of assholish.

[Saltire]

Originally Posted by BrainGlutton

May Day is celebrated as International Workers' Day in 80 countries (but not this one, we had to put our "Labor Day" in September for some reason), so, yeah.

The weird thing is that May Day was chosen to honor the Haymarket Riot, which happened here in the USA in 1886, in Chicago. But we're one of the countries that doesn't make a big deal about it.

[BrainGlutton]

Originally Posted by Justin_Bailey

I expect what the Occupiers are doing, but that sounds all kinds of assholish.

Like the Great American Boycott was assholish?

[Sage Rat]

Originally Posted by What the .... ?!?!

Don't the Communists usually do something on May Day too?

If you go to the occupier's website (at least in Seattle), it's not too unclear that they're mostly lead by Socialists.

[Oakminster]

Originally Posted by What the .... ?!?!

Are there any significant occupations ongoing?

There is absolutely nothing significant about this "movement". They've accomplished nothing, and they aren't going to accomplish anything.

[elucidator]

The only thing less significant than being talked about is not being talked about. You're talking about them. But they ain't talking about you. Oscar Wilde said a similar thing about squash, but seems never to have mentioned broccoli.

[Chronos]

There is absolutely nothing significant about this "movement". They've accomplished nothing, and they aren't going to accomplish anything.

Would you say the same thing about the Tea Party? Because the Occupy movement is everything that the Tea Party claims to be.

[Oakminster]

Originally Posted by Chronos

Would you say the same thing about the Tea Party? Because the Occupy movement is everything that the Tea Party claims to be.

No it isn't. The Tea Party, for good or ill, is a political force to be reckoned with. They have organization, and more importantly, money. They've parlayed that into actually electing candidates to pursue their agenda.

Meanwhile, the Occupy folks have managed to....camp in parks. They have no organization, no money, and no influence with anybody that matters.

[gamerunknown]

Originally Posted by Oakminster

They have organization, and more importantly, money. They've parlayed that into actually electing candidates to pursue their agenda.

As someone that's attended a general assembly and talked to various people at the Occupy protests, this is precisely the difference between the two protests. I would say no candidate requiring independent funding would support such a movement, but I suppose Elizabeth Warren did so indirectly. The issue seems clear: corporate advertisers would not benefit from an Occupy candidate and would not support the exposure of reasonable arguments by them to a general public. Unless one holds that all mainstream views are encapsulated by the range of broadcast media in the US and a lack of favourable hearings to Occupy is a conspiracy theory.

That said, Occupy has at least seeped through into the public conscious, with resignations over their right to protest from Giles Fraser for instance.

[BrainGlutton]

Originally Posted by Oakminster

No it isn't. The Tea Party, for good or ill, is a political force to be reckoned with. They have organization, and more importantly, money. They've parlayed that into actually electing candidates to pursue their agenda.

Meanwhile, the Occupy folks have managed to....camp in parks. They have no organization, no money, and no influence with anybody that matters.

Think about that for a moment. Why is it that the Tea Party does have money and influence? (Hint: Those things were not provided by the people you see at the rallies.)

[BrainGlutton]

Originally Posted by Oakminster

There is absolutely nothing significant about this "movement". They've accomplished nothing, and they aren't going to accomplish anything.

You don't know, yet, that OWS will not impact the 2012 election like the Tea Party on 2010's.

[elucidator]

Kinda depends on which Tea Party you mean, the ones in thrall to their corporate masters or the ones wholly owned by same. Remember when the Tea Party Express came out firmly in support of Comcast and Verizon on the whole "net neutrality" issue? Most likely, this reflects the mad enthusiasm of most everyone for their cable provider, everybody loves the living shit out of Comcast.

When you want to talk "grass roots" movements, Dick Armey and the Tea Party Express is who you've got to talk about. Lately, of course, they've adopted a lower profile, similar to the profile of a road-kill armadillo. Not dead, mind you, resting. Pining for the fjords.

[Oakminster]

Originally Posted by BrainGlutton

You don't know, yet, that OWS will not impact the 2012 election like the Tea Party on 2010's.

Sure I do. They were a non-factor in the primaries, have no known major candidates in the general election, and again no organization and no money. They don't even have a coherent agenda. They are impotent as a political force.

For what it's worth, I don't like the Tea Party. But there is no disputing the impact they've had. If the Occupy people want to be effective, they've got to learn how to work within the system. Camping in parks is not going to put asses in the seats that matter. They need structure, cohesiveness, discipline, and money. Until they get those things, they're pissing into the wind.

[gamerunknown]

Originally Posted by Oakminster

have no known major candidates in the general election

Depends how you'd qualify that statement. Ron Paul at least is endorsed by some Tea Party members.

[Oakminster]

Originally Posted by gamerunknown

Depends how you'd qualify that statement. Ron Paul at least is endorsed by some Tea Party members.

I was pretty obviously, given prior comments in this thread, referring to the Occupy folks.

[Ca3799]

During the week of April 9-15th, 'Occupy' teamed up with many other organizations (approx 70) with the goal of providing "99% Spring Training", a day of teaching and non-violent direct action protest training, to 100,000 people. I don't know if they met that goal. Some groups don't partake in civil disobedience -for example, MoveOn, but others like to, such as ActUp. So even with so many groups officially participating cooperatively, the occupy movement is still quite nebulous and fluid.

They certainly have not congealed or organized like the Tea Party and I'm not sure they have any intention to do so. It seems as if they prefer to not do so.

Recently, they have been disrupting shareholder meetings at large corporations- corporations which are targeted for either perceived unfair treatment of customers or ones that receive unfair tax benefits, or both. In San Francisco about a week ago, I believe there were quite a few arrests (24?) at a Wells Fargo shareholder meeting. There were charges traded back and forth- that Wells Fargo used employees to block the seats during the meeting so occupiers could not get in, and charges from the bank that occupiers took seats belonging to legitimate shareholders, etc. Some occupiers were also shareholders.This event had reports of occupy turnout varying from several hundred occupiers to 1,000. A recent GE shareholder meeting in Detroit attracted occupiers in numbers reported to be 100 to a couple of hundred.

I don't see much about them in the national news, but they seem to be making headlines locally.

I know they have national events planned for May 1st and May 9th and one website says they have 982 protests in the works throughout the US. I believe they are hoping May will bring renewed larger group activity.

My area group has two or three events planned and I understand there may be plans to get newsworthy with larger things like possibly blocking the Golden Gate Bridge as part of the May Day General Strike plans. This idea is also about and/or related to supporting local transportation workers in a union dispute. I say possibly because I'm not part of their group but I understand many ideas are being bounced around as to what exactly to do there.

So, who knows how they will do?

[Northern Piper]

Originally Posted by BrainGlutton

You don't know, yet, that OWS will not impact the 2012 election like the Tea Party on 2010's.

Sure we do - at this time in 2010, Tea Partiers were heavily involved in the primary process, supporting people like Rand Paul and trying to get candidates elected to Congress that supported their views. That effort was successful to some extent.

So what Occupiers have been challenging in the primaries lately, with realistic chances of getting the nomination and standing in the general? What Occupy Pledge have they been circulating to candidates to try to get them to commit to Occupy principles, whatever they might be?

If the Occupiers are to influence the elections, we'd see them in action now.

[InterestedObserver]

Originally Posted by BrainGlutton

Apparently they're planning something for May Day.

I saw those stupid signs on campus..."No work! No shopping! No school! No Housework! No whatever...."

Look, I generally support the overall goals of the Occupy Movement (hell, I looked it up, and only 1.5% of us have annual incomes of $250,000 or more, and moderatly increasing taxes on those of us who DO would virtually wipe out the annual deficit) but their tactics suck, imo.

Here in Portland, they take to the streets and block the bridges/shut down the trains and have made me late for class 3 times this past year. Look guys, I can assure you the "1%" AIN'T on these trains trying to get to work or class or home from work or class...you are simply making the 99%ers LATE and PISSED OFF!

And how about, instead of organizing an opt out of everything event, you organize an opt IN event; as in opt IN to buying from local, small businesses and opening an account at your local, customer owned credit union and not working for companies whose practices or products you find offensive etc...and do it EVERY DAY.

Think THAT might have more of an effect than shutting down mass transit, tearing up public parks, shutting down the docks so people who work there can't get paid, costing the city millions in police overtime, and generally pissing off those who are most likely to AGREE with your professed goals?

The Occupy Movement is SOOOO over, imo.

Yes, it did some good; it brought the issues of income/wealth/power inequality to the forefront and got people (even our politicians) TALKING about them.

But it needs to move on to POSITIVE action on the INDIVIDUAL level (and sitting on your ass on strike from your life and obligations for a token day is NOT "positive action", imo.)

Don't drop out of life...just live it differently and watch how fast your power is felt. JMHO.

[Justin_Bailey]

Originally Posted by InterestedObserver

And how about, instead of organizing an opt out of everything event, you organize an opt IN event; as in opt IN to buying from local, small businesses and opening an account at your local, customer owned credit union and not working for companies whose practices or products you find offensive etc...and do it EVERY DAY.

They did that actually. It's the main reason why I respect the movement. But it's the idiocy like the general strike idea (and the fact that one of the early organizers in my local Occupy group is a damn birther) that make me never take them too seriously.

[InterestedObserver]

Originally Posted by Justin_Bailey

They did that actually. It's the main reason why I respect the movement. But it's the idiocy like the general strike idea (and the fact that one of the early organizers in my local Occupy group is a damn birther) that make me never take them too seriously.

In my area, the "divest from the banks and join a credit union" drive was sponsored by another group, unafilliated with Occupy (and Occupy never officially joined in or endorsed it, to my knowledge.) Same for the "buy from local small business" event.

The Occupy crowd's main focus has been occupying public spaces and banks/businesses, blocking the flow of traffic and commerce (shutting down the trains and/or bridges, closing the docks, etc..) and calling for general strikes.

I'm sure the movent is not homogenious (hell, they can't even seem to agree on anything even in a crowd of a few thousand, given their "consensus" form of decision making/"democracy")

[Chronos]

Of course the Occupiers are influencing the election; they're just not being self-destructive about it. Unlike the Tea Party, they're willing to recognize the value of compromise, rather than primarying out people who don't quite agree with them enough, just to spite their own face.

[BrainGlutton]

Originally Posted by Chronos

Of course the Occupiers are influencing the election; they're just not being self-destructive about it. Unlike the Tea Party, they're willing to recognize the value of compromise, rather than primarying out people who don't quite agree with them enough, just to spite their own face.

Other than that, then, the only way the OWSers could influence this election would be to campaign for Dems and help them take back the House. But I don't hear any talk about that.

[BrainGlutton]

Apparently they're intending more of a general demonstration than a general strike:

The plan initially drew the ire of some labor leaders who quickly declared their members would not participate in the so-called strike.

“It won’t happen,” Stuart Appelbaum, president of the Retail, Wholesale and Department Store Union, flatly told Buzzfeed. “They are not working with the unions in a serious way yet; nor are the unions working with them in a serious way. And it is the wrong strategy.”

Under the 1947 Taft-Hartley Act, a general strike in support of other workers is illegal. Furthermore, individual unions must call for a strike, so the participation of workers in a protest does not constitute a general strike.

The official OWS press release about May Day mentions the phrase “general strike” twice: once in the headline, and once in quotation marks in the first paragraph. Perhaps keenly aware of the likelihood that an across-the-board labor strike is not only unlikely but illegal, the day is now being described by organizers as a nationwide protest with themes of economic noncompliance. (Poster by Nina Montenegro, via Occuprint.)

“We wanted to create a broad space for people in all different circumstances from all sorts of backgrounds to be able to participate,” the OWS press release states. “But we also recognize that for some people skipping work is not feasible so we are encouraging people to participate how they can whether that involves wearing a button at work or leaving early or simply showing up to the march after work.”

[Oakminster]

Originally Posted by Chronos

Of course the Occupiers are influencing the election; they're just not being self-destructive about it.

How? Where? Which election? What influence? Let's see some cites.

[Elendil's Heir]

There are still a handful of Occupy Cleveland protestors camped out just off Public Square. They seem pretty forlorn these days.

Originally Posted by Chronos

Because we were afraid of the communist association with May Day, and needed something else to preempt it.

Such as Law Day, which doesn't get much attention other than from law-talkin' dudes and dudettes: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Law_day

[Chronos]

Other than that, then, the only way the OWSers could influence this election would be to campaign for Dems and help them take back the House. But I don't hear any talk about that.

Well, we're only just now getting to the point where one would start hearing such talk. I mean, up to now, how much talk have you heard from anyone about the general election?

[florez]

We met some OWSers in New York City, and found them to be know-it-all brats.
That day, we were with an old school anti-war/civil rights activist friend,
who could have given them some pointers, had they not been so full of themselves.
When questioned about their goals and objectives,
they responded by telling us to join them.
But what are your goals?
Just join us!
But........

[Least Original User Name Ever]

Originally Posted by Ca3799

During the week of April 9-15th, 'Occupy' teamed up with many other organizations (approx 70) with the goal of providing "99% Spring Training", a day of teaching and non-violent direct action protest training, to 100,000 people. I don't know if they met that goal. Some groups don't partake in civil disobedience -for example, MoveOn, but others like to, such as ActUp. So even with so many groups officially participating cooperatively, the occupy movement is still quite nebulous and fluid.

They certainly have not congealed or organized like the Tea Party and I'm not sure they have any intention to do so. It seems as if they prefer to not do so.

Recently, they have been disrupting shareholder meetings at large corporations- corporations which are targeted for either perceived unfair treatment of customers or ones that receive unfair tax benefits, or both. In San Francisco about a week ago, I believe there were quite a few arrests (24?) at a Wells Fargo shareholder meeting. There were charges traded back and forth- that Wells Fargo used employees to block the seats during the meeting so occupiers could not get in, and charges from the bank that occupiers took seats belonging to legitimate shareholders, etc. Some occupiers were also shareholders.This event had reports of occupy turnout varying from several hundred occupiers to 1,000. A recent GE shareholder meeting in Detroit attracted occupiers in numbers reported to be 100 to a couple of hundred.

I don't see much about them in the national news, but they seem to be making headlines locally.

I know they have national events planned for May 1st and May 9th and one website says they have 982 protests in the works throughout the US. I believe they are hoping May will bring renewed larger group activity.

My area group has two or three events planned and I understand there may be plans to get newsworthy with larger things like possibly blocking the Golden Gate Bridge as part of the May Day General Strike plans. This idea is also about and/or related to supporting local transportation workers in a union dispute. I say possibly because I'm not part of their group but I understand many ideas are being bounced around as to what exactly to do there.

So, who knows how they will do?

In Detroit, it was somewhere between 1 and 2 thousand I'd say. It was between one and two hundred in the shareholder meeting.

[BrainGlutton]

Originally Posted by florez

We met some OWSers in New York City, and found them to be know-it-all brats.
That day, we were with an old school anti-war/civil rights activist friend,
who could have given them some pointers, had they not been so full of themselves.
When questioned about their goals and objectives,
they responded by telling us to join them.
But what are your goals?
Just join us!
But........

Resistance is futile!

[gamerunknown]

I know of at least one old school anti-war activist that's given a talk at Occupy, Father Berrigan. The General Assembly I went to (LSX) was quite positive too: they established by consensus that the camp should move towards self-sufficiency by pooling funds to buy a solar panel generator and they should begin growing their own crops. Utterly disjointed from reality (there's no way they'd be able to grow enough to feed over one hundred people bar the second coming), but positive nonetheless - until the camp was shut down anyway.

[Oakminster]

Originally Posted by gamerunknown

they established by consensus that the camp should move towards self-sufficiency by pooling funds to buy a solar panel generator

Were any funds actually "pooled"? Who held the money, and what happened to it?

[Measure for Measure]

The Occupiers are doing what they always have: they engage in hard hitting actions based upon solid research and tough-minded investigation. Let the Tea Party crazies prance in their costumes and expect the congressional republicans to pamper their plutocrats. Occupiers believe in vigilance and hard work.

The cutting edge involves a full scale occupation of the regulatory system. Republicans have succeeded in removing many of the teeth of Dodd-Frank, so occupiers must redouble their efforts as the regulations are codified.

Many of the Occupy wonks once worked on Wall Street, and some of them still do. They’re former derivatives traders, risk analysts, compliance officers and hedge fund quants. They hail from Morgan Stanley, Deutsche Bank, Bear Stearns, D.E. Shaw, Merrill Lynch and JPMorgan Chase — and at least one is a former Securities and Exchange Commission regulator. They’re more likely to use a flowchart than protest signs to fight big banks. But they identify with the movement’s animating belief that America’s financial heavyweights wield too much power, and that its political leaders are too eager to do their bidding.

They've set up a website: Occupy the SEC. They are diving into the details of the rulemaking around the Volker rule. They deserve the highest praise and acclaim.

[Oakminster]

Originally Posted by Measure for Measure

They've set up a website: Occupy the SEC.

Probably a bunch of whiners from the Big 10 and PAC 12.


What? Oh.....that Other SEC. The one that doesn't have 6 consecutive BCS titles.

Meh. Never mind,

[gamerunknown]

Originally Posted by Oakminster

Were any funds actually "pooled"? Who held the money, and what happened to it?

I'm guessing the general assembly funds were monitored by the general assembly. Kind of hard to pool funds once the camp was disestablished by the authorities.

[elucidator]

Aw, hell, just tell hlm the truth! We blew it all on hacky-sacks and organic yoghurt.

[Gyrate]

QUite by chance I passed by Finsbury Square in London on Saturday, and the Occupy crowd are still there despite being ousted from the primary site outside St Pauls. They looked very wet and miserable, but then so did everyone else on Saturday.

[Elendil's Heir]

Originally Posted by elucidator

Aw, hell, just tell hlm the truth! We blew it all on hacky-sacks and organic yoghurt.

Ha! I KNEW it!

[Siam Sam]

We saw a group of Occupiers still on Wall Street early last month. They were occupying a sidewalk right across from Federal Hall and the NYSE and had a sign promoting the May Day action.

We saw a small group of them in Philadelphia near Independence Hall. And some in Washington, although we're not 100% sure the DC ones weren't just regular homeless.

[Tom Tildrum]

There was an Occupy the Justice Department rally on April 24, outside the Justice Department. The OWS website described its objectives: "Short term goal: release Mumia. Long term goal: end mass incarceration."